The Ramsey Show - App - Your Mother Is a Travel Agent for Guilt Trips! (Hour 3)

Episode Date: August 7, 2023

Dave Ramsey & Jade Warshaw answer your questions and discuss:   EveryDollar, budget for the life you want today for free: Click Here "How do I help my parents plan for retirement?" Getting an apartment without a credit score, from the blog: Living Without a Credit Score, "Should I pay off my house if I'm going to sell?" "Should we sell a paid off rental to pay off debt?" Support Our Sponsor: Neighborly Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Enter The Ramsey Cash Giveaway for a chance to win $3,000! https://bit.ly/TRSCashGiveaway Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: Click Here Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: Click Here Interested in advertising on The Ramsey Show? Click Here Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the pods of Moving and Storage Studios, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Jade Walsh, our Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us, America. We're so glad you're here. Marie's with us in Chattanooga. Hi, Marie. Welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hi. It's really good to talk to you guys. How are you doing?

Better than we deserve. What's up in your world? So short question, how do I ensure that my parents don't end up homeless in their retirement without them coming to live with my husband and I? So why is that your job? Because, um, I, my parents don't have anything safe for retirement. And for various reasons that I experienced growing up, my husband and I are not okay with them living with us in the future. Why is it your job to take care of them? Because I can see the trajectory that they're on. Why is it your job to take care of them? Because I can see the trajectory that they're on. Why is it your job to take care of them? If they go in the street, why is it your job to get them out of the street?

Because they're my parents and I love them and I don't want to see them homeless. Okay. It's not your...here's where... That's a desire, it's not your here here's where that's a desire that's what i was gonna say it's not your job it's something that you like to do want to do and are choosing to do so don't don't pose the question in your mind as if you are somehow forced ethically or morally or spiritually into doing this now why are why would your parents not have any money why would they not at least have social security they would have social security but um they're too irresponsible to pay their house

payment they don't have a house right now um where do they live now yeah they are in the process of moving to another state my father just got a new job and um with various moves in the past couple of years all of the equity that they had built up in the house that they um owned when i was growing up um has been depleted the reason that i feel like i want to give back and i don't want to put my parents in this situation is because... You're not the one putting them in this situation. You didn't put them in this situation. They put themselves in this situation. I'm not saying that it's my fault.

I know it's their fault. You didn't put them in. You just said, I put them in this situation. You didn't put them in this situation. Here's the thing, Marie. The reason we're getting you on your language is because what you speak is a reflection of what the way your heart feels so even though you're saying i know i know i know what you don't you don't because you keep saying it it'll be if they end up like this it'll be my fault i have to be the one to help them if i don't

do it no like you keep putting that on yourself and it's so important to make sure your language is clear and the facts about this are clear going in. How old are your mom and dad? They are 63. Okay, and your dad just got a new job and they're moving to another state. What's your dad going to be making? $280. $280? $1,000 a year?

Yes. thousand dollars a year yes the reason is my parents have um my grandfather decided that he was going to pay for my um father and my uncle to go through school and so my parents decided that they were going to do that for us so i don't have any debt because of that and i am super super grateful for that and i want to figure out what to do. Wait a minute. I'm sorry. Somewhere I got confused. Stop, stop, stop.

You just went off to another planet. I asked you what your father was going to be making in his new job. Yes, $280,000. And you said $280,000. Yes. And what I need to know is has he always earned an income like that or is this just out of the blue it has been around the 200 000 mark this is this answers the question this answers the question okay stop stop you don't need to do anything you need to look at

your mom and dad and say, I love you. Bye. People that make $300,000 a year and can't figure out a way to have housing aren't your problem. This is asinine, Marie, that you even have the feeling that you have to prepare for the homelessness of someone making $280,000. Your family is dysfunctional. They have dumped some crap on you. And what do you make, by the way, Marie? of someone making $280,000. Your family is dysfunctional. They have dumped some crap on you. And what do you make, by the way, Marie? I bring in $4,000 a month, and my husband brings in $3,600.

Look, look, no, no, no. What in the world, girl? Nope. Your dad makes $280,000, and the two of you together don't make $90,000? And you somehow got that this is your job to prepare for their homelessness? Because they're not going to be making $280,000 indefinitely. Well, no kidding. Once my father is unable to work, they won't have anything built up. Well, that's their fault.

