Live Like a Girl with Dr. Mindy Pelz - Gabby Bernstein on Self-Healing with Internal Family Systems (IFS)

Episode Date: February 10, 2025

Gabby Bernstein introduces how to use Internal Family Systems (IFS) as an effective tool during mid-life and menopause. Gabby explains IFS as a therapeutic model that identifies and befriends "protector parts" that emerged from childhood traumas. She describes a four-step process: choosing to check in, becoming curious, compassionately connecting, and checking for self qualities. This episode is for anyone who is ready to engage in meaningful self-exploration and transformation. Chapters: Chapters: 0:00 Who is Gabby Berstein? 4:09 Gabby's Personal Experience with IFS 8:46 Explaining IFS 16:25 Identifying and Addressing "Protector Parts" 22:21 Practical Application of the Four-Step Process 27:21 The Role of "Self" in IFS 32:21 Navigating Menopause with IFS 37:11 Real-Life Application of IFS 41:09 The Power of Self-Help and IFS To view full show notes, more information on our guests, resources mentioned in the episode, discount codes, transcripts, and more, visit https://drmindypelz.com/ep274 Gabby Bernstein, a #1 New York Times bestselling author, has been helping people for over eighteen years. Her books, like Self Help, The Universe Has Your Back, Super Attractor, and Happy Days, have been featured on Oprah's SuperSoul Sunday and the New York Times. Gabby is a regular on popular media outlets and launched the gabby coaching app in 2023. Her weekly podcast, Dear Gabby, gives real-time coaching and talks about personal growth and spirituality. Gabby started with intimate conversations in New York City, but now she speaks to tens of thousands of people in sold-out venues all over the world. Check out gabbybernstein.com for more! Check out our fasting membership at resetacademy.drmindypelz.com. Please note our medical disclaimer.

On this episode of The Resetter podcast, I bring you New York Times bestselling author Gabby Bernstein, who has, by the way, authored 10 books, which I can tell you as somebody who writes book that is, I am in awe of how prolific this woman's mind is. And her most recent book is called Self-Help. And it is a book about internal family systems. And this, if you have not heard of IFS, if you have not experienced what internal family systems is, I think you're going to really enjoy this conversation. I personally, and you'll hear it in this podcast, I personally was introduced to IFS through my breathworker. And we started talking after one breathworking session about parts and how we develop parts of our personalities that have adapted to traumas, sometimes little traumas, sometimes big traumas.

And those adaptations, even though the trauma is long over, we are still operating from those adaptive parts of our personality. And through the work of my breath worker, through some of the work I've been doing with my therapist, we started to just scratch the surface of identifying some of these parts in my life. And it was remarkably helpful. And this is why I really wanted to bring Gabby and her new book to you. Because what Gabby has done is she has taken internal family systems and brought it down to a layperson level. And what you're going to hear in this interview is what IFS is, how you can use it. Gabby's come up with a four-step process.

So this is a very action-oriented podcast. And so she's going to explain how you use these four steps to identify the parts of your personality that you may have been living with that maybe you need to encourage these parts to take a little rest for a while. and how do you move through life loving these parts, connecting to these parts, and using these parts for good. So it's a really cool conversation. Gabby has become a beautiful friend, a fellow Hayhouse author. We have discussed at several Hayhouse events. Her own personal health have had some really insightful discussions with this beautiful woman. And I'm really excited about this book. I bring you guys.

a lot of authors, I bring you a lot of books, and every once in a while, one just really hits me right in my own self-discovery spot. And self-help, Gabby Bernstein's new book, did exactly that. So you're going to hear how you can use this. You're going to watch her do a session with me, and she will teach you how she uses this. So it's really dense as far as the information you're going to gather, but more importantly, you should be able to leave this podcast and identify these parts in yourself. So Gabby Bernstein, her new book is called Self-Help. We will leave links for it. I highly recommend you run out and get it. And I hope that you find peace. I hope that you find the next clue to your personal expansion in this interview, because this was a real gem.

So Gabby Bernstein, self-help and internal family systems, enjoy. Welcome to the Resetter podcast. This podcast is all about empowering you to believe in yourself again. If you have a passion for learning, if you're looking to be in control of your health and take your power back, this is the podcast for you. I just, I have to start by just welcoming you, Gabby, to my podcast. podcast. I feel like you and I've had so many fun conversations, but we've never had like formal conversations about each other's work. So I am, I'm just so geeking out on this new book. And I'm so excited to have you. So welcome to the Resetter podcast. It's so good to be with you. And it's also so

nice for me to be able to look you in the eye and tell you that you were probably five months ahead of my perimenopause melt of my peri menopause shakedown. And I remember, I remember, when you asked me, do you still get a period? And I was offended. And five months later, here I was, and I was like full-blown in it to win it, like menopausal numbers, like, shakedown. And I was like, oh my God, she was so right. Yeah. Welcome. Welcome. And I'm here, and I'm on HRT, and I'm lifting my weights and eating my protein, just like you told me to do. And I'm feeling fabulous after having lost my mind for several months. And I'm back. I'm alive. We've survived.

Well, at least it's only for several months. I mean, some people lose their mind for like the whole 10-year journey. So you're ahead of the game. Well, what I realized, I think I was in peri menopause at 35 and then I turned 45 and I'm like in menopausal numbers. So I think I didn't know actually that I was in Perry for so long. But here we are. Yeah.

