The Ricochet Podcast - Dinner At Rob's

Episode Date: November 30, 2013

Direct link to MP3 file We has planned to do a new show this week, but travel and technical issues got in the way. Please accept our apologies and this previously publicly unreleased dinner party at Rob’s house recorded on November 9th, 2013. Rob, Troy Senik, Mickey Kaus, Ricochet General Counsel Daniel Friedland, and shy, retiring Ann Coulter — got together to talk, well... Source

They say you can't hurry love, but if you don't get to your post office by March 23rd, you'll miss your chance to save €2.50 on a book of 10 heart-shaped love stamps. Now, just €14. Down from €16.50. Perfect for all kinds of love messages like, We're getting hitched. You're still my favourite. Or,

Growl McCree. If you've a couple of fuckle. Buy yours now at your local post office or at onpust.com. Send joy. Show growl. Send love. Onpust. For your world. T's and C's apply or at OnPost.com. Send joy. Show grow. Send love. OnPost. For your world.

Decencies apply. See OnPost.com. Go ahead. Hello and welcome to a Friday night in my house in Venice, California. Ordinarily I cook. All I can do all the time today is cook dessert. I'm sitting here with our old friend Ann Coulter. Ann, how are you? Fantastic. A little disappointed you didn't make the whole meal. I dessert. I'm sitting here with our old friend Ann Coulter. Ann, how are you?

Fantastic. A little disappointed you didn't make the whole meal. I know. I saw your look of kind of disappointment. Well, I let you down. I apologize. You are here. Where are you on the book tour? Is this the middle? Yeah, I guess it's about the middle. We're about three weeks in.

Oh my god. How long does the book work out? It ends at Thanksgiving. Are you just exhausted at the end of it? I'm exhausted today. And tomorrow you are meeting you are appearing, no, Sunday you're appearing. Tomorrow I'm appearing at 5 I'm getting picked up at 5am

to do Fox and Friends from LA. Oh my god. And then I'm doing NBC Latino at 5 a.m. to do Fox and Friends from L.A. Oh, my God. And then I'm doing NBC Latino in the parking lot of Fox because I figured I'd have my hair and makeup done. That seems racist. And I want to go home and sleep. And also I thought we'd bring out the Latinos to my USC speech. Right, so the USC speech is on Sunday,

and you'll be doing an appearance with the Hancock Park Patriots. And USC Republicans. And USC Republicans. And then apparently there's some protesters. Yes, I believe it may have been a strategic error for the Hancock Park Patriots to decide to have this event on a college campus. Because normally when I show up at a college campus, it's like David Duke speaking. You have to have the room lined with cops. I have to have

personal bodyguards. And we just thought, oh, it's going to be a sweet little tea party group. So that's why I've been doing radio all day to try to bring out nice people like you, Rob Long.

Okay, I'll do it. You haven't bought your ticket. I haven't bought my ticket yet, but I will do it. We are joined here by Troy Seneke. You heard his laugh earlier. Troy, how are you?

I'm as good as the one glass of wine I've had with a woman. There's more wine. I feel like you didn't read my contract right. I did not. I will go get some.

And Mickey Kaus, my neighbor Mickey Kaus. Howdy. I just wandered in. Mickey was not invited. I wasn't invited. I just saw the light on. Mickey is sort of pre-homeless,

I think. I would call that work. And we are also joined silently. He can't say anything because if he does, it's a billable hour. We can't afford it. Ricochet corporate attorney, Daniel Friedland, who has been a huge help to us and really is a major reason why we have Ricochet.com and we don't have sad letters to our investors

and why the Obama administration has not harassed us although that's coming. All right, so, it's a Friday night. We've never really done this before. You and I, we've not done this once before. We did.

We were drinking right in there and you made dinner. Well, I made dessert, okay? Is this going to be a six-act play now? Didn't you make dinner last time? I made dinner. Last time you made dinner.

I'm having two desserts tonight. Yeah, exactly. Okay, so, we were talking earlier before you guys got here, about the biggest loser politically from Obamacare rollout. Because I'm not done with this. This is so much fun. This is so fun.

It's like Christmas every day. It's like Christmas every day. And I was positing the biggest loser is Joe Biden. I got to hear that. Well, he's going to run for president, right? And it's not Barack Obama. Barack Obama can't really run. But the last time they had the presidency, the House and the Senate, remember the first thing they did?

It was something called Hillarycare. Now, admittedly, it didn't pass, but I believe it bore many similarities. And by the way, I haven't given you my vote on who's the biggest loser. I know. Who's the biggest loser? Mickey Kaus. He doesn't seem like he's lost all that much. I think I've lost a lot, but I'm not that big.

I've lost everything I have. And nobody cares. You're a huge... I was a supporter of Obamacare. I figured, why not give this attempt to bring competition to drive up efficiency and drive down prices, give it a chance before we go to the single payer system that everybody on the left really wants. And I think it might work. It might not work. I still think it could work.

Maybe there's, so he's really screwed that if there were a Democratic House, you could, for example, they larded up the plan with all these essential benefits that Anne rightly complains about. Which they were inevitably going to do. You know, maternity benefits, drug treatment benefits that people don't necessarily want. Well, get rid of those. And then the cost will be cheaper and there won't be such sticker shock. And, you know, that's one fix they could do. The other fix is they've put all the expense. It turns out, and Josh Barrow had a very good column on this. It turns out that one of the reasons the rates

are so high, because insurance think that these uninsured people are like loser, high risk people with bad habits who they really don't want to insure. It's going to cost them a lot of money. So all those people, they're not just ordinary people like people who already have insurance. They're worse from the insurer's point of view. They're going to flood into the system and cost insurers a lot of money. So they compensate by raising the rates on all the normal people who already have individual insurance. Well, why should they bear the burden? You know, I mean, spread the burden around. So maybe there's some mechanism. This is why Mickey was the was attacked in my column

That's why I'll be protesting your event And a bullhorn, yeah, yeah Mickey cows out there This is the problem with Harvard you people think you can just design the perfect system and we can figure it out all out And by the way, you didn't mention the big Blue Ribbon Commission you're now suggesting this week to fix it. The Blue Ribbon Commission is a political move to give voters

some confidence that he is not going to be the one to fix it. Have you met an American voter? You find me an American voter who has confidence in the Blue Ribbon Commission. If it's headed by Bill Clinton, I think it'd work. Oh, you've got to be kidding. Oh, my Lord. Anyway.

That's actually a really diabolical move, but Obama would never do that. Well, Clinton would never do it either. It's like, here, you take this mess. And by right, it would be no confidence. No, you, I can't even, we're skipping the insanity of Bill Clinton being Mr. Popularity.

There's a reason Al Gore didn't campaign with him. No, what you are describing, and this is the problem with Harvard people, you talk about competition and what the insurance companies should be weighing and how insurance should work. This is known as the free market. And, you know, you've learned about the problem of government intervention with things like welfare and the unintended consequences, but you just come right back to it when it's something new.

And of course it's going to be a disaster. Of course it will be run like the Amtrak food service. But no, we worked it out on paper. This time it's going to work. This time, everything you had in your column of what the Blue Ribbon Commission should consider, and I would add a billion other things they should consider, are already considered when you have 310 million people

making decisions for themselves about their own health care. But we don't. We have a system called Medicare that works for people over 65. It's single payer. They're happy with it. They're so happy with it that the Tea Party is going to prevent them from screwing around with it because the Tea Party is very conservative on Medicare. They like Medicare.

