The Ramsey Show - App - You Are Not the Person You Were Yesterday (Hour 2)

Episode Date: May 28, 2020

Savings, Career, Debt, Relationships, Budgeting Tools to get you started:  Debt Calculator: http://bit.ly/2QIoSPV Insurance Coverage Checkup: http://bit.ly/2BrqEuo Complete Guide to Budgeting: http://bit.ly/2QEyonc Interview Guide: http://bit.ly/2BuGnZE Check out other podcasts in the Ramsey Network: http://bit.ly/2JgzaQR 

🎵 Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, is my co-host on the show today as we talk to you about your life and your money. And those two things are interwoven to where you cannot take them apart without tearing things. Breaking things.

Breaking things. Things break when you try to do that. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Mike is going to start off this hour in Michigan. Hey, Mike, how are you? I'm great. Good afternoon, guys. I hope you're staying safe.

We are, sir. How about you? I've been following the baby steps. I'll be kind of doing a little bit of a hybrid version, so hear me out if you could. I started my $1,000 emergency fund. The bank talked me into doing an extra $100 per month, so I'm at about $1,000 emergency fund. The bank talked me into doing an extra hundred per month. So I'm at about $1,500 now. I paid off the higher interest credit cards and I just paid off my last one last week, actually, about $2,300. So debt-free. My question is, I have $13,000 left on my mortgage. I had a

15-year mortgage at 6%. And I've always kind of paid a little bit extra, and I know the next step in the basic steps is saving that six-month emergency fund. Yep. Would it be smart to aggressively pay off the house and still continue slowly to the emergency fund, or just do the emergency fund and worry about the house later? Nope. You get your emergency fund in place. Dude, you're living square in the middle of a freaking emergency.

Have you noticed? You're in Michigan. a freaking emergency have you noticed you're in michigan yes i have i mean um you you're walking metaphor for the answer and i know you dude you're right there you're so close i know i know i promise yeah you the problem is it's 13 000 it's. It's not $130,000. Yeah, you can see it, man. I promise you. You can reach over and smack it. Something's going to happen. I promise you.

What is your household income? $85,000. It's a single income. Okay. So what is an emergency fund then? Of three to six months. I'd say about between $5,000 to $10,000. That's with the house payment.

But if I get rid of that, I'm down. Well, you're going to get rid of that. Okay. So let,000 to $10,000. That's with the house payment, but if I get rid of that, I'm down. Well, you're going to get rid of that. Okay, so let's call it $10,000. How long does it take to put $10,000 aside if you have no payments but the house, which is where you are right now? You're about to achieve that. How long are you going to put $10,000 aside? How long is it going to take?

I'd probably say six to eight months. Yep, that sounds right to me. And if you can do that in six to eight months, and then six to eight months. Yep, that sounds right to me. And if you can do that in six to eight months, and then six to eight months later the house is paid off. Yes. So really we're having a one-year discussion right here. Mm-hmm. It ain't that big a deal.

I appreciate the answer. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Thanks, guys. I greatly appreciate it. Well, hey, and this is a value conversation too. I want folks to, after you've paid these credit card folks, pay yourself. Like, you're worth putting money in the bank for instead of dumping stuff off.

I think that's a value judgment that we often pull ourselves out of this baby steps conversation. You're worth saving for. And I don't know, man. Something's going to happen. God almighty. It would be great to have an emergency fund. I spent too many years in crisis. My bell curve has shifted and messed over.

I just, like, well, there may be a car wreck, and there may be a – maybe I need to go more counseling, Dave. But, yeah, I know how hard that is to see the finish line. I mean, can you imagine the hate mail we would have gotten if six months ago I would have said something like, a disease is coming, and I'm going to shut the whole nation down for a month for two months but that's that's it though and you need an emergency fund instead i said you know grandma said save for a rainy day because sometimes it rains as a matter of fact about all that you can

predict is change so you need to be ready and one lady called it the gok fund the god only knows fund you know and god only knows god only knew who knew that covid was going to shut the whole place down for a period of time and people were going to lose their jobs. And who knew you were going to feel different if you had $20,000 in the bank instead of $20,000 in credit card debt? Who knew? Common sense knew. That's who knew.

Everyone should know. Everyone should know. But, you know, if you didn't, then this is your call. This is your wake-up call. Answer the phone. Never again. Say never again. Never, never again.