I made it. I survived. Well, as we were talking about before we hit record, have been on my own emotional healing journey for about, you know, three years. I've always been involved in just that growth. mindset, but literally the last three years, I was like, okay, girl, time to buckle up and deal with traumas, deal with thought patterns. And so I've been deep down many paths. And one of the paths was with my breath worker. She brought up this idea of parts. And she was like, have you

heard, Mindy of IFS? I think the way you're operating is from different adaptations and parts. and she introduced the concept to me and it blew my mind. And I've been geeking out on it ever since. So how about we start with, can you explain to us what IFS is? And maybe give us like an intro to this parts theory because this is so helpful. Yeah, I mean, that's actually what the whole book is about. The whole book is an introduction to IFS and it's a self-help practice based on the principles of a world-manon therapy called internal family systems therapy. And just to back it up a little bit, I had been practicing IFS with my own therapist for now about

10 years, seven years with one therapist and now with a new one. And I didn't know that I was doing IFS. I was just doing this work where she would have me connect to these parts inside. And one afternoon in 2020, I was watching this video on YouTube and it was with an interview with the founder of this therapy called Internal Family Systems Therapy, Dr. Richard Schwartz. And I'm watching Dick in the interview and I'm like, holy shit, that's what I've been doing for my therapy all this time. And the way he described it just sort of felt like the puzzle pieces fell into place for me. And then I read every one of his books. I watched every video. And in 2021, I had him on my podcast. He was the third interview I ever had on my podcast. And on that

podcast, I said to him, you know, this work has changed me so much that I know psychically that I'm here to share it with my audiences and democratize it and bring it out to the world. And he said, I have a feeling that's true and that you will do that. And he suggested that I go on and get the training to become trained in the model. And this was at a time when non-therapists could still qualify for the training now you can't. And so I was one of the few people in my training that was not a therapist. And I did hundreds of hours of training. So level one and level two and went on to become an IFS practitioner. But as you know, I'm one to many, not one-to-one. And I'm not a therapist or a one-to-one coach. And so it was my calling to bring this out.

into the world in a way that could be self-help. And as Dick Schwartz says, in the forward of the book, he later on became a very dear friend of mine and my mentor and my brother. And in the forward, he says that he'd always dreamed of somebody with both spiritual and self-help bona fides to be able to bring this kind of work, his work, into the world in a self-help way safely, and that this book is doing that. And so this is the biggest privilege for me to be able to take this work that someone who I cherish so deeply has created and then demystify it, simplify it, and make it into a self-help tool. Yeah, some of these masters who have started these incredible concepts, they aren't the ones to necessarily bring it to the masses. And to your point, you know, when you have

the public platform you have and you have the ability to write amazing books like this, which, by the way, the book is, I devoured it. Like, I got it two days ago. And it was so, like I just read it, but the next thing I know is like 24 hours later and I had finished the book. I was like, it was such, so easy to read. Your stories were great. Like, it's, I really like it from that angle. Thank you. I agree with you. And I think that, I think that the, the thesis that sometimes, the reality here was that this is a therapeutic model that costs money to go get that therapy. There aren't, they're consistently trying to train as many therapists. So there's a lot of people out in the world like you're, breath worker who's IFS informed, but not trained in IFS. That's a big difference, right? And so not a lot of people are going to get access to it. They may not afford it. They may not ever really

want to go get therapy, but they may be willing to open a self-help book. And so the gift here is that I can have this opportunity to really share it in a much, much different way to audiences that may not ever have found their way to IFS. And then, of course, there's the folks like yourself who have experienced IFS that can take it further with this type of practice because now you can practice it on yourself safely. Right. I got that in your book is really good that it is a very, you can read it and then put it into action immediately. So agreed. Immediately. And so I'll kind to describe to you what IFS is in the Gabby terms and Gabby's and Gabby's layman terms. So we all have these extreme behaviors, patterns, maybe addictive behaviors, belief systems,

that drive our lives that can oftentimes feel like they're the driving force of our lives. And maybe we've said things like, oh, when I'm activated by my husband, a part of me takes over and I become something different. Or maybe we say that a part of me freaks out when my team doesn't do XYZ, or a part of me gets really shy in social settings, and a part of me wants to people please every time I don't feel good enough. And we may have some awareness of these aspects of ourselves. And they, if you ever asked yourself, like, how long of those parts of me been around, it's likely they'd say forever, right, for as long as I can remember since I was four years old or forever. And these parts of us that oftentimes seem like they're extreme or addicted or, or sort of shameful are actually protection mechanisms. And in IFS, they're called protector parts. And they've been around for a long time. They're very, very young. parts of us. And if you were to get a little bit more close to them, you'd ask, well, what are these, who are these protector parts protecting? And these protection mechanisms that we live with all

day and every day, protector parts, are protecting these very young, exiled, wounded child parts of us. And as children, we all experienced some form of trauma with a big tea or a small tea. Maybe we experienced being bullied as a kid or, you said earlier, nobody listened to me, so I want to speak so loudly, that was, you know, definitely a part. Or we had big T trauma, like in my case, I experienced abuse and so much so that I didn't even remember it until I was in my late 30s and neglect and big T trauma. And so we have these small T's, these big T's, but they were trauma nevertheless. And in those experiences as little children having these very extreme experiences, big or small, we felt terror, we felt fear, we felt shame, we felt unlovable,

we felt inadequate, not good enough. And in those extreme feelings, we didn't know how to process them, and we didn't have an adult caregiver to help us process them. So we did whatever we could to shut them down from the very, very, very young ages. So little Mindy, maybe she didn't feel like she was being heard. So she started screaming at a young age, right? I'm just putting that. Maybe that's how good. Yeah, you know me well. But I know you well, baby. I know you well. Well, I mean, I have a familiar part. I have a familiar part. Little Gabby felt so out of control in her life that she was really hypervigilant from a very young age, very anxious. Her stomach was in knots. She was trying to control every single thing in her life, which she still has manifested as an adult and is finally unburdening that part of myself now. Interesting. And so these little exiled parts, the traumatized parts, we're not working with those guys. Those guys can be definitely tended to in trauma therapy, with IFS therapy. But what we're going to work with in this book are the protection mechanisms, are those protector parts that are really running the show, Mindy, right? They're like, the controller in my life

