The Ramsey Show - App - You Can Grow in Your Career Even After 30 Years! (Hour 3)

Episode Date: February 10, 2020

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Coming to you live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is The Dave Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. Sitting in for Dave Ramsey, I'm Ken Coleman, host of The Ken Coleman Show on the Ramsey Network. I'm also the author of the number one best-selling book, The Proximity Principle, and I'm here with you this hour, helping you get clear, get unstuck,

and on the path to your dream job. 888-825-5225 is the number. 888-825-5225. We're going to start it off with Michelle in Iowa. Michelle, how can I help? I am in the middle of a fourth stage of a job application. I have a final interview coming up this week, and I'm anticipating a job offer. I have not ever negotiated salary, and I'm wondering how do I go about asking for what I think I'm worth.

All right. So the first thing we want to do is we want to have a lot of research. You want to come into this conversation impressing them with all the homework that you have done. So have you done any research on the salary ranges for somebody in your position and with your experience? I have. I feel like I'm on the high end of that scale. Okay, great. So in that scale, what is the scale, by the way? Do you mind sharing?

No, it's 150. Okay, great. So what do you make right now? So I'm at a position where I have commission, and it's a sales role. So I had a change in my commission structure and in 2018 I was at 150 and this year I'm at 135. So 2019 I dropped about 15,000. Okay, great. So I feel like we're in that. Yeah, all right. So you want to be at the very high end there. So what you want to do is if they throw at you a question like, okay, what range of salary do you need or do you want to make? That's where you want to throw out, well, I range of salary do you need or do you want to make? That's where you want to throw out, well, I've done my homework. And for somebody of my experience,

the range is, you know, 145 to 150 or 140 to 150. And I've been at the top of that range. So I need to be at the 150 with an opportunity to grow. And you just say it that way. So it's not so much a negotiation. I think people get hung up on, you know, how do I negotiate? Well, negotiation, you know, if you strip it down, it's they throw a number at you, you throw a number back at them, and we just go back and forth and back and forth. And I just don't think that's realistic. And I don't think that that's what's going to happen here. So what I want you to do is have another couple of sources. So you've done some research, it'd be great if you said I went to Indeed, I went to Glassdoor or whatever. And I went to all these different these websites. And they're all saying the same thing. And this is what I've made

the past. So for me to leave where I am now to come join you, I need to be starting in that 150 range. And then ultimately, I want the opportunity to move up. And so I'm curious about what that growth plan looks like. And I love the idea of adding to the conversation. I would also love to know beyond salary, what do you see as the growth plan for me? How will we measure my performance beyond just sales and commissions? Because I want to continue to get better and continue to grow and not just drive revenue, which will drive up my commissions, but I want to grow as a professional.

And I think when you say things like that, hopefully that hiring manager goes, now this is somebody that we really want. We really want Michelle. She is hungry. She's humble. And we need to bring her in. So that's where I would keep it. Always have your homework, folks. They need to know that you're as informed as they are. That's always a win. Let's go next to Kelly, who is on the line in Florida. Kelly, how can I help?

Hi. I've been a special education teacher, Ken, for 29 years. I said to one of my colleagues a couple weeks ago, I go, can you believe next year I'll have done this for 30 years? Wow. And that's what I thought. I thought, wow. Yeah, but I'm saying wow in a good way.

That's impressive. Yeah, it is. And I'll tell you, I'm really proud of it. You should be. Yeah, it's not something I plan on leaving. I don't want you. I'm really proud of it. You should be. Yeah. It's not something I plan on leaving. I don't want to leave my career. I was married to a Marine for 28 years, so I got to travel and do a lot with that. What's happening now is, though, I said it out loud that it's 30 years.

And I'm really trying to think of a way to increase my income, but honor what I do and use the knowledge that I've gained for sure in this area over that much time. Okay. How much do you make right now? I make 57. 57. 30 years with two master's degrees. Right, right, right, right. And so I know you've been in special ed, but you just laid it out beautifully.