Medicare works. So worst comes to worst, we expand Medicare. Make it 55 and over, 45 and over. It's not the free market, but it works. We are Blue Ribbon Commission without being part of the... I just haven't seen a guy, a big fat guy in a suit with like a little badge. This Blue Ribbon Commission, I called to order

when it was 1934. You can't argue that Medicare doesn't work. It's expensive. It's expensive, but it works. No, it absolutely does not work. It absolutely does not work. This is insane. We just expand Medicare. The idea that, yes, people on Medicare like it.

Well, yeah. That's all they have. I assume 11-year-olds like birthday parties. Can we pull the neighbors and the cousins who are required? Hey, you have an 11-year-old having a birthday party. Do you like birthdays? I love birthdays. If you took a vote on Medicare, it would be very popular.

No, it's too expensive. It's bankrupting the country. We have no money for defense. Everyone, everyone, even the Obama administration admits that within less than a decade, Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security is everything the federal budget

will be spent on. So you cannot say this is a smooth-running program. Just expand it. No, we can means test it, and that solves the problem. It's like a $1,000 hamburger. And you're telling me, but it's a very good hamburger. Well, it damn well better be a good hamburger. We can't afford it.

Who would be on the Blue Ribbon Commission on this? It's not even Bill Clinton. Realistically. I ran into a guy named Ovik Roy He wouldn't do it Very weird He's a Romney advisor Who thinks that the exchanges

Could be made to work But Obama screwed it up with too much regulation Okay He's a smart guy He would be very good for the commission I just see you in your room regulation. Okay? He's a smart guy. He would be very good for the commission. Guys like him. I just see you in your room with like a little action figures

with Avik Roy on one of them. And they're like having the little like having a blue ribbon commission. I'm here. I have a blue ribbon commission. Well, take a seat. Does anybody want some coffee? Well, yes. I'll have a coffee. Well, let's get down to the business of it. Well, at least we should have some cookies.

Thank you. And I just see this. Even saying it, don't you realize what an incredible admission of defeat this is? They had all these commissions. These guys were so arrogant. I would not. I'm against anything that helps him out of this mess. He did it himself.

He deserves it. This BS, like mealy-mouthed, weasel-worded apology the other day was ludicrous. I want him in tears. I will not be happy that this president with snot streaming out of his face like a big glazed donut begs forgiveness for being

such a dumbass. Things you could only say behind the payroll. Yes. Troy, am I wrong? No, you're not wrong. Yes. Troy, am I wrong? No, you're not wrong. By the way, I actually think I think your biggest loser to answer the original question.

Oh, I forgot. I think your biggest loser because they've got if you want to play it forward to 2016 to folks like Biden, there's a lot of time for them to adjust what they can. I think your biggest loser

is short term red state Democrats. People who are running next year in places like Arkansas and Louisiana and North Carolina, Alaska, Montana, they do not have the time. If Republicans are not stupid enough

to run Christine O'Donnell in every one of those states. That's fighting words. So you're saying the big winner then is of those states. Right. I'm fighting words. Okay. But you could, so you're saying the big winner then is Republican Senate.

It could be, but given Ann's proviso, I mean, you have to, that is not mathematical certainty. That's right.

And not just the Tea Partiers, as I described in my fabulous New York Times bestselling book. Look at that. It was seamless.

Never trust the liberal upper three, especially Republican. There's also the consultants who lose at West Virginia twice. Twice, because they just go for the deep-pocketed candidate. John Racy, probably a fine individual, but he has homes in Telluride, Palm Beach, and one in Tennessee. His wife doesn't even, or not Tennessee, in West Virginia. His wife won't even live in West Virginia. Let's run him twice.

Fantastic idea. So they all have new Jaguars and we've lost two Senate seats. Two. Right. I think the other thing that you have to consider too is there's a certain amount of prudence that goes into this. I mean, if you look at how these Tea Party challenges have shaken out over the past couple years, you can win it with Iran, Paul, and Kentucky. You can win it with a Ted Cruz in Texas.

Because these are pretty conservative states. Mike, you can go to the right of Bennett in Utah because you've got an electorate to do that. You can't do it in freaking Delaware. You were telling me this the other night at dinner, which I thought was a really good point. Could you unpack that for everybody? I have no idea what you're asking me right now. Well, that you want to go where you can get a true believer and a rabble rouser and a real radical that we like at Ted Cruz in Texas.

You go for that. Yeah, you can have those guys. Where you need to trim your sails a little bit like Delaware, you trim your sails a little bit. Right. Because controlling the Senate is a really big deal. You can have – Democrats understand that. Why don't Republicans?

That's right, because this is precisely what Rahm Emanuel did when he ran the campaign committee in the House. They figured out that when we go into the Midwest and you go into the South,

you've got to trim your sails in those places because a majority is more important. And your ideological base is going to get a lot of what they want with members of this

broader caucus that don't necessarily agree with them. with those fake Democrats. And we're just not doing the math on this in a lot of what they want with members of this broader caucus that don't necessarily agree with them. Other than get it all with those fake Democrats. And we're just not doing the math on this in a lot of places. But you know what the problem with that is? The reason we can't have a Rahm Emanuel and Chuck Schumer, who are absolutely ruthless in doing exactly what you're saying, is the base, and I think even non-base people, don't

trust the Republican committees anymore. That's right. Right. That's right. If we Republican committees anymore. That's right. Right. That's right. If we can trust them. That's right. And meanwhile, the Tea Party isn't being ruthless and amazing Tea Party generally, because most Tea Partiers, I think, actually agree with us. But they're not being realistic and clear-eyed.

That's right. They have the passion. Nobody out there has the clear-eyed, where do we run whom? And by the way, I don't blame them for the mistrust. Because if you can look back at Florida a couple years ago, they picked Charlie Crist. That's a good enough grounds to mistrust them. Look at Virginia not helping fund Cuccinelli. Cuccinelli is the perfect example of all the factions of the conservative movement.

Virginia's a little more complicated, right? Because Virginia's a convention state, not a primary state. Didn't you kind of rig it a little bit? Who? Cuccinelli. I don't really know. I'm kind of talking out of my head.

As I recall, the kickoff of that campaign wasn't exactly... That's what I was going to say. Every single group hurt Cuccinelli. You have, for lack of a better word, the Tea Party crowd. Because it's a caucus. I think that's what you're saying. That Republican caucus chose, as the lieutenant governor candidate, someone I would personally love.

In fact, he reminds me of one of my ministers. A black Christian minister who had said some really spicy things about homosexuality. They pick him to run as lieutenant governor? Cuccinelli was answering throughout this campaign, do you think it's a perverted mind that creates homosexuality? Look, you can't run

a hardcore Christian, and I'm a hardcore Christian, don't run me for office. That's my tip for Republicans. I's your takeaway. And you have a Libertarian candidate who took 6% of the election when Cuccinelli lost by less

than 2%, so phony, hardcore Libertarian candidate. And you have a totally corrupt sitting Republican governor who's taken mint coats and Rolex watches. He screwed Cuccinelli. And the Republican National Committee, the establishment, didn't give him enough money. He's a fantastic

candidate. He's smart. He's articulate. He's good-looking. He could be the future of the Republican Party. Every aspect of our morons screwed him. Stop for one second. Okay. Pick it up. Okay, so I guess I accept what you said about C cucinelli um i didn't really

follow it too much but i i did i i have noticed that the well here's the gossip i heard that the certain and i will not give you any more details but a certain prominent republican strategist who has a had a very high profile um uh bankroll to get into races um has about three million dollars left um it's over the all that that thing wait what like five six seven years ago we had a bunch of republican strategists some very famous ones going around the country and raising money and saying give us the money and we'll come in and we'll make differences in these late-breaking races. We'll do something. I have it. Oh, Karl Rove, but he kept losing elections.

Is that what you're saying? Or someone like that. Someone like that is now out of money. It's Karl Rove. They're now out of money. People are so anti-Rove because he lost so many elections. Right. And, I mean, it's not his fault that everyone was donating to him.