has like really runs the show. She shows up all throughout the day. She's gotten so much softer in the last 48 hours even. But I've been working really, really deeply with her. I really, really support her. The controller became so extreme at times of my life that she turned to drugs and she became an addict,

a cocaine addict, right? And then, you know, there's other parts of us that people might define as like the people-pleaser or the shy part or the perfection part or the part of us that's anxious or the part of us that's hypervigilant. And maybe you might not identify these parts of yourself, but you can identify beliefs that you have. Maybe you're like, you know, I don't believe I'm worthy of this, or I believe I can't attract love, or I believe that I'll never make money. Or maybe you can't even identify a belief or a pattern, but you can

identify a feeling. Like, I always feel afraid, or I always feel worried, or I always feel anxious. These are parts of us. And so what do we do with these protection mechanisms? What do we do with them? Well, in the book, I've created a four-step process for befriending these parts of ourselves and offering them the care that they need so that they can soften. And in doing so, this is the big part. In this process, as you witness these parts, there's a beautiful quote in the book from a therapist and IFS therapist called Stephen Kranz, and he wrote, this quote that says that self is like the sun behind the clouds and that when the clouds the clouds are the protectors blocking self and when you start to befriend to these protector parts they can soften and they can really release and dissipate and then the sun can emerge naturally and the sun is our self it's our undamaged resourced calm compassionate creative courageous all these sea qualities clear

committed, confident self. And it's kind of like the God within us or the love within us or the Buddha nature or the spirit and the inspiration. It's the creative force. It's the flow state. It's what we want to access on our meditation pillow. And self is always there. Right. We just have to release and help these protectors calm. Love that. So that self can emerge naturally. Which is why the book is called self-help. That self-energy is waiting inside of us to help these protection mechanisms feel safe, and in doing so, these protection mechanisms start to relax, and as they relax, our most natural, healthy, childlike, abundant, joyful, free, creative, calm, confident, courageous self begins to emerge, and our life begins to feel free. And how, so the

biggest question I have when I hear that beautiful description is how do you figure out who these parts are? And, you know, I will tell you where it came up in my breathwork and it came up in my therapy was a message or a part of my upbringing because, and you say this in the book, and I think this is really interesting. I had a very wonderful childhood. Like, I had very loving parents. I didn't have any, you know, big traumas that I can think about. But there was an underlining message that my mom gave me, which was, well, she would always tell me that I was her favorite, which is really lame. No mother should ever tell their daughter that they're the favorite because then that set up this part of me that always needs to be the favorite because

I attached the favorite to mother's love. And once I got a whole, hold of that, I realized, oh my God, like, how exhausting has that been my whole life? Yeah, yeah. To be the favorite was the protector, right? I got to be the favorite to stay safe, to stay loved. Yeah, beautiful. Yeah. And so how do we identify these parts? Well, really, if you've ever looked at a pattern or behavior that you've felt is undesirable in your life and you've judged it or you've shamed it or you've been like, oh, why do I keep going back to the refrigerator and every time I get upset or why do I keep picking up a drink or why do I keep, you know, just, you know, excessively calling that guy that I know isn't good for me or whatever that

might be. You can look at that pattern of behavior and see that as a protector. If you've ever noticed that there's a belief system that is in the way of, you can even find your protectors by seeing, okay, what do I want to attract into my life? What do I want to manifest? We kind of all know that, right? Right. And then the next question could be, well, what's the belief that's blocking?

it. That's a protector. Yeah, that's a protector. Or what's the behavior that's blocking it? And even if you can't get to those kinds of things, you could even say, what feelings do I have, right? Do I have a lot of anxiety? Do I live with a lot of fear? Am I constantly hypervigilant? And that's a protector. So it's feelings. And then for your crowd, this is really valuable. Even physical pain. There's a whole chapter in the book called body parts. I read that. And it's really based on a lot of the John Sarno work, about how our physical pain, gastro, headaches, back pain, neck pain, can often be the effects of a psychosomatic condition, which really, if we have repressed rage or if we've got these exiles that we're trying to keep down, these young, these young really terrified parts,

sometimes we'll even project our pain onto our body so that we don't have to actually feel that impermissible pain from the past. And so that doesn't mean that you're actually not having the physical condition because you may still have. Remember, Deepak said this to me once. You know, you could line up 40 men all the same age, all the same build, all the same health, and they all have the same herniated disc. Half of them will feel the pain and the other half won't. And the half that feel it are the ones that have impermissible rage that they're just trying to avoid.

And they're projecting that pain onto the back. And so read that chapter, if they're. This is something that's curious. I did. Read the whole, yeah. Not you, but like the audience, yeah. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Everybody should because you tell the story about your husband, which is fascinating.

I love how you tell it. You're like, do I not put it in the book? Do I put it in the book? I think it's the author's, you know, dilemma always. But I do think if we just put it in the context of health in general, that what I've discovered after working with so many people is that, yes, you can teach somebody to eat different. You can teach them to exercise different, fast different. You can give them a bazillion supplements. But at the end of the day, that doesn't guarantee they're going to get well. And

whenever I would get to that place of like somebody's being stuck, I had this internal hunch of there is some deeper reason here as to why this body, I don't think it's because it's not conscious, but why this body's staying stuck. And I became obsessed with body keeps the score. And he references Bessel is friends with Dick Schwartz, and he references IFS throughout the book, yeah. Yeah. And so I think there's something really interesting about the underlining subconscious part of what you're saying. And what I'd love to do is you, in the book, you have a four-step process. You alluded to this. So can you take us through like an example of somebody who gets stuck either in their thinking or stuck with their health and how they would see this all. the way through. Yeah. Would you like to be the example? Sure. I can be the example. Are you comfortable doing that? Of course. Yeah. You can pick a part that I think this is actually really good for the listener, too. Don't dive into the most deepest part of you. Work with something that's just sort of

