The Ramsey Show - App - You Have To Clean Up Your Financial Mess Before Building Wealth

Episode Date: September 30, 2025

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Normal is broken common sense is weird so we're here to help you transform your life from the Ramsey network in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio this is the Ramsey show jade washaw Ramsey personality number one bestselling author is my co-es host today. The phone number here is 825-5-225. Leslie is in Lexington, Kentucky. Hi, Leslie. How are you? Good. How are you? Better than I deserve.

What's up? Thanks for taking my call. I have a dilemma. I'm recently married and I'm selling my home and I've moved in to his home on his family farm that's been in the family for 100 years.

We need to put a new house on the property. We're looking to spend about $150,000 on that. However, I am hesitant to go into debt on a mortgage on a property that is going to be 100% willed to his grandson. I'm sorry. It's likely that he'll... Yeah, so he's going to leave the property to his grandson. What's that going to leave you in? nothing i mean i can stay there you know but i know 100% that i won't want to stay there after he passes and it's likely that the mortgage will still be in existence because he's a he's like 11 years older than me yeah i'd be paying on a mortgage for a house that i'm giving away to

someone else yeah well that doesn't work does it it doesn't what should i do what should he do he's in this too i mean he wants to leave this land to his uh grandson and i that's kind of understandable if it's been in the family for generations i get that but also making your new wife homeless is not understandable yeah or or mortgaged up to her eyeballs how old is he 57 and how old are you 46 okay so 10 year difference there and have you talked to him about the idea of it passing to you first and then it then you turning around and willing it to the grandson when you pass yes he would do that the thing is i don't want to stay there because it's i have no family there you know it's i would want to move closer to where like my family is

it's like out in the country i wouldn't want to be there by myself and is he in poor health do you see this happening relatively soon um no i mean a whole This could be 30 years. I guess that's what I'm saying. You're willing to live there 30 years. And all those people that you want to move towards, they might not even be there then. Yeah.

I think you just don't want to live on that land. I kind of think you don't either. I think I'd buy a couple acres across the street and build a house there that is yours and his together. And then the family farm is intact to be left to his grandson. and it's not interfering with you all building a life together. I think the problem is when you tried to build a life together on something that is not going to be yours, and that's where it got complicated, so I think you've got to build it somewhere else.

Yeah, the problem is we would have to spend a lot more money if we did that. Well, why? Like closer to double the amount of money. Why? No, no, not double. Because the land is not, unless you're going to buy a whole bunch of land. I mean, if you bought one acre across the street, it's not anywhere near double. Well, and to put a house on it.

Well, you're going to put a house on it anyway. Yeah, but it would be like $300,000 to $400,000. You're going to build a house anyway. The only difference is the land under it. Right. Remember, we're trying to help you solve the problem. When you called, you said the problem is, if I live on this land, it's not going to be mine. So that was problem number one.

You want something that's yours and you want to be able to get to your family when the time comes. So you want the freedom to be able to sell it, do whatever. So we're trying to help you accomplish that. Because the other option is you move elsewhere, I don't know, closer to your family and buy something there, right? That's the other option in the complete other direction. Okay. So either way, the point is either way, you're going to have to spend some money. Does he live on the property now?

Yeah, we live in the old farmhouse that. is beyond renovation okay yeah i can tell you what i would do i would move off of the property to somewhere else and i would rent out the old house that's beyond renovation until it's beyond rental even and just let the property sit there and it's going to his grandson i would not combine your lives on that property i'd let that property be what it is it's legacy generational property and you're tangling up two things. You're trying to accomplish two goals with one piece of property

and it can't do it. You're asking it to do too much. Yeah. It's almost the equivalent of like you marry a guy and he's got like his bachelor pad apartment and he wants you to move into the apartment and you're like, I don't really want to live here. I'm only doing this to make you happy, right?

And then he goes on and he's like, you're not going to still live in the bachelor pad. You want to live where you want to live. You want a foundation that you start together where you both feel like this is our home where we live together. Yeah. The only other thing I could do is you could plat off one acre off of the family property,

build the house on that one acre, and that one acre is deeded to you, not to the grandson, period. But it would be tough to get. And then you sell that if you want to offer it to the family when you get ready to sell it before you sold it to the public, that's fine. But when he dies, you're going to move anyway. By the way, wherever you move to when he dies, you're going to move, according to you. But that's also the assumption that 30 years later, the grandson is going to want to keep up this land and wants the land, right? 30 years later that the family you're going to move next to are still alive.

Right. There's a lot there. Yeah. So we're really, really, really. But I think you're our wise to recognize that this is not a good system. It's not a good plan. So, no, I would not go forward with a plan. I would do something different.

So, you know, carve off an acre. That way you could sell that acre in that house when you got ready to leave after he passes and the family loses one acre of the family farm. If the family farm's two acres, then I guess that's a big deal. But if it's a 200 acres, it's not a big deal. So, you know, decide how that's going to work. And then, or literally go across the street off the family farm and build something. I don't care what you do.

And be smart about where you plot it out. If you pull it out smack dab in the middle, you don't want to do that. The corner, off in the corner. And that way it doesn't harm the value of the property. And it doesn't leave you with something that's not marketable when you get ready to sell. Right, right. So, yeah, but just the, you're correct in that going forward with the plan that's on the table is a bad idea. You are correct about that.

It's not going to end well sooner, later, whenever this is. I mean, the grandson could be really old by the time you're really old. Also true. You know, I mean, he's 57, so this grandkids, it's probably six. Uh-huh. Yeah. And so 30 years from now, he's 36 or 40 years old when. when papal dies.

Yeah, that means that's a whole different thing. Yeah. And he might decide he didn't want the land. He sells it to somebody. Now suddenly you don't like your neighbors. You know, there's a lot. A lot can happen in 30 years. Mm-hmm.

You know? A lot will happen in 30 years. That's very interesting. Very interesting. Good question. But you're recognizing, I think the bottom line is you're asking this piece of property to do things it cannot do. You can only do one of the two.

things it can't do both and so you're not going to be on the property if you're wise korena is in Washington hi korena how are you good how are you better than I deserve what's up I have a question I'm trying to figure out the best way for me to proceed So earlier this year, I had picked up a second job because I wanted to save up for a house, and that's what I've been doing thus far. And I learned that my second job actually offers a Roth 457B. And so now I'm wondering, should I put more money into my 457B so that when I leave, I can roll it over into my Roth IRA,

or if I should continue saving all my money for a house. I'd save all your money for a house. Okay. Yeah, you got your emergency fund in place and you're debt-free, right? Correct. Okay. And you're going to save up your down payment and then you're going to start your retirement savings, correct? Yes.

How far are you until being done with the down payment? How long would take you? It really depends. In our area, houses are pretty pricey, so they average about $500K, and I have saved up $83K. Oh, good. Okay. So when do you think you're going to buy? Um, originally I was thinking, um, that I would get a mortgage, but a month ago, a coworker of mine turned me on to the Dave Ramsey show and I read your book and started looking at your YouTube videos.

And so originally I was thinking probably, you know, this fall or, you know, in the winter, but now I'm starting to think maybe I should wait another year, save up and then, you know, put a bigger down payment or whether I should wait for about four years and just try to buy house and cash. Wow. What's your income? Originally I had started with about 70K, and right now it's probably going to be about 160 with a two jobs. 160? That's great. Correct. Wow, nice bump from 70. What did you do? I am in biotech, and I have an IT job. So what are you thinking you'll live on 60? Is that the plan? And then in four years, you'll have 500? that's kind of what I'm hoping for interesting I mean I'm never going to discourage you from paying cash just know it's a moving target so there's part of me that says if I can get in the game earlier I'm getting in the game earlier so just think that through yeah I think I would go with your plan but if the if the market starts moving on you you maybe can jump in with the 300k down payment or something if you had to but let's let's work your plan for right now I love that that's very cool good for you

congratulations that'd be very sweet place to be that's us we need more people with that mindset I think talk about hustling man hustle hustle hustle hustle I love Mike's in Pennsylvania hey Mike how are you I'm doing well how are you guys better than I deserve how can I help um so thanks for taking the call I have a pretty basically my situation here is I'm going to be receiving an annual bonus in a month a few months and I'm trying to decide what is the best use for the cash. So current situation, I have a little more than a emergency fund in the bank. I have about 50,000 in cash right now, about 25 of which I would say is emergency fund related. And I'm going to be getting a bonus of 60,000 gross, so probably about 40,000 after taxes. Between my wife

and I, we have about 50,000 in student loans. And then I have, the only other debt we have is two mortgages. So I have a rental property that was originally my primary residence that I have about 80,000 left on. And then I have my current primary residence that I have about 240,000 on. And the simple thought was put the money toward the student loans, pay them off completely. But the rate on my current mortgage is about 7%, whereas the rate on my rental mortgage is about 3.6. And my student loans are at about five. So when I look at the long term, when you look at the long term, you're wrong.

You look at the wrong term, you've got to get rid of the stupid student loans. You're not going to prosper as long as you keep those things around. This is not an investment strategy. This is stupidity, and you've got to clean it up. Right. So the student loans was the, that was the first one where I assumed that's what I should probably put it towards. You're right.

You assumed correctly. And then you'll still have, you'll still have a little bit because like you said, your emergency fund is inflated. So you'll still have a good chunk that... I'll take 25 and put it on a student loan a day. Uh-huh. And when the bonus comes and pay off the rest of the student loan. And then you'll still have money left over that if you wanted to throw it towards...

What were you saying? Your primary? Is that what you're trying to do? Yeah, well, I have the primary mortgage and the rental mortgage. The primary just has a much higher rate. So while I would assume, like typically I would have paid down the rental, but the primary is a much higher rates. I'll just have more savings for putting it toward that. What's the balances or the primary?

on the primary and on the rental? The primary balance is about 240. The rental is about 80, and the rental is probably worth about 175, and the primary is only worth about $2.90-ish. Is the rental local? They're both local, yep. I manage the rental myself.

