The Ramsey Show - App - You’ll Always Live Paycheck-to-Paycheck Until You Have a Budget

Starting point is 00:00:00 This is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to have a conversation about their life, specifically their money, their work, and their relationships. We want to help you win in all of those areas. The phone number for you to jump in today is AAA 8255-225-2-25-2-5-2-5-3-8. 825-5-2-2-25. Alongside the fabulous Jade Warshaw, I'm Ken Coleman, and we are ready to go to help you. Let's start it off with Dallas in Birmingham. That's not confusing at all. Dallas, how can we help? Good morning. Good afternoon. I'm sorry. That's okay.

Starting point is 00:00:52 Just wanted to. My wife, my lovely wife and I, of 26 years, we are just swamped in debt. And I have been doing, we've been doing this for so long. I am just, we're beating down with it. So we're trying to get some help here. We have a decision. Well, we were kind of trying to decide what to do. I were, where do you want me to start? I have $76,000 in student loans.

Starting point is 00:01:26 I did do two stupid moves. I'm an avid Dave Ramsey fan, by the way. I listen to you guys podcast, and I listen to you a lot. So I did do two stupid things. I bought a truck after selling my truck to pay for my baby's first semester in college. So I missed my truck. I bought another one. And my wife retired a couple of years ago.

Starting point is 00:01:56 So I got the bright idea to go out and try to buy her a car. Oh, no. Okay. How old are you guys? We're both 50. I'm sorry, I turned 51, and she will be turning 51 here shortly. We're high school sweethearts. Sorry, I know that had nothing to do with anything. That's okay. Hey, that's a good year, by the way. And 74 is a good year. I was born in 74. It's a good year. Oh, great, great. Good year. That's not relevant to anybody but us. Thank you very much. Give us the debt load on the car and the truck. Okay. The debt load on the car, on the truck, owe 29,000. Her car, we owe 33,000. Okay. Anything else? And we have 13, yes, $13,000 in credit card

Starting point is 00:02:40 debt. So that's it. That's it. Well, house? Yes, we have a home. You want the total on the home. We owe $373. Okay. I was just curious about that. Tell me about your income. I know you said your wife's retired, but what do you guys take home every month? Actually, she started back working again. She has to start back working again. So she's a teacher. She's a retired teacher. And then she's teaching now in the private school system.

Starting point is 00:03:12 So what do you guys bring in home? Total. My pay varies. Last year I brought home. Think about it by the month. That'll help you out. When you see the month, what's it look like? I wrote it down.

Starting point is 00:03:26 My wife, she actually, and I wrote down. numbers that we actually touch. So she actually touches $4,049 a month. Good. And my pay varies due to overtime and things like a... Give me a middle month. A middle? I can do you better. I can do the worst month.

Starting point is 00:03:42 The worst, well... At this point, I'll just take a number. I'm anxious for a number. Just any number at this point. I'm so sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Okay. 6723 is what I'm totaling this far. So you guys are take home. So you guys are taking home almost 11,000 take home. Is that what I'm hearing?

Starting point is 00:04:03 I'll say 10, yes. Okay, great. 10K a month. How much is your mortgage? Mortgage is 2137. Okay, fine. Okay. Who, listen, that was a lot, Dallas, to get to that. Okay. So you called in saying that you guys are just over, overwhelmed. Yeah. When did your wife start back working? Did that just now start, or has she been back for a couple months?

Starting point is 00:04:27 or since last year, I should say. Oh, no, no, the last year. She started bagged last year. Okay, so you've had her income. Tell me, so you did mention a child that went to school, but it sounded like you were able to cash flow that, or is college still on the plate? College is still on the plate now, and it's mainly her, well, it's mainly her apartment.

Starting point is 00:04:47 So you're cash flowing that? Yes, we are. Okay, I'm going to jump to the crux of this thing quick, Dallas. But I want one more number. What are you paying for her apartment? $750. $750. Okay.

Starting point is 00:05:01 Does she have roommates? Yes, but it's kind of one of those things where they both pay the $750. Okay. All right. So what is the car worth? I know you owe 33. Is it worth more than you owe? No.

Starting point is 00:05:19 What about the truck? I know we're. Well, I'm getting confused. I'm so sorry. Are you upside down? All right. Here's it. Let me drive. Let me drive. Hold on. Let me drive. We got it. We got three minutes. So you answer. That's okay. I got you, dog. All right. So are you upside down in the car? Yes. I don't have those exact numbers. That's okay. Are you upside down on the truck? Very. $14,000.

Starting point is 00:05:46 That's okay. We won't spend any time on that. Okay. So Jade, I'm leaning in here. I want Jade to be able to help. What I think is happening, Dallas, is you guys have no idea. how to budget because even with these numbers, and I don't want to take up any more time on what you're, well, you know what? Do you know your payments on the car and the truck? What are the truck? We need those. Yeah. My truck payment is 545 and the car payment is 668. All right, that gives Jay to think. I bet you guys just don't know how to budget. That's what I think. I don't think you should, you have debt so you're going to feel the squeeze, but based on the numbers, I feel like the biggest squeeze is from the fact that you guys aren't on a budget in Ken and I can hear that in the way you're talking about it.

Starting point is 00:06:28 So before you get off the call, we are going to set you up with every dollar. And that's going to help you get control over. Just seeing the numbers, Dallas, is going to give you so much control so that you know actually where your money's going. And you'll be able to see, once you plug the numbers into your budget, how much margin you should have left to be attacking your smallest debt. I'm going to give you three bits of homework. The first bit is, yeah, when we give you every dollar for free tonight, that's your date night with your wife. All right. So you guys are sitting down and I want you to complete it. Don't start it and be like, oh, tomorrow we'll do it. I want you to complete the budget tonight so you can see that margin. Second thing is, Ken and I want you to go on Kellybluebook.com and get the true numbers on what you owe on these cars versus what they're worth so that you can find out the amount that you're upside down. Okay. So that's the next thing. Find out how much I am upside down from a true source, not just, you know,

Starting point is 00:07:25 boo-boo who took a look at your car the other day. Don't trust boo-boo. Yeah. Real number. And then the third thing is now we're going to find out, is it something that, you know, I don't know what your credit's looking like, but you're going to need to get a loan for the difference on this upside-down stuff, whether you go to the credit union, whether you go, I don't care where you go.

Starting point is 00:07:46 The point is we need to get a loan for the difference so that we can sell these vehicles, at least one, right, and get ourselves into a cash hoopty. I didn't ask you, but do you have any money saved, quick answer? Do not. That's the issue. I had to stop my retirement because I can't afford to put in the answer to that. That was right. That was right. That was the right thing to do.

Starting point is 00:08:06 Okay. And we just cannot save a dollar. It's because you don't have a budget. And to Ken's point, you're spending. That's going to stop today. Yeah. Because you're going to see, yeah, debt is a problem, but you want to know, Dallas, you're also going to see, we've been going out to eat and we've been doing things we can't afford.

Starting point is 00:08:23 And it really is just a lack of. of sight line on this. Dallas, I'll say this as point blank as I can say it. I'm doing a rough look at the numbers you gave us, plus I'm looking at utilities, groceries. We didn't get the credit card minimum, but I have a general idea. Your take home, you're ready for some good news, Dallas? If you do it, Jay told you, and use the budget, you're going to be able to put a couple thousand dollars a month towards debt. Yes. You guys have the margin. You just have no plan. No plan. All right, Quinn is up next in South Carolina.

Starting point is 00:09:00 Quinn, how can we help today? Hi, I'm currently in college. I'm $49,000 in debt, and I have three semesters left, and I still am going to need to come up with about $28,000. Okay. And what are we pursuing? And so mechanical engineering. Okay. All right, keep going.

Starting point is 00:09:22 and so I'm currently a senior but I switched majors a couple times so I'm going to have an extra three semesters after my senior year and my parents have helped me these four years and then the next three semesters I'll be on my own and I'm curious on whether I should continue to do federal loans to pay for that or if I should or how I should go about paying for that. Well, when you said your parents were helping you the first four years, what does that mean? Because you already have $50,000 in debt. So they would help me, like they paid for my rent. And anything that federal loans plus my scholarships didn't cover, they would cover. Uh-huh, uh-huh. Okay. So the problem here, and you need another $28,000 is what you said.

Starting point is 00:10:15 What school are you at? Where are you at? Clemson University. Okay. I think the problem, are you doing any part-time work? I do. And how much does that bring you a month? I make about, depending on the week in like my classes, I make between like 100 and 200 a week.

Starting point is 00:10:39 Okay. Which pays for groceries and then a little extra. Right, but the problem is none of this is touching tuition and the tuition is the problem because that's what you're taking out loans for. The problem, let's go back. identify the problem. I know there's not a whole lot you can do for the spilled milk, but your school is too expensive for you. That's the problem. And so you have, you're at a really critical point where you're going to keep going or you're going to stop and reevaluate. And part of you has

Starting point is 00:11:10 already stopped because you're calling here, but you have to make a very clear decision whether or not you're going to stop borrowing money or not. And it has to start there. And then from there, we can decide now what levers do we want to pull. But the first question is, are you ready to stop actually borrowing money? Yes, I'd like to borrow no more money on top of this. All right, so let me tell you what I would do. I'm going to walk you through the questions I would ask myself, but I'm asking you. Is that cool?

Starting point is 00:11:39 Okay. All right, here we go. Absolutely. What is it that I want to do, Quinn? What do I want to do? Let's fast forward and assume we have this degree. What would be ideal? I'd like to work in the automotive or aerospace industry.

Starting point is 00:11:53 Fantastic. And what would an entry-level job look like? Payment-wise? No. What are you doing? A lot of it is like doing tests on engines and like already produced products to see if they're Got it. I don't need to understand it. I'm walking you through an exercise, but you understand what entry level looks like, correct? In those two fields. Okay, wonderful. So the question is, the next question I would have is, can I do those entry level positions now without the degree? What's the answer to that?

Starting point is 00:12:34 No. You cannot do entry level without that mechanical engineering degree. Not an entry level engineering job. Okay, can you do adjacent work that is similar to it, but, but you don't have the degree, but you're doing similar, functional type work? I'm not sure about that answer. I could look into that, though. Because I'm clueless about your fields, I can ask this question. You want to work with engines, yes?

Starting point is 00:13:07 Yes. Okay. And this is a mechanical engineering degree, so I know you don't want to be a full-blown mechanic who works on my car, but it's the same function. True or false? Yeah. Great.

Starting point is 00:13:22 Do you have any idea what mechanic, like could you go and do basic mechanic work right now on something? Yes. And you have any idea what that pays per hour? I do not. It's pretty good. Pretty good. So now I've arrived at a solution because I've committed to Jade and I've committed to myself. I'm playing Quinn right now.