They're not okay with them living with us well that's their fault okay with them living with us that's their fault i'm aware of that let me tell you the number of dollars i'm gonna give this guy zero marie they don't have to live with you look they don't have to live with you if he screws up a 280 000 income and ends up homeless that is not on you it is not on you do not need to do this i don't know what in the world has gotten into you and by the way they're not going to end up homeless it the worst case scenario they're going to be people land on their feet repeatedly yeah they lose everything and get a job at 63 making 300 grand this guy lands on his feet like an alley cat and he's got his daughter over here making 40k

worried about his homelessness yeah this is hey kiddo really you need to sit down and see it you need to see a counselor yeah because this is this is deep stuff you are you are reflecting back weird crap that happened in your house growing up and i don't know what it was but how in the world your mama ends up a travel agent for guilt trips on you is beyond me i mean there is no possible way you end up taking care of these people not in my book nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope dave dad does cocaine so i have to take care of him no you don't well you have to honor your father and your mother the bible says yes we honor the position of fatherhood and motherhood.

We do not honor the use of cocaine. There's two different things. If you misbehave with 280 grand to the point you don't take care of your own household, that is not on your kids. Yeah. It's not. And you know what? I got to say this because I hear it and I heard heard it in her and it has to be addressed there is a

burden that kids grown kids grown adult children face when they see okay your parents they're not doing what they should do and even if you know it's not my job like it's not my responsibility there is a part of guilt that you feel that's like okay that's like okay am i going to be the one that's going to watch them you know go by the wayside am i going to let them live like this and you at some point you have to make peace if you're a kind person people that you love are hurting you it's not it's not fun to watch people you love doing stupid things if you're a kind person if you're a good person. But it doesn't make me happy that people that I love are doing stupid things.

But it also doesn't make me responsible for them. Yeah, you have to make peace with the fact that you're not responsible for adult choices. Henry Cloud has this wonderful book called Boundaries. You need to memorize it. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way, and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer,

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CHM programs start as low as $98 a month. So learn more today and join at chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. Jade Walshall, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us, America. We're glad you are here. Ha! Speaking of Jade, she is going to be doing this Wednesday, August the 9th, a free, free, did I mention it's free, budgeting webcast.

That's pretty cool. It is pretty cool. We're going to talk about all those pain points that people deal with day after day, trying to do their budget, the things keeping people from doing a budget right we're going to talk about that we're going to address it we're going to show you live on the screen how this stuff works using our program every dollar you're going to walk away from it feeling like huh i know what i'm doing now i feel like i got a raise and how to deal with an irregular income yeah Yeah, that's true. An unpredictable income. How do you budget for that?

We're going to show you how to do that with every dollar. We've got a thing called Paycheck Planning that is one of the items in the Robust app that we have. That's a good word. That's a good internet term. Yes, it is. Robust. Robust. It's robust.

It is. It really is. These features will make budgeting, it just makes it a no-brainer it makes it so easy of course a program does all the math for you it helps you decide when is the best day to actually spend the money that you're saying you're going to spend through your budget so that you know no worries we're going to help you with that it's free i will be the person uh guiding you through that and let me tell you these, these classes, they fill up fast. Every time we do these things, they just sell up. So you need to sign up today if you want to reserve a spot.

There you go. Check it out. Everydollar.com slash budgeting this Wednesday, August the 9th. The first webinar is free. Jade will be doing it. We're going to be doing a bunch of these in the coming weeks. I will be letting you know. And you need to get in on this one if you want to learn how to budget with Jade on every dollar. It's good stuff. Things are happening out there. I love it, love it, love it. All right, Aaron is with us in New York City. Hi, Aaron.

Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, how are you guys? Better than we deserve. What's up? Hi. So I have kind of a two part question. So my first question is I recently got engaged and my fiance and I are getting married next June. Congratulations.

