The Ramsey Show - App - You Go From Intense to Intentional in Baby Steps 4, 5, and 6 (Hour 1)

Episode Date: December 9, 2020

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show, where debt is dumb, cash is king, and the paid-off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Rachel Cruz. Ramsey Personality, number one best-selling author, is my co-host today here on the air. Open phones at 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225. Jeff in Dallas starts us off this hour.

Hi, Jeff. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you so much. How are you doing today? Better than I deserve. How can Rachel and I help? Yes, thank you. So my wife and I have made a lot of progress in a relatively short amount of time. Our only debt left is our house. But honestly, I feel like I've done most of it on my own. She's not necessarily pushing back on when we were attacking debt and our other planning.

But I feel like when I bring up the conversations to move forward, she's just not necessarily interested. It's just not her cup of tea. And, you know, as successful as we've been, I know it's going to be that much better once we're on the same page. And I just would, I'm looking for some advice on how to get her on that same page. So going forward, do you mean saving up for the emergency funds, funding retirement? When you say moving forward, what do you mean exactly that she doesn't want to be on board with? Retirement fund is set. I'm sorry. Emergency fund is set.

You know, retirement planning, our kids' college. Like, we're starting to invest, but I feel like she's just not connecting in all the conversations, if that makes sense, and how we can get on the same page is what I'm really looking for. Okay. Well, I mean, funding the retirement, 15% of your income, is she wanting to do less than that? I'm trying to understand what her pushback is, or is it just that you guys aren't... She's not pushing back. She's just not pushing forward, I think is what you're saying. Is that right? A little bit of both, yes. Yeah, I mean, she's not necessarily thinking about retirement as much as I am. I mean, we're young.

We're in our 30s. But I still feel like we've got a later start than I should have. And I just want to be on the same page moving forward. For sure. Well, the fact that you guys got through the hardest stuff i mean baby step two and three that's the exhausting time of life you know when you're living like that so the fact that you guys got through that together is awesome and just as long as you're not continuing trying to be gazelle intense and continuing to sacrifice as deeply as you guys have been because baby steps four five and six is

really really where you can let your foot off the gas. You guys can go on, save up for a vacation. You can replace a car. Like you can actually start living life a little bit more. It's just that 15% of your income going away into retirement. And then yeah, sure. Looking at kids college for the future and all of that, but you guys are still young. You, you do have some time to just kind of breathe. So I'm just wondering from her end, cause I'm probably more like her, honestly, I'm more of a spender, I'm more of a free spirit. So if I was in her shoes and just say, okay, yeah, I am making these sacrifices now. But at this point, I would want to start to live my life. So do you feel like you guys are having these conversations about doing fun things again? We are, you know, obviously more postcovid and that really makes sense we were very gazelle

intense for the better part of a year knocked out a lot of debt and um you know i could probably learn to take my foot off the gas as you said yeah i think i was getting ready to say jeff let me ask let me tell you what i think i'm hearing and you tell me if i'm wrong okay i think i'm hearing you are a super intense nerd that loves the details and you have loved this process of having a goal and focusing on it and pushing through. And you're like 90%. You know, you got your foot on the gas, maybe too intense, maybe not. But at least you really spend a lot of headspace dealing with this. And she's like spending 20% headspace, and you're spending 90%. And it just feels kind of like she's a little bit apathetic,

and all it is is you're like a super nerd. Did I miss something? I think you hit the nail on the head. Okay. Because that's kind of the way it can be sometimes at my house, and I'm freaking Dave Ramsey, okay? So I'm the guy that thinks about this stuff all the time because I teach it all the time,

and I want to make sure we're modeling it, we're not being hypocritical that we've done this stuff. And so I might, for instance, on our estate plan, in a given year, I might have 40 hours invested and my wife might have 40 minutes. Like when she attends the one meeting that we do once a year where we cover our estate plan with the whole family. And then we all go to dinner, and she's wondering what's for dinner. Yeah, okay. That's the truth.

