Live Like a Girl with Dr. Mindy Pelz - How Red Light Therapy Can Benefit You - With Wes Pfiffner

Episode Date: November 21, 2022

For full show notes, resources mentioned, and transcripts, go to: www.drmindypelz.com/ep148/. To enroll in Dr. Mindy's Fasting membership, go to: resetacademy.drmindypelz.com. This episode explores using red light therapy to protect and energize cells while improving sleeping habits, hormonal balance, and more. Wes Pfiffner is a member of Joovvs leadership team and leads all their marketing efforts. Wes has a background in marketing and is a complete nerd when it comes to all things health and fitness related.  Please see our medical disclaimer.

But when you really look deeper at a lot of the science behind red and near-infred light therapy, it's incredible for your overall health and not just your skin health. That's kind of like the outward appearance you see. You know, it may be easier to sell, wrinkles, stuff like that. But what it's doing on a cellular level is really where the magic is happening. Resetters, Dr. Mindy here. And I am on a mission to teach you just how powerful your body was built to be. This podcast is about giving you the power back and helping you.

you believe in yourself again. Let's jump in. On this episode of the Resetter podcast, I bring you Wes Piffner from Juve Red Light. So check this out. I really wanted to bring to you all a discussion on red light. It's a pretty popular discussion right now. And I think there are a lot of great ways to use red light, especially a tool like Jouv and what you're going to hear right now. And there are other times when just getting out into the sun and seeing the sunrise and the sunset and getting the red light there can be very helpful. So I really wanted to unpack where do we use red light, what kind of research do we know behind it, and what kind of conditions can't, do we know that it can heal? I even went in with Wes into conversations like, do you have to be fully naked?

when you use these red lights? What body parts do I put it on? How long do I have to do it? These are all questions that so many of us have wondered. Many of you have been asking us. So this is what I would consider the most comprehensive discussion that I've had on any of my platforms about red light. So if you're curious about it, I'm excited to bring you this episode. I do know that there is more and more research coming out every single day. More people, popular podcasts are talking about it. And a large part of that is because we're inside all day. We're not getting the exposure to light that we used to get years ago. And you'll hear Wes and I talk about that. So this was definitely a necessary conversation. When I look at all the conversations I've had this year,

I'm always trying to bring you new pieces of information that will propel your health forward. I also want to bring you pieces of information that help us thrive and survive in this modern world that our bodies are breaking down in. And I couldn't let this season go without a discussion of red light. So here we go. Wes from Juve, all your questions about red light, hopefully answered, enjoy. Okay, cool. Well, we're just going to dive right in.

And let me just start by saying it has literally been, I think, almost three years since we've talked Red Light on the Resetter podcast. So I just want to start off by saying, thank you, Wes, for being here. I can't wait to have this conversation. Yeah, I'm super excited. I'm super excited. As you know, I dig Red Light Therapy and so happy to have this conversation today. Yeah. And you know what?

Here's where I want to start. Why is Red Light so popular? My gosh, it's like, I feel like everywhere I turn, somebody's either got red light on or they're talking about red light. Why in this day and age has it become so popular? It's a really good question. And you would think with how much clinical data there is, this would have been much more popular before it is now. Because that's something that's unique about red light compared to a lot of other modalities out there is the tremendous amount of clinical data to support it. Yeah.

And so I think what it, honestly, what it took is just the right, getting the right message out. And when Juve launched its first product back in 2016, nobody was really talking about using red light on a daily basis to support your health. Like nobody was talking about it. Most of what you would have seen with red light therapy would have been primarily used in like physical therapy offices like in the form of like a laser. Or you would have seen an esthetician offices for skin health. But when you really look deeper at a lot of the science behind red and near infrared light therapy, it's incredible for your overall health and not just your skin health. That's kind of like the outward appearance you see.

You know, it may be easier to sell, wrinkles, stuff like that. But what it's doing on a cellular level is really where the magic is happening. So, you know, I don't want to sound too overconfident when I say this, but Juve really helped start getting that message out in 2016. Yeah, I just want to point out you were like the original that. got it out. Yeah. Yeah.

I absolutely agree with that. And it took putting the right, like connecting the right dots for people and to see, hey, you know, you can do this on a regular basis and here's what the science shows. And, you know, that, you know, so we started that, right? But none of this would have gone anywhere had it not worked. Right. Like had it not made a difference on people's health. Because everybody likes to think of, oh, we created the best product and it's our marketing.

And I've been in marketing long enough to know, like the problem. product has to work and word of mouth marketing and folks who have, you know, they use something and then they tell other people because they believe in it and they see the benefits. Like that, that is why where it is now is we've helped get it out there. And then it's spread because people are seeing results. You know what I mean? So that's where I think. Fasting. You know, last year, uh, around Christmas time, I was brought on a bunch of news shows and the most common question people asked me was, why are we still talking about fasting? Like, are. Isn't that fat over?

I'm like, no, it's not over because it's working. So I feel the same thing about red light. Like, you know, each year it's like gaining more and more and more popularity. And I think to your point, it's working is really important. Here's the question. What is it working for? Another great question. So I, when I first heard it, so anybody listening to this, you're probably a little bit skeptical,

probably maybe not as much as other folks because you, you know, Dr. Mindy's, we're talking about this. and, um, but for a lot of people like light, how can it help heal your body, you know, improve performance, hormones, all these different type of things. And if you're like me, you're like, no way it can do that. But it's really because of the, our, my understanding of light at the time was I, I just thought it was illumination. I just thought light was something that helped me see in the dark. But when in reality, light's energy. Um, and it, and it's in the form of electromagnetic waves. and so that energy can hit our bodies and we can react to that energy.

You know, the sun, the original source of light, it's what powers the entire universe. So light, when you start thinking about it, you're like, it's actually super important. And it's something we have, most people don't really have any understanding of. Even, even the, and we can get him to talk about the lighting in your room, you know, the lighting at night, etc. But what makes red light so unique is these specific wavelengths can actually stimulate and heal. heal cells that are under oxidative stress. And so why that's important is cells that are under oxidative stress, they're producing less energy.

And when your body's producing less energy, it can't produce its normal regular activities, right? That's why, like, aging can be directly tied to the state of your cellular health. The older you get, the less efficient your cells become, then other areas of the body start breaking down. In fact, I just learned this yesterday. It was really interesting. your eyes actually age 70% faster than any other organ in the body. And the reason it does is because the mitochondria and the ATP energy in the eye

fades quicker than any other area of the body. That's crazy. And you have the most amount of mitochondria in your eyes. That's right. There's like a few places where it's just packed with mitochondria and that's one of them. So that's fascinating. Yeah. And our organs are packed with them.