Thank you so much. We're looking for an apartment for when we get married, but we are trying to do that without a credit score. Good. So I know, so we've been looking for apartments and some apartments are saying they need credit history or credit scores. And we're just wondering how to do that without credit score. Like what are the steps we need to take in order to get that done? I don't know how prevalent it is in New York city, but in other cities that we've done research where we've actually called, like we'll go and call 20 different apartment complexes, we find that 75 to 80% of them don't require anything. The other 25% may require a credit score or a deposit, an extra deposit.

But if you say, hey, look, we're newly married. These are the jobs. You show them what you've got. You apply for the apartment. they do not solely make the decision to rent an apartment on credit score now i'm not positive in new york city if that's actually true but i'm going to guess and say if the rest of the nation's 75 at least 50 of the apartments there you can do it with again they're looking what a landlord's looking for is can you pay the rent right if you find one that has a brain and you tell them hey i don't have a bad credit score i just don't have a bad credit score i just don't have a credit score and you're able to show them what you earn i do yeah we do make

this much money yeah uh we are getting married and you know this is what we're going to be making as a household we easily can cover this what's your normal deposit we can definitely do that and so on you know and you know but if you find someone that only is going to make the decision on credit score you found a corporate goob okay you know what i'm saying they're they're they got a ball they got a boss in another city somewhere they're not making any decisions they're they're at the very bottom of the food chain and they don't get to make any and somebody's just put in place a random policy you probably don't want to rent any and somebody's just put in place a random policy you probably don't want to rent there anyway that's true that's true okay but you can you can find them

okay cool and thanks for the call man we appreciate it so anthony o'neill that was a ramsay personality yeah sat and uh called it's on youtube and he sat when he was here and called multiple apartment complexes and said hey i'm moving to nashville i'm a single young guy i got no credit score i got a job i can show you my income and they said sure that's fine and this idea that you have to have a credit score to rent an apartment by and large is just false show yeah that's just that's just one of those lies people tell so that they justify going to get a credit card and justify going into buying a car they can't afford, meaning they took out debt on it. Yeah, I mean, the fact is, and we do have to highlight this, sometimes when you choose to have a debt-free lifestyle, the way you're treated is unfair.

Like, it's not fair to say, well, if you don't have a credit score, we're going to make you pay a little bit more first and last month's rent. That's not fair, but sometimes there is a slight price that you pay for choosing to have that debt-free lifestyle. Yeah. I'll give you another example. And this one still ranks, reeks, ranks among the things that reeks. But yeah. So if you have no credit score, you're going to pay, in a lot of cases cases a higher premium on your car and homeowner's insurance you know why because these goobs did a little bitty tiny study in philadelphia or in pennsylvania university of pennsylvania about 20 years ago that showed that people that had no that had bad credit had a higher claims rate on their insurance in the event of a wreck

or in the event of a they had a higher claims rate on their insurance in the event of a wreck or in the event of a they had a higher claims rate on homeowners and on car insurance well no kidding but hello how about you know so i'm worth several hundred million dollars i don't have anything but a big old pile of cash and i'm a higher risk because i got a low credit score well that's dumber than crap of course that's stupid of course i've got a lower claims rate i've got i carry five thousand dollar deductibles on most of my stuff because i can carry that much and keep my cost of my insurance down you know it's just but this just stupid because they took this stupid little tiny study and extrapolated from that now the whole freaking

insurance industry just about which is a bunch of lemmings all following each other off a cliff um they all go and line up and go everyone that doesn't have a credit score now has the equivalent of bad credit and so we're going to charge you more when in reality people don't have a credit score probably have money and are going to have lower if you'd have done a real study a detailed research and the industry accepted that but no what it is freaking insurance companies with an excuse to charge more is what it is now did i get through with my little rent yes i did well when you said rank what did you say it ranks reeking ranks among

things that reek i thought you were going to talk about rental cars. Because they want you to pay credit. Rental cars, they say. Are they charging more? Well, if you use your credit card, they say you have to use a credit card. But if you choose to use a debit card, you're more risky. Oh, yeah. And you end up paying more. Well, you know why?

We found this out when we were. We had Dollar Rent-A-Car for a long time. I remember. We had the Dollar Rent-A-Car Studios back in the day. And Dollar went and did a full thing, and they agreed for a while. Now, they all went broke with the Fauci quarantine. They all lost everything. And they all got the opportunity to go into bankruptcy, right?

