The Ramsey Show - App - When You've Walked Through a Mess, You Can Be a Messenger (Hour 1)

Episode Date: August 30, 2019

Chris Hogan, Home Buying, Retirement, Debt   Tools to get you started: Debt Calculator: http://bit.ly/2QIoSPV Insurance Coverage Checkup: http://bit.ly/2BrqEuo Complete Guide to Budgeting: http://bit.ly/2QEyonc Interview Guide: http://bit.ly/2BuGnZE   Check out other podcasts in the Ramsey Network: http://bit.ly/2JgzaQR 

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is the Dave Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I'm Chris Hogan, filling in for Dave, and I'm excited to be with you, America. I know you've got money questions. I know you've got some things on your mind that you want to talk about. Well, guess what? We're going to do it right here, right now. What I want you to do is call me.

The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. And if you prefer, you can find us on social media as well. It's at Ramsey Show. Or you can find me at ChrisHogan360 on Twitter and Facebook and Instagram and all the other grams that are out there. Just find me, send me your question, and let's talk about it. All right. Well, listen, I'm diving on the phones because that's what we do.

And first up, I've got Mike on the line from New Jersey. Mike, how are you? Hey, Chris. Thanks for taking my call today. Oh, absolutely, my friend. What's on your mind? So I have a 30-year mortgage rate today. I'm wondering if it makes sense for me to switch to a 15-year rate.

Okay. All right. Now tell me about this. How long ago did you do this loan? 2017. Okay. 2017. And what was your rate at the time that you did the loan? 4.375. Okay. 4.375. All right. And did you all put some money down? We did. We put $30,000 down.

Okay, good job. Good job. What's the value of this home? Well, the value, the loan remaining today is about $559,000. Okay, and how much is it worth? The home is now worth close to $700,000. Okay, and is that something that you found from online or have you had an appraisal recently uh that's just from our online research and talking with our local real estate agents okay all right mike all right i like where you're at right now now tell me this what baby step are you on we're on baby step number two my wife had about seventy three thousand dollars worth of student loans okay yesterday we knocked down the smallest student loan, which was $13,000.

So we just crushed that, and now we have $50,000 left. Wow. Where'd you get that $13,000 from? We have about $40,000 in savings. Okay. Okay. So was that your emergency fund? Nope.

Okay. So that's just, we are brand new to the baby steps. Okay. So we just are starting off here here we had about 40 000 we wanted to reduce our student loan debt okay and we thought the best way was to knock off the smallest student loan which is exactly what we did yesterday fantastic i'm very proud of you my friend doesn't it feel good to get that out of your life absolutely i can't wait to knock out the rest of it see See, that is fantastic. So outside of this student loan debt, Mike, what else do you all have? That's it. That's our only debt aside from the mortgage. All right. I like it. Now tell me, what's your household income? $220,000 a year. Okay. Fantastic. Are you both working outside of the home?

Yes. Okay. Yeah. I definitely would reach out and look at getting refinanced to a 15. Okay? Okay. Now, typically, as you look at this, a refinance to a 15-year from a 30-year payment can have a fluctuation of payment in anywhere from between $500 and $700. But where you all are budget-wise, you can definitely do this. And let's be real, Mike. It's knocking 15 years off of the life of this mortgage. So I want you to reach out to your current lender. You shouldn't have to formally apply

for them to kind of work up and let you know what rates are today, what the cost would be to refinance. But listen to me, here's a tip. Once you go to your current lender, I also want you to reach out to another lender just to get an idea of what their rates are on a 15-year fix as well. And so you all doing your homework in that way, what it's going to do is set you up to let you know kind of where you are and what steps you're wanting to take to move forward. But here's the deal. Because you did buy this home two years ago, you will have to pay for a new appraisal. All right, that will be absolutely important. That will be something you have to do, which, you know, you're in Jersey, so there's no telling, you know, that could be anywhere from $1,200 to $1,500.

But it's worth it because the 15 years you're knocking off the life of that mortgage is a big deal, and it's going to set you up for success. So, Mike, thank you for calling in. America, listen to me. If you are out there right now and you've got a 30-year fixed rate mortgage, I want you to do the research on refinancing to a 15-year. Now, again, it's simple math. We know 30 minus 15 equals 15. I'm from Kentucky, and I can do that math quick, right? But you want to save yourself some time, be aware, and save yourself some money.

