The Ramsey Show - App - Where You Spend Your Money Reveals What's Important (Hour 3)

Episode Date: August 9, 2019

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🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is done, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. You jump in, we'll talk about your life, your money. It's a free call at 888-825-5225. And some say the advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. Norma is with us to start off this hour in Greensboro, North Carolina.

Hi, Norma, how are you? Hi, Dave, thanks so much for taking my call. I really appreciate it. Mya. How are you? Hi, Dave. Thanks so much for taking my call. I really appreciate it. My pleasure. How can I help? Yes. So my parents and I are really trying to figure out how to or what to do with this Parent Plus loan they took out for me over 12 years ago. Of course, had I known then what I know now, things would look totally different. But the loan is now at $72,000. My parents are in no way able to pay for this. My dad is supposed to retire in September. We're all freaking out because we're worried they're going to garnish his check.

My husband and I are trying to figure out what we need to do to pay this off, whether we need to sell our house or take out. We don't know what to do. We're all kind of panicking. I feel burdened by this because this is their only debt and it's really holding them back. And so I just need guidance. I'm willing to do whatever we need to do to free them of this. Why have they not paid it off? Their own financial crisis. My dad only makes about $1,800 a month. The loan or the payment is like at $1,000 right now. Why did they agree to borrow $72,000 if he makes $1,800 a month? Well, this was 12 years ago.

And then it was not at $72 thousand dollars with the interest and them not being able to pay um that is where it is now my dad was originally borrowed yeah what was originally i believe it should have been um about forty thousand so your dad took out a forty thousand dollar loan he made twenty thousand dollars a year no at that time he was in california he made significantly more um the job closed so it was kind of like just a crisis after crisis, and they had already taken out that loan. Yeah. How old are you?

You know, I am 31. And what's your household income? So our household is about anywhere from $3,000 to about $7,000, just as in the last two to three months. My husband just left his job. We're both working our own businesses that are doing better than it was prior, so we're hoping to be able to take care of some things. How much debt do you have?

We have my husband's student loan at $39,000 and then our mortgage at $108,000. We have about $60,000 in equity in our house. Okay. Well, your parents are the only ones that are liable for this loan legally. You know that, right? Mm-hmm. Okay. Morally, you want to help your parents because they have made a mess,

and they did that to help you. Yes. And so you feel the moral obligation. Although at the time they took out the loan, you guys did not even have a handshake that said you are responsible for this. They fully intended to pay for it. They just never have. Right. And they still feel like they want to handle it,

but they know they can't, and I know they can't. Right. What's their house worth? They don't have any. They live in an apartment, so they don't have any debt outside of my student loan. They don't own a house. Okay.

Uh-uh. All right. And how old are they? My dad's going to be 65 in September, and my mom is like 58. Okay. And why does your mom not work? She's had some medical challenges that have prevented her from working. What are the nature of her medical challenges?

A lot of joint pain. And I actually just got diagnosed with Lyme disease, so I'm kind of stepping into that similar. So I kind of understand the severe fatigue where I'm barely working 10 to 15 hours and I'm beat. So she deals with some serious pain issues. Okay. That's sad. Okay. Because really, what it amounts to is between the two households, somehow we've got to find $72,000 because otherwise they're going to take their tax returns and their Social Security until they get their money.

Okay. So they would garnish my dad's check. They'll take everything. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. It's a federally insured student loan, which gives them access to anything that's federal. Okay. Yeah, it's a federally insured student loan, which gives them access to anything that's federal. Okay. Nothing else can get at it, but that can get at it. Okay. So I'm not going to panic, but, you know, between the two of you,

you need to sit down and do a budget and start putting $1,000 a month on this thing, and then soon after, you guys get your husband's student loan debt cleared up. Then, and only then, do you put extra money on this. But if you get a little bit started, get $1,000 a month started on it, they're not going to do anything at that point. If you can get some kind of a payment plan working with them, $1,000 a month will take care of it. You put in $500, they put in $500.

And your dad's just going to work more, and he's not retiring at 65. Okay. He has $72,000 in debt and no money and no assets. And so he's going to be working more. And you and your husband are going to be doing everything you can to get your income up, and you can put in $500 a month if you want, but no more until you get your house in order when you get your house in order then you're in a position to do charity

and that's what this is is charity okay can i ask you a question sure if i if i take over my my home we take over the student loan payment just a thousand dollars and my dad still retires at 65 would they still take his checks or no? That's as long as if we're making the regular payments, they can't touch his Social Security. If you make a deal with them and pay the payment that is the deal, they're not going to do that. But that doesn't work.