Like the heart has a ton of mitochondria, etc. So the point in what I'm getting at is. cellular energy is super important. And what makes red light so unique why people aren't staying in front of green light in these others, because these specific wavelengths of red and near and fred

can actually boost cellular energy. And when you have more cellular energy, your body can function more efficiently. Cells can actually heal. And not only do the heal, they're better protected, right? They're better protected from going under stress again. So it just makes you stronger.

It's like, it's almost like giving your cells like food, you know? So it's pretty incredible. So what it does, you know, to summarize that, it's boosting cellular energy and specifically mitochondria function. Is it true that the mitochondria have receptor sites for red light? Yeah. I haven't heard that recently. Yep.

They have photoreceptors. Yep. And they respond to these wavelengths, like, which makes it just all the more interesting. And I kind of like think about this explosion of us understanding light, right? Understanding more about circadian rhythm. And it's funny. like when we're when you kind of go through life and you go through school you think like we have everything figured out but then you can kind of look at history and you're like well just a hundred years

ago we didn't even know what vitamins were we didn't even have those proven out now we know what they are so i feel like that's where we are with light you know you see this explosion with infrared saunas using using like to heat the body right to put it under stress and you see more things exploding of using um you know i can't remember the company but there's glasses you can put on that give your eyes like green light that can help help ship. Yeah. Brain tap has something like that. So we're kind of figuring out there's so many different ways to use light for our benefit,

right? And so that's where kind of juve is in is we're giving you this healthy, healthy wavelengths of light, but we're making it convenient to use at home, which is the most important because it takes consistent usage to really see benefit, no different than it would be if you're taking a supplement or like you talk about intermittent fasting. A one-off of intermittent fasting could maybe. help in some areas, maybe some digestion, but really you've got to consistently do it to really

reap the benefits. And that's how light, that's how red light is. So, you know, I feel like if there is a receptor site, like this is the way I process the body is if it has a receptor site for red light, then we need to see red light. And if we don't see red light, then you're depriving that mitochondria of a nutrient as powerful as oxygen, as vitamin, as ketones. All those nutrients are all important. So if we're inside all day, if we have our sunglasses on, if we're not seeing sunrise and sunset where the red light exists, we're literally getting no red light and then we're not nourishing the mitochondria in the way that they need to be nourished. Is that a proper way to look at it? like we're depriving our mitochondria of a key nutrient if we're not getting red light?

I would, I'd say that's spot on. And I think it's accidental because I think when we develop this indoor lifestyle, we didn't fully understand what we were doing. Same thing when we brought light in the home. I mean, you can go through the research and see that it's been amazing since we brought light into the home. The average American sleeps three hours less. So there's lots of stuff we've done by accident, you know. And so, yeah, I mean, that's spot on.

And one thing to add to that is not only, are we not being exposed to these wavelengths of light, but we're also being over exposed to certain wavelengths of light, like blue light as an example. You know, most indoor lighting is all blue light. And then at night, all of our devices, TVs, computers, everything, it's utilizing blue light, which is really, really a stimulative light to our, to cortisol. So it's pretty much helps us stay awake, which is why the sky's blue during the day. So, okay, so blue light raises cortisol. it suppresses melatonin. Red light raises melatonin.

Is that a way to look at it? There is one, yeah, there is one study to show. I wouldn't, at this time I can't say like definitively, like if you use this light, it's going to help increase melatonin. Now, what you could, what you could theoretically say is because you're giving your body better cellular energy by exposing this, then your body can work better. Then a cascade of fault could be, you know, your body's able to produce more, melatonin because it's just got energy to operate and function, right?

But where it's different than blue light is it doesn't stimulate cortisol because it's a lot lower Calvin. It doesn't really, so blue light resonates really well with this gene and I call the melanopsin gene. And that's what can help stimulate cortisol. Red light really, really doesn't do that. It really doesn't stimulate. So it's not affecting melatonin. So a lot of people, like we have this feature in our device and all of our newer devices

It's called ambient mode where you can just turn the device on for it can run for over and over again just 90 minute cycles. And it's not delivering a therapeutic effect, but it's delivering a little lower level light of red light. So you can use it as lighting in your bedroom so it won't affect your cortisol. It's not going to necessarily increase melatonin, but it allows you to have some red light in your room, like in the bedroom, without affecting your sleep, if that makes sense. Yeah, so that actually ties into a couple of studies that my husband and I were looking at. And that's that when the sun goes down, making sure that the lights on in your house are not full blare. And that if you can put these red lights, especially low on the ground and have them illuminating the room, that that actually is more conducive to going to sleep. It starts to wind down the nervous system.

So are you saying that we could take like a juve like you have? have behind you right there. I could put it in the corner of my living room. Yep. And put that on for an hour or two before bed and it would help me assist me in falling asleep. Yeah. Yep.

And a big reason is it's not intrusive on your melatonin. It's not stimulating like that same bright light. So yeah. And it's actually very effective when I, my daughter is going to be two here in November. But when she was first born, you know, is any, any mother out there, like the baby wakes up a lot. And so I would use the little handheld device we had. And I would turn that on for light.

So my fiance could see our baby girl, could grab her. And because I was really, really worried about how much light I would expose her to during the night. Because I wanted her to go back to bed right away. As soon as she was done eating back to bed so I can go back to bed. So it was really helpful in that regard too, like just using it for different ways to eliminate the bedroom. I take the mini or the go and I take it with me when I travel and so especially if there's going to be jet lag involved I use it as a way to retell show my brain like hey this is where we're back on this to particular or we are on this time zone I'll use it in the morning first

thing when I get up use it at night it really is amazing how light can really train your circadian rhythm. Do we do we have research on that on what red light does to the circadian rhythm in general, the 24-hour circadian rhythm? You know, I would say it's definitely it falls in the cycle, right? Because in the first thing in the morning, what wavelengths do we typically see? It's in the red and infrared spectrum. And really because those are the longer wavelengths. So when when the sun is rising, those are the visible ones that you're that are first able to hit Earth because they're longer. Right? And that's why we see red and. And in the sunset, too, because those are the last ones that are able to make it through the atmosphere because they're longer wavelengths.

The shorter ones are in the blue and green. And that's why once the sun is fully set, the sky is blue, et cetera. So naturally, like, we're meant to that. And this is really interesting. There's some data out there to show that exposure to light, like red and near infrared, actually can help prime your skin to better handle the harsher wavelengths that come later in the day. Such as what are those Lloyd? What's those wavelengths? It's like in the red and near inference.

