The Ramsey Show - App - When You Decide the Money Game Is Rigged (Hour 3)

Episode Date: August 20, 2018

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where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. Open phones this hour at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Choices have consequences. Choices have consequences. When you choose to put the right things in your mouth, and you choose to exercise regularly, you will enjoy the benefits of good physical condition.

If you choose, like I have done a time or two, to eat an entire bag of chocolate chip cookies at one setting, your body will look like it. Choices have consequences. If you believe that the game is fixed, that it's all hereditary, everyone in my family, obesity runs in my family. No, no one runs in your family. That's the problem.

It's a choice. It's a choice. It's a decision. Choices have consequences. Now, do some of us have DNA that's tall and slender? Yes. Do some of us have to fight against it a little more? You bet.

You bet. You bet. Choices have consequences. Are some of you born into a situation where it's easier for you to build wealth because you don't face some of the uphill battles that some of the rest of us have faced? There's outside forces pushing in on you, racism, sexism. You were born, I don't know, with a disability of some kind. There's something working against you that you have to overcome that some of the rest of us don't have to overcome.

Yeah, that's true. But choices still have consequences. But when you decide that the game is rigged, that you're just going to be fat because it runs in your family, or you're just going to be poor because everybody in my neighborhood is poor, and everybody I grew up is poor, and people like me me can't get ahead it's only the big man that gets ahead back in the 70s the hippies always said the man the man the man the man controls everything and now they're out there saying you know wealth inequality no no one has any wealth unless it's inherited well you, you know what? That's just not true. That's just not true.

Choices have consequences. Tell you what happened. We started talking about this with millionaires, and we started asking millionaires here on the air. There were Dave Ramsey listeners. How'd you become a millionaire? Did you inherit it? Nope. Nope.

Nope. We've been doing it for three years. We've talked to one that inherited their money. One. All the rest of them started with nothing and saved money. And surprise, they had money. I know that's shocking. They started with nothing, they stayed out of debt, and they invested, and they saved,

and they paid off their house early. And they're millionaires. At 52 years old, paid off their house in 10.2 years. And so we decided we were going to study millionaires because we thought, well, maybe it's just Dave Ramsey listeners that are doing that. Because, I mean, there is 15 million of you out there. So it's a valid firm and spent about a year and a half not only modeling out the actual research so that it was clean and clinical and done properly, but it was beyond reproach. And we interviewed non-Dave Ramsey tribe, people outside the tribe, people never heard of me that were millionaires. And then we interviewed about 6,000 that were millionaires inside the tribe.

Oddly enough, the statistical evidence is almost identical, and the results are almost identical. I kind of thought maybe I was having an effect, but it turns out really I'm not, other than the fact I got some people to do it. That's the only thing I did. They did the exact same thing the people that never heard of me did. The only thing is, I was just saying the same thing that the people never heard of me should have done, right? I mean, that's the only benefit I get out of this, the only credit I get.

So we spent like $50,000 on this research project, studying millionaires. Where do millionaires come from? Did they inherit their money? Was it the lottery? Are they all NBA, MLB, NFL stars, some kind of alphabet? I mean, are they all actors and musicians? Because when I was a kid growing up over there on the other side, we used to look over there at rich people and go,

man, oh, man, i wish i could get over there little man can't get ahead we're just stuck i know a lot of people like that don't you they say stuff like that just living dream which means they're living a nightmare because they're stuck because they don't believe they can do anything so we did this research project in detail chris hogan led the thing. Our team here led the thing. And Chris Hogan, a Ramsey personality, he's been interested in this millionaire stuff from the day we started talking about it. And so we ended up assigning him to write the book on the project. And we ended up doing the largest study on millionaires outside the tribe and inside the tribe, ever done.

No one's ever done one as large as we've done. We did about 6,000, between 6,000 to 7,000 of our people, and about 5,000 outside, 4,000 outside the tribe. It was a little over 10,000 people total that were all millionaires. And how'd you do it? What's the secret? Did you inherit your money? Where'd you do it? What's the secret? Did you inherit your money? Where'd it come from?