When I went broke, I said never again. And I never again have been without an emergency fund. I never again have used debt. I never. I was through. I learned my lesson. So the bad things happen to you, and then you learn your lesson, or you get to repeat the test. So you've worked with millions of people.

What is – so a crisis comes, and there's two responses. One is to try to insulate yourself and never let that thing happen again, and I'm going to do that by running as fast as I can from it. And then there's something about turning the table and saying i will absorb the next one of these it comes you've you've helped millions of people what's the what's what's the what is the characteristic what's the character trait that someone turns around and says i'm not going to run i'm going to have somebody in my family die i'm gonna have a car that breaks down i'm going to be ready when it happens not i'm going to run from those from being scared and i'm going to run from no one's ever going to die in my life i'm going to run so you're saying it's the same response it's a different motivation in both cases we're building an emergency fund but

some people are doing it because they're running and some people are doing it because they want to be ready well so let's say a pandemic comes there's going to be a crew of people they're going to there's going to be a crop of industry that shows up it says never get sick from a virus again and and they're gonna you know chase down vitamins and workout programs and this and that they're not going to save money they're not going to get connected to their families they're not going to do the thing that is going to be pandemic proof or death in the family proof or insurance didn't cover flood, whatever the thing is proof. Does that make sense? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Because in other words, you can prescribe the wrong medicine for the illness. Yeah. It's this idea of we're going

to chase the black swans and you missed the whole point that a black swan comes and you don't know what's coming. And so you can build a resilient life or as Taleb says an anti-fragile life that says come what may I'm going to have an emergency fund I'm going to have a community of people around me I'm going to have a church that I rely on or I'm just going to keep chasing down the next the next rabbit trail oh that got me last time so that will never get me again yeah it's not it's not that will never get me again and that's why we say you know three to six months of expenses right And somebody says, well, you know, I'm in the military and my wife works at the post office. We're not going to lose our jobs. Well, losing your job is only

one possible emergency, right? Your transmission going out and your, your aunt passing away across on the other side of the nation. And they need you to pay for the funeral is another type of emergency. An emergency will show up. So what something is going to come have you seen a difference in a person or does it just have to get bad enough that that they're going to shift then you know les brown the great motivator says people change their lives when they say i've had it i've had it and so it it usually the the healthy response usually comes from a righteous anger. Okay. Not at yourself and not at other people, but at the concept. Okay. I've had it.

I will never be here again. I've had it. Right. And, you know, like my mother, you know, a bunch of redneck hillbilly kids, we'd be running in and out of the house, running in and out of the house, and she would finally reach a boiling point, and she would say, That's it! The worm has turned! We didn't even know what that meant.

Found out later it was Shakespeare. Who knew mom knew Shakespeare? All we knew was the beatings were about to begin, you know? That's it! I've had it! And when you go, that's it, then you're ready to change your life uh never again am i gonna be in a relate never again am i gonna be caught off guard by whatever by whatever i'm not gonna do that thing that way ever again this is the dave ramsey show For most of us, health care costs seem to increase every year,

and saving money on health insurance feels more and more out of reach. For example, take the Olcheski family from LaGrange, Texas. Jeff and Carice had just celebrated the birth of a new baby boy. Shortly after, they had a health scare involving one of their kids that was completely unexpected. With today's healthcare climate, this could have bankrupted them. But thanks to Christian Healthcare Ministries, the Olcheskis were spared from a ton of medical bills. As members of Christian Healthcare Ministries, they're part of a group of believers who financially and spiritually support each other.

CHM is the original health cost-sharing ministry and is a Better Business Bureau accredited charity. It's biblical, affordable, and it shared nearly $97,000 to help the Olcheskis. To be a part of Christian Healthcare Ministries, visit chministries.org., visit chministries.org. That's chministries.org. CHM is a proud sponsor of Dave Ramsey Live Events. thanks for joining us america this is the dave ramsey show dr john deloney ramsey personality my co-host on the show today mike is with us in pennsylvania hey mike how are you

hey guys thanks so much for having me. Sure, man. What's up? Yeah, I'll be concise, so just let me know if you need any more details. I'm married. I've got four young kids. It's always been a goal of ours to relocate someday, and we just completed Baby Step 3, so now it feels like the right time. Oh, congratulations. But here's my dilemma. Thank you. It was a long Baby Step 2. Yes.

