The Ramsey Show - App - You Have to Get MAD to Get Out of Debt (Hour 1)

Episode Date: November 22, 2019

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollar Car Rental Studio, this is the Dave Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. Sitting in for Dave, I'm Chris Hogan, and I'm excited to be with you and excited to take your calls. So if you're sitting out there and you're thinking, this is the time, Chris, I'm getting serious about getting more focused on my finances and we're going to make this year the best year I've ever had, it's time to get started. All we have to do is make a decision and then have a plan and a process to follow and you can make it happen.

But I want to hear from you. If you're out there and you've got a question, give us a call. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. We'd love to hear from you. You can also find us on social media, all the places, Instagram and Twitter and Facebook and all the things at Ramsey Show, or you can find me personally at Chris Hogan 360. We'd love to be able to talk to you. And so the goal of this is to make decisions to get better. And as I was perusing the news, you can imagine, let me throw my glasses on here. I want to tell you about an article that jumped out at me that tells me that we still have work to do.

The reality is this. This is the headline. This is from CNN. Americans now have a record $14 trillion in debt. Okay, first of all, that's trillion, people. I didn't say million. I didn't say billion. I said trillion. $14 trillion. It says households are sitting on a record amount of debt in mortgages, credit cards, student loans, and other forms of debt.

Household debt ticked up 0.7% during the third quarter, according to the New York Federal Reserve, continuing a five-year climb encouraged by low employment, strong consumer confidence, and cheap borrowing costs. Now, this is a phrase I need to jump in on because this is a situation. When you have low unemployment, that means people are working, people are making money. Strong consumer confidence means people are feeling good. But here's the situation here. Cheap borrowing costs.

See, regardless of how we're doing financially, if you continue to borrow, you're going opposite of the direction you're trying to go. Let me give you a PhD in economics here, people. Interest that you earn is a reward. Interest that you pay is a penalty. So if I borrow someone else's money, I'm being charged a penalty. That's called interest. And when we get this in our heads and we start to understand it, we can start to take steps to put ourselves in a better position. So what we have to do, regardless of what's going on in the economy, we've got to make sure that we have a plan. And so if you're out there and you're hearing this, don't let consumer confidence throw you off your trail. You've got

to know the path. And we talk about the baby steps here. Why? Because that's the path that can change your life. That's the path that has helped millions of people turn around their financial situation and truly understand how this works. So I'm going to the phones and I want to talk to someone. Let's see here. I got line four. I've got Parker. Parker, how are you? Hey, I'm doing well, Chris. How are you? Oh, I'm focused and not finished, my friend. How can I help you? Hey, I just had a question. I'm 24 and I'm about at baby step five. No children. I'm focused and not finished, my friend. How can I help you? Hey, I just had a question. I'm 24, and I'm about at baby step five. No children. I'm single.

My household income is about $122,200 a year. I have about 101 invested and about 34 saved. And I was just kind of wondering, what's the next step? And I'm looking at a house. Where should I invest that? Okay, very good. Parker, where did you, at this age, you're 24 years old, where did you learn about money? You know, my parents were pretty good, but I joined the Navy and learned a lot there. And that's where I am now. I don't have any debt because of that. That is fantastic. Well, thank you for your service, my friend. How much longer are you

going to be enlisted? I'm actually out. I got injured, so I'm working as an engineer now. Okay, fantastic. And where you are right now, is that where you plan to be for the next five years or so? The next five years or so, yeah. I'm going to grad school, but work's paying for that as well. Okay, good. And I say that because with the way you've worked through, you got yourself out of debt, you've got a fully funded emergency fund, and you're investing. You know, at 24 years old, already have $101,000 put away for your retirement is phenomenal.