So what would be out of a juve light. So theoretically what researchers are kind of kicking around is the sun in the morning by exposing that to your skin and, you know, etc. It's actually priming your cells to have a better defense when they get hit with harsher vitamin D and the harsher wavelengths that can burn your skin. So essentially it's like equivalent to a 15 to 20 SPF protection on your skin, like naturally. It's like sunblock? Yeah. Like that's what they're kind of. of showing. So all in all, it blows on mind because I think, like, Mother Nature is like

king. Like if it really does that, the sun is automatically already working for us and we have no idea of it. You know, so there are ways where I believe it is helping from a circadian rhythm standpoint. Now, if you're looking at it to help retime, the best wavelengths for those are typically in the blue and green. So if you were to go to a completely different time zone, then it's better to use those stronger wavelengths to stimulate like morning and night. And those that's better in the blue and green, the really bright stuff. That's why most of like sad lamps,

as you would see, they're super bright. Like they're really, really bright white light. And that's why that helps stimulate, um, simulate cortisol. Yeah,

you know, and the where my brain goes with, with the sunblock idea, that makes actually perfect sense. Is that I feel like right now we're in this evolutionary mismatch. Like the way the, what the human body is living in in with light and with being, indoors and toxins and the frazzled world we're in and the information overload, the poor human

body is like, whoa, like, I don't even, I don't know how to sleep, I don't know how to handle stress. And when you reintroduce something as primitive as light back into the body, you're not only going to see changes in sleep, but what I'm hearing is you're going to see a lot of changes in a lot of other areas because you're bringing back something that you're not getting as frequent as we did decades ago. Yeah, I mean, that's spot on. And that's what's really cool about doing more of like a full body exposure because you're opening yourself up for systemic benefits.

So what I mean by that is just exposing this to your body, you're giving your cells and, you know, nutrients, right? A nutrient and energy that it hasn't had. And so when you give your body the tools to function as it's intended, it can do pretty incredible things. So we get a lot of time, somebody will say, hey, I bought this for X, and I actually am noticing this. Like, is that, is that normal? And it's like, yeah, it's like, that's a systemic, like, benefit. Like, a lot of people say, you know, bought this for, to relieve pain. First thing I noticed before I, I experienced some pain relief was I, I'm sleeping better. Like, I don't know why that is, you know,

or my skin, I bought it for skin health and I noticed, like I did a, I did a pre and post, uh, hormone test, my hormones went up, you know, my testosterone went up 200 or et cetera. So it's really interesting like that it can do this. And so for a lot of people listening, like this is still being uncovered of these systemic benefits of that can happen. But there's a lot of clinical data for more targeted treating, right? So pointing at any which way on the body. But full body exposure, it's something different. And, you know, you hit it on the head, Dr. Mindy is it's stemming from folks have gone without this nutrient for a long time. And then once they bring it back into their body, it does amazing things.

Yeah. This is the same concept as fasting. When people fast, they start to get not just ketones. We see all kinds of neurochemical changes that they're not getting and they're missing out on when they eat all day long. And to my to this to me is where we get into this evolutionary mismatch. Like we really at this point in 20, 2022, we've got to pause and say, okay, some of these nutrient requirements of the body are not being met. And I feel like light is like right up there with one of the key ones. But it's really easy to look at a red light

and be like, oh, I'm going to wave that thing all, you know, I'm going to stand in front of it. My testosterone's going to go up. So explain to us a little bit. I know there's some great hormone studies. What is the research saying about testosterone? Do we know anything about estrogen and progesterone. How can we use this as a tool that might be as powerful as just, you know, a good old-fashioned meal? So to give more information on that, in 2019, we participated in a case study, and it was about 40 people between male and female. And we divided, the research group we were working with, they were heavily interested in helping people specifically metabolically. So they're big believers in a ketogenic diet.

And anyone that has seen research on the ketogenic diet can be very beneficial, not a diet for everybody, but it can be very, very beneficial compared to a standard American diet. And so that's what they were focused on. And they had seen a lot about juve and red light therapy and seen how it could help a ton for mitochondria function. And they were, you know, as being clinicians, they knew, you know, mitochondria function is a key to especially as you age. So they wanted to put a research study together and asked us to,

to participate, and so we did. And so we enrolled 40 people. And one group, they, um, they just implemented red light therapy, stayed on their, their standard American diet. But the other group implemented a ketogenic diet on top of daily red light therapy treatments. And we looked at the results over 12 weeks. They, we, uh, they did blood serum. Um, and it was amazing. So the ketogenic group and red light group saw the, saw the biggest benefits, as you would suspect, right, going from a standard American diet to a ketogenic diet plus red light. Yep. They saw incredible benefits.

So the males saw increases in both total testosterone and free testosterone in that, in that ketogenic red light group. And I mean big, big time, like 100% increases, 150% increases, you know, average age, I think in that study was like 45. So folks that were older where it's like there's probably not a lot of hope for you, you know, your testosterone's been what it's been for years, you know, stuff like that. saw big increases, which is incredible. And then the females, what's really interesting and what we didn't know, because there

wasn't anything out there, the females actually saw a balance, balancing to their hormones. So if they were too high in progesterine, you know, that came down, like it leveled it out. Like it just made them more healthy. Like they, what the researchers concluded is like adrenal healing. And so, and the non-red like grew, I mean, the non-keto group. that just did red light, they still saw significant benefits. I mean, the average testosterone increased 35% in that group. That was just adding in red light on a regular basis.

And females saw the same results. And what did they do? This has been a huge debate in my community and in my clinic is how long do you do it? Do you have to have it on skin contact? What body part do you do it? So for that particular, like if a woman wants to use this to balance hormones, what does that look like? on a daily basis.

So in that particular study, they used a similar size device that's right behind me. And they stood in front of that for 10 minutes on one side of their body and they exposed fully naked and then 10 minutes on the back side of the body. So they just spent 20 minutes a day.

And that's it. Now, I will say if you add other things in with it, like a proper diet, you know, you're focusing on better sleep. Like then you really have a chance to see pretty even more dramatic, dramatic results but even the red light group alone saw saw tons of of benefits in that red so it's just that's what's great about this it's just exposing your body to it you don't there's

no magical thing it's literally just you know acting like a solar panel exposing yourself to this light you know 10 minutes that's it and it would you do like 10 minutes of the morning 10 minutes at night is that you could it up yeah so if you're like i don't have the time you know in the morning just do the front half of your body for 10 minutes and then the backside 10 minutes. And for a lot of people, they want, you know, they want to optimize more time. So our system's modular. So you can add upwards of six of these panels together and create a, you know, a huge wall of

it almost. And you just, your whole body head to toe in 10 minutes. So that's what I want to do. We're empty nesters now. So we have all these open rooms in our house. And I'm like, okay, that's going to be a biohacking room. And so I'm slowly getting all my equipment, but I want to put the juve around the the whole edge of it.