That doesn't work. You guys don't have enough money to do that. You just took on $100,000 plus in debt with your household income and you are telling me you're fatigued with Lyme disease. That doesn't work. He needs to keep working. Is selling

the house just not wise at all? No. It's not. It's not. It's not. Because here's the deal. If, God forbid, your parents were to pass away, the loan is gone. Mm-hmm. And so I'm, you know, there's cold hard facts in here, and there's a lot of feelings and a lot of things you want to take care of mom and dad, but, you don't make three hundred thousand dollars a year and you're not worth two

million dollars if you did and you were i'd tell you to write a check and that's fine pay it off i got no issue with that i'm not mad about this but you just you guys have your household to watch over first and frankly your parents have done a crummy job in the last 12 years. 12 freaking years, and they didn't take care of $40,000 in debt. They've done a crummy job. And so, you know, they really have. And yeah, I understand they had some setbacks, and they had some things happen. I've had things happen to me. But 12 freaking years for $40,000?

And didn't pay a dime on it. Not a dime. Not once. And so, yeah, he's working. He's working a while longer. It won't hurt him. It'll be good for him. I know he's 65.

I'm 57. We'll work. It's okay. You got $72,000 in debt. Work. And you guys get your budget tightened up and jump in there and help him. I'm with you on that part of it. This is the Dave Ramsey Show.

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Plus, take an additional 5% off at Blinds.com. Slash Ramsey. Blinds.com. Slash Ramsey Richards in Arizona. Do you have any tips on getting my significant other on board? We've been together for about 10 years, and for the past four years I've been making good money, but nothing to show for it.

All she wants to do is take vacations and go out to eat. Richard, you're probably not going to like my advice, but I'll give it to you anyway because you asked. Here's the thing. I answer questions on this show, what would I do if I were in your shoes? 20, 25 studies with all kinds of data points in them that indicate all of them conclusively that people who are married get along better than people who are shacked up when it comes to money. And people who are married versus being shacked up actually statistically become wealthier on average.

Now, there's exceptions, obviously, but there's a tremendous data out there that talks about the benefits of marriage. Now, I look at that as a Christian through a moral lens as well, but that's not what I'm talking about here. I'm talking about just the practical data points that say that your relationship functions better in that situation. It's a little different telling your girlfriend what to do than it is your wife. It's a little different telling your husband what to do than your boyfriend. Or when something's important to you. I think we should do this, but there's not really a we.

I think we need to get on a budget and we need to save for retirement, but there's not really a we, not legally speaking. And for that matter, not spiritually speaking. And data says not relationally speaking. So you leave yourself at a disadvantage there. So you asked, you know, so I'll just tell you. I think part of the problem is marriage. So I think you get married,

and part of your pre-marriage counseling, even though you've been together for a bazillion years, you ought to sit down with a good pastor, a good marriage coach, a good marriage counselor, and get pre-marriage counseling should include, let's get on the same page with money. And, you know, we need to be on the same page with money. We need to say, okay, we're going to live on a written plan that we both agree to and that we both have a vote on. So it's not me telling you what to do, not, we're going to live on a written plan that we both agree to and that we both have a vote on. So it's not me telling you what to do, not you telling me what to do, but we're going to get on a plan and we're going to work towards being debt-free.

Why? Because that leads us to be able to be more generous and to be able to go on vacations or go out to eat and that kind of stuff. But, I mean, if you will just step back and say, it's tough for me to get my roommate to not want to go out to eat, that's a different discussion than I want to talk to my wife about we eat out too much because when we're 80 years old, we're going to be broke if we don't straighten this out. It's a different discussion. It really is. And I know some of you don't think it out. It's a different discussion. It really is. And I know some of you don't think it is, but you're wrong. Again, I've read 20, 25 studies on this,

and there's all kinds of socioeconomic, psychological, relational data out there that matches up with my faith belief as well, which happens to be handy. But it's not just this blind thing of, oh, Dave Ramsey's one of those guys that believes in God. Well, yeah, he is one of those guys that believes in God. And so I believe you ought to be married before you're sleeping together. I know. Duh. But that's just that.