Here's my dilemma. I love my job where I am, and we've got deep roots in this area, but I hate the part of the country that we live in and I always have. I was hoping you guys could offer your advice on whether we should stay or go. What are the roots? Both of our families are here. We've got the four kids in various stages of school. We own a house. My wife's very close with her family here. She does agree with me that the area isn't the greatest, but she's not as eager as I am to pick up and go. What do you hate about the area?

Well, for one, the winters are brutal. They're extremely cold. They're long. The summer is beautiful here where I live in the summer, but it's brief. We get maybe two months of nice weather. And there's not a lot of opportunities as far as jobs and the amenities of a big city. I want to live outside of a big city in a warm area. And I do have a great job, but I would like the comfort of knowing that if I didn't have this job, whether voluntary or involuntarily, that I would have more opportunities. And I just don't feel

confident about that in this area. Who's more excited to leave you or her oh me without a doubt he is i've been i've been wanting this for my whole life ever since i can remember she she you grew up there yes i did interesting so um she comes in today and says let's sell the house what goes through your your your head then? Oh, I feel like that's the validation that I needed because I'm doubting myself right now. See, I'm afraid that the grass is always greener on the other side, guy, that I want to get out of here and then I'll be just as unhappy when I get wherever I'm going. I mean, deep down I don't feel that way, but it's something I am worried about. So the draw of the other area in your dream scenario is weather and economic prosperity.

Sure, and the amenities of a big city, sporting teams, restaurants, you know, stuff like that. Where we live is very rural. There's not a lot going on. Everything's a 20-minute drive from here. Let me, like, I can just walk you through my situation. My wife and I lived in Texas every single day of our life up until a little over two years ago. And we have deep roots, close friends, all of our family. And we had a vision of a life with trees.

We had a vision of a life with running water year round. And we had a, just a picture in our head of a family working in a situation similar to what you've outlined. And what I can tell you in our family, it has been magic. We've gone home to Texas several times. We still visit our family. We still love our family. It's been extraordinary. but the key here is we did it together and it was a plan that we made together and we waited until we had the right um job opportunity to go what do you do i'm in supply chain what do you make uh household income is about 130 okay all right um i'm sure that i'm just wondering if uh if you left and three years later it was horrible how hard it be to just come back you know i i think that might be something that might be a possibility sometimes it it helps to remember like when you're buying a car we get it in our

head like we have to drive this car for 8,000 years or something. And you can sell the car two months later if you don't like it. It's just a stupid car. And so maybe this isn't as permanent an all-or-nothing decision as it feels like. Maybe it is. I don't know. But, I mean, if you moved and two years later, three years later, you absolutely hated it. It wasn't what you thought. everybody's miserable, including you,

and you might even go back to your old employer. They may hire you back. I mean, I don't know. But you could probably put the life that you have there back together if you needed to or some semblance of it, right? I think that's great advice. How old are your kids, Mike? I think that's great advice. How old are your kids, Mike?

My oldest is 11. My youngest is 2. So I'm going to give you unpopular advice. Is this cool? You called this show, so I'll give it to you. Sure, absolutely. Please do. They don't get a vote.

And they're going to have a 10-year, 11-year, 4-year-old picture of what the world is, and they're not going to have the wisdom. And so everything is going to be about, but my street's going to look different, and I'm going to miss Timmy and Susie, and I know a lot of folks who carry that baggage of, my 8-year-old doesn't want to move, and he's in a good middle school. I appreciate that, because I feel like I'm doing it with their best interest in mind, but they do feel that way, so I feel like I'm being selfish by it. No, your job is to take a longer picture, at the end of the day a unwell an unhappy dad and an unhappy mom i don't care where they are is going to put more poison into them than having a

fun street to play on or whatever whatever the the the thing that that they're going to present to you is but i just know a lot of parents say hey we're going to go on an adventure yeah he's got to do with his wife there's something both of you both of you're there we're gonna go on an adventure and we tell the kids we're going on an adventure that's the exact words we use is we're going we're going on a camping trip for three years and um then we may just decide to stay yeah but um but you know if it's not so stinking permanent in your head it makes it easier to make the decision. And let's try it. Right.

You know, let's try it. And if it doesn't work, we'll try something else. You know, and it's not, if I don't like the car, I'll get another car. If I don't like this location, I'll get another location. You've never tried anything else. Your whole lives have been there. Right. So try something else.