Starting point is 00:13:47 now. Yep. Okay. And I'm not going to, debt is not an option. So this is where innovation comes from, by the way. As a mechanical engineer, you should appreciate this point. True innovation happens at its purest and best form as a result of a lack of resources. That's right. Right? It's why everybody love the old show, McGiver that you're not old enough to know, but McGiver was innovative, all right? The guy didn't have it. He was under pressure and he saved the world with a tube of paper towel cardboard and some duct tape and the inside of a Bick pen and he killed a man and operated on him at the same time. And it was innovation and we loved it, right? It was this. So what I'm challenging you to do right now is to be innovative. And if I'm you and I've got $28,000 I've got to come up

Starting point is 00:14:35 with, seems insurmountable when we put it in the form of a student loan. But when I say, wait, can I make two grand a month using my basic mechanical skill set? The answer is, absolutely bargain basement you can. So if it's me, I'm going to press pause on Clemson because here's what I know about Clemson. Clemson is going to be there. Yeah, that's right. When you come up with $28,000. So my last point, I want to bring my partner in here on this one, I would press pause. I'd go make $28,000. And then I would show back up to Clemson. They'll take your $28,000, whether it's tomorrow or two years from now. And it doesn't take two years to make 28,000. I'm making the case to you that you can make 28,000 in less than 12 months.

Starting point is 00:15:19 Yeah, you can do that. And go turn a wrench and get dirty and get nasty and go, I never want to do this kind of mechanical work, but I'm going to do it because I have to do it so that I can do what I want to do later. And that's what I would do. I would come back with the 28,000. I'd lay it on the counter for the Clemson folks and go paid in full. I'm going to finish my courses. I'm out of here, and now I'm rocking and rolling. That's what I would do. what would you do can i think you're 100% right quinn i think your battle here is with the clock because people think i'm in college i got to do it in four years i got to do it back to back i have to do it at this time in this amount of time and if you can change that and say the most important thing

Starting point is 00:16:03 is that i get where i want to go that's right and where you want to go is not just you you made it clear you said where i want to go is not just where i want to end up is not just with a degree i want to with a degree without a dime more debt. And since you said that's the destination, then you have to be willing to invest the time to go the right way to get there. Otherwise, you won't end up there. You'll end up with $28,000 more of debt. So that's, those are your guiding lights there is you want to be clear about where you want to end up with this degree without a cent more of debt. And you've got to wrap your head around the fact that it's going to take time to get there. And that's okay. Yeah. I love that. I love that. I love that.

Starting point is 00:16:44 that. Jay just nailed the, I gave you a, here's what I would do tactically, but she gave you the mindset that you're going to have to adopt. You've got to listen to what she said. If you adopt that mindset, you go, wait a second, I've now changed the clock. I'm not racing against this concocted societal norm. I'm racing against debt. Now it's a different race I'm running. I don't want more debt. And I throw another one at you. How many credit hours are we talking about that you is it was it two more semesters or three more semesters three more semesters how many hours are you would you be able to do mechanical work and carry the class load

Starting point is 00:17:26 um not at a full okay all right that's fine that's fine because i was going to challenge you to keep on you know getting i mean i got a movie in my mind tell me what movie can um what is that movie describe it it's Matt Damon and Goodwill hunting thank you you know I got a hustler in my mind thank you this is what happens when you throw an alley-up to somebody who can dunk it she just comes in broke the glass

Starting point is 00:17:56 ripped the rim off love that but that's what I'm talking about I'm talking about blue collar attitude I'm gonna work my way through this and I was hoping that you can make some money and pay off some of that $49,000 while we're doing it and so we got to a little grease under our fingernails. That's the price of admission. So chin up, new mindset that Jade gave you and decide today. I'm going to finish this and make it a new race. I'm

Starting point is 00:18:24 going to race against the societal norm. Come on, Quinn. We believe in you, man. So go do it. Hey folks buying or selling your home is a really big deal and with all the clickbait headlines and conflicting data out there it's hard to know what's happening in the housing market and we want to make the latest trends easy to understand giving an example median home prices stayed steady last month at about $439,000 the number of homes for sale hit one million for the third month in a row so buyers have more options and more negotiating power while sellers are the ones facing a little bit more competition. The average 15-year fixed rate dipped a bit to 5.86% last month. So if you're debt-free and have a fully funded emergency fund and a solid down payment, now is, in fact, a great time to buy or sell your home. If you'd like to learn more about the housing market trends and get free tools to help you buy or sell with confidence, go to ramsysolutions.com slash market.

Starting point is 00:19:25 That's ramsysolutions.com slash market. or you can click the link in the show notes if you are listening via podcast and YouTube. Paul is up in Washington. Paul, how can we help? Hey guys, thanks for taking my call. About five months ago, my wife and I took FPU and we've been working on Baby Step 2.

Starting point is 00:19:47 So about two years ago, I took out $100,000 He-Lock against our primary residents in order to make down payments on three different rental houses. It was an idea to, you know, for a retirement plan was to try to accumulate a bunch of rental houses. We're seeing problems with that. They've not been cash flowing well.

Starting point is 00:20:13 One of them, especially, that one of them, especially, that one's for sale right now. Good. When it sells, we're going to pay off. We have about $17,000 in, like, between a car loan and credit cards. We're going to pay that off. and then we're also going to, I was thinking it would be wise to have a six-month emergency fund for the rental houses to cover their mortgages in case the rental income doesn't. How many rental houses are there?

Starting point is 00:20:43 Currently there's three, but one of them is for sale. We close on it next week. But none of them are cash flowing positively on a consistent basis, correct? Not consistently, no. are you are you are you uh do you have equity in all three yes okay um we have okay let me address something before the call gets going too further we're going to tell you what to do but i want to go and address something you just kind of said this the emergency fund the six-month emergency fund is not there to cover the rent uh the the rental income on these homes that's not what the emergency

Starting point is 00:21:19 fund is for it's for actual emergencies that affect your life that are there are your expenses, your income, you know, your bills. You want to cover your expenses. It's for your personal expenses, not for your rental homes. Okay. So that's a non-starter for us. That's right. Okay. Ken, I'm glad you clarified that because I, that is so important. What it sounds like is you could benefit from some simplification here. Am I, is that fair? It is fair. Okay. That's question one. That's question one. So that that you said that was fair question two would be like you said these these properties aren't making you any money right right so my since they're not making money and since you could benefit

Starting point is 00:22:07 from some simplicity i would recommend selling them since they're all worth more and you could actually make some cash on these things uh get out of these hundred thousand dollars of he locks and obviously you know clear all your other personal debt and kind of start this idea over from scratch and just build it the right way because if you do that and you're able to use some of this money because I mean we could go through it if you want if you were to sell all three what would you end up with after fees and everything um I think of selling all three I think we would clear the $100,000 he lock and the 17k in debt I think that is about it and they would be at zero away okay we would be at zero debt except for our primary residence

Starting point is 00:22:54 Tell him all he's won, Jade. Well, you've won peace. And now you've won the ability to focus in on your security, which is your primary residence. What do you owe on that? Shoot, 100 and, no, what are we on that? I'm sorry, I'm not prepared for that. That's okay. Around 100 and a half, something around there?

Starting point is 00:23:14 160. Okay, 160. And then what's you guys' income without the, I mean, your properties weren't making anything, but what's your income? after like take home i think we're at about 110 okay so with that income and with what you owe on the mortgage i mean with a little intensity or with just being intentional you could clear your own mortgage out if you wanted to very very quickly and then now you can start this real estate dream if you even wanted to like this might have been your last i don't know maybe you're sick of it at this point but now you could go back in and say okay next time we do this we're going to do it for cash we're

Starting point is 00:23:50 going to move a lot slower and we're going to make sure that no matter what we're not putting ourselves in a risky spot and we're going to be making money on whatever we do yeah yeah that's that's been the gist of how we've been feeling i just uh it was hard to let go of the idea that you know down the line we would have all this rental income but it might like i'm afraid we won't even make it there but not now but to jade's point if you clear all this and now you go about it the right way. You still have time. How old are you? Forty-four. And what do you have in retirement? About 30K. Okay, so we got to build that. Yeah. I am not thinking about houses. Let me tell you why. Just to kind of, if I was in your shoes, this may help your stomach and your

Starting point is 00:24:38 heart sell these three homes. Here's why. Okay, the three homes, let's say that you guys were cash flow positive, which you're not on these things. But let's just say, you know, because we hear this call all the time, and somebody will say, well, we're clearing, we're clearing about $600 to $800 a month on these things. Or let's go to $1,000. Let's do a round number. Let me get $1,000 a month, free and clear. All right. That's $12,000 a year. Okay. That doesn't include expenses, right, that home repairs. $12,000. I would rather be investing in the investment strategy that Ramsey teaches than I would be fiddling around with houses, especially in your shoes. You're not what I would call completely behind

Starting point is 00:25:20 the eight ball. You're a little bit behind at your age with only 30,000. But the baby steps is to play for you. So you get this debt out of the way by selling these houses. And now we attack baby step three, go to three to six months of your expenses. And then we think, all right, now we're all baby step four in the sense of we're now 15% fully funded retirement accounts. And let's see what happens above and beyond that. But I just think for a lot of people, the rental house of income, it just looks and smells and sounds way better than it actually is. It's a lot of work, a lot of work for $12,000.

Starting point is 00:26:04 It will never be me, Ken. It's too much. I'm not doing it. Yeah, no. On the other hand, I look at my little dashboard every month. And I go, oh, look what the stock market did today. That's true. That's the true passive income.

Starting point is 00:26:16 and I was snoring, you know? There's like, I got a guy in the audience, thumbs up to me, and he's a, you're a fellow snorer, but we're making money while we snore, bro. Yes, sir. That's the play. Yeah, everybody talks about real estate, like it's some form of passive income. It's so not passive. But I think, I mean, I don't know what your wife says about this.

Starting point is 00:26:38 You guys have to go home and talk about it, but I think to solve for the two things that you said, which is, hey, it's fair to say I could. benefit from some simplicity. And the truth is, these things aren't making me any money anyway, but you are losing, you know, your peace over them. So your blood pressure is going to drop. Yeah. You're going to sleep better. The baby steps is the plan for you, Paul. It's not too late. But I would say at 41, this is the time to make this move. And let me just be fair. Let me, because somebody's listening and going, gosh, you know, anytime somebody calls him with real estate, you guys tell them to sell it. That's not necessarily true. If he had called in and said,

Starting point is 00:27:14 hey, I've got these three properties. They're killing it. You know, banging. I would have maybe suggested selling one possibly to clear some debt. And I would have said, yeah, keep the others. Here's the plan to pay them off. Like there is a time where somebody calls in and they've gone and done what they're going to do. And it's not always about telling them to, you know, fold everything and start from scratch. So just putting that out there. Actually, it's a great point. It depends on a person's financial position. I know somebody going, well, Ken, okay, my little rant about the $12,000, that's okay, if you're, no debt and your retirement's great and this is something we're going we're trying to pay

Starting point is 00:27:49 this off as quick as we can and now we're not doing it for the $12,000 a year we're doing this for a house that you know is going to be worth 400 grand and we're going to pay it off in a year now that's real money right that's 400 grand cash that I could unload that's the idea so we're not anti real estate it's just does it fit the baby steps does it fit your financial situation that's the question Hey, if y'all enjoy the show, if it's helping you, would you help us? You can do that by liking the show, whether you're listening on podcasts or on YouTube, subscribing on any of those platforms.