I want to do something that honors what I've been doing. So in your mind, what have you wondered about? What is a step up or a step two or three up from what you've been doing now? What would that field look like or what would that role be? I really want to help more. My audience right now are the kids that I work with and the families that I work with, and it's a lovely audience. If I had what I wanted, though, I would want to be able to reach more people. So many people don't understand what their children really need. So many educators are confused and want to do well,

but don't always understand what's required. Okay. All right, this is fun. Okay, I'm starting to track. All right, now it's time for you to dream, and you have to promise me before you answer this next question that you're not going to come up with limitations. You're just going to let your heart throw it out there.

Do you promise? Yes, sir. All right, if you knew you couldn't fail, you absolutely knew it wouldn't fail, how would you affect more people knowing what you already know right now? How would you get that information out to them? Honestly, I have really thought about and even have started kind of working on a blog website to look at, you know, what am I reading now? What can you learn from it?

What is a great resource for assistive technology and who can it help? Yeah. See, here's the question. You really do know where to look. Even if you don't know the exact resource that a family or, you know, someone affected has a special needs person in their family, whatever it is, that you just know the direction. Even if you don't have the resource, you could go find it, couldn't you? Oh, absolutely.

Okay, that makes you tremendously valuable. So let me throw something at you. Here's what I want you to consider. Kelly, I want you to consider launching the blog tonight, but why not do it on a Facebook page? Don't even worry about a design. Create a Facebook page. You can do that. It costs you nothing.

And I want you to start writing. And I want you to commit over the next week to write five or six pieces, okay, coming out of your existing experience, something you're fired up about. Second thing I want you to do is launch an Instagram page. Put some resources out there. Then I want you to start a podcast. Just record something from your heart. Interview some people that are experts right there in your area.

I want you, in short, Kelly, to begin to create content that you know is valuable, that you know will help your target audience. See, you're absolutely clear. You know who you want to help. You know what problem you want to solve. You know what solution you want to provide. Start doing it. And let's not try to do it full time right now.

Let's just do it on the side. Let's build the platform, build the audience. Start going to the conventions and the trade shows and getting online in the webinars where other people who are sourcing these families, you start hanging out all the time. Just use the proximity principle. Get around people that are doing what you want to do. Get in places where what you want to do is happening, Kelly. And guess what? Opportunities are going to present themselves to you. You've got what it takes. It's go time. Don't move. More Dave Ramsey Show coming right up.

We've been voted one of the best places to work in Nashville 11 times. You want to know how we do it? Well, our team has been using LinkedIn jobs for years to find the best people from all over the country to come and help us change lives. Think about it. LinkedIn has more than 600 million active members. I'm talking about people who come to LinkedIn to make connections, grow their careers, and discover new job opportunities. In fact, 90% of LinkedIn users are open to new opportunities, but not actively scanning job boards. This means LinkedIn Jobs gives you access to an entirely different demographic. Don't wait.

One hire can change the direction of your company. Post a job today at linkedin.com slash Ramsey and get $50 off your first job post. That's linkedin.com slash Ramsey. Terms and conditions apply. Welcome back, America. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, host of the Ken Coleman Show on the Ramsey Network, sitting in for Dave this hour. So thrilled to have you with us. So here's what we're doing. I focus on helping people get clear on the giant question that we all wrestle with.

Why am I here? What should I do with my life? So we're going to help you get clear, get qualified, get connected, get started, get promoted, get the dream job. Why? To be able to work with tremendous meaning, giving yourself away, working like no one else. 888-825-5225 is the number. 888-825-5225. We'll go to Corey next, who's on the line in Florida. Corey, how can I help?

Ken, I'm calling on behalf of my younger brother. So he recently graduated from a military academy back in May, decided to take his final summer as, I guess, a civilian off to go back home, work on the beach. He was a paramedic on the beach for the summertime. And since then, he was supposed to be entering the military back in January and never did. So he's kind of hit like a, I guess, a stalling point, I guess, in his life. And I'm not really certain.

I've been trying to like motivate him to get back into that place where he can, you know, feel comfortable entering the military. I don't know if he's getting cold feet or not, but he's getting all of these mixed emotions of thinking about going back to school again, which is very silly from my perspective. But he's carrying a lot of student debt from his first school, and he is collecting unemployment right now, which is pretty silly. So it's been a really, really weird situation.