I've had that for about seven years now. Good for you. Okay. I would clear the student loan, then I would clear the rental, and I'd refinance the primary. Okay, so you would go toward the rental first after student loans. Just because, not because of anything.

except it's just only 80 grand and you're going to knock it out quick because I smell a $200,000 income, don't I? Yeah, I'm right around 160 right now before the bonus and the bonus is annual but it's not guaranteed but I typically do receive it. Yeah, yeah, and so you're making $200K on average and almost like I've done this. And so, yeah, with 200K you're going to knock the 80 off pretty quick as well with you're sitting there with your emergency fund, refinance, get rid of that seven and some change because you can get a 5.7 right now in a 15 year.

Yeah. Once the rental's gone, how much will you clear in profit every month? Just curious. It's $2,200 a month right now, gross rent. Yeah, sweet. So you're probably making $1,500 a month, give or take, whatever your property taxes are in Pennsylvania, which I don't know. But, yeah, you mean, you're probably making some money there at that point.

Good job. And that's another, what, another $20,000 a year that you can throw at the primary. at the primary. But, yeah, I'm going to refinance that primary because you're going to, it's going to be more than two or three years before you get it paid off. And I want to get that rate down because that rate is a little bit jacked. But, yeah, but here's the thing. When you're paying off debt folks really, really fast like we are with this student loan almost instantaneously. And with the, the entire thing here is not even five years.

right the whole thing okay and so when you're doing all that then interest rates the shorter the period of time in which you're going to pay off the debt the less interest rates matter the only time interest rates matters when you're playing them out 20 years when you're playing about 10 years playing about five years but when you're paying off in four months it's irrelevant negligible almost I mean it's not like interest rates not your problem right at that point cash flow right right that's what you're leaning in on so good stuff Dylan is in Fort Worth hey Dylan Hey, Dave. It looks like I got the perfect duo today.

I got the payoff debt queen and the real estate master. So happy to be back on again. It's been a few years. So my wife is listening. So we have a new surprise coming that was really unexpected of a baby in, of course, nine months. So we bought our home for 420, probably close to two years ago. So we're not quite past that capital gains mark yet. if we were to sell it now, we're probably looking at 420, 430, we owe 388.

I have a feeling, I know what you're going to tell me to do. We have 62 left in student loans, and that's from myself and my master's from years ago. It's now been lingering like a pet for 10 years. I think our big question is we're trying to reduce that monthly cash and increase that monthly cash flow. If we could be going from like 3560 a month down to like 2,500 to 2,800, which is what we see rentals going for the around here, probably a game changer with cash flow. We could then throw all that in debt, stop pile money, go into sork mode until baby comes. What's your income? What's your monthly take on pay?

I have very irregular, so. On a regular month. Quarterly. what do you make a year? What do you make a year? Yearly this year will probably be about $150 for me, about $70 for her. If a regular month is $6 grand, then yeah, you got to get out of this house. It's more than 50% of your take-home pay.

But $6,000 is not $150 plus $60, so those numbers aren't up. So hang on, we're going to come back to you because I can't figure out what the flip you're doing. Hold on. All right, we're talking to Dylan, who's got a baby on the way. Surprise. It's awesome. And we're trying to figure out exactly what's going on. If I remember, your house payment was $3,500.

Is that right? Yes, sir. And as my wife just texted me, her baby wasn't a surprise, but we weren't sure if we were going to be able to have one. Got it. We were texting offline, and we're roughly around 9 to 10,000 take-home pay a month. It's just I get paid commissions quarterly. So, like, every four months, we have a big surge of like a $10,000 to $15,000 commission. Above the 9 to 10K, or that included in the 9 to 10K?

Correct. No, above, above. So you get 9 to 10K plus you get quarterlies of around 15K. I'd say so. So you're averaging about 15K a month. month. Yes. So the way I kind of have to budget it out is I kind of have to have those

sinking funds ready to kind of know what's coming over, you know, until the next quarter hits. Well, that may or may not be, but either way. Your question is, can you afford this house? Yes, you can afford this house. Why are you wanting to move? I think it's just that monthly is so tight. on us that it's not tight it's because you're not on a budget it's not tight I think you make

$15,000 a month you have a $3,500 house payment that's not tight well and I think it's only feels tight because you're trying to live without and act like your commissions aren't real probably true yeah so your commissions right let's let's pretend for a second No, well, whoa, whoa, whoa, let's pretend for a second. Let's pretend you got your commissions in your hand, $15,000, and you said, I'm going to allocate $5,000 for each of the next three months. I'm going to pull from that commission bucket, and I'm going to put $5,000 on my $10,000 income. That's making me have $15,000 income for the next three months.

Then when your next commission check comes in, you do the same thing. You're trying to do this backwards looking in the rearview mirror rather than looking at out the windshield like I just outlined because you've not gotten ahead of it yet. When you do that, this is not going to feel tight at all. Yeah, and I have been dropping each big checks onto a truck painter. Yeah, you're just acting like you're acting like you don't get those checks. It's not even part of your budget. The problem is that's leading you to a faulty decision on the house because you're acting

like you can't afford the house. You can afford the house. If you don't want the house, that's a different issue. you can you're you're you're obviously a free person you're allowed to sell the house if you want to but not because I I you know pretended like a third of my income isn't there yeah so for that for that first quarter it's not there and then when you receive it then you can say okay for the next quarter like you said you're putting that 5,000 per month and now you're ahead of it's 18,000 it's 6,000 yeah but now you're ahead of it it's just that first quarter when you're not ahead

of it yeah you just got to say that and so you have three me you have three you're If you start my plan, you have three more tight months. That's right. And then you'll never have a tight month again. Yep. It's the same thing with normal budgeting when you get paid on the 30th. The 30th check goes to the next month. It can't be used for the month you got it.

You can't wait to pay your house payment until the end of the month. So yeah, you've got to get ahead of it on all of this. It's just a little one month cash flow or in this case a three month because it's a quarterly commission check. So then you've just got to decide, do you want this house? Do you like this house? So I think what happened here is the announcement of the child made you go, oh, we've got to really start. Yeah, you do have to start now.

That's good. That's really good. It's good catalyst. We're going to give you a year of every dollar as a baby celebration. And I want you to get in the new improved every dollar because it's going to guide you through everything. But you get ahead on the sinking funds, not behind them. And then quit ignoring the fact that you actually make this commission because you're throwing 100% of it at something else.

And no, we can't do that. So it all goes into the plan. Then you work the baby steps from the plan. And while doing that, you look at the ratio of your house payment and say, okay, I can afford this house. I choose not to. That's right. But it's not because it's in air quotes tight. That's right.

Okay. Now, I feel better. You feel good. Nate is in Wichita, Kansas. Hey, Nate, how are you doing? Better than I deserve. How are you, sir? Better than I deserve. What's up? My wife and I went through bankruptcy last year and into early this year because we just made an absolute mess of ourselves financially.

And at the start of this year, we decided to focus and commit ourselves to getting out of the rest of my student loan debt, which is all we have left. And trying to live really disciplined. We lost our car last year when we went through bankruptcy, obviously. And we've been just driving an absolute beater, and we're trying to make it work. My daughter just turned three last month, and I'm feeling very grateful for that, and she's healthy and happy. But I'm just trying to maintain hope right now because it's hard. It's so hard to stay disciplined, to stay focused, to not give any of the temptation to go back into debt,

to have a nicer car, so things are a little bit more reliable. What's your household income, sir? Just under 70. And how much is your house payment? We're renting right now. It's just under 1,000. Okay. All right.

And are you still putting money into your 401K? No, I was pretty undisciplined through my 20s. I just turned 31 a couple weeks ago. We don't have any money in retirement yet. You're not putting any money out of your check into retirement? Not yet. As soon as we get out of debt. And how much student loan debt do you have?

Just over $20,000. Okay. We've paid off about heat so far this year. Okay. The thing is that you're facing, the math is not as much of a problem as the emotions. Right. I know, I know I'm just being emotional.

Well, I mean, you've been through hell, and there's a shame that goes with bankruptcy. It's, you're like labeling, I'm a money fail. you know and you're not but you know for a moment there you were but you're not that way forever and we're not going to stay that way forever so um i remember how it shook my confidence when i went through that and that's just very real so okay now how do we fix that well we need some quick wins we need some small wins and that starts to build our confidence up and um the best place to do that is a budget don't you think jade yeah i agree yeah

I mean, I agree wholeheartedly. So I would get your, get, you know, again, we'll give you every dollar for a year, and it's the new improved every dollar, and so it's going to guide you through the baby steps. But what you've got to do now is say, okay, we're going to look at the money coming in every month. Are you getting a tax refund? Not much of one. I set up my taxes, so I don't end up giving the government a free of interest free loan. Good.

Good. So you've done a lot of the things already where you can find some margin. Every dollar will help you find some more margin. But with a $1,000 house payment, you've got some margin in this because you don't have any other payments now except the student loan. And so, you know, our first goal is to save $1,000. Our next goal is start knocking off the student loan, making $70. You can probably do that in about a year if you live on beans and rice. And what your confidence will come, not because, the magic wand waves and gets rid of the student loan, but when you start being in control of your money instead of it being in control of you. The hard part is you're doing something that you've never seen done before, right? So you're attempting to pay off debt to become debt free and you've never been there before.