So when you walk in, it's just a, it's just red, pure red bite. It's a pretty amazing experience. I have a, I have a quad. So it would be four of those connected. And so that pretty much gets my, my body from head to toe. And it's a great experience. I mean, I can, it's so relaxing. I like to do it in the morning right as I wake up to, you know,

because I'm in L.A. right now. So it's a little bit warm. So the hotter it gets, it's not as fun to stand in front of it when it's so hot out. But that's why I like. to do it either in the morning or later at night. And I find, I don't know, I've been using it for so long that the first benefits when I first started using it was primarily like muscle recovery. And I actually noticed a big increase in blood flow.

And that's, that's actually a big correlation with the mechanism of action is more nitric oxide gets released into your bloodstream. So, you know, if you put like, if I put my arm in front of it, within a minute, I'm seeing vasal dilation. And so, you know, those are some. some theories on why of potential systemic benefits is it's increasing blood flow. And when you could do that through the whole body, I mean, blood flow is incredibly important. And that's something that diminishes as you get older, right?

Your blood flow can start to diminish. Wow. So last time I talked to you all, there was a study that had just come out showing that if you put the red light right on your forehead, that it could actually start to upregulate and energize the prefrontal cortex, which is, Everybody needs their prefrontal cortex working at their best. That was just a study that was starting to be launched. Do we know anything about it with it around the brain? And my intuitive sense says, but there's bone.

How can the light get through the bone of my skull? So there's a lot of research on the brain. And Dr. Hamblin, he's a research professor. He was formerly at Harvard for the majority of his career. Now he's retiring. He oversees a journal. but most of his research what he's been highly interested in

is how it affects the brain and specifically folks that have like brain diseases like Alzheimer's dementia stuff like that and there's a ton of now research coming out of it showing red and near infred helping folks with Alzheimer's and dementia

symptoms so they're able to have better memory they're you know clearer memory like clearer thoughts stuff like that like quicker reaction time and then there there's a side of it too helping with, there's some research out there helping like traumatic brain injury. So inflammation in the brain, etc. Because there's mitochondria in the brain. And so if

this stimulates that, you know, then theoretically there can be a benefit. So there is a lot of research around around the brain and a lot of it is being geared towards the, you know, Alzheimer's dementia, that area. Because there's just not a lot of, there's just not a lot of stuff that folks can do once they hit that part in their life. There's just not a lot there. So they're heavily focused on that. The device that I've seen use the most for that type of stuff is it's called a V light. And it's actually a little light that attaches to your nose and clips on and actually

shoots light up your nasal cavity. Oh, I've seen that. Yeah. That's an interesting thing. I think that's their way of trying to bypass maybe some of that skull. But even Dr. Hamlin says, like, by putting it there, It can still travel even through that, given enough time. We haven't done any research with our products regarding that, but it's interesting that

what is a, what is a like a loop or a path into the brain like your eyes, right? Like your eyes can take that in. And so there's lots of different potential avenues, but we get that a lot from people of like they have a clearer mind, they think better by just using it. And so could it be through the eyes affecting the brain? I mean, there's a lot of different things. But one thing we know for sure, like the brain is positively affected by these wavelengths. Well, so the eyes are like if you wanted to look inside your brain, it's like your eyes are the output of what's going on in the brain.

And we have the most amount of serotonin receptor sites in our eyes. And light can stimulate those serotonin receptors. So do we know the name of the receptor? I'm just kind of curious for my own clinical study. Do we know the name of the receptor that red light goes into? Like serotonin like 5H2A is a serotonin receptor site. There's about 30 different serotonin receptor sites. I'm curious if we know the one.

I don't know off the top of my head, but I will say I was just reading research, and I'm not joking you yesterday, on red light and the eyes. Because I personally have experienced a benefit with that. I don't, I'm 32 years old. I don't have, I've never had contact. or glasses. And I noticed like my, my vision's not what it was when I was 12.

But I noticed that, like I ran out of a stretch of being able to use the device consistently and my device. And so what I noticed is my vision was like being weird. Like it's starting to be blurry, seeing like road signs, stuff like that. But once I got back into routine, like, it's clear again.

And so I started looking at stuff. And I already kind of heard that from customers our own. And I know there was, there was a big study released in 2020 that that was highlighting benefit for eyes and it's actually true like they've there was a clinical study done in 2020 and then another one done in 2021 that just regular exposure to these wavelengths of light for like simple like three minutes people's vision was was getting better and it and it was affecting people most that got the benefit they were past 40 and so that's where I was I saw that stat of your eyes and you'll find this interesting that or what I mentioned earlier like the eyes like they age 70% faster than any other organ in the body and it's to mitochondria and so what they're saying is like this and this was the researcher's words it's like it gave those mitochondria a charge and they're able to reduce more energy and then the vision gets better so it's like it's almost like you're jumping a car

right it's like you're you're sticking these um you know your your cables onto a car and you're charging the battery from another source. So it's really interesting in that regard. Yeah, that's the way I look at it is it's like a like you're charging up your cells. And the way I've seen it, felt it, the way I've watched people that I have coached back to health, the way I watch them use it, is that every time they go in front of a red light, you're supercharging mitochondria and whatever that mitochondria is trying to do, whether it's detox, whether it's energy, whether it's ATP for healing, it's like all of a sudden it amplifies that. And without the red light, now we're stuck with cells that are kind of mediocre. They're not like the hardest working cells. And then

year after year after year, they're getting less hard, less efficient at working. So I look at it like plugging my cell phone in. I'm plugging my cells in and boom. Now, now they're getting turned on and they have full electrical capacity. That's right. That's a perfect way to look at it. And so I like to explain it in two ways then. You know, they're short term benefit. It's you can get from red light right away healing those cells that are under oxidative stress and returning them to normal like inflammation reduction stuff like that you can see you can see benefits in you know in the short term long term it's it's just a great tool for to help support healthy aging and we just released an article on our website talking about that exact same thing to ensure something to

help ensure healthy cellular function so that your cells are getting the energy so your body can function and like I you know going through all of a lot of different health stuff and seeing it and you know in the health community and the body is king like we can we can come up with so many different like theories and everything but give your body what it needs and it can do the rest so like that's kind of what we're talking about and I think that actually is the most confusing part about all of this is because what we've been taught in health care is that you have to have some magic pill to be able to change your symptom or change your condition. But when you come to things like red light and fasting, what's happening is you're giving a requirement that the cells need,

and we don't know where the healing's going to happen. If you need the healing in the brain, it'll happen in the brain. If you need the healing in an injured knee, it'll happen there, especially when you get in front of these big panels. You have no idea, but the body knows, because it's so smart and it knows how to prioritize, which is the beautiful part because sometimes we've got to pull our educated brain out of the way and go, okay, I'm going to give you something you need and I'm going to let you figure it out.