Well, Corey, let me start by saying I think you're a really good dude, and I really think you're a good brother, but you're not being a very good encourager right now. The last thing your brother – is he your little brother by any chance? He's younger, yeah. Yeah. The last thing your little brother needs is big brother telling him he needs to go into the military and stop worrying about all the things he's afraid of. That's not what he needs.

What he needs is a big brother that comes alongside him and says, hey, man, hey, little bro, it's going to be okay. Let's get clear. Let's just slow life down for a second, and let's look at why you are hesitant to go in the military why don't you just ask him and let him lay it out there then i would also ask him why is he thinking about going back to school get all these answers let's get into a place where he's comfortable having a conversation with you and then right well hold on hold on ahead and uh and he's's paired those two things together, actually. His hesitation to enter is because he's under the impression that if he goes in fluent in a foreign language, in his case he wants to learn Spanish fluently, that it will give him better placement and jobs once he does enter the military. And that's what he wants to go back to school for is to learn Spanish fluently.

Okay, so you're telling me, because where I was going is, I want to know what little brother really would want to do with his life if there were no hurdles at all. Has he had that conversation with you? Has he always wanted to be in the military? He really wants to be in the military, and he wants to be in Spanish-speaking roles because he has a love of the Hispanic world, the Hispanic community? I mean, give me a why here. What's his why? Well, he wants to be a career service member, that's for sure. Okay, great. He's always wanted to enter the military. That's the reason why he went to a military academy. And I guess part of his experience was that he was coming out of his

academy without skills, I guess, that would better place him than the average person who would just enlist out of baseball, for example. So you're telling me that the reason he hasn't re-enlisted or jumped back in is because he doesn't feel like he has the skills, and if he jumps in now, it's just a waste of his time because he doesn't think he's qualified enough to get something that would be worth doing. Is that what I'm getting? Maybe not necessarily that it would be a waste of his time, but that the military would then

place him in something that's not satisfying to him, that it would be almost unfulfilling and miserable. That's a waste of time. Yeah. Okay. So we're saying the same thing. All right. So here's the deal.

I think he's worried about school costing him too much, and I just don't think he needs to go to a four-year college to become fluent in Spanish. In fact, I could think of a bunch of different ways and he can go research it but if he wants to be fluent in another language whether it be Spanish or any other language he does not have to go to a traditional college to learn that that information is available a whole lot cheaper and he can do it on his time so I'd say hey hey I tell if I were you, I'd find three or four or five different programs, give him the different pricing, and show him how easy it is and how it's doable, and he can actually get that qualification of being able to speak a different language. And he can get it in this amount of time, which means he needs to see a clear path forward. Oh, wait a second. I don't have to go back to school and totally radically change my life. I can go learn this online or in person at this place, this place, this place. And

once I've got that qualification, then I reapply and now I'm more qualified or much more attractive candidate. That's all you need to encourage him to do there. Listen, when you are a family member, and this is tough. I mean, I love Corey's heart. But you want so much for your family member to see the potential or to experience the momentum or experience the victory that you see for them. But in wanting to help them sometimes and pushing them and pushing them and pushing them, if they don't realize the clear path, if they don't see that their fear is not reality, then it's just going to create tension.

So the better role is not to be the pusher in that situation. The role is to almost be the helpful guide and the helpful listener. Let them get it all out. Let's get out what's really holding them back and then help them walk through how to defeat that enemy. And it's going to come down to three things, fear, doubt, and pride every time. Let's go to Oscar next, who is on the line in Arizona. Oscar, how can I help? Hello, sir. Thank you for taking my call. Appreciate it. Sure. What's going on? I am a behavioral health therapist. I work with youth who are hooked on drugs and I am currently burnt out. I am trying to find my way out of this

career, but I invested so much time in it and energy and it's my passion. But at the same time, I feel like it's debilitating. Oscar, Oscar, Oscar, I got great news for you. I know you feel burned out. I don't question for a second that you have the feelings of being burned out, but I got great news. You're not actually burned out. You're dealing with buildup on the heart. Now, Oscar, I'm going to identify the five causes of buildup, and let's see if you're

experiencing all five or a few of the five. Number one is no connection to the work. That's not your deal. You just told our entire audience you're passionate about this work. So it's not a lack of connection and heart with the actual job and role. The second cause is you're overwhelmed. You feel like the moment you pull in the parking lot that you're absolutely about to drown. The third cause is that you are underappreciated. You just don't feel like anybody appreciates you. Okay?