Starting point is 00:28:32 And, of course, share, share. That helps us so much. There's no marketing strategy in the world that competes with the good old-fashioned word of mouth, and that's how you can help us. So thank you for those. that do, and we'd love for you to continue to help us there. Mary is up now in Boston, Massachusetts. Mary, how can we help? Hi, yeah. I really would like to retire, but I'm very nervous about it. You're not sure I can

Starting point is 00:28:57 afford it. Okay. Give us some numbers, so we can figure this out with you. Okay, well, I'm still working. I work full time. I'm 71. What is your, what is your income? It's about $100,000. Great. What do you do? I'm sorry? What do you do for a living? Sales. What are you selling? I'm not to go supplies.

Starting point is 00:29:24 Nice. Good for you. I'm just curious because this is awesome. I think you're the hero of today's show. That is so fantastic. It's still be crushing it. Is it straight commission or is it a base plus commission? No, straight salary.

Starting point is 00:29:39 Oh, a salary. Okay, good. Good for you. Okay. All right. So walk us through. what do you already have? Yeah. Well, I have about a million and a half in a 401k. Okay. I have about a million and a half in stocks, probably a little more than that.

Starting point is 00:29:57 Mary, I've got great news. This is breaking news. It's coming in my right ear right now. I'm getting this fresh from James. Right here, breaking news. He says you're fine, Mary. You have $3 million. I was getting out my calculator like we were going to have real work to do. I was nervous for you. I have a lot of expenses, though. What are your expenses? Okay, yeah, let's hear it. Well, I have two houses, two cars.

Starting point is 00:30:21 I mean, they're paid for, but... Then they're assets. Mary. You only need one car, so sell the other car, but it's not cost in you much. Well, they're in different states. Okay, well, we can clear that up. You all, so you got a, you got two homes in two states. Yes.

Starting point is 00:30:37 Are the homes paid for? Yes. What are the states? What is one year? You're wintering home, and one is your summering home? Yes. Okay. Mary, America is about to get mad at you.

Starting point is 00:30:50 You are truly living the dream, Mary. We're having a little bit of fun, but in all honesty, you're in great shape. You have two paid for homes. Uh-huh. You have two paid-for cars. Uh-huh. What are these expenses that you said you have that are so, so high that 3 million, as it continues to grow, is not going to be enough for you?

Starting point is 00:31:12 What are we missing? Well, I don't know. It's about $45,000 a year, the expenses for insurance, and that's without any emergencies. So, insurances on all your assets. I don't get any a pension. Right. But my guess is you're going to have a pretty nice Social Security benefit, is my guess. And you'll draw from your accounts.

Starting point is 00:31:38 Well, it's about $4,400. Sweetheart, how much does it take for you to live every month? I know you know the answer to this, Mary. What is your top line expense for everything, all in? Food, gas, clothing, everything. Well, it's about, I don't know. Oh, come on. You don't have a mortgage.

Starting point is 00:31:59 It's just you. You're not married, right? What do you need to live? Take an educated guess of what you need every month to live comfortably. How much money? Probably about $4,000. $4,000. Okay.

Starting point is 00:32:11 You're going to have a Social Security payment. of $4,400, so we've got that. And then you've got $3 million that is continuing to grow. Jade, I don't think I'm getting through to Mary. She's in great shape. You're in great shape. In the words of Ken Coleman, this is a nothing burger. This is a nothing burger. Yes. There's nothing there. This has got ketchup, mustard, pickle, lettuce, the whole. It's the works. You are great, Mary. Great job. Do you know how many people, how many people who are in their 20? 20s, wish they had a job that paid them $100,000. That would chew their right leg off on camera to have your portfolio.

Starting point is 00:32:49 Yeah, you're doing so well. But I'm going to lose that. Why? That's fine. Yeah, you're going to. What are you losing? You will lose the job. No, no, no, you won't.

Starting point is 00:33:01 You won't. You will lose the job because you will choose, hey, I don't want to work anymore. Then you can look over to any of these retirement accounts and say, I'd like to make $100,000 a year, please. And they're going to go, okay. And you can afford that. And by the way, you've got that. Yeah, but how long would that actually last me?

Starting point is 00:33:17 Your whole life. Because you're not touching. Okay, let's teach for a minute because I want to make sure you understand this. So if you have this money invested the way it sounds like you do, you should be making on average annualized rate of return. You should be somewhere around the 9, 10% mark. Okay? That is when you take all the years that you've had it invested and average those rates of

Starting point is 00:33:41 return. it should be around 10% okay so that means let's just take a round number like i don't know one million dollars if you've been making 10% on that what is 10% 100 000 does that make sense so you should be able to live off the interest alone without touching the nest egg does that make sense if it doesn't i'll explain it another way let's let's use real numbers you've got a total of you've got over three million dollars in retirement accounts so that's what you told us Right, and I do have some CDs and cash. I'm sure you do.

Starting point is 00:34:14 Oh, listen, none of this is a surprise. I think you got more money buried in your backyard than most people make in a year. I think there's probably that level. Sometimes I do. Sometimes I do bury it. I know you do. The point, Mary, is, you have enough. If you really lived off of 10%, you could take a $300,000, you know, salary. Well, that's exactly right.

Starting point is 00:34:34 Now, we would account for inflation and we would account for, you know, I don't know if this is in Roth or what it's in. So there are some things to consider here, but none of it, none of those details are going to drain your nest eggs. None of those details are going to cause you to be even close to broke, okay? I would go on, I would stand on business today and say, if you retired today and took your same salary, you would be fine. Now, if you don't believe me, that's okay. I would encourage you to get with a smart fester and let them show you this. But here's what we haven't discussed yet, Mary, okay? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:35:10 The $3 million you have right now, just the $3 million. You got more than $3 million, but at this point where there's no need to get into it. I think close to the four. Oh, sure, of course. Let's just say three for a moment, okay? Based on what Jade told you earlier with the historical return of the stock market that Jade laid out, you realize that you're a young and vibrant 71. Seven years from now at 78, Jade, you want to tell her what that $3 million is going to be worth?

Starting point is 00:35:37 Yeah, so we call it like a rule of seven. A lump sum generally at a rate, the right rate of return will double every seven years. So that means you're with, you got six million. Yeah. And the truth is you got four. So let's just have some fun, Mary. So $8 million. $8 million at 78.

Starting point is 00:35:53 I mean, this is like, this is like you and your fried green tomatoes annual trip. We're blowing it in Barbados. We're having a blast. Like, you are way ahead of the game. You should be, what you should have done was called. Ken and I to invite us to your retirement celebration. I will emce it and Jade will sing. It's a combo. It's a great. And all we ask for is four-star accommodations and travel expenses. That's all we ask for, Mary. That's right. That's right. No, Mary, we're having fun.

Starting point is 00:36:25 Well, the market hasn't been that great, though, that it's going to double in seven years. No, Mary, this is, this is, you can actually go, you can Google this one. Yeah, this is real. You can really Google this. Check our, check us on this. This is the historical. historical path of the stock market over this entire existence, okay? This is a rate of return that you can expect. But even if you didn't get the 9 to 10 percent that Jade, all right, let's go conservative. Let's go 6 percent. Run your numbers on 6 percent. And here's what we really want you to do. Do you have somebody that manages your money, a licensed professional? No, I do it on my own. Oh my gosh, Mary. You are such a rock star. I mean. The superlatives, I

Starting point is 00:37:09 can't summon enough. Okay, here's what I want you to do. I don't want to get on Mary's bad side. We're going to put you on hold and Kelly is amazing. And Kelly, let's make sure she gets to the Smartmaster Pro section of our website at Ramsey Solutions.com. And I want you, Kelly will walk you through this, but I want you an interview three, four, or five in your area. And Mary, I know you've got a gut and go with your gut on the one you trust the most and help. Let them tell you what they think your portfolio is going to turn into and where you are. And then if you choose to have them work with you, Right. But trust me, these folks are affiliated with us in the sense that they believe what we believe,

Starting point is 00:37:45 and they'll back what Jay and I are saying up and show you real numbers. So thank you for calling Mary. And can we just slow clap? The whole audience is clapping for Mary. This is what we do. This is why we do it. Mary, you're the poster child. You won. This is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to talk about their money. their work and their relationships, and we're so glad you've joined us. I'm Ken Coleman, the incomparably fabulous Jade Warshaw joins me. The phone number is 3,000-8-8-25-2-25. Mike is up in Illinois.

Starting point is 00:38:23 Mike, how can we help today? Hi, good morning. So I just had a question for you guys on we are new to you guys' program, and I'm talking really new, like maybe three, four days. Welcome aboard, sir. Yeah, we don't, we don't really have a lot. And I'm not even going to say like this is even overwhelming for us because it's, it's truly not. We're in a pretty good spot, I feel. We're about 150 a year between the two of us. And we got about 45,000 in our cars, 57,000 on our house. We got really lucky on our house. Wow. Yeah, so we're good. We do have some credit card about between seven and ten, and we got some medical about four.

Starting point is 00:39:07 but we did some home improvement and we took out borrowed against ourselves we took the advice of somebody else and borrowed against our 401k so we have how much payment's like about 25,000 you're going to love the tax on that pal yeah I know that's going to feel great we do have it paid down to maybe 20ish I'm guessing So we're just at a 401k loan. So we're paying that back. But my question was because we want to attack, we want to tackle all this pretty aggressive, you know,

Starting point is 00:39:49 following the program. Should we take the hit on the 401K, get rid of that big monthly that we have there, and then apply that $1,000 a month towards paying everything, else off more aggressive and then put the money back and then put the money back quickly. You know what I mean? It just seems like the way we've been kind of running the numbers is if we were to take away

Starting point is 00:40:22 from, use that money from the 401K, the monthly part of it, we would be able to go really aggressive and really pay this down because we're super excited to get towards the financing part. Are you familiar with our debt snowball? I know you're three or four days in, so that's why I'm asking. Are you familiar with the Dead Snowball? Yeah, you know, and I think so familiar with the Ramsey name just didn't really know about it. Yeah, that's fine. So, Jade, let Jade coach you through what exactly we would do if we were in your shoes.

Starting point is 00:40:54 Yeah, I'm going to simplify this for you because I'm going to go back and kind of assess, can I just take a moment and go back and assess? Do another diagnostic? Yeah, because then it will help us. be in the right mindset to talk about the solution. The problem is, you know, you make a really great income, you and your wife combined. And the sad part about this is you didn't realize it. And so you let people trick you into thinking you needed to use debt to do all of the things that honestly, you could have done with your income because it's so great. And the fact that your mortgage is

Starting point is 00:41:27 only $57,000. And so I kind of want you to get your head around the fact that your income and your money is real money and it's better than borrowed money. And somewhere in your brain, you started thinking that borrowed money was better than your actual money. And I really want you to spend some time thinking about that because I never want you to be here again. Sure. Just not to interrupt you there real quick. But the only thing that kind of put us in that is I guess I didn't say at the beginning is I went through a divorce 10 years ago. So I did have child support. That was pretty a lot of child support, pretty substantial. Not complaining about it.

Starting point is 00:42:07 You know what I hear you. But that did play a huge part in us, you know, financially. Sure. It played a huge part, but it didn't make you take out debt. You still chose to do that. So I just want you to go forward from today going, you know what? Like, my dollars are better than borrowed dollars. And yeah, to Ken's point, let's walk this thing out.

