The Ringer NBA Show - A Mavs Clusterf---, Plus KD’s Return | Group Chat

Episode Date: March 30, 2023

Justin, Rob, and Wos recap the Mavericks’ loss to the Sixers (02:18). They discuss Kyrie Irving’s postgame comments regarding the team’s struggles, and then move on to debating whether the Sixers are reliable. Then, they talk about the Suns’ victory over the Timberwolves, Kevin Durant’s return, and whether Rudy Gobert has regressed offensively (21:10). Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny Lambre Producer: Eduardo Ocampo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey there, humanoids. This is David Chewaker here with a very exciting announcement. Your favorite wrestling podcast feed, The Ring or Wrestling show, is now going daily. And you can hang out with me and Kaz on Mondays and Thursdays for the Masked Man Show. And you can join me, Peter Rosenberg, alongside Stack Guy Greg and Dip every Tuesday with cheap heat. And on Fridays, I'll welcome a friend or special guest from the world of wrestling. Now on Wednesdays, we have a very special new show called Wednesday Worldwide that you're going to want to check out. Paperview reaction, one-of-a-kind interviews, fantasy booking, talking about bagels. That's what we do here on the Ring of Wrestling show.

Follow the show now on Spotify. And do us a favor. Give us five stars. And do us another favor and stay major. And welcome to group chat after dark. I am Justin Verrier and joining me. The Disgusting Brothers. It's Rob Mahoney.

Big Wise. What's up, gentlemen? Too many people are calling us that. I don't know where it came from. I'm good, man. I'm just happy. My date is not wearing a garish burberry bag to this podcast. I'm happy about that.

Could slide it across a bank floor when you're heading into the vault, you know? I think this is now like the 100th succession reference on a ringer podcast that has nothing to actually do with succession. So I think we've tapped out right now. I think we've hit the limit. So sorry to anyone else coming after us. Sorry to real one. Great, great show. but also we got to start working on our Daisy and the Six references, man.

Y'all need to watch that on Amazon. I'm really, really into that show right now. I actually, I think that's what Luca and Embed were chatting about after the game tonight. They were just going real deep on Daisy and the Six. Riley, Keogh, a revelation. Riley, Keel, like, did you like the book better? They were just exchanging notes. Big Camilla Maroni fans.

They really thought he should end up with her and not Riley. Yeah. Sisko and I never give her two thumbs up. All right. So we're recording after Wednesday night's slate, Sixers, Mavs, and also Sons, Timberwolves for the big ESPN games of the night. We were going to start with the nightcap just because that one had the momentum. And then Kyrie Irving gave a press conference after the Mavs lost yet again, this time to the Sixers. I believe this is now one in four in their last five, including some pretty dire situations. against the Hornets. Why don't we just start from the Kyrie comments in which he told the media

it's kind of a little bit of a cluster fuck right now referring to the Mab situation. Rob, would you agree with our friend Kyrie? Well, certainly it is in the standings. But what's kind of funny about this quote at this time,

I thought the first half of this game was like as competent as the Mavs have looked in a while. They had some really good stretches. Luca Donchich was engaged, defensively. The ball was moving. They were holding down Joel and Bede with this hybrid zone defense that was kind of working.

And then in the fourth quarter, they score 17 points and just completely implode. Is it fair to call that a cluster fuck? Especially when, honestly, like they missed a lot of open threes. They had some chances to stay in this game and just like couldn't pull it off. Yes, there are mistakes.

Yes, the Mavericks remain the Mavericks and are small and are flawed and can't really defend over long stretches. I don't know. I thought the Charlotte games were the cluster fuck, to be honest with you. This is just like the aftermath of it. Come on, Rob. Why are we pretending that Kyrie knows the exact definition of cluster

fuck? Like, I think he's just describing a situation that's not going amazingly. And he's right about that. And for the reason, and it's mostly for the reasons that Rob just mentioned. They're a tiny team. They're really thin. They can't

defend anybody. It's literally a layup line and a turn style. No matter who they're big man rotation is. Dorian Finney Smith was probably their best defensive player and they traded him in order to bring Kyrie in. And I was somebody who was like, I don't

mind this trade. If they keep Kyrie, I think they have the basis of a team that could do things, but they have to fill out the roster with complimentary pieces, meaning people who can defend around what Kyrie and Luca

are doing. They don't have that right now, but they could build that out. in the near future. I don't think it's impossible to get much better defensively, considering how awful they are right now. So, yeah, while I don't think Kyrie is saying like, oh, this is like some maze that's impossible to see your way out of

and all of that. I think he's just saying if I may interpret a Kyrie quote that things aren't going well. And he's right. Yeah, I mean, I know we're not the first responder on the MAVS panic meter here.