And so the natural inclination is to say, I'm going to go back to what I know. That's the comfort zone, even though it's not good for me, even though it got me in bankruptcy. see that's why you're like you know what let me just go back to credit card debt let me just go back and you're you're fighting yourself because you're you're heading towards a truly a brand new frontier for you and so what you need is to keep engaging with people who have done it before

so that it becomes more and more real to you and you can see it and it starts to become a normal reality right now it's not a normal reality for you is that fair so keep engaging keep being around here watching these shows listening into these debt-free screams get on social media, follow Rachel Cruz, follow Dave Ramsey, follow myself, and this is going to become normal to you, what we're talking about, and that's what you need so that it doesn't feel like this foreign thing that no one's ever done before. Well, last two callers, we gave the all-new every dollar to, it's a game changer. Watch the premiere on our YouTube channel to see the new app.

in action. I hear how folks are finding thousands of dollars in margin in just 15 minutes when they open it up, start plugging in their numbers. Every dollar's new features will point this out to you and then show you exactly what to do with that money so that you can move from debt to wealth. And that's exactly what we've been showing you how to do for 30 years and now we're growing it right here in the palm of your hand. Imagine how much you could find to put towards your money goals. Be ensure and check it all out. Again, watch the premiere on the YouTube channel. It's pretty incredible. Carl is in Cincinnati. Hey, Carl, what's up? Hey, Dave. I'm calling here under some pretty crazy circumstances. So, first off, I'll tell you my situation. I am a

100% disabled veteran from the Iraq War, and my income is strictly from those sources. It's fixed. It goes up when the government decides to give us an increase, but that's about it. And I've navigated a lot of things quite well I know um my wife died a month ago oh my gosh and uh yeah it's been traumatic for my family um what happened she had a stroke in her sleep was according to everything that happened how old was she 37 man she had a heart defect but we didn't expect this to happen i'm so sorry my goodness wow um we lost about 40% of our income when she passed and um gracefully we've at least had some life insurance which was just two years of her salary split evenly between her youngest our youngest and myself because of that I was already in the

middle of the Dave Ramsey plan at the time and because I wanted to do the right for my kids and set ourselves up and economize we are debt-free other than our mortgage we have six months of savings set up set aside largely due to because of that life insurance and I am just trying to figure out with my income which is about 81,000 a year just strictly that trying to live comfortably

while saving for my son's future both my boys got education benefits guaranteed to them so we don't have to worry about that I want to try to invest How much? Stop a second You're doing like 43 things at once And your wife just passed away

Let's just calm down a little bit Yeah I'm sorry man The life insurance was how much My share was $45,000 And the other was Theodors And that's going to be in the certificate Held until he's 18

and how much is that about the same about 45,000 okay all right and um so that was structured wrong okay um it was strictly through her work it was a benefit through work yeah because of her heart defects it was yeah pretty hard to get her any insurance yeah but by structured wrong i mean there should have been none left to the child in a certificate that's horrible so you're treating the 45 is your emergency fund did i hear that right i put that towards paying off credit card debt and the rest in the savings and economize, economize. That's literally what I'm doing. Okay. And how much is your house payment? $2,600 a month. And as soon as my lending guy, a really dear friend of mine who works in the

lending industry for veterans, he helped me get this house when I didn't have the credit to deserve it. But I got it anyway. And as soon as the rates are low enough for, me to do an Earl, VA Earl, I'm going to. I'm going to lower the rate but not restart the loan. That should hopefully bring me down a few hundred dollars a month once that hits. But I can manage with what we got right now. Okay, so if you've got an $80,000 income, you have no debt except the house, you have some money in savings for you have some money in savings.

You don't have to save for Theodore's future. You're fine. My thought was I want to leave in something that I don't qualify for life insurance, because of my disabilities. That is not my thought right now. I thought right now is you get your house balanced, quit worrying about saving for kids. He's got $45,000 sitting there in a cert,

and he's got a free education because his dad served his country. Thank you for serving your country. Okay. And so that's all set. And he can make his way. He'll be just fine. I'm worried the way you leave him in inheritance

is not by having a kid's savings, the way you leave an inheritance is you get yourself straightened out and you begin to build wealth for you over time but right now the first thing you do is you just get balanced you buy groceries you keep the lights on you pay the house payment and you live on your income and you can do that it's just been easier to focus on that and just sit and you know idle time sucks yeah i don't doubt that i mean it's waves of grief coming out you you and catch you off guard at the worst possible time but in terms of the math of your situation don't try to make this do too much the first thing is just live set up sustainable and that's food

shelter clothing transportation utilities um you know you're in good shape you're you're not in a pinch now if you start trying to put you know 25% away for retirement and i'm going to put another two thousand dollars a month for for theodore you don't have that kind of room That's not an option. She did have survivor benefits that are going to start this month, and I want to invest that. That's what I want to do. Well, if, if and only if your dad-gum budget is balanced. Got it.

Okay. If you do so much investing that you call me stressed out, then you're just, you're over-analyzing this. How much is her benefit going to be when that pays? $1,600 a month, divvied up between the two of us. divvied up between the two of you. How old is Theodore? Hello? I think we lost him.

Must have. All right. Yeah. There he was. Well, okay. Anyway, yeah. So it shouldn't be divvied up between the two of you. There's a survivor benefit that should go to you.

Shouldn't go to a minor child. so um but even if it does come to him it's for his care and we're going to use it in the budget for his care right you're the so we're going to take care of the household let's get the household going then we'll start worrying about investing breathe give yourself give yourself six months to cry man i mean 37 years old oh my god it's just a month ago she just give yourself let's just get this budget to where we're not going in the hole we're not having a problem and we're just everything's running smooth and we'll worry about investing a little bit later you got time you're you're okay you got plenty of time we'll get to investing

six months from now but for right now let's just see how big a pile of cash we can pile up and living on the income that we have coming in right right just keep it real clean real simple and then give that gives you you know if you don't want to add financial stress to grieving yeah well like you said i think he's trying to give him he's giving himself something to do when really there's not much to be done. I really wouldn't. I'd find a different hobby than screwing around with this money stuff right now. You know, let you give yourself a little room to breathe and the hurt and then six months from now your brain is going to be working a little better. Then you can talk about doing investing at that point. That's how I would do it. Wow.

So a couple of pointers then across the board. You always need to be in touch with Xander insurance and get term life insurance and you need 10 to 12 times your income on you if you're insurable. Now, Carl's not insurable. His wife may not have been either because they may have already detected the heart. As a matter of fact, he said that because he got it through the work.

But for the rest of you, you're walking around out there and you're 37 without any medical issues. For the cost of a pizza, you can get 10 to 12 times your income. And so you're making 50 grand. and you put 600 grand on you. And it's four people who are dependent on your income of somebody,

if something happens to you. Because all the time people are like, I'm taking a policy out on my kid. I'm like, no, no, you got it twisted. No, you put it eye on you. And 600K and 15 to 20 year level term insurance. And Zander insurance can help you do that. They've been doing it, been a Ramsey endorsed, Ramsey trusted for 30 years.

And we've been sending people over there. And you need your life. life insurance in place if you can. Now, Carl's family was not able to, but that call can remind some of the rest of you to get your stuff done. Make sure you're lined up. Kayla, how are you? Hi, I'm doing pretty good. How are you? Better than I deserve. How can we help?

Okay. Let's see if I can get through this without crying. So I recently separated from my husband because of abuse. Okay, I'm good. And I'm currently living with my parents in Virginia, but my husband and I originally lived in a different state, so I'm going to have to go. go back there for custody season soon. And I was wondering, obviously I'm not moving back in with my husband,

um, is it smarter for me to get any cheaper apartment that's around the one bedroom that's around, uh, $600, $700, um, for me and my two month old or is it better for me to get a, uh, two bedroom apartment because I work from home and I'm just wondering what's more important paying off my debt. as fast as possible or keeping up my mental health with just having more space and a space for the baby versus a space for my work. How much debt do you have? I have about 32,000 in student loans, 6,000 and 6,000 in credit cards.

6,000 credit cards? And so how much, what does he make a year? He doesn't make anything. He's a student. and so honestly I don't know how he's going to pay for our current house he was insistent on keeping it and I kind of want to stick it to him and see him struggle because I know he won't be able to afford it your name's on the mortgage too honey it's a rental oh your name's on the lease also I explain everything to my landlord and he understands what's going on I bet he understands your name's on the lease

unless he understands by giving you a, unless he releases you from liability in writing, your landlord and understood nothing. Okay. So I don't know. I'd be careful about sticking it to him with your name on there. Okay. Now, what do you make again? I make 20 an hour.

I think it's about 40K. There's part of me that I would really focus on, getting your situation financially cleaned up. And if you're able to live cheaply for $600, I would do that, especially while your baby's young and you guys can kind of huddle up in a one bedroom. And then if you can clear out some of this debt, then the time can come where you can move to a two bedroom. But I think now's the time while the baby's little and doesn't take up a lot of space. Now, you said mental health. I'm guessing because living and working and sharing a room all in one space, that's claustrophobic. Is that what you're saying?

yeah yeah yeah but you've been in a domestic violence situation so you got a whole different issue on mental health you've been dealing with a 10 out of a 10 on mental health a baby being in the room is a 2 out of 10 I think you're going to feel relief so yeah you're are you talking about moving back to that city because of custody um I don't know about the same city with the surrounding areas um within 30 minutes okay are you going to be safe rural area so are you going to Are you going to be safe? I think so. It was emotional and verbal abuse.

It wasn't physical, thankfully. But he is violent, and so it just depends. Like, he would break things. So I really don't know what he would do if he found out where I lived. Yeah, so here's the thing. You're coming through an absolutely horrible situation. And so you've got some spiritual recovery to do, some emotional recovery to do, and some financial recovery to do. Agreed?

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And so the last thing you need is right now is to be spending any money on an extra bedroom. So right now I'm with Jade. Let's keep everything as cheap as possible. How long have you been with Mom and Dad? How long have you been there? Two weeks.

Okay. How much longer do you plan? plan to stay there. We're meeting with some lawyers tonight to figure out how long I can stay without him being able to charge kidnapping or anything, which you'd threaten. Yeah, he can't, well. So, well, yeah, let your attorney advise you on that, and I would recommend you stay with your parents as long as you can, like for a couple months if you can, and during that

time, I want you to pile up cash, okay? Don't pay down debt right now. You're in the middle of a storm. I want you pile up a big old pile of cash for attorneys and for deposits on apartments and all that kind of stuff. Okay. Then once you get settled and you've got a divorce underway, you get settled on the cheapest possible apartment, then and only then will we turn loose on these debts. Now, if you haven't cut up the credit cards, you need to cut them up, okay?