Starting point is 00:42:31 Because if you have something like a 401K, loan, if you owe money to the IRS, that business is jumping to the top of the list. So typically what we would tell people to do is list your debt smallest to largest, but there are a couple of exceptions. And like I said, owing money to the federal government is one of them and having something like a HELOC is, or I'm sorry, having something like a 401k loan is one of them because the implications around that are very, very big. And so for this, for this, I would say to you like, you got to understand every minute that you don't pay this back

Starting point is 00:43:06 is a interest that you're missing out on every moment that you don't pay this back means if something happens and your job is on the line it's going to become paid due and full 12 months after you were let go so there's a lot here around that so I would I would get in full gear on this and start getting it knocked out

Starting point is 00:43:26 now the good news is you've got 150K of income but are you guys on a budget it? Yeah, so we kind of use a calendar system. We kind of write everything out on due dates and everything on our calendar. Good. My wife's, she's pretty on top of it. So we do know exactly what to do, when, where, and we pay weeks ahead. Good. So how much are you guys putting extra on debt every single month? Not a whole lot. Why? You have, you don't, you don't have hardly a mortgage and you make this great income what are those cars yeah I wonder what this two yeah I think the the car payments are pretty high what are they um uh we got one that's 600

Starting point is 00:44:11 and some change is and then another one that's four for something I believe listen it's not as bad as it could be that's not what's taking your income what's taking your income is you guys aren't you're not on a budget you're still spending a lot of money in a lot of areas it's not the 4,000 of medical debt. It's not that, because I can guess what the 10,000 of credit cards payment is. It's, you guys are living like 150,000 is the be all and all. And I think that's what it is. And I'm sure you're still contributing to retirement. Am I right? Oh, yeah, 100%. Yeah. I'm doing the match. And then I'm doing just the match right now. And then my wife's doing 10%. So let, let Ken and I give you a rundown because you did say you're brand new to the baby steps. So

Starting point is 00:44:57 let's just dial it in and from here you're going to get to choose do you want to do it do you want to not do it and that's your choice to make with you and your wife later so what we would say is baby step one when you're in your situation baby step one is hey i just i need to go down to a thousand dollars saved if i can just keep a thousand dollars aside that's my you know quick rainy day fund but every other money needs to go to baby step two which is paying off all the debt and i told you before it's list them smallest to largest with the two exceptions and then we're there but part of step two says, hey, I need all of my income at its fullest power. So that means I am not dwindling my income on, you know, investing right now. I'm not putting too much into my withholding right now.

Starting point is 00:45:41 I'm putting just enough because I don't want that tax refund. I want that money in my pocket every month. So those are quick ways to make sure we have all the money. And a lot of people don't like when we say pause investing can because they feel like they're missing out on time. And they are missing out on time. But the thought process of that is if I have, Ken, if I have a bucket of water, if I have a pitcher of water here and I have, I don't know, you have one, two, three, four, four or five different glasses of debt. If I put a drop in each one, it's going to take me forever to fill up those glasses. But if I just take all the income in my picture and pour it on one, I'm going to fill up that glass very quickly and it's going to be gone. Okay. So that's why

Starting point is 00:46:19 this works that way, Casey. And then we can go into steps three and four and on down the list. later but right now one and two is big and something tells me you might have some savings somewhere that he needs to tap into and i'd even we're running out of time but i i would tell you that look at those cars if there's enough equity in those cars you could go to a clunker let's see if we can get that a thousand dollars as well so that's what we're doing here thanks for listening All right, Casey is joining us now in Wyoming. Casey, how can we help? Hey, thanks for taking my call.

Starting point is 00:46:57 I'm trying to get some input or advice on. I started building a home on a property that I own. and I'm getting to the point where it's getting difficult to continue cash flowing it, and I'm debating on just continuing down that path of cash flowing it, or if I should take out a construction loan for what I need to do to finish. How much more do you need to finish? Probably $100,000 to finish out where I'm at. So 100 grand is what you need to either cash flow,

Starting point is 00:47:36 which is going to take you longer, or your idea of a construction loan gets it to you and you can finish this house by what time? If I took the loan out, I could probably finish it. I would think next spring. I mean, we're heading into where I'm doing all this, all the work myself physically. And so if you cash flow it, how long will it estimate to take?

Starting point is 00:48:01 So probably another two years. And that's kind of where the difficulty is. I get it. And I'm digging a little bit here to get full perspective. So is this your dream home and you guys are already in a home that you can easily afford? What I'm trying to figure out here is, is there financial pressure to finish this house? Like, what is the status of this house? So I bought the acreage.

Starting point is 00:48:30 It's 40 acres. And I bought the acreage four and a half years ago. with the plan of just moving out there and building the house over a couple of of year period, and then some things in life changed, and most of the money that I had saved up for the project went away. Okay, so the plan was to live out there on the 40 acres in some type of a temporary situation. And that's why I am now. I'm in an old, it's an old single-wide trailer on the property,

Starting point is 00:49:00 so I'm building, you know, right next door to where I'm at. But it's just me and my two kids and that little trailer. So, yeah, it's just getting to the point where I've been doing it for three years and a couple more years. So essentially, the only, so this would be like taking out a mortgage of $100,000 is what I'm hearing. Right. Plus, I do owe some on the land itself. How much? I didn't buy a land outright.

Starting point is 00:49:30 What do you owe on the land? I owe $130 on the land. Okay. So if you were, so if I'm in your shoes, I'm assuming you know the numbers, but what will be our combined, I'm going to call this a combined house payment. That's what I'm looking at here because the land and the home. What would be that combined mortgage payment? Well, it'd be a 15-year rate on 250,000, give a fake, right? And can you afford that at 25% of your take-home pay? yeah but i don't i don't think the payment is is that big a deal not i don't think no is it underneath our 25 percent threshold so 25 right right at okay then then i don't have an issue with this because it's like it's like buying a home and i don't think living in this trailer with the two kids is sustainable for much

Starting point is 00:50:25 longer so yeah this is not what we would consider an irresponsible home purchase that's essentially, you're doing it a different way, but it's the same idea. Am I right, Jay? I want to make sure I'm hearing. Yeah, right on. I guess there's, well, because I am not a contractor, I can't qualify for, I would need to hire a general contractor and get somebody else involved in by business to, they won't loan, and it makes sense, they're not going to loan somebody that's just building a house.

Starting point is 00:50:57 No, of course, I get it. I totally know what needs to happen. So you bring a general contractor. Sure. What's your problem with that? You don't want a general contractor? Is that the biggest problem? You want to do this all your own?

Starting point is 00:51:08 Is that the biggest thing? I mean, that's a big thing. And also, I mean, there's, I guess there's a pride component of it where I had a plan to cash flow. Hey, I have a plan to dunk a basketball in a game when I was in high school. And it turns out I had five, nine, and couldn't jump. So I had to deal with it and become a pass first point card. Life throws you things. No, I'm just being honest here.

Starting point is 00:51:29 No, no, you're right. pride. I don't care that you want to finish it yourself. Well, I do because here's a thing. I do. Because there's, there's that. Because the financial side of it, there's not a wrong answer. If you want to cash flow, cash flow. If you want to get the mortgage, get the mortgage. There's not a wrong one. Cash is better. But for a time, we would have said, yeah, go ahead and get the mortgage. But then you turn around and said, well, here's a thing. I want to build this thing. I don't want to hire a general contractor. So now we're talking about other things. We're talking about values. And so if you say to me, you have to then decide,

Starting point is 00:52:00 What's it worth to me to have the timeline? Do I want to sacrifice timeline to have the values I want? Or do I want the values at the sake of the timeline? That's really what it sounds like this conversation is. Or do I want to hate my kids and hate my life all to keep my pride intact? I mean, that's the thing. The kids don't really get a vote in it. They're not talking about the kids. They'd say they'd rather have the new house right away. I'm talking about you, brother. You're the one that's on the phone and you're the one that talked about. Everybody heard it on your voice. I'm with you 100%.

Starting point is 00:52:33 The kids don't get a vote at all. I don't care what your kids think. I'm with you on that. But I think you're the one going, I don't think I can stay in this trailer with these kids. How old are they? Am I right or am I wrong? The kids are six and eight.

Starting point is 00:52:45 You didn't answer my young. They're not going to know if it's two years down the road. They're not really going to remember. All right. Let me come at this a different one. Can you live with these kids in this trailer for two more years? well you can do anything I mean my that's what I said you just have kids in a little two-bedroom house that's what I'm saying you have to decide yeah so only you can decide because Ken will say

Starting point is 00:53:09 hey and my if it were Ken Coleman he would say I'm taking the loan well if it were me I'd never even be in a trailer that's 40 acres I don't like to sleep on anything less than 700 thread count I'm not an outdoorsy sleep guy all right I'll be outdoors and then we take a shower and we stay in a nice room. But I, here's what I'm getting at. This is up to you. I just walked you into it and you went, well, I can, I can do anything for two years. Well, then there's your answer. Yeah, I think you just want to cash. If to Jate's point, your pride is like building this thing yourself and it's really important to you, I'm not going to poo-poo that. I said swallow it and get the house done. But that's when I thought you were angst about staying in this trailer. If you're going,

Starting point is 00:53:50 I can stay in the trailer, I can do anything, Ken, for two years, then I think that's your answer. So you build it yourself, and then you take two years and the kids are six and eight. They don't know. You know, get a pup tent in the backyard when the weather's nice in Wyoming. The kids can sleep outside. You know, do whatever you want. It's your 40 acres. I was trying to like say, it's okay for you to take out a loan, but this is before you

Starting point is 00:54:15 through the, it's important to me to build it myself. Again, something I can't even process. I can barely put gas in my car. Do you have tools? do you have any tools? I do, but it's limited to the socket wrenches. I got a cool little set of those L wrenches. Wait, no, that's the stuff that comes. I do have a, I got one of those little battery powered drills that has a Phillips head and then a normal, but I hire other people to do that. It's called a flat head. What is it? Flathead. See? No, that's all I know. I'm just making that up. That's

Starting point is 00:54:48 all I know. So of course I'm going to say hire a contractor. Yes. Because I got nightmare in my mind if you're building this house and but you know look man you're you're a man you live in Wyoming on 40 acres right okay this is a different this is a different type paradigm for me I go to Wyoming in a postcard yes I go I go oh that's that's that's nice I go to Wyoming when I watch what was that Kevin Costner show I don't know what was the show that was big a show remember oh yellowstone yeah that's the only time I go yeah oh yeah no I love that But see, I'm in my living room with a nice blanket, you know, hot cup of tea. Kevin Costner's roughing it.

Starting point is 00:55:33 He's cold. And you're like, ooh, look at him. I'm like, ooh, it will never be me. I get a little shiver and I tell Stacey to turn the heat up. One of my favorite things about you is when you told me about your robe and how comfortable your robe was. My robe is next level. It goes all the way to the ankles.