But I got to say, I kind of expected the MAVs to look like the team we saw tonight. And to that point, I kind of feel like Kyrie's just basic read on where the team is and how they've been playing is kind of right. If you read the full quote of what he said, it's pretty winding as it typically is with Kyrie. And at one point, he kind of references

how he doesn't know what the future holds for him and the MAVs down the road, which seems pretty typical. but this is also the first time he's been traded to a team in the middle of a season and this team is playing like a team that as was said does not have any defense to really rely on

and B is still trying to get familiar with each other not only have they only played a handful of games, Luca and Kyrie have only played even fewer games together and they kind of look like that team so like I guess I'm not surprised that they find themselves in the situation right now. No and if you want to flash back to last year's

playoffs too and the run that they went on. All of that was based on how coordinated, coordinated and organized and connected they were and how well they played defensively in particular. And that was kind of triangulated between, as you said, was Dorian Finney Smith, very important defender for them. Maxi Kleba, who has not been the same since his hamstring injury, still kind of gradually working his way back.

And Reggie Bullock, who has dropped off significantly defensively this season. And those are your good defenders. And so you have those guys, you have Kyrie, who's upsetting kind of the balance, of your team via this late midseason trade and you have a bunch of other kind of new wish guys or young guys stepping into much bigger roles who weren't really doing that last season. It's not exactly a mystery

why they aren't connected or why they aren't performing defensively, why it is as much of a cluster fuck as it is. But I do agree that like the stretches of competence should be a little bit more common, right? Like just things like the first quarter, first half of this game, even things as simple as just like,

okay, we're going to run a lot of offense, through Kyrie to establish Luca off the ball and run stuff through him later, I liked some of that balance. It didn't pay off in the fourth quarter in the way they wanted because Philly's defense kind of solved them a little bit. But you can see the outlines of some things that

could work. It's just they haven't been. Here's the question I have. Do we feel like the Mavs played particularly well over the first three quarters, or do we think that the Sixers kind of sleptwalk through the first couple quarters and then turned it on as they kind of have been doing

of late Hardin coming off of a four-game absence and Bid has been in and now after ducking Nicola Yokic, memorably. So it just felt like not everything was like really working for the Sixers, and they kind of just tried. And at the end, it seemed like they just pushed over the Mavs and they fell over. It's hard for me to believe that any team

that isn't scoring consistently against the Mavericks, this particular group, is trying very hard. That's just, you just got to watch them, play especially when you know the other night they put they had javel mcgee out there they had him they had him out there tonight like just regular real life minutes with javelle mcgee like bro and he's at one point at one point the guy he was defending um was had sort of floated to the three point line and javel was off the ball and he completely turned his back to the dude he was defending and was facing the basket.

And I was like, in preschool they teach you men and ball. Like, it's like just crazy stuff. And this is who's getting minutes for this team at this point, you know? He also called for a post-up against Joelle and Bede at one point and got exasperated with Tim Hardaway Jr. when he didn't feed him the ball. I mean, look, ultimately we're talking about a couple minutes in a much larger game. the Mavs did not have it. Honestly, as far as the Sixers,

I thought Embed did look like at least a little bit hesitant coming up back from that Achilles injury. Like maybe they just didn't want to force feed him over and over in a way that you probably could, honestly, against this Maverick's front line, right? Like, if you want to ride Joel Embed to an easy win, you could probably do that. This felt a little like them playing a longer game.

And to your point, Justin, kind of easing into it, taking their time. And when they really needed to, they did get basically every bucket they needed to. two and every stop they needed to. Dude, you just put Christian Roe, Christian Roe, Christian Wood in pick and roll

and you're going to get great looks. Any kind of look you like. That's what I don't get about the Kyrie trade. And I said this at the time, and I'm going to say it again. Like, what else is there around the two of them

to really make this work? It's not just the fact that they don't have defensive pieces, which, as we outlined, are like, they're scraping the bottom at this point. It's you're relying on Javail McGee and Christian Wood. And also all of these young guys, Jaden Hardy is playing 18 minutes. Josh Green kind of flips in and out. It seems like he actually plays better when some of these

star players aren't on the court and he kind of floats around when they're not. And so like, I just don't know what they expected to do this season with these guys around them. And if I don't even see what they were going to do beyond that, because as we know, Kyrie's a free agent and a flight risk from the moment he gets into your organization. So, I actually don't think it's a Kyrie problem. He's actually played particularly well when he has been on the floor. I just think it's an organizational problem. It's a lack of assets problem,

which ultimately becomes a big question when it comes to Luca Dodgers's future. Yeah. I mean, to me, it's not like the Lakers gave up a ton to bring in a guy like Vanderbilt, right? Like, there's ways to bring in defensive-minded and defensive talent. without, you know, breaking the bank, so to speak. So I don't think it's impossible. And the offensive talent is such that they don't need these, like, incredible guys. Like, they don't need a McHale Bridges two-way defensive player.

