Live Like a Girl with Dr. Mindy Pelz - Lessons Learned from a Heart Attack - Dr. Mindy & Adam Massey

Episode Date: June 23, 2020

How are you living with intention? Adam Massey is the CEO of an AI services start-up called Fourteen33, veteran technology executive, public speaker, and podcaster. He is also a passionate student of leadership, management, and growth. In his 20+ year career, Adam has built companies from scratch, led large organizations, and been fortunate to be a part of some of the most innovative companies and teams in the world. Most of all, Adam loves being a father of 3 amazing kids, a husband, mountain biker, and a leader in his community.                                             In this podcast, we cover: How to live your life with intention What Adam has done differently after his heart attack About the red flags that Adam suffered prior to the heart attack The importance of finding balance Why we need to think for ourselves How small changes can lead to a massive impact Our sponsor of this episode is: PRIMAL KITCHEN | Use code: PELZ RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE: Adam Massey GrowthSwag Podcast The Monk Who Sold His Ferrari    

The information discussed in this episode is intended as general information only. It is not intended for one-on-one medical advice, and you should always consult your healthcare practitioner before making any changes. And if you like the content discussed in this episode, please go leave a review so that others can benefit from it as well. I am a woman on a mission that is dedicated to teaching you just how powerful your body was built to be. I like to do that by bringing you the latest science, the greatest thought leaders, and applicable steps that help you tap into your own internal healing power. The purpose of this podcast is to give you the power back and help you believe in yourself again.

My name is Dr. Mindy Pels, and I want to thank you for spending part of your day with me. Have you ever had a situation in your life that made you look at your health so drastically different in one brief moment. And this is exactly what happened to my next guest, Adam Massey. He is a former executive at Google. He was CEO of many startups working in the high tech world, and he had a heart attack. And prior to his heart attack, and you'll hear his story in this episode, he thought he was living a healthy life. But in one flash, in one moment, when the heart attack happened, he realized there was so much more that he can be doing. So I loved this conversation because it was so powerful to hear the mindset shift that that happened. And you don't have to have a

major crisis to get that mind shift, which is what his mission is. He now has a podcast called Growth Swag. And he talks a lot about leadership and mindset tools not only for health, but for life. So really excited to share this journey and conversation that I had with Adam. And if you are looking for some more mindset tools specifically around your health, but this podcast also, he dives into some mindset tricks around your life. You're not going to want to miss this episode. It was truly my honor to hear his journey and to share all of the gems of wisdom he has with all of you. So Dr. Mindy here.

And I have a topic. and a guest that I am so excited to talk with and to discuss this topic because we have not launched into this particular path before. So let me just start off by welcoming Adam Massey. Thank you so much, Adam, for being here. Oh, thank you for having me. I'm a big fan of all of your content. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. And you're like you and I have talked about, you're the person I'm trying to reach and really empower to take amazing care of their health. And so, So just to fill my resetters in on your journey, tell us a little bit about where you are now, the health crisis you had, and eventually we'll kind of get into your gross swag podcast.

But give us a little background on you. Yeah, absolutely. So Adam Massey, I am a 43-year-old tech executive here in the Bay Area. And my story is one that it was marked by, I think, the focal point of this was really in 2017. at the age of 40, I had a heart attack, a pretty severe heart attack, actually. That really opened my eyes. And a lot of people, when I tell that to you, they go, oh, my gosh, I'm so sorry. And in some ways, I go, you know, it was such a blessing, A, that I'm here, and I survived, because actually what happened was, and I'll go in a little bit more detail in this in a minute, if it's, if it's,

if it makes sense. But my left interior descending valve, which is also known as the widow maker, was totally clear one day, and I was feeling good that week. And Friday afternoon of that week. It was really hot. I went for a mountain bike ride. And a lot of things added up to the fact that I had some loose plaque, which many people around in their 40s accumulate, not the hard, thick plaque that, you know, you imagine probably when you're thinking of like, you know, heart clogging and things like that. But that really soft stuff ruptured. And when it ruptures, all of the white blood cells rush to it. You effectively get a clot. And I had basically an acute 100% blockage that happened very, very quickly. And so I went from.

feeling generally pretty good, not feeling bad, to knowing something was significantly wrong. Turns out the survival rate of that kind of heart attacks about 20%. Wow. Incredibly grateful to have survived. But back to what I was saying, in many ways it was a blessing because it really opened my eyes to how can I really prolong life, live healthy, be happy, live in harmony with my body and not fight it and create unnecessary friction. And so it caused me to kind of look back.