I know. I know some of you don't like that. And you know how much I care? Not at all. So that's what I believe. And so you asked, you're going to get that. That's what you're going to get. So, by the way, those of you that are getting engaged or thinking about getting married,

one of the best pieces of research that I ever saw, and I've read it in probably read similar conclusions in several different locations, says that before you get married, if you want a highly successful marriage and a very low probability of a future of divorce, I mean, it takes your divorce rate well under 10% if you do this. It's amazing. These four things, be in agreement on these four things. Money is the big one.

Number one thing people fight about in marriage, in relationships, is money. So be in agreement on it. Finding agreement on money is everything. Because where you spend your money says what you think is important. And when you think two different things are important all the time, you're never going to have fun. Now, if you can get to both of them, that's fine. But you're never going to have a great relationship when one of you wants to spend like you're in Congress and the other wants to save everything and live in a cave and only come out on triple coupon Thursday and collects Lent, you know. And so you have to get on this.

You have to have this discussion, this meeting of the minds on your value system on money. And that's a budget. That's getting out of debt. That's building wealth. It's putting money in the 401K because we want to be an everyday millionaire, all those kinds of things, right? Being in agreement on money is one of the things. Number two is being in agreement on money is one of the things.

Number two is being in agreement on kids. How many to have, if we're going to have them, and how we're going to treat them. Ramses are old-fashioned people, as you can already tell. The inmates do not run the asylum at our place. We are in charge. You're smaller than me. I can take you out and make another one that looks just like you. We are in charge. You're smaller than me. I can take you out and make another one that looks just like you. That was my theory.

And so you're going to behave. And my grandkids are being raised the same way. Thank you, Jesus. So there you go. We're not mean. We just don't raise little hellions that think they're in charge. They're respectful. And as the three-year-old said the other day, they have consequences if they're not. What three-year-old says consequences?

Rachel Cruises, that's a vocabulary, unbelievable. So I have consequences. You get your butt busted. It's a good thing, you know. So how you're going to treat your kids, how many you're going to have if you're going to have them. The third one is in-laws. How you're going to deal with the crazy people in each other's family. And every family has crazy in it.

If you don't think there's crazy in your family, it's you. Every family has crazy in it somewhere. How are you going to deal with some kind of someone who's going to violate a boundary at some point and if you don't have that set up you're going to get to experience it and it's going to be a strain on your relationship and the last one is being in agreement on religion it's very unusual for people to have long long long

happy high quality relationships that have two different spiritual beliefs. Now, I'm not talking about Baptist or Methodist. I'm talking about, you know, one of you doesn't believe there's a God, one of you does. So on, that kind of thing. Because it changes, well, your value system gives you your beliefs, and your beliefs give you your attitudes, and those give you your actions. And so your actions are always going to be in conflict with each other when you don't have basic belief systems in harmony. That's what it comes down to. So you need to be in agreement on religion, in-laws, kids, and money.

If you do that prior to marriage, I'm telling you, you could almost wipe out the probability of divorce. If you want to add to it a couple of things, here's a couple of the data points. If the household income stays over 50 000 you did not have a child prior to marriage out of wedlock in other words uh you both graduate from college these are all variables you control if you do that with the four things i'm talking about, your divorce rate drops below 5%. 52% of Americans end up in divorce. Yeah, but it's messed up situations most of the time. You can control a lot of these variables. It's the quality of your character, the quality of your life, and the quality of your decisions.

And being in harmony intentionally. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions, Justin and Ariel are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Good. We're good. Welcome. Where do you guys live? Memphis, Tennessee.

Wow. And all the way to Nashville to do your debt-free screen. Yes, sir. Welcome. Good to have you guys. Glad to be here. So how much have you paid off? We've paid off $45,000.

Wow. How fast did you do that? It took about a little bit under three years. Okay. Very good. And your range of income during that time? It's about $75,000. That's the max.

About $30,000, $35,000 is the least. Gotcha. What do you all do for a living? I'm a photographer. And I just opened a home daycare. I was a teacher for five years. Okay. Gotcha. What do you all do for a living? I'm a photographer. Mm-hmm. And I just opened a home daycare. I was a teacher for five years. Okay, cool. Very good.

So what kind of debt was the $45,000? Forty of it was my student loans. Selling me for the photographer. Selling me, selling me. Yes. And five was credit cards. Right. Okay, cool.