commonly around and, you know, if it feels safe to connect to. And we're not going to the exiles. We're not going to the traumatized little children. We're going to the patterns, the behaviors, and the beliefs that are sort of running the show. Okay. Okay. So is there a protector that's still present for you that's kind of running the show for you? Well, one that I'll be really open. One that came up in my therapy yesterday is not the fear of upsetting people I love. There is a deep-seated fear that I, even when I need to stand up for my own self, if it's going to hurt those that I love, it's really difficult for me. I get that. Okay. Nice one. Okay. So the first step is to choose to check in. and this is the step of recognizing, okay, that fear of disappointing people or the people that I love

is present. And so typically maybe what you might do, and this is just giving the example, it's not necessarily you, but one might check out when they feel that feeling or feel that fear or notice that. They want to check out, right? And so in a case like this, maybe one would, you know, people please or override themselves or do something to not feel that feeling. So they'll Normally we would check out. In this case, instead of checking out, we're going to choose to check in. So in the case of the person that's about to go binge, you know, instead of opening the refrigerator and binging, you would check in. Or maybe midway through and your head's in the refrigerator, you're going to check in. Okay. You're about to go rage on somebody. Let's check in. Or you did

rage on somebody. Go check in afterwards. Okay. So it's instead of checking out, you check in. So there's times when we want to dissociate, go back to YouTube, whatever, check in. Step one. And so the step one we've already done because you've chosen. to check in with this part and is really getting buy-in from that part of yourself. Like, yeah, okay, let's take a look. And so, you got the buy-in? We got the buy-in? Yeah, absolutely.

Yep. Okay, step one is done. We've chose. And so step one, choosing to check in, Mindy, focusing your attention inward. And if you feel comfortable, you might want to close your eyes, giving yourself a little bit of more of an experience inside. Okay. And so just checking in, focusing your attention inward instead of checking out.

That was the first step. Now, the second step is to become curious about. this part. And so, Mindy, you can answer the questions out loud to the extent that you feel comfortable. Now, focusing your attention towards this part, where do you notice it in your body? Oh, it's in my gut. Your gut, yeah, yeah. And is there any imagery or sensations physically that you might have connected to it? It feels like a strangling, like somebody's gripping me. A gripping and a strangling. Excellent. Okay. And then is there any thoughts or sensations or or emotions attached to it?

You know the word I keep using is it's just, I feel yucky and nauseous. Okay, good, yeah. Nauseous, yucky. You have a lot of access to this part. It's beautiful. Now, is there an age connected? How old is this part? Yeah, it's early, like three or four.

Yep, very young. Okay. Is there anything else, any other images or sensations or visuals or thoughts attached to it beliefs that you want us to know, that it wants us to know? Well, one of the things just that came up, and I don't know if I'm stepping ahead, but was when I was in my mom's womb at three months old, her father died. And I have an innate sense, and I've worked on hypnotherapy and timeline work and things like that to understand if I came into this world to take care of her. Yeah, beautiful. Her father adored her.

and she lost him while I was being formed. And I feel like that might have been some kind of agreement I came into to take care of her and never let her hurt. Well, you've done so much work, so you have so much access to that. So that's beautiful. Yeah, so that connection is there too. Beautiful. Now, with a lot of that connection that we have access to, you feel connected now.

I can tell. You don't even have to tell me. I know you are. The third step is to compassionately. connect to this part of you by asking the part. That part is exhausted. That part needs to stop doing its job. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. It's just, it's hit a wall. And part of the challenge is my own menopausal journey. I've stepped into a new empowered place where I'm no longer, taking care of everybody. I'm no longer taking, being responsible for everybody's happiness. And that has caused some challenges in very close relationships in my life because that part is exhausted. And she doesn't want to play the part anymore. She wants to stop playing the part. She wants

to rest. Yeah. Yeah. Now, can you give her a little bit of breath right now? I'm calling her her because you did. Sometimes these parts have genders or sometimes they don't. So can you give her a little bit of breath? Like, place your hand on your heart, your hand on your belly where you feel her and breathe into her for a moment. And just let her know that you heard that she needs rest and let it go. And now check in and we're going to check for the sea qualities of self. How do you feel now, Mindy? Yeah, I would say just by acknowledging her. her and checking in on her, I could feel a little bit, a little bit like the hold in my gut. That strangling feeling feels a little bit softer. A little calmer. Yeah, I feel like if she could speak

right now, she would say thank you for recognizing me. Connected. So she feels connected to you. There you go. Yeah. Do you have more clarity about her? Well, it's interesting because this sort of just showed up yesterday in therapy, and I realized how insidious it is. You know, it's just she adapts over and over and over again. She puts everybody's needs ahead of her own so that everybody can be happy, and she takes everybody's pain on her own shoulders. And yeah, I mean, it's vast. It's in a lot of relationships. Can you let her know something right now? because we have some access to her,

you're connected to her right now. Yeah. You feel a little bit, like a slight molecule of calmness has come over you. So that's self, right? Yeah, yeah. Can you let her know

that you now know she's here? Mm. And maybe you want to let her know that you have these tools now. You've got the four steps and that you can maybe make a commitment to her to check in a little bit more often. Yeah, how does she...

I mean... How does she get my attention? And the other thing that I would say is sort of coming up for me is she's angry. That's another part. Oh, it's a different part. Okay. Yeah. But she can be angry.