Starting point is 00:55:51 Restoration hardware, super plush. It's great, folks. It's like it's like wearing a snuggy, but you have freedom. Yeah, and dignity. I can move my arms and legs. And dignity. Yes. It's a great robe. I think every woman should buy my robe for their man in their life. So Ken is saying, Robs over tools. Robs over tools all there. Which one are you going to use more? It's pretty easy. I'm using my robe. 365. Hey, if you're tired of living paycheck to paycheck and feeling like you can't get ahead,

Starting point is 00:56:30 you need to join one of our free every dollar trainings. We've got one every week this month, and they're all hosted by one of our Ramsey personalities. What are we doing? We're going to show you how to stick to a budget and even find $9,000 of margin using every dollar so you can get out of debt and then begin the process of building wealth. You get to ask questions during live Q&A. You can sign it for free at ramsysolutions.com slash webinar. Ramsey Solutions.com slash webinar.

Starting point is 00:56:57 Esther joins us now in South Carolina. Esther, how can we help? Hello, thank you for taking my call. I'm just trying to figure out a game plan. I'm thinking about leaving my husband. I don't work. We have two kids, and being a single mom is potentially in the future for me. I'm just trying to figure out how I'm meant to navigate this.

Starting point is 00:57:23 Okay. you're not working you're thinking of leaving your husband tell us more about that part is there danger I wouldn't say there's imminent danger we've had a domestic violence issue before it's when I was pregnant

Starting point is 00:57:39 in my first my first is going to be two in a couple of weeks and I literally just had newborn on Saturday on Saturday on Saturday yeah oh my gosh okay And I moved from the UK about three years ago within nine for about four years.

Starting point is 00:58:00 And I've only worked like short stretches of time since being here. I'm in the medical field. I'm a medical professional, but just with having the babies and the exams, I haven't had like the time to just seriously just do my exams to be a pharmacist over here. So I haven't been working. How much time and how much money would it take to get those exams done and essentially become qualified or current? There's one exam that happens every October over here. Maybe about 3,000.

Starting point is 00:58:37 I've literally only got about 700 in savings. But I just don't... My dad was abusive is something I work on for sure, but I don't know whether to call this abusive just because I... I'm sorry, just because I'm not getting beat down 24-7. Of course. Hey. I need to figure out something.

Starting point is 00:59:01 Okay. First off, yeah, you're right. Domestic violence doesn't mean you're getting beat down 24-7. It can be, it doesn't have to be to that extreme to be domestic violence. Okay. I want to know what's going on because when I asked you earlier, you said not imminent, but then you went on to say that, you know, when you were pregnant, there was an incident, which to me is pretty crazy.

Starting point is 00:59:31 But I just want to validate to you that any behavior that is in, they're attempting to intimidate you, they're attempting to isolate you, frighten you, terrorize you, threaten you, hurt you, like any of that, even if it's just a threat, okay, that's not normal and you shouldn't be in that environment, especially with babies. But even without, you don't tolerate that more than once. Do you have anywhere you can go before, like, let's forget about the legal separation or divorce piece. Let's just say if you're going to take some of these steps, before we talk about the finance stuff, do you have friends, family in the area that you could flee to and be safe with?

Starting point is 01:00:17 I mean, I've got, the only family I've got other in-laws, it can be a bit difficult because with the first incident. Well, yeah. I don't know whether it's a cultural thing. I got a lot of the blame for it. Yeah, you can't go there. They don't, no, I can just tell you right now they're not part of it. So the answer is you don't have anybody.

Starting point is 01:00:35 What about a church? Have you gone to church? Have you visited any churches in the area? I've got a church. Okay. Again, they were aware of the first situation. That's fine. Um, they were a bit hit in this.

Starting point is 01:00:48 So I haven't, after the first situation happened, I just kind of kept myself to myself and kind of, you know, been, been safe in the way I've reacted to things. I don't get myself into a predicament, um, but, um, yeah, but I don't like that you're feeling like you're the one getting yourself into the predicament. It's not you, it's him. And I want you to, when you get off this call, A, I want you to call the hotline for domestic violence and domestic abuse. I think you need to call and talk to someone because I understand if you don't want to share with us

Starting point is 01:01:19 what's exactly going on. But you need to share with someone that's going to be able to advise you and I'd be looking into shelters in the area because what it sounds like is he sounds volatile to me and it sounds like you can't, is that right? Yes.

Starting point is 01:01:36 Okay. He definitely is. Okay. Yeah. I'm sorry. And you're not in any position to be able, you never were.

Starting point is 01:01:45 But now with a newborn on Saturday, you can't defend yourself from this person. And they clearly don't care if you were pregnant, if you have a newborn on your hip. So you have to go someplace else. And I hate that for you because you're supposed to be able to have a newborn and come home to a safe environment. And I'm so sorry that that's not the case. Okay. I'm so sorry. Here's the thing.

Starting point is 01:02:09 You call the number. You find a shelter. and then you get to a safe place. Then your brain can kind of open up a little bit because you're safe. We're going to make sure to put you in contact with a financial coach and we're going to make sure that they talk with you,

Starting point is 01:02:25 help you figure out what's next. Do you have, yeah, and speaking of what's next, I do want to try to give you, and Jade's right, getting you safe and allowing your brain to slow down and function to its best is huge. But you did call and say, how do I financially prepare for this?

Starting point is 01:02:46 And if I were in your shoes, I would be asking friends or family in the UK. That's where your base has been. And I personally would have zero pride issues with asking for $3,000. Because if $3,000 was what I needed to become a pharmacist in the United States where you can make really good money,

Starting point is 01:03:10 have fabulous benefits for those littles, I would be I have no problem asking for $3,000 and I wouldn't say borrow I didn't say borrow I need to have it we don't ask we don't borrow so I want to make sure because I can hear the people going oh no I didn't say borrow it I'm saying in your situation I would be very comfortable going to family and friends going I am in a desperate situation and I do not want to borrow this money if you could find you know can do you have people in the UK real friends

Starting point is 01:03:41 I believe we could scrape $3,000 together out of family who love you and for the sole purpose, okay, in this situation, when it's right to finish out this qualification, get a current on your stuff. And that's not too much to ask, and don't borrow it. You're going to ask people. I need you to help me. I have a very specific need. By the way, a really good church would step up.

Starting point is 01:04:11 in that situation as well. It would. And so, because this gives you freedom. I'm just wondering if you don't, I mean, I think what Ken said is a great place to start. I'm just going to tag onto that list. Is it better for you to go back to the UK temporarily to be around supportive people? Can you take the kids to the UK or is there some time? This is outside of my legal knowledge.

Starting point is 01:04:34 That's true. That's true. That doesn't want to, that's a good point. So I'm a little nervous with that. Yeah. Ah, that's a good point. You know what I mean? Now, it makes complete common sense. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:04:45 I just don't know legally. No, you're right. I think that's a dangerous situation and I would not do that. Okay, yeah, bad plan. Given that she's not a U.S. citizen, so you don't want to complicate things. But I think safe first, okay, safe, then we work on stability, whatever that looks like short term. That means if you're working at a Walmart, you know, and there's an old lady in the church

Starting point is 01:05:09 you willing to watch the kids mean because you've got to challenge with child care which is very expensive so we got to get safe we got to get stable but i'm trying to encourage you that you becoming a pharmacist as quickly as you can that's going to set you free and in getting hired is going to be a game changer you can mama you can take care of those babies on a pharmacist's salary and you can you'll be fine just promise us you'll leave that environment promise us you won't go to in-laws because they're not for you. That's right. And he's there.

Starting point is 01:05:42 Yeah. Right. And just call us anytime, Esther. Truly. Anytime. Don't lose contact with us because we want to follow you. Hang on the line. Kelly's amazing.

Starting point is 01:05:53 She's going to get you plugged in where we can plug you in. So hang on. All right. Today's Ramsey Show question today brought to you by Yree. If you have been turned down by for refinancing, your defaulted private student loans, you're not alone. And here's the good news. You're not out of luck. Why refi exists to give people with you, excuse me, like you, another shot.

Starting point is 01:06:21 Go to yrefi.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y-R-E-F-Y.com slash Ramsey. It may not be available in all states. Okay. Today's question comes from Sydney in Colorado. She says, my husband and I are relatively new to the baby steps. and I wonder if it's normal to find it hard to transition from using credit cards and thinking you have all this extra money to not using credit cards and realizing you don't have as much

Starting point is 01:06:50 money as you thought you had left over every month. If it is normal, does that feeling quickly go away or am I just going to be uncomfortable for the next few years? Oh my gosh, what a great question, Ken. Yeah, actually really good. You know, I think that Sydney, what you're feeling is completely normal because the truth is, yeah, when you're on a credit card, it is a safety blanket, right? It is, it's a crutch. And what happens when you have a crutch, Ken, you know this. If you, if you wear, lean on it, if you wear a cast for too long, if you sit in a chair for too long, the muscles, they atrophy. You know what I'm saying? And before you know it, doing things that should be normal range of motion, normal things become more difficult because you have atrophied that muscle.

Starting point is 01:07:34 So it's the same thing with your money. is a skill and a learned skill to be able to manage your money, the actual money that comes home in your check. And when you lean on credit cards, you can be willy-nilly, right? You don't have to be as on it. You know that if you break the budget, it's okay

Starting point is 01:07:53 because I've got this extra, you know, the limit is here and I can go beyond and there's no real guard reels there. So I think what's happening is for the first time, you're like, oh, I have boundaries. I have limits and I must, depend on my financial, you know, fortitude and my own kind of willpower to stay within those boundaries. And yeah, that's a skill to learn over time. And I think that you're on the right track.

Starting point is 01:08:20 And it could take a while. You know, we do say that when people build a budget can, you know, what is it, 90 days before they feel like, I got it. I can stick to this. I can start to live like this. And, you know, for you, I don't know how far out of bounds you guys were going. But yeah, it's it's a lifestyle change. That's right. And I would just give you give yourself grace because everybody's different as to their discipline. I know some people

Starting point is 01:08:46 that they get this Ramsey plan and like, oh, got it. Yeah. And they're just such system, discipline people that it's just like, okay, I'm in lockstep and then there's other people that it takes a while. And here's what I would tell you that once you finally get over using credit cards,

Starting point is 01:09:03 what I found to be true for us years and years ago, we finally cut ours up and that whole deal. And it's kind of like when you give up something food-wise. And what happens is your appetite changes. And I think credit cards are much like food or beverages. And I'm going to give you a specific example in my life. Years and years ago, I was a sweet tea animal. I mean, I drank a lot of sweet tea. I thought it was a rite of passage because I was born and raised in the South. You know, it was kind of like water and sweet tea.

Starting point is 01:09:44 And I kept looking for sweet tea in the Bible. I couldn't find it anywhere. Oh, man, no, it ain't there. That's how much I love sweet tea. And I cut it out as a part of a massive physical goal. And this is the only thing I can describe in my life that means is where your appetite changes. and so I was very disciplined for at least a year jade to not have sweet tea and and then a year turned into two years and I just I just had all these other options and I remember one day I was at

Starting point is 01:10:16 some thing in the summer and somebody had a gallon of chick-fil-a iced tea sitting on that picnic table and it was just going pst and you know what I did yeah what did I poured a little bit over some and I took a drink and I promise you this is the truth it was disgusting I believe you and here's what I learned I talked to a nutrition a nutritious about it like weeks later and I told that story and she said yeah your appetite changed yeah it's real and so I think as long I know that was a long-winded metaphor but I can't help it I'm a preacher boy okay I think that once you get off of credit cards and you really truly follow the Ramsey plant. Excuse me. And you really truly. I'm not getting choked up emotionally. Are you crying? Yeah.