They're cut up. Good, good. Yeah, I've been trying to pay them off, but my husband is, for some reason, against going ham on paying off or debt. Oh, it's real easy. Why that was, you're trying to control you. That's a control. Yeah.

So what we're going to do is you're going to clean this stuff up after you get stabilized. And the way you get stabilized is you keep your housing cost as low as possible utilizing mom and dad for the next one to six months. And after that, then and only then, as the divorce progresses, and only when the lawyer says you absolutely have to move back into the market, do you move back to the market and you do the cheapest thing you can then and you clear the debts and you pile cash clear the debts and pile cash and pile cash in the meantime because that if you had $15,000 saved right now and it was just a pot sitting there in a pile it would give

you a whole different comfort level than sitting there with no no cash and this other you probably wouldn't have even called us but because you'd have that much different of a feeling that's right And that's where I want you to get to first, then we'll clear the debt, and then we're going to be in an inexpensive temporary housing, which is like for a year or two, okay? It's not your whole life, it's for a year or two, so that you get away from the jerk. And, wow, pretty crazy.

That's something. Good for you. Good for you for pulling away and for having the strength. to do that good for your mom and dad to give you a safety net to land in and uh you know and it sounds like you've got your head on your shoulders you're already thinking legal counsel you're figuring out what you can do and can't do uh you sound like you've got a good support around you uh which is how you break free from this kind of stuff because it's got a this level of uh stupid has has a gravitational pull mhm yeah sucks people back into it over and over again especially

the more desperate they feel yeah you know and control that's the financial control is one of the things we learned 30-something years ago was when we see a guy that is 1,000% controlling every ounce of the money, there's very often domestic violence included. That's right. It's a symptom. It's an indicator of what's going on. It's not 100%, but it's really close to 100. It's in the 90s.

And so if the wife's not allowed to go the grocery store without her husband, if she's not allowed to do anything, make any money decision without her husband. If she's not allowed to, he's got a complete death grip on every single dollar. There's usually domestic violence tied with that. So that's a little bit of what you were experiencing there, Kayla, where he didn't want you out of debt because it gave him a power over you. The Ramsey Show question of the day is brought to you by why. refi defaulted student loans that are private can drag on for years but why refi helps borrowers explore custom refinancing with a low fixed rate and a payment you can actually manage go to yrefi.com

that's the letter y r e fy dot com slash ramsay not in all states all right today's question comes from chad in Washington he says my wife and i followed the baby steps and are debt free except our house our net worth is one million and we owe 75,000 on a house that is worth $750,000. We are in our early 50s. When we got married, my wife had a $100,000 annual salary, but when we had kids, we made the decision together for her to stay home and homeschool them.

Fast forward 20 plus years. The kids are grown. We are doing well, but my wife is still not working. My income is $150,000 a year. I have asked her to get a job for a few months to knock out the mortgage and build up a gap fund so I can retire a little early. We have plenty to live on, but I've noticed some budget drift as the kids don't require

as much attention as they did when they were little. Is my wife a princess, or do I just need an attitude change? Interesting. Okay, so just to recap, you guys are millionaires, you owe $75,000 on the house. Your wife has not worked in 20 plus years, is what it sounds like. And now you're saying, hey, I could retire a little bit faster and we could pay off the a little faster if she would just get a job. That's where we're at. I don't think she's a princess. I think there's something that maybe you guys need to do to work to meet in the middle.

I can understand you wanting to go a little faster on the house and I can understand you wanting to retire a little faster. But I don't necessarily, I wouldn't go as far to call her a princess. I think you need to frame up the argument in a way that she's also excited about it. because whatever you've been saying in West, it's not, you know, it's not, she's not excited about it. So she doesn't want to do it. Yeah, Chad, if we look up nerd in the dictionary, we're going to see your face. Okay. You got, you completely dialed in here, bro. And that's good. That's good. That's what got you here. But, yeah, you're, you're 100% concentrating on numbers, which is what I do. That's how I know what you look like. I know who you are. And, um, if,

you're not careful, you forget about relationships. No, your wife's far from a princess. Yeah. Does she need to dial it in and get a little bit more serious and join the crusade to build some more, the last little bit of wealth so that we can, yeah, yes, she does. We tighten up that budget a little bit and we can, but does she have to necessarily go back to work to accomplish that? I don't think so.

I think the budget is her, that's been her thing for 20 plus years. So if she can tighten up her end of the thing, which is managing the money at home, and if you can tighten up your thing, which is bringing in the money from outside, I think that's fair. I mean, you manage the money at home together. Yeah. You're going to do your budget. We're not going to do it. But I mean home economics. But no budget drift. We're not going to be drifting. And but I think I think you could dial it back a little and she could dial it up a little. And like you said, meet in the middle. That's what it sounds like. But no, it's neither. It's not that you are completely out of line and need an attitude change. And it's not that she's a princess.

That's right. That's right. But I think you're making some valid. observations from a nerds perspective, and she's probably gotten just a little comfortable. That's true. And let's just dial up the seriousness just a little bit, dial down the seriousness just a little bit, and I think we'll find a really happy place right here. By the way, you guys have done great. Yeah, woohoo. Luke is in New York.

Hi, Luke. How are you? I'm doing good, Dave. Much like you, I'm doing better than I deserve. How are you? Just the same, sir. What's up? All right.

So I am 25. I just moved back home from graduate school. I just got my master's degree. And, you know, I listen to your show a lot, and I know sometimes there's recent graduates on, but I guess I just needed like a refresher. So, you know, I'm having trouble in my job search. I know you always say to not just apply to a thousand jobs on the line without really talking to anybody.

But, you know, I have kind of a niche skill set. I worked in the sports industry for a few years, and I guess, you know, that's what I want to do, and I guess I'm kind of being picky at this point, I'll admit. So I just kind of wanted to get like your advice or whatever on, you know, handling a job search postgraduate degree. So what are you wanting to do in the sports industry? So my master's was in data science, sports business analytics, which, you know, I didn't just choose that degree.

It was what I was doing out of school. I was working for a major sports organization, moved down to get my graduate degree at a school that had, you know, pretty good sports and was working for their basketball team. And, you know, something in that field, I live around New York City, so obviously there's tons of opportunity for roles like that in other fields. So I have kind of brought in my search in that sense, but it's still just kind of been not the most fun process. Yeah.

Well, you're right. You're in an epicenter of sports, without a doubt. If you were going to be close to a whole bunch of teams, that'd be the place to be, right? uh in all kinds of different things um and and yet having said that it's a fairly small pond you're fishing in yeah so that means you've got to go one direction or the other to jog something loose and one is you lower your expectations for salary and position and you take more of an entry level get your foot in the door in a sports organization or two is you step outside sports and you make and you make what you make what you think you can make so what is it your what do you

you think that this position you're trying to get is worth? Well, I guess that's kind of definitely part of it. I've definitely lowered my expectations in terms of salary. I would guess like the 85,000-ish range, but at the same time, I'm not really locked into this area. You know, I just moved to Mississippi for school and for this job. So, you know, I'm not kind of, I'll kind of move wherever if the opportunity is right, and there's definitely, you know, a path to developing as a professional and developing my technical skills. But I'm just in a weird tweener spot where, like, I'm not entirely entry-level, and then for the jobs, you know, I'm thankful to have gotten interviews.

It might be, it might be, I think I heard language that you were using early in the conversation, that it's possible you are overvaluing the degree. For sure. The, like, I got this degree, and, and you think that's going to be. like the magic bullet, the silver bullet, the silver bullet, the secret sauce is Luke. And what Luke learned while he was getting the master's. The master's degree has zero value in and of itself, only the knowledge that you put in your brain while you're getting the master's degree.

Now, that knowledge has value. So knowledge is valuable, but degrees are worthless. So people don't care what degree you got, they don't care where you went to school. What they care is, did you learn something that you can use to help us move our process, our company, our organization forward? And so if you'll concentrate on how you can add value, not concentrate on, look at me, I got a master's. That might change your interview posture, the posture of your heart in the interview.

It's like, hey, guys, I went back to get a master so that I could get really good at this data stuff, and I'm really good at this data stuff, and I can help you with your data analysis, and it's going to do this, this, and this, and I want to add value, and I'm excited, and I'm pumped up about adding value, adding value, instead of, like, opening up your shirt and showing them the S on your chest or the MBA on your chest, right? I didn't know where you were going with that. Okay, great. Superman is here, right?

And so, you know, like Clark Kent and, you know, not, no, don't, don't, you know, you got to be real careful with a new degree that you worked really hard to get it, and I'm glad you got the knowledge, but then don't place too much emphasis on that. Plus, there's a certain level of, I don't know, ladder climbing with any position, right? No matter what, when you start out, you're kind of at the low end of the totem pole and there's some building that has to be done in your role, right? Like you're building your personal brand and you're building your skill set and you're, so there's that part of it.

There's a grunt work aspect all the time as you're building. So that's just part of it. doing our onboarding and stuff here that, you know, I want, sometimes I'll swing in and sit in with the new team members. Inevitably, one of the last question, what's it take to get ahead at Ramsey? I'm like, well, here's an idea. Be really good at your job. Yeah. Start proving your value. Add value. Make us really happy that we hired you. And that's how you move ahead. We're very utilitarian. That's right. Most businesses are, by the way. We really just want a return on our investment. That's how this thing works. And so you got to, you kind of, you kind of, you kind of

Make us more than you cost us, or we all go down, right? That's how this works. So how can I add value? How can I add value? And how can I, in a very practical way, hit the ground with my feet and start running from day one? Well, guys, big news. The Fed cut rates, you know about that a couple weeks ago. And the 15-year fixed-rate mortgage rates have dropped as well.

lowest we've seen in about 11 months. If you're financially ready, it's a great time to buy houses because house prices have kind of been basically flat up a little bit. Buying an affordable home you love is possible when you work with a Ramsey trusted real estate agent. These high-octane, high-protein pros are handpicked to guide you through the weird market and keep your financial goals in mind while we're doing it. Find a trusted, Ramsey trusted, local pro for free at Ramsey Solutions.com

slash agents, or click the link in the show notes. Tyler's in Toronto. Hi, Tyler. What's up? Hi, Dave. Hi, Jade. I want to start by saying I'm a long-time listener, and God bless both of you and your team for the work that you do.