But I feel sorry for these Republican donors because he was the only game in town. They turn on Fox. They see him. I want to get Republicans elected. I'll write a check to him. But I do think not only with consultants, but with like think tanks in Washington, you want to spread the money around. Yeah. Because he made a big mistake. but with like think tanks in Washington, you want to spread the money around. Yeah.

Because he made a big mistake. He spent way too much money on TV advertising because he makes more money with, a lot of them do. They make more money with media. Right. Yeah. So if you're going to design or you were going to appoint,

I mean, Mickey's got a blue ribbon commission. If you were going to have a blue ribbon commission to fix this, who would be on your blue ribbon commission? Me. Okay. Yeah, I knew you. Me.

I should be the right-wing Ayatollah and they should hang on my every word. Don't they already? You know who was great? And I... He annoys me with some of his commentary on MSNBC because he sounds like you, Rob Long.

But I really liked Michael Steele. I don't know why people didn't like him. I thought he... For one thing, he was a great spokesman. And I was just about to write a column defending him and demanding they reelect him. Um, when there was some shooting, it was something, it may have been Tucson. I think it was Tucson. So I never wrote that column saying you have to reelect him, but it's not Reince Priebus leading to, um to Mickey and my favorite topic,

because Reince thinks the key to Republican triumph is to give the Democrats 30 million new voters. Go, Reince. He's talking about immigration reform. Oh, I know what he's talking about. I can tell Mickey you suddenly lit up. It's not immigration reform. It's amnesty.

On one Saturday, I was doing errands. And on Saturday afternoon, I was reading my mail, sitting outside at the In-N-Out Burger down the street. And who walks up at Mickey Cow's? And so we exchanged these. This is how it went. Hey, Mickey. How are you?

Hey, Mickey. Hey, Rob. How are you? And then he says, terrible. And I said, why? He said, because we're giving up on immigration reform. We're not going to build a fence. And I thought, this is not how these pleasantries go, Mickey.

I say, how are you? You say, I'm fine. What's your favorite? The burger here? Do you order off the menu? And then we have a little bit of conversation. And then maybe at some point I say, say, Mickey, you have a minute to talk about immigration reform?

And only a minute? I caught you reading these magazines and I was hoping they would be porn magazines. In fact, they were like Southern Barbecue and Bon Appetit. Who is usually cooking for us, unlike tonight. Well, I'm doing dessert. I'm doing dessert.

Geez, I'm not going to forget. I was disappointed. I was disappointed. I was proud. Are you jonesing now? Because no one's talking about immigration reform. I just did. Actually, they sort of are. Okay, well, you explain that while I pour some wine.

I would like a glass of wine, please. Red or white? White, please. I don't drink. I know, but I think I might have it on doodles. That'd be great. Okay. So, they are talking about immigration reform,

but it's not dead. Amnesty is not dead. A lot of big bucks corporate people are pushing for it. It's not going to be voted on this year. We learned that today, but it might be voted on next year, early next year. And they're taking heart from the fact that Christie got this very high percentage of

the Latino vote in New Jersey. If Christie can get 51 percent, then, you know, then he can get 51 percent of the Latino vote if he's running for president. And that's that's given them another little data point to talk about. It was in The new york times today uh so um yeah the the other the thing in our favor is that uh uh people are a republicans who are the going to be the deciders in this one the republican house members are a so pissed off at obama for the shutdown be be so distrustful of him because of the mess he made of obamacare, do we really think he's going to implement a very complicated amnesty proposal effectively

where he has to check the IDs of 11 million people? I don't think so. And C, they're pissed off at the Republican establishment for what they did to Cuccinelli, which is what we were talking about a few minutes ago. So those are three factors that I think the election was sort of a wash. I have questions on your five points before you got to the bullet points on the fifth point. Number one, it just occurred to me, I mean, you told me this in the car and I was just happy, but do you think that Kevin McCarthy claimed that they're not voting on it this year as another fake out?

So we stopped paying attention holding rallies against them and they slip it through Well, they're gonna slip it through any chance they get the the problem is they don't have anywhere near a majority of them of the majority for any of their proposals As soon as they get that They will do it instantaneously. Yeah, that's good. Thank you. Sorry. I think the shutdown on balance made it less likely that they would get that. I haven't figured this – I'm a paranoid person and I'm paranoid.

What? I'm paranoid about – We're all shocked. But he's not paranoid about we're all shot every time there's not paranoid about the government running health every time there's silence on the issue it's because they're stealthily planning to make it through and it is true that if you wanted to kill it you would you would gin up the left in into some sort of paroxysm of protest but you would do that by proclaiming it dead and And they're... Right.

And so they're doing something against their interests by encouraging the left to protest. Okay, the other point I have, which was on your, I think, bullet point three, the Christie thing. I emailed you and I tweeted it out. The exit polls that came out of New Jersey one hour after the polls closed, according to

the New York Times, showed Christie getting 31% of the Hispanic vote the last time he ran and 30% this time. And I almost put in my tweet, parentheses, New York Times, colon, better edit this. So I am very suspicious of the 50% of Hispanics. An exit poll is an exit poll. They can figure that out six seconds after the polls close. Why does that change four hours later after I'm laughing about them and everyone's laughing about them for saying he only got 30% of the Hispanic vote? The argument that I've heard is that Christie was 40, was in the 40s with the Latino vote because of Sandy long before he did anything

about amnesty. According to the exit poll that went up one hour after the polls closed. I remember I emailed it to you. It's preserved forever in your email and it's preserved forever on my tweet. Can you imagine what that email inbox looks like? The problem is, the problem is that however Christie got 51%

of the vote, even if it had nothing to do with amnesty, the Mike Murphys of the world are going to say, see, a Republican can get this high percentage if only we got amnesty out of the way. That's going to be their argument. Out of the way. I love that. So we can spend the next 30 years arguing about whether they are guest workers, whether they're second-class citizens, do they get to vote immediately? And what if they just came yesterday and mean Republicans are stopping the illegal immigrant who came yesterday

from getting citizenship and voting tomorrow? And the other argument is that the reason Christie got 51% of the vote is because he's practically a Democrat on most issues. Though I don't think it's because... So if Republicans want to become practically Democrats on most issues, they can get a chunk of the Latino vote. I don't think it's because... So if Republicans want to become practically Democrats on most issues, they can get a chunk of the Latino vote.

I don't think that's it. For one thing, I think he got 30%. And I don't think other people are as tuned in to his having his temporary Senate appointee vote for amnesty as I am. I mean, it wasn't his vote himself. And all the polls show, including from Pew, that Hispanics do not care about amnesty as I am. I mean, it wasn't his vote himself. And all the polls show, including from Pew,

that Hispanics do not care about amnesty. If they thought about it for six seconds, they'd be against amnesty because it's their wages that are going to go down. Now, so are you still a Christie fan or not? Dead to me. He's dead to you. You obviously have not been following my tweets, though.

He has. I have been, and I just wanted to hear your... I was setting you up. Oh. He's dead to you. Dead to me. Can he ever be alive to you again? No.

No. No. No. No. What did he do? What pushed you over? No. Maybe, though.