It worked out well for me and my family. Have an adventure. You know, I don't see a downside because I think you can undo it. It would be some financial pain and some trouble and jobs and a little bit of embarrassment or whatever else you might feel. But I think you try it. But you've got to both be on board. You've got to both be going.

And maybe you talk to her in that sense too that this is not forever. I will make the agreement that if we go and three years later we're both miserable or you're completely miserable we can talk about coming back yes you you're man i like that idea because we do that with cars we do that with locations but we also do that with my job i came here for one job and i'm in an industry that quite frankly i didn't really know existed right i got to a new geographic location and i met some great folks and i had a set of transferable skills that moved over but i'm doing something that i hadn't it was so far not even on my radar i didn't know it was a thing right it's not a thing we're the only ones to do it that's my point right but he may take the supply chain

um yeah gift that he's got end up somewhere in texas or in alabama or nashville and then suddenly he's using this set of skills for a job that's a better fit for his family that's wonderful that he's good at that he didn't even know exists so go for it man hit the dude in the mouth and hopefully he falls down and if he doesn't, then when you wake back up off the canvas, you can go back to Pennsylvania. You say we were in the ring. Yep. There you go. Reed is with us.

Reed is in Virginia. Hi, Reed. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave. How are you doing? Great, man. What's up? Well, I'm at kind of a crossroads in my life right now.

I'm 10 years in active duty military, and I've got two years left in my contract, and I do not want to re-enlist. Okay. And not that the military hasn't provided for me. They have. They've gone above and beyond, but it's just not something I want to do anymore. Okay. Well, thank you for your service. What are you going to do? Absolutely, man. Well, so my plan, like I said, I've got two years left in my contract. So the whole time I've been in, I've been putting off going to schools,

but now I've been talking to schools, and I'm going to use tuition assistance. And my plan was to go get a degree in environmental science. I figured that's a good degree because there's plenty of opportunities, lots of different avenues to go down. And it's what you want to do with your life. It's what I want to do with my life, yes. Okay. What's the downside?

Why not? I have no formal education. I'm 35 years old. You know, I joined the military a little late. Yeah. So go get you some. You know, that's what I want. But it's a scary thing to jump into.

You got what it takes, man. You absolutely have what it takes. You're going to be the smartest kid in your classes. You're going to inspire the young folks who are sitting around you in classes, and you're going to go be a better time to try online grocery. My friends at eMeals make it incredibly easy for you. eMeals creates a shopping list based on the meals you want for the week and then directly sends it to Walmart, Kroger, Instacart, Shipt, or Amazon Fresh.

Your choice. Head to eMeals.com slash grocery. Find what delivery and pickup providers are available in your area. Try eMeals free for two full weeks. That's eMeals.com slash grocery. These are crazy times out there, folks. There's so much you cannot control, and it might be scary, but now is not the time to decide you're a victim of all the outside variables. Don't let the constant news cycle get you down.

Don't let people tell you you have to take out debt to survive, and don't you dare pull out a credit card. It's time to take control of what you can control, and in a lot of cases, that's your money. Get on a plan that will take you from where you are right now to where you want to be. For the very first time ever in this pandemic shutdown, we started offering Financial Peace University membership for 14 days as a free trial. It includes the EveryDollarPlus budgeting app. It includes the new Baby Steps app. It includes community.

It includes all nine hours of the nine lessons of Financial Peace University, a 14-day free trial. You can set yourself up to win even during times like this. You're going to be okay, but you need to adjust. You need to trim the sails. You need to catch a different breeze than the one you were running to before. Go to DaveRamsey.com slash hope. Maybe you've had a never again moment where you say never again. DaveRamsey.com slash hope.

Sean is with us in Florida. Hey, Sean, welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. How can we help? Thank you for taking my call, sir. I'm employed full-time. However, I was furloughed from my part-time job at a local theme park, and unbeknownst to me, they filed unemployment for everyone. They sent an email saying that we should follow up with the unemployment office,

and I did not because I'm not qualified because I work full-time. However, two days ago, I received a $600 check from the Department of Economic Opportunity. When I called them to say, hey, I'm not on unemployment, they said, no, no, this is a federal CARES Act, and everyone is going to get it. I'm skeptical of free money from the government. I also don't want to get hit with a big fine later for maybe fraud. So I was just wondering, should I put this money in the emergency fund? That way, if they do ask for it back, it's no harm, no foul. Just take it out, give it back. Or do I put it towards baby step two?