She can be angry. There's a lot of aspects to all these parts, right? So that part can have anger, right? And also anger can be another part that's coming up. Because when we start to phase into these parts of us, these other parts, start to come in. So it's a lot of different emotions at once. Got it. I would like to say that you did the process perfectly, and there's no right or way, as long as you're following the steps. Because when you follow those steps, you will experience

a molecule or more of self. Got it. And so the celebration here is that you had a little connection. Right. And the celebration is that the belly softened a little bit. Yes. And that there was a little bit more clarity about what she needs and that she's there. And that she actually felt connected to you, which is huge. Yeah, I would say, I feel like if I sat in like real like meditation with her, it would be, there would be a deep thank you for acknowledging that. I'll give you my app today just to support you in this, because in the app I have 11 self-guided, self-help meditations. And so you can connect with her with, I can guide you with the meditation. So you can just have that in your pocket, just going to her whenever you want.

And of course, the practice is in the book. And what I also want to, first of all, I want to say thank you to that part. Let her the part know that I'm grateful that she was willing to come forward. And I also want to acknowledge another thing for your audience and for me and for you as women, going through menopause, is that when you go through menopause and I'm new to really realizing it, but I've been going through very menopause for 10 years and now I'm here in menopause, I haven't gone a year without a period, but my numbers are very menopause. Yeah, you're getting there.

So I'm there. You have no more shits to give. That's right. That's right. And as hard as that is, it's beautiful for parts for us to do this parts work. This book should be given to every single woman going through menopause. pause because it should be just like sitting right next to your book because when you have no more shits to give it's this beautiful quote is you know my roomy quote

is when the wound is the place where the light enters you yeah when you're in that wound of just like I don't I don't have any capacity anymore to play this role yes you what you said is actually like literally verbatim what I've been saying I can't actually do this anymore that's right I can no longer be this role anymore. That's right. It's such an opening because you have no other choice that have kept you stuck in the park. It's so interesting you say that because I've been telling people that are close to me that are understanding what I'm going through. I've been telling them that I can't stop this new version of me that's emerging. It's like I can't even hold her back because I because of my

I'm two years without a cycle. I'm definitely at that place where I don't care anymore and I'm exhausted holding all these parts to your point. And it's exciting, it's liberating, and it's scarier than shit

all at the same time because every relationship now has to have a new conversation and people have to get to know you differently. I had this happen with my dad the other day. I said something to him and he's 88 years. old. He's pre-dementia. And literally he looked at me and he said, you know what? I realize you've

really changed and I need to look at you differently. And I said, thank you. Thank you. And that's a bit of where I sit in this early postmenopausal time is that your brain changes and I think you're spot on that perhaps all these parts come up and they're like, hey, we've been here. You have better access to them now, how do you release them? Like, I don't know if there's a way of thanking them and releasing them. Well, in IFS, there's deeper processes of actually unburdening the parts, and it's actually a very ceremonial process. It's really beautiful in the IFS therapy session, where you would offer the part, you know, the element to up to the elements. And so, and I write about that at the end of the book where you can, you know, burn it or you can, you know, send it to the

or the air. And so that may be where you get to. I actually, I'm going to highly recommend psychically for you that you join up with an IFS trained therapist and I'll help you find somebody. Yeah, I'll get somebody great. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, because you're just right out on the precipice that it's just like topping, popping off for you, you know? And the unburdening is just, it's, it's an alchemizing the part. It's, it's extraordinary. And it is really appropriate for those menopausal years. And I think that menopause actually is, is, this process of self-help or IFS, either one, depending on how deep you're going, is so crucial when we're going through this, because what's happening is we were shedding the patterns, and so therefore shedding the

parts, and becoming new. Yes. And in that rebirthing, we need the tools to do. To do stay bounderied with these new changes and stick to them. And then also to tend to the grief, because these parts will experience, you know, a lot of grief letting go, right? When we change, grief is there to tend to the grief of what that means to become new. And it's a beautiful, beautiful experience when you have those tools and the resources to navigate it in this way, rather than to override it or ignore it or push past it. And so this, this, these four steps are just right now they're available to people in this journey. So for the person listening, you know, how I ended up with kind of understanding that there might be

this part that accommodated to my mom's, you know, suffering was that I, as I've been changing, I am feeling bad at watching how my changes are hurting some people that I, that this part has really catered to. And so it came out as I was talking to my therapist, like something in my childhood, is what I said to her, has me thinking that I developed the thought pattern. I need to take care of everybody's suffering.

I can't let those people suffer around me. So it started with a thought and a pain in me that I just couldn't take anymore. I was like, how can I be blossoming into this beautiful new version of me and be, have such a pit in my stomach because those around me are not loving the changes that they're seeing because they have to take care of themselves now. So you see how I got to that? I'm curious how the follower, you know, people listening can take a suffering thought and link it to a part. Yeah. Well, I think that any part of us that's out of harmony with self is a part.

Got it. And so the work isn't that we're going to live in self all the time. These parts are beautiful. They have very important roles. We don't want to stop the parts, right? Your part that's saved and served, right? has healed so many people, Mindy. Yeah.

And she's changed so many lives. And we don't want her to stop doing her beautiful work. We just want her to feel less extreme in how she does it. Yeah. And so these parts have very polarized roles, right? They're like, my controller part has written 10 books in 14 years. She's served many souls. but we just want to help her not have to do that,

write these next books in a controlling way, right? Just let her go off to a cabin for a few months and write the next one, right? Oh my God, I keep saying that. It's every author's dream. Every author's dream. But, you know, there's the Walden, you know, there's the Thoreau in us.

It's just like you want to have this experience. That's right. But whatever that means, even if that's a weak retreat to just go be in that journey. And so let's look at this part, these parts of us, however we access them, and recognize that they've been working really hard to protect us.