And we put it all together, and we pulled conclusions from it that are freaking blatantly obvious. I've never seen any set of data that is so solid. And, I mean, if you got, you know, you got something, you say, over half, and then you look,

and it's 52%, right? Over half the people in America voted for the president. Well, it's 51.4%. That's barely freaking over half. I mean, you're reaching, right? And so, I don't know what the number was, but I mean, whatever it was. You see what I'm saying? It's not even half, I guess.

It's probably 48, 48, 49, something like that. And then that 1% is still undecided. But, you know, but that's not, this stuff came in like 83% of them do this. 92% of them do this. It's like all of them do this, this, and this. And the data is unbelievable. You know what it says? Choices have consequences.

Choices have consequences. When you live and spend like you're in Congress, you're going to be broke your whole life and looking good. And then you're going to retire and say, I sure hope the government, which is well known for its ability to handle money, will take care of me. That's just plain stupid. That's just straight up stupid.

Or you can invest the equivalent of a car payment and drive a reasonable car that you pay cash for. You can cut up your stupid credit cards or never have a balance on a credit card. You can invest steadily in your 401k. Never miss a month from 25 to 45 and you'll be a millionaire. If you do what we teach and you walk these baby steps, you'll be a millionaire. That's what we discovered. Independent.

Non-dave. White's what we discovered. Independent. Non-Dave. White space, we call it. The interview. The book is called Everyday Millionaires. It's on sale. It actually comes out in January, but we're doing the pre-sales on it now. We've already sold 10,000 of them. How Ordinary People Built Extraordinary Wealth and How You Can Too.

Everyday Millionaires by my friend Chris Hogan. Research project done here. Absolutely incredible. It's stellar information. You can get it at DaveRamsey.com. There's all kinds of specials and deals and bells and whistles. We make buying it early fun. Check it out at DaveRamsey.com.

I get asked all the time, when in the baby steps is the right time to buy life insurance? My answer is typically now. Life insurance is not part of the baby steps because it's needed when your family has debt and not enough savings to provide for their financial needs. That's when they're at the highest risk. And no matter where you are in your baby steps, it's a necessity, not a choice. This includes working husbands and wives as well as stay-at-home parents. It's pretty expensive to replace those stay-at-home parent responsibilities. I only recommend term life insurance since it's the most affordable way to get the right amount of coverage and not break your budget. Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282.

These are the guys I personally use. Term life insurance is inexpensive and your family needs this no matter where you are in your baby steps. That's Zander.com or call 800-356-4282. Zander.com. thanks for joining us america so i was talking about the everyday millionaires book and i don't want to goof this up because our teams work really hard on it. Then I screw up and go, there's some cool stuff. But we have sold 10,000 of these books. The presale has been going for only two weeks. This is going to be a blockbuster, huge hit.

How Ordinary People Built Extraordinary Wealth and How You Can Too, Everyday Millionaires by Chris Hogan. The largest research project ever done on non-Dave Ramsey and Dave Ramsey tribe. Be very clear, there's some morons on social media already running around saying, Oh, that's just those Dave Ramsey people. You see, people are desperate to be a victim instead of a victor. So if you pre-order it today at DaveRamsey.com or ChrisHogan360.com, it's only $20. And you get $50 worth of free bonus items because you get the book in January and you get the audio book. That's one of the bonus items read by Chris Hogan himself. Even his name reads the phone book.

And that comes in January, obviously. and so does the e-book. You get a video lesson from me immediately, How to Retire Inspired. That's from Chris Hogan, rather. You get a video lesson from me on It's Okay to Be Wealthy. You have to tell people it's okay to be wealthy now because some people think it's a sin because they have really really really bad doctrine we're also offering an all-inclusive bundle this is huge the financial peace university program the one-year membership and the new book every day on millionaires only for 129 and that includes all the free bonus items so check it all out at DaveRamsey.com or ChrisHogan360.com now I did that properly I got so excited thinking about

the book though I mean this book is incredible in two weeks we've already sold 10,000 and the book doesn't even come out till January things gonna be blockbuster every day millionaires how ordinary people built extraordinary wealth and for those of you on YouTube here's what it looks like it's a Everyday Millionaires, How Ordinary People Built Extraordinary Wealth. And for those of you on YouTube, here's what it looks like. It's a good-looking book. Got Mr. Hogan's face on the front. It's pretty cool, man, I'll just tell you. He's incredible.

