The Ramsey Show - App - You Could Be Free From Debt TODAY! (Hour 1)

Episode Date: September 30, 2022

Rachel Cruze & John Delony discuss: Investing using company stocks, Conviction about debt in sales careers, Why you shouldn't take money from your 401k, Why you shouldn't wait to pay off your credit cards, How to talk to parents about end of life arrangements, Why not paying off your house is horrible advice, What to do with extra money in your budget. Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: https://bit.ly/3nInETX Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: https://bit.ly/3GxiXm6 Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Девочка-пай Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Paws of Moving and Storage Studio, this is The Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I am Ramsey personality, Rachel Cruz, hosting this hour. And next to me, Dr. John Deloney, bestselling author and host of the Dr. John Deloney Show. So we are here taking your calls. It's a free call anywhere in the country

at 888-825-5225. And that's about what the advice is worth. All free. Free. You may love it, You may hate it. Who knows what's going to happen? And we have a lobby full of people on this Friday. And so just to remind, they're all clapping and cheering, to come visit us.

Our headquarters is right outside of Nashville in Franklin, Tennessee. So come. You can have a cup of coffee, some cookies, hang out, and watch the show. So you are always welcome here. All right, we're going to go to the phones this hour to Maria in Chicago. Maria! Hi, Maria. Welcome to the show. Hi. Thank you so much. Thank you for taking my call.

And I have a quick question for you guys. Yes. I'm already investing 15% for my retirement on my 401k through my job, but they do offer us a discount for the tax of the company, 15% discount. So my question is, would it be smart for me to take advantage of the discount and only put like 10% for my 401k and the other 5% on their stocks since it's a discounted rate. You know, Maria, company stocks, it's not my favorite place to invest because there's a little bit of putting all your eggs in one basket.

Even though you're getting a discount, I hear that. But the idea of more diversification and spreading your money around and so keeping some money, yes, in your 401k. And I would even, what's their match? What's their match percentage in their 401k? For our 401k, they match the first 4% 100%. And then the next 2% is 50%. Okay. Maria, do you have a Roth IRA?

I have it, but I'm not able to put a lot of money in there because me and my husband, both of us are putting 15% on 401k and then trying to put $100 extra to our mortgage, then it's not enough room to put extra money to that Roth IRA. I only put $20. So I know it's not a lot, but I at least put $20 every month. Yeah, no, I hear that totally. So one piece of advice, Maria, I would give you is just to run some math and even talk to a SmartVestor Pro. If you don't have a great financial advisor, I would check one of them out.

But even look to see, okay, what if you went up to the match of the 401k, up to that 4%, see how much it would take of your percentage of your income to go and invest and see if you can even max out your Roth IRA, and then come back to your company's 401k and put some more in if you haven't reached that 15%. So I would love the idea. A Roth IRA is just one of my favorite things, John, because it grows tax-free. And if you're able not even to max it out, but to contribute even more because of that growth, it's just a wonderful thing.

It's one of my favorite retirement vehicles when it comes to investing. So I would run some numbers, Maria, on your situation. And again, look to see, OK, if we just put in 4% and took up to the match of the company, see what percentage is left of your income and how much it would be to max out your Roth IRA. And if there's any more percentages left of that 15% pie, go back to your company's 401k. But I would not, to your original question, invest in your company's stock. My mom worked at this little company when I was a kid

called Enron. And they were notorious for being so generous with the greatest stock on planet Earth by selling it to their employees for cheaper. And then they built an extraordinary amount of wealth on the backs of their employees. And the people that were close to us that went to bed, bajillionaires, and woke up literally, Rachel, with nothing. With nothing. So she really worked for Enron.

That's like the infamous story of the absolute worst of the worst of the worst. The historic story. Deloitte and then went to Enron and went back to Deloitte. So she really worked for Enron. And that's like the infamous story of the absolute worst of the worst of the worst. The historic story. Deloitte. And then went to Enron and went back to Deloitte. So she was in both of them. But it was this, it just all went away. Yes. It all went, like the, whatever it was, the third or fourth largest company on planet

earth just didn't exist. Right. Just like a vapor. And so I think the idea of company stocks, I get it. And I appreciate them being kind. And I don't think every company is like Enron. It's just not where I'm going to trust my, I've already got enough invested in you with our,

like I'm doing work, you're giving me my paycheck. I'm not going to put that much more. I'm going to spread the rest of it out. That's great. That's great. All right, up next we got Jack in Grand Rapids. Hey Jack, welcome to the show. Thanks guys. How are you doing? We're doing great. How can we help?