In the book I write, the year that I wrote this book, I was also a fellow at a recovery center, a sober recovery center. And every month, a new group of, it was every month I would go in. And so it was like a 28-day cycle or 21-day cycle. And every month, I'd meet these people who had one day, two days, three-day sober. And I'd give this talks, and I was workshopping this method. And what I'd offer them was this idea that, first I'd say to them, you know, how many of you in this room have experienced adversity or trauma in your child? And every hand would go up, right, including my own. I'm a sober woman of 19 years. And then I'd say, well, that was really tough suffering. And they'd all say, oh, yeah, oh, yeah. And then I'd say, well, wouldn't it make sense that you would do whatever it took to put out the fire of that flame of fear and suffering? And everybody would kind of nod their heads like, well, yeah, yeah, I get that. And then I'd ask them, well, then wouldn't it be reasonable to see that this addiction has been trying to protect you?

Ooh. And some people would be really resistant. Like, they hated their addict part. They're days sober. It was too much for them to contemplate. But a lot of people might be like, wow, okay. And then they might even experience this glimmer of compassion. Holy shit, this part of me has been working so hard for so many years to protect me from this very scary experience from my childhood.

I have a lot of compassion for that part of me that's been running the show. So now, of course, 19 years later, I look at my cocaine addict part with so much compassion and gratitude. You know, thank you for working so hard to keep that memory down. I wasn't ready to remember that, you know? And so it's just a different approach to the way that we see ourselves. And then there's another piece of this, which is that the people around, you are changing, right? The subtitle of this book, you know, it's like self-help, this is your chance to change your life. And this is your chance to change your life and other people's lives will change

because of it. Yeah, or not choosing the sub-subtitle. I should do the sub-subtitle. There's your sub-subtitle. Because it's just, you know, you change. Here's the good news, though. As you do this work, Mindy, more and more self is going to emerge, right? Yeah. And so you're going to start being able to come to these relationships speaking for these parts. of yourself, not as these parts of yourself. So you could go to your loved ones and say, you know, I have a part of me that's been really trying to save everybody. And I've been going through this menopausal journey and I'm realizing, you know, like you really, I don't have it in me anymore to do that. And I just want to

speak for that because it might be uncomfortable for you, but I want to create a boundary with love that this, you know, this part of me just can't do it anymore, you know, instead of speaking as the part of like defending it or trying to make sure that everybody's safe while you're doing the boundary. You know what I mean? It's like, just speak for it. And that's what self is, because self is clear. One of the clarity is a quality of self. So speaking for it with clarity. And how many parts, I know this is probably unique for everybody, but how many parts do we have? And are they all, are they all protector? Do we have parts? No, not just that are like, we have tons of parts. Yeah. Like, how do you know what's a good part and a bad part?

We have many parts. There's no bad parts. Dick Schwartz wrote the book, no bad parts. It's a very important message. There's no bad parts. There's just parts that were forced into extreme roles. Got it. Okay. And so some of the parts that are extreme, some of the parts that are addicted, some of the parts that are protecting so much were very young and they were forced into these adult roles to have to take care of this little exile child. And they've been extreme because they've been working so hard. So there's no bad parts. They're just extreme parts. And so these parts don't actually need to be forced or shut down. They need to be related to.

They need to be connected to. And named and called out and honored. Honored? They need these steps. They need to be checked in with. They need curiosity. They need compassionate connection to have their needs met. They need to be seen.

They need self. So, you know, it's so interesting when I first learned. about IFS, it reminded me of when I saw that movie, Beautiful Mind. Do you remember that movie about that he was a schizophrenic? And it was a big movie at the time it came out. And I remember walking out of that movie and thinking, we're all schizophrenic. We all have. Exactly. It's exactly right. It's exactly right. This guy was like shown to be this obscure human. But I was like, we all have these different voices in our head. We all have these different stories. that we're working with. So as I'm listening to you talk, I'm thinking about that. And then it makes me

wonder, like, you've done a lot of work on yourself using IFS. Do you, do you, when you're in a, in a stressful moment, do you, does your brain go, oh, you're reacting because of this part? Like, do you call the parts out as you feel the suffering? Yeah. Well, well, to answer both of those questions. So the first thing is, yes, Dick Schwartz is very clear. This is non-pathologizing. So he wouldn't even call it multiple personality disorder. He would just call it parts, okay? Because we all have them, and some people have them in more extreme ways. And oftentimes those who have more extreme ways and might get the diagnosis of multiple

personality disorder are the ones who have had the most extreme traumas such that their brain just fragmented. Right. Right. That they just, the parts explosion, okay? Right. So in the case of, so that's why I love that it is a non-pathologizing therapy. Yeah.

And we all have these parts and we have lots of them. And how do you, so first there's lots of parts. There's no bad parts. Some parts are very childlike and already very youthful and calm and easy and confident. They have a lot of access to self. And some parts have less access to self because they've been in these extreme roles. And so the ones that are extreme, it's our job to, it's not our job. It's our choice to check in with them and bring them back to self and connect them to self. That's our choice. Okay. So how, yeah, how would you use that? Like in a day- So this is how I use it. Okay. So very recently I've been using my tools like a full-time freaking job here. So I have this part that I've had for a very long time that believes that that has believed, because I'm actually unburdening her really as we speak and crazy, like in real time. She believed that, and it's really, really deep for me to say that, to say like she believed. It's a big deal for me to say that. She believed that if she didn't do it, nobody else would.

And so that belief is very understandable. She has an exiled child who didn't have caregivers taking care of her in very extreme emotional upheavals. And so she had to take care of herself. And everyone did disappoint her. And so she had this belief of if I don't do it, nobody else will. And she lived up until today with that belief driving and running the show. And I say you today because this is a real big neuroplasticity happening for me in this moment. Thank you.