It's made a great deal of difference in my life, and I'm sure for many others. Thank you. How can we help you today? Well, I'm calling because my wife and I, we are both 30. we've been together six years and we are currently on baby step three but we are stuck we're stuck on step three because we have been working at gazelle like intensity for the last five years or so and we between the two of us we have two full-time jobs and three part-time jobs and I'm calling to ask for help on what advice you would give to boost a household income

so that we don't have to be working 70 to 80 hours a week each because I'll be honest, we work conscious and hard and we love each other, but we are tired. Sounds like you don't make any money. Yeah, what are you making? Well, so part of, we live just outside Toronto, so we are in an ultra-high cost of living area. Our monthly budget, which we have followed dutifully

since we moved in together four years ago. So our monthly expenses total, including everything, is about $6,800. And we make, and between the two of us, we bring in about $105,000 a year. Okay. And what did you pay off during that five years of Baby Step 2? Our total debt wasn't very high. We only had about, we only had about $8,000 or $9,000. So if you don't get different jobs, you can't afford to live there?

With our current ones, we can, but the compromise is, no, just on our full-time salaries, we can't. Yeah, that's what I mean. You don't make enough money to live there without working 70 hours a week and three part-time side hustles. It's a cost-of-living thing. Yes. I mean, you also can't live in Manhattan, and you can't live in L.A. either. What's keeping you in Toronto? know. What's keeping you there? Two reasons. One, all of our immediate family is here, and both of us are

fairly connected with our families and churches. I mean, we've lived here for 30 years. We just want to stay in our home. But I mean, is there a... Both of our jobs are tied geographically. She is a high school teacher, and so she would lose her seniority and her salary if we moved. and I work as a copy editor for a municipal company. So if I moved away, I would have to find another job. Right, but I do feel like both of you have jobs that you could find in outer rings of Toronto, right? I mean, how far out from Toronto do you live currently?

Are you an hour outside of town? Yes, we already live in a suburb. But both of us have been looking for the last year and a half because we set a goal and we're fed up with this. We want to get it, so we have more time together. And so we have been consciously applying. Right. And I've had multiple interviews and two offers, but both offers were for less money than I currently

made. Well, there's going to be a cap. I mean, you're going to, you've got to go into this knowing for my job, for my career, here's kind of the salary cap. Like, here's a generality of what I'm going to make. So just because you apply for more jobs doesn't necessarily mean they're going to be higher paying. And Dave made the, Dave made the point.

If you choose to live in Toronto, there are certain things that are going to go along with that price-wise, and you have to at some point say, I can either afford it or I can't. I have family members who lived in L.A. for the longest. And they said, the truth is, even I'm a teacher and the spouse did something else. If we work here for our pay, we will not be able to afford the lifestyle we want. We won't be able to buy a home. We won't be able to do X, Y, Z. And so because of that, they moved to Georgia, where they could have that life.

So you guys have to decide as a family, what's more important, working 70, 80 hours a week to have this dream of staying in Toronto or having the picket fence and having some breathing room and being able to have, you know, whatever that is. You guys have to make that choice. And the third option is completely change your careers and get your income up. But you cannot, you know, you're right. The reason you're tired is that you don't see a way out. You feel like a rat in a wheel. and because mathematically nothing's changing and you're smart enough to realize

doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result as the definition of insanity. So, you know, you've got to change something if you want something to change. So there's three possible variables and, you know, it's location and is one of them.

And then the second one is to change careers completely. But I, you know, I've, feel for you. But there's some things you just can't, you know, you can't afford to live on $20 an hour in Manhattan. You're not doing it on $20 an hour, but you're trying to do it on about $40 an hour. And so, and you just can't afford to live in Tokyo and London and Toronto and Manhattan. You just, you can't make it there on that kind of income. So, I mean, you guys are

staying afloat but you're doing it by just you got every finger stuck in the every hole in the dam and if you pull one out the whole thing's going to flood out on you and you realize that so I'm sorry man I wish I had a magic wand that would make it easy to do but it's not you're going to you're going to change careers or you're going to change locations and uh or you're going to work 70 hours a week which I don't recommend as a way of life I don't mind doing that to get somewhere but I don't want to do that and say that's that's for the next 40 years what I'm going to do. Yeah, there's a cap on, there's a cap on that. And five years is a long time to be in that mode. You don't only get physically tired. You get emotionally tired. Yes, yes. You

lose sight. You lose sight. Justin's in Illinois. Hi, Justin. How are you? Good. How are you today? Better than we deserve. What's up? Awesome. Awesome. So, yeah, I try to get back to the point. um i'm 48 and in my 20s and 30 and in my early 30s i never gave retirement a passing thought you know there weren't 401k meant nothing to me and so now that i am retiring you know i know you can't make up for a lost time i just want to make sure i'm doing the right things so that you know hopefully i can't retire someday and with a with a healthy retirement and i just you know run numbers by you and basically see what you think and you know what what i was to change Are you out of debt, except your house?

Yeah, completely the house is paid for. Oh, everything is paid for. Very good. Okay. Yes, sir. So are you maxing out your 401Ks, IRAs, and so forth, all in Roth? Yeah, but my 401K is in Rop. I do 14%, which is my company's max.

I guess I fall under their high earner category. So I'm at 14%. How much is that? I understand at 50. I make about $1.40 a year, so it's, you know, $18,000, $19,000. And even though I'll call it $1,500 a month, and what else are you doing? On top of that, the reason I'm not worried about that, the 401K that much is my company also has profit sharing, which obviously fluctuates,

but the last two years, it's been $30,000 that they put into my 401K. That's great. What's in there now? What's the total nesting? the total is only right about 100,000 that's why I was calling you today because they had a financial advisor

come in a few months ago and just look at your numbers and see where you're at and he gave me some numbers for 15 years on the line and just I don't know compound interest so I look at my numbers today and the numbers he gave me

I'm like that's not right you know one of those deals listen I plugged it in now if you work from your current age 48 to 68 you've got 100,000 in there now you put $1,500 in a month, average rate, annualized rate of return, 10%. You're at $1.8 million. That ain't too shabby.

There you go. If you want to get some more help, sit down with a Ramsey SmartVester Pro, and they'll show you in detail exactly how that works and how you're going to get there. Emily is with us in Detroit. Emily, how are you? Hello, Dave. How are you? Great.

What's up? Hi. Well, I'm calling with sort of a financial, moral, ethical, and biblical question all in one. Let it rip. So my brother and I, we both work in ministry, different churches. We live in different states. He's clear across the country than me. He and his wife, they have eight children, and their belief is that God called us to go forth

and multiply, and they believe Christians should be having his money children. Well, they are doing a good job. of that? Well, regardless of finances. So their only income is my brother's pastor's salary, and as you may imagine, pastor's salaries, you know, nobody goes into the ministry to, you know, make it big. So he has actually said in podcasts and interviews that if you have more children, then you can afford to have, that qualifies you as the needy. And the church and family members are called to help the needy. And so his solution to this is to be on state aid. in addition to a salary, and his in-laws also pay them a stipend every month

because they believe he's in ministry and they should be helping them with their bills. I think it's lunacy. I think it's crazy, and I was just kind of curious what your opinion was of that. I completely agree. Thank you. Yeah. That is not biblical. I don't believe it's biblical either, and even though the same denomination.

The Bible does say to be fruitful and multiply. The Bible also says that those that won't take care of their own household are worse than an unbeliever. I would 100% agree with that. And he and I are the same denomination, but sometimes I wonder if we're reading the same Bible. But my other question to piggyback on that is do you think Christians in any capacity, whether you're a pastor or a firefighter or whatever, should ever be taking advantage of government or, if I like to call it,

taxpayer-funded eight? Well, I'm not ready to throw rocks at everybody who ever does anything. But obviously we at Ram, are big on helping you prosper. And I've never met anyone who prospers on government aid. I would 100% agree with that. So it's not an act of love for me to recommend that. Or you certainly wouldn't tell people to do it as a way of life

because it's not good for them. It's not as much a moral judgment as it's just loving the person and saying, gosh, I've never met anybody on welfare that had just a wonderful life. I would agree with that. The consistency of staying on welfare. Yeah, but are you going to hell or are you a bad Christian

if you go through a rough patch and the government helps you for a little bit? I'm not going to be that judgmental. I'll give you a break on that. Okay. Not perspective. And my other question was actually kind of on behalf of my parents.

My parents are very generous people. They fly out, so they live in Detroit with me, but they fly out to where my brother lives periodically, you know, to see the kids to keep up that relationship. And they're very generous when they're there. Um, but when they are there, you know, they kind of have their limits on generosity. My brother will make comments like, gee, you know, my van needs new tires and, you know, see these bald tires. It's not safe. Or one of the kids lost their glasses. And, you know, we just can't afford to repair them. What are some good boundaries that parents of adult children could have on saying, well, this is your problem, you know?

Yeah. Um, so it's just kind of my question is there's any good guidance on that. The thing is that there's not anything your parents are going to say or you're going to say it's going to change your brother. He's made his decision. True. It's very true. And so I'm either just going to love him where he is and disagree with him.

I mean, I have relatives that vote wrong and I love them anyway, you know. And so, um, you know, that's okay, you know, and they think I vote wrong. So that's okay. And they love me still. So, but now, you know, how much money am I going to pour into a situation like that? Listen, they're fixing the bald tires or replacing the lost glasses is not going to repair this situation. It's bigger than that. Correct.