Absolutely. I'm so proud of him. I'm so proud of our team on this work. It's just solid research, solid clinical research. And that means if you don't like it or you don't agree with it, you're what's known as wrong. That's what that means. Jacob is with us in Lexington, Kentucky. Hi, Jacob.

How are you? I'm doing well. How about yourself? Better than I deserve. What's up? Hey, well, me and my wife, we just got married back in May. We got settled into our apartment. And right now, we're making payments on our college. But from what I'm hearing about, we went through Lumarit, by the way.

And from what I'm hearing from where I work right now, they're saying that around December they're looking to cut hours by about 20% to 40%. And it'll be like that until about May. What do you make a year? We already got $1,000. What do you make a year? About $46K a year uh both of us put together what do you what do you make a year uh i make about 25k something like that so go get another job this one sucks

really i mean they're getting ready to tell you you're 25k is going in half and they told you four months in advance go get another job yeah i'm working on that right now i've been talking some other ones um and uh working on that plus uh i was curious about something else too, is the payments we have on the college, we already have about $1,000 in an emergency savings, and we're working on knocking out some of our debts. We're blessed that we don't have a whole lot of those. would it be appropriate to use that $1,000 to pay forward on the college, or is that something that would be a big no-no, and that's something for another type of emergency? No, this is not an emergency.

Paying forward on college is not an emergency. Right. Now, if you get down to the last minute and you're going to have to miss class because you haven't paid, you might call that an emergency. But that should never happen because they gave you four months' notice. Right. So you get two extra jobs, part-time jobs, and you change careers. What are you studying in school?

I'm studying information technology with an emphasis on cybersecurity. Good. Are you working in that field now? I am not. I've been trying to find a good job that would help train me on that because I don't really have a lot of programming experience at the moment. Yeah, good. Okay.

But the good news is for somebody in that field, at $25,000 a year, you work cheap. You don't know nothing, but you work cheap. Right. So you're kind of getting in there willing to go get their coffee make their copies um drive their car and get it work get it cleaned or whatever you got to do to get in get your foot in the door with people that do that and that's a good place for you to move your career to because you need to move in that direction anyway as soon as you graduate from

school so you you need another job man because they just told you in four months they're getting ready to cut it by 40%. They pretty much told you to leave if you were listening. And so, I mean, 40% of not much is very not much, and that's where you're sitting. So, yeah, no, I'm not using that to pay my college. I'm going to work on my income side of the equation. Income, income side of your equation is what's struggling here, my brother. You got this. You can do it. All right, Jenny's with your equation is what's struggling here, my brother. You got this. You can do it.

All right, Jenny's with us in Buffalo. Hi, Jenny. How are you? Hi there. I so appreciate the opportunity to talk with you, Mr. Ramsey. I'm honored to speak with you. How can I help? Well, my husband and I just completed Baby Step 2, and in a few months, we're hoping

to be ready to work on college savings. And about 15 years ago, we did open a 529. It has a little bit in it, but we stopped contributing, so there's only about $10,000 in it. We don't feel that 529 is the best fit for our family. Why? And so I'm just wondering your opinion on, like, if we have a chunk of money. Wait a minute.

Stop. I disagree with your feelings. What are you talking about? As far as the fit for my family? Yeah. What do you mean? You don't want your kids to be educated? Oh, no, no, no.

I'm in education. I'm just not sure as far as potential scholarships for one possibility, or if they decide trade school or wanting to work right after school, we want to support them financially at whatever best avenue is best for them at that time. Okay, so what I would do is build a sufficient 529 for them to get a four-year college degree. And if they get scholarships, you can withdraw the equivalent amount of the scholarship completely tax-free from that 529. Okay. So you're not trapped. But you're not trapped. If you've got an athlete or a scholar or something on your staff there that's going to be great and get free college,

then you're going to get the money right back out of the 529. You're not trapped at all. Trade school can be used for 529. Okay, and what if they decided to go into work and kind of get on-the-job training? Yeah. How about that's a dumb idea? Let me tell you why, okay? Okay.