Because I have seen him with the Wall Street Journal crowd. This is the first time I met him in person. Totally sucking up to them on amnesty. And he is Mr. like regular guy. And there was some town where I guess all the white blue collar workers are. And he kept citing them. It was like their Dickie flat or whomever. Who was the guy that Phil Graham used to cite all the time? Oh yeah. I check with, wasn't it something Dickie something? Dickie somebody. Dickie somebody. Yeah. Okay. So he had, it was like

his Dickie somebody that he goes down to the the boys in Raway or wherever it is. And so at the end of this whole thing of him sucking up to the Wall Street Journal, I went up to him. I had been very clear publicly that I was in love with him and wanted him to run for president. And I said, first of all, before you get on the bandwagon on amnesty with these Wall Street Journal heathens, you might want to check with the boys in rawway um and by the way email me so we began emailing and every once in a while i'd either say something um mostly flattering about him but sometimes not completely flattering in your trademark style and he'd say and we'd email now and then he'd say call call call the first time i said i'd call was after my CPAC speech attacking him because I didn't trust him on amnesty. So we had

quite a little chit-chat about amnesty. He can't claim and about immigration, he can't claim oh, this is something I'm not paying attention to. And I thought, gosh, he doesn't even understand family reunification rules. He did

after talking to me for 45 minutes and then he has his then he has 45 minutes only on amnesty no we chit-chatted after that was he on an iphone was he on an iphone i was like i've given that to the i have a lot you think you think he can talk about amnesty? Get me going. All right, so who do you have? And then he has his temporary Senate appointee vote for amnesty, and my entire defense of him for having a temporary Senate appointee, rather than...

Because he can stop it. Yep. So who's your 2016 current crush? Current fave. Anybody who's a governor or a senator, I want to see them in debates, and I got to say, Ted Cruz is looking good now. Even if you had doubts about him during the shutdown,

well, he's looking good now as Obamacare falls apart. He is the anti-Obamacare senator. And he went to Princeton, which obviously is a better school than Cornell. I'll admit it now. And then Harvard Law. Because at Princeton, they don't think they can run society. Unlike those Harvard people. No, apparently he learned from his father's Cuban experience,

unlike you, Mickey Kaus. But explain to me, was he born in this country? Just so I know, what's the deal? Alan Dershowitz says he can run, and it's funny, I always tell, like Sean Hannity and other people, it's an interesting question. Um, and I'll defer to someone who went to Harvard law school, except Mickey cows. Um, um, and that is, he has one American parent. He has one parent who was a Cuban was imprisoned by Castro fled Cuba and was in the process of becoming an American citizen.

And in my opinion, that makes a difference than if you have a father who's just passing through, but is fully a citizen of another country. He has to be natural born American. He was an American citizen when he was born. Alan Dershowitz says that's natural born. You were an American citizen because you were born to an American mother. I think it's also, I'm making the point that the fact that his father was basically stateless is at least important to me because if that's enough, even if Obama had been born in Kenya, that would have been enough, right? Right. But his father is very different. He wasn't trying to become an American citizen.

He's a Kenyan. He's passing through. And also, I think we should have an asterisk for Canada. Come on, it's basically the U.S. We're going to take a short break. If you are listening to this, well, we haven't decided yet. There's a chance that you're listening to this and you're not a member of Ricochet. If you are listening to this and you're not a member of Ricochet,

it's really time for you to go to Ricochet.com and join. It's not very much money, and it helps support things, events like this. But if you are a member of Ricochet, we thank you. We thank you as fellow members, as fellow contributors, and as people who have big plans.

Good. All right. That's good. Now you can write off all the booze. Exactly right. Hey, you know what you could do? You could put one representative. Okay, so we're starting on the segment. The food is getting just heated.

We went a little too long in the last segment and it got cold. But we were talking while the mics were off, we were talking a little bit about libertarians and that seems to be,

you know, the conventional wisdom is if you can grab part of the libertarian vote, that's where the young people are. Libertarian young people are basically Republicans in training. Appeal to them more on the issues they like, like pot legalization, etc. And you don't like that. No, I was saying I always taunt these idiot libertarians.

And that's their entire idea of libertarians Let's legalize prostitution and bot saying Richard Epstein would be ashamed of them He would privatize everything He would privatize Yosemite before we get to hot legalization And he started out And by the way, once I was on TV

with a guy from Reason Magazine on Stossel And as usual Do you love St guy from Reason magazine on Stossel, and as usual... Do you love Stossel? I love Stossel. I love Stossel, but as usual, I'm more libertarian than the alleged libertarian, with a very simple and obvious point, which is airport security should be run by the airlines. Then you can pick and choose. Right, there's an actual incentive. Much like we should be able to pick and choose our health care, Mickey.

And so one airline might say, we're the Muslim free airline. Okay, they couldn't really say that, but they could stage something to get boycotted by the Muslims. There's ways of words, sure, if you can get there. They could just engage in nothing but racial profiling. Another one could keep having you pull out your little plastic baggies and patting me down because I'm a big threat. And then I would stop flying those airlines. Because nobody wants to get blown up. You can make a choice for your life.

And this was like news to Mr. Reason Magazine. No, he was off prattling about legalizing pot. So you think Epstein's in favor of legalizing drugs, right? Yes. Yeah, well, I think he is. He doesn't really talk about it very much. But I think, to Ann's point, this is not Richard's priority. If you don't know, Troy is the host of Law Talk.

I know Richard Epstein. Richard Epstein is a friend of mine. And it is the hardest job in podcasting because he's got some brilliant, brilliant people. I actually need pot to be legalized in order to keep working for the prison. Yeah, exactly right, right. And he, I mean, he's a remarkable guy.

Yeah, but the thing that's interesting. What I love about you is that you just kind of gets in there and just, it's like get grandpa going a little bit. Right, right. But to Anne's point, the thing that's interesting about Richard that's different from sort of the reflexive college libertarians. Right. from sort of the reflexive college libertarians right is that uh there are areas where richard comports very closely with what you'd expect from somebody who's a philosophical libertarian there are other areas richard is not a ron paul foreign policy guy very interesting if you listen to him he was not terribly bothered by the nsa thing he was right he was more hawkish on syria

than a lot of us who just identify as conservatives. Say us, I'm fairly libertarian anyway. So Richard does not consider that sort of Ron Paul, Rand Paul foreign policy wing an essential part of libertarianism. A lot of serious libertarians do. I agree with that. And I have another libertarian who's very, very smart and you should put in your lineup of interviewing. Gary Lawson, law professor. Have you interviewed him?

I have not interviewed him. No, he is a real libertarian. And I've known him and Epstein slightly back when I was in law school. You know, for like 20 years, I've never heard either of them talk about pot legalization. Give me a break. No, I've never heard either of them talk about pot legalization. Give me a break. No, I've never heard anything like that. We're talking about airlines. Are you TSA pre?

What the hell? TSA pre, okay, here's what you do. You go to the website. You've heard of the Illuminati, Rob? By the way, this website works. Oh, the pre-check thing? You join, you get something called global entry, which means that you go,

you schedule an appointment at the airport, you show up with your passport, and they take your fingerprints and your driver's license so you live here, right? It's really simple. It just shows you how easy it would be to enforce citizenship laws. Right, right. And then, I'll tell you, it's remarkable what the free market has done. With global entry, that means when you come from overseas you kind of just walk right through customs because you're sort of pre-cleared what it also means is that you have yet what they call a known traveler id you got a known travel id when you when you when you

check into your united flight when i check a united flight to san francisco or new york or wherever i get it's automatically makes me TSA pre. I go in the short line, and I fly coach, so I don't get the fast line anyway. I go to the short line, I don't have to take anything out of my bag, I don't have to bring my shoes, no belt, no toiletries, no computer. You just put your bag in there and you saunter through. It is awesome. I think it costs like 20 bucks.

The reason I haven't done it yet is, for one thing, I don't like the idea of the whole fingerprinting, but that's a minor point. The major point is, and maybe I'm wrong about this, but I think there are a lot of airports that don't have it. The way my life is, it's not like I'm usually flying out of one airport. I'm all over the country, so if it's only going to help me in 50% of the airports, oh, why bother? It'll help you maybe 50% now, but it'll be 80% soon. 80% I, but it'll be 80% soon. But you know the thing... 80% although. The thing that's irritating

about that, though, it sounds incredibly accommodating based on what you're describing, is the fact that you have to pay a premium for things to be normal. Yes!