This next step, Parker, is going to be huge, especially as you look to buy a home. I want to encourage you to make sure that you're thinking clearly on what it is you're looking to buy, but I want you to be intentional with saving for a down payment. See, I want you to have a minimum of 10% to put down as a down payment. So this would be where you would just in your money market account, you'll start to stick some money. I would love for you to go into it with 20% down, and here's why. There's a thing out there called PMI. It's private mortgage insurance. See, don't talk about this anywhere else, okay?

But the reality is what this private mortgage insurance does is protect the bank. It doesn't protect you at all. And, in fact, it adds $150 to $300 a month to your payment. So if you can go in with a 20% down payment, you won't have to deal with that PMI at all. Now, you're single, you don't have kids, you got a strong income, there's no reason you can't get to 20%. But I also want you to be aware, buying a home is a business decision. You don't get caught up in emotions, you want to see clearly, you want to make a two year decision, I call it, you want to make a decision about the type of home you buy right now,

and you want to look back on it in two years, and you want to be glad that you made that decision. Now, listen to me. A two-year decision requires that you pull up out of the situation. You don't make an emotional decision. You want to make a business decision. And so, Parker, I encourage you, don't buy your dream house. This is your first house.

And trust me, you're going to meet somebody and get married later, and they're going to show you why that house you wanted wasn't right anyway. So you want to slow down. But you want to go into it with your eyes wide open. I'm proud of you, young man. At your age and in your stage, you're ahead of the game, and you're doing a fantastic job. Stay focused, my friend. You are definitely not finished. Okay, I'm going back to the lines. I've got Jake on the line from Colorado. Jake, how are you? Doing fantastic. How about yourself, Chris? Oh, I'm focused and not finished, my friend. What's on your mind? So my wife and I had a bit of a fiasco last week. Her car got damaged by the garage door from the building that we live in. The upside is it's just cosmetic. They're going to be giving us a check. I'm kind of

curious what your advice would be on which way to go. We could either pay off the smallest debt on our debt snowball, which would be her car, or I could use that check to buy myself a beater and get out from under my $18,000 truck balance. All right. What size check are we talking about here, Jake? It's going to be about $3,000 to $4 or 4,000 when we owe that 2,500 on my wife's car. Okay. 2,500. Is your wife's car the smallest debt on the debt snowball? Yes, sir.

All right. Now, what other debts? You said your truck, her car. What else do you have on there? So we've got one more credit card, I'm sorry, two more credit cards, student loans for her, just a lot of small little piddly ones. We've paid off about 5K in the past couple months, paid off three debts. So definitely rocking and rolling, definitely bought in.

And I'm a car guy, so it's kind of hard for me to think about getting rid of my truck. But eliminating that payment would be great. Listen to me. You can be a car guy. I want you to be a debt-free car guy, so it's kind of hard for me to think about getting rid of my truck, but eliminating that payment would be great. Listen to me. You can be a car guy. I want you to be a debt-free car guy. So, yes, as that check comes in, do not let that check sit in your checking account because I'm telling you right now, you're going to think that it's free money, and it ain't free.

All right? It's not. Pay off that car. Wait a few weeks. The title's going to show up, and you drive that thing till the wheels fall off. Any extra money that comes in, people, we have to attack the dead snowball. We've got to get serious. We've got to stay focused.

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Hello, everyone. You are tuned in to The Dave Ramsey Show. No, Dave doesn't have a cold. I'm Chris Hogan filling in for Dave. Excited to be with you and excited to talk to you. You guys are already on fire. The phone lines are lit up. Social media is flying around.

So, listen, if you've got a question or something you want to talk about, we want you to send us your message. If it's via social media, look for us at Ramsey Show. Real easy to find. But, listen, you can also call us. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. I was just out in the lobby, and we've got some fantastic guests out there. I've got two or three people out from Florida, which I don't know why Florida is up here.

It's warmer down there. I'm going back with them. And then we've got a couple people in town from Connecticut, which I know why they're here. They've probably got 24 feet of snow on the ground out there. But listen, if you're ever near Franklin or you're in Nashville, come see us. You can get a chance to come visit the new office. You can go over and visit Melissa over in the Baker Street Cafe.