When I think about my 30s, my decade leading up to my 40th birthday, I kind of thought I was a healthy guy. I would always like I was very into, I've always kind of been into like nutrition because I've struggled with weight here and there over the years. And so I was always the first to jump on a new fat diet. I would stress my body out in retrospect. Like I would get really into things like CrossFit or extreme adventure racing and things like that because I've got this kind of like probably an ego I need to feed, but I wasn't really

at the right level of fitness and conditioning. So in retrospect, I looked at some of those different kicks I got on as probably more stressful than bad. And you combine that with diet. The other trend I would say, which I've gotten feedback from like my social friends is fairly common is I've got three young kids. So as I was raising kids in my 30s or in the very early ages, I started meeting more parents. It was very social. There was just a lot of drinking and stuff. And I would never say that I've struggled with alcohol, but I think that my normal was not normal. Or maybe it is more normal than it should be. But what I realized was like more often than not, you know, we were kind of drinking a little bit of wine or a couple glasses of wine every night.

Weekends, there was a lot of social recreational drinking. And not the drinking in itself is terrible. You can make your own call on that, but it led me to a lot of other things like poor, eating decisions, poor nutrition, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, all those things kind of compounded on May 2017 when I had this heart attack. And so it's kicked off a really, I think, an awakening for me and certainly a health journey where I've really been trying to optimize longevity and health and wellness. I love it. I love it. You need to come check out our biohacking center. We have a whole, we have all these really cool pieces of equipment that tap into your own healing power. So when we all come out, when we come out of quarantine, you can come check it out.

You know what's so interesting is that in the 24 years I've been in practice, when you sit with somebody who has either been given a diagnosis of cancer, who is really sick and out of answers, their motivation for their health goes up in an instant. Like they go from like, yeah, I should probably stop drinking. Yeah, I should probably eat really a lot better. And then they have this crisis moment. And their motivation for improvement dramatically changes. Do you feel like that happened to you? Or did it take some time to figure out how the heck did you get there? Oh, for sure.

I mean, so I definitely have thought many, I've reflected many times on the fact that prior to that event, I never thought about it this way at the time, but in retrospect, I felt invincible. Like, in fact, even while I was having the heart attack, I didn't believe it was a heart attack. I thought it was heat stroke or I was balking because I was on a mountain bike ride

and I hadn't eaten that much that day, which now I know is actually not a bad thing. But, you know, I felt invincible. there was no way I was having a heart attack. There was just no way. Even in the back of my mind, I acknowledged that could be a possibility. I didn't believe it. And so absolutely, I feel like it goes from, it's in acute shift.

For me, my initial reaction was fear of like, what does this mean? I mean, at the time, I still do. I have three young kids. So I was like, gosh, you know, am I going to die in a couple years? How do I ensure that? And by the way, another thing that's scary about this whole thing in that existential sense is, I can't get life insurance anymore. And that freaked me out at first.

You know? Interesting. And not because I can't get life insurance, but the whole idea that the fact that they won't insure me means, you know, I'm high risk. You're tainted. Exactly. Interesting.