All right. I have a question about the, I guess, the morality of my job. So I'm a car salesperson. I'm a car salesperson. Oh, good. You don't deal drugs? You're a murderer or something. You're a deal and drug something crazy. That's not near what I was hoping you were going to say. Okay.

Yeah, sorry. It's not as interesting as you hope. Yeah, so obviously a huge part of my job is signing people up for car loans, which ever since listening to you guys, I don't entirely agree with. I don't think it's the right path, and I kind of feel bad for customers, but at the same time, I know it's my duty to do that. So I've been struggling a little bit with kind of the moral responsibility of that. I know I'm not the one signing them up. I'm not the finance person,

but I know what's happening. I know what's happening, so I'm going to go in the office. And this is something that I've been dealing with. I'm giving advice of, am I more responsible for that? Should I be seeking some other work? Because this job has been a big blessing for my family.

So just maybe seeking some guidance with that. I think everybody I've ever met has a moment when they walk by the mirror and look in it and ask themselves, is the job they're doing or the people they're working for or the culture of their job or the time away from family that has some sort of value misalignment and they have to ask themselves, is this okay with me? And so what I would tell you is, I've got my personal opinion. I think it's way more valuable for you to make that choice. And it sounds like you've made that choice. You just realize, and I go back to people who, and again, this isn't about the facts or anti-facts, but

people were told to keep your job you will get this vaccination and some said okay and some said i'm gonna forego my paycheck because uh i'm not doing this um often our values cost us something and it sounds like your values you know what you feel you don't feel good about what you're doing and again i've got people working who i love who are in the car industry so that's not that's why i'm not putting it put it out there but for you you're having a harder time looking in the mirror and so i would tell you um go with your guts what your values are and then know this probably going to cost you something and it's not something by the way you have to walk in on on monday and quit right it might be something that you say this is not going to be what i do the long-term play yeah we've had many people bankers called the show and they end up doing this and like i just can't anymore and here's

the deal too jack and we say this all the time that that debt is not a sin right this is not a salvation issue this is not a thing that like it's it's not you can have debt and you know in the faith world, still love Jesus. Go to heaven, right? This is not a salvation issue. But it is down to a little bit of that moral dilemma for yourself. And how do you feel? Do you feel good at the end of the day?

And I think some people can hold that and walk forward, and some people can't just out of a personal conviction. Yeah, we call those people psychopaths, right? I'm just kidding. I'm totally kidding. No, no, no, no, no, no. But, yeah, that's one of those areas. I think people can reconcile.

Yeah, they can hold it different ways, right? Or am I a psychopath? Maybe I am. I mean, I got a TikTok account. I do it every day. Like, what am I doing? You're a YouTuber, John. Trust me, I know.

All right. This is The Ramsey Show. សូវាប់ពីបានប់ពីបានប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពីប់ពី welcome back to the ramsey show i am rachel cruz hosting at this hour with dr john deloney and we are taking your calls on life, money, relationships, career, anything and everything. We are here to have a conversation, to chat, answer your questions, and, yeah, have a good old time. Right, John? We're having a good old time.

Good old time. We're going to have a barn raising. That's right. So call us at 888-825-5225. It's a free call anywhere in the country. All right. Up next, we have Stacey in Chicago. Hey, Stacey, welcome to the show. Hi, thank you for having me. Absolutely. How can we help? So I had a question that I had some advice given to me by my financial planner. And I have a lot of medical expenses.

And I was told that for anything of this calendar year, if I have any unreimbursed medical expenses beyond 10% of my AGI, I can take anything out penalty-free. And I have well beyond the 10% of my AGI for medical expenses. And so I was just trying to lay out the pros and cons on whether or not I should do that or just pay it down because currently the expenses are on my credit card. Okay. So how much in total are your expenses? I have close to $33,000.

$33,000, okay. And what other debt do you have? I have some credit card debt right now. How much? That's about like $12,000. Okay. And then I have medical expenses also on those credit cards from last year, which is about $18,000.