Grab a cookie, get something to drink. You can check out all the different books that we have over there from all the Ramsey personalities as well as some other ones that are preferred reading for us here. But really want you to tune in. We're having a blast talking to you. And I'm getting back on the phones. I've got Wendy here on the line. Wendy is calling in from Massachusetts. Wendy, how are you?

I'm good. How are you? Oh, I'm focused and not finished, young lady. What's on your mind today? My question is, so my daughter is a junior in college, and she got into some really good schools, which we couldn't afford. So she's going to the state school,, she took out a FAFSA loan. So by the time she graduates, she'll be about $20,000 in debt. Um, and I went back to work so I could cover the rest of her tuition,

but I've been able to save about $14,000. So by the time she graduates, I should have enough to pay off her debt. He's worked really hard and she saved about 10,000. So my question is, do I pay off her debt or is that undermining her? Like, and do I, so cause she worked so hard, but I don't want to sort of,

you know, pull the rug out from underneath there and be like, you worked so hard, but I'm't want to sort of, you know, pull the rug out from underneath her and be like, she worked so hard, but I'm going to pay it off anyway. I got you. Or is that a gift? Why is she working? Is she working hard to attack and pay those off herself? Yes.

Okay. And she works vacations, not during the school year, though. Okay. All right. She's working. She's stressed about the debt. She is. Okay. Well, you know what? Here's the thing. So you've gone back to work. Before we get to that, let me hit the stop sign. Okay. Tell me first, Wendy, how do you all,

what's your financial situation look like? How much do you all have saved for retirement? Okay. So this is where the complexities come in that I didn't understand. When my parents did their estate planning, they put a large property into my name, which then when she went to apply to college, it made my net worth so high that we didn't get any money, except I don't get any of the money from the property. Are your parents still alive? Yes. Okay. So let me ask you again, Wendy.

How much do you have saved for retirement? I have about a million. Okay. All right. And I own my home. You own your home free and clear? Yes. See, I like you already.

All right. We're doing some stuff here. Yes. Well, hold on a minute now. All right. See, this is a different complexity. Now, what do you owe on? Do you have any debt?

I have a, no. Let's try one more time, Wendy, because you paused. You have a car loan? No. Okay. Do you owe on anything else? Right now, I have a credit card bill of $1,000, which I will pay off next week. I felt the guilt over the phone line.

You know that? I got intuition. I could feel it, Wendy. Now, listen, pay that thing off and get that thing out of your life. Quit messing around. Get back here to your daughter. Number one, see, you all have trained her. The fact that she feels a little stress about this debt, I don't think is a bad thing. I really don't. And I love the fact that you are looking at it and you care enough. You want your daughter to start off on the right foot. Here's what could happen. Let's think,

let's go down two paths. Let's say she does continue to work and she pays off that debt. How's she going to feel about herself? I think she's going to feel empowered. I think she's going to feel empowered. She's going to feel like she did this. she's going to feel empowered. I think she's going to feel empowered. She's going to feel like she did this. And lo and behold, what if as she graduates, you have some money that you're able to gift to her as a graduation present? You see where I'm going with this? Right. Yeah. See, I think it can be twofold. Number one, she did this. She paid off her student loans. And so for her and her mind, she's got the feeling of what debt feels like. She knows that weight on her shoulders and that's what's pushing her. So I don't

think we take away this growth opportunity for her because she's going to learn some things. But I still think you have an opportunity to be a blessing for her and to be able to gift her with that money as a graduation gift. Maybe you buy her a car. Maybe that's something you kick off and she's got an emergency fund. There are two ways. But I like the path of this young lady being as focused as she is. That means you all have trained her and you've talked to her about money. Let's let her keep growing. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I think in America today, our goal as parents is to help people to grow up to be productive citizens. Too too oftentimes we try