That to me is the whole premise of fasting and what I hear you saying is that's the premise of red light. We can pinpoint these studies, but it's really about giving a requirement to the body so the intelligent body can figure it out. 100%. And we can't like, to a certain extent, point, like I can't always guarantee what that's going to do for you, what that light is going to

do for you because I don't know what shape your body's in. I don't know. No one knows really the shape of yourselves, right? It's not like we can know that. And most people, unless you do a biopsy, you're never going to know the state of your cellular function, right? And so giving your body that's like it can never hurt and only support. And that's where, you know, Red Light continues to B is there isn't a lot of like there's very, very, very little, if any, negative results coming from people with negative side effects. There are on occasion folks that experience some detox symptoms, stuff like that, but I could probably argue that that's actually a good thing that you're experiencing detox symptoms.

Yeah, you upregulate the mitochondria. They make more glutathione. They're going to detox more. I could totally see that. And then there's always a small group that they're light sensitive, right? They're light sensitive to the sun, everything. But those people know who they are. So for 99% of the population, it's completely safe, non-evasive.

You know, it's just, it's giving your body the tools to work. And so it's like I'd love to, I'd love to like give everybody a more science explanation. Wow. But that's kind of what it is. And it's no different when you're making sure you're eating the right diet and you're getting the right vitamins. You're just giving your body the tools. Yeah.

And I always say that with fasting. Like people are like, why is, how can fasting be good for? for losing weight and dementia at the same time. And it goes back to the same premise that we were not meant to eat all day. We were meant to eat in a compressed period of time, leaving a longer period for this neurochemical change to happen. The way I look at red light is we're not meant to be in blue light all the time.

But from the moment we get up, we pull our phone out, we're on our computer, when night sunset happens, we're not really conscious about do I need to get outside. And so we're getting this synthetic light over and over and over again. So when you put red light back in, it seems to me like you're giving a requirement that the body just isn't getting. And especially in this day and age. I mean, it's well said. And a lot of it is the root of it's just not taught.

It's not taught these ways to take care of our bodies. It's just, you know, all you're taught is go, you know, go to the doctor if you're dealing with something. And they're not going to know much. about you unless you can like you know sink your brain to them they're just going to go off of what you tell them and then try to give them the best guess and i'm not saying there's not a place to go to to go to the doctor right it's if i break my arm first place i'm going is going to the er but yeah but what we're talking about is is knowing how to support your body especially for the long term and that's what i think needs to get into folks's head is there's ways you can do it and same with like exercise

like exercise doesn't need to be a tool to just beat your body up It's just a way to move the body, you know, move the body and just get movement in there. Get, stimulate those muscles. And it's as simple as that because that's just going to bring you so many benefits, you know, for the long term. So true. Okay, talk about collagen because one of the things that was the most exciting to me when I saw the red light was that it can start to stimulate collagen on the skin. So what do we know research-wise on that? What have you seen?

I know that once I got a mini that that was my first thing is that I put it in front of me in front of my face when I was meditating in the morning for collagen production. So similar to what we've the research for skin, similar to what we've been talking about

for mitochondria. It's the same thing. The skin cells can absorb that. And then the fibroblasts and insectra can make more collagen, bring more blood flow to the skin, healing, oxygen to the skin. to the skin. It's the same, it's the same type of thing. And there's, there's lots of clinical data

out there for skin health. That's probably one of, I would say probably the leading amount of studies is skin health. And a lot of it you'll see for wound healing, wrinkle reduction. You just mentioned collagen. There's a lot out there for that supple skin. So it's very, very beneficial for the skin. And it's the same type of mechanism. It is the mitochondria in those skin cells are responding and being stimulated and they're getting energy and then they're able to do, you know, what they should be doing. And so what happens then? Your skin just returns back to looking more healthy. You know, it's not like it's a magic. It's just your body is meant to be healthy. You know what I mean? And when like they, this narrative that gets kind of pushed in people's

heads is, oh, after age, you know, 30, you're just going to slowly keep declining. But like, I don't think we have to accept that. I think we just don't know how to support ourselves because, you know, and support our bodies. And what are ways to do that? Like we're finding out we've been going without doing red light. You know what I mean? Like, you know, that's something that if we give our body, fasting, exercise, good diet, all these things mixed together.

And I think we can live a happier, healthier life. Yeah, a thousand percent. And I will tell you that, again, the little go, when my kids were living at home, any kind of rash, any kind of wound, my kids are super active. My daughter does a lot with horses. Anything that was like an open wound, the first thing was put the juve over it. Just put the red light to speed up the healing. I'll never forget one time my daughter.

We live in an old house and my daughter, the old window fell on her finger and like on top of it. And she was just, it was hurting so bad. And I didn't know what to give her. We don't have Advil in the house. We don't do painkillers. So I was like, grab the juve. And she put the juve over it. And like literally within like seconds,

She's like, I don't know why the pain is going away, Mom. Wow. The pain seems to be improving. So when she took the juve away, then the pain came back, but it almost acted like ice every time we put it on there. So I'm glad you mentioned ice because that's something we actually just included in our newsletter today. And this is interesting just how we get to doing things when there's not a lot of support for it. So what have we always been told like if you twist an ankle or you get a bruise or something is hurting?

it's put ice on it, right? And I've always been told ice helps speed up the recovery. But there's actually no really data to support that at all if you actually look into it. I've heard that. Yeah. And the person that invented, the person that came out with the rice method, which is rest, ice, elevate, etc. He's actually walked it back now. And he's like, you actually don't really want to ice it.

And if you do, use it as just a pain reliever and don't even do it more than five minutes. And here's why. When, because a lot of times they say, oh, the swelling, the swelling will down and speed up the, speed up the healing, put ice on it. It can't take the swelling down. But why does it take the swelling down? Because that ice is just cutting off blood flow. And so it's going to, the inflammation is going to go down. But what I've actually learned is we want that acute inflammation.

That inflammation is putting up almost like a bandaid around that area and it's going to repair. So what red light does, the opposite, it's going to increase blood flow. And it's actually going to. to repair those damaged tissues faster. And there's actually clinical data to support that. That's why, you know, we have a partnership with the San Francisco 49ers. And they, all of their, all of their players use our full body systems on a regular basis. Why?

It's to help repair and reduce inflammation because they're constantly putting their body under stress. So my point on that is like next time you like twist an ankle or whatnot, kind of think of, you know, you're better off with light than you are with ice. Ice can still be helpful as a natural pain reliever. So like if you don't want to take Tylenol or IVProfen, you can use it if it's really bad pain. But it's actually not going to help speed up the healing. Yeah.

It's really interesting if you think about it because the body is always doing the right thing at the right time. So when you spray in an ankle and blood flow goes to the area, what's the body doing? It's sending chemicals to heal it. Yep, oxygen. Yeah, when we put ice on that, we tell the chemicals to go away.

and slow down the healing. But yet too much inflammation that doesn't get processed through the body can be a chronic problem. So I love this idea that this is self-regulating, that this is a way for the body to decide how much blood flow it needs and how much it doesn't. What do we know about the nervous system? Because I can tell you the first time that I saw you all. And this was like, I feel, I don't know how long you've been around, but I want to say it was like six years ago. I was at a conference and all the panels were up. And I felt like a zombie.