So reach out to it. If you're a Dave Ramsey Show listener, you know that we work with Churchill Mortgage. We've had a long time relationship and connection with them. They're going to treat you well. But whether you use Churchill or use your own lender, get refinanced into a 15 year. It's a game changer. All right. I'm going to the next line here. I've got Nicole on the phone. Nicole, how are you? I'm well, Chris. How are you? Oh, I'm focused and not finished, young lady. How can I help you? I will try and keep this brief. So my husband and I both work for the state, and we're right now in baby step two, but I'm kind of looking a couple steps ahead.

And because of our work in the state, we have to, we have a mandatory PERS contribution from each of us. Mine is 14%. His is police and fire. It's 20%. We can't stop it. We can't reduce it. So it just is what it is while we're in Baby Step 2.

But I'm wondering, once we're in Baby Step 4, should I contribute more? Because mine is only 14%, even though my husband's is 20%. Okay. Now, hold on before I answer your question. I need to know. You're on baby step two. What kind of debt do you guys still owe? We, well, we've actually paid off a lot.

We paid off over $2,000 in our August payoff challenge. Oh, I like that. Yeah. So we have just shy of $14,000 left to pay off on credit cards, and then we'll be debt-free. Okay, so $14,000 is all credit card debt. That's it. How many cards, Nicole? How many cards is it?

Two. Two? What kind of cards are they? Just regular consumer credit cards. Not store cards, just regular cards. Okay. You've been using them a long time? We did, yes. We were not smart at the beginning

of our marriage. No, listen, Hey, we've, we've all been there. We've all done something crazy with money, but I liked that you guys paid off 2000. Was that on a card or was that just 2000 toward a balance? Um, it's, we paid off 2000 towards a car. I think we've paid off now a total of almost $5,000 on that card since June. Fantastic. And once you pay it off, Nicole, what are you going to do? We're going to snowball it to the next card. That's exactly right. And you call, listen, you call and you shut it down.

Yes. Yeah, shut it down. Listen, have you ever tried to break up with someone that was crazy? Luckily, no. But my husband just had to call two different places to close the credit card. And he says he's never gone through customer service faster than saying he needed to close the card. Yeah, it can be rough because they don't want you to leave. They know how much money they're making off of you.

But here's the thing. I love that you all are dialed in on Baby Step 2. It means you're trying to attack debt. But you're peeking ahead to Baby Step number four. I'll tell you about it. Don't skip steps. Once you get out of debt, I want you to go. Okay.

All right. Now, listen. All right. Don't make me come to Nevada. All right. You follow in steps. But, yeah, with you doing 14% and, you know, you guys, we tell people to do 15% as a household. So, if you are at 14 and your husband's at 20, you guys are technically kind of over kind of where you are.

So what I would do is turn your attention to attacking and paying off the house. Pay extra toward that. Because imagine this, Nicole. You get that mortgage paid off and you freed up the mortgage payment. And now that payment's staying with you. Yeah. See, you're not paying anybody else. Now you've got opportunities and you got time on your side because you got your money back.

That's what we do by getting out of debt. You give yourself a raise. This is the Dave Ramsey show. Let's talk about low interest rates, baby. I know right now that Churchill Mortgage can get qualified buyers into a 15-year conventional loan for well under 4% with no discount points or no hidden fees. Listen, if you're even thinking about buying a home or refinancing, do it right now. These rates are incredibly low. Here's what I'd like you to do. Take 10 minutes and call Churchill Mortgage and see what you can qualify for. So even if you have to get creative and buy something further out of the city to get something you can qualify for. So even if you have to get creative and buy something further out of the city to get something you can afford, now's the time to make the move.

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NMLS ConsumerAccess.org. Equal housing lender. 761 Old Hickory Boulevard, Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. Hello America. You are listening to the Dave Ramsey Show. And no, Dave doesn't have a cold. This is Chris Hogan filling in for Dave. And we're having fun, right?

We're taking your calls about money. And listen, I know you've got some questions. So what I want you to do is give us a call. That number is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. Or you can find us on social media. It's at Ramsey show, or you can look for me at Chris Hogan, three 60. Uh, you can find us all over the place. We, we, we love social media around here. Well, listen, I want to tell you about something. See financial

peace university has been changing lives for over 25 years, and that's a whole lot to celebrate. And like we usually do around here, when we do something, we do it big. And so for the month of August, we've challenged some folks that are in baby step number two to pay an extra $1,000 toward their debt. It's part of the $1,000 payoff challenge. And we're almost to the August finish line, and we've had over 100,000 people commit to the challenge. Now, hold on a had over 100,000 people commit to the challenge. Now, hold on a second. 100,000 people have committed to this.