So how long have you guys been married? Almost four years. Okay. Four years in cards. Right. Okay, cool. So how long have you guys been married? Almost four years. Okay. Four years in December. Okay, so after you get married and go along about a year, you decide we're going to get out of debt. Tell me the story.

What started this? Well, I grew up listening to you in the car. My dad plays you all the time. Oh, you're a financial peace baby. Yeah, I am. He paid for five kids to go to college, so I didn't have debt. Yeah, he was hardcore. Look at him. Way to go to college, so I didn't have debt. Yeah, he was hardcore.

Look at him. Way to go, Dad. And then I met Justin, and we got together, and then he told me he had debt, and I was like, okay, that's not going to stay for long. I knew nothing about paying off debt. Okay, so because you've been listening since you were a wee child in the car, Justin's got a whole new idea if he's going to marry you. Whole new world. Okay. All right.

But it took about a year to get started? Yes, sir. It took about a year or so just to get really serious. Okay. All right. Now tell me, what's the secret to getting out of debt? You pay $45,000. Very good.

Very good. Being married to her and also just just being I guess consistent and like just looking forward to the end goal live on less than

what you make we didn't finance anything we cash flowed a car we lived in a tiny apartment and kind of humbly

for some years and weren't afraid to look kind of crazy to people. Don't care what other people think. No, not at all. That's good.

So tell me about the home daycare. Did you have a baby and decide to come home and then take care of other people's? No, I was teaching for a while. And my last year teaching, the Lord was just laying it on my heart to go out and try something new. And so kind of setting it up so when the kids do come, that I can be there and just go with the flow. Okay.

I love it though. Very cool. Very cool. Good. So are you making more money or less money than when you were teaching? So I just started. So right now it's less.

Okay. But enrollment and all of that is going on. And we just bought a new house too. Ah, okay. Got out of debt and got the house. Yes. Perfect order. Good.

Very good. And that gives you the room to do it. Yeah. Correct. Obviously. We actually have space to have people in the house now. Kind of refreshing. Yeah.

Oh, to do the photography as well or just visitors? Oh, no. Just visitors, family and friends. Just entertaining. Okay. Correct. Instead of one bedroom. Ah, I got you.

Yeah. You get out of that little cramped apartment, it makes a difference. Yeah. Stretch your legs a little bit. Correct. Instead of one bedroom. Ah, I got you. Yeah, you get out of that little cramped apartment, it makes a difference. Stretch your legs a little bit. Exactly. That was a good motivation, too, to pay it off. Like, okay, I want to get out of here. Right. I want to get out of here.

Let's pay this off. Right. Very good. Well, congratulations, you guys. Thank you. Did you have people cheering you on? I know Dad was, I'm sure. Who else?

Well, he actually passed away when I was in college. But I definitely was thinking about it. Well, he was cheering you on anyway. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, we're in a marriage group. So we got to share our experience with them along the way of getting there. And I think we...

Family, parents. Yeah, family. Yeah, my parents. And my mom. Yeah. Okay. All right. Good. Very good. Well, congratulations, you guys. Thank you. Very, and family. Yeah, my parents. And my mom. Yeah. Okay. All right. Good.

Very good. Well, congratulations, you guys. Thank you. We're proud of you. Thanks for making the trip from Memphis to do your debt-free screen. Absolutely. We've got a copy of Chris Hogan's retire-inspired book for you. Awesome.

That is the next chapter in your story to be millionaires now. Yes. And outrageously generous along the way. I want to hear from you when you hit the millionaire status, okay? Absolutely. Very good. All right, Justin and Ariel from Memphis, Tennessee. $45,000 paid off in three years, making $75,000 a year.

Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. What are we doing? Five, three, two, one. We're debt-free! There we go. Game on. Love it, love it, love it.

Very well done. Very well done. Kathy's in St. Cloud, Minnesota. Hi, Kathy, how are you? Good, how are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? So I've got a question here for you on our situation.

I'm 26 years old, my husband's 31, and we have a 15-month-old daughter. So currently we're on baby step four, and we're investing at 9.5%. With my husband's income and mine combined, we make $77,000. Without my income, my husband makes roughly $38,000. Our mortgage is at, we owe $63,000 on our mortgage, and it's a 15-year loan at 4.5%. So when I do the math, that's 27% of my husband's take-home pay, and then if you include property tax, it's 31%. What does your husband do?