So after bankruptcy, they came out, and the new guys running Dollar looked up and went back to the old ways, okay? So we had to not be the dollar studio anymore. So now we're the pod studio, and we're proud of that. Love pods. And they don't take credit cards either, so no, they probably do. But anyway, the dollar told us, the Hertz people told us on the inside that these organized crime guys that steal their cars, and they do it in like thousands of them, and it's almost always in Vegas, always use debit cards.

And it's kind of like the insurance thing. This one person screwing up for all of us. This one little thing. And so they then assume all debit cards because they're so narrow-freaking-minded, they don't understand their own actual data they don't they don't do a decent analysis on their own data to realize a regular country boy with a credit card is not or debit card is not a threat yeah hello wow but um now the goobers but yeah that's that's exactly what it is yeah exactly where it came from was organized crime using debit cards to steal cars in ve. And that's where the whole industry pulled the thing from.

Interesting. They used, again, bad research, bad data leads to, or bad analysis of good data leads to bad problems. Good problem. Crazy. It reeks. It ranks. Crazy, crazy, crazy.

Yeah. It's not good. This is The ramsey show jade washall ramsey personalities my co-host today in the lobby of ramsey solutions on the debt-free stage brad and britney are with us hey guys how are you good how's it going better than we deserve where do y'all live uh fisher's indiana which is near about 20 minutes north of indianapolis indy okay welcome to nashville good to have you and how much debt have you guys paid off 277 000 how long did this take about four years good you. And your range of income during that time? Started out at $230,000 and then went up to $300,000 combined plus bonuses.

Way to go. What do you all do for a living? I'm a sales manager for a medical device company. And I am in sales as well and medical as well. Okay, wow. Well, you guys are killing it. Way to go. So what kind of debt was your $277,000?

It was our mortgage. Let's go! Looking at weird people. Really weird. I love it. What's this house worth? Anywhere between, I would say, $550,000 and $600,000. Let's go. How much in your retirement accounts?

It's getting close to a million, Dave. Hey! In there alone? No, no, no. So about $500,000 there, too? Yeah, a little over a million, Dave. Hey! In there alone? No, no, no. So about 500 there, too? Yeah, a little over 500. Okay, so you're a million-dollar net worth. Yes.

Baby steps millionaire. Yes. Let's go! Way to go! Ding, ding. Two wins on the day. I like it. Absolutely.

How old are you two? I'm 38. 37. Come on! I got two young kiddos here that are a part of it. Love it. Love it. Love it.

Man. Oh, man. Oh, man. So did you guys grow up rich? No, we did not. No, we did not. How much did you inherit? None.

None. So you just gutted this out. Absolutely. Which is, by the way, how most people do it. By the way, I shouldn't know. Way to go, guys. Way to go guys yeah we grew up with uh two hard-working families that instilled good values and worked very hard their whole life would give anybody the shirt off their

back but we uh learned that and learned that we needed to really uh get down and and work hard to be able to accomplish what we do you know the best gift you can give your kids is teach them where money comes from. Absolutely. Work. Absolutely. Teach them to work. Send them to the salt mines early. Oh, my gosh.

I'm kidding. I'm kidding, kids. It's okay. Joking. Grandpa joke. We learned at a really early age your common sense principles from our parents and Stodeman and us as well, too. Okay.

They had common sense before it was cool. Absolutely. You guys, awesomeness? Tell us about this. Four years ago, what happened? How long y'all been married? This be 12 years, 12 years. Okay, so four years ago, you say the mortgage is going down. Tell us about it. Yeah. So I'll tell you two stories, Dave. Two quick ones are our journey first started when I was at my previous organization. I was coming home from a sales training module or sales training meeting. And Mandy Hall, who's actually listening here today, I was talking to her about paying off our student loan debt and how long it was going to take, which was between the both of us was $70,000. This was about 15 years ago. And she introduced me to Dave Ramsey and the Total Money Makeover. And I think in four days, we both read the book.