to make sure that our kids don't ever have any struggle and if they never get a chance to have struggle they don't ever get a chance to kind of learn and grow they'll never get a chance to flex muscles to find out what they can withstand and to learn some lessons and so we got to let them we got to let them feel that we got to let them push now i didn't say struggle unnecessarily but not all struggle is a bad thing struggle will help you find out who you are and help you to understand more of what you say you truly believe. So, Wendy, I think this is a good thing. Let her keep pushing. I think she's got a lot of things that she can learn from this process, and I'm proud of you. And Wendy, pay off that credit card and shut that thing down, okay? I want you to send me a message

when you do it. Get that thing out of your life. You're an everyday millionaire, honey. You ain't got time for that. Next up on the line, I've got Patrick in California. Patrick, how are you? I'm doing great. How are you?

Oh, I'm focused and not finished, my friend. What's on your mind today? Well, I'm a divorced dad. Well, I'm in the process of getting divorced, really. So that's increasing my issues. I don in the process of getting divorced, really, so that's increasing my issues. I don't have control of my son. He's with his grandma, but

I was in a bad place until about a year and a half ago. Drugs, all that stuff, but I got out of there, moved to Utah. I'm getting myself together. Got myself a good paying job. I'm trying to build my credit and get my debt paid off. My credit score was like 540.

And right now I've got about 15,000 in debt. And 10 of that is from a car loan that I got. One of those high interest, low credit score things. Okay. Because I know it's high interest with my credit union. I'll be getting a refinance once I get it lower. Well, listen to me, Patrick. Are you trying to get serious about getting out of debt?

Yeah. All right. Well, here's the deal. Number one, we're not going to worry about FICO score. Okay? Now, you done got me riled up. Okay? Now, FICO score, listen to me.

It is not an indication of how well you're doing. A FICO score means that you get a chance to borrow more money, to go further into debt, and to be further in the hole. So, we don't want to do that. We don't borrow our way out of debt. You know how you get out of debt? You get mad. You put it down on a piece of paper.

Small is the biggest. You start attacking it. You throw all the extra money at the one little one, and you make minimum payments on the other. And you take a second job, Patrick. I'm sorry to hear about your life change, but guess what? Life happens. Now it's a matter of how we respond. And so you sound like somebody that's got a little fervor.

You've battled some personal things, but you're coming back. I want you to come all the way back. And that means you get intentional. So the debt snowball. People, listen to me. You want to get serious about getting out of debt, list your debts out smallest to biggest, make minimum payments on everything, but the little one and attack the little one with every extra dollar you have. See, getting out of debt's not about math. Don't come at me and tell me, well, Chris, I'm going to attack the highest interest rate first. That's not going to work. Okay, I want to attack the biggest debt first. It's not going to work.

The smallest ones first. Because getting out of debt's not about math. It's about momentum. And when you have the confidence that you can do it, and you start showing you that you can, there's something in your back that gets a little stiff. You start to stand up a little bit straight. You understand that, oh, I got some stuff to do.

I got a future to chase. I don't care what's in my way for now because it's going to leave. And debt's a wimp. When you start to hit it a little bit and you throw extra money at it, it shrivels up and eventually get out of your life. And guess what? Then you get your money back, people. And now we're doing some stuff. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Folks, let's cut through the bull.

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This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLSconsumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender. 761 Old Hickory Boulevard, Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. Hello everyone, I'm Chris Hogan filling in for Dave. You are listening to the Dave Ramsey Show. And we have just wrapped up an absolutely hectic event season. We have been all over the place. Dave and I were just in Charleston, South Carolina, where we did a Financial Peace Live, which was amazing. We had about 3,000 people there in attendance. It was rocking. Before that, we were in Sacramento at our SMART conference. We had about 11,000 people there.