It's like being here in Southern California and having to pay for the toll road because it's the one lane that you can actually get to. Right. The imposition about it is...

I mean, I understand. This is the word we love. No, that's right. I'm with you on this. You're totally right. The irritant is the fact that I mean, I understand. This is the word we love. No, that's right. I'm with you on this. You're totally right. The irritant is the fact that I've got to pay a premium for something that should work anyway. To get out of government idiocy. Well, here's what I like about it.

I like it that they are making a calculated, they're making, not a calculated, but an uncalculated admission, which is that American citizens are not a danger. Right. And that if you're an American citizen and you got a passport and you go down to the airport and you give me your fingerprints, they're like, you're not going to blow up a plane. Right. And they are racially profiling you, but in kind of the obverse way, right?

You're profiling yourself. Right. And they're allowing you to profile yourself and you zip right through. You zip right through. It is awesome. And that is government working with private industry. What do I have to do again? Passport, fingerprints?

You go to like, it's just Google Global Entry. And then you sign up for it. And you look like, well, why am I going to do that? I don't really come from overseas that often. But do it because then you get a known traveler ID. And automatically, when you check into your flight, it automatically prints on your boarding pass TSA pre with a little check and you just saunter right through like you're like...

The problem is if Anne does that, she'll become a Democrat because about 50% of her anger seems to be from going through the TSA and being pissed off that they don't profile and they have to pat her down. So if you eliminate that I mean you've neutralized I don't think it's possible to neutralize Ann Coulter.

I would like to see someone try, but I don't think that's possible. I think you just have to reach out. If you try, it's like the Latino folk. Just show up for a while. Just show up. Show some respect.

All right. You're rolling. So, all right. If you're just joining us, we are sitting here having wine and pizza and salad. And there's ice cream coming that I made myself. And a little ginger ice cream. I poached some pears. It's going to be good.

That's our dessert. But while we have a little moment ice cream. I poached some pears. It's going to be good. That's our dessert. But while we have a little moment, you said something interesting to me. You said you watch CNBC all the time. I mean, MSNBC. Why? It's unintentionally hilarious. For example, you people probably did not know. The stupidest straight person in the universe was a Mongolian. They recently discovered

his bones. He lived in the 16th century. He had to rely on the kindness of strangers to feed him. And they discovered that he was the stupidest straight person who ever lived. And the stupidest gay person is Thomas Roberts on MSNBC. Okay. All right. But then you go on these weird fasts right you go on a little bit like six months and you don't where i don't appear on right but you watch tv then for the six months yeah not as much not as obsessively but you know did you see richard did you see who has time for that why would you why do you subject yourself to that? Well, I have to cook and clean, and it's hilarious. It's hilarious.

And like every conservative, I know you probably don't watch that much Fox. Well, there are commercial breaks on MSNBC. I actually know why, and I'm not saying this because I love him and he's a good, true, loyal person. The person I do watch is Hannityity because if you've been busy and not following everything on Twitter, you want to know what the facts are you need to know? That is Hannity. There is not going to be a cultural quiz.

There will not be some idiotic legal segment or letters. Or a lyric about Bill O'Reilly. No, Hannity will give you everything you need to know so I actually I genuinely like his show and not just because he is the one person

everyone at Fox totally loves yeah he's a nice guy he's a genuinely nice guy everyone in that building the makeup people you know he just switched time slots and the makeup people got to stay the camera guys couldn't stay and you should have seen them. They were so long-faced.

They were begging, can you switch us? Not only because he's just a pleasant person. He chit-chats with them. Everybody who comes on his show loves him. It's just a wonderful, happy atmosphere. But just to mention how generous he is, and he's never told me this. It was the makeup gals who told me how sad the camera guys were. He gives them all Christmas bonuses.

Does anyone on air at any place do that? That's true. That's big stuff, actually. Yeah. And so what else do you watch for comedy? Oh, Martin Bashir. He's my favorite.

Alright, if you're listening to this, there's a lot more on the member feed. He's my favorite. All right. If you're listening to this, there's a lot more on the member feed. We talk about the election. We talk about Chris Christie. We talk about libertarians. We talk about liberals, of course. We talk about immigration because Mickey Kaus is here. We attacked Mickey Kaus.

We attacked Mickey Kaus. Deservedly. Deservedly. Thanks for having me for dessert. Exactly. And we're here with Ann Coulter, Mickey Kaus, Troy Sinek, and me, Rob Long. So if you're listening to this and you're thinking, I'd like to hear more,

all you have to do is join Ricochet. That's all you have to do. That's not like signing up for Obamacare. It's really, really easy. Which brings us back to how much we hate Mickey Kaus. So we're back.

We're back a little bit before. We're about to have dessert, so we'll talk a few minutes before dessert. We just had two Ricochet meetups. We had one in Las Vegas, which was huge and apparently great. I was sorry to miss it. And we had another one in New York, and Ann Coulter was there in New York. First day the book came out. First day the book came out. First day the book came out.

I was bleary-eyed, but luckily you and I were on with John Bodhorod, so I could be bleary-eyed. You could be bleary-eyed and it would be fine. But you met two identical twins. No, that isn't what we were going to talk about. We were going to talk about the gun. All right.

My friend Mickey Kalsier, whom I hate now for supporting Obamacare, but he is very good on amnesty, came with me to a fabulous event in Fort Wayne. Wasn't it good, Mickey? It was a very good event, yes. Yeah. But one obsessed fan.

Oh, okay. No, I am telling the story. You're all ruining it. Okay. So the VIP obsessed fan here and twins here, you people can't follow that so there's all there's generally a vip where you pay a little extra and you get a private meeting with me and photo and a book and i sign it for you right there so that's what they had

and so they're all coming up for their photos and and one guy told me for one thing he'd flown in from texas wow so he is a big fan. I said, wow, thank you. I think you win the prize from coming to Farless. And he hands me a little gift bag. But, you know, I have to take lots of photos. So I set the gift bag down. And I say, you know, nice to meet you.

Thank you. And then Mickey and I go back to the green room. And I opened up my little gift bag. And it was a 38 Smith & Wesson hammer. And as I squealed with delight, Mickey, being a liberal, was terrified to be in a room with a gun. I was pretty terrified. He thought I could go off with no bullets. There was no ammunition.

It was in a lockbox. But the amazing thing was, so obviously we met up with him later. Of course, yeah. The guy gave you a gun. And it's the best gift anyone has ever given me. But I said, how on earth did you get it this year from Texas? And he said, no, it's fine. You just put it in a lockbox.

I told him, I'm flying back to New York. A lockbox isn't working. I know how you transfer them. You just go gun store to gun store. But I must say, you, Rob Long, would have really appreciated it. I'm sorry, Mickey. I love you.

But I hate you for Obamacare. You were terrified to be in the same room with an unloaded gun. I was definitely going to be. We had to mobilize the entire four-way police force to figure out what to do with this gun. But they didn't know what to do. Every time they look at this gun, they would go, wow, that's a good gun. That took another 20 minutes. They loved the gun. And the guy turned out to be a really nice guy. He's a good gun that took another 20 minutes they loved the gun and the guy turned out to be a really nice guy

he's a doctor of course he's a nice guy what's his position on Obamacare he was confirming everything weirdly I know a lot of doctors right now Mickey's met a lot of them you meet one and they all go to medical school together and it's actually a great thing you. You meet one and they all go to medical school together.