You know what that equals? That's over $1 million in debt that's getting attacked and deleted. I love it. And I'm telling you, there's a lot of people out there who are on fire to take back their financial lives. And we're giving away $2,500 to four of those people this month. And so that's what we've been doing. And so I like to check in on people. All right.

I like to talk to people just to see how they're doing, the people that had entered the challenge. Amanda, are you there? Yes. How are you? I'm good. Good, good. Well, listen, I'm just doing a wellness check on people that have entered the August Payoff Challenge. And have you been making progress on this?

Yes, we have. Have you? Okay, good, good. And are you feeling good about it? I'm feeling great. Are you feeling great? And if you were to win, now this is purely hypothetical, what would you do with that money? I'd pay it more on my credit

card. Okay. Alright. You would pay more. Are you sure about that? I'm absolutely sure about that. Well, guess what, Amanda? Guess what? What? This isn't a wellness check. I'm calling to give you a check. You're the winner! Yay!

Congratulations! Are you still there? Well, you can't say that anymore because you just did. Congratulations. Did I have you fooled there for a minute? You did. Well, see, that means I did my job. I did my job. Congratulations. Seriously. I'm very, very proud of you all for taking a stand for your financial future and being committed to that. And I absolutely hope that you guys use that money to help you continue to push forward and move forward. And we're excited. So thank you for participating, Amanda. And we wish you all the best. Okay. Thank you. You are very welcome. Oh, that's fun. I mean, seriously, I'm gifted at this.

Giving away Dave's money, I'm pretty good at it. I could do this full time, I think. But it's fantastic. Now listen, if you're out there, my friends, you have an opportunity to do this as well. This challenge, again, if you're all in and getting debt out of your life, there's still time to join the $1,000

payoff challenge. We're going to be giving away $2,500 to two more people that commit to this challenge. And get this, it's commit to the challenge. It doesn't say you have to have it done, but you're just saying you're going to be intentional. And so to enter, what you do is go to DaveRamsey.com slash payoff. And there's no purchase necessary. And so again, to take a stand for you and commit to this debt payoff challenge, go to DaveRamsey.com slash payoff. That's fantastic.

That's so fun. That's a lot of fun. Okay. All right. Listen, I'm going back to the phones, America. I have Somalia on the line. This is Chris. How are you?

I'm well, sir. How about yourself? Oh, I'm doing well. What's on your mind today? Well, I had a question. I had a relative recently ask us in an emergency, their emergency, if they could borrow some money. And we don't have it because all our money is in our debt snowball. But they wanted us to put it on a credit card, but we don't have any. So we had to turn them down.

But we wanted to, there's a financial piece live coming up. We wanted to offer them a ticket and their emergency, their number one emergency fund, if they will commit to going to the class or the show so that they won't fall into this event again. And I'm just wondering what you thought about that. Does it sound like enabling? Wow. Okay. Hold on.

So you had a family member call you. They asked for money. You didn't have it. They asked you to put it on a credit card for them. You said no because you didn't have one. But you're saying you're offering them a ticket to the event and their baby step number one, $1,000? Yeah, if they go to the event. Wow. And what baby step are you guys on? We'll be finishing up baby step number two in the spring, but we just wanted to make the investment into them since we are so committed to finishing our journey. Okay. Is this family, is this a sister, brother? What family relation is it? Really close, immediate family. Okay, close, immediate family. And their family and and are in and their

emergency was it what is it something you can tell me about yeah yeah it was a car their car needed to be uh fixed repaired okay all right and so you're asking is giving them a ticket to the event enabling no a thousand dollars really you know i won't get to that yeah okay you guys are you're on baby step two yourself yes sir right so right now you don't have that to give no but we were gonna take a little bit out of our debt snowball to to invest in them okay and what's your husband think about this it was was his idea. It's his idea. Is it his family? No, it's mine.