And it's very valuable to speak about it as a part that's a burdening in real time. And so she's, you know, had this story. and she would, you know, constantly do things work-related that she shouldn't be doing because she didn't think anybody else could do it. And she created a reality, right? And of course, there's instances where it's hard to get people to help you or hard to get the right people to help you. But she wasn't even able to attract the right people because she was so burdened by this belief. And it would happen in my marriage and it would happen in, you know, work and in all these places. And as I've continued to work with her and work with her and work with her, I've kept

checking and kept checking and kept checking in. And just last Saturday, as I continue, I'm at this very beautiful precipice of genuinely unburdening her and giving her a new life right now through the therapy and through the self-help and through all the work I'm doing. Last Saturday, I decided I was going to quit my job, meaning I'm going to quit my role as it is. Like, I don't want to do this job anymore. I'm just going to, aren't you an entrepreneur? Don't quit your job. But I was, I was really going to, I'm quitting. I quit. I did quit the job that I was running, the way that I was running it. And I emailed my team when I said, letting you lead. It was the notion memo that I sent.

Wow. And at the top of it, I said, listen, when people ask me what I do, I say I'm a motivational speaker and I'm a self-help book author, but right now that's a lie. Right now I'm writing emails and Chazale's Preach briefs and then caring about YouTube thumbnails and I'm focusing on all the things that actually are totally misaligned with what myself is here to bring forth. And as a result of all the beautiful work I've done on myself, I've been able to attract a team.

Here's the good news. I've been able to attract a team of people around me that are actually really capable of leading. And so here you are. I'm going to let you lead. And then with clarity, so that's confidence and courage to say that and tell the truth. And then clarity of self came through. And I carried on. And I said, and here are the clear steps that I would like you to take to fulfill this for me to let yourself lead so that I can step out.

And then I went on and I said, and here are the boundaries. You know, the courage to speak for the boundaries. Here are the boundaries I'm creating. And then for the last several days, I've been catching myself in the moment, but I'm saying, like, oh, I'll do that. And then I'm like, literally like, actually, I won't do that. Wow. You can go figure that out.

And so just checking it in real time. And then the months leading up to this moment were really, really chaotic, right? Because it's menopause. It's like just getting my, my, it was getting my meds right, right? Getting to the place where my hormones were working properly and getting out of that zone of sort of confusion. And while simultaneously, like, deep in it, like really like releasing this part and working with it. And so it was really chaotic and really scary for me, Mindy. And I just kept, just kept checking in, checking in, checking in. And just moment by a moment. And sometimes when I

didn't have the bandwidth to check in, I would pray. And there's a chapter in the book about how prayer is a choice, right? The first step is choice. Sometimes just a prayer is a choice to check in. And so if you're like, I don't even have the bandwidth to check in, you could start by just saying, I need help to God, to spirit, to your inner guidance system, to self-inside. I need help. I give it over. I don't know how to do this. Yeah. I need help. And then there's a release in that question, I'm sure, that allows, you know, something to come through. I'm a woman of faith. I have full embodied faith in a God and a higher power of my own understanding. I believe in angels. I believe in guides. I believe that there is a presence beyond my physical

site. So when I pray, I'm praying to those guides and angels and to God, and I'm saying, take this from me, help me reorganize this and help me bring my thoughts back to love. And for me, that's such a strong knowing that a prayer offers me extreme relief. Now, for folks who may be new to their spiritual practice or may not maybe feel like they're atheists, and that's not real for them, just setting an intention, you know? Yeah. I'm setting the intention to get help. Yeah. That's a message. So in the story you just told, what I heard was you identified it a part, you gave her oxygen and acknowledged her. You publicly acknowledged her.

And then you created a plan with your team, which was beautiful. And then, but then the part I don't want to miss was the aftermath, which was how sneaky it was. She kept trying to come back in to her role. Yes. And so when she does that, is there a conversation with her? Let's talk about that. Because even the steps I shared with you, it's like, it's like of like a self-help brag a little bit because to get to that place where you really have the courage to do all the steps that I did, that's the promise of this book, right? Right. But it does,

it's a journey to get there. It's not going to, yeah, there's a lot of checking in that I want you to do. But the thing is that you'll have all these miracle moments where you're going to be like, whoa, I just did that thing differently. And then I just did that thing differently. And you're really, we're reprogramming your neural pathways while you're doing this. Right. Right. Right. Right. It's extraordinary. But yes, on the moment to moment basis. So like my husband triggers me. And that, that same old thing, the loop that we get into, that we all couples do. I will, one, notice that I'm there and I can have enough awareness now

that I'm about to, instead of raging on him, I'm going to ask for some permission to step away. Then I'll go to the bathroom or go upstairs or just hide, and I'll do the four steps, and I'll choose to check in with the part rather than check out and rage. And then I'll get curious about where she is and I'll get into the somatic experience

and just listen to her, let her speak up, get, you know, how old are you? What do you want me to know? And then I'll go to the third step and I'll compassionately connect and I'll say, what do you need? And she'll say, I need to be seen, I need to be heard, I need to go for a walk, whatever she needs.

And then I'll breathe with her for a moment and I'll let her know I heard her. And then I will check for C's. Do I feel more calm? Do I feel more connected? Do I feel more clear? Do I have creativity? Do I feel a little bit of a courageous energy

to go back to that conversation or to say I'm not going to talk about this till tomorrow, do I feel confident? And I connected. And if I have a little bit of C qualities, then I've helped her. Right. Because self came forward to help her.

It's like what I hear is it's self-compassion. Because if when you identify these parts, you stop fighting them, you stop letting them run you, and then there's a level of compassion that must come over you for your own self. Yeah, well, self, is compassion. Self energy is connected. Self energy is curious. Self energy is creative. So the way that I've

designed these steps is really cool because I've used the qualities of self as the steps, right? So choosing to check in step one. But curiosity is a quality of self. So you've got this self-like quality that you're applying. So maybe you're not in self, but you're using self's quality to get curious. to check in. And then you're using self's quality to compassionately connect and say, what do you need? And then you're checking to see, oh, wait, now is there a little energy that's like self coming forward? Right. Yeah.