Because 75% to 80% of the millionaires that we interview have higher education. This idea that higher education has completely gone crazy and everyone needs to abandon the idea of going to college because of the student loan debacle and because education is so expensive and because people study stupid butt stuff that's not applicable in the marketplace does not invalidate the power of education. People need to be smart. Right, absolutely.

And they make more money if they're smart fully agree but we have we do have one kiddo that um school is not really his thing he's a hands-on kid he's uh super smart but not uh not a fan of school and so we just want to be most prepared for then you know again i would do a 529, and if you take him to it through a trade school route, or maybe he's a tech kid or something like that, he can make a lot of money, have a great career doing that, as you said, certifications and that sort of stuff. You can use 529 for most of that, but building an UTMA to the side, Uniform Transfer to Minors Act for some of it,

but be careful how you're programming everybody here, because this is a dangerous trend, folks. People are just completely abandoning education because stupid people have been doing education wrong. I understand college is not for everybody. I agree with that. But let's save money for it. Okay. money for it. Okay, I need you to listen to this, because one normal routine that everyone does can cause total chaos in your life. Folks, I'm talking about the simple act of using Wi-Fi. When you're

on Wi-Fi anywhere in public or at home, you're at risk of hackers easily seeing every site you visit and search you're doing online. It doesn't matter if you're doing risk of hackers easily seeing every site you visit and search you're doing online. It doesn't matter if you're doing it on your cell phone or your laptop. I'm not telling you this to scare you. I don't operate in fear. But I want you to be aware and take action. You need to download Hotspot Shield.

Hotspot Shield helps keep your connection on your own Wi-Fi and any public Wi-Fi secure. 600 million people worldwide have downloaded Anchor Free's Hotspot Shield. Download it now. My listeners can save even more by going to hotspotshield.com slash Dave. That's hotspotshield.com slash Dave. You can be secure in seconds. Download Hotspot Shield today. Okay, we're going to have a little discussion about education in the next segment. We're going to have a discussion about college in the next segment.

So stay tuned. I was pretty hard on that last caller, and I kind of feel bad about it. Not much, but a little bit. Because I'm just kind of aggravated with this space right now, and I want to talk about it. We're going to do that next segment, so stay with us. Meantime, in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions, Tom's with us. Hey, Tom, how are you? I'm doing great, Dave.

I like your shirt. Thank you. Debt-free and loving it. Absolutely. Very cool. Here to do a debt-free scream. Yes, we are. And where do you live? We live in Newtown, Dave. I like your shirt. Thank you. Debt-free and loving it. Absolutely. Very cool. Here to do a debt-free scream. Yes, we are. And where do you live?

We live in Newtown, Connecticut. Oh, okay. Very cool. And how much debt have you paid off? A little over $330,000. Yeah-ho! That's a nice number. And how long did this take?

About five and a half years. This must be your house. It did include my house. Wow. And your range of income during that time? Started off about $90,000 and finished off around $150,000. Good. What do you do for a living?

I sell mortgage origination software, the same kind that Churchill Mortgage uses. Absolutely. Good. Good for you. Very cool. And doing well at it, obviously. And you paid off your house. Yes.

What's this house worth? $265,000. All right. And you brought the kiddos with you to celebrate. Yes, I did. And their names and ages? Lauren is 14 and Tommy is 12. All right.

Very cool. And so what's the house worth again? About $265,000. Wow. How fun. Five and a half years ago, something happened and you said, I'm getting out of debt. What happened? Actually, I had a number of job changes.

I started working in the real estate and mortgage industry back in 2003. In 2007, I decided to have my own mortgage company. That was pretty bad timing. Your timing sucks. Yeah. That was July of 2007. Okay. It was a little bit hard.