And then translation 13 months later, we were consumer debt free, student debt free. Boom. That was the do nothing, didn't go out to eat. Yep. All hands on deck. So then we kind of went ish for a little while and kind of trying to figure out where to go, not really truly figuring out four, five and six yet then we built the house and in october of 2019 we kind of looked at each other and said why do we still have this like we don't have any other debt the mortgage yes and we were on a 30-year fixed at the time then when covet hit we've refinanced into a 15 and we just really cranked it out from there from then on out and really just started chunking all of our bonuses on there started six months before covid six months and then when the quarantine hits boom you're game

on game on because medical device y'all kept working absolutely you were essential yeah there was a period of time we were at home for a little while but we did get back out there pretty quickly as well that's really great i'm just the fact that you guys are 37 and 38 years old, paid for home, millionaires, what do you say to that other person who's your age, but they're still deeply in debt? They've still, you know, maybe they haven't even bought a home yet. What would you say to them? So I would say, I have a mentor that is at my company and he always says, play the long ball. And I do feel that with us. We're playing the long ball um and being patient which is really a reflective because I it's hard for me to be patient him not so much so um play the long ball and being patient is my advice because it's

easy to get caught up in the wants especially what I call the blackout period of two young kids a house you know you're just you're in the thick of it and it's hard to feel like you can catch your breath. Yeah, I know that's right. And all spending is justified in the blackout period. Absolutely. Not, but we act that way, right? Yeah, you're right. I like that. That's a good, I like that. I've never heard that phrase put that way, but that's good. So, you know, and Dave, I said like, we always had a goal of being debt-free, completely debt-free. And for me, it wasn't necessarily about the wealth journey. It was about the freedom to choose.

And you said something. I saw you live, and I think it was either Carmel or Fishers, Indiana a while back. And the story that you said was like if you walk into your job and you've got no payments and your boss is a jerk, you can just turn around and walk away. And when he yells at you, you can say, I've got no payments and your boss is a jerk, you can just turn around and walk away. And when he yells at you, you can say, I got no payments. And I walked out of that presentation and I said, I want that ability to make that choice. I want that choice and that autonomy. And I love my job. I love my boss. So I don't want to quit or do anything, but I love having that ability and that freedom

to make that choice if we need to. You know, the weird thing is, is when you can quit, A, you usually don't want to and b you you kind of walk different and so they treat you different absolutely it's like i don't walk like a victim you know and it's it's it changes your body language it does it changes everything you're gonna be a whole lot better at sales now i mean it's gonna be incredible because you got nothing you got this now it's just a game yep there's no there's no need it's just a game it's fun absolutely and uh yeah i mean i was contacting the president of a major company uh last week about us doing business and they just emailed back and told me to pound sand and it's just a game it's just a game right and it's just fun it was fun that happened at the last commercial break yeah but i mean it's just fun. It was fun. That happened at the last commercial break. That's fresh.

Whatever. You know, next. Right? It's hilarious. Very cool, you guys. How does it feel to be millionaires at 37? Freedom. And debt free.

Grass feels different. And that's what I'm saying. The grass does feel different when you pay your house off and you walk outside bare feet. So your advice is play the long game. If someone says, how do you get out of debt? Is that the advice or is there something set a goal set a goal and go after it yeah so and and then also to like i mean we wouldn't have been able to accomplish this if we weren't on the same page i mean we've all we've throughout our entire journey through the student loan crisis that we had and then you know paying off our mortgage we had an we had a goal the

entire time i'm curious about that that's a really good point and you know most everybody says that um and it's true um now you guys you were on the same page we read the book both of us 48 hours 13 months boom we knock it out mic drop we're done with that debt and then we went a little ish when you decided to go game on again were both of you on the same page still he had a lot of come to jesus moments with me because we were so extreme and that was pre-kids and i was like i want to be able to give them experiences still be able to live while we're getting air quotes yes and he's like britney no we can do this let's stay focused and we still that's why i think we would have done it a lot sooner we still what i would say we took the kids on a trip. You're supposed to. Yeah. By the way, baby step six is not intense.

It's intentional. I mean, Dave, we got couches in our house that are 20 years old and she's just itching to replace them. Thank you.