I mean, that's a Sharon Ramsey story, isn't it? Yeah, and I talk about this in my new book, Know Yourself, Know Your Money, about these tendencies, and her tendency probably is just more of a free spirit. And so she probably just is just not really thinking about it that much. And, Jeff, that's me. In my relationship, my husband is the one that plans our investment meetings every year with our financial advisor I mean he's the one that loves digging into the details and I do this for a living and I don't as much so like yeah I'm probably on her team she doesn't hold you but you

don't hold Winston back you don't argue to do something dumb to offset the process. No, no, no, no. But you're just not spending all your focus and your energy on it because it's just not like your favorite hobby. Exactly. Like if I was like, babe, let's just run out some numbers and look at compound interest. He'd be like, what? Yes. And I don't. So it's fine.

Who are you? What have you done with my wife? Yeah, that's all it is, Jeff, is she may never really be a super nerd like you are. But as long as you guys are talking about things, having shared vision, shared goal with where you guys want to be as a family, like you're on the same team, but one of you just may be like the varsity player that's just so excited about the game all the time. Open phones at 888-825-5225. If25 you jump in we'll talk about your life and your money well who just gives away money for free we do this is the final week to enter our ramsey christmas

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So our famous $10 sale is going digital. For a limited time only, you can instantly get our most popular audio books and e-books, all for just $10 or less. Get my number one best-selling audio book, The Total Money Makeover, read by me. If you're serious about getting your money in order for 2021, The Total Money Makeover is a must-have. Plus, it makes the perfect gift. Or learn what it takes to build wealth with our Everyday Millionaires e-book.

And as a bonus, for the first time, we're adding Debt-Free Degree and our latest audio book, Redefining Anxiety, by Dr. John Deloney, to our new digital $10 sale. It's not too late to invest in yourself or a friend this year. Skip the lines and shipping delays and shop our new digital $10 sale at our online store at DaveRamsey.com today. Or call the Ramsey Concierge Team at 888-22-PEACE. rachel cruz ramsey personality number one best-selling author is my co-host today this is the dave ramsey show open phones at 888-825-5225 chris is in charlotte north carolina

hi chris welcome to the dave ramsey show hey dave thanks uh. And Rachel, thanks for taking my call. Sure. And I am in an emergency situation and I'm on my wife and I are on baby step seven. And, you know, first off, I just want to thank you. We've been followers of yours for over 10 years now, maybe close to 14 years. And going through an emergency in the shape we're in is a great solace, and you are a major part of that. But we have six kids. My five-year-old is a cancer patient and is in the ICU after a surgery. And there's been some complications and there's going to be probably a couple of months of ICU stay. And so we're in really good financial shape. And my wife is basically living in the hospital and with my son uh, with my son. So, um, my question is one of the very, one of the ways where I was a little bit Dave ish was, um, uh, our fully funded emergency fund

is in a brokerage account and I can pull it. No, it's no real sweat off my nose. I'm just wondering if you recommend, um, just, uh, looking into, you know, because we're going to need full-time nannies. We're going to need all sorts of stuff. The medical stuff is actually not as bad as some of it, just the rest of the expenses. But do you recommend pulling that all out into some boring checking account or, you know, something where I'm not dependent on the market? The market's obviously on a real good rise so um i mean anyway i'm just wondering what your advice is where i go from here yeah i'm sorry i can't imagine what you're facing um we got five-year-old grandbabies one

of them is rachel's and um i can't get my head around what you're facing. So, yeah, the purpose of the emergency fund is not to make money. The purpose is to give you peace when you have an emergency, which is what you're talking about here. And so the reason I say that is, yes, I'd pull it out of the brokerage account today and put it in a money market with check writing privileges and a debit card so that you can get at it and just use that as your overflow whatever you can't cash flow for lifestyle needs right now like nannies and uh hotel rooms or whatever it is you've got to have that's not medically related but is related to this uh strain on your family yeah that's what this money's for. As a matter of fact, that's what all money is for right now.