It was an absolutely phenomenal event. And so I just want to let you know, event-wise, we've got a couple of things that are coming up. In February, on Valentine's Day, it'll be a great date night opportunity. We'll have our Money in Marriage event with Rachel Cruz and Dr. Les Parrott. Now, they have been traveling around and doing this event quite often, but they're going to be here in Nashville at Church of the City on February 14th. And so this would be a great opportunity to do a date night. Come talk about money and marriage and learn. I want to encourage you of all ages and all stages, don't care if you've been married for 20 minutes or 25 years, it could be a great event for you.

And I also want to let you know about something else. People, we're about to go on a boat. Okay? For the first time ever, we're going to have a Ramsey cruise, a live like no one else cruise. This cruise is going to be March 22nd through the 29th. We're going to be going through and porting in the Bahamas, Turks and Caicos, St. Thomas, and San Juan. And it is going to be amazing. And everybody was so pumped about this.

It sold out in less than a month. And we've got a few more cabins that they have released to us. And the cruise, it's going to be epic. Dave and I are going to join. Get this. The other Ramsey personalities will be there. Dave, Christy, Rachel. We'll all be there. Dave, Christy, Rachel, we'll all be there. But we're going to have other world-class friends of ours there, like Jeff Foxworthy,

Stephen Curtis Chapman, Manit Chauhan, an incredible chef. And we're going to have several days at sea, jam-packed with amazing experiences and entertainment. And we're just a few months away, actually. And so we've got a few more cabins that have actually opened up. That's right. You can still join us in March. And maybe you've been working to pay off the last few debts to open up, or you finally finished your emergency fund, and now you're ready. But listen, this is the time. So what I want you to do, you can join us for this unforgettable cruise. Here's what you do. Head over to ramseycruise.com. Now, hear me with this, okay? People get on me, say I talk too fast, so I'm going to downshift. Go over to ramseycruise.com right now to claim one of the last remaining

cabins. Now, this is sure to be a debt-free celebration of a lifetime, and we want you to be there. So again, go to RamseyCruise.com. Now, I don't know all the festivities they're planning on this thing, but I know I'm going to be there, and some of the things they have in store I've vetoed. I may get outvoted. I don't know, but I refuse to wear that costume. It's not going to happen. But anyway, listen to me. We'd love to see you there.

And again, it's a live like no one else cruise. Go to RamseyCruise.com. I'm looking forward to me. We'd love to see you there. And again, it's a live like no one else cruise. Go to RamseyCruise.com. I'm looking forward to it. I'm excited to hang out with people that have battled to become debt free so we can live like no one else. That's the name of the game. All right, America, if you're out there and you've got a question, call me. Okay, I'm sitting right here ready for you. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225. Or find us on social media at Ramsey Show or me at ChrisHogan360. Let me know your question. All right, I'm jumping on the line.

I got Anna out here in California. Anna, how are you? I'm doing good. How are you? Oh, I'm doing fantastic. I like your voice. You're all peppy and stuff. How can I help you?

So I have a question. My husband and I just got married a couple of weeks ago and we combined our debts. Okay. And so my question was, so my student loans is like total of like $51,000 and they range from like, there's like 10 different loans inside of it. And they range from two, from $2,500 to $7,000. Now, my husband's largest credit card is $9,500. So I don't know if I should break up the student loans and put it individually into my debt snowball or just start attacking the student loans after we pay off his last credit card. Okay, gotcha, gotcha.

So right now, the student loans right now are all individual loans, correct? Yeah, it's like all under like one umbrella loan, I guess. Okay, so. In each one, there's 10 different loans. Okay, and so, okay, it's one or two ways. If it's all under the same name of the loan and you've got five to six individual loans, then you would treat those

as individual. So as you make your debt snowball out, you would start off listing debt smallest to biggest. And so what you would do is the $9,500 credit card, it would fall in whatever order you're going through. So I'd still attack it smallest to biggest. However, if they've been consolidated and they're all into one and you've got one big payment and one big loan, that's a different ballgame. So if it's just one big one, so let's say, for example, it was one loan you consolidated 10 different loans into and you've got this $51,000 and the payment's like $2,000 a month, then that would be the largest debt that you have on the debt snowball. The credit card would go in front of it. So the mindset around this, Anna, is getting out of debt's not about math, it's about momentum. So when you attack the smallest one first, what you're showing yourself is that you can do this.