Like I was like, what is going on over there? And I walked over to it. And all I could do is stand in front of it. And I stood there for about five minutes. I had my clothes on, obviously. But when I walked away, I was like, what just happened to me? I'm different. I was so calm.

So tell me what the, is there a parasympathetic effect? What is it doing to our nervous system? That's my hunch. And that's been my hunch for a couple years. Now, we did, we did do some testing. with a group that specializes in the brain and specifically for athletes. And the initial testing that they were doing, they changed ownership. So that kind of fell apart with working with them.

But the initial data that they showed me is that they had the, I can't remember the brainwaves that are for calmness. Is it? Gamma. Gamma. Is that what it is? And beta is the high ones, right? Beta is high. So beta is like alert.

Yeah, Alpha is also another one that's. The alpha is a really good state that's more mellow. So the initial stuff that they told me is like, hey, pretty cool. Like we're seeing like high beta waves, which is associated with like alertness. We're seeing that reduced. And then we're seeing the gamma rays go up. So like what he was telling me is like it's calm. It has a calming effect.

Yeah. And so that like I've thought that for years now of like it's probably shifting you into a parasympathetic state versus a sympathetic state. And that's maybe why folks. that use it, you know, maybe, you know, a couple hours before bed or before bed, they experience a lot better sleep is they're just relaxed. Yeah. One thing that I've done with the go, and thank you for making a little stand now.

It has a little stand. Yeah, it's nice, isn't it? Yeah, it's really nice. So I put it on my little nightstand. And one of the things that happens to women as they go through menopause, as our hormones get depleted, we don't have the hormone, especially progestrone. we don't have the ability to relax our body and brain as much. And it takes,

as women go through their 40s and into the metapausal years, it takes time for the body to adapt to all these missing hormones. So I take the go and I put it right on my nightstand and I just turn it on. And it's on a timer, right? So I just, as I'm going to sleep, I just, with my eyes closed, it really is a weird way of just creating this ambiance in my room that relaxes me. So I don't know if the menopausal women in your world and in the Jew the Jew world have told you that. But I think for menopausal women, that is probably one of the best ways

to use it is just to calm the body and the mind to allow women to finally sleep. I like, I 100% believe you. I think there's probably there's truth to that. And part of it is like we're so stimulated in this world all the time by every, every single thing. So just doing something that simple just to relax yourself, especially before sleep. If you can relax the mind and the body before sleep, you're setting yourself up for a really good night's sleep in it. Also, what you're talking about too is you're, you know, you're not having that stimulant effect from, you know, bright blue light. So that can definitely have, have an impact as well. But yeah, I think anytime you can get yourself to relax in a world that's trying to

get you to do anything but that is, you know, it's definitely a key. Yeah. I, uh, a thousand percent. And this is the menopausal evolutionary mismatch is that as women go into their 40s, we lose these hormones, but the world is not, we're not equipped. You know, we've got, we're type A, we've got so much information coming in. We're in go-go mode. And I'm finding that all these menopausal symptoms are becoming so magnified, not because hormones are more of a problem, but because our environment is more of a problem. So when I'm working with my, my reset academy members, we talk about red light all the time. We're always like, okay, let's put, we got to add some red light in at the beginning

of the day, at the end of the day. I just think it's so, it's so simple. So I absolutely love that. Talk a little bit about seasons. So, you know, when we go, like, you know, when I, in summertime, I got a lot of blue light. I've got a lot of daylight. It's easy for me to get up and see the sunrise and see the sunset.

But as we go into December, especially here in this hemisphere, the days get shorter. Does that mean that red light becomes more important then? Or do we need to change our usage with it throughout the year? So the days definitely become shorter. But, you know, I originally grew up in the Midwest. And not only the day is shorter, but it's cloudy. You know, once it hits past Thanksgiving in the Midwest, like for a lot of people know, like the sun's really not back until the springtime.

There are days. It'll poke out and be really sunny, but primarily it's what you'd call overcast. And so the sun isn't even out. It's still bright, like brighter than your house, you know, so it's still really good to get outside.

Even on a very cloudy day for your circadian rhythm, it's still best to get outside because it's brighter than in your home. But yeah, you're going without a lot of sun exposure. It's typical. A lot of people's vitamin D is low in the winter because the sun is,

and out, folks that live more in the northern hemispheres, Seattle, Canada, etc., like, you know, they don't get a lot of sun exposure. So you can argue it's even more critical to have a light therapy system during those winter months because you don't even have access even to regular sunlight. And not only that, it's winter. So the intensity is extremely low. So even if it is a really good sunny day, like your UV is going to be on your UV index, it's probably going to be like a one, if that, right? In summer, it's going to be a 10, you know, on a scale. So, yeah, there's, there's lots of limited exposure. And so even through the winter, you know, it's going to be very beneficial versus not having it. It's not a full. I want to make it clear for folks. It's

not a full sun replacement. The sun is full spectrum. So it's delivering all types of wavelengths that exist that we know of. The sun delivers all of them. This panel and Juve is only delivering a specific band of red and near infrared and actually just two wavelengths so it's very specific because what the goal is is to stimulate cellular function and so even out in the sun like you'd have to be out there for a really long time to get this single of a dosage of red and near infrared and then you know when you're out there and other times you're getting you know you're going to be tany etc a lot of times you can't be fully fully naked out out in the out in the sun some people might be if they have a nice private but you have a nice private backyard and who you're

neighbors are yeah some people some people have gone for like the i don't even want to say it but the the the naked tanning um i don't know if you've seen that going around but um part of that i have i have naked tanning very interesting body parts yeah yeah very interesting and so like what is the concept there is they're trying to expose like similar to what like a juve essentially is you're exposing areas that never get sunlight yeah trying to stimulate like cellular energy and so you see a lot get mixed around like red light is kind of gets mixed in with that and I don't know it's I never even thought of that okay so basically what you're saying is some red light I mean I know there are devices that are like internal devices for women um of red light but so red light on body parts

that don't get exposed like genitalia do we have any research on does will that increase like testosterone and men and estrogen and women well that that's a theory of how it's one of the leading theories of how it affects and is able to improve male testosterone is it's hitting the latex cells and the testes and stimulating them to produce more more testosterone. I don't really know because I think, you know, with what we're talking about, if you're delivering, like if I'm sitting in front of this device behind me and I, and I'm, you know, I'm fully naked and I'm able to just expose all my core vital organs like my head, my brain, etc. like I'm delivering a lot of energy

and then my body can then you know it kind of does with that as it sees fits I don't really know if it necessarily has to hit like your testes we always encourage you know as much skin as you can expose but that's an interesting theory of like something that you know would be interested in test is can you is it is just exposing it to those

other reasons is that how it produces testosterone to this point we don't we don't necessarily know let me know when that study comes out also do we know if increases vitamin D. You mentioned vitamin D a while ago. Can we use it as a vitamin D enhancer in the wintertime? So it doesn't necessarily stimulate vitamin D. That's kind of like the same. I'll kind of circle back to how I explain like the melatonin. Could it could exposing yourself as could help improve your body be able to produce vitamin D just as a result of you, you know, getting out in sunlight regularly, right? Could it help that process of you converting UV light that hits your skin to

vitamin D, et cetera, can it help that process along? Because that's a process, right? It's absorbed by the skin, et cetera. And then it eventually, I can't, I... It helps in the gut, I believe, right? It helps to absorb calcium. I believe vitamin D. It's a lot of benefits to it.