Is that $18,000 included in the $33,000 that you were talking about or in addition to? No, it's separate. Okay. Okay. Anything else? Student loans? Car loans? I have about $16,000 left in student loans and my car is paid off.

Okay. How much do you make a year? I make $100,000. Okay. Um, you know, honestly, Stacy,

yeah, we don't, we don't encourage, don't, don't, don't, don't take out. Even though there's not a penalty,

there's still going to be taxes. Like there's still going to be, there's still going to be things going around in that. And so just not touching retirement is, is the goal again, mostly because we don't want you to pay taxes and penalties. And I'll say this, right now the market has been down this calendar year. You will lock those losses in forever. I can't imagine a worse time to borrow against your

401, to take money out on it. That makes sense. Yeah. I mean, because that money can grow at any point in time in the future. And since it is low, I'd be losing out on a lot. For sure. Yeah.

Especially what can be. So, um, what, what keeps happening year over year with medical expenses is this going to be ongoing so given my um current situation i am trying everything in my power now to make sure that what i am doing is covered by insurance um i i think i i don't foresee this lasting for another year or so currently.

I mean, I'm no stranger to working hard and doing this. Of course. You know, I paid down $100,000 in student loans before working two jobs. But certainly given my challenge and my current condition, I just really, one job is already enough. What's going on medically with you? I have Lyme disease and a bunch of co-infections and some mold toxicity and some mold illness. So I had to move and there's been a lot of expenses that I've had to kind of try to take care of in order to get myself into a better environment. You've locked these expenses, some of these in the medical expenses from last year

with your credit card. Have you sat down with the hospital and tried to settle this? I mean, cause there's something about saying your income is high, so they may not help. They may not work with you very much, but there's something to be said for, Hey, I got $50,000. I can't, I can't. Um, what number would they settle with, um, settle with you on? Right. And that's something I'm not sure about. I've tried to call my insurance company and understand that. No, cut them out. Cut the insurance company out.

I'm talking about going directly to your provider and sitting down. I had something done a few months ago, and I just asked, hey, if I write you a check, what is it? And it was a quarter of what it was of the total bill if I didn't use insurance. A quarter, 25%. Wow. And it's not what you're dealing with,

so it might not be so drastic, but there's something about if you owe, what, did you say $35,000? Yeah, about $33,000 for this year. Yeah, if you come in with $10 dollars cash and say i'm i i can do this can we call it good if i give you 10 grand i call it good um and they may do that and stacy and going back yes which i totally echo john for sure uh and then going back to your original question you know so much of this yes is out of your hands when it comes to the medical side of your bills, but making a hundred grand, which I know in Chicago doesn't go as far as

somewhere else in the country. But, but if you even just lived off of and said like, Hey, I'm going to live like I make 60,000, it could take you two and a half years and you can clean up all of your debt, all of this. And with the student loans, you know, and even the other credit card, which I know you said was with medical expenses as well. But, you know, all of this, just looking at it and saying, I am going to just, I'm going to go scorched earth and I'm going to sacrifice and I'm going to do it. Like you said, I know that the medical side that you're dealing with is going to make it more difficult, but put goal out there you know pulling money out if this was a just a mutual fund out there floating around i would say cash it out but when it comes to just your retirement overall it's just not a wise thing

to cash out uh stay in it don't don't don't jump off the roller coaster and and and map your map it out to stacy because even in your voice, it feels, you sound tired. You know what it sounds like? We hear this sometimes, Rachel, when people call and they've got their $1,000 and they're in Baby Step 2 and then something breaks and they have to go back

and do the $1,000 and they've sold everything. So now they're just got to grind it out. Yeah. And then they get up again and then something else happens. And it's just like, you know what?

Screw this. I'm just going to go put on a credit card. It's so much easier. And we're the only ones telling people, I'll sit with you because it's hard and it's awful that this happened. But you got to get back up and you got to go again. And you got to get back up and you got to go again.

You know what I mean? And at some point we say, you know what? You're right. You deserve it. Or here's a hack. There's not one, man. And she, I hate this for you. You paid off what?

$85,000 in credit. I mean, in student loans. Student loans already, $100,000. Yeah. So you can do it. That's the great thing. Yeah. But then just, but I just, in my guts know like the feeling of, oh, we get to go do all

that again. Right. Totally. Yeah. Here we go again. Right. So hard. Stacey, thanks.