I think it's totally shifted all that. And I've chilled out a lot on that stuff now. Now I know I'm definitely going to be not dying a few years. And I actually think I will probably live longer than the average person or, you know, than I would have certainly before. But absolutely. I think it puts that into focus. And you start thinking a lot more about the long haul.

about some of these choices you can make that don't have immediate payoff, that compound over long periods of time. Absolutely. And I'm in Silicon Valley too, and I watch so many of these Silicon Valley families. And I mean, my family would be the same one where you've got, you know, both parents working. You've got kids in all these activities. Everybody's living a very abundant and fast-paced life. And sometimes I have to ask myself if this is benefiting us or not.

and some people are really stressed in that fast-paced life. Do you feel like you were in a place of high stress, high-performance kind of mode? Definitely. And some of it was self-inflicted as well, but definitely. I think we still, to some degree, have very high-paced, I think the Bay Area is a high-paced place

where just the general tempo and cadence of things is accelerated significantly. I also think, you know, our culture is one that you work long hours, you work hard, and you prioritize work over yourself, I think that's very short-term thinking, and that's one of the things that has become very prominent in my mind in the aftermath of that event, which is, you know, it's better to take time for self-care and for yourself. You'll be more productive and more impactful at work. So I started noticing that, like, yeah, I might have been at work, working, hustling really hard, commuting, all that,

but how was my performance level and how is my actual impact? And I would argue, and I tell younger folks who I'm mentoring, you need to have that balance because balance will make you more effective. And when you show, I'd rather show up a little bit less at the highest level possible than kind of always be there operating at a mediocre level. Yeah, yeah. It's that short-term awareness that we need to have. It's so important to understand that one of my favorite quotes is do something today

that your tomorrow self will thank you for. Yeah. And I think we don't ever think about the tomorrow self. And definitely when it comes to, you know, and I can only speak for here in the Bay Area, but, you know, we are so focused on careers and kids getting into colleges and remodeling homes and things like that.

And that's what we think our tomorrow self is. But all it takes is one moment like what you had to realize, oh my gosh, all of that does not make a difference if I don't have my health. And health needs to be at that foundational place. And if you're healthy, everything can blossom from that point. You're saying those things, it's like that's most people's normal and it's super stressful.

You're constantly worried about so many things that really aren't even in your control. But that's just everybody's doing it and everyone's stressed out and you're thinking about, I mean, just for me to even reflect on the cost of putting my three kids through college, not to give me another heart attack. But I'm not worried about that right now. I'm just worried about trying to create, you know, follow the path that's in front of me and do the best I can. One of the things that I did, which was really beneficial now, after this, at some point,

I got healthy again, I went back to work, and I started questioning, like, my purpose. Like, am I doing the right things? Am I focused on the right things? And I went through this exercise where I was reading a book or something. They were talking about, you know, grounding yourself in your decisions and your core values. And I remember thinking, oh, I totally want to, like, coach my kids to do that. And then I thought, wait a minute, what are my core values? I don't even know mine.

How can I coach my kids to do that if I don't know mine? And so I kicked off in a process to try to get down to three core values that really are my personal core values, how I want to direct and lead my life. I wasn't able to get to three. I got to four. But that, I think, opened up a whole other level of awareness of like, what's important in my life and how am I going to prioritize my time and my decisions and ultimately live with more intention?

And I think that's the thing, right? And we're talking about that hectic burial life. A lot of us aren't really living with intention. You're reacting all the time. That's a really stressful place to be. Oh, my God, that's so well said. I don't talk about this very much. But when my kids were little, I was on a vacation down in Cabo and I swam into a pile of Portuguese manor. And I almost lost my life. And I came out of that experience really with that same kind of aha of like, why am I here? Why did I not go? I'm here for a reason. How do I want to show up every day now? And I do think those moments are gifts that we can really make a decision to do things differently, which is again, why I was so intrigued to bring you on and help people see that because you can learn so much from somebody who almost in an instant lost their life. And it really can be impactful. So one thing I have, I want to know from you is what did this? the pre-heart attack Adam look like compared to the post-heart attack Adam? Like, what have you done differently that now as you move beyond this moment? Yeah. So that's a question I love talking about.

So a couple of things. I'd say the big changes I've made post-heart attack were nutrition, mindfulness, probably time management and spirituality. So let me break some of these down. Yeah, please. Of course, like exercise actually. But I'd say first, let's talk about nutrition. So as I mentioned, I kind of yo-yo-weighted a lot. My weight yo-yoed a lot over the years. I did a lot of fad diets, but I'm always got a big eater. Like, I love eating and I was pretty bad with portion control. I also mentioned that like just recreationally, we drank a lot. So the big changes I made was actually about six months after the heart attack, I took a year off of drinking and just cut out alcohol for year. And what I found, the main reason I did that actually was I was finding it difficult to modulate.