It changes the microbiome of the gut is some of the studies that I saw. So, like, my point there is it's first absorbed by the skin, right? And then it's helping in the guts. It's helping other areas. So it's got to have energy and processed your body to be able to do that. So like an offset benefit could it help? I mean, theoretically, yeah, but, Is it a direct source of it?

No. And the reason being is because it doesn't contain any UV light. Okay. And what about, there was a study that was done out of Canada a couple years ago about during the wintertime, they believe that people hold on to more fat. They don't burn as much fat because they're not getting as much light on the skin, which is actually mobilizing fat tissue. Whereas in the summer, you get that light.

They didn't say what spectrum of light, but do we know anything about, red light for mobilizing or breaking down fat cells? I think I know the one you're talking about. I believe it was more in that way. I think it was more blue light where that helped stimulate something of like wakefulness, fat burning, etc. And so since we don't get outside much, like they were trying to kind of link, I think link that to a little bit more of like part of the obesity problem.

So I know that when you're talking about was really interesting to know that fat cells even recognize light was super interesting. It just goes to show you even more of like we don't know. But in regards to weight loss, we do have a study that will be published here, hopefully in the next three to four months. The results are already done. And the research we're working with, he's writing his final manuscript for it. And then he'll submit it to a journal.

And that takes the process. But the results, and I've seen them, they're really interesting. And so in this particular study, it was overweight, obese diabetic women. And they just exposed themselves to regular, I think it was red light therapy treatments on a full body. Like it was a full body setup. And they were doing it three to three to four times a week, I believe. And they didn't see it. They saw, what they saw from benefits was on metabolically.

So they saw, you know, their insulin levels were drastically. reduced. They saw their LDL and HDL improved. They saw, I mean, it's just amazing, right? What's doing just on their metabolic, and this is just light, right? And so a couple other other errors they saw. They did see some circumference changes like the hips and et cetera. But most of the benefits of what they saw was metabolically, which was, you know, incredible. And right, and that kind of then taught, like that led me back to that, that keto study where they mixed. red light and keto and it and it's like well what is keto so great for it's helping metabolically right and so folks that are diabetic they tend to see a lot of benefits going on a ketogenic diet

because of um because of uh you know no sugar no no glucose responses etc so just just showing that like it helps metabolically you know that the the the use cases for it are kind of endless and that's that's what folks that are fairly sick right obese diabetic diabetic individual that's not a healthy individual and to show that it helped on a metabolic way, you know, just light, right? It's insane, right? It's kind of insane. Me saying it is really insane to just think this light just did this for these people. So I'd love to share that when that comes out because it's really interesting. Because, you know, when you look at 12% of Americans, and we have a worldwide audience, but 12% of Americans being metabolically fit, again, I'm going to go back to we can blame the food, we can blame

stress. We can blame lack of movement and the pandemic. There's a lot of fancy things to blame, but what we really need to do is go back and say, how did our cave ancestors live? What did they do? Because as my friend Bill Schindler, he wrote a book called Eat Like a Human says, he says the cave people were crushing it with their health. They were doing so well with their metabolic health primarily. And when I asked him about it, he's like, well, think about what they were doing. doing. They were fasting, so they got the ketones. They were moving to go hunt. They were sticking to meats and plants as their primary source of nutrition, and they were outside. They were at sunrise, sunset. They were out during the day. So everything that they did that we're not doing now,

we got to bring back. But when we sit in an interview like this, I mean, we both have light coming in. Oh, yeah. But we also are on our computers. I don't know how long you've been sitting here, but this is like my fourth hour of zooming today. It's not, it's so synthetic that it is destroying our metabolic health. And we've got to go back to what our cave ancestors did. And red light is a piece of that in my book.

Yeah. And I love that. I love that. And how I typically will talk about that is this modern day has brought us a tremendous amount of benefit. I mean, just the fact that you have running water in your house, you know, all that sort of stuff. But it's brought, that's brought challenges. Yes. And how can we live healthy in a modern lifestyle?

And that's exactly like to sum it up is bringing these type of tools that we can use because it's not going away. Right. It's like I love the thought of how hell like a, you know, how cavemen used to live and hunter gatherers. But I don't want to go live in a cave. Like I like being able to do an interview with with you right now. Right. Yeah. You're across the country.

And I love doing it. So, like, I love that thought concept, but, like, I don't want to go live out in the wilderness and maybe be eaten by a bear. Like, I'll take my home. So how can I live better, healthy in my home? Yeah, I love it. So how do people decide which panel to get? This is another dilemma that I've had and a lot of people have asked. And I usually say whatever your financial resources can afford you, go for the biggest and the best.

But is there, if I, you know, if we choose the go, it's the smallest circum. What do we need to know about the circumference area? So I think if you're, it really depends on like what, what are your goals? So if you're someone that has maybe some joint issues and you're really wanting to help with just relieve joint pain, right? Whether it be anywhere around your body, the go is it can be a great device for that because it can specifically target treat. But if you're looking at for something to maybe improve your overall health, then the more,

the more energy you can expose your body to, the better, you know? And so what's great, then aside from the go, all of our devices, the mini solo on up, they're all modular capability. So you can you could start with a small panel and then add to it later to build a bigger setup. Our accessories do that and they make it such a flawless experience. We have, you know, if anybody goes to our website, we have this pole system to where you can attach them and mount them on this pole and you can get other poles and you can attach them and you can create a bigger setup and you can do it over time. So you can start with one device, you know, and then. and then invest in the later. And we see that.

We see a lot of folks, excuse me, a lot of folks skeptical at first. And they're like, I started with one. And then I saw a benefit pretty quickly. So then they came and they bought more, but they weren't out.