He is an assembler, welder. Okay, and what your husband do? He is an assembler welder. Okay, and what do you do? I actually am an eligibility worker at the county. Okay, all right. And so your question is what? So my question is with my job and my pension, I'm not quite yet vested, but I will be in about 15 months. We just found out that we are expecting a second child. And so my question is, is it okay to just pull away and become a stay-at-home mom?

Well, what I would do is practice living on his income only, which means you would bank your entire check. Yeah, that's what we plan on doing this winter. If you can bank your entire check, you've proven to yourself what I think doesn't matter, but you want to prove to yourself that you can live on his check, right? Right. And if you can do that, say pay all the bills and you put your entire check in savings, I mean, you could pull a little bit out to cover gas or something that you won't have when you're not working right outside the home.

And so some of your costs will go down when you stay home. There's some other savings as well but I don't want to lean too heavily on those. I want you to learn to live on his income. And then the second part of the equation is I'm going to have some real strong discussions about what he's doing to increase his income. You know, he's 32. At 42, I don't want him making 38. Yeah. You know, I hear all these news reports about stagnant wages.

Yeah, wages are stagnant, but stagnant people sometimes have stagnant wages because we just don't pay attention. And so what you've got to do is not be stagnant people sometimes have stagnant wages because we just don't pay attention. And so what you've got to do is not be stagnant. You've got to say, I'm going to look and what have I got to do to make, instead of 32, what have I got to do to make 62? What have I got to do to make 162? And I don't know what he does with that. Maybe he owns a welding shop someday and has people working for him. I don't know. But long term, 10-year plan, 5-year plan, what are we doing to get his income up?

Because, you know, I don't want you at $38,000, which is less. The average household income in America is about $56,000 right now. And so you would be at, you know, considerably less than the average household income, which is fine, but I don't want that to be my long-term game plan. Does that make sense? Okay. So I want to talk about his career track, and I want you to live on his check. And if you do both those things, then absolutely, if your desire is to be home full-time with the children,

then absolutely go do that. No matter the pension, no matter, you know, because when the second child comes, we'd roughly get about $300 for my income and net income after all expenses, daycare, all of that. Doesn't matter. But I've just been struggling with that. Yeah, it doesn't matter if you can live on his and your desires to be at home. Okay.

And if he has a plan to increase his over time, and maybe you've got a plan to do something and start a business or start a new career when the kids start school someday. I don't know. But anything in that's okay. But let's have an idea that, yes, you're going to come home, and, yes, there's going to be some sacrifice for you to be a full-time mom. But that's not our permanent, stagnant way of looking at this.

That's all I'm asking. But I think it's a great idea, especially since it's what you want to do, kiddo. Hey, thanks for the call. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. Our scripture today, Colossians 3, 1 through 2. Since then, you have been raised with Christ. Set your hearts on things above where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things. Norman Schwarzkopf said,

Leadership is a potent combination of strategy and character. But if you must be without one, be without strategy. Ooh, that's good. Sarah's with us in Chicago. Hi, Sarah. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Hi. It's so good to talk to you.

You too. What's up? So I'll try to make this brief. It's complicated. But anyways, my husband is a helicopter pilot. He has a very lucrative career. He's done very well. He worked really, really hard, completed the entire program in nine months. His parents funded that. Seven years ago, his cousin on his mom's side decided that they wanted to be a helicopter pilot too. There was no money, so his mom convinced the grandparents to loan her $100,000 to do it. She was given $100,000, didn't follow the program, broke every rule that was set. My husband's, or my father-in-law was against it. It was kind of a joke in the family. It's my husband, myself, and my father-in-law against his mom and her mom. There was no accountability. She would go on trips and spend, I mean, you name it, she did it.

This is your mother-in-law or your mother-in-law's sister? My mother-in-law, it's my mother, the girl wanting to fly is my mother-in-law's niece. Yeah, but who screwed up the money, your mother-in-law? My mother-in-law and her mom. Okay, your mother-in-law is the one that misbehaved and blew the money. Is that what you're saying yeah pretty much um so anyways to fast forward now my husband and i bought our own personal helicopter um two years ago and now my mother-in-law wants us to let this cousin use it to keep, I call it funding her misbehavior.

They call it, um, showing grace and that the problem is me. I just don't like her. And my husband and I made it, this is where it gets spicy. So my husband and I made the decision when we bought the helicopter that she was not going to use it. Um, and that was the decision when we bought the helicopter that she was not going to use it, and that was our decision. However, now my father-in-law has given up on trying to defend this. It's been a whole marriage problem with them, so he's taken my mother-in-law's side.