It's actually a great thing that you meet one doctor because they have every lunch together, every dinner together. They all know like a hundred other doctors. I'm the one non-doctor who enters their life and every single one of them is not taking Obamacare and they all say... They've all assured me if you get an actual doctor as opposed to a nurse practitioner, he will not have gone to an American medical school. Which, by the way, I'm being, oh, fact-checked on, fact-checked on. Excuse me, this is a prediction.

Wait, no one here is fact-checking you, but is that happening out there? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, because, oh, you're wrong, you're wrong. Cold fact-checked and three Pinocchios. You know, A, F you. It's a prediction about the future. So you can't really

be wrong yet. And B, I'm gonna be right. How about dessert? So Troy, you are working on a California, yeah, you're working on a California thing,

right? The City Journal's coming to California. Oh! The Manhattan Institute, is that right? That's great! Or should I not show that? Yeah, you probably shouldn't. I used to be working on that.

I'm not anymore. You're not anymore? I still do stuff with them sometimes, but yeah. But is City Journal coming to California? There is a City Journal California, which is only a website at the moment. But they do content that's analogous to what they do in the magazine. Because they saw an opening here.

Is there an opening here? Yeah. There's an opening here. I don't mean a need. I mean an opening. Oh. Yeah, that's the distinction I was about to make.

What's the distinction? Well, there's a need because the state is falling apart and it needs to figure it out and it needs to turn back to the city. Yeah, there's definitely

a need. But where there's an opportunity, I don't think that's ever going to happen. It's probably shrinking as time goes by. You mean for the policies to go into effect.

Right, to actually get something done. I think it's going to have to get a lot worse. Yeah, the concern is, well, that's always the question, right, is what's the inflection point that turns it around? I mean, the problem right now is that we're sort of circling the drain in that a lot of the exodus you're seeing from California is precisely the people who would probably be voting for policies that might sort of pull us back a little bit.

I do think that the one thing that... That's interesting. That's just self-fulfilling prophecies. Yeah, the one thing that is a source of hope, though, probably, and it needs to develop more, but there's some germinal form of it, is the fact that there are some divisions growing within the Democratic Party

in California. Because people are starting to realize that for instance, the Green Lobby and Organized Labor are at loggerheads a lot of the time. Also, did you hear about the guy who primaried Barbara Boxer? I am aware of that. I am aware of that.

Perhaps he liked it. There are some virtues of having a one-party state, which is now you're a Democrat democrat you can oppose unions because hey we're all democrats here and that was the next example and the unions are taking the money that we could spend on early childhood education so you can go

rant about greedy union members where you couldn't before who's doing that? there's some people doing that there's a famous guy in San Francisco who does that. Unions are now embattled, I think, in the Democratic Party in a way that they never were when they were just running the House. Gloria Romero, who used to be in the Democratic leadership in the legislature. I mean, it's still a minority, but you're right.

I mean, it gets to a critical mass, and then you start seeing these fissures. I don't know that it's going to be enough to get you to a place that's going to rehabilitate the state but it's the one little green shoe oh i see yeah i don't want to poop on that and we were i mean it's a pretty constructive organization they work with mayors in new york they're democrat they work with boomberg they they're enough they're enough right-wing democrats especially right-wing Democrats who are really pissed off about the condition of the schools out here. Really? Jamie Alter, John Alter's sister runs an outfit called

LA School Report that is basically a journalistic endeavor that lobbies for charter schools. And Green Dot, the big charter thing, is actually run, I think, by a guy who used to be a Clinton financier. In fact, it's more effective, I mean, for the most part, when you hear Democrats making this case. But then how come that primary opponent against Barbara Boxer didn't sweep the state?

Because he was a terrible candidate. He was a fantastic candidate. Because he was ahead of his time, Ann. California was a ready. Mickey was ahead of his time. He had great media, I've got to say. He had great media. The media was to say. He had great media. The media was good.

Great radio spots. Yeah. I noticed the radio spots especially. Yeah, they were good. Because I played some of the roles, including I played the sneering Democrat. Mickey Kaus is running for Senate. They're talking about me running for Senate. He's not out of his time.

Really? That's what's going on now. I'm explaining to our viewers who haven't the faintest idea what the hell we're talking about. Oh, right. Oh, wow. No, everybody knows that. You ran for Senate. Well, that's you. I think it was Mickey Kaus is running for Senate. really what's going on now I'm explaining to our viewers who haven't the famous idea of what the hell oh right oh wow no everybody knows that you ran for senate what about you

I think it was Mickey Cowles is running for senate but he's not a career politician that's just the point and at the end I got to say

you didn't know you were being recorded no no I'm just trying to run the house what does he know about politics as usual nothing

that's just the point and then at the end I got to do this I got to go pay for it but Mickey Cowles for senate pay for it but Mickey House Presented.

Pay for it by Mickey House Presented. That was my best ad, but I made a few crucial mistakes. Like what? You have to do an event every day. I ran into a Democratic political operative in Camp Coatigo. Unfortunately, he died. But he said he had a few drinks in him, and he said,

Mickey, I expected you to run a campaign with more oomph. And the good thing about these political guys, they're really to the point. They don't mince words. And what he meant is you have to be out there every day. Yeah, I see you walking out at a Kinney. Yeah, I run into Rob. I run into these Democrats, you know, like in Beverly Hills having a little bagel or something and they say,

Mickey, is this the best use of your time? So, you have to be out there every day and you have to I should have done more campaigning in the Inland Empire where they hate because the unemployment rate is 17% and she put agriculture out of business.

Well, that's where you did the best in the Inland Empire. Right, but I campaigned there, I think I will. Yeah, you're right. I would have broken it into double digits. You would have had to leave Venice. Those are the two obvious pluses. So it was single digits?

I beat Anthony Weiner. That's pretty good. I got 5.2%. That's not bad. Considering he did an event once every two weeks It's 1% more than I would have gotten Just out of pure random error Anyway

That's absurd You're the hope for the Democratic Party That's true Other than Obamacare Alright we're back. We just had dessert. How was it? Fabulous. Thank you. Anybody else want to say anything?

It was really good. Homemade ice cream with pear poached in wine. Yeah, there you go. Amazingly good. That's why I wanted the whole meal cooked by Rob Long for anyone paying attention from the beginning. Still on that.

All right. So just for that, I'm going to ask you to talk about 2016 and make some predictions. Not necessarily actual names, but dynamics. Oh, no. I'll totally get into names. But here's – just to start on the other side. Yes. Everyone acts as if Hillary Clinton's inevitable.

Yes. But didn't they act like she was inevitable in 2008? Yes, they did. You know who else they acted like was inevitable? Christine Quinn, mayor of New York. For the past year, I've been hearing Christine Quinn, Christine Quinn, Christine. They have election day. Oops, it's Bill de Blasio. But first, I want to hear Scott explain what my, what the question is I'm answering the way you gave it to me at halftime the question was can ted cruz win a blue state and you have to win a blue state in order to be like the president and oh isn't christy wonderful because he won a blue state i believe were the

precise parameters of the question and the answer is Tom Keene won Is that how you say his name? Yeah, it's Keene Or Kane, wasn't it? Kane? He pronounced it Kane because he was kind of a He was sort of a

Snooty? He was a grandee I like Tom Keene I'm Tom Keene And he did these New Jersey commercials New Jersey and you Yeah, it was like

in the 80s or 90s He was a Meanwhile, all the denizens call it fucking Jersey. Just to give you the native speak. Okay, he won by much bigger landslides than the fat man just did. And weirdly enough, he was never considered presidential material. George Pataki won three elections in a state bluer than New Jersey.

Meanwhile, our last Republican president had only won statewide in Texas. So no, I think your question is wrong as a general matter. Isn't this great? This guy just won in New Jersey, but in particular on Ted Cruz. And look, I'm not necessarily for him.