Self is an energy. Self is a, self is an energy. It's a vibration. It's alignment. It's like an interparent. Yeah. It's so interesting. I would, I'm, and this is a side conversation, you and I can have it another time, but the book I'm

writing right now is about the brain changes that happen to women after 40. And one of the, where were you six months ago? I know, right? I'm taking an anthropologist, a neuroscientist, and a feminist philosopher, and I'm merging all of their teachings to create a through line that I feel that menopause is actually a process of returning back home to yourself. Totally. And I don't think we talk about that enough. And you have just given me, new context because there's a couple of statistics that just like have really driven me. And one of them is the most common time for a woman to commit suicide is between 45 and 55. And I believe that that's because she's returning home to herself. But maybe in returning home to herself, she has all

these parts that have adapted and have taken her away from her, as you put, her authentic self-energy. So what I'm learning from this podcast is really this idea that your book should be mandatory reading for every woman over 40. And it is a wonderful way to understand yourself as you're on this journey to the next part of your life and your postmenopausal years. That's how I would see this. Do you have a way in which you wrote this book that you see the world using it? Yeah. Yeah, I love that question. And I agree with you, too, that women, that women, and it makes me, breaks my heart of that statistic as well, because also it's just so reflective of the lack of information and the lack of people like, doctors like you. And God, you are doing God's work, my love. It's just, there's, and it's, you know, I need, we need you and the Mary Claire Havers and all the doctors, Dr. Taz and Dr. Hall and all of you that are out there just doing this, doing this work.

really helping people, women understand this, and saving our lives really, truly. Because I would have been one of those that would have taken my life if I hadn't had the education. Because that's where it would have taken me. Yeah. Because it's where it took me during postpartum, too. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know for a fact that would have, that would have been, could have been a path for me. And so I'm glad we're talking about that. How do I want people to use this? I wrote this book and I really bluntly called it self-help and I put these big flamingo colored letters on the page and it's it's it's in your face and it's it's a book for the willing it's a book for for people who know that they want to heal that they want direction and guidance and they want relief and so for anyone that's listening still to the end then this is

definitely your book because you're obviously curious well said and for those folks that are those women that are going through menopause, this is your book. If you're really going, if you're identifying with the story of what we're saying of like, they have no more shits to give and you just want to, you want to unburden the patterns.

This is it. This is your book. But I believe that this book is for anyone willing to truly heal because there's a lot of self-help books out there, lots of tools, lots of practices, but this is based on a therapeutic model that works, that has,

that science-backed, that has proof that it works. I am living proof that it works. We're minutes away from my next call, which is with my IFS therapist, okay? Right. So I can swear by this. I can say to you,

if you apply these four steps, I can say with full-bodied conviction that your life will change and the lives of the people around you. And so it's, how do I want people to use? I want them to use it for a minute a day. At least a baseline of one check-in a day. Oh, I love that.

And if you can do more, great. But if you just do one a day, you're getting a little molecule of self. And as you start to add the molecules of self up, you start to trust that self more. And as you trust self more, you become more inclined to check in and less inclined to check out. And then self begins to expand inside of you and become more of a natural state. And then you feel more resource and you feel more safe and your life begins to change. Oh my God, that's beautiful. Where can people find the book?

And then maybe before we shut this down, talk a little bit about it. It sounds like the app coincides with the book and they can have the meditations. That seems really helpful. Yeah. So you can grab your book at any bookstore, deargabby.com slash self-help. And on that page, deargabby.com slash self-help. There's a few meditations like we mentioned, the self-help meditations that I'll give you, where I guide you through the steps as well, which is quite a very.

beautiful experience and then the audiobook does that as well. So it's really nice. But these ancillary meditations are really, really divine. And I would also really recommend. So I've got the Gabby coaching membership and it's an app where you have hundreds of meditations and workshops and daily two-minute practices every day. There's 365 daily practices and card pulls where you can pull your own affirmation cards and you can do little readings and it's challenges. And then inside it is a self-help section. And in the self-help section, there's 11 of these meditation. and there's workshops and there's like a six-hour workshop on this book that you get. And so it's all inside the app.

You can try it for free. You can go to deargabby.com slash app or just go to the app store and try it out. Amazing. Amazing. Well, I want to make sure you get to your therapy since we just identified that you have a new part that you're giving oxygen to. I'm going to, we're letting her go. She's free.

And I just want to say to you that this was one of my absolute favorite. interviews in this whole journey of my book interviews and you've brought such self-energy to it because this is all the curiosity that you bring to it. And I just want to reflect back to you that I'm just so proud of your your parts that they're just emerging and that they're so courageous and that there's so much so much passion to heal. And I just am so proud of you. And I'm so excited for this next book. And I just think I can't wait to deepen our friendship. And I just think you're so fabulous. Yeah. Oh, the feeling's mutual, Gabby. Absolutely agree with all of that. So, and thank you for writing this book. I mean, I know the amount of labor that goes into a book. And the way in which you spit this one out into the world is going to help so many people. So the feeling is very mutual and I appreciate you. Thank you. And I'm here if I want to check in. Any parts that want to check in, call me. And my menopausal parts will be texting you.

There we go. That's what we can do. We can text each other the menopausal parts. We can probably do a lot. We can probably do a a whole video on the menopausal parts. You can do a whole menopausal parts video. I mean, we really should. It would be quite interesting. It would be great. Actually, I actually do, because I text my menopausal friends and I'm like, I'm like, full-blown punching the dashboard, dashboard punching, dashboard punching.

Yeah. It's really wild. It's awesome. Well, I love you, Gabby, and I just really love this conversation as well. And we'll make sure people gobble this book up so that we can get more selves out there. I really think there is something beautiful about a ripple effect of people applying this work will be really cool. So thank you.

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much for joining me in today's episode. I love bringing thoughtful discussions about all things health to you. If you enjoyed it, we'd love to know about it. So please leave us a review, share it with your friends, and let me know what your biggest takeaway is.