Like I was saying, I would go to a party and I'd say, I'm only going to have two glasses of wine. And it would just like those two glasses of wine would go really fast. And I'd start stressing about it. And so I was like, it's just easier for me. I'm kind of an all or nothing person just to say, you know. And so taking a year off of drinking was a good reset for me. And it helped me realize I've since started, I enjoy a craft beer once and a while. But it's very far and few between.

It's certainly, you know, one, two beers a week now versus probably one, two beers or wines or whatever per day or more. So that's one big change. and I think that gave me a good reset to be able to reset what my normal was, and also realize I don't really need alcohol. And alcohol is tough because it's like empty calories, it gets easy to overdo, it becomes a crutch. It also, for me, led to poor nutrition. So the next thing I did was nutrition.

Obviously, coming out of a heart attack, nutrition is one of the first things you try to optimize. I initially just tried to do some basic things. I started doing some research, and I found a couple prominent books on reversing heart disease. and the primary clinically proven ways to do that are through a plant-based diet. I was a very big meat eater before that, so that was like a scary shift for me. I did make the shift.

My body responded very well to plant-based. I dropped like 40 pounds and got really fit because at the same time, I'm a big kind of, I really became much, much more passionate about mountain biking. And when you lose weight as a cyclist, your performance goes through the roof. Yeah, I bet. That worked really well. it still is working pretty well, though, like, as I've shared with you separately, I've started to kind of slowly put some weight back on, and it's not unhealthy weight, but it's a weight I prefer not to put

back on, especially for cycling. So now I'm trying to wonder, like, I've probably adapted a little bit to my diet. I'm probably a little bit carb-heavy, so now I'm actually looking to maybe make some tweaks and fine-tune my nutrition. But big thing there was for me after heart disease was reducing the levels of cholesterol and some various other things that were present in my blood. The other thing, nutrition, by the way, is I have this amazing doctor who did a genetic test. And there's a genotype, the APO-E genotype, turns out as kind of an interesting one. I happen to be APOE 3-3-4, 4 being kind of a bad one. So when you're a 3-4 mix, you're prone to heart disease, you're prone to some other things. You don't process toxins quite as well. And so because of that, she also encouraged me to go plant-based

and be much more whole food oriented, whole nutrition oriented. But I'm still experimenting with diet. So that's one other change. I'd say one of the big changes to reflect back on our previous conversation has also been, I'm trying to just also like slow things down, be a lot more present, a lot more mindful. I'm trying to both meditate, you know, intentionally, but also just spend more quiet time. And that means over rotating, I think, not always like having to fit everything I can into a day. thinking about a day in terms of how do I get the optimal level of balance?

Get work done that I'm proud of, spend some time with my family, invest in myself a little bit, usually through getting out on the bike or doing whatever, ensuring that you've got that balance. And I also like being more in service to my community. That's part of my purpose. And I want to, you know, that's part of why I started my podcast and stuff. So those are all things I think that I was never intentional about before that I'm intentional about now. And it feels really good and it feels aligned.

Yeah, that sounds like the recipe. for an amazing life is what you just gave, right? Like, it really is true that we can get stuck in the hamster wheel and the, I've got to do this, I've got to do this, I've got to do this, and you don't ever take a step back to realize that 10 years you blink and 10 years have gone by. So have you ever read the book, The Monk Who Sold Is Ferrari? No. Ah, you have to read it. I'm going to. Okay, so it's Robin Sharma. I read it like 30 years ago. It's an old book. And it's about a guy, a lawyer who has a heart attack in the middle of a courtroom,

and he decides, forget it, this isn't worth it anymore, and he goes and becomes a monk. And it's great, it's called the monk who sold his Ferrari. You would resonate with this. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, okay, and so I would, I mean, we don't have your wife here, but if I could ask her if you're a happier person now than before, do people give you that feedback that you just,

you vibrate at a happier frequency that you're calmer. Like surely with that many changes, people give you good feedback. Yeah, and I get that feedback a lot now, especially now. I think, you know, I will share that there was a period, I think in the first year of this transformation, where I felt a little lost and scared, and I probably over-rotated in all these things. Like, it was probably during that period where I stopped drinking.