You tell him. It's time, Brad. Give Brittany a couch. You're a millionaire. If you knew. Come on, man. It's been years of me asking. So basically,

you're leaving here to go buy a new couch. That's it. More than that. On the way home. Hey, we've got the live and give bundle for you. Most of it's going to be give for you guys, a total money makeover book, an extra one, a financial peace membership, and of course, the Baby Steps Millionaires book.

You are Baby Steps Millionaires. So proud of you. Bring the kiddos up. Let's introduce them, get their ages, and do our debt-free scream. What are their names and ages this is kate who is eight and this is jake who is six i love that you're ready way to go you guys all right 277 000 paid off house and everything that makes them baby steps millionaires at 37 38 years. Did it in four years, making $230,000 to $300,000. Count it down. Let's hear a debt-free scream.

Count it down. Three, two, one. We're debt-free! Yeah! Wow! Wow! Hey, those little kids right there, their whole lives are changed.

I know, that's right. Their kids' lives are changed. That's called, that sound you heard, those little kids right there, their whole lives are changed. I know, that's right. Their kids' lives are changed. That's called, that sound you heard, those little kids screaming? That's the sound of a family tree changed. That's it. Those people are heroes. Very cool. Good stuff.

This is The Ramsey Show. Our Scripture of the Day, Proverbs 9, 10. Fear of the Lord is the foundation of wisdom. Knowledge of the Holy One results in good judgment. Ralph Waldo Emerson said, The invariable mark of wisdom is to see the miraculous in the common. I like it. Linda is in Los Angeles.

Hi, Linda. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thank you so Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave. Thank you so much for taking my call. How are you? Better than we deserve. How can we help? Okay, my question is twofold. First, I'm interested in paying off my mortgage,

but I'm wondering if it makes sense to do that if I know that later on down the line I'm going to sell the property. Yes. And then the other part is when I do get ready to sell it, am I going to have a problem because the property is inside of the living trust? And my husband passed away. The loan was in his name. So now the loan is in the estate of his name, but the trust is in both of our names. So will I have a problem selling it if the deed is not going to be coming in my name,

but it's going to come in his name? The deed will come from the trust. The trust is the owner of the property, and the trust will sign for the deed. Who is the trustee on the trust? I am. You're the beneficiary. I'm the beneficiary. I'm the trustee. I believe it says I'm the trustor, the trustee, and the beneficiary since he passed. You're all three?

I was the trustor, yes. Okay. since he passed you're all three i was doing trust or yes okay um in most states that can't be but it could be in california i don't know i'm not an attorney okay oh but usually you can't be the trustee and the beneficiary on a trust typically like a conflict of interest huh yeah usually oh typically that doesn't but it but it could be i'm not i'm not an attorney okay but either way a trust is an entity and the trust is the owner of the property and the trust will transfer the deed to the buyer and the trustee will sign the deed on behalf of the trust okay and it doesn't matter that... The mortgage has nothing to do with it.

Oh, okay. Yeah, the ownership is in the deed, the warranty deed. The mortgage is just a lien on the property. And if the mortgage is paid off or not paid off, it doesn't matter. The mortgage would get paid off in the event of a sale, obviously, or if you have paid it off earlier, which is what I'm going to recommend you do, go ahead and pay it off. Okay. And then you're free to make decisions because you're not losing the money

when you pay it off. You get the money out when you sell the house, right? Yes. It's not like the money's evaporating. We're just investing into the – we don't have any debt payments anymore. And then when you know and so you might want to follow back up with the attorney that did the living trust with just a phone call and go hey pull this file up i'm a little confused uh exactly who signs the deed am i the trustee and

the beneficiary is that how this works and ask him uh just or her just to be sure what you've gotten yourself into there it's not a big deal though it's not a problem i mean i had we had a our last residence uh our current one isn't but our last one was in a trust and uh my wife was the trustee and um i was the beneficiary meaning she was in control hello that's what that means okay but yeah we sold that property and she signed the deed it wasn't a problem on behalf of the trust but neither one of us personally were the owner anymore so you don't own the property anymore the trust owns the property

got it okay okay okay thank you i'm an attorney, but everything I told you is just right. Double-check it with your attorney, okay? Okay. Yeah, and pay off your house. Good question. Tom is in Philadelphia. Hey, Tom, what's up? Hey, gang, thanks for taking my call.