And so you'd make minimum payments on everything else while throwing every extra dime toward the smallest debt. So that's how you'd go about that. Now, in looking at this as you all are newlyweds and you're trying to start your life off right, and I'm proud of you for being plugged in on this money stuff and talking about it, but I want to encourage you, how do you go further faster? That's what I want the two of you to start to brainstorm. Just because you have that debt, and again, I know it doesn't take long to accumulate debt, but getting out of debt is much more difficult.

So you're going to have to make a commitment to it and be focused. And so what are you guys willing to do? It might be taking on an extra job. It might be working a little extra and converting all that overtime toward the debt. I say this because you guys taking a couple years right now, as you just got married and you all getting focused and really zeroing in on this together, in a couple of years, you can knock this out, right? Long before you start talking about starting a family or anything. And you truly get a chance to start off on the right foot. And so I just want to commend you guys to continue to work together, stay aligned, stay connected, and don't stop. You've got a great opportunity to keep growing forward.

I got a message in off of Instagram. It says, hey, I wanted to ask, my mom had passed away several years ago. I was the only beneficiary on her life insurance. I'm planning to join the Army, but I also want to get a really nice car, a Scion. They're really cool, and I love them. I don't want to waste the money, but I really want this brand new car. What would you say? Well, first and foremost, sorry to hear about your mother.

Glad to hear that she had life insurance and you have an opportunity to receive those funds. I think those funds probably mean a lot to you, and you want to do something of significance. I also like your mindset of wanting to join the Army. I think that's commendable. Those are the true heroes in our country, not necessarily athletes or musicians. And so I love that. I love the way you're thinking. But then you say, this car is really cool and I want it and it's brand new.

This is where you lose me, okay? You don't want to do this. Like, you're about to go into the Army, you said, which means you're not going to see your car, right? You're going to be running around in mud and climbing things and jumping out of planes. You don't want to do this yet. What you could do, though, is pause and wait, let that money sit there, and as you get ready to move forward, you could get a car that's newer to you. Brand new cars, they depreciate quickly.

That's a depreciating asset. So I would rather you be more intentional, be very aware of the decisions you're making, and go into this slowly. Be careful. Oftentimes when people get money into their hands, they tend to get so excited, they want to hurry up and do something, and you want to take your time. You want to think this through. Your mother was very intentional leaving this money to you. I know you want to be intentional with it. And so is this something you buy a car that's newer to you? And again, I just want to caution you because oftentimes people will run forward in this so quick that they're not really thinking it through. I got another one from Twitter. It says, I'm

inheriting my mom's home when she passes away. I want to know, should she put me on the deed now to avoid inheritance tax or put it in the will? Well, Tanisha, here's the thing. You guys are talking about some estate planning steps. And what I would encourage you to do so you can get an overall view of the whole thing is to sit down with an estate planning attorney, walking it through. You know, you're looking at putting it in a trust. If the home is paid for, uh, the trust might be the best way overall. Uh, but the trust is the owner, not you or your mom. So that's something to talk through, but you can find it. Go over to Chris Hogan, three 60.com click on the dream team button. You can find someone you can talk to.

This is the Dave Ramsey show. Hello, everyone. You are listening to The Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Chris Hogan, filling in for Dave. And we have had a blast so far. You guys have had amazing questions. And so if you're out there and you've got a question, I want to hear from you. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Again, that's 888-825-5225.

Or if you prefer, you can find us on social media at Ramsey Show or me at ChrisHogan360. We'd love to hear from you. That at ChrisHogan360 is my social media handle on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, all the things. Just would love to hear from you and to take your question. So I'm going to the phone. I've got Colleen on the line in Florida. Colleen, how are you? I'm good.