Usually the ones we're talking about 18 months out are not still running. But Ted Cruz is the smartest United States senator. When is the last time a Republican has been the smartest United States senator? Let's start with that. It doesn't seem like that's heavy competition, though. Look, Chuck Schumer is very smart. He's evil, that. Doesn't seem like that's heavy competition, though. Look, Chuck Schumer is very smart. He's evil, but he's very smart. There are a lot of smart senators. There are at least a dozen smart senators, I'd say. But Ted Cruz is really,

really smart. The other thing I love about Ted Cruz, one of my litmus tests is you have to be more conservative than your constituents. Rudy Giuliani wins there. Fred Thompson loses. John McCain loses. They're more liberal than their constituents. The great thing about Ted Cruz is he's from Texas and he's more conservative than his

constituents. I love him. Couldn't you say that about Chris Christie? You could, but amnesty Christie you could but amnesty he's for amnesty he's for giving the Democrats another 30 million voters because he wants to suck up to Mark Zuckerberg and the Wall Street Journal

and the Wall Street Journal is not the Republican Party I mean the Wall Street you'll get the Wall Street running for governor, but I promise you they're voting for Hillary. All right. So Ted Cruz.

Other possibilities. Mike Lee. I'm just going to run through possibilities. Mike Lee, also very, very smart. Clerks for the Supreme Court. And both of them. I'm worried about a senator being president, though. Possibly.

That's a different question. It's got to be all I want in our primaries are governors and senators. No congressmen. Right. No inspirational figures. I'm sorry. Right. No inspirational figures. I'm sorry. Love you, Ben Carson. But even I briefly fell for Herman Cain in 999.

No more inspirational figures. Senators, governors, that's all we're considering. And I don't care how much Newt Gingrich wants a TV show. No congressmen. So we have. And both Mike Lee and Ted Cruz, I will also say they're young. They're fresh faced. There is nothing frightening about them. There's nothing mean about them.

They have a very pleasant aspect. Again, kind of unusual for a Republican. Ron Johnson, Senator from Wisconsin, moving to governors. That's all I think we have in the Senate. Governors we have, they have to win the re-elections. Rick Snyder in Michigan, Rick Scott in Florida. Christie's going to run. I don't think he's going to go very far.

I was the last right winger defending him, and I've turned against him. Do we have any more governors? Scott Walker. He can run. We'll see. John Kasich. Same thing I say. Same thing Mike Pence.

Throw him in the debates. I don't think they hold a candle in charisma. And I love them. I love them. Don't look at me like that. Do you really want me to point out those ears of his? Wow. She went to the ears. We should have known.

Yeah. But seriously, we're not gonna run somebody who is and this isn't Jindal but there are others who are four feet tall we're not we're not running a midget

look what happened to Dukakis if you're not ideologically committed and you're approaching it from probably the superficial level that even those people who are ideologically committed do without admitting it

Bobby Jindal does not cut a very presidential figure no there's no sort of commanding presence there I love Bobby Jindal same thing no but you're not I love Scott Walker who I really love Bobby General does not cut a very presidential figure. There's not sort of a commanding presence there. I love Bobby. Same thing.

No, but you're not. I love Scott Walker, who I really love. Same thing, I think. But we'll see. Look, you can throw them all in a debate. We'll see how they do in a debate. But I do think looks matter. Height matters.

Frankly, I think, and you're all going to pretend you disagree with me, but you won't. I think gender matters. I don't think America wants a female president. Oh, I totally disagree. I believe that America wants that. And my argument is... Everybody hear that? I'm on the record. ...we are the last remaining superpower. People can talk about Margaret Thatcher all they want.

And by the way, there are no Margaret Thatchers out there. I do not think even England would have chosen Margaret Thatcher as their prime minister in the middle of World War II. We are the defenders of the free world. You want a man as commander-in-chief. And it doesn't really matter because there are no Margaret Thatchers out there.

So if the aesthetics are that important... They are. The second coming of Rick Perry, then. No, it's not the only thing. Did I suggest at any point that all we care about is looks? No, but this was an excuse to get you to opine on Rick Perry. I was out here in Los Angeles speaking to FOA, Friends of Abe, the day he announced, I think. And, oh, there were like 300 people there.

Luckily, my friend Michael McDonald, the comedian, was there. So he will confirm my story. Melanie was there. She will confirm my story. I will ask them too, by the way.

Yes, you may. And I would like a little addendum to this. Everybody in the audience was so gaga for Rick Perry. And I warned them all. I said, you don't believe me now. Wait until you see him.

No, he is not presidential. The lesson, Trust Ann. Called you a shot. Our expectations have been lowered. We don't expect him to be presidential, so we'll do better than expected. Good point. No, he still has to be president.

Great. He's not Zippy the Chimp anymore. Well, as a Democrat, I don't care about anything. Wait a minute. What? Cruz seems nice. He doesn't seem nice to me.

I just get this weird vibe from him that he is ready to sell out anything on a moment's notice. Maybe that's not proven. I think Ann disagrees. I'm not sure what that noise actually meant. It sounded like disagreement. I think Ann disagrees. I'm not sure what that noise actually meant, but it sounded like disagreement. I think it was negative.

Yeah, it was negative. We have argued about this endlessly on email, and I am so clearly right. You may as well admit it, Mickey. He's upset that Ted Cruz has not spearheaded the opposition to amnesty. And my point is, it's the same reason I don't write about

women's issues. I don't write about feminism. I'm a girl. I don't want to be niched as the conservative who's against feminism.

A lot of black conservatives don't want to be the black who's against affirmative action. He voted against Rubio's amnesty.

This is why Mickey doesn't trust him because he's not leading the charge. He's not on the committee. For those of you listening at home, Anne is pointed gesturing violently at Mickey. And he said he looks like he's in physical peril.

He said the reason he didn't vote for the Rubio bill is because of his citizenship. But if it only legalized, that would be a different story. Well, that's a setup for being for legalization, which is basically what Democrats want. And it also lets him keep getting donations from big businessmen.

That's what it says. It's not that he wanted to kill you. He doesn't need it. He didn't want to go against another Latino. He wanted to keep the money flowing. No, you are totally wrong. Wait, I just specifically want to address this. This is the other reason Cruz is fantastic.

The reason people like Christie instantly sell out America is because his money comes from Wall Street. The great thing about Texas is their money comes from oil. He does not need Wall Street. Ted Cruz is the he here. Ted Cruz does not need Wall Street. He does not need Sheldon Adelson. He does not need the people who want cheap nannies and cheap maids.

He has the oil money based in Texas. You are completely wrong, and I do not even believe this rumor you keep fostering about how he'd be all for legalization. He said it. Yeah, I don't believe it. He said it. I didn't say I was against legalization. I only said I was against citizens. That's, oh, you see, he's already backing down.

I think the only way to settle this is with a duel, with a gun. With that gun that you got. And we'll find another gun. I'm sure there's somebody in this house who has a gun. And we'll just, we'll settle it. Only one of you is walking home. That gun is so good. You don't know.

I have no chance against it. Mickey, is it weird to be you and be a Democrat You could do a hard stop right there. and be a Democrat and like be as incredibly

uncompromising as you are on immigration because look, what the liberals say about our position on immigration or your position

on immigration is that you're a racist. Right? You're a racist. Yeah. And that's They said that about my position

on welfare too right but that doesn't i mean is it but why are you i mean are you do you is it uncomfortable for you when you talk to all of your liberal reporters i have found lately talking to enough of them that if you make the low wage argument half of them will agree with you yeah if you say look unskilled workers are the people who've gotten the shaft in the economy. They're competing against the whole world now. And why bring the unskilled workers from abroad to compete with them here? I mean, it makes no sense.