You have one job, beat cancer, right? And any money we've got, any time we've got, any prayer bandwidth we've got, any emotional bandwidth we've got, any relational bandwidth we've got, any friend bandwidth we've got, any church bandwidth we've got is all aimed at one thing, beating cancer. that's it consumes your world and it should it should be your priority um right so um yeah i can't imagine yeah you got one job and so all this money's for that and and it's not it's not to ride the market and it's not to be in a brokerage account it's just sitting there just to be able to without thinking about is the market or and it's not to be in a brokerage account. It's just sitting there just to be able to, without thinking about is the market up, market down,

I need to write a check for a nanny. Boom, done. I need to write a check to charter a jet and put him in another city to get him looked at by somebody. Boom, done. That's what this is for. Yeah, and making sure your wife, obviously, Chris, has access as well because if she's in a situation that she needs to pull money out, if she's somewhere that she has everything she needs.

What this does is it gives you power in a situation where you're very powerless because at least you can control the controllables. There are variables in front of you that you can control, at least you can control the controllables. There are variables in front of you that you can control with money, and there's certainly medical diagnosis and healing you can't control, but you can't write a check for that, or you would. All of us would. But we write a check and help you, you know, but we can't control that. But like you said, the other, the ancillary thing.

So my guess is you're going to run through deductible instantaneously and you've got good, strong health insurance because you're talking about several million dollars with three months in ICU pediatric, right? Right. Yeah, it's all. Our diagnosis was back in June, so we hit all of our maximums long ago.

Yeah, yeah. And you just need to keep a good, as best you can keep your brain clear to do it, you need to keep a good audit on the medical bill flow because there's a lot of mistakes in billing coming at you. But probably it's not going to matter much, even if they doubled up on something. If insurance pays it, that's all that matters because you're going to blow through your co-pays and your deductibles so fast. And if you're on an HSA, you're into that 100% stop loss pretty quick.

So I'm sorry you're facing that. But, yeah, that's exactly what it's for. You have analyzed this properly, and you're discovering why we wouldn't have it in a brokerage account in the first place is because it's not there to make money. It's there to protect your life while your other stuff makes money. And that's the direction I would go. Wow. Just in case you thought you had a problem today, huh? Right.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. Angel's in Texas. Hey, Angel, what's up? Quite a bit, but how are you guys doing? Great. How can we help? Well, I need to know what would you guys advise if, so my husband, the industry that he works in, he has been in it for about 12 years now. And about the time that we had our first child, which was almost eight years ago, he decided to change companies because we decided as

a family that he, our goal as a family is to be together as much as possible. And this industry, he tends to travel a lot for work. And so when he changed companies, he changed and they were like, okay, we're going to keep you in Texas as much as we possibly can. And we're going to try and have you home on weekends. And that worked out for a while. He was there for seven years. And then last year he changed over to another company because that other company had decided to change up some of the way that they structured things.

And so he was then going to be going out of state more. And that was just not the direction we wanted to be in. And when he signed on at this new company, he told them, because they had asked him, you know, how much to get you to come and work for us. And he was like, it's not so much about money. It's about being home with my family. And he's like, I know that in this industry, that's kind of a tough thing to ask for,

but that's what we need. And that's more important than money to us. Yes, we are in debt. Yes. So just to kind of throw that in there real quick, we've got 170 on how. Before we run out of time, what's your question? Sorry.

Okay. The question is would you advise somebody to stay at a job that they love but is causing severe stress on the family or to try to find something else because the the problem with trying to find something else right now is you want him to find something you want him yeah you want him to find something else. There's not a question about that, the way this whole question has been set up. And so, Henry Cloud, Dr. Henry Cloud wrote a wonderful book called Necessary Endings. And in Necessary Endings, he said you end a relationship, whether that's a personal relationship, an investment, a job, whatever it is, you end the relationship when you lose hope that in the future it's going to get better. And so, you know, he comes home drinking for the 14th time.