How are you? Oh, I'm focused and not finished. What's on your mind today? So I have been blessed to actually live with my parents for the first five years of my life. But part of that was to max out my 403B every year. So I have about $100K in there now, and I didn't know if I should try and go back and pay the taxes on it because it is not a Roth. Okay. So I just wanted some input there.

Okay, gotcha. That's fantastic. How old are you? I'm 26. 26 years old. And so did your parents teach you about money? Yeah, yeah. They have always told me that I need to make sure that I stay below my means and just save as much money as I can.

Right. No, that is fantastic. So you've saved up $110,000. So I'm assuming, Colleen, that you're completely out of debt. Yes, sir. And you've got an emergency fund. Yes, I do. I like you. That is fantastic. And so now you're looking at this and you're thinking about, okay, what do I want to do and how do I grow forward? So where are you working at a nonprofit or a school? I work at a school. Okay.

All right. And so looking at this, you're wanting to look to convert to a Roth? Yes. Yes. Okay. And you've got a great opportunity to be able to do that. Here's the deal. In walking through the options, you want to make sure that, A, you take the right step and you get the right guidance.

So I want you to reach out to one of our SmartVestor pros. Have you ever worked with one before? I have not. Okay. Now, what these are, people see all the time people would call Dave and ask, Hey, we want to find somebody we can work with that's not going to try to sell us stuff but going to help us. And so that's where he started the Endorsed Local Provider Program. And so he's vetted people all across the country. It's a strenuous program that people apply to get in

because what they're saying, Colleen, is they're going to agree to guide people the way that he and I talk about. They're going to teach people and make sure that they're investing in the growth stock mutual funds and doing things the right way. And so we've got an entire network of these investment professionals. They're called SmartVestor Pros all across the country. And so you can go to DaveRamsey.com and click on SmartVestor Pro. You'll put in your zip code and you'll get a list of five to six people that are near you that you can call to interview to talk with. Now, I think it's important to call and interview them because you want to find the one that's the best fit for you. You want to find the one that you feel like, hey, is this somebody that can come alongside me and help me reach my financial goals?

And so you interviewing them, talking with them, getting a feel for them, then you pick one, then you can meet with them. And I want you to take your stuff in from your 403B, sit down, talk with them. They're going to be able to guide you on the investing side, but you also are going to want to talk to a tax ELP. And again, tax endorsed local provider, because you're going to have to talk with them and to figure out, okay, what are you paying in taxes to convert? I love the idea of you doing this at such a young age, at 26 years old. It means you're going to be able to give this money an incredible opportunity to be able to grow after tax. See, that's the thing people don't realize. Roth means tax-free because it's after-tax money.

So Roth IRA, Roth 401K, all the Roth things. Senator Roth was an – I love him, okay? It's awesome. And it gives you a great opportunity. So you doing it at that age is going to set you up for some incredible growth. But the key is going to be we've got to make sure we get the right people in our corner. We always want to take our cars to a good mechanic. We'll ask friends, hey, do you know a good mechanic?

Because it's someone that's going to guide you. Or a good dentist or a good whatever. But we need good investment professionals. Our financial future depends on it. And so go to DaveRamsey.com, click on SmartVestorProCoin, and sit down and have a conversation with them. I'm very proud of you and what you've done. 26 debt-free with an emergency fund and over 100,000 already saved for your future. You, young lady, have begun your journey to becoming an everyday millionaire. And I want you to tell your parents they did a great job because they were teaching,

but you were listening. And that's where the game changes. So that's fantastic. All right, I'm back on the line here. Let's see. I've got Hillary on the line. Hillary, how are you? Hey, Chris. Doing great.

It's an honor to speak with you. And I've got to say, I just started your book last night. Oh, well, see, I like you. I like you a lot. I appreciate you reading the book. So what are you doing right now? Are you attacking debt or are you building wealth? I am attacking debt.