Starting point is 01:11:08 Listen, I was ready to step in for you. I'm reclumped. I just believed like the sweet tea that the idea of a credit card when it pops back up on the picnic table that you'll go. Yeah. I don't want what comes with that. And for me it was just it was too sugary. Yeah. And but what had changed was my appetite. It wasn't discipline in the moment. Well, it was my appetite change. So I hope that helps. And I think that's for a lot of people to go, okay, man, I don't know if I can really get myself away from these credit cards.

Starting point is 01:11:43 But I'm telling you, when you change your lifestyle and you change your habits, your appetite changes with it. And that's game changer stuff. So I hope that helps. If I had an organ, I'd have played the organ behind you. But I didn't have it. Don't get me started. I'll take an offer. I mean, we'll do an altar.

Starting point is 01:12:00 call. I mean, let's go, man. I'll give you three points in an offering here quick. No, I hope that encourages people. And it's same way with debt. All right, let's get to Kyle, who's joining us now in Charleston, South Carolina. Kyle, how can we help today? Hey, Jayden, Ken. How are you? Thanks for taking my call. Sure. So I just finished baby step three. Congrats. Thank you for the last couple years, getting out of about $80,000 worth of debt, and I just finished my emergency fund. At this point, thank you. At this point, I have no savings outside of my emergency fund, and I'm looking to start budgeting for the first time. So you did all that without a budget? How did that happen? It was everything that was not living expenses was going on to the debt. So basically insane

Starting point is 01:12:51 disappointment. Yeah, you just went hard in the paint. Good for you, good for you. Okay, so we're making a budget. Right. And I appreciate the structure. of the baby steps. I think that helped me out a lot while going through the process. And I wanted to see if you guys have any similar rules or best practices that I'm able to stick to as like a first time budget or making a budget for the first time. Great question. I love this. All right, Jade. So here we go. The guy's got his fully funded emergency fund. Yeah. So first off, yeah, I would recommend the same budget that I use. The same budget can use as is called every dollar. we both really like it everybody around here seems to love it it's great and so once you have that budget

Starting point is 01:13:34 at the top of it you're just going to put in your income right which what is your income every month uh it's about a hundred okay oh i'm sorry uh annually annually okay so you're going to plug in your money you know i don't know what it is after taxes i whatever that is so eight thousand dollars right there at the top then you're going to plug in all of your expenses now when you're doing the budget you're going to keep in mind what you're next goal is, right? And for you, the goal is I need to be investing 15% of my income. So let's say, let's just pretend you start the budget, just to see the money you have. Let's pretend you start the money, the budget without accounting for that, just to see, okay, here's the margin I actually

Starting point is 01:14:15 have with the life that I actually live. Then you're going to say, well, wait a minute, I do need to budget for this 15%. What will it look like when I pull this money away? Because that's going to go into retirement. And now am I able to budget less that 15 percent? And so that's kind of the exercise that you need because that is the drum that you're going to be beating from now until the time that you retire. You're going to be investing 15 percent of your income. Then from there, it's like, okay, what are the other things that I want to do with my margin? Do I want to put savings anywhere else? Am I thinking of buying a house? Am I thinking of buying a, you know, saving up a down payment. And by the way, is that part of your goals? Yes, it is. Okay. So those are the two things

Starting point is 01:15:01 that are going to be driving the driving forces behind your budget right now. Does that make sense? Yes, ma'am. All right. Kelly's going to pick up. Kelly, you know what to do. Oh, the assist of Kelly. You got to love it. Yeah. You know, this is exciting. I just want to say yay, yay, yay, yay, Kyle. I mean, the fact that you went so hard and fast to get. So good. To get. to Babyship 3, and we're like, I don't even know how to budget. I mean, that, again, I applaud that, and I love that you're now leaning in. You're on your way to wealth, young man, and that is exciting. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show alongside Jade Warshaw and Kent Coleman.

Starting point is 01:15:39 Let's get right to Josh here in Fort Worth, Texas. Josh, how can we help? Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my call this afternoon. I had a question about buying my son a vehicle. A little bit of background. His mom and I have been split up for about eight years now. He's 17 and recently got his license,

Starting point is 01:16:06 and I've been trying to talk with her about getting him a car for about the last year now. And she doesn't want to participate financially because his grandparents on her side are, willing to let him use a car that they have. It's still titled in their name. It's insured on their policy and they added him to their insurance. And I don't think it's the right kind of car. It's kind of a sporty

Starting point is 01:16:34 sedan that an inexperienced 17-year-old probably shouldn't be driving. What is it? Tell us more. For real. It's an Accura. It's an Accura, T.L. I think it's about 15 years old. but it's, you know, 300 horsepower, and he got his license like two weeks ago. You think that he's going to drag race in this? What is the concern? No, but he's pretty impulsive kid.

Starting point is 01:17:02 I wasn't quite ready for him to get his license. I'm looking online at Accura TL that's 15 years old. That is not a impulsive car. I am not seeing any, unless I'm missing something. All right. But, Josh. It's got a little get up and go. Josh. It's a 15-year-old Accura. Nobody thinks of that car is irresponsible for a kid.

Starting point is 01:17:26 In fact, an Accura is a fabulous car, a 15-year-old Accura. What do you want to buy him? Let's run this whole risky thing. I'm dying to know. What do you want to buy him? I'm looking more like Honda Civic. You realize Honda makes Accura. But that's the one folks trick out in race is the Honda Civi. That's like what they do. It's like pure stock. It doesn't matter. It's a gutless wonder.

Starting point is 01:17:54 Wait a sec. Okay, here's the deal. Okay, I'll get out of your way, Jay, because I think you're revving up. I like when you get rubbed up. If I'm in your situation, I wouldn't spend my money on buying this kid a car. The grandparents on the other side are doing you a solid, man.

Starting point is 01:18:13 Take a, don't look a gift horse in the mouth as the old phrase. Or at least try it out first at the very, least let him try with the accurate and if he if he races it then get him a civic to race but that's his problem but the fact that you don't want your 17 year old you don't think he's ready for a license is also an issue that's you know I mean is any 16 year old ready I mean I know when two of my three I'm getting ready to have a third one driving y'all pray for me I'd like to keep my hair but I remember when the first two started driving jade I was absolutely mortified terrified. I'm letting them drive a vehicle. It didn't matter if it was an Accura or a Yugo,

Starting point is 01:18:55 people from the 80s, remember that car. It's basically a lawnmower, you know, it doesn't matter. You know, it's, the very concept of driving a car is dangerous. So his impulses and all that, that's a bigger issue. You get him a civic versus him giving him an accurate is, and I'm just telling you as objectively as I can. You called us. You're worried about the wrong things. And I would take the gift. I would too. Listen, I second that. I thought you were going to say they're giving him a brand new 2025. Lamborghini. Like I was expecting something like that. Even then I'd take that. I'd just ride with the kid. But that's me. Yeah. I think that you have a gift here and don't block the blessing. Well said. Josh, we've spoken. That's the gavel right there. You're going to do what you're

Starting point is 01:19:49 going to do. I got a feeling. Do you remember when I was in high school, the car to have? Like, if you had this car, it was like, oh, I'm very excited. I'm a little older than you, so I'm anxious to see what this is. Well, and I also grew up in like a country town. If you had a Trans Am, like that was the business. It was speed. Speed on wheels. Oh, man. And it was funny about it. It was funny about of Trans Am, it's honestly a piece of crap. Yeah, it is. It looked fast. It looked so cool.

Starting point is 01:20:17 It had the, like, the bird on the, oh gosh. Oh, the bird. They had the bird on the hood. I know. That's from, what's the, uh, smoking the bandit? Yeah, Bert Reynolds. Come on, man. Now I'm dating myself.

Starting point is 01:20:29 Yeah, that's okay. There's like a whole demographic that's like, did he just say, Smoky and the Who? Listen, I'm going to act like I don't know what you're talking about. You do know. Because you're the real deal. Dan is joining us now in Alabama. Dan, how can we help?

Starting point is 01:20:42 Hey, Ken and Jade. I'm a new listener. Welcome aboard, sir. Well, thank you. My wife and I, of almost 40 years, are searching for peace. We're sick and tired of being sick and tired. Good. We sold our family small business of 20 years back in 2021.

Starting point is 01:21:11 the buyer made it 18 months and bankrupted it. Oh, no. And that really has thrown our retirement into a spiral. What were the terms of the deal? Well, it was an owner finance deal for three years. And, you know, the deal was that he would operate two years and be able to get SBA financing. No, I get that, but over the three-year period, when the three years was done,

Starting point is 01:21:47 what were you expecting to be paid? About a half a million. So you were counting on a half a million, and I'm guessing you're getting zero. Well, we didn't get much. Okay. You have any other retirement accounts? Well, we've been trying to keep the facility operations. because we had tenants renting out part of the facility.

Starting point is 01:22:17 I had to keep that up and going. So we have kind of blown through what retirement we had saved up. What kind of facility is it? Like, do you still have any of this? It is a food manufacturing facility. Okay. It's a large facility. Who owns that?

Starting point is 01:22:39 Who has ownership? I'm assuming the new owner. You still kept ownership. Yeah, I leased him. He bought assets of the... All right. Understood. So you have zero.

Starting point is 01:22:52 Yeah, well, tell me, give me real numbers. How much did you get from the sale of the company? You said you got a little, not much. We need real numbers here. What do you have? Yeah, we got less than 100,000. 90, 80, 75, 20? 90.

Starting point is 01:23:08 Okay, 90. Okay, so 90,000. and then you have zero retirement money? Right. Other than we just received an inheritance IRA from... How much is that? How much? It's now that $100,000.

Starting point is 01:23:24 Okay. How old are you guys? I'm 64. Okay. Okay. And how much is the building worth if you were to sell it today? I have it now listing for 1.375. Okay.

Starting point is 01:23:38 Okay. Go ahead. Well, here's what we're doing. Let's hold this because there's more work to do here. So hang on the line. Keep those numbers handy, Dan. We need those numbers. And we're going to pick up where we left off, all right?

Starting point is 01:23:53 Okay. Hey, don't just set goals in 2026. How about learning how to reach them? The 2026 Ramsey Goal Planner is here, and it's packed with monthly content from Jade, Rachel, and John Deloney to help you stay on track with your money, faith, and relationships so that you can follow through on your goals. And these sell out every year, so don't wait. You can get yours for 4997 at Ramsey Solutions.com slash store or click the link in the show notes. If you're watching on YouTube right now, I've got it in my hands here. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:24:31 This is no joke. It's nice. I mean, if you judge a book by its weight, this is valuable. Substantial. I could knock a man out with this with very little effort. It's just that substantial. A lot of tabs. And I think that's probably a good feature for a planner as well, don't you think?