You lose hope. That marriage is over. You know, sometimes he comes home drinking for the fourth time. You've lost hope. That marriage is over. It's when you don't think it's going to get better, you end it. And so is this a pandemic-related thing where because of pandemic, he's had to go on the road, he's had to work?

I've had to work some hours this year. I don't want to work as a pattern the rest of my life. I mean, we've been putting in some 16-hour days down here. Rachel has, and so have I. And because we've got a lot of media and stuff to do. We're trying to keep people's calm down so they don't do stupid stuff with their money and so on. So if it's just a short term thing,

or is this a longterm thing and an integrity problem with the company? And so if you've lost hope because it's a longterm thing and it's an integrity problem with the company, then it's time for him to look for a job and you move on and you don't sit there with your feelings hurt because if you just stay and keep talking about it with your feelings hurt then it's on you so you got to move if that's what it is but if it's pandemic and he's just having to dig right now and it's gonna it's gonna work itself out in a year then that's probably anywhere he goes right now. Thanks for joining us, America.

Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today as we answer your questions about life and money. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Ashley is in Columbus, Ohio. Hi, Ashley. How are you? I'm great. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? So, first off, I want to say thank you for your teachings.

In September, my husband and I sold our first home. We netted $135,000. Woo-hoo! With our emergency fund. And when Murphy came knocking at a tune of $15,000 on our new home, we were able to cash flow without touching our emergency fund. So thank you so much for that. Way to go.

Our question revolves around baby steps four, five, and six. My husband would like to build a pole barn on our property. How do we balance all of that while saving up to pay cash for a pole barn that we know is going to probably cost us somewhere around $30,000 to $40,000. We want to make sure we're paying down on our mortgage, but we're just trying to find a good balance. I think you'll slow down paying on your mortgage to build the barn. That's my thought, too, but I wanted to make sure that that's kind of the right route. It's what we teach.

Yeah, it's consistent with the baby steps. It would not be ish. It's what we teach. Yeah, it's consistent with the baby steps. It would not be ish. It would be doing it. Because the point of letting you go from intense to intentional in 4, 5, and 6, which allows you to hit 4, 5, and 6, but also hit some other goals. Because, Rachel, people do all kinds of stuff in this section. Yeah, for sure.

And people are paying their houses off on average in seven years. So you guys could maybe slow down for a year or two, save up this on the side, build it, and then go back and maybe throw a little bit more at the mortgage, you know, throughout it. So, again, it is a balance, but you want to be able to live your life as well, Ashley. Right. It wouldn't be any different from someone saying, I'm driving a $2,000 car, and now that I'm in four, five, and six,

I want to move to a $15,000 car. Where do I save up that $13,000? Well, you'd slow down your, and six, I want to move to a $15,000 car. Where do I save up that $13,000? Well, you'd slow down your baby step six is what you're going to do because you're not going to stop the 15% to do this going in baby step four, but you're going to, it's going to affect five and six to some degree, one or the other or both in order to hit some other family goals. But you know, if you need to move up in car, pole barn's a reasonable investment. It's probably going to make the property worth more than what it costs. It's a good improvement, especially if you're in a farm or a gentleman farm situation.

And so, you know, in Ohio, I would think it would be worth more than what it costs to do that. So you're actually adding assets in that sense. So, you know, this is the position you do it in. So you're doing everything right. Way to go. Very well done. Nick's in Vancouver. Hi, Nick.

How are you? Hey, Dave. How's it going? Great. How can we help? So I'm just wondering, I'm 24 years old, and I have about $70,000 savings right now with no debt. And I've been following you for a couple years years. So you successfully scared me from debt. So that's good.

Good. And I'm just wondering, because at my work, I work for city municipal government. And I put in 7% for the pension. And then they put in 8%, which equals to the 15%. I'm just wondering if I should be saving extra for retirement as well. Yeah, Nick, we usually say the match of what the company does does not count towards your 15%. So that 8% that they're matching does not count in the 15%.