Okay. How much debt do you have? My husband and I have $51,000 total. Okay. Break that down for me. What's that $51,000? What's that made up of? About $7,000 is a car loan, and then the rest of it is my student loans at $43,000.

Okay. All right. Now, see, I like, Hillary, A, that you know your numbers. All right? You know exactly what you owe on. Okay, this is fantastic. So what's your question for me? Yeah, so we've been paying over the minimum.

We've been knocking this out. I'm new to the Dave Ramsey principles, so I'm just kind of starting to think more intently about this. My husband and I actually have $90,000 in our personal savings and checkings right now. It's just sitting there. Now, that includes a $34,000 bonus that my husband just got through his employer. So my question is, do we just boom, just pay these things off today immediately in full, and then we could even maybe have enough left to go ahead and fund our full emergency fund, or do we just keep working, hold on to that $90,000?

I'm just wondering. I don't really hear a situation like this very often. No, listen to me. I like you a lot, you and your husband both. And this is, I'm serious, because you all have had the mindset of doing some savings to begin with. And now what I'm about to tell you,

Hila, take a deep breath for me. Okay. Alright, good. Here's what I'm going to tell you. You're about to start writing some checks. Alright? Now, here's the deal. This student loan, you're about to tell $43,000 worth of student loan. Bye.

You're getting ready to evict it. You're going to get it out of your life. You're going to pay off this car. I mean, seriously. And you look at that and what you were paying, like how much you all paying on student loans right now? Um, gosh, a couple thousand a month. But that's me going in and making additional payments.

No, no, no. I understand. So you got about 2000 $2,000. How much do you got going out to the car each month? $295. Okay. So you've got almost $2,300 leaving you each month right now, correct? Yes.

Okay, here's the deal. You pay this off. You've got $90,000. You pay off the $43,000 student loan, the $7,000 on the car, and then you take this and you go, we were already sending out $2,300 a month, right? So you keep that mindset. So you've got that. If you do that, you've got your fully funded emergency fund almost as well, along with that money. Now you guys are immediately at baby step four, where you're investing 15% of your income. Remember, we just got back $2,300 a month for you.

You were sending that out. You're not sending that out anymore. Does that make sense? Now listen, your husband, you're going to have to sit down and show the numbers on this, and you guys are going to have to breathe careful because what's going to happen is your blood pressure is going to spike because I told you to write checks out of this money that you all have been saving up. But see, nobody counts the debt. We'll count the savings, but we don't look at the debt like it's a cousin or something. No, it's not. It's an enemy. It's stealing from

you. So write the check, get the student loan out of your life, get the car payment out of your life. You've got your fully funded emergency fund. Start investing in your 401ks. Listen to me. You guys are well on your way. Wow. See, that is a crucial moment because most people would just want to let that money sit there and say, okay, it's my safety net while the debt continued to churn and prime and prime and get bigger and grow. So we've got an opportunity, Hillary, and I appreciate you calling in. And listen, for all of you out there listening, if you're on Baby Step 2 and you've got more than $1,000 sitting in your savings account, you need to use that to attack debt. Get this debt out of your life because when you get the debt out of your life, you give yourself a raise. You ever think about that? You can give yourself a raise without having to go in and talk to anybody that you work with.

You don't have to beg anybody. You get to make the decision just by getting more focused and more serious about attacking debt. Well, listen, I want to thank all the callers. Thank you for calling in. Thank all of you for tuning in and listening. I want to thank James Childs, producer. And filling in for Kelly, we've got Amanda Rogers as associate producer today on the show. And I want to thank all of you for tuning in and listening.

This has been The Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, it's Kelly, associate producer and phone screener for The Dave Ramsey Show. If you would like to do your debt-free scream live on the show, make sure you visit DaveRamsey.com slash show and register. We would love for you to come to Nashville and tell Dave your story.