What do you make it your full-time job? Well, I have four jobs, and I make about $125,000. Put it on Baby Step 2. Here's the thing. I want to correct a piece of information, though, that you got. Everyone is not getting this. This only is coming to people who filed unemployment, and they filed it for you at the other job. That's why you're getting this. This only is coming to people who filed unemployment, and they filed it for you at the other job.

That's why you're getting it. It's federal dollars. It's not local. It's not your state unemployment that's doing it. It's the federal 600. It is for unemployment. And so you may want to place a phone call back again and go, everybody's not getting this.

There's only people that are unemployed, and I'm not unemployed. Please get this thing canceled. I don't think they're going to come after you and fine you for fraud they're they're they're not that competent so and i don't think they're going to ask for the money back but you are a person of integrity and honor with the way you ask the question and i think it'll do you good to shut this down he's a guy that works four jobs to make a six-figure salary and doesn't like checks coming in the mail from the government like that guy from the government well i mean you know what what ronald reagan said is right one of the scariest phrases in the world is i'm from the government and i'm here to help it's ridiculous oh man crazy. Paul is with us. Paul's in Virginia.

Hi, Paul. How are you? Hey, guys. Thanks a lot for taking my call. I appreciate you guys. Sure. How can we help? So I've been married for about a year and a half.

My second marriage. And I recently finished up your financial master coach program, which was awesome. And I really liked it a lot. So I wanted to shout out to Tim, Wes and Lisa on that. They were great and getting us through the program. But I'm having some challenges with, with my wife in a few ways in regards to this program. So she wants to be a part of it.

She wants to come alongside and help, which I think is fantastic, but we don't see eye to eye in a few things. And one of the big ones is we still have separate finances. Um, it's been a point of contention between us, um, almost a month after we got married and for her, it's a security thing that she's holding onto. But, um, I just don't see how we can advise. I can advise people in a certain way when I'm not even following what I'm advising. And so it's such a struggle I've got with that. We've been in marriage counseling already, going through many other things,

and it's just another thing. And I just wanted to see if you guys had any advice on maybe the best way to approach that. That's a great question, Dave. I'd love to pick your brain on that. Can somebody teach a class? Well, it's hard to, I mean, you can do it, and you just say, you know, we're working on this. I think the, as your marriage heals from the other things that you're working on, her resistance to combining finances is probably going to go away.

Yeah, that's a value question. That, to me, is a separate thing. That's a security issue and a value question and developing a connection that allows you to communicate in a way that you can hear each other. Control is, right, that's an anxiety response. It's a, I don't fully trust where I'm at. I don't fully feel safe here. And once you get a context, I'm glad to hear you're all working with a professional there. Once you get that safety and the context and you become trustworthy, she feels safe with whatever her past scars are, then you join those finances together.

So that's a value question to me. In the meantime. In the meantime. Yeah. If you're working on it, I think you can. I wouldn't tell you not to tell somebody. But, I mean, if somebody presses you on it, you can go, well, you know, right now ours are separate because we're working on some other stuff. And we'll be combining them someday soon, which would be true because you're going to heal your marriage overall. but I think her insecurity around combining finances

hasn't got anything to do with all the stuff you've learned or that you're teaching. It's got to do with the other stuff, and your marriage is struggling. And as you solve that and she starts feeling, like you said, a sense of peace, a sense of security in the relationship, then the combining isn't isn't a problem um it's um i don't i don't know why i mean can you tell somebody how to get out of debt if you've got debt sure right you know can you have to be out of debt to coach people on that no you don't

i'm working on my debt i'm getting out too right you know we're working on this in our marriage too y'all are working on it in your marriage. And you don't have to go into your own underwear drawer and show them everything, but you can just be authentic and you don't have to, you know, we don't teach you to rise above people and be pompous anyway. Right. So, you know. It might give you some pretty authentic empathy when you're walking alongside folks

who are trying to figure it out, too. Yeah. But I think what this is highlighting, like, is there was this big question here, and it was almost like a drive-by, oh, and we're working on the marriage, too. So I think the marriage is the big question, and you're all getting on the same page on that, and then all this other stuff is going to heal itself. Right. So, yeah, you're putting emphasis on the same page on that, and then all this other stuff is going to heal itself. Right. So, yeah, you're putting emphasis on the wrong thing,

overemphasizing one and underemphasizing the other is what I heard. So, anyway, Jacob is with us. Jacob is in Oklahoma. Hi, Jacob. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Hi. What's up, all? I, when I separated from my ex-wife, I went in an agreement with my dad, and he bought a house,

and I pay rent to my dad, essentially. And the agreement was, is I would have to live with my dad until he started getting his pension, which is coming up in September. And this year I've started going through your plan. I'm on baby step two and I'm doing really well. But my question is, should I continue to live with my dad longer past September to keep contributing towards debt? Or should I find my own place because I feel like I'm a 30-year-old man. I should probably have my own place. That's a great question. I think your feelings and value judgments get pushed aside if you're working on a plan and it's working out for you.