So I would have an additional, you know, you'll have 8 more percent to invest. Yeah, I would pick it up. Maybe step four is you are investing 15%. If you get a match, it's gravy on the biscuit. And this is just extra money, and it's wonderful. I'm glad you get that. But it's not instead of. And so, because the point is, how are we going to end up with the most money?

Well, we're going to consistently invest out of your cash flow no more than 15% so that you've got the other money for kids' college and for paying off the house early. Good, good. Well done, sir. George is in Providence, Rhode Island. Hey, George, question for Rachel and me. Hi, Dave. Hi, Dave. Thanks for taking my call. I'm 64 years old. I recently retired. And I'm wondering if I should take my lump sum on my pension or if I should take a monthly stipend. I have around $1.6 million in my 401k. My only debt is a mortgage of about $120,000, but I can't decide on the lump sum or the monthly stipend. You have done incredible, George. How much of this did you inherit?

Well, I inherited another $500,000 in taxable accounts and stocks that I'm not even touching here. Oh, wow. So you've got a several million dollar net worth. Well done, sir. Very well done. Well, a sidebar before I answer your question is I'd write a check out of that account and pay off your house today. You'll feel so much different that you won't believe it.

Now, then, as far as the lump sum on the pension versus monthly, it's kind of a no-brainer. And let me walk you through why. I would take the lump sum and I would roll it into a direct transfer rollover IRA, so you don't have any taxes on it today, and let it grow tax-deferred from this point forward, especially if you're investing in good growth stock mutual funds. And if they're mirroring the market, the market is averaged between 11% and 12% since it started, where pension is growing at a maximum of about 7% because they have all kinds of regulations on them that prohibit them from investing aggressively.

Okay? The second reason is, and the biggest reason you would roll it, is when you die, and when your wife dies if they're a survivor on it, the pension is worth zero. Right. But if you die doing what I'm talking about, you're going to make more gains on the investment, and when you die, you keep the the money they don't keep the money

okay okay i did have a question on the taxable account that i have i'm holding off on taking social security for another two years so i can get to my full retirement age okay and i was going to draw an income to cover my expenses from that should i still yeah i plead that that much more to kill off my mortgage yeah that much more to pay off my mortgage? Yeah, that's fine. Just pay off your mortgage right now, today. Write a check out of that account today and pay the mortgage off. But then, yeah, just set up your expenses and live out of it.

And by the way, be outrageously generous to yourself and to others. You have several million dollars, and the reason you do is because you've been very responsible and you've been very responsible, and you've done a wonderful job investing and saving. And, you know, this is the everyday millionaire, Rachel. Yes, exactly. I know. The $1.6 million, it's his.

He didn't inherit any of that part of it. Right. And it's an amazing thing. I know I was thinking about Nick, the caller before that, who's 24, no debt, $70,000 and funded his 401k. And I thought, well, you'll be George here in a few decades. That's exactly right. I mean, the math tells you that. The compound interest tells you that.

You're investing 15% of your income, Nick, and you get the 8% on top of that. That was the question he had, right? Yep, yep. And if he does that, he'll be George. That's a good point. That's very fun. You kind of almost had a before and after picture right here with back-to-back callers. Right, right.

The thing that we do find when people are able to do that, when they're able to hit that $2-3 million mark like that, you almost have to retrain yourself to make sure you're maximizing your outrageous generosity because that improves the quality

of your life. There are almost no depressed, generous people. There's a stat for you. Yeah. In a year where depression is through the roof. Oh, absolutely. And all kinds of, as Dr. Deloney calls them, diseases of despair in this dumpster fire year of 2020. So, but number one, I would be very intentional about my generosity,

and hands-on generosity, not just writing checks to distant things that you don't see. I want you to see some of it and touch some of it. And then the second thing is intentionally enjoy it. The chances of you going crazy and spending all this money and being broke and not having any food is zero. It's not in your DNA anymore for somebody like a George. He's there, and if you took 10% off of $2 million, that's $200,000 a year, and he's not going to spend anywhere near that.