Starting point is 01:24:50 And it's a little bit smaller than last year, so it's easier to just handle. Smaller than last year? What was last year? The scrolls? Wow, this is substantial. I really am fascinated by it. and you know else I like this little what do you call this? The binder it's continuous so it can't come off like last year last year we had a little bit of problems with it this year it's completely solved it's great

Starting point is 01:25:11 I feel like you might have engineered this not only contributed to it you're speaking with great knowledge about all this I just well I'm part of the product and I I care about it I love it it's great I love it there you go all right so we're going to come back to Dan and Dan kind of set this up here Dan sold his family business and the person who bought it was owner finance that means they were paying Dan over three years and did not go well so we're running through the numbers so Dan

Starting point is 01:25:39 we're coming back to you let's recast on the numbers to make sure that Jade and I are completely caught up you walked away with $90,000 cash from the sale of this company is that correct correct okay

Starting point is 01:25:54 and you were expecting to walk away of 500,000. Is that also correct? That is correct. All right. And you've depleted your retirement funds down to basically nothing to kind of keep this building that you still own afloat. Is that correct? That is correct. All right. Great. And so what did you tell me if we were to sell this building today and you have listed it, what do you expect to actually walk away with? Equity, I would hope to walk away with around 400,000.

Starting point is 01:26:33 Okay. And just to clarify, there's no business running out of it. It's just a building. You said you had a couple of renters in there. Is that what I heard? Well, I restarted a different version of the business that I sold because I had to keep the building going. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:26:50 And how was that doing? Well, my son came on board. He stopped his career venture. into insurance to join with me and try to restart the business that we were doing. And how's it going? Well, it's still not paying for the building, and it's just bleeding me. It's bleeding in front of it. So, well, you shut that business down?

Starting point is 01:27:17 The building is too big for what we are able to do. If you sell that building, would you keep that business going? No, because now my son has decided he wants to go back to insurance. Good move. I was going to suggest that. So with the risk of having to build a whole new smaller facility in order to operate profitably, he doesn't want to take that risk. So if I'm reading the situation, if I've got the facts, Dan, correct me here,

Starting point is 01:27:48 you were hoping to walk away with 500K over a three-year period, but if we sell this building, we're going to end up being at 490K now. So instead of 500K later, you're going to be 490 now, correct? Well, the 90's gone, but it was still money you received. Wait, wait, wait, so you've already spent. Okay, I was only the impression you retained the 90. You're saying it's already been spent. Yes.

Starting point is 01:28:12 Okay, but same scenario. So instead of 500K after selling this business, once we get rid of the building, you're going to have 400K. Hopefully, yes. Okay. So the only difference is. is as we blew through retirement. How much retirement did you spend? Probably 250. Okay. So that's the number. So when I look at, okay, where we thought we were going to be was 500K in cash and 250 continuing to grow in

Starting point is 01:28:40 retirement, now we're going to be at 400 and zero in retirement. That's the difference. So we've got a $250,000 deficit. Okay. So we've got to address that. You know, my head has just been, so wrapped up in all the arms and legs of this thing, I can't seem to critical think my way through these. And, you know, I've tried to, we never have been much of a budgeter. So I've thrown all this mess together on a spreadsheet. I think you've had this for so long, and it went away that you didn't want it to go. And so you're kind of trying to grasp at straws to keep it. But I think the longer you keep it, the more loss you're going to feel.

Starting point is 01:29:27 And I get it. You've sunk a lot of time and money and cost into this. And that's deceiving, right? You keep thinking, oh, there might be a way that I can re-get it and get it back and get it back, but instead you're just losing at a very fast rate. Here's a quick question. I don't, where's your income? I understand the 400 because that was going to be a part of your retirement or were you planning to live off of the 500?

Starting point is 01:29:49 In other words, all I want to know right now is how are you bringing an income? Well, it's through the business that we're operating now. But you're about ready to shut that down. Yes. And so now that's our biggest issue. So how much money? What do you need to make? What kind of income do you need to replace?

Starting point is 01:30:07 The hope is that I am willing to sell off what is left of the businesses that we are operating. Yeah. Because there are, there is potential there. I mean, there are. What kind of potential? What do you think it would be in dollars? hopefully at least another three or four hundred thousand but that I think I can resell it again if I can split it up into two segments well now we're closing that gap well and we can

Starting point is 01:30:41 invest that in retirement and replace the 250 with these numbers but again where's our income if you sell those businesses you still need some income yeah what will you do yeah well and that's and that's the next thing is this is all we've ever done. So, you know, manufacturing food is what we know. And in order to duplicate that on a smaller scale, we still have to have expensive facilities. So then we're going through the mind process of, like, your book,

Starting point is 01:31:15 is what are we really wired to do? Well, I get that, but I wonder if you could go work for somebody instead of running the business, you're 65, and you're trying to play catch-up, but if we sell all these businesses and stack this cash, if I'm in your shoes, I'm looking to go do similar work, but I'm going to go do it for somebody else in this twilight, and allow myself to keep stacking onto retirement. For right now, I'm not thinking that I have to start another manufacturing business. I actually think at this stage, with you checking out of all these things and exiting, I would go

Starting point is 01:31:52 do similar work, you know, contract work, go work for somebody else that does it. Is it ideal for you? No. But is it a lot safer and is it a lot calmer? And does it help you continue to catch up? Yes. That's what I would do. You also did say though, and I just want to play this out. You said before, hey, we would be making money on the manufacturing business we have now, but our facility is too large, so we're bleeding because of it. And you said we needed a smaller facility. So my question is, if you sold off the smaller businesses that you've created as a result of having all this extra space, would that create the money you need to have the smaller facility so that the existing business can actually be profitable? And then over time, maybe you just

Starting point is 01:32:34 have somebody else come in and run it. And that's kind of your plan to transition out. Have you thought through that? Well, we have considered that. But, you know, without a son to take longevity. I just don't have it in you. I can hear it. I understand. I can hear it. I can hear it. I've already retired once. I get. I can hear it. That idea, well, a good idea, I think for you it's exhausting. You know, I'm in good physical shape. So yes, going to work somewhere for a little while and stack up some more cash. It's just, that's the play. So much to think through. Well, I just simplified it. I just simplified it for you. And you got to be a with it. Yeah. You got to be okay going. You know what? The deal went bad. It's not my fault that

Starting point is 01:33:22 the bonehead ran it in the ground. Maybe I could have done something, but we don't play that game. We're not going to, you're not going to just play Armshire quarterback on yourself. Let's move forward, sell everything, let's stack the cash, and let's retire with dignity. Hey, how are you doing with the baby steps? Are you on track? You can take a quick quiz to check your progress and received a personalized plan just for you all you do is go to our show notes click on the link titled are you on track with the baby steps and you can complete the quiz that's a great resource let's go to norman oklahoma tristan is there tristan how can we help hey guys how you doing good how are you uh pretty good i have encountered a situation um

Starting point is 01:34:13 I was not ready for it. I've been listening to you guys for about a year now. And about a month ago, at the end of July, I got into a wreck. I was, I goofed. I was trying to work the baby steps out of order, so not the smartest part of my end. But I was trying to get rid of my debt before saving up the nest egg, so I don't have $1,000 to help me out with getting a new car. I was in a cry accident, and it was his fault.

Starting point is 01:34:40 He ran into me and told her my car. but I just have liability. Now I don't have transportation, and I am trying to find a vehicle off of, like, Facebook marketplace, and I can't seem to find one within my price range. Right now I have about 700 saved up, and that's about all the money I have. Okay, hold up. Slow down. Just one second here.

Starting point is 01:35:03 So because it was the other guy's fault, have you talked to your insurance people and his insurance people? Are you getting... You should get some money. You should get some money on that for the car. From his insurance. From his insurance for your car. Yeah, so the thing is, like I said, I was working on Baby Step 2, and so I was $6,000 before.

Starting point is 01:35:24 I was trying to get paid off at the end of the year, but I was $6,000 under. And it was a 2016 Hyundai Sonata, and so the value is just right around there. I'm so confused, brother. So you're saying you are upside down on? the car. Is that what you're saying, the 6K? Is that what you were saying? Upside down on the car. Okay, so that's neither here nor there. Yeah, what's the car worth? What is the total? When the car was total, what is the number? So my attorney's been working on that. She has gotten to me, and the number that we're looking at is

Starting point is 01:36:02 $5,500. So you should be getting a check for $5,500 from his insurance agency. but I was told that that was going to go straight to the bank since I'm in since I it's under a loan that is correct I apologize I was so focused on your next car that's okay so that's gone and you have $700 correct well that's a and don't be looking for a $700 car you might as well get a bicycle because that's going to be more dependable I'm not even kidding how old are you I'm 26 okay what do you do for work I am a teacher a teacher a teacher a teacher teacher. Okay. How far away do you live from the school? I live about 11 miles. Okay. So you're still able to work like you're not injured from this. Are you? Correct. No, God was surrounded me. I'm going through PT right now. I am finally an accident injury lawsuit. So we're on the steps of that, but I don't know what to do in the meantime before I get that money. I think you're going to be on. So the first step is we need to figure out where is there any margin in your budget? Because that's what's going to be what you're putting towards saving up for a beater vehicle. And in the meantime, you're doing a couple of things

Starting point is 01:37:15 called the bus. You're doing, you're taking the cheapest level of lift. You're hitching a ride with, you know. How much bicycling have you done in your life? I bicycled the other day to my workout. Did you really? Okay. The reason I'm asking is what do you think 11 miles? How long would it taking to ride 11 miles. I can ride a mile in like, I don't know, like five minutes, because when I ride to my workout, it's about a mile and a half away. Yeah, 55, yeah. I thought it would be faster than that, but I, you know,

Starting point is 01:37:47 I always underestimate these things. If it's a safe ride. I was pretty good on the Peloton. If it's a safe ride, try it. You got to do something like that. I mean, that's the real, real, Tristan. Like, you're going to have to save, what do you think in your budget you could carve out every month?

Starting point is 01:38:01 month to go towards a car. Because you need like $3,000. Yeah, I'm thinking, I'm just trying to, I'm still, I'm still working on trying to get the, I have the every dollar app, but I'm trying to get those behaviors in, so I'm not too good at it yet. No, no, no, no. Okay, you can do this today. So I don't want you to over, make this too difficult. Today, you go in there, and when you get paid from your, from being a teacher, do you get paid twice a month? Yes. Okay, so what are those checks? Um, they are 1,300. Okay. So you put both of those $1,100 checks in there. And then you're going to say, okay, I've got $2,200. Do you teach full time? Uh, yes. Okay. I've got $2,200 to spend. And then from there, you're going to, it's going to give you a place to put all the things you spend money on. So you're

Starting point is 01:38:49 going to put your rent out of there. You're going to put everything out of there. So when you were paying off debt because you said, hey, I went too fast. I paid off my debt too fast and I didn't do the savings. When you were paying off your debt, how much? extra were you putting towards paying off your debt? Anything I could. I don't have a specific number. I was putting my rent. Give me a good month. On a good month? On a good month, 600. Okay. So now that, essentially what I'm telling you is that $600, instead of going towards

Starting point is 01:39:19 paying off your debt, you're going to stack that for the next two, three months, two months until you have, okay, $1,200 plus the $700 you had before you're going to have about $2,000, right so it's like okay great now i'm getting closer to being able to buy this car if you can put another thousand with it that's that's how this is going to work now the hard part is usually we would tell people if they're saving for a car you need to be side hustling you need to be doing this and that but for you it's a slim margin because you don't have transportation so this is going to be a grind out for you for three months are you how much money you're generating because i'm over here um jay just you know i'm not uh no i know you're not checking my

Starting point is 01:40:00 stocks. I'm looking up. Use cars. Are you actually near Norman, Oklahoma? Yes. Okay. I'm South Norman. How much money have you generated for him with this coaching? In two months, he's going to have $2,000. In three months, he's going to have, if he grinds it out, he's going to have $3,000. Okay. All right. So I'm just doing a check here. You're going to need, I think, to be safe, another $1,000. I'm looking at some cars that, again, will get you from point A to point B. go lower. I think you can go lower. I'm just doing a quick, you know. Okay.