The other thing is that you are unrecognized and there's no reward in the work. You can't see it. You're working really hard and you don't feel like that's happening. And then the fifth cause of burnout, excuse me, of buildup is that you're just bored. So which one do you think it is? Because I think you've got a couple going on. Yes, I do have a couple. Okay, so tell me, what's causing you to feel that way? Let's identify it specifically. I do feel very overwhelmed. I have also been in my journey through the baby steps, and I've developed other ways of income. So there are times in which I question if I should I just focus on those other areas and leaving my job. Not necessarily.

Again, what if I removed your workload? Okay, you know you're overwhelmed. If we were to remove what is causing you to feel and be overwhelmed, would you even be calling me right now? Would you be feeling like, hey, I mean, if I'm doing what I'm doing and I'm not overwhelmed and I don't feel like I'm just about to overheat every second of the day, do I still love the work? Yes or no? Yeah, the answer will be yes. Yeah, so here's the deal. Keep doing the stuff on the side that makes more money. That's all positive for you. But I deal with this call all the time on the Ken Coleman Show. We got to figure out what's causing us to feel the symptoms of burnout. Realize it's buildup on the heart,

and when we can remove the buildup, the heart's still there beating passionately. I can feel my heart right here, right now in the studio. If I put a bunch of blankets or thick coats on, I know my heart is there, but it is so covered up by all the layers, I can't feel it. Burnout doesn't exist. If you're alive, you're not burned out. You're just dealing with buildup. Let's remove the cause of buildup. And the heart is beating as strong as it ever has been. Don't move. More of your calls. I'm Ken Coleman, sitting in for Dave Ramsey. Welcome back, America. I'm Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, host of The Ken Coleman Show on the Ramsey Network

and author of the bestselling book, The Proximity Principle. We're taking your calls about work that matters, your dream job. Is it a fantasy or is it attainable? The answer is absolutely, 100%, it is attainable. But you have got to be clear, and then you've got to get qualified. Then you get connected, and then you got to get qualified then you get connected and then you get started then you'll get promoted and then you'll eventually step into that dream job why why do we talk about this on the ken coleman show why am i doing an hour on this on the

dave ramsey show because i believe that every man and woman on this planet was created to fill a unique role that means that you are needed. It also means that you must do it. Somebody out there needs you to be you. So we're not talking about selfish ambition. We're talking about selfless ambition. We are created to contribute. And I am in the business of helping you figure out what that is

so that you can give what this world needs from you. By the way, quick resource for you if you're new to the Ken Coleman show. Some of you are going, okay, you took over for Dave, I understand that, so it's not been a hostile takeover. You're part of Dave's thing, I get that.

But I don't even know if this conversation matters to me. How about the Should I Quit My Job quiz? Tens of thousands of people have downloaded this new resource from Ramsey Solutions. It's at KenColeman.com. It's going to take you three minutes. It's only 20 questions. And it's going to

help you get clear on that big question. Should I quit my job? It's going to throw you into one of four areas, and this can tell you what you need to do depending on how you score. So go get it, kencoleman.com. Who wouldn't want to do 20 questions, less than three minutes to get that to make a change. 888-825-5225 is the number. 888-825-5225. We go to Ohio where Lisa joins us. Lisa, how can I help? Hi, Ken. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. My company has offered a voluntary separation package, and I'm trying to determine how do I make the choice of to stay or to go in a logical way versus emotional. Financially, there are benefits whether I stay or go,

so that's not a determining factor in this particular case. Okay. But this is a job that fits me well, that I enjoy, but I do have a concern about it being there until my retirement. Yeah. Okay. Well, that's... So I'm trying not to make a choice out of fear, whether to stay with the company or to leave, but I need some clarity as far as what that process is. Okay. Let's walk through it. You know what it is, Lisa, this is just good old fashioned pros and cons. Okay. So what you're telling me is, is that financially, if you take, if you take the separation package, um, that, that number and the number, if you stay and we're going to call it short to near term, because you're not sure it's going to be around long-term. So you're saying in the short term, the money's about the same. So there's no clear advantage, pro or con, to taking this separation package versus staying?