I was very, like, militant about all these things because I was super paranoid about trying to get my life on the right track. And I think that was actually a tough time for my wife and I because we were in very different places and we hadn't struck that balance of harmony. Now things are in harmony and they're really flowing very well. So now I feel like I've come back to a place where balanced is a really good term to describe it in harmony with my family.

And I definitely get that feedback from others that like, hey, you've just got this like glow about you and this purpose and energy. So I think that's achievable for everybody. I do a big part of his letting go of some stuff that's just really not that important at the end of the day. You said something earlier I will definitely agree and resonate with. I make a lot of decisions going, what will 90-year-old Adam think about this? Should I do it or should I not? Like, should I take this risk or should I not? And that actually serves me well. Yeah. Yeah. And I'll tell you just in working with so many people with health issues, is that I resonate with what you're saying about how I thought it was healthy. thought I was okay. It's like you didn't have any litmus test to tell you you were not okay until you

had the crisis. And I think with health, it's so easy for the bad habits to build and then they become bigger and bigger and bigger until the body is in a state of crisis or disease. I think like right now, if we just look at what we're dealing with with the COVID-19, I've been walking around saying the reason I think this thing is spreading so quickly is because you're dealing with so many people who are immune compromised and they don't even know it. Yes. Because they have been living the life that you are living. They've been eating bad. Well, your food wasn't bad, but so many people are eating bad food, living stressful lives, thinking about things other than their health. And then a virus can come to town and they're unprepared, just like a heart attack can show up and you don't even

realize it. Yeah. I think that's totally right. And it's funny, you know, speaking of COVID-19, We were talking about like the pace and the speed and the stress. There's a lot of people right now who are in tough situations because their business has been destroyed. But there's also a lot of people inside. I don't want to, you know, be insensitive to that because that's, it's awful. But there's also just a lot of people, I think, that are being forced to slow down and spend more time with family. Like in our neighborhood, I'm noticing just like more, so many more families going for upton and walks and bikes. And, you know, so there's some good that can come from this to you, maybe a little bit of just a,

slowing down of some of the pace. The other thing, just real quick, I think it's interesting is, I forgot to mention one thing. There were some red flags, symptomatic red flags that I didn't realize at the time, but when I looked back, are I think glaring. One was prior to the heart attack, I would have, I struggle with a lot of heartburn. I would notice that I would have these, like this raging heartburn from time to time. And I just thought, oh, you know, getting older, kind of comes with the territory, just have to deal with that. I never got on heartburn medication, but I know a lot of people do use that as a band-aid. So that's one thing. The other thing I had noticed was I would have a lot of like really chronic night sweats.

Like I'd wake up, you know, in the morning and my sheets would be soaked, you know, and that doesn't happen anymore. And then I also had some digestive stuff that was an anomaly that's totally gone now. And so when I think about some of those things, it's interesting, like my body was trying to tell me, like, this is not right. You know, you're not living in the optimal, you're not eating or living in the optimal way, but I just sort of took those things as, you know, getting older or whatever. And when I made changes to my diet specifically, that stuff just went away completely. Also, like, you know, I don't get sick that much anymore either, right? So anyway, so I feel like there's a lot there. You know, again, this is again why I do all the videos that I do on YouTube. And if you watch,

there's a common thread in them, which is I'm trying to teach people how to think because it's not, it's not going to benefit people if health influencers get up and just say, you should think this way. What I want people to do is start to think for themselves. And one of the challenges we have with symptoms is that when we have a symptom, we have been taught one of two things. Ignore it and it'll go away or medicate it and it'll go away. But we don't use it as like if your body could talk to you, it would be like, hey, Adam, this is not going well down here. that's what it's trying to say to you. But we from an early age have been taught to completely either medicate or ignore that stuff.