Okay. Now, how do you feel about this idea? Well, it's funny because it was kind of a collaborative thing. He was trying to figure out a way for us to help her, and I have been kind of burdened by the helping also. And so he was trying to figure out a way to help her, and I came up with that idea. So he liked it, and we just have to see if this person would be interested. Okay.

Now, so what are they doing right now with this car that's in need of repair? How are they getting around? I think it was repaired. They got the money from trying to wait. Okay. So the car is fixed, so there's not the immediate need there, right? Right. Here's my thing, Somalia. I love the idea of the giving heart. I like what you're trying to do, but you ask about if it's enabling. That is all going to be based on the individual that you're helping.

Meaning, have you all helped this individual in the past? Yes. Okay. Oh, have you helped them financially in the past? Yes. How many times have you helped this person? Round it up. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Come on. I don't really have a number up. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Come on. I don't really have a number. Maybe let's say five. I was thinking more toward probably closer to 10. And what you have here is what's called a track record. So I love the idea of you all giving them a ticket and coming to the event as well. I love this idea.

I like the idea of potentially even working hard and you guys getting focused. And once they complete the nine-week course of Financial Peace University, maybe there's something you can do there. But no, I don't think $1,000, when you guys are on baby step number two, I think that's too much to try to do at this point in time. But you and your husband get on the same page, and you guys agree. But it sounds like this is somebody that has a repetitive kind of need, and they're becoming super reliant on you all instead of learning to stand on their own two feet. So I like the idea of them coming to the event and learning. See, that's the deal, and I want them to learn.

Here's my question, though, Sommelier. I wonder if they'll show up. I wonder if they'll even take the time to come to the event. Or were they just looking for you just to quickly fix their problem? And I think that's where the rubber meets the road. And so talk with them. You and your husband. You guys get on the same page.

I got a social question in as well. Someone said, how do you talk to family about money? And that can be a tricky topic. And it's going to be important for you to always have this mindset of wanting to help. But America, keep this in mind. You can't make your family do it. I know firsthand, right? I've got family that doesn't do it, and I try to help them.

So what can you do? Provide them information. But don't forget, ultimately, people make their own choices. We can't control them, but we can help them. And so point them to information. They can go to a library and check out a book. Or you could gift them a book. They could go to Financial Peace University.

You've got some things you could do. But just don't take it onto yourself to try to solve it, right? What that is, is that can set you up to be frustrated and irritated later. So talk with them, have that conversation and try to help them, but meet them where they are, but it's up to them to make the decision to want to move forward. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. We've been voted one of the best places to work in Nashville 11 times. You want to know how we do it? Well, our team has been using LinkedIn jobs for years to find the best people from all over the country to come and help us change lives.

Think about it. LinkedIn has more than 600 million active members. I'm talking about people who come to LinkedIn to make connections, grow their careers, and discover new job opportunities. In fact, 90% of LinkedIn users are open to new opportunities but not actively scanning job boards. This means LinkedIn Jobs gives you access to an entirely different demographic. Don't wait.

One hire can change the direction of your company. Post a job today at linkedin.com slash Ramsey and get $50 off your first job post. That's linkedin.com slash Ramsey. Terms and conditions apply. Hello, America. You are listening to The Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Chris Hogan filling in for Dave. And I want to make you aware

that I have a show. It's The Chris Hogan Show. It's available on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, as well as SiriusXM. And we have a lot of fun. We're digging in, talking about the everyday millionaire content. That was the largest study that's ever been done on millionaires. We talked to over 10,000 of them from all across the country. But we also dig into topics in retirement, but also money. And so if you haven't listened to it, I want you to definitely check it out. You can go to ChrisHogan360.com and learn more. I've got some upcoming episodes that are just, I've had a lot of fun with those. Coming up on 828, I release, When It Comes to Money, Don't Despise Small Beginnings.

And so many of these everyday millionaires, that's exactly what they did. They started small, but they worked towards something. They were being very intentional. So I would love for you to check it out and become one of my VIPs. All right, we're going to get on the phones. If you've got a question about money, I want to hear from you. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225, or you can find us on social media at Ramsey Show or at ChrisHogan360.

Okay, I'm going to get on the horn here. Let's see. I've got Josh on the line. Josh, how are you? I'm great. How are you? Oh, my friend, I'm focused and not finished. What's on your mind today? Well, first off, it's an honor to speak with you.