Starting point is 01:40:33 I'm just saying, I direct to say like Facebook Marketplace, you probably can. Yeah, because he's only going 10 miles a day. And then you can slowly build up after that. Yeah, but I like the 3 to 4,000. I just was playing off of your number. I think 3 to 4,000 is the number. And I would say Facebook Marketplace is a good play. But some of these dealers get really.

Starting point is 01:40:55 Seedy. Well, they're very happy to unload a, like, here's, a 2007 Pontiac vibe base. I never even heard of this car. No, don't get that. I'm not saying you get it, but I'm saying you go to this dealer, they're asking $39.99 for that. You go in there with $2,000 in $100 bills and lay it on the hood of that vibe, and you're driving that thing away. Yeah, you shake his greasy hand and you're out the door. You don't even have to shake his hand. Just, hey, here it is. Spread it out. And that guy's going to go, $2,000 cash for a Pontiac vibe? Don't spread it out. You're going to get the man jumped. Just, just, just, just, just, just, just write a check like a normal. No, you're missing, no, you're missing my drama. You thought that was gangster? I think that's a pack. I think it's a flex. It's like, you're like, unbutton your shirt, throw your chest hairs out, put a gold chain on and just slap it on the table. If that works for $2,000, my point is cash, for these older cars, cash really goes a long way. It does, it does. And that's all I'm saying, just something practical there. But that's what your play is right now.

Starting point is 01:41:58 And then hopefully you get a nice check from this case or whatever. Yeah, I hope so. Yeah, man. This is called grind time. That is. You know, there's an old phrase. You're a teacher, Tristan. You probably heard this.

Starting point is 01:42:11 Where there's a will, there's a way. There you go. And this is the time. And it's very easy, by the way, because there's going to be a chorus of people singing. Go get a car payment. Don't do it. And there's the choir. The choir is going to be singing.

Starting point is 01:42:28 Don't do it. There it is. Don't do it. Nice. Nice. I'm always ready for you. You got to step out of the choir like Jade does. Like she has a different color robe than everybody else, you know.

Starting point is 01:42:40 She's got the mic. She gets out at center stage. That's what you got to do here. The soloist. You got to be a soloist on this because the choir is going to get you in trouble with a car payment, you know. Don't do it. And I tell you what, folks, you want to enjoy yourself sometime and you're really bored, nothing good on TV. pull up the old use car websites and look for cars listed under $5,000.

Starting point is 01:43:03 Give you a chuckle. Our scripture of the day comes from Ephesians 2.10, for we are God's handiwork created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do. Our quote of the day From Ephesians 210 to Janus Joplin It's always just a natural bridge Indeed

Starting point is 01:43:33 You are what you settle for Jesus to Joplin With it all day Thank you Jail Well said By the way I want to be known for quotes like that You are what you settle for

Starting point is 01:43:45 Yeah six words Like Janice just dropped the mic She did drop it She just said it lit up a sig I walked away No big deal Nicky is in Missouri Nicky how can we help

Starting point is 01:43:55 there was a senior citizen widowed and there is another senior citizen much older than me a widower who was interested in a relationship with me and with the goal of getting married because he wants to get married all right all right all right Nikki you're putting that the vibe huh well there's more behind it though oh I'm better off financial agent yes he does not know my financial situation, but I know his completely. Okay. I like how you roll, Nikki. I like it.

Starting point is 01:44:33 So you've got money and he doesn't. Exactly. So he doesn't know you could be a sugar mama. He just got out of a sugar mama relationship. In fact, I'm the one that pointed it out and said, look, let me lay this out for you and she's going to take all your money. She had every bit of his money in a joint account with her name on it. And did she take it?

Starting point is 01:44:56 Did she take it? No. But he doesn't have a whole lot anyway. No, $125,000. Oh, that's it? All right. So what is your, keep going. So what's your concern or what's your question for us?

Starting point is 01:45:08 All right. My concern is he told me that $125 is burning a hole in his pocket. And it's like, you know, his pension alone is about $100,000 a year. Okay. And so, you know, he makes good money. but where is it? Is he that bad with money? Well, apparently he was spending it on this last lady.

Starting point is 01:45:30 Now he wants to spend it on you. Yeah. I mean, what's this? So is this leading to should, I mean, I feel like you're leading to another question here. I don't want to ask it for you. I want you to ask it. What's your question? I'm ready.

Starting point is 01:45:43 I'm worried that he's going to end up needing a very expensive nursing home care or something and he'll blow through his money instantly and then I'd have to dip into mind if we're married. How old is he? He's 81. And how old are you? 68. Oh, yeah. See, I don't know. Interesting. I don't know. Well, first of all, we jumped ahead to all this.

Starting point is 01:46:04 The way this call started is, this met this guy, he just got out of this other relationship. Seems very fast. This all seems fast. Do you even like this guy? Well, we've been Facebook friends for over three years. Well, that doesn't mean anything. I'm not going to marry my Facebook. First of all, I'm married. But if I was in your situation, I wouldn't, I wouldn't consider marrying a Facebook friend. There's got to be more criteria. We've liked each other's pictures for three years. We thought maybe we would tie the knot. What else is there? Nikki, no. This guy needs

Starting point is 01:46:35 to court you. Can I act like... I know. I'm not saying that he's not going to. But he has he started yet, is the question. Or are we jumping ahead? We're talking about something we shouldn't talk about is what I'm getting at, Nikki. This guy's got to earn your love. He's got to earn the right to marry you, at which point you discuss all these things in this process. And if you guys aren't aligned, if you're not aligned with your money at this late stage of life, you shouldn't do it. Because I mean, God bless him, 81. That's my question. Is it, or because he has such a good income, do I not worry about it so much? Am I overthinking this? I think, well, we're trying to get a bead on what the relationship actually is. It ain't.

Starting point is 01:47:22 Are you dating? It's Facebook. No, it isn't yet. I have been putting him off. He asked me out two years ago, and I said, oh, I'm in the middle of the house repair. Okay. You were washing your hair. She went to that one.

Starting point is 01:47:34 That's great. But wait a minute. Nikki, let me ask a question. I don't think you really like this guy. She doesn't. I feel like it's a line in the water, and you're like, well, I'm not doing anything else. I think you're 68 and you're a widow, and this guy's interested in you, and that's kind of nice. But you haven't said anything that makes me think there's something there.

Starting point is 01:47:52 No. You said he would like to get married. There isn't yet. Well, he asked me already. To marry you? I wonder, basically. We have to. Would you consider getting married?

Starting point is 01:48:04 It's like, well, I don't know. I don't even have met you yet. Have you? Nicky. Do you live in the same space to actually meet each other in person? And we're going to in a week and a half. He's coming here. He's six hours away.

Starting point is 01:48:17 So you really legitimately have never met him. Hold up. How do we know this isn't catfishing? Do you even know what that? means? Yeah, but I really don't think it is. He is too open and on it. No, no, no, no, no, no. Nikki, you are, you have a hook in both sides of your mouth right now, and this needs to stop. Yeah. You do not have any more communication with this guy until this 81 year old wrinkled dude shows up in his Bermuda shorts and is the real deal. Yeah. This is, this is a, I'm not kidding you.

Starting point is 01:48:47 Yeah, neither am I. I wish Dave were here today and I don't want to get mean like Dave, but I'm telling you, everything you're saying sounds like you are being completely punked and you are falling for it. Yeah. Your first reply to me was, oh, no, no, but he's so open and honest. And that's how they get you. And why would you even be talking about finances to this level with somebody that you've never even seen in person?

Starting point is 01:49:14 Oh, that was because of the scammer he was with last and he just about went. Right, but even that part. You've not met this guy. You don't even know if he's real. Yeah, this all sounds like a scam. Tell him to come meet you. He's going to. Okay, well, let's wait until.

Starting point is 01:49:30 He was wanting to do that for two months. Let's wait and see if he shows up. Yeah, let's see if he shows up. My buddy's on, this guy never shows up because he gets a mysterious case of overnight gout. Yeah. Do you know anybody else that knows him? Okay, we get on Facebook widowed video chats. And so, you know, you kind of get to know the people in the group.

Starting point is 01:49:49 And he was in that group for a long time. Yeah, he was. because that's where I would fish if I was a scammer. But you've seen his face. Go where the fish are biting. As a Zoom call is what you're saying. I don't buy it. What's his name?

Starting point is 01:50:00 Yeah. Charlie. Yeah, it's not real. It actually is. Here's the thing. But Nikki, you need to wait to see him. If you see him in person, if you see him in person, you've had Zoom calls with him, seeing his face.

Starting point is 01:50:15 If you see him, now if he's doing the Wilson from home improvement where you never see oh no it's always like this and you never see the whole face Nikki if your daughter called us if you had a daughter I don't know if you have a daughter or if you have a daughter or if you have a daughter and she called us and you were listening to this call what in the world would you say to her oh I know it but she's much younger than me it doesn't matter you're not a desperate lost case you you've got to be careful the other thing is I honestly think he went, I told them where I lived last year. Gee, that's smart. That's smart. I know it. I know. I know it.

Starting point is 01:50:57 Nikki, no. I do trust the guy. No, no, no, no, no. I'm done. I'm not going to be his me and his day, but I'm going to tell you something, Nikki. I'm going to tell you the truth, because I feel like I have to tell you the truth. And then Jade can clean it up. I'll give you my 30 seconds and then I'll give me. Nikki, this is absolute foolishness. Whether it's a scam or not, this is foolishness. And I mean very, very serious. And I'm going to tell you. you why I don't care. I'm not listening. No, I don't want to hear it. Let me tell you why. You need to protect your heart. No, you need to protect your heart, whether it's a scam or not. You are talking about finances and combining your life with a guy that you've never been on a

Starting point is 01:51:34 date with that is significantly older than you, that based on what he's told you so far, he's reckless with money and all these other things. There's nothing stable about this entire phone call. Nothing stable. The only thing that is, stable is your financial situation, but you are putting your financial and your emotional situation in massive risk. And I'm telling you the absolute truth. You need to run from this if this guy's real. If he wants to pursue you like you were when you were 22, then we have a conversation. And not that I need this, but everybody in the audience out there is shaking their head. And this is insanity that you're considering this. And so Jay, only a desperate person

Starting point is 01:52:17 would go forward with this. Only a desperate, stupid woman. And you are neither of those things, so don't do it. Well, I might get a little stupid because the only thing that makes me think, well, maybe, would be, would be, he said his full pension goes to his wife when he dies if he's been married to here. No, no, no, you don't need his pension. No, no. You don't need.

Starting point is 01:52:39 Well, then why are we still having this conversation? Go hang out with some fried green tomatoes and have some strong margaritas. and cry yourself to sleep tonight about how lonely you are because that's what's going on. You're lonely.

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