Thanks for the call. Hang in there, Stacey. All right. So when it comes to changing your life in any area of your life, so whether it's your marriage or your mental health or your money or your career, it takes being intentional and it takes having a set of tools to help you in these changes. And again, whether it's even losing weight or changing a career, whatever the thing is, being intentional is so, so key. So that's one reason that we created the SMART Conference

to give you a plan to help really turn up that focus, turn up that intensity, to meet your goals in every area of your life. So we are so excited that we're gonna be in Dallas, Texas, Saturday, October 22nd for the SMART Conference. There's still some tickets left. It'll be about 6,000 people in an arena. And all the Ramsey personalities will be there.

Myself, John, Dave Ramsey, Ken Coleman, George Camel. And we are all sharing the stage to help you. Christina will be there. Christina will be there. Craig Rochelle and Amy, Pastor Craig Rochelle. And they're going to be talking about marriage. And there's live music. There's chaos all day.

It's going to be a blast. It's a fun day. It's a long day. It's going to be a blast. It's a fun day. It's a long day. You're going to feel like you drank out of a water hose because there's so much information. Yes. You're not out of a water hose.

It's going to be relaxing and bring you back to your childhood and the nostalgia of that childhood. John, this is why we host together. I know.

I'm so glad. You know, I wasn't in honors classes like you clearly were. All my AP classes in high school are really paying off. You're going to be drinking

out of a water hose, America. Just like we used to in the olden days. It's going to be fantastic. So get your tickets at framsysolutions.com slash events to get your seats today and join

us in Dallas, October 22nd. ДИНАМИЧНАЯ МУЗЫКА Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with Dr. John Deloney. And we're going to the phones this hour. And Rita in New York is up next. Welcome to the show. Thank you, Rachel and John. How are you? We're doing well.

Thanks for calling. What's up, Rita? Fantastic. Okay, my question is, should I pay off this last debt? So I've been working on my budget. I'm so proud of myself. Thanks for the app that you guys have. We're proud of you too, Rita.

Well done. I'm crunching all the numbers. And after I pay this debt, which is a consumer debt of $1,320.41, I will have left in my account about $1,600. I'll tell you in the beginning of the year, I had about $6,000 worth of debt. It just piled on. I don't even know how I did it. Um, I was working at a retail store making about $17 an hour. Um, but as of last month, I was offered a position making 95,000. Oh, wow. Yes. Doing what? Rita's a gangster, dude. What are you doing? I'm in insurance.

And I want to thank you guys, too, because I used to be in insurance about 12 years ago. Left that to live a little more. And I've been out of insurance about seven years now. And I was listening to one of the shows. And I don't know what happened, but you guys were just talking about insurance, umbrellas, this and that. And I was like, is this a sign? I reached out to a buddy who I know is still in the insurance industry.

I said, hey, listen, I'm thinking about coming back and I'm back. Rita, that's amazing. Okay, Rita, so tell me about this debt. Is it handsome? Is it just so lovely? Like, why do you want to hang on to it so tightly? You know what it is?

I think it's a mental thing. I think it's a mental thing. And, like, in my heart of hearts, I know I can do it. Like, just pay it off. I did crunch all the numbers, rent, everything. I'm good. You know what? I think I answered my own question, right? Pay it off. I did crunch all the numbers, rent, everything. I'm good. You know what? I think I answered my own question, right?

Pay it off. Rita. We're so glad we could help. Are you the first person in your family to go down this road? No, I don't think so. I think I'm the only one who's taken a stand on it. That's what I mean. That's what I mean.

Okay. So here's, I can imagine. This is just a psychological thing. You're about to cross a line that was always in your life for other people. Other people didn't owe money. Other people got to sleep all night and not worry about how their bills were going to get paid. Other people. And now you're about to step over a line that really doesn't exist, by the way. to sleep all night and not worry about how their bills were going to get paid. Other people. And

now you're about to step over a line that really doesn't exist by the way, but you're going to step over a line and you're going to become the other person now. And often we get hung up right before that. It's why weight is so hard to lose because man, oh, those people, the skinny people just gets it is hard. Right. And we can fill in the blank. Oh, they drive those kind of cars. So you're about to cross the line, and what Rachel and I would tell you is don't just step over that line. Sprint across it screaming and yelling the whole way.