That's not in that guy's DNA. But you can do a lot of fun stuff and a lot of outrageous generosity when you relax a little bit in those areas. But we've had to be so intentional and in some cases so dialed in and so focused, it's hard to relax that muscle because it's been tense for 40 years. Yes. So even putting money aside and even people in baby steps four, five, and six, after your gazelle intense, to let yourself breathe, let yourself enjoy life. Yeah.

Once you go from intense to intentional and breathe let yourself enjoy life yeah once you get to the go from intense to intentional yeah and then you go from intentional to legacy here which is baby step seven legacy stuff and legacy is learning to relax a little bit and uh you know do the math and it'll give you a lot of peace that's right this is is The Dave Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Joe is with us. Joe is in Milwaukee. Hi, Joe.

Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you for taking the call. I appreciate it. It's a first-time caller. I'm 45 years old, and since 2015, I've made it a priority to invest, and I've been doing self-investment. I've not received any guidance, and I think I'm doing everything right. And I'm trying to figure out whether I should now invest to get a professional financial advisor. So in 2015, I started with $200,000, and currently I have about $1.7 million,

with $900,000 in a brokerage account. Well done, sir. Thank you. Well done. Well, the same question then applies. How much of this did you inherit? Zero. Okay.

So you are not an evil rich person who was a trust fund baby. You're just an evil rich person who saved all his money up. Yeah, so I did $1,000 a month every single month since 2015, and that went into a Vanguard account. I'm so proud of you. Okay, listen, there's no arguing that if you just keep doing what you keep doing, you're going to have a whole lot of money. Agreed?

Correct. Yeah. So how old are you? 45. And you told me that. I'm sorry. And there is, you said there's $2 million now, right? No, 1.7.

1.7. Total. Okay. So when you're 52, if that's sitting in a S&P 500, when you're 52, on average, that's going to be 3.2. When you're 59, on average, it's going to be about 7 million. That's if you don't add anything and you just left it sitting in an S&P 500. Okay? Because at 12%, it'll double every seven years. At 12%, it'll double every seven years.

At 10%, it'll double every seven years. So S&P 500 has averaged more than that. Now, so then the only question is, what would you get with a financial advisor? Because it's not like you have to have it to win. It's a predetermined fact. If you just don't drive the car off the road you're going to be okay right yeah and i guess you know the number grew so much and you know when it was a smaller number you know i paid the one and a half percent for an etf and it's um you know do with that number growing the only reason i would pay the one percent for management is if it gained me more than 1% above what I could have done by

myself. So I feel comfortable with my plan, but it's relatively passive. I'm confident in the market. I don't need this money for the next five years. So here's what I would do. Could somebody who's more active buying and selling... You don't need somebody churning your account, but they just may need to have their fingers on the pulse of it being a touch more active. Here's what I would do. Get online at DaveRamsey.com. Click on SmartVestor. It'll drop down a list of the guys in your area, gals

in your area we recommend. Go meet with three of them. Pick one and give them a half million dollars to manage. And let's run a control test for three years against what you do. And then if they can make you more than they cost you for three years, then maybe you move some more over there. So I have met with people in the past, and they kind of tell me to do what I'm doing.

In those times of emergencies is a financial advisor going to be proactive and say hey joe i want you to sell or i want to buy this or listen they might they might but a smart investor pro is going to tell you to hold just hold if it's my guys because that's what i'm going to do when the market dove in in march you know what i did nothing and you know what right now i'm really glad yeah because it recovered in 57 days yeah no that's uh and during that time i i i blocked and you know we had covid relief and i didn't pay my mortgage but i bought a thousand dollars worth of mutual funds that much do you own do you owe on your mortgage?