I appreciate it. Sure. How can we help? I'm married 14 years to my wife. We have two young kids, and it has recently come to my attention that she is very unhappy in the marriage. She thinks that we have been hyper-focused on retirement and investing for retirement and we're missing out on today as we plan for tomorrow. So I can give you a quick breakdown of our numbers, what the portfolio looks like. The main question is, do we sell a two-unit rental property that we have, which would, for the most part, eradicate

all of our debts with the exception of our mortgage, and give us much more latitude to do the things that she wants to do that, frankly speaking, I happen to be in agreement with after sitting down and talking about it. I feel like we're missing out on too much what is your net worth well let's see we have an eight hundred thousand dollar house with a three hundred and forty thousand dollar mortgage at 2.7%. Okay, that's 500K. What's the rest of your net worth? We have $100,000 in a home equity line of credit.

We have $30,000 in credit card debt. What do you have in investments, Tom? We have a two-unit rental property, which is paid off. It's worth what? What's it worth? Between two 50 and two 80. Okay. All right.

We have 500,000 in 401k. We've got 50,000 in a Roth IRA. And we have a second rental property that we just bought last year, which we still have a mortgage on that for about $180,000. What will it bring if you sold it? I'm sorry, say that again? What would it bring if you sold it?

About the same, about $250,000 to $280,000, somewhere in that range. We also have $25,000 just sitting in liquid funds, $10,000 in a checking account, another $15,000 in a five-year degree. Okay, so she's suggesting, what do you make? Combined, we make $200,000. Okay. She's suggesting that you clean up some of the chaos and enjoy some of the fruits of your labor. I mean, if we sold the two unit like i said and you sold the other house you're not making money on the one you just bought's

not going to cash flow because you got no equity in it right well i mean it's just it's a bigger problem than it is a blessing i love real estate i don't like that house with what you owe on it okay so i'd sell both rentals and i'd clean up the mess and be debt free and let's put yourself on a written budget that you and your wife agree to that includes enjoyment that's what i needed to hear yeah yeah debt 100 percent debt 100 percent debt free 100 percent debt free no rent $200,000 a year, and you can put enjoyment in your budget and still become very wealthy. There's no reason you can't do both. You've got the numbers to do both.

Right, right. But the hyper-focus is like she doesn't feel like she's got a vote in this process, and if y'all will start doing a monthly budget where she has a vote in that'll help uh the marriage discussion too yeah right so you're a you're a go-getter numbers guy am i right you are right yeah and how old are you i'm 46 she's 40 yeah okay so when i was in my 20s i was the go-getter numbers guy, and we owned real estate my wife never even knew about. Not because I hid it from her, but I didn't need her opinion. Yeah.

And you know what? You know what? She says that's the worst seven years of our marriage, until I went broke because I was stupid. And then when we started working together, we had a lot better marriage, and my success rate on investments went way up, because it turns out she's got a good common sense. Yeah. It feels like she's kind of just along for the ride, but she's not getting to participate.

She needs a vote. And when she gets a vote and then she says, hey, I want to build wealth and go on vacation, your life's getting ready to be amazing. And you can do both man yeah i'd clean up these little rentals and clean up use a rental i'm with you i think you got a good plan tom and i love that you love your wife so much that you love her more than your plan your old plan and so you're going to turn away from the hyper thing and knock it out i like it man you're a good guy yeah that's good you love your. You're willing to abandon your former game plan and develop a new one to hit her.

But also, you don't have to completely abandon the goal of being responsible and of building wealth. I think you can do both. Absolutely. And you'll be amazed. Jump on every dollar and start using the every dollar budget. And the two of you doing your budget together, you're going to love this. You really are. It's pretty cool.

That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. Austin, Ben, James, Zach, and Andrew in the booth. The booth dudes doing the show. Jade Walsh, all Ramsey personality. Good work today. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. Hey, what's up guys?

It's Jade. Look, if you like what you heard in this episode and want to know more about getting started on the Ramsey Baby Steps, go to ramseysolutions.com and click the Get Started button. We'll help you figure out the best next step for you based on your specific situation. That's ramseysolutions.com and click Get Started.