And that's what the advice they've been given by other people is. That's just a band-aid on it. But the tires are going to be an issue again. The glasses are going to be lost again. Whatever it is, it's not. Yeah. So, you know, I would just say, okay, I have a budget of money I'm going to burn on these grandkids just to, just to, be just to be that guy and I'm not going to worry about it but past that the answer is no and so you

know when we go out here and visit we're planning to drop a thousand dollars into kids stuff that they need right now because their dad's kind of a doofus and so um you know I'm just going to have that as my line item and then when it gets above that I'm not going to you know I'm not going to do any more than that also Emily everything that you're talking about is not even a direct effect on you You're talking about this is your brother, this is your brother and your parents deal. So if I were you, respectfully, I'd just mind my own business because nobody's coming to you for money, right? Well, it's her mom, and this has not been said directly to be, but a good friend of mine is actually married to my sister-in-law's brother. And she has made money comments about how, oh, gosh, they're in such bad, you know, straight financially.

Everyone in the family, including, you know, myself and my husband should be helping them. And I just think it's wrong. I think you should be embarrassed. If you're in your 30s and 40s and your county and family members to pay for things for you, I think you should be so ashamed. As an ongoing pattern, yes, but as an off thing. But, you know, again, somebody four degrees of separation away doesn't get a vote on what I do. If they don't like that, I don't agree that he has labeled himself needy biblically.

And I don't agree with that label, so I'm not going to biblically step up and make him not needy. He's needy, but it's not money. He needy a new job. Careful. You'll get a jadeism. You'll get a jadeism dropped on you like a bomb. You needy a job. Oh, that's it.

That's the deal right there. Oh, boy. Here's the thing. It is frustrating to watch people that you love, especially when they're taking advantage of people that you love. And they're not winning. But I'm also not going to get sucked into. anyone else's guilt trip or I particularly resist someone trying to Christianize their guilt trip.

I know that's right. So like we had a guy one time at the old office, Jay, this was funny. He came in and he was at the front desk and I walked out. They said, this guy's out here to see you and I walked out front. And he said, God told me that you're going to give me a new van. And I said, no, he didn't. he said oh yeah yeah he did and i said no he didn't because if god told you that i was going to give you a new van he would have told me okay and there'd be a new van sitting out there with the keys

in it i know that's right if god told me to do it that's what would have happened but god didn't tell you nothing you had bad pizza last night and you're blaming god and so um and then of course he starts cussing and screaming about how we're not real christians and had a little duck fit right there on the floor and we had to have him removed but um because you don't you don't challenge these God people when they're doing this stuff. So, I mean, crazy Christians give the rest of us Christians a bad name, y'all. I'm just saying. So, yeah, God told me that, you know, and so, yeah, you're going to quote scripture that demands that you remove my private property from me. We're going to have an issue with that, needy, needy a new job. That's it. Yeah, wow. And here's a

sad thing. Wow. There's eight kids being affected by this. That's what I know. Yeah. That's, that's tough now they're being raised by that and then they come then they can't figure out why they strayed away from the church exactly yeah because they were raised poor because their mom and dad had decided to have a bad um biblical definition series of biblical definitions yeah um but i tell you i do love the idea that that we ought to be fruitful and multiply but um maybe we also ought to raise our income while we're doing that right so that we can feed them that's supposed to be the kind of other thing goes with it. So I agree with you. I agree with your frustration, Emily. But to Jade's point, there's not anything you're going to do about any of this. So this was just a

discussion we all had because nothing changed at the end of this discussion. Because we could give no one instruction in this process that's going to take the instruction. Yeah, if they wanted help, they would have called in. If the parents wanted help, they would have called in. Yep. So now you get to just sit on the sideline be frustrated or just watch them and grin and go, that's my brother. Yep. Yep. That's him. That's the guy. I I know that guy. That's the hardest part of all this, though, when you see a better way and you know a better path and you just want that person to just change.

You want it more than they do. That's how we become enablers if we're not real careful or just really frustrated with family members. Yeah. You're just sitting back there just, meanwhile, they're broke, eating a sandwich. They don't care, you know. They're broke, eating a sandwich somebody else made. That's right.

That's right. Media job. I can't believe you, Jake. That was really good. That's good. That's good. I'm going with that. I'm sticking with it.

I'm going to steal that one. Steal it. For about three more times, it'll be something I said. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fair Winds Credit Union Studio. Jade Washaw, Ramsey Personality, number one bestselling author, is my co-host today. Kayla is in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Hi, Kayla. How are you?

Hi, how are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? So I had a question about term life insurance. I've been listening about you saying that we need about 10 to 12 times our annual income. And I just, I guess, from my point of view, it seems like that's very, very high. And maybe I'm just like missing something in the calculations. And so I'm just hoping to kind of get an idea of like why that number you pick. That's a great question. Thank you so much. I appreciate that. Because a whole bunch of other people are probably wondering exactly the same thing if you are.

I'm so glad you called. So to start with, it is not universal. Number one, everyone does not need life insurance. It's if people are counting on your income to live and you die, then they're up a creek, right? And so, and as you build wealth through your life and get out of debt through your life and your net worth increases through your life, you progressively need less insurance to the point that you're self-insured. I'm 65,

I'm worth millions of dollars, and I don't have a dime of life insurance. Okay? My wife will be just fine if I die, okay? As a matter of fact, she's kind of planning it. Okay, but that's because we're out of debt and have built wealth.

You follow me? And there's no kids to raise. The kids are all grown and gone and so forth, okay? jade on the other hand has two littles and she and sam are raising a family right now okay and so different positions in life so if you're 20 and you have no spouse and no kids um you don't need much life insurance because no one's counting on your income so that's that's the sidebar that's the caveat but then back to your original meat of your question is let's say you're 34 you have two kids and you make $60,000 a year and your spouse makes $70,000 a year, okay?

That's when we would say if you got a house mortgage, you know, you've got some student loans you're still paying off, you're working the baby steps, you're a normal 34-year-old in America today, oh, you definitely need 10 times. And the reason is this, $60,000 income earner 10 times would be 600,000, 12 times would be 700,000. So if that person died, let's say that, let's say that was the husband. He died and left the wife behind with two littles and half the income that used to be there. That wife could take that 600,000 and invest it. If she made 10% on 600,000, it creates 60,000 of income without touching the nest egg that is created. The goose will keep laying that golden eggs perpetually.

if you invest 600,000 at 10% in a good growth stock mutual fund, it should average that or more, then she's going to have the same income off of that mutual fund that her husband used to produce. And you did not sacrifice retirement. Yeah, and she didn't have to starve to death, okay? And so that's where it leaves her in reality, and we've got thousands of those stories over the years.

But that's where it comes from. You invest the 10 times and at 10 percent, then you end up with replacing the income of the person, and that's what life insurance is for. That makes sense? Yes, I think so, yeah. Okay. So, in other words, what's your situation? How old are you? I'm 35.

Okay, single or married? I'm married. We have three kids, two in middle school, one in high school. Okay. And what's your net worth? Our net worth is roughly about $200,000. Okay. So you're doing pretty good.

All right. How much debt do you have? We don't. Okay, good. House or anything? Well, house we have a little bit left. There's a little bit less than $100,000. Well, you're ahead of the game.

Agreed? Yeah. You're doing better than average for your age. Okay. Funny, I picked out 34 a minute ago, huh? For the example. But that is the exact average. So what does your husband make?

My husband makes about $80,000. So if he had a million on him and we invested that at 10% and make $100,000 minus taxes, you'd have $80,000. And we would not miss his income. We'd miss him, but we wouldn't miss his income. And here's the weird thing. If he's healthy, if he's not obese and he doesn't smoke, that $1, that million dollars on that 30-something-year-old is very inexpensive.

Okay. It's like the cost of a pizza. I mean, it's nothing when you look it up. Have you priced it out yet, Kayla? Yes, yeah. We had gone through Xander and had a couple estimates, and so we had priced it out. I was just trying to figure out exactly, like, where we should land with that. So truthfully, a million is a little much for y'all because you're in such good shape.

because if you didn't get his whole income replaced as good as job as you've done, you'd probably be okay. But for the difference in the cost in $800,000 and a million on policy so low, I'm going to go ahead and beef it up a little bit. And even later on, when the kids were grown and gone and we had some wealth, Sharon wanted me to keep life insurance for a while, and I kept it for a little while, S-W-I, Sharon wants it. There was no reason for it whatsoever mathematically.

She just wanted some. Did she let it go? I finally talked her out of that a few years ago. But for about a decade, I kept a life insurance for no apparent reason other than SWI. She said, I'd rather have that million dollar policy than another diamond. I'm like, wow. Good. Okay.

You can have it. It's just a gift to you. But you understand it's not good financial planning. You understand it's not what I teach. And she's like, I don't care what you teach. I want it. Okay. To be a fly on that wall.

But that's where it comes from. If you take 10 times or 12 times your income, your spouse could invest that amount at 10% and we have replaced you if something happens to you financially. Obviously, no one could replace you. You're special. But yeah, right. But anyway, so yeah, that's the thing. You're going to be okay.

And then as you age, like let's talk about once you've aged out of it, like when you feel like you've net worthed out of it. Let me call it that. Well, the kids are grown. We say 15 to 20 year level. term that's a good point because 15 to 20 years from now the kids will be grown and gone that's right and they're making their own money they're doing their own life they don't you know they're not a liability anymore financially um 15 to 20 years from now you'll be out of debt 100% house and

everything that's right because we tell you never take out more than a 15 year mortgage so you're going to be completely debt free 15 to 20 years from now and 15 to 20 years from now you probably have a million bucks or more in your 401k so you will have been investing in baby step 4 15% of your income. And so your assets are rising, your debts are going down and the kids move out, then it takes less to support you. And you set up with good financial planning working the baby steps, a situation where you become self-insured. Right. We're really at that point, the only thing you're thinking about is your health. Yeah. And caring for your health. And so there you go. Yeah. But we're not, if, again, if something happens to me today, we've done all of those things,

And then some. Right. So Sharon's more than okay. And vice versa. I'll be okay, you know, without her income. It'd be okay. She doesn't have an income. But that's good.