Okay? Because there is no other people. We're all in this big sinking ship together. So just run across it as fast as you can, cheering all the way, okay? And you make $95,000. Your emergency fund will be built up in, what, three months? You'll be good to go?

Yes. Yes. I already have the $1,000 in there. And I have a retirement fund from my previous job. I have $130,000. Rita, Rita. Right now. You're trying to make this a math problem. You're free, lady. Okay.

You're free. You got it, Rita. Do it. Do it today. Do it today. Done. And then, oh, I just cut her off. I'm so sorry, Rita. I thought you were going to tell her. Rachel's the hospitable one on the show. No. But isn't that it is it's free

it i'm like it's right there and it's almost this intimidation of oh is this real like is this yeah what is this and i get going down to 1600 which we say a thousand dollars so you're even 600 buffered more than what we even would say i think she has her thousand bucks i think when she pays it all she's still gonna have 1600 have $1,600 in her account. With that, yes. And so, yeah, you got this, Rita. And well done on pursuing a whole new career. She's working retail, making $18 an hour, and just thinks, oh, I could get back to insurance. How many times do we hear that? When somebody's getting, when they cross the halfway point of their debt-free journey,

they just start walking taller and demanding, like, I don't have to live like this. And then all of a sudden they get promoted, get new jobs, making 95 grand. Start to see hope. Rita, you did it! Well done, Rita. We are cheering you on. Sleep well tonight,

knowing that it's paid off. It's paid off. It's awesome. Only free person in New York. That's awesome, Rita. All right, up next we have Chad here from Nashville. Awesome. Hey, Chad, from Nashville. Awesome.

Hey, Chad, welcome to the show. Hey, thank you guys for your time today. Absolutely. How can we help? So we began our debt journey here about 11 weeks back. It's going phenomenal. We're on track to be debt-free except for mortgage come the end of this January. And one of life's circumstances has just kind of shown up.

One of the unique ones where my dad, who lives in Michigan, he's 82, and he's no longer able to safely live on his own. And a combination of the siblings that are up there, um, who are either not willing or able to provide any more help. And he only has a $2,000 a month, um, social security check that he gets. So from what I've looked into assisted living is, is just beyond his means. With that check, he has basically nothing in savings. So me and my wife talked about it, and with her support, we convinced him to come and stay with us to help them. And thank you to my beautiful wife for that, because she's been amazing i'll i'll personally think his um remarkable son too because this y'all working hard y'all had a picture of what this was going

to look like and all of a sudden that picture's gone and y'all are having to scramble to paint something new like right you're having to change the oil on this thing while it's driving down the road and so good for you man that's hard that's a hard choice and i'm proud of man. That's hard. That's a hard choice. And I'm proud of you, man. It's hard. Thank you. Um, the, so the, the couple, a couple of things I wanted to throw at you guys and get your opinion on, there's a couple. So first we were thinking as far as him coming down here, um, contributing to the household, um, we're, you know, we're talking about, you know, maybe just if he contributed, you know, just for groceries, groceries um out of what he gets three two three hundred dollars for the month for groceries and we're talking about um maybe having him put uh ten thousand dollars aside for his own personal emergency fund um it was kind of the ideas we

were tossing around for him and talking with him and is this is this for your motivation for this, Chad? Yeah, what's he in an emergency fund for? In case he has to go to the hospital or something? Yeah, general emergencies and if for the day that we hope is still a long ways out, celebration of life, you know, expenses. Okay. So here's the thing it's common that when our worlds blow up that we try to solve that explosion through extra means of control and what you're doing now is

things blew up and your dad's moving in it wasn't in the plan but here we are you're disappointed your brothers and sisters here we are and now're disappointed, your brothers and sisters. Here we are. And now you're starting to rehearse tragedy that might be five or 10 or 15 years away. I would recommend get settled. I do love the idea of giving him a role to play financially in the home. That sounds counterintuitive, but-

Gives dignity. Gives dignity, yes. Hey, old man, you're paying rent. You see what I'm saying? Like he's got a he's going to participate even if it's a little bit and that will give him some responsibility there and then i think you'll have a hard conversation about recommendations and savings and things like that um i don't know rachel it's hard to tell your dad

what he's going to do with his money i know know he's living under your roof. This whole thing's flip-flopped. Yeah. And getting his thoughts as well, Chad, having that conversation. It's a dialogue. And to say, hey, let's do this together and figure it out. Because we all want the same outcome. We want to have a peaceful household. And how can we do that well?