It's screwing them even more. And if you make that argument without any of the Latino or that, you know, half of them will agree with you. Agree with you? What do you mean? They'll agree with you that you're making a good point or they will agree with you. Agree with you? What do you mean? They'll agree with you that you're making a good point or they'll agree with you that you're right about immigration?

Well, they're not going to call you a racist jerk. They're going to half agree with you at least, enough so that they don't think you're an insane person. I think it's changing people's minds, too. So, you know, this is why I think if we stop it this time, there's actually a chance of stopping it forever. And also, it proves the point, something you attacked poor Jake Tapper for. It proves the point of why they won't allow someone who was anti-amnesty on the television panels.

In Jake's defense, all the people around CNN on any given day are pro-amnesty right but it is striking if you pick three people to put on a show they're going to be pro-amnesty but it's not just Jake Tapper it's all over television

it's always three pro-amnesty people every place you go only pro-amnesty people are allowed to talk even Fox News Fox the Wall Street Journal

CPAC which is why we'll see if I get invited back this year because I never tell them what I'm going to talk about. But every one of C-PAC's panels last year on amnesty was... That's because it was run by a guy named Al Cardenas

who was for amnesty, right? He was very close to Rubio, apparently. But I don't know. I don't know why. I just know the conference... I and Donald Trump, because we don't submit our speeches first. Well, aren't you proud? No.

That's illustrious company. Thank you. I think it is. But the point is that those were the only, there were specific panels and, you know, meetings set on immigration. And every single person talking was pro-amnesty. So the only two voices in a three-day right-wing festival against amnesty were, as far as I know, me and Donald Trump and probably all of talk radio. At the last minute, they invited a quick orient.

They did? Yeah. And I found this is why I was trolling Jake Capra. It's a very... It's sort of an easy win to troll somebody in the conventional media and say, hey, you had five people on the panel and they're all for amnesty.

Right. They don't actually realize that this is indefensible and half the time give in. So now he has other people on the panel? Like BuzzFeed. I managed to intimidate Ben Smith, damn it. Wait, but that was a good question. No, he doesn't manage to have other people on the panel.

He just said, oh, you're right, but the next panel was going to be all about him. He's tweeted like five times, like we should have. Oh, tweeted. Thank you. I didn't realize you had floored him. I don't watch CNN. I don't know what he's on.

I don't think he's talked about anything. Fair point. No one watches. Anyway, the media is so biased that they're not living up to their own principles on this. But if they would allow one anti-amnesty person to talk, I think what you said, but are you persuading the liberals?

I think we are, if they can... And conservatives and everyone. Just let us talk. Right, right. The first reaction in Los Angeles is, oh, you're a racist. You're a racist, right. The first reaction in Los Angeles is, oh, you're a racist. You're a racist, right. All right, can we just switch from that one side

to the other side? Can we talk a little bit about the Democrats? That seems to be more fun. He's the expert. Because it seems to me like Obamacare is really going to be a problem. I know, isn't it fun? And it's fantastic. I mean, everyone, even ricochet people are pitching possible TV commercials. I mean, it's great. That mean, everyone, even ricochet people are pitching possible TV commercial. I mean, it's great.

And Joe Biden has been AWOL? Has anybody seen him recently? I never really noticed him. He made speeches and stuff. He used to be in the news. I think he's been very quiet for the past two weeks. Because this is his... All he did was say it's a big effing deal.

That was his contribution. Yeah, but it's going to be hung around his neck. He's running for president. So is Hillary. I don't think it's ending. I don't think Hillary escapes this. People think it's a big boost for Elizabeth Warren because she can say, I was for a single payer, which wouldn't have any of these problems,

and I'm a woman. You know, that's totally going to work on the Harvard crowd like you, who think if only the government was more involved, it would be better. It would be more like Amtrak. Is Elizabeth Warren running for president? That's what they're... Look at the cover of the New Republicans week. Oh my god. I didn't realize there was...

I was homeless. Wall-to-wall for Bahamas. Yeah. So the answer to that is yes. Can you just tell me the answer so I don't have to go to the Republic? Yeah, why not? She's a one-term senator.

And McAuliffe. She's a one-term senator who's extremely liberal. We've had a lot of success so far with that. They have? McAuliffe is going to run. For president? O'Malley's going to run. McAuliffe already?

You think so? They're all talking about it. O'Malley's not going to run against Hillary? Come on. O'Malley's going to McCullough already you think so they're all talking about it McCullough's not gonna run against Hillary come on Cuomo's gonna run oh Fairpoint maybe she'll be

the vice presidential nominee he wouldn't run maybe he will what does he care they're all soulless you Democrats that would be great but I don't think

that's too good to Cuomo and hopefully a whole bunch of inspirational figures and congressmen so it'll be like a Republican

what about Cory Booker? Yes. Too young? Yes. Why do they care? Why should he stop at Senate? Yeah. Right. At least be somebody's number two. Castro from Texas is the other one that gets talked about as everybody's vice presidential choice. And it's a perfect name

for the Democrats. Cory Booker, he had a tweet up saying, watch the video of my first day in the Senate. And I thought, it's going to be a long... Yeah, that's what I can tell you. Right. He's going to be tweeting every roll call

about another guy. He would not be Senator if Chris Christie had not been so selfish as to hold a special election. I tweeted what you said today and I got a bunch of blowbacks saying it was implausible that even if Christie had

delayed the election until his election, that this guy Lonegan would have beat Booker. Lonegan was crushing Cory Booker in the debates. And I'll tell you who to check with. I probably can't say his name publicly, but a very smart fellow Harvard graduate friend of yours who's a rhino like Rob.

And both of you know him. He kept washing the debates. We went out one night after one of the debates and he said, wow, Lottigan is good. And he is not someone who would normally be on the side of a tea party. The only rhino I know is Lawrence O'Donnell. He said, wow, Lottigan is good. And he is not someone who would normally be on the side of a tea party. The only rhino I know is Lawrence O'Donnell. That's not who you're talking about, I think.

No, he was Harvard after you guys. But he, and I think he's right. I mean, a lot of stuff came out on Cory Booker we didn't know. You know, at the end of my book, Mugged, I described Cory Booker as my favorite Democrat in the country. I didn't know. If they postponed the election, that just would have come out later, so we would have ended up in the same place at the same time. No, no, no, no, no. Everybody was saying if the election had only been held two weeks later, because Lonegan was really coming on.

And Lonegan was really good. And if he had been held at the same time as the Republican governor is winning by, what was it, 22 points, Lonegan would have won. He had no foretells in any other race. Because he's in it for himself. The point is he would extend the love by having the election be the same day. He didn't campaign for Cuccinelli. That was my last complaint with the fat man. I wrote that that was not implausible, and I thought I was laying it on a toothpick.

It was too much of a heavy endorsement. It's not unimplausible. These are a bunch of liberal jerks. Well, I think dessert's been eaten, and we should probably wrap it up on liberal jerks, because you can't really do better than that. Thank you, Anne. Thank you. Sorry I talked too much. It's your fault for giving me one. and we have to we should probably wrap it up on liberal jerks because you can't really do better than that thank you Ann thank you sorry I talked too much

it's your fault for giving me wine no that was the point of the wine Troy I see you likewise see you soon Mickey thank you

for in a good natured way putting up with me your constant denouncing your constant denouncing

and Daniel thanks for being the lawyer and making sure that nothing actionable has been said here. He didn't say that. We don't know that yet. Actually, I think probably something actionable has been said here. Once or twice. We'll cut those out.

We'll cut the actionable stuff out. And thank you for listening. Thanks for being a member of RickandShay.com if you are a member. And if you are not a member, what are you waiting for? Now's the time you