So 2008 completely wiped me out financially. And just like you say about you and your wife, our marriage was hanging on by a thread at that time through a number of different job changes, which ultimately culminated with what I'm doing now for the past six years. Just as I took my job with Ellie Mae, which I work for now, my best friend Chad gave me the total money makeover. Oh, okay. So it was perfect timing. I started for now. My best friend, Chad, gave me the Total Money Makeover. Oh, okay. So it was perfect timing. I started in August. He gave it to me in October, and I just was starting to get back on my feet. So I read the book, and December 1st, 2012, we started our debt-free journey,

working on consumer debt. And a couple weeks later, as many people might be aware, living in Newtown, Connecticut, we had quite a tragedy. And that was very difficult, and there were so many things that we just couldn't control and that just happens in life there's things you can't control and so one of the things

that I could control was our finances and so I focused on our finances I focused on coaching wrestling and coaching soccer for my son and both my daughter and my son. And both my daughter and my son wrestled at that time. We actually were at Sandy Hook School the night before for a wrestling match. And so there was a lot of changes that went on at

that time. So you guys knew a bunch of those families then? Yes. Close, personal friends? Yes. We don't really talk about it. I know where a lot of the kids went to school. But yes, so our community was forever changed. It was

and still is very emotional. But having this to focus on, some people thought it was extreme. We talk about, you talk about gazelle intensity. I'm looking at a gazelle here in your lobby. I think of it as hyper-focusing, and I really hyper-focused on just my debt. It's a little bit of an extreme, some would say, and just went through, paid everything off, and focused on the house.

And literally one of the things that I did was the last thing, we had a leased Toyota Camry. And we drove it out through the end of the lease. But I bought a 2000 Ford Expedition. And we named it Freedom. Because that was the... That car needed a name. It had 172,000 miles when we bought it. And Lauren

and Tommy loved it. And we just gave it to a friend about two weeks ago and replaced it with another older Expedition, but only with 60,000 miles. But we drove that thing forever. just gave it to a friend about two weeks ago and replaced it with another older expedition, but only with 60,000 miles. Okay. But we drove that thing forever. And every time I pulled up to a toll booth, because I travel a lot for work, every time

I pulled up to a toll booth and had to open the door because the driver's side window didn't work. Oh, good. It reminded me why I was working on this and what I was working towards. And it made it not as bad having to open the door instead of be able to roll down the window yeah so yeah well I mean with going broke and losing everything number one going through that and then having to take a job and start again and in the midst of that your community goes through sandy hook I mean you get you get just uh you get rattled a little

bit and you need something to focus on you need something to cause you the like you said control what controllables can i control because everything feels out of control at that point yeah it was chaos with all the news media in the town you couldn't escape it and uh you know everyone meant well in most cases and not everyone yeah very true but a lot of people meant well. There's a lot of positive help, yeah. I mean, there was over 30,000 teddy bears sent to town. I mean, there's only 27,000 people in the whole town.

I mean, they had to rent warehouse space just to house them. It was a little crazy. So people meant well, but it was chaos, and it was hard to get through. Yeah, I guess so. Wow. Well, congratulations. Thank you very much. You did it. Yes to get through. Yeah, I guess so. Wow. Well, congratulations. Thank you very much.

You did it. Yes, we did. You did it. You actually did. You don't have a house payment. No. Have you ever not had a house payment? No.

No, never. I mean, you came out of the mortgage business. You've always had a house payment. Exactly. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Wow. Way to go, man.

Thank you. Way to go. Very, very well done. What is the secret to getting out of debt? It's hyper-focus, as I call it, or gazelle intensity, as you say, and just really focusing on what's important and not taking your eye off the prize. And if you do get a little bit sidetracked, just get right back on. There's nothing that is blocking you from getting back on track.

So how many times did these two kids think you were losing your mind and then how many times did they get it? Quite a bit in the beginning, but we made a chart which helped a lot. And so we put a chart on the refrigerator, one of the pictures that I sent in, for all the consumer debt and each square represented $1,000. And so they knew what the goal was, and they would ask me each month, can we rip off another square? Okay.

And so it helped having that visual so that they knew what we were working towards and why. Okay. And their names and ages again? Lauren is 14 and Tommy is 12. Okay. All right. Perfect. Okay.

So they really have grown up with this. Absolutely. And now they're standing here. So they'll remember this whole idea of dad going nuts and paying off the house. So he never had a payment again. And Dave's dad's hyper-focused. They're inspired for life. You've changed your family tree.