Secondly, I'm a little ashamed of myself. I apologize. I recently discovered about myself I've got a gambling addiction, and I'm currently trying to get back on track, and I'm wondering if bankruptcy is a viable option for me at this point. Okay. Josh, tell me this, my friend. What makes you think you have an addiction?

I find myself at the casino every chance I get and the other night when I walked out of there you know with nothing again I kind of went home and looked at all the numbers and it was it was horrific really so tell me about the numbers what what is it right now well uh just this is a new thing for me i've never really had a problem with addiction or any problem this is a recent thing this year so from january to to now just this year i've paid uh about 2,700 and overdraft fees to the bank and over $25,000 to the casino. Okay. All right. That's a lot, isn't it?

Yeah, but it's all my fault. One million percent. It's my fault. I understand that. And, Josh, I'm going to tell you something. The fact that you're owning it like that, that you're not looking to blame anybody, tells me a lot about where you are, my friend, because you can't fix anything you're not looking to blame anybody tells me a lot about where you are, my friend, because you can't fix anything you're not willing to acknowledge.

So I'm proud of you for calling in. I'm proud of you for speaking this and understanding kind of where you are. This $25,000, are you using this out of your checking account, or are you using debt to gamble? No, I just didn't pay any bills. Okay. All right. what's going on are you dealing with a life situation what happened that caused you to start doing this more in january

well i've never really gambled before this year i went through my second divorce last year and uh i just i don't know uh idle hands i guess guess. I don't know, just bad decisions. I work a lot, and I live alone, and I get bored. And, you know, I Uber and Lyft part-time when I'm not at work and on the weekends. And, you know, I drop people off and pick people up at the casino. So it all started, I guess, because there was a couple that invited me in, like, hey, clock out and come hang out with us. Gotcha.

Gotcha. You know. Yeah. Tell me this. How much debt do you have? Is this $25,000 that you've spent? What debt do you have right now? Oh, I've got $65,000.

Okay. What is that? None of it's gambling debt. You have $65,000 in gambling debt? None of it is gambling debt. None of it's gambling debt. You have $65,000 in gambling debt? None of it is gambling debt. None of it is. No. Okay.

Like I said, I've basically paid for this addiction out of my payroll. Okay. My payroll checks for the year. See, I've got a car. I've got some personal loans. I've got some student loans. I owe the IRS. And then most of it is unsecured credit card debt and finance companies and stuff.

Okay. How much of it is student loan? $10,000. Okay. How much of it is your car? $16,000. Okay. All right.

And what's your income right now, my friend? Well, with my salary and commission, that's $66,000. And then I get $7,200 worth of VA disability. And then with the Uber and Lyft, it's about $10,000 annually. Okay. All right. So I'm right at $80,000. Okay. Josh, I do not think that you're at the point that you should consider bankruptcy. Okay?

You're not. You're not there. Okay? Where you are, though, is at a point of opportunity right now. Like, you've got an amazing opportunity, my friend. See, you've acknowledged a struggle. You've acknowledged a problem. You understand the numbers and what you've spent as far as gambling. Now, this next step, you called in to ask for help, and I'm proud of you. But the next thing that you do is going to reveal your

opportunity, which is believing you can turn this thing around. You've had some life changes, my friend. You said you went through your second divorce. You're living by yourself, right? And I'm going to tell you, isolating is the wrong thing to do. What you have to do is get connected. You need some good men around you. You need to find a church. I want you to go find a counselor and therapist that you can sit down and talk about this. And I want you to go find a counselor and therapist that you can sit down and talk about this. And I want you to have something that you can do with the idle hands, i.e. read, get connected, have some conversations. But you're not alone. This can be fixed. Your income, $66,000 plus your VA benefits and you're working. So you have the ability to be able to turn this around,

but you're not going to be able to do it alone. And that's what too many people try to do. They don't reach out. They don't ask for help. And you've done those things, my friend, and I'm proud of you. And I want you to take that next step, which is get a counselor, get somebody you can sit down and talk with. You can even call the Gambling Anonymous line to be able to have a conversation. But I want you to be focused. You can do this. It's frustrating. But being able to make sure you're taking care of the bills that you have to have a roof over your head, that's job one.