But we commend you, Chad, you and your wife both, for doing this. It's very honorable. Get Power of Attorney, too, by the way. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Rachel Cruz with Dr. John Deloney, taking your calls at 888-825-5225. And up next, we have John in New York. Hey, John, welcome to the show. Hey, guys, big fan of the show. Hi, John. Hi, Rachel. How are you today? We're doing great. Thanks for giving us a call. How can we help? All right. I have a tough one. Okay. I have $170,000 remaining balance on my 15-year fixed mortgage. Okay.

2.0% rate, so it's a great rate. Financial advisor and accountant insist I should not pay it off. As they all do. However, I have about $170,000 in savings. The problem is I skipped the baby step, and i have no college savings for the kids if i pay it off i have no other debt i can immediately start that so i did skip that baby step what's your mortgage pay it off 170 no what do you pay every month in your mortgage principal and interest is about $2,600.

Okay. How old are your kids? Not including the property tax. 11, 7, and 5. Okay, okay. And household income is about $400. Oh, nice. Okay, okay.

Can I tell you what I'm doing in my house? Yes, sir. If I have a 12-year- a six year old, and if I was in your exact, exact same boat and I had $170,000 in savings, I would pay my house off before the end of the day is over. Full stop. You know, I've always gotten the, yeah, I love it. I've always gotten the advice that, God willing, I can continue to work. And when they start college, I'd pay for that out of my earnings. So I never really, you know, started anything up. Yeah.

With the anticipation that I would hopefully pay this off. Absolutely. Yep. If I pay it off though, emergency fund is gone so I should probably wait a few months to get that. Yeah, I was going to say don't cash it all out. Leave a little bit. That's including your emergency fund too? Yeah, I think so. Don't do that.

Yeah, keep three months and then yes, but write a big check tonight. I mean like have a level of it to be like, okay, we're getting there and yes what you're saying with your income yeah with your income level um obviously depending on where your kids go to school because they all won't be in school together at the exact same time that you

may be able to cash flow it completely uh just off of your income but the question is yeah will you will you have that that same level of income in 10 years let Let me do this. Here's some back of the napkin math. Okay. I'm just using my cell phone calculator here. If you take that $2,600 that you pay every month and multiply it by 12, that's $31,000 a year you're sending, not including your taxes. Okay. Your child is 11. Is that what you said? Your oldest? Yes. Okay. So it's seven years until they go to college. So if I just take $31,000 times seven, that's 218. It's 220,000 bucks that you can have by not changing your life in any shape, form, or fashion, just continuing to pay your mortgage. See what I'm saying?

Yeah. That's not cash flowing. That's just if you just kept making your mortgage payment and stuck it in a zero-percent earning checking account, you'd still be way ahead of most parents. So you feel do this in two steps, do a big chunk, build the emergency fund up, get it to three months and then finish it off.

Yeah. Otherwise you're going to write $170,000 check and you're going to go screaming down Manhattan Boulevard tonight. So happy. And then tomorrow morning, your air conditioner is going to break. And then you're not going to be happy anymore. But the fact that it's a, it's a good rate and it's 2% and it's an attractive mortgage, so to speak, that has no bearing, whether my rate's 2% or 5%. It really doesn't. Yeah. And that's what makes us

weird. This is where we're different than majority of a financial advisor or a tax pro out there, or at least ones that we don't recommend at Ramsey. But the norm out there is that they're playing a math game, John. So on the math side, could you invest that mortgage payments, you know, or keep the mortgage and not have, you know, have a low interest rate? I mean, all the math game that is played in that industry, like there's a, we have brains, like we see it and we're like that, I get what they're saying, where you could take this chunk of money and invest it and you could make more in the market versus what you're you know having to pay an interest on your house all that like mathematically there's a yeah like i get it that could happen but john yeah but john like what what freedom does to you and what peace does to you when you don't owe anyone anything changes the game you're in

you're in downtown new york uh no suburban new jersey okay think back to 30 months ago i rachel and i were in downtown manhattan when they came out of broadway and said broadway is closed until further notice as covid was kicking off we were in there in march i think march yeah we had a big work event that we were doing and we were all down there. Yeah. All the Ramsey personalities and we were literally there.