Thank you for saying that because that's exactly how I think of it. I've changed the family tree. No question about it. Very well done, sir. Thank you. Very well done. Proud Thank you. Very well done. Proud of you. Good job.

Good job. What was the hardest part for you? Just staying focused for that long. And, you know, I mentioned marriage was hanging on by a thread. Well, ours didn't make it. And so one of the reasons why I did this so quickly with the mortgage was literally I had five years from the date of the divorce to get it paid off. And we finished that four and a half years from the time of the divorce. Oh, wow.

Or you had to refinance it or something. Yeah, but a previous short sale had blocked that from being possible. So it was either sell it or somehow. Okay. So you had a real reason mechanically to be hyper-focused. Absolutely. More than just the philosophical reason, so to speak. Correct. Okay, so you had a real reason mechanically to be hyper-focused. Absolutely. More than just the philosophical reason, so to speak. Correct. Okay. Very cool. And you did

all this for the Total Money Makeover book? Actually, so we took Financial Peace last summer. That was the final step. I had a bunch of stock and options that I had accumulated over working with Ellie Mae, and our stock had done well. And I had hesitated to sell it all until I took the financial peace class.

That actually was the final straw that convinced me to try and pay the mortgage off. And I liquidated those and threw it at the mortgage, and that was when I got huge traction. And so that was not the final step, but very close to it. Yeah, I kicked it into overdrive where you could see the light. Yes. Yeah. Good for you. Well done.

Very well done. Proud of you. You're a hero, man. You took control of your life. Thank you. Very well done. We've got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you, Retire Inspired. We want you to be a millionaire.

That's the next chapter in your story. All right, Lauren and Tommy, here we go. Tom, count it down. $330,000 paid off in five and a half years, making $90,000 to $150,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt paid off in five and a half years, making $90,000 to $150,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're debt-free!

Love it! Well done. Very well done, you guys. Proud of you. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Our scripture of the day, James 1.22, Do not merely listen to the word and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. My friend Stephen Mansfield, best-selling author, says,

Ultimately, you only know who a man is and what he believes by what he does, not by what he sits around talking about. Well, that's the truth. Well, if you're living paycheck to paycheck, I got one way to help you fix that. A plan. A plan is called a budget. The best way to do a budget these days is the world's best budgeting app. It's free. It's called EveryDollar. You can get it for your phone, EveryDollar, or you can go to EveryDollar.com and get it. It's free. Get your budget done. Okay, I promise you we're going to talk about education for a minute. I realized that in the midst of fighting this ridiculous view of education that's floating around, that I had joined hands with some of you that I didn't mean to.

Let me tell you what I mean. Or I had made the appearance to, which would have been, by the way, hypocritical. And I'm, if anything, not a hypocrite. I'm unbelievably consistent. I never tell you to do anything on this show that I wouldn't do or that I'm not currently doing or haven't done, you know, something along those lines. I just don't, including advertising endorsements. I just don't.

Life's too short for me. So I saved up and paid for all three Ramsey kids to go to college. I brainwashed them to go to college. We're doing the same thing with the next generation, with my grandkids, to go to college. It would be inconsistent for me to tell you not to go to college or not to save money to go to college because I truly believe you should go to college. Now, that's a general statement.

Are there some people who are not cut out for college? Sure. Absolutely. And I'm not mad at you and I'm not talking down to you. If that's you, and you're going to go get a technology certification, and you're going to study and get your Microsoft certs, or you're going to go to trade school and be a heating and air guy or gal, I got no issue with that at all.

But be careful about people telling you you're not cut out for college and be very careful to not tell other people they're not cut out for college. And here's why. There is a direct correlation between education and income. Even though there are stupid people studying ridiculously stupid left-handed, you know, I got a master's degree in left-handed puppetry. I spent $250,000 getting a master's degree in sociology. A lady told me the other day, that's dumb. Because the field of sociology does not pay enough to justify that expenditure. That's why it's dumb. Because the field of sociology does not pay enough to justify that expenditure.