The separation package allows me a golden parachute, shall we call it, which would give me a year or even more to find another position. All right. Let me ask a question there because that's where I was going. Can you also take this package, this golden parachute, and start working right away? Is there limitations to that? Time of separation is unknown. It could be as soon as a month from now or as late as a year and a half. Okay. You broke up. That will not be determined until we agreed. Okay. Okay. You broke up. So I didn't hear your answer. Your phone kind of went out. I'm sorry.

Are there limitations? Could you take the golden parachute and apply for a job the next day? Yes. Okay, so let me just explain something. Your voluntary separation package is a much better financial deal. You don't have to sit on the sidelines for a year. Now, I understand what that means. You've got a year to make a decision.

But this is the perfect scenario because you don't think it's going to be there long-term anyway. How long do you think you could stay in this current position before it became a forced separation? Anywhere from two to five years. Yeah, I don't like that at all. What I love is you getting paid to go find another gig, and now we're going to get strategic. And we're going to look about what we really want to do and why you really want to do it. And you get paid and you don't even have to touch much of that money at all, if any. That's what I like. So I think you should go. Question is, where would you go tomorrow, Lisa,

if there was no risk? I guarantee you that you'd be successful, you could not fail, and you didn't have to decide on it for the next 10 years, but short-term it was an absolute win. What would you do tomorrow? I would go if there was no fear. My fear comes in that I have a high school education. Hold on, hold on. You didn't.

Lisa, Lisa, Lisa, I get to host the Dave Ramsey Show this hour, not you, so you don't get to change the terms of the question. I know you're afraid. I'm going to deal with your fear in a second. I'm on your side. What would you do tomorrow? No fear. What would you do?

Leave. No, I know that. What would you leave to? No. Lisa, let me reframe it. You didn't even listen to me last time. Now you got to listen to me. Here's the deal. Lisa, I give you a gig tomorrow using what you do best, doing something you really love that creates a result you really like. I guarantee you, you will not fail. Even if it's something new that you've always wondered about. You can't fail, and you're going to love it.

What would you do tomorrow, Lisa? Say it. I don't know. No, that's not true. You would try something. I know you would. You have wondered. You've thought about, well, I think I'd like to try this, or I would do this.

What would you try? I love what I do now. Which is? It's telecommunications. I work in a network operations center. Okay. What do you love about it? Tell me. Tell me what you love about it. I love research. I love responsibility. I love the challenge of working with multiple technologies, multiple responsibilities. Okay. So, Lisa, the answer to the big question I pose to you

is, can I do something pretty darn similar to what I'm doing right now? That's the answer. I actually like what I do. I want to do something similar to that. So here's the deal, Lisa. Here's what you have to do right in this moment. You have to have a mindset of, I know that I can replicate pretty darn close to what I do now. There are multiple companies in the hottest job economy in the history of the United States right now.

More people right now, excuse me, more jobs available than there are people who are unemployed. You have something to offer. You've got a lot of experience and you've got a lot of skill. And Lisa, you know what work you like. You just described it without even thinking about it. So I don't know what you're locked up about. Let's go find that. Let's go find that. Where is all those roles? Where does that work exist in my area? Because