Okay? And so what you're going to have to do is that next urge you have to go to the casino, I want you to have another place that you go to, and that's go to a good friend and sit down and talk, right? But I'm not telling you it's going to be easy. I'm just saying it's going to be worthwhile. But bankruptcy is not an option. I'm glad you've not opened up any kind of debt in the line of credits at the casinos or whatever else is out there. Don't go that route. You can't win your way out of this situation. You got to work your way out. And that work is day to day. And I would encourage you, I'm going to gift you Financial Peace University, because what you're going to

find is other like-minded people that are in there that are wanting to strive and wanting to win. So I will be praying for you, my friend. As I said, the order of operations is to get you a counselor, number one Then I want you to find some good friends to be around But you need to get plugged into a church You need some people around you that you can talk to and be real with Just like you were with me And it takes courage to reach out when you struggle And when you're having a problem

And I'm proud of you I'm very, very proud for you taking that opportunity America, I know he's not the only one. John isn't. And we all have some things out there and we can struggle at times. Things can get frustrating and irritating, but you're not alone. And isolating is dangerous because then you're in your own head and your voice is the only one that you're hearing, which you need to hear some people that believe in you, that are encouraging you, that know what you can do. And here's what I found. Whenever you've walked through a mess,

I firmly believe that it qualifies you to become a messenger. That means you can share your story with someone else. You can help kind of shine that light because it's not new for you. If you've walked through some tough times, find somebody to put your arm around. I think we all need certain people in our lives. You need a coach, somebody to push you. You need a mentor, someone to guide you. You need a friend, someone that'll listen to you. And you need a cheerleader, somebody that believes in you. You find those four people in your life, but you also need to be one of those four for someone else.

This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. I'm Chris Hogan. fantastic today. If you've got a question you want to talk about it, give us a call. Our number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. And definitely find us and follow us on social. You can look up at Ramsey Show, and you can also look for me at ChrisHogan360. We have had some phenomenal calls, people that are talking about real world situations, and that's exactly what we're all about. So I've got Bob on the line. Bob, how are you, sir? I'm doing fine. Thank you for taking my phone call.

Oh, you're very welcome. How can I help you? Well, my wife and I are hosting a financial peace university at our local church. Very cool. And it's going well. We've got our group to set aside their $1,000 emergency fund, starting to attack their debt snowball. But I've got a young couple who are not quite convinced that they should stop their 401k contribution since it's matched to a degree in order to attack. And quite frankly, I just don't know how to address it.

Okay. Do you, how much debt do they have? About 40, I think they have about 40,000 or so. Okay. You know, we took all the debts in and I'm averaging what the group debt would be. Right. Well, okay. First and foremost, let me thank you and your wife for being coordinators for Financial Peace University. I don't think there's any better gift than you helping other people kind of find their way. Bob, here's what I found as a financial coach. I tell people that if you are gazelle intense, if you're serious

about getting out of debt, that pausing investing is the thing to do. Now, I shifted. It's a semantic difference between stopping investing and pausing. Pausing it means I'm taking that money and turning it toward debt. And so what I would do if I were you is talk with them and find out what motivates them. What's the thing that they're driving toward that they're trying to accomplish? For example, if they have kids, most of the time people are very motivated to attack debt for the sake of their legacy, for their children. And ultimately, here's the thing, Bob, your success as a coordinator isn't depending upon them stopping or pausing.

It's really more a matter of them getting on the same page. And again, that whole mindset around getting a match, Bob, I've heard it time and time again, and it's okay. You know, ultimately, if you're helping them to get on a budget, for them to be in agreement that attacking debt is a good thing, and then they're going to save and invest, then you've helped them. They get to pick and choose. But I just say, hey, if you're really motivated, you don't have a problem pausing to be able to direct that money toward debt. So it just really boils down to how motivated are they? Super motivated people want to get to the destination. They want to get there. So they're willing to do the things that are've got Diane on the phone. Diane, how are you? I'm great. How are you?

Oh, I'm focused and not finished, young lady. What's on your mind? I need some help. Uh-oh. I've been through financial peace, university. Okay. I'm on baby step number two. Okay.

I'm 52, and after marrying for 15 years, I'm now divorced with three kids, 16, 13, and 11. I have no retirement and no college funds. Okay. My debt snowball consists of student loans that have been deferred forever. And I have a piece of land that I am kind of emotionally attached to. Okay. But I'm thinking if I sell my land, I can net enough to pay off my student loans, use the rest of the money to refinance my house where I could save about $500 a month on my house note. So between my student loans, my land note, and my house, I could save $1,100 a month. Okay. And I would be debt-free except for my house. All right.