That's why it's dumb. And she was in debt $250,000. So we hear these bizarro overcharges by ridiculously expensive, primarily private schools, and people going hundreds of thousands of dollars into student loan debt, and our, me and you, normal people's visceral reaction is, well, it's reached the point that college is just stupid, and a bunch of you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

And that's what I was reacting against with our last caller before the bottom of the hour. Well, college is just not for everyone, is the saying. But what that means is college is not for anyone. Let me just tell you, 98% of you need to go to school. Well, Dave, you don't understand. I've got this and I've got that. Listen, when I was a kid, we didn't have AD or ADD or ADHD. We didn't know those initials.

They called me hyperactive. Hyper. Couldn't sit still. Couldn't pay attention. But you know what? I learned to. Sit still and pay attention. I couldn't read coming out of the first grade.

I shouldn't have gone into the second grade. My mother talked them into it. I mean, coming out of second first grade. I shouldn't have gone into the second grade. My mother talked them into it. I mean, coming out of second grade, I'm sorry. My third grade teacher, Miss Mary Jane Hurt, my fourth grade teacher, Miss Pratt, taught me to read, and now I have written several New York Times best-selling books.

Several. And sold millions, tens of millions of copies. Because I learned to sit still and pay attention. Now, does that mean everybody's ADHD? No, I'm not getting into that fight. That's not my point. My point is, is that when you look at someone and say,

you're not college material, that's what they used to say. You're not college material. You should just go off and do so-and-so. You might have just ruined their dadgum life. So let's teach people to dream about getting an education. And when I say getting an education, I mean going to a reasonably priced institution where what you spend is going to cause your income to go up so much because you study something that's applicable.

If you get a good, solid degree in a good, solid subject matter that businesses are actually using in the marketplace, by the way, businesses are where freaking jobs come from. And so someone will hire you or more likely to hire you because you know something in a field. Not because you have a degree, because you know something about marketing or you know something about communications or you know something about accounting or you know something about whatever. Fill in the blank. Studies, you know, you become a nurse. I don't care. But you have to know something to be a nurse. You have to know something.

It's a great career path, by the way. You have to know something. And so don't let this ridiculous thing that's happened in our culture where people are overpaying for bad degrees, tremendously overpaying for bad degrees, and going deeply into debt for bad degrees in subject areas no one should have ever been studying, because there's no application for them in the marketplace whatsoever. It was an excuse for rich people or dumb people to go to school and get ripped off. Instead, study something at a reasonably priced institution.

Become smart. Read a book. Take a class. That's what a degree is so my rant is simply this college is not a bad idea college statistically speaking is a great idea. That's why we used to say with great pride, I'm the first one in my family to get a college degree. Because it meant that you were going to be more prosperous than your family had previously been. Because they had an education. I'm about halfway through David McCullough's book on John Adams. The education level of the signers of the Declaration was astounding.

Astounding. Their quest for knowledge, their reading, how voraciously they read was astounding. And these were very young men. Thomas Jefferson was in his 30s and he wrote the Declaration of Independence. You don't do that if you're a fool. You don't do that if you have not been formally trained and your mind has been trained. And so my University of Tennessee business degree has been worth a bazillion times what I paid for it.

I use it every day running this business. Is everything they taught me perfect? No, absolutely not. So consequently, I brainwashed my children to go to college. And consequently, I'm brainwashing my grandkids to go to college. Now, if one of them has a learning disability, that's a different thing. If one of them has a, you know, is just really going to do something else, they're going to work with their hands, they're going to be an artist, they're going to do whatever, that's fine.

That's fine. But this idea that you can go and be an intern at Microsoft and end up running Microsoft is complete BS. You can't. It takes more sophistication than that on the job training. It doesn't work that way, folks. So let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater. Being smart, being educated in the right things in the right way with reasonable price structures is absolutely vital for most people.

Let's not lose the dream of Americans being smart. That puts this hour of the Dave Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. Hey guys, this is Blake Thompson, Chief Production Officer for The Dave Ramsey Show. Here's a tip. To keep from missing Dave's classic facial expressions to some of those calls? Make sure you watch him live. Just visit DaveRamsey.com slash show each day from 2 to 5 p.m. Eastern. Enjoy.