So my father-in-law calls at my husband and undoes the decisions that we made. No, he doesn't. No, he doesn't. Your husband did. Your husband wimped. Your father-in-law doesn't have the power to do that. Only your husband does. Okay. Well, my husband says that...

You and your husband need to see a marriage counselor. Because his parents are freaks. That's what you've just described to me. And if the two of you don't get on the same page on how to deal with the freak show that is his family, you're going to end up divorced. Okay. Does that make sense to you yeah his family's a freak show and you can't fix them and you can't even do them be the one that sets the boundaries he has to set the boundaries because that's what he's suggesting he says well you march in there and you set the rules

he needs to he needs to actually he needs to actually have a backbone. Run down to Walmart on all three, pick up a backbone, boy. Your mama's crazier than a bean and your wife is right. You need to keep your word to your wife. Okay, so how would you answer this? I get asked all the time, well, how do you know your rules are right? I don't even know how to defend that. Because it's my freaking helicopter. I don't have to defend my rules it's my house it's my i want to drive your

car no well how do you know that's okay because it's my car and i decided. No. It's not mean. It's saying, look, we have decided that this is how we're going to run our lives. And if you don't like that, then you have to decide how you're going to react to that. But we can't control your reaction. All we can control is what we are going

to do. And here's what we're going to do. We don't loan out our helicopter. By the way to anybody anybody we don't give it to anybody else either non-family members if somebody else walks up to and says oh i want to use your no we don't helicopter is not something you you know you you loan it to somebody over the weekend hello it's not my husband has even my husband has even said things like, to me, if this causes my parents to get divorced, I'll never forgive you. Then you need marriage counseling.

Your husband is more loyal to his parents than he is to his wife. By the way, he set up a game. He set up a boundary. He's the one that went back on his word. How about I don't forgive you for, you know, having no backbone when your father called? I think you're hitting on a major problem because his dad will openly admit that he loves his son more than he loves his wife. Well, there you go. So we need to decide.

Listen, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and to health, you leave your parents and cleave to your spouse. I love my parents. I love my wife's parents. They do not run my house. My daughters and my son are married. I do not run their house. They run their house. I have to respect their decisions.

They're grown people. They have their decisions. They're grown people. They have their thing. My son just got married and his new wife is not going to have to struggle with the Ramseys getting between the two of them. If one of the Ramseys does that, they'll have to deal with me because that's not going to happen. One last question. Yeah, I guess it's all blows down.

I've been told by the entire family if I don't do what his mom says, she'll hate me for the rest of my life. Oh, well. Oh, well. I have to put up with a bully. I have to do everything you say, and that's the only way you like me. No, that's not liking you that means you're a wuss and you have no opinion and no backbone you're a jellyfish and you know you're not even a real adult you're just this woman pushes everybody around this this chick is a she's a test pilot for a broom factory

i mean what you're describing here is completely dysfunctional family i'm not a financial i mean i'm a financial counselor i'm not a family counselor but i run into this crap all the time around the money issues the book is boundaries by dr henry cloud you and your husband need to get that and you need to read it by monday and you need to be in marriage counseling sometime in the next four days. This is not going to end well, Sarah, if you guys don't take a proactive stance to protect your marriage. This is not a mother-in-law problem. It's not a helicopter problem.

It's not a niece problem. And it's not a grandmother problem. It's a marriage problem. Am I wrong? I think you pretty much hit it on the head. Yeah. Here's the thing. When you set boundaries with people like his mother, the first thing they do is attack

those boundaries because they don't like boundaries. And they're going to be angry. Boundary-less people don't like being told where the fences are. The first thing you did, you set a boundary on the helicopter. What did they do? They all immediately went after that boundary. And you're not crazy. They are.

It's a classic case study. It's classic in this space. Book is Boundaries by Dr. Henry Cloud. It'll be the new Bible for your house. One of them anyway. And you guys are going to sit down and you two are going

to have to get on the same page about his crazy family because they're consuming you guys and they're going to consume this marriage. That puts this hour

of the Dave Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.

This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. Once again, you made The Dave Ramsey Show one of the top five most downloaded podcasts last year. To get your daily dose of motivation and inspiration, subscribe today.