I'm already qualified. I know I like it. And let's get yourself out there and let's step into that. Don't even think twice about it. The only thing you're afraid of right now is you're afraid of the unknown. You've been in this position a long time. And so you have little thoughts bumping in your head all the time going, I don't know if I've got what it takes. Maybe it's too late for me to actually switch careers. I don't know. I've got to do this. I got to do that. No, no, no. You're really clear. You know what you want to do. Let's go do that. Use your web of connections. You got tons of relationships out there. Let's see you do that. Marcus writes in on Facebook, I'm interviewing for my dream job, but the catch is that it's almost two hours in a commute. Moving isn't an option

because my wife would have a long commute. Should I just give up this dream job? Yeah, I think you've answered your question here. It's not giving up the dream job. You're giving up this particular opportunity. There's more than one opportunity. There's more than one way to truly be in your dream job. It's more about, listen, listen, folks, to the formula. I use what I do best, talent. To do what I love most, that's passion. To create results that matter most to me, that's mission. Talent plus passion plus mission is the sweet spot. That's what we're looking for. There are multiple jobs and careers that will allow you to achieve that. It's not worth the two-hour commute because it's going to cause a problem for the family. So hey, the good news is

let's look at what we were considering here and it's attractive in every area except for the commute. Let's go find that closer, or let's decide to move. It's all about assessing what you need to do, what is best for you, when is it best for you to do it. It's not just one shot. You're not giving up on anything. You're making the right decision. More of your calls coming up.

I'm Ken Coleman sitting in for Dave Ramsey. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Welcome back, America. You're listening to The Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman sitting in for Dave. Thrilled to have you with us. As we take your calls this hour about work. Are you in a job you hate?

Are you like 70% to 80% of Americans and those worldwide who on Monday morning, they wake up with a pit in their stomach absolutely miserable feeling underwater the moment they drive into the parking lot a lady right out there in the glass is shaking her head saying no i'm not one of those congratulations ma'am thank you for listening anyway here's's the reality. Life is way too short to live for the weekend. The average American will spend, you ready for this, folks? 90,000 hours at work in their lifetime. Now, you run those numbers. If you're not doing work that you're good at, that you love,

that creates a result that matters to you. You're not in your sweet spot, and you're not contributing to the role that you were meant to play. And that's why we do what we do, 888-825-5225, taking your questions. 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225. Hey, speaking of the sweet spot, how about leaders in their sweet spot? Our event, Entree Leadership Summit from Ramsey Solutions, coming to the lovely Orlando, Florida area, May 17 through 20. May 17 through 20, Orlando, Florida. We have another unbelievable lineup.

It's the best event in leadership in the corporate space anywhere in the country and I believe around the world. Mike Rowe from Dirty Jobs. Damon John from Shark Tank. Legendary HP CEO and presidential candidate Carly Fiorina. Craig Rochelle, pastor of the largest church in America.

Benjamin Zander. Unbelievably celebrated and genius conductor. He's going to have his orchestra there. It's going to be unreal. Cat Cole, a really great executive with an unbelievable story. Chris Hogan, Christy Wright, myself from our team joining Dave Ramsey. It's going to be a one-of-a-kind event.

It's going to sell out. You better move on this. Text Orlando to 44222. That's the word Orlando. Text that to 44222 or call 888-22-PIECE to get your tickets. It's going to be great, great, great. Can't wait. It's going to be here before you know it, May 17th through 20th. So move on that. Change your entire leadership paradigm so you can grow yourself, your team, and your profits. 888-825-5225, the number. Back to the phones we go. Lori joins us in Kansas.

Lori, how can I help? Hi, Ken. Hi, how are you? I'm good. How are you? I am living the dream. What's going on? I am a special education teacher. I've been teaching for 18 years.

I think when I initially started, I wasn't sure exactly what to go into. And I feel like I've struggled first initially with confidence and then just to feel confident in the job. And I've changed jobs as far as teaching positions several different times just to try and see if, you know, it would be a better fit. But I just have felt like teaching in such education is just a very stressful, demanding job. And I've tried to leave teaching and go into other different parts of education, but I feel like I've struggled a lot to find a job that fits my personality and my skills. And so I just, it was kind of just looking for just different suggestions or areas of something to do just to get me out of. Special education, I guess. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Let me ask you this. You mentioned your skills. If I talk to everybody that knows you really well, and I said,

tell me what Lori does better than anything else, what would they tell me? What do you do best? I feel like I do have to do a lot of brainstorming and problem solving just because I'm confronted to a lot of situations that, you know, it's a lot of unknown. Um, and so, um, I have to go like be on the fly and, and sometimes I like that, but sometimes I like having a routine and. Hold on a second. We'll get to what you love. I want to know what you do best. So I wrote down creative problem solver. What else do you do really, really well? I feel like writing skills. I mean, I've always liked writing. I feel like it's been like a strength of mine. Yeah, it absolutely has been. So verbal skills, because you're also a good communicator in the classroom. So, you know, we've got verbal skills, creative problem solving.