Yeah. Go back to that moment and imagine not having a house payment. Do you give a crap what the interest rate is back then? No. Not really. No. And then the idea of,

or the age old saying of cash is king and holding cash and having more than your emergency fund and just sitting on it while you have the mortgage that we that's a fallacy in your opinion right it's like cash is king but i have debt so you're solving for freedom right you're solving for freedom and all when you have when you have debt and you've got savings all you're doing is holding the bank's money for them. It's not your money because you owe it. Correct.

Yeah, so you have cash as king, but you don't have cash. You've got their money just in your account. So I would just give it to them. Like what does Happy Gilmore say? Just send them home. Just send them home. Just send them home. Just send them home, man.

Hey, congratulations, my brother. Yeah, John, well done. In 90 days, you're free appreciate it that's it i know well done john you've done a fantastic fantastic job absolutely incredible and yeah and that and that's what's interesting about what we what we encourage you guys to do is again debt is so normal and people play the math game over and over and over and over and over. And what's not in the math game is risk. What's in the math game is not fear. What's not in the math game is sleeping at night. What's not in the math game is not owing anyone anything and having literally no one that has their name on your paycheck. I mean, there is just something to be said that can't be put in a formula, but we are as human beings, like our soul, who we are and how we function. There's a lot there that again, a tax pro isn't always going to just sit down and help you have those

conversations. Well, I'm always just, ah, this is hard, man. But I always want to ask somebody when they're giving advice, do you stand to benefit from this advice? Right. And that's why I appreciate calling us. We're just a neutral third party out here on the airwaves. And I'll tell you what I'm going to do in my house. Right. I'm actively working to set myself up to be in the position that John is in. Right. For that very reason. And my interest rate is almost identical to his. It's basically nothing. Right. And it's not about the interest rate. It's about absolutely being free. And here's the great the interest rate. It's about absolutely being free. And here's the great thing too.

If you want a mortgage again after you pay it off, you can always go get one if you really want one. Yeah, go borrow one. If you like miss it and you're like, oh, I miss the mortgage. Oh, we really want that mortgage. Pay it back. We're going to go back and get one.

Your wife's going to tell you, hey, have a candlelit dinner. Say, I have a hard thing I need to tell you. He's going to think, what is it? She'll say, I miss the mortgage. Just miss that mortgage. I miss that mortgage. I miss all that you. He's going to think, what is it? She'll say, I missed the mortgage. Just missed that mortgage. I missed that mortgage. I missed all that money.

That $2,600, just leave it. All right. Next, we have Aaron in Knoxville. Hey, Aaron. Welcome to the show. Hey, man. We're right up against the clock. Go as quick as you can.

Okay. I got a really simple, quick question. I love it. I started the EverDollar app this month for the first time and I have showing $742 left remaining. I don't know what I'm supposed to do with that. Mail that to Ramsey Solutions. Attention, Rachel Cruz. I'll take it, Aaron. Congratulations, Aaron. That's a good problem to have. Okay. Do you have any savings right now? I'm currently fixing to officially start maybe step one in October.

All right. I'm just playing with the app to try to learn how to use it. I love it, Aaron. So great. So great. Did you get the app? Do you also have Financial Peace University? No. Okay.

I want you to hold on the line. Jenna's going to pick up, and we're going to get you a year subscription to Financial Peace University as well, because that's going to be able to go really in-depth with this information. So, Aaron, that $700 is going to go towards Baby Step 1 until you build up $1,000, and then any extra money you have left over in the months coming with extra work, selling stuff, cutting your budget down is going to go to Baby Step 2, and it's going to help you start the debt snowball and paying off your debts.

Great job, Aaron. I'm so excited for you. So excited for you. Go Vols. Hey, it's John Deloney, co-host of The Ramsey Show. Did you know over 18 million people listen to The Ramsey Show every week? A lot of those people listen on one of our 600-plus radio stations across the country. To find a station near you, go to RamseySolutions.com slash show.