And that is one of the big missions that I'm on is like let's wake people up. And one of the reasons I'm so excited, this sounds horrible, but one of the reasons I am so excited about COVID-19 is I think we all have this moment where we can go, okay, am I vulnerable, would I be vulnerable to this virus? Like maybe there's something, how is my health? I think you've got a world of people that don't know. Yeah, I think you're right. So it'll be really interesting.

So, okay, what, a couple other thoughts that I have. If you could go back and talk to the 39-year-old Adam and give him some advice, what would you give him? Gosh, that's a really great question. So, I mean, I think it would really be, I'm trying to think about how I would actually frame it because it would clearly be, dude, you're eating like an idiot because I wasn't eating well. Like I, you know, I think back on it. I'm not anti-meat by any means, but I was eating like steak multiple times a week, cheeseburgers multiple times a week, a lot of like high-carb, like all the bad stuff together.

And then I would go a couple days low-carb and say I'm paleo, right? So like I think just being a lot smarter about food and looking at food as, you know, sure there's a pleasure element to food, but really first and foremost thinking about food as, you know, fuel for your body and medicine, right? I think that's a really good lens to look at it through. I'd say the other thing is balance. I have sense, like when I'm coaching people or just friends when I talk to, I'll say like I think about things like in balance of this quadrant where I've got,

you know, how am I showing up as a father? How am I showing up as a husband? How am I showing up at work and how am I showing up for myself? And not all of those will ever be in perfect balance. But when one of them gets too far out of whack, they all get out of whack. And so I'm constantly assessing balance across those things because those four things end up being, they reflect my priorities. And so balance is another really good thing.

And I think the other one would just be slow down, right? Carve out time for yourself because like you're going to show up better in every other aspect of your life if you're taking care of yourself first. You're the foundation, right? Like you're not an, you're not just like this asset. You can't burn it out. You've got to invest in that in yourself. Absolutely.

The way I had always heard those different pieces of our lives that like makes me kind of check in and realize I need to work on some of the areas that I may not be putting enough attention on is it's like spokes of a wheel. And so if you've got family, you've got your spouse, you've got your career, you've got your health, you've got yourself. Like in order for the wheel to work, you can't have some of the spokes be longer than the other. You've got to be working on keeping all of them equal. So it really, and we our society does not teach that. It does not, we get rewarded for, you know, the careers and the, and what I call it. We call it. We, we get rewarded for, you know, and what I call outside, outside living, the stuff that people see on the outside.

We don't always get rewarded and applauded and patted and patted on the back for taking and saying care of ourselves. Yeah. And by the way, I guess one last thing I would, I think, just from reflecting on it, that I would really want to tell 39-year-old self is like, I would ask the question, are you living with intention? And I think a lot of people are. I'm very impressed with a lot of younger people who have just this incredible sense of purpose

and direction. I didn't have that. In fact, I feel like when I look back at my 20s and 30s, it's kind of floating through life, reacting to opportunities, seizing those opportunities. And that served me well. Certainly serving me well from a career perspective. I was lucky enough to marry a great woman, have amazing kids. But like, I don't ever really feel like I was living super intentionally. As far as we know, it's the one life we have. And so I think being more intentional with how you spend your time, how you treat others, how you serve your community, how you treat yourself, it's super important. And this event really put that in focus for me.

I love that. I love that. So what would you tell the person that's listening right now that is resonating with some of the things that you're saying and is like, ah, yeah, I really need to maybe make some changes to myself, but it's difficult. So I mean, I think when you have a crisis, sometimes it becomes a little bit easier because you know what the consequence could be. But what about the person that's listening and goes, yeah, it really should do something about that. Do you have any advice that you would give them? Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, that's my mission. I would love to, I had an OSH moment. I don't if I can say that word here, but like, I sure you can. Yeah, I swear all the time. I had a no shit moment. And I would love to inspire people