That's a really good start. Basically what we're doing, we're having some fun. We're having fun, Lori, right? Because you have confidence problems. I want you to be confident in what you know you do well. Listen, we've all got stuff we do awful. I mean, I've got a long list. In fact, if it makes you feel any better, Lori, I promise you, my what I do best list is way shorter than what I do awful list. Does that make you feel better? Yeah. But guess what, Lori? Listen, nobody's going to pay me to be awful. So who cares what I do awful? Now, let's move over.

What work do you really love? Think of a task, a function, a role that you've always wondered about or you know when you think about this, your heart gets a little bit, it beats a little faster when you're in the middle of it. Time seems to disappear, and it creates a result that you really care about. What are we talking about there? Tell me. I'm not sure. That's not true. You've always wondered about something. If you've never done it, you've at least wondered about it. What would you do tomorrow, Lori? If I guaranteed I take my Ken Coleman show pencil and I go poof and you're there and you can't fail and you know, you'll enjoy it. And the added bonus, you don't have to commit the next 30 or 30 years of your life to it. It's just a big work adventure. We, what would you do, Lori? Say it.

I've probably leaned a lot towards college university, um, type areas, but then I'm just, I'm not sure. I actually, I started my PhD like a year and a half ago, but then I don't know for sure if it's the right thing to do. I just started it just because I thought it might make you feel more marketable. Okay. So you're talking yourself. You're talking your heart.

Your head right now is trying to turn your heart off. You are so close. We're going right back. I'm not letting you off the hook, Lori. Your brain is coming up with all the reasons why you can't do and pursue what your heart's telling you it wants to do. You already gave me a clue. You'd love to be in the college university space. What would you do on a college university campus if you knew you couldn't fail and you knew you'd love it? Just take a stab, Lori. It's right there. Say it.

Either like teaching or like supervising like student teachers. Absolutely. So guess what? What if I told you that you're doing the right thing in the wrong place? What if I told you you're using those verbal skills, the ability to creatively problem solve on behalf of students. What if I told you you were doing that, but the special education sector is not for you? That's a unique place that takes a unique person. And it doesn't make you a bad person for saying, it's not the right place. I'm doing the right thing, but I'm not in the right place. What if you are supposed to be that instructor and use those verbal skills, and you're helping a different type of student in a different place? How's that feel?

Pretty good, I guess. Well, there's the not confident. There's the not confident, Lori. Lori, you'd love to teach and guide and instruct and mentor students who are on purpose and at that next stage. Am I right or am I wrong? Sometimes I just feel like my expressive skills are not always good as far as, like, talking in front of people just because I get kind of stuck very easily. Would you rather be in a one-to-many or one-to-one environment? Probably more one-to-one. That's exactly right. Okay, so here's the deal. You're not going to get it in this moment, but what we've created is the process for you. This is the mindset you've got to have. What do I do best? I'm going to use

what I do best to do what I love to create a result that matters to me. We know where you would like to be. And you just identified one area. It doesn't have to be a college or university. But what is that role you would love to fill every day? And you're really, really close. But I want you to spend some time with the following people. The people who know you really, really well will be honest with you and give you some confidence.

And then people that are doing what you think you might like to try, get some clarity in what's involved there, and you'll get there. Hey, I've got to get out of here, but I want to thank Dave Ramsey for letting me hang out in the studio, James Childs, our producer, Kelly Daniel, our associate producer, and you, America. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show,

make sure you visit DaveRamsey.com slash show and register. We would love for you to come to National and tell Dave your story.