This idea that I'm this age and so I should be doing these things. And if you've got a system that's working for you and you're able to live by your dad's rules and the boundaries that he set for you, and you're working your plan, work your plan. I think you need an end date. I don't care what it is, but if you've got an end date, then you're going to be okay with yourself. If it's not September, it's March, I don't care. If it's December, I'm fine. You know it's not three Septembers from now. So give yourself an end date, and then you know you're okay. Please hear me loud and clear. The government is not going to bail you out of your student loans,

at least not completely and not without a catch. What they're talking about only impacts federal, not private loans, and you need to take responsibility for what you owe and pay your debt down quicker. Right now, Splash Financial is offering their lowest rates ever. With lower rates and extra payments, you could just find yourself debt-free in the next five years. Visit splashfinancial.com slash Ramsey to see if you qualify. thanks for joining us america dr john deloneysey Personality, my co-host on the air today. Jack is up next. Jack is in Missouri. Hey, Jack, how can we help?

Hi, thanks for taking my call. Dave and Dr. John, excited to talk to you guys. So I just got a big commission check for about $120,000 that I've been waiting on. Nice. And that's after taxes. How often does this happen? I've made it happen a couple times. But right now I'm on baby step six, and I have a really big mortgage by myself.

It's a $500,000 house. So I'm not calling with bad problems, but what I notice is the more money I make and the more I kind of worry. I don't know what that is. Yeah, Biggie Smalls talked about that years ago, right? More money, more problems. Yeah, and I feel like I already kind of have OCD in certain ways, and I feel like it's going to be a problem almost,

but really here's where I'm at. I just got this big check. I'm a baby steps six and I owe about $370,000 on my mortgage. So I'm above about $120,000 in equity right now. So I was thinking I could sell my house right now and get rid of baby step six by maybe building something small or just going and downsizing. So what do you think about that plan? Does that sound something like you would do? I make enough money, about $200,000 a year right now, and I'm in sales. So that kind of swings with the economy. So I'm a little worried there that I could find myself in trouble in a year with a $2,600 mortgage by myself. How much is in your emergency fund?

So right now I have about $130,000 in the bank. So my emergency fund kind of skipped that step because I built that with that big commission check immediately. And I've always been doing that. And what should your emergency fund be? I feel comfortable with, say, $30,000. Okay. It means you have $100,000 extra to put on Baby Step 6, right? Yep, yep.

And all on top of this, I just got out of prison 10 years ago. I was in prison for about two years. I got in a fistfight when I was a young man, uh, no weapons or anything like that used, but he was in the military. So I really got, uh, I really got in trouble for it. So I feel like I'm also a success story. Um, and I don't, I've never really shared that with anyone like employers or anything like that. It's something I really keep secret, but I also feel like it's something that should be talked about. Like people should celebrate that, but I also feel ashamed of it. It's a lot to ask, but really, am I on the right track? Would you sell the house,

go something small? Cause I have a pretty extravagant house for a single man. So, um, how old are you? I just turned 36. What kind of house do you want to own when you're 42? You know, I like nice things. I sell a nice product from Holland, a building product. I just feel like something right now. Stop. What kind of house do you want to live in when you're 42? Just something like a ranch, 1,800 square feet that's nice nice and that's a lot less than what you

have now i have 2500 square feet it's a little big jack this isn't a square footage issue man you're gonna have to you're gonna have to make peace with who you were and the success and the man that you are now. And you're going to have to make peace with the fact that you're good at your job and you make good money. And you have a heart for helping people. And I want you to go out and help people. But this isn't a house size issue and this is a demon that you can't exercise by running from it. And you can't come up with a new plan, a new scheme.