to get the same realizations or awakening without having to have their own. So that's my mission. I think what I would tell people is, you know, don't look at this as like this Mount Everest you have to climb, like baby steps. I would say, do an honest self-assessment of where you really feel like you can maybe feel that you need to make the biggest course corrections and start to do real small baby steps. Experiment with what works for you, what doesn't work. But I would, you know, for sure, I think the key things you want to understand your body because you're different than everybody else. And, you know, one of the things I found is having a really great sort of health wellness partner, which is my general doctor. She's amazing. Has been great. But it could be, you know,

it could be a number of different people in your life who are giving you that. Self-assess where you are with health, diet, nutrition, exercise, rest. One of the things I'm not practicing what I preach, I don't get enough sleep and I need to work on that. I'm kind of a night owl, but I also have a morning routine. You need to get an aura ring. Do you have an aura ring? No, but I want one.

Yeah, it'll make you go to bed earlier. It does that to me. That's cool. I got to do that. Because it scores it. So you get up in the morning, you're like, ah, man, I got a bad score. Okay, tomorrow night.

I'll do better. Yeah, I got to do that. That's a good call. But yeah, I would just sort of self-assess where you're at on a couple of different planes. figure out what your priority is and then start to do baby steps. Like, you know, you and I were talking about, you know, how to implement intermittent fasting. Well, like, you don't start by doing like a 36-hour fast, right? You start with a little baby and pushing back breakfast a little bit. And so I would say the same thing.

And then ultimately, like, if you're really honest with yourself and I talk to my friends all the time, you know where you're living in friction. And, I mean, you can really kind of, especially if you start to honestly self-assess, you'll be able to sense where you can make some small changes that will have big impact. And then I think these changes start to become addictive, getting out of your company. comfort zone, trying new things, experimenting with what works for you. I think those are all good things to do. Yeah, I love it. I love it. That's great. Well, I appreciate you telling your story. And I, you know, I think that people who have had those moments really need to get up and shout them so that we can all learn from them. So I appreciate that. I like to end all my podcast interviews with this thought, because everybody, whether the, and you, I think you'll, you already know it, but everybody has a

message for the world, whether they're aware of it or not. If you had one message for the world, and maybe it's the message your life stands upon, what would that message to people be? I mean, I think for me, life is all about love. And to me, love encompasses so much. It encompasses how you treat yourself, your loved ones, your community, how you, you know, for me, my intention is to live with love and light and shine to everybody. I can. That might sound cheesy or whatever. But like, for me, I think that's what it all comes down. to. And to me, the opposite force from love is fear. And I'm really trying to release myself from fear. And so for me, that's a big thing. And I think that shows up with how you serve your community,

how you show up for your family, how you treat your employees, your co-workers, all of them. So nine out of ten people I interview say love. Wow. That's awesome. And it's really interesting because I interview everything from, you know, doctors to people who are doing unique things in the world. And they, everyone almost comes back to, you know, the idea of love, which is so cool. That makes me, that increases my confidence in us as a human race and civilization. Right? Yeah, it's really cool. It's like, you know, here you spend, you know, 30 minutes talking to somebody about a totally different message and when you ask them that one question,

they all come back to love. So cool. I would not have said that in my 20s, I don't think. I think I would have said something super-ticky and lame. I haven't interviewed a lot of 20-year-olds yet, so yeah, probably not. So, okay, how do people find you? Because you're doing something really neat with your podcast, which has me intrigued. Yeah, no, I appreciate it. So my podcast is called Growth Swag, S-W-A-G. It's available on most of the podcasting platforms.

I'm fairly new at it, so you'll only find, I think, 13 or 14 episodes so far, but it's all about growth. So, you know, it's a little bit about leadership and career growth, but mostly about personal growth and, you know, how we can get outside of our comfort zone and ultimately be good to ourselves, be good to our communities, and have impact.

Yeah, awesome. I love it. So we'll put the links to your podcast in our notes. And thank you again. You know, not everybody comes out of a crisis with a mission like this. So we're just grateful to learn from your experience. So thank you. I'm grateful for coming on.

Thank you so much. My pleasure. Organic food in and you shake bad toxins out. That's what it's all about. You put fast cycling. Fast types out. You download. That's what.

That's what resetting is. Oh.