So that's other than mine because it's ours and all that. That's right. Investing might seem complicated or confusing, but it doesn't have to be. The Ramsey and. Investing and Retirement Hub is packed with interactive tools and resources that can help you get informed, not intimidated. Check it out, Ramsey Solutions.com slash retire or click the link in the description if you're listening on YouTube or podcast. Guys, remember, retirement is not an age, it's a number. So it's not like 65.

Bing! No, it's more like 2 million six. Bing! You know, okay, what is it? You want, what's the nest egg you want to where you don't have to think about money, then you are able to retire at that point. Now, we can call that financially independent. I don't like that phrase very much, but we could call that whatever.

And I don't like just saying, I'm never going to work again either. I think you ought to do something. I work and I don't need to because I love what I do and I help people and it's a good thing. And so find something to lay your hand to, that's a good thing. because too many people do quote quit work and like a year later they're dead so you need to something you're doing right so you need to be plugged into something and but that's yeah remember retirement is not an age it's a number all right here we go amelia is in south carolina hi amelia how are you hi dave i'm well how are you better than i deserve what's up great um okay well i'm calling because my husband is a physician and His practice is a private practice, and they are about to merge tomorrow with some other groups. And we just figured out that his 401K from his old company, or the company he's with today,

but it's about to become a new company tomorrow, we don't have to put that in to the new company's 401K. I guess we can instead make it a self-directed IRA. Or you could just roll it to an individual IRA. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So I think that that may open up lots of different options and just wondered if you had any advice. Like, could we consider putting some of it into real estate investments or something like that? Okay. All right. Good. Well, the first thing is, yes, I would roll it to something. I would not leave it with the new company 401K. This is an opportunity to move it to something where you have a lot more control and a lot more options. At a minimum, you sit down with a SmartVestor Pro and you pick a series of good mutual funds on your own and you manage that, you roll it to an IRA.

There's zero taxes on that and you manage that from this point forward at a minimum. Okay. If you chose to do a self-directed, you could roll some or all of it that way. How much is in it? It's our biggest of all of our retirement accounts. It's $1.155 million. Okay. Do you own other investment real estate now?

No. Okay. How old are you guys? 52. Okay. All right. So here's the, yes, you could roll half of it or some of it or all of it. Let's say you moved a half a million over and you bought a couple of $250,000 rental houses in South Carolina.

And you put the other half a million or other $600,000 in a regular IRA like I was talking about in mutual funds. Okay. In the self-directed then, you can buy real estate, as you mentioned, and you could do those two $250,000 houses in there if you wanted to, okay? The downside is two things. One, people screw up and forget that you can't touch any of the money from those rental houses, okay? Just like you can't cash out your mutual funds in your IRA until your 59.5, you're going to get penalized. Okay, so you can't pull the rent money out and use it. 100% has to be operated like it's someone else's company,

and you can't embezzle or commingle funds in any way. It has to be a standalone operation, and 100% of the repairs are done from the IRA, the roof, the heat and air that goes out on the rental, the carpet that has to be replaced on the rental, and 100% of the income created, and the rental has to stay in the IRA. You understand?

Okay. Yep, that makes sense. Because if you pull one dime out, number one, they may toss you out of the whole thing, but number two, you're going to get penalized on that dime and taxed on that dime when you pull it out. So don't commingle it, and people often mismanage these things. So you've got to just be real airtight with that and promise, promise, promise, and stick with it. The second thing is you've never owned any real estate. Now that's an investment, no.

Yeah, and you're getting ready to be a landlord and buckle up, Buttercup. This is a new experience. Okay. So when she pulls the rents, those hypothetical rentals that she purchases, she pulls the rents, those money, that money has to immediately go back into the IRA. You're not pulling it. You're running it as a separate company. It's got its own checking account.

You're running it as a company over here like it's not you, like you're doing it for somebody else. So it all stays encapsulated within the IRA. So there's no liquid money for repairs and for, that's interesting. Yeah, well, the rents would create because they're stuck in there. You can't pull the rents out. Wow. Okay. So the rents begin to build up cash.

Right. Over time. Hopefully you're cash flowing. I mean, you're buying two paid for rental properties, right. So hopefully you're cash flowing. You're making some money. So those $2,500 rents are piling up. Then you've got to pay property taxes out of that, pay insurance out of that.

You've got to do your repairs out of that. And what's left in there is profit, but 100% that profit stays in there. That's what we're doing. So, yeah, you just got to be ready because here's the thing. If you get in these things and this is a lot of trouble, you'll make more on those two rentals. If you buy them well and manage them well, then you will on mutual funds. But you're also going to invest a bunch of time in it. Okay.

That makes sense. Because people who say real estate's passive investing make me laugh. there's nothing passive about it okay it's real estate the beauty of it is it requires some more effort with mutual funds you can set it and forget it look at it once a year twice a year and not worry about it you know i look at my real estate stuff every month i get reports on it every single month and that's just me looking at the people that are managing it for me that work for me okay and i look at my mutual funds once a year uh-huh that's a i mean so i i burn a lot more brain calories on my real estate than i do on

my other but i make more money on it so but i love real estate i'm a real estate guy so it makes a lot of sense for me i would not put 100% of it in real estate i would do something like i outline maybe 50% okay but do you think with the real estate market where it is right now that this is a good time to consider something like that if you get a bargain on a piece of real estate it's always a good time okay don't pay retail good lord no yeah no we want to get a deal and so we're going to get a deal we're going to buy 300,000 dollar house for 250 because we're writing a check and we're closing Friday you want to sell your house it's so I'm getting a bargain okay and we're looking for a deal and not and deals are hard to find but they're worth it it's

$50,000 you made right then soon as you buy it 50,000 under market and that's what I'm looking for if I'm buying, I don't buy houses anymore, but if I was buying houses right now, that's what I'd be doing. I'd be looking for a bargain. Are they everywhere on every corner? No, they never have been. There's no market that they're everywhere, but you can find them, and there's somebody out there needs to sell a house right now, and there stands Amelia with cash. And yeah, you can do it. And here's the other thing. If you get into it and you hate it, you can sell them inside the self-directed IRA and roll the self-directed into mutual funds into a regular IRA. You can put the car in reverse and back out of this and maybe not even lose money,

but if you just get into it and go, this is a pain in the butt. I don't want to fool with this. And I want to be traveling. I don't be dealing with renters, right? And so that's okay. That's fine. So you can put the car in reverse and get out of this. So, yeah, if I were you, I'd try it since you got the itch, but I wouldn't try it with

more than half and I wouldn't do it. Of course you're going to pay cash. But I actually knew a guy that did this because he was a guy that did flips. And he took his million and made it into three doing flips. All inside the IRA, though. He couldn't eat out of it. Well, I was going to say it had to have a job over here to eat. Yeah.

It's a fail safe in that way. You're not going to spend your earnings. It keeps your hands off of it unless you screw up the whole thing. Yeah. Michael and Kara are on the debt-free stage right here in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions. Hey, guys, how are you? Better than we deserve. Good to have you.

Where do you all live? King George, Virginia. Oh, fine. Welcome to Nashville. And how much debt have you two paid off? $212,626. Good for you. And how long did that take?

65 months. Good for you. And your range of income during that. time was 96,000 to 120 and down to about, I think it's going to be about 115 this year. Cool. What do you all do for a living? So I am a vendor. I work for lift off distribution, which is a Red Bull vendor. And I work for a child development center at the Navy base. Oh, very cool. Very cool. All right, 213,000 over 65 months. That's your house? Yes, sir. Well, look at it weird people. A paid for house. How old are you two?

I am 34. I'm 35. And a paid for house. Oh, and there's a picture of it in the snow. I like it. So what's that house worth? Well, they said in the email after, I think it was 3.30, yeah. 330,000.

Amazing. Good for y'all. And you're 34 years old. And how much have you got in your retirement next thing? 146,000. All right. Halfway to millionaire. Going to be there quick now.

How's it feel to have a paid full? four house at 35 years ago you know how weird you are right oh yeah yeah we hear it a lot yeah it feels great yeah we're really excited yeah that's fun good for you so what started the journey yeah yeah i mean like 65 months ago wow five years in so you uh did an interview on the sunday special and i got to listen to it one day when uh at the time i was working at friedo and i was loading my truck and I was listening to it and I was listening to it. And I said, oh, I can't wait to get home. I got to tell my wife, this is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

I got to go home. So I got done, came home, and I said, you know, we got to do this journey. And my wife was like, what are you talking about? I came in through the front door like I was crazy. And he got into the Fritos again. Yeah, and she was like, okay, well, it makes sense. So, you know, where do we start? And I said, well, the first thing is,

we got enough money, we had a car payment, pay the $3,000, let's just pay the rest of it off, got the money. And she said, okay, let's do it. Well, all right, one down. So you didn't start with a bunch of consumer debt. You had kind of kept your way out of debt up until this point. Oh yeah. Yeah, no, it was, uh, and we've always been against credit cards. Yeah, credit cards and all that stuff, to be honest with you, I wouldn't have gotten, I wouldn't have gotten the car debt if my mom didn't tell me that it was good for you. And so, since it was so good for me, I went ahead and paid that off. Yeah, so we paid that off, and then we did the six months,

get your emergency fund, and then right about that time, COVID happened. So once COVID happened, I took advantage of the refinance rates because they were way down. I went to two and three quarter on the house. And then at that time, you know, so we continued to. put anything extra on the house and it was just a small amount at first and um every raise we'd put more yeah and i got a little more nervous yeah every every raise every tax return it just was automatically the raise that i needed to put on the mortgage every month every single month every single year if it was seven thousand dollars back okay divided by 12 that's what it goes up if if i got

she got a uh a raise at work for cost of living or something okay it's 1200 dollars divided by 12, that also goes on it. And we just lived exactly the same way for 65 months. No vacations, no eating out, no nothing. Just streamline. And now you're completely done and halfway to be millionaires already. Yes, sir. Yep. Congratulations, you guys. Thank you. Wow. How many people making fun of you while you're doing this? To be honest with you, it didn't really tell a lot. I don't think anyone made fun of us. A lot of people were just like, wow, that's awesome. I wish we would do that. Yeah, they were like, I had a lot of people saying, you know, it was that it is unusual. usual why do you know why do you want to do it and you know i'm just was kind of fed up with some