It's like they didn't have to sell the one they bought. They could just add to it. And so that's what's great about our modular system is you can kind of start where, where you feel comfortable. And then you can expand over time. We have a great, actually, we just launched a great resource page for that where we,

we have a great video that. it kind of just explains the basics. And then we go, we have videos for each individual accessory option that can kind of break it down to see which best, you know, fits your home because it is something that's, that's an investment. And it's an investment in your health. And so we wanted to try to provide as many tools as possible for folks to pick the best thing for, you know, for them.

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I always say, you know what the most expensive thing is, is to be sick. I remember sitting with a good friend who went through 10 years of fighting cancer, and it was hundreds of thousands of dollars. And the year she died, I'll never forget, her mom was sitting on the couch next to her. And she was about 51 at the time, dying of breast cancer, in hospice care, in her living room. And her mom pulls me over aside and says, hey, Mindy, let me show you how much we've spent this year on her care alone. And she had like the top of the line insurance.

And at that point, it was around $75,000. They had spent to give her one more year of life. And that always hit me that, okay, we can bitch and moan about expenses of things like red light therapy. But when you really dive into understanding how important it is for your long-term health, you'll start to see that sickness is the most expensive thing you can do. And the fastest way to get sick is to completely ignore your health. health. It's funny. It's funny too because it's one, that's a very sad story. And it's, it's very common, I think, for a lot of people, you know, across the country. But it's funny.

It's like we, we wait too long to spend money on our health to where it's like already too late. You know, where, you know, and it's like, I don't know why we do that, right? Why do we buy the big flat screen TVs? And it's like, why don't we invest in this stuff that can help us for the longevity, right? Set yourself up so you can enjoy all that stuff, you know, later on. Because otherwise, if you don't take care, just like a car, it's like people understand the concept of a car, right? You got to get an oil change. You change the tires and everything. Our bodies are the same. If we don't, if we don't service the system and the machine, it's going to break, it's going to break down. And oftentimes we just kind of forget that.

And I think everybody falls, everybody falls into bad habits. You know, nobody's, nobody's perfect. But if you could just do some little things along the way, like you talked about like investing in a red light panel. And, of course, like bias. I'm biased, right? Because I want everybody to have a juve light. But it really is something that is so beneficial for your health. And it's easy to do. And what we've done at juve is we've taken the ability to be able to have full body exposure in your home.

Before Juve launched, the only option for full body exposure, we're, we're, we're, extremely expensive red light therapy beds and they range from 50,000 to 140,000 and we've taken that and be able to have not only that same clinical dosage but medical grade same the same quality in your home for a fraction of that of that cost so you know I I just love you guys and I love what you're doing and I so appreciate the modular system because I am that person believe it or not when it comes to a lot of these biohacks that it has to be makes sense to me. And the first time I saw this, I was like, okay, I think it makes sense. And then I experienced it. And I'm like, oh, wait, I can feel the difference. And then you want to end up

getting more and more. So the modular system is so crazy powerful. Let me finish up on this idea. I always ask all my guests at the end of the podcast, what is one thing you're grateful for this year and do you have a gratitude practice that you do on a daily basis? Grateful for, I'm grateful for my family. My beautiful daughter, who she's about to turn two, she's such a blessing to me and brings a smile to my face and just being able to experience being a father is, I'm thankful for that. You know, at the end of the day, like when things don't go right, you know, there's always

something to complain about and there's always, and so when I'm thinking of that, I'm thinking of like I have my beautiful daughter like you know it's it's something that's easy I can go back to being being thankful for um and I'd say like a ritual I think a lot when I do a red light session um I kind of use that as a time to really think about especially during the day and I you know even for anybody like like I'm guessing this is why you brought it up but anytime you're dealing with a challenge and you're upset about something it's so easy to kind of flip that switch just to focusing on like what you have and what you can be thankful for. You know what I mean?

And so I'd say my ritual would be, I kind of think a lot about that stuff when I do my red light sessions. You know, I started doing 20 minutes, the first 20 minutes of my day, I put on music that inspires me and I literally sit there and think of all the things that I'm grateful for. And my life has changed so dramatically doing that. It's such a small little habit that over time. time. It's amazing. It's almost like you program your brain to start to find more things to be grateful for when you do that. It's like setting the program before the day even starts. So I just

love that. Well, Wes, what we're going to do is you have some discounts and stuff going on. I know depending on when people are listening to this, I know you have some Black Friday sales. So we will put all your information so that my community can get those discounts. And any last things you want us all to know about red light or places we can go geek out on the research on it. Yeah, so I'll answer that first question. If you are listening to this around Black Friday time, that is when we do our biggest sale of the year. So if you're in the market for a Juve device and you're ready to purchase one, definitely wait until that Black Friday weekend. It will be the biggest savings that we ever offer in a calendar year. So you'll be able to save hundreds

on a new juve. And so, yeah, Black Friday. And then if you do go to our website, j-o-o-ov-v-com, juve.com, I encourage you before, don't go look at the products right away. Go look at the science page. Go, go read the information for, you know,

for your own eyes of what I've said, what Dr. Mindy have said. Go, go read it. You know, we have, it's all source. You can click on the studies. You can go directly to PubMed and read that stuff because there is a, there is a mountain of it and you can get lost in it.

So, you know, that's number one. Go go to that science page. But then number two, I encourage you to go to it on our website is the reviews page. Just go read what those people are saying. It's pretty amazing. I get. It's actually a really good idea. I wouldn't have thought to make that the second place to go.

That's a great idea. Yeah, I like to send people there because I don't necessarily know what it'll, what it can do for you. I mean, I know on a scientific level, like it can help skin, it can help this. Like there's a high likelihood it could. But I don't know in those areas that are kind of off label, right? That are still off label of hormones. We have people say, I've lost my sense of smell. My sense of smell is back.

We've had people with, I can't remember, what's that, what's that? It's not a disease, but where half your face can, like, go numb. Oh, Bell's palsy. We had somebody that has had Bell's palsy and they say, hey, I've tried everything. I've kind of just live with this. I, and she was using our light to do like a, um, a, um, a, um, media, she was, she was going to write a review for, for some media outlet. And so she was doing a review for them. And she's like, it's like 99% gone. And it's like, Red Light did that. Like,

I don't know. I can't explain that, you know. So my point is that's where you can find interesting stuff in the reviews, um, where it's just, it's, it's all, it's all just uploaded from customers and it's just real. So like those are two great places to start. Yep. Yeah. Love it. Well, Wes, thank you. And thank everybody at Juve for doing such a great job. You guys, again, were the first out of the gates, and you can continue to be just a high standard for red light. So thank you for entertaining my brain today and so grateful for everything you all are doing. Thank you so much for joining me in today's episode. I love bringing thoughtful discussions about all things health to you.

If you enjoyed it, we'd love to know about it. So please leave us a review, share it with your friends, and let me know what you're biggest takeaway is.