$235,000. You need to pay that off today. So even at whatever, you know, 3.5%. I don't care. But I'm making more in the market. No, you're not. You need to pay your mortgage off, dude. You have no idea what it's going to do inside your brain and inside your spirit when you don't have any debt. If it was such a good idea to borrow 3. a half percent you would have already borrowed a million dollars

at three and a half but that that made you perceive risk a little 200 000 didn't so i if i'm you i'm cleaning up your mortgage i'd sit down with somebody interview them what you're looking for is something with the heart of a teacher the heart of a teacher and um i've got one of our smart mr pros that is in my corner and i can call him and talk to him if i want to if i need if i'm wondering about something if i want to run a scenario out on something uh he doesn't have to talk me off the ledge on when things are getting bad but rachel you and winston meet with a smart mr pro and you're rachel cruz that's right well these people they do this stuff day in and day out. But again, Joe, I mean, because he has what? His stuff in like a Vanguard account?

What did he say? Yeah, he's got an S&P 500. Yep. So again, you're doing fine, Joe. If that's what you want to continue to do, fine. But I think running the controlled experience, that would be interesting to say, hey, let's put this other, you know, $300,000, whatever it is, in the market and watch it and see what a financial advisor does with it versus

just a traditional vanguard account i think what you're missing is some teaching and you're missing some input at key times when you want some input you don't have anybody bounce this off of it's a little bit uh it's a little bit lonely a weird kind of lonely but it's a little bit lonely the way you're doing it and uh so i've got these people in my corner and you know, Chris Hogan will sit down in here at a commercial break and we'll talk about something or Anthony talking to me about buying a house the other day. So, you know, we're just got we got people to bounce our ideas off of. And, you know, even though we know the answer to, but it just helps to have somebody to kind of work it and wrestle it, wrestle the problem with when people like this that are in the investing world day in and day out again they eat live and breathe this they're

watching it constantly they're gonna have a good pulse on what's going on i mean you could read health food magazines and articles all day long and really be healthy and you're eating and really be in good shape but a nutritionist could probably teach you something right that's you know great analogy that's that kind of you probably could get a leg up, you know, get some information you didn't have, some motivation you didn't have. But it's not to say, Joe, that you're like a loser and the only way you're going to make it is with a smart investor. It's quite the opposite.

You're going to do just fine. If you just keep doing what you're doing. I outlined it for you. You're going to do just fine. But I would get a smart investor pro in my corner to teach you and make you think about things and give you somebody to kind of wrestle ideas with. But they don't need to be somebody that just takes over and just says, well, I'm smart and you're not, and I'm going to go to prove to you that I can beat what you're doing.

Well, no, that's not what we're talking about here. We're talking about him or her explaining to you we're going to do these things with your managed account, and if they meet projections and historical data, we should outperform your S&P 500, which you can do, by the way. Lots of people do it. My portfolio outperforms the S&P 500, and I still buy some Vanguard S&P 500. I still buy some, well, Vanguard and another one too, but, I mean, S&P 500 is just still buy some, well, Vanguard and another one too.

But, I mean, S&P 500 is just kind of a safe, predictable place to park money. And it is what you said. It's a passive choice because you're not having to actively try to find something and move something that's beating it. But, you know, over half the funds do not beat the S&P 500. So you can't just buy funds blindly and beat it. But you can buy funds that have a track record of beating it, watch them, manage them, and beat it. My portfolio outperforms S&P pretty considerably, about a point and a half overall year in and year out. And it's nothing really rocket science about it.

I'm just picking funds that have a history of doing that and watching to make sure they do it. Yeah, and I think, too, knowing that investing is for long term. So even Joe being 45, I think some people want like some fascinating stuff and it's interesting and it's intriguing. Not him. Usually the boring, but I'm just saying for the listener, though, but usually the boring stuff over a long period of time. Is much more profitable. Yes, because it's predictable. You know what's happening.

And that's him. He was that guy. His stuff is not sexy at all. Yep. By coming out of his own mouth, he said that. It's just steady. And it was the other guy that said $1,000 a month for all this time. That's how I did that.

And you just freaking get out of debt, and he's not paying a freaking car payment, you know, or two car payments. And Sally Mae's not got her own bedroom in his house. When you don't have any payments, you can get rich. That's these people we're talking to. This is real people here. We don't set these calls up. They're just calling in.

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