You're going to have to come at peace with Jack. make two hundred thousand dollars a year you live in a five hundred thousand dollar house there's absolutely nothing wrong with that right see i i do feel like maybe it's too much for myself so okay that does feel better why does it feel like it's too much i mean the difference in 2500 square feet and 1800 square feet in terms of too much house is too much space. That's one rec room. I mean, there's not – that's not a – you know. Are you having problems with deserving or worth? Absolutely.

Always, you know. It's a shame. I guess it's shame. It's hard to get rid of. I don't think you can get a small enough house to get rid of that. Yeah, sure. Hey, and as soon as you buy a small house and it's going to be nice, you're going to work on a scheme,

and then you're going to have to make another plan and another move, another thing. What do I do with this money, though? You put it down on a house and you work your baby step six. Yeah, pay off your house, man. Give some away. When's the last time you got in a fist fight? I actually got paid to do a professional.

Well, besides professional fighting, you know what I mean. Oh, since I was, I mean, a kid. Good. You know, like, since that incident. So, hey, hey, hey, you're not that guy anymore. And for probably a hundred reasons, all valid, you're letting that guy still drive the car that you get to and from work every day in. And whether that's going to see a counselor, whether that's going to see a pastor,

whatever that has to be, you need to do the work that it's going to take. And it can be easy and quick. It's going to be painful, but easy and quick. And get that guy out of the driver's seat. I think it's a really good exercise for you to keep this house, which is going to make you deal with this crap. I think that's a good idea. And you're going to be OCD,

and you're going to get a stupid thing paid off in about three years anyway. So I'm not worried about the debt on the thing. But, I mean, you're going to have to walk in there every day and go, I own this house, and I'm going to have to deal with this stuff. And he's going to have to look in the mirror and say, I am not my yesterday. Exactly. That's what I mean. I am my right now.

This house makes you deserve it. Yeah. Yeah. And it makes you face your deserving. Yeah. You're a good man, dude. You've got a really good heart. And a good story. And a really good heart. And a good story.

And a really good story. And you will tell this story someday. There'll be a venue and there'll be a time, and it will inspire other young men that have bumped into stuff that follows them around. And, Dave, I think this is important to point out for folks who are struggling, folks who have made a dumb decision, folks who are still wrestling with digging themselves out of whatever hole they got shoved into or jumped into themselves. Economic success, winning won't make you well, I guess is the best way to say that.

Being at the top of your chain, getting on top of a $ 200K salary, which is ridiculous awesome, getting just another fly-by $120,000 check doesn't make that go away. Right? You can't run from it. A half-million-dollar house doesn't make that go away. You got to do the hard work with being okay with who you are when you see in the mirror. You know, when we went broke, my need for stuff got fried out of me. I mean, to where I'm just stuff, stuff.

And I like nice things. I've got some nice things. But my need for stuff, to the point that I was driving a junkie car, and I had plenty of money. And a buddy of mine, we were going to Chattanooga, and the car blew a radiator on the way to Chattanooga. And we're on the side of the road, and I was a millionaire, again. And I'm on the side of the road in a junkie car. And buddy is like you're an idiot i'm like what i don't need a better car

he goes yes you do we're on the side of the road the the famous songwriter theologian rich mullen said people can be as proud of the things they don't have as people are of the things they do have yeah it's the same heart it had uh it had it was a healing thing for me to go buy me a decent car because you got more than easily could afford by then and uh and i've gotten over that now i'm still working on it dave will always have some cars now and just because somebody said i shouldn't have them that immediately went i needed to go get them so but it's amazing how that hangs around your neck from when you're a kid or from an incident like this idea that i'm not worth that i'm not i'm not worth a house good people don't do that right or i mean who needs a car like that right no one needs a house like that.

Was that Jesus would have driven an old Accord or something, whatever? Yeah. Because there's going to be one old Honda because everybody's in one Accord. That's right. That's right. But the, yeah, I mean, 1994 Camry, anything above that, your salvation's in issue. You know, so, yeah, there's that stuff, right? And it's just this craziness very interesting

good for jack man you're a good man you're worth it you're a good man keep your house and pay it off that's what i would do if i were in your shoes heal your heart i had to get a car you got to get a house this is the dave ramsey show Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Dave Ramsey Show. This episode is over, but if you heard about an event, product, or service and didn't have a chance to write it down, don't worry. We list everything you've heard about during this episode in the podcast show notes or head to DaveRamsey.com.

Thanks for listening.