And I could start saving for retirement. I could start with my college fund for my kids. Diane. Yes. You don't need any help. You're focused on it. Oh, I am, but I'm emotionally attached to the land. Like it's three acres and I'm like, that's where my grandkids are coming. Come visit me. Okay. Hold on. Do I really want to take care of three acres. Okay. This three acres of land, where did it come from? We bought it when I was married, when we moved to a different county for the schools. I mean, we live in a fabulous community, and that was going to be our forever home. That's where we were going to retire and die.

Okay. So you didn't inherit it. It didn't come from family. You all bought this. Correct. Okay. And do you know the thing about that three acres is that you concocted and developed a dream in your head and in your heart? Oh, yes. Oh, yeah.

It's clear. You could see it. And that dream has not been thrown away. That dream can be located on three acres somewhere else. And I want you to get yourself to the point as you've already done you just did the numbers how much is this land worth um i owe 40 on it but i could sell it for probably 150 excuse me yes 150 yes okay wow We've got land down the street, and it just sold for $90,000, and it was two acres. Okay.

So that's what I'm using for my comp. I have three. And what is your household income right now, Diane? I make $60,000. Okay. And you have all three of the kids? Correct. And you have a mortgage?

Correct. How much is your mortgage payment? I am not going to lie. I am overextended. And the reason that I am is because I had to be in this neighborhood so that my children with their extracurricular activities could walk across the street to the school. How much do you owe on this house? My house, I owe $250. It's worth $280.

My house note is $1,600. Wow. Yes. Okay. Guess what? We did it for location, location, location. Okay. Well, and listen to me. I'm okay. I'm going to tell you what the kids need. Their mama, their mama, their mama. I know. Okay. And so what we can't do is we can't try to be everything to everybody. So if this land means that much to you, then you need to sell the house and go get an apartment. We can't do that. No, you're not. Say I'm not willing to. I am not willing to.

There you go. When we got divorced, this is now my kids. This is now their home. I understand. I understand. But I need you to understand something that home has some bricks some wood and some mortar what they need is their mom yes okay and so because of you feeling that way and i'm just helping you walk through the

process the decision tree which just means guess what you need to contact an ELP or a realtor and get this land put on the market ASAP. I am a realtor, so. Listen to me. Don't be holding out on me. Oh, and I'm an accountant. I'm an CPA. See, you know this. No, it is.

And you know what? I'm proud of you because what you're doing is wrestling with the emotional decision. You did the numbers. You laid it out. And you're absolutely right. You being willing to sacrifice this land sets you up to attack debt to give you some breathing room so now the house isn't as much

of a stressor. Right. Right. And you're a realtor, which means you don't have a cap on your income. Right? Yeah. So you can do this. You can do this. I just wanted you to tell me I should. Not only do I think you should, I think you're going to be grateful that you did.

Because what's going to happen is that stress that you're feeling, because you're trying to hold on to everything. You're trying to make everybody happy, and you're trying to do it all. I want you to know your hands can only hold so much. So you pick and choose what you set down, what you're willing to sacrifice. But that sacrifice, and listen to me, you're walking through some life change as well. And so you've got some emotions attached to that, but you're a realtor. You don't have cap on your income. You can find other land.

You can do that. And you can still have that dream of having that home where your grandkids are going to come visit you. I have 100% belief in you for that. And again, it's just that little nudge. And I want you to do that, Diane. I want you to stay in touch with us and let us know. You have helped some other people out there right now that are dealing with some life change and some challenges because we have to pick and choose.

We tend to have an and mentality. We want to do this and do that. And the reality is, is we got to make some choices. We need to do the things that matter most. And sometimes we do have to make some sacrifices, but those sacrifices can set us up to be able to move forward. And also for you out there that's dealing with some setbacks, listen to me. A setback can be a setup for a comeback. All you got to do is keep trying. It ain't done. You're the referee. You control the count.

I want you to stay focused. Well, listen, I want to thank all the callers. I want to thank James Childs, associate producer Kelly Daniel, and of course you, America, for calling in and making today absolutely fantastic. Until next time, stay focused

because you're not finished. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. Did you know you can now listen to The Dave Ramsey Show on Pandora and Spotify? For all the ways to watch and listen, check out our showcase at DaveRamsey.com slash show.