career path stuff that corporate america does to people so uh i got really really aggressive get that piece mm-hmm yeah so you got walk away power at that point yeah yes i know that's right so what's the my favorite question is what are you going to do to celebrate yeah you haven't done vacation you haven't done anything in five way over years well we brought all of our kids here today that was not a vacation uh as far as vacations and stuff like that i don't i'm i'm not totally ready for it yet i just because the mission's not quite done so this house is done uh but the house that we have now you know is uh we we got a full house five kids nine pets 1200 square feet running out of room yeah so probably going to take the next year and a half or so

pile up cash take the equity by you know five 50 you know five 50 you six hundred thousand dollar house cash then from there then you can take a vacation no take a big take one in between a little one oh boy congratulations you guys thank you very proud of you pretty amazing who was cheering you on um our families uh yeah his parents my parents um i'm one of 13 kids so we have lots of aunts uncle's cousins so we had we had a lot of a big support system Yeah. Wow. Wow. That's good. That's good. That's the way it should be. All right. So can this still be done? Do you think people listening can do it? Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Definitely. You just need to be motivated. Yeah. It is the discipline. It is discipline. If you, if you... Where did the discipline come from? How did you develop your discipline? To be honest, I think it's been a work in progress. Over the last 10 years, I think he's just steadily got more disciplined and everything.

And I think a lot of it is perspective. I listen to a lot of podcasts because I do work by myself as a vendor. I get to listen to a lot of it. And, you know, being able to hear what other people are doing, being able to, not just on the Ramsey show, but maybe on Jocko's podcast or other things like that. And hearing the type of disciplines that people go through the life things that they go through as well, that, you know, if the worst thing that I've got to do is, you know, throw product in the rain, okay, my life's pretty good.

I ain't got to go out and go get a new. car to impress somebody or go spend some money or whatever to feel good I can I can hold off you know cool well way to go you guys rock and roll man that's fun that's fun so how does it feel one more time it feels amazing it feels great like you said that you brought you brought the kids with you or they're in here to do the debt free screen yeah bring a lot let's introduce them get the names and ages on them come here you come with me all right there's the first one There's the first one. This is Decky.

This is Declan. We got a Landon. We got an Anthony. We got an Elliott. And we got my big baby Riley. I love it. All right. Very cool.

Fabulous guys. Well done, well done. Good stuff. Well, these kiddos don't even know how powerful a hero their mom and dad are. They've changed their whole family tree. Everything's different in your house because of your decisions. I'm so proud of you. Thank you.

All right. Michael and Kara and the kids. gang from Virginia, 213,000 paid off in 65 months, making 96 to 120, house and everything, halfway to baby steps millionaires at only 34 years old. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream. Ready? Three, two, one, we're debt-free! Yeah! Oh, man. If you didn't know what freedom sounded like, you can play that back. I know that's what freedom sounds like. That's how it works.

I love that. Listen, if you can pay off a house in five years, then you can save up a down payment to buy a house. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's just a mirror to show real estate dream is not dead. Right. They paid off their house. They paid off their house at 34 years off. Yes.

With a house full of kids, by the way, and dogs and cats. Yes. This is not a, this is doable. This is reachable. And that's why we do the debt-free screams to remind you guys that real people are doing it too, and that gives you permission to go do it. Hello, it's called hope. Proverbs 184 is our scripture of the day.

The words of the mouth are deep waters, but the facts. Mountain of Wisdom is a rushing stream. Elizabeth Elliott said never pass up an opportunity to keep your mouth shut. Make a boring podcast, but other than that. Michelle is in Dover. Hi, Michelle. How are you? I am wonderful, Dave.

Jade, how are you? Great. How can we help? Well, I was calling in because I need some guidance getting out of a financial mess. and I have been in and out of this mess for many years and I'm tired of being tired and I just figure if someone has eyes from the outside looking in and can say, hey, this is what I see

and I know, like I know how to do it. You know what I'm saying? I just, I don't know what I need. I just need some help getting out of the mess because that's what it is. Yeah, you're sick and tired of being sick. sick and tired, huh? Yes.

So tired. Yeah. Okay. So tell me about it. What's the mess? Well, the mess is I have, I've been, I'm in debt. Now, what kind of debt have you got? $40,000.

I have IRS debt, $22,000 worth. IRS, $22,000. Yes, $22,000. What else? A car loan, $20,000. Mm-hmm. I have a credit car. $477, and I have a vote. I literally just had my car, repaired and financed $834 of that, $83419 to be exact.

Mm-hmm. Is that it? Yes. No student loan? No. You got a mortgage? No. I've got an extraordinarily expensive for my budget rent.

How much is your rent? to paying, $1899. Okay. All right. Are you single? Yes. And what do you make? It fluctuates.

I work as a teacher working. I work online, so I have about one, two, three jobs. And generally, I literally just did this. In one of the jobs, I bring home $500. a month. Let me see. I'm just looking at the numbers. $500 a month. The other one is $1,000 a month, and the other one is approximately $3,000, $2,800 a month, approximately, because they fluctuate. All of them do. Okay. All right. And how did you get IRS debt? Some of those $10.99 and you didn't pay your taxes? Well, I was, yes, that is the end,

that's the cut and dry thing. Yes. I've worked at this, one of these companies for 15 years and when I first started we were 1099 and of course you know the tax bill is so high and I couldn't afford it to be quite frank and I've been paying on this since then okay all right so for many years you've had this IRS laying there yes okay so you got 3,800 you've got $4,300 a month take-home pay and 8 in 2000 almost your rent is ridiculous your lunch yes it's ridiculous okay how much is your car payment um it's 427 i believe it's the exact amount but i've been behind on it so i literally called yesterday and got a payment arrangement for five hundred dollars um i've been paying 430 on it okay all right so um first thing is we have

to address living emergency to emergency and then the second thing is you're going to have to make some adjustments in your rent. You can't stay there and prosper. Got it. You simply cannot afford $1,899 on $4,300. That's your math strain point. It's killing you. Now, how many bedrooms are there?

Three. Okay. So the other option would be taken two roommates. But if you're not going to do that, you have to. I'm sorry? What? I said, I don't want to do that. I don't want you to do that either, so you're going to have to move then.

You simply cannot do this, okay? Unless you're going to tell me that somebody's offering you a job to double your pay. And I missed that in the conversation. So, yeah, this is what's killing you. Don't you think, Jade? I think so. Can you tell us more about the jobs that you're doing? Yeah, so I'm an ESL instructor, and basically it's the way that they pay.

It's kind of like piecework, if you're. will. So depending on how many students I teach for that day, then I get paid. Basically, I get paid for every student that I teach per the minute. And the other is, one is the same thing, actually. It's just another company. I do that as well. And then the other job is I work as a tutor for schools throughout the United States. I just came off of a job on the other side of this same company where I had just for six months because of the summer where I was working full-time. Is there any decent money in translation at all? That's what I'm wondering.

Well, I, there is, but I don't know any other language. These companies, these in the ESL and sector. So you're teaching English as a second language, but you don't know the other language. Right. It's the unofficial first. English is the unofficial first language in South Korea. that's where I teach, so I don't have to know Korean. I see.

Got it, got it, got it. So you're, okay. My end goal is that my end goal is that I've been called to ministry, but I do not and refuse to be broke. I don't know the Dover, Delaware market. Is it an expensive market? No, it's not. Okay.

You're just found an expensive place to live. Okay. And you, this has taken up, is this taking up 40 hours a week or 50 hours a week? Oh, I'm working literally sunup to sundown, before sunup to sundown. All right. Let me go, let me change gears back to what I said a minute ago. The first thing you've got to do is to do your detailed budget and you have to prioritize every dollar that's coming in. And the priority sounds like this. The first thing you buy is food. The second thing you buy is lights and water. The third thing you pay is rent. And it's an adjusted rent because you're moving.

Okay. And so food, shelter, clothing, transportation, and utilities. We pay your car payment. We keep the lights on. Okay. So we're not ever behind on the car again. We're not ever behind on the rent. We're not ever behind on the lights. You've got enough to do all of that. The only question is then how can we make progress when we knock out these first two little debts, the little credit card debt and the little car debt you just took on. But from now on, you're going to be so in control that these little things that pop up are not. You're going to put $1,000 as your baby step one aside, the savings. And so if a little car thing pops up, you just pay cash for it. You stop everything. You go back and build that thousand back up. But you've got to get away from this crisis to crisis to crisis because it starts to feel like your life's a country song. Well, the rent is the unlock for that.

Yeah. Well, but being on a budget and a prioritized budget, every detail written down before the month begins and then it's prioritized. as a dollar comes in it is already spent because you've got the next thing up next thing up first thing up's food second things lights and water third thing shelter four things car and car gas that's it next thing up next thing up and then we're going to knock out the little 400 we're going to build our 800 or build our thousand dollar up then we're going to start on baby step two and working our way through that you adjust that um you also have a car you can't afford

as well and so you know I'm going to start looking at that but it's not as big a pain point as the rent is the rent is roughly double what you can afford yeah and so you may you're doing all this remote anyway you may be moving out a ways from the city yeah to find a bargain in a little bit of a more rural area and get a much better deal of some kind uh you know a garage apartment over the back in the backyard of a rich old lady and you move in there and help watch over her a little bit or something and she's make sure she's doing okay and you get a bargain with that garage apartment until you get this thing squared around and then when you get it squared around you get these debts cleared then you start to build your good emergency fund you start to build some wealth

then you got some wiggle room to start to build a better quality of life at that point but in the meantime we're going to beans and rice rice and beans and we'll give you every dollar for a year and get you set up and get you going on that, that's going to really help you with the process, our gift to you. That puts us our The Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember,

there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.