They need guys that will play really good defense and can be a baseline, even a PJ Tucker kind of guy, right? He'll be completely fine around what Luca and Kyrie are trying to do. but they need those guys, and they need them now. You know, what's kind of funny about the chain of transactions that the MAVs have had? Because you're right, Waus. Like, in theory, not hard to get a Jared Vanderbilt type, but through all of the trades that they've made,

Chris Apzborzingis and Kyrie Irving, like getting all these guys in and out the door. Josh Richardson, remember that one? Josh Richardson. If I'm not mistaken, I think they don't have, I think they have one second round pick between now and 2030. it's like those could be pretty helpful in terms of like two seconds for a rotation player

like just kind of filling out this roster on the fly because to your point Justin the Kyrie trade is a starting point right it's like we're making this deal to get this star with the expectation we're going to go into the offseason and then we can start adding piece by piece but you just gave Javelle McGee a mid-level exception last season that could have been

a good spot to pay a player who's actually going to be a part of your meaningful rotation and going into next summer Kyrie Irving could just leave and so you'll never even have a chance to see this experiment to fruition. That's why games like this really hurt. And the fact that you have an incomplete roster and this is an incomplete experiment,

it could be a fatal flaw in what's ultimately like the Luca Donchich era. Ah, I'm glad you brought him up because I don't know if you guys caught this, but at the end of the game, before the game even ended, our friend Luca was having quite the long little chit-chat with Joelle M.B on the floor.

And I'm not talking about like a, hey man what are you doing after the game like idle like oh man great stuff have a good season whatever this was long i would say it was like three minutes or plus of going back and forth and at one point hardin comes in to say goodbye to lucca they stopped talking and then they start talking again so my conspiracy hat is fully on i'm wearing tinfoil all over my body at this point i have a nice little like fake tinfoil suit on. Could we see Luca replacing James Hardin next year in Philadelphia? I ask you, my friends.

No, we can't. But also, like Stephen Adams already told you, man, all the immigrant hoopers are friends, all of them. That's just what it is. That's all I see there is that, you know, every single non-American hooper in the NBA is connected. They feel connected in their foreignness. And they're like, can you believe these dudes listening to Eminem?

Idiots, you know? Like, that's, that sort of bonds these guys. So I'm not surprised that Luca and Joelle have a great relationship. And, you know, they're great players. My instinct with this stuff is always say like, oh, they're just, you know, they are talking about Daisy Jones in the six. They're swapping Overwatch strategies out there, whatever it is they're doing. And then you do get the cases like the Kyrie and Kevin Durant clip in which he's saying like, two Mac slots and when they turn the audio.

So maybe we just need the raw ESPN footage of that exchange is what I'm saying. Like somebody release the tapes. Listen, I've said it before. If Hardin leaves for Houston, which seems like a thing that could happen, believe it or not. And if that could happen, why can't this happen? But also Tobias Harris, expiring contract, got a couple picks, maybe a little Tyree's maxi action. God, this would be really bleak. Make this European cross-continental connection happen here.

I get that our company was founded by the person who made the trade machine famous. But even for us, even for you, Justin, this is low. Tobias Harris? What? I actually don't know what it would be. But like, I think that the point is I think Luca's future is coming up very quickly. It seems like he's been frustrated over the past couple of weeks. And I said it when they made the trade.

That's probably the nail in the coffin for this just because of the lack of assets they have going forward. And if Kyrie just happens to walk for nothing or God forbid, he stays and this becomes just like a cluster fuck, if you will, a chemistry powder keg of the two of them trying to coexist. I just don't see any pathway. I know it sounds ridiculous, but these things like the ripple effect. of these things happen very soon. And I wouldn't be surprised that this is probably the big one that ultimately decides what happens with Luca, whatever it is. Yeah, I mean, the superstar exits do evolve slowly and then all at once.

And so we can't count out those possibilities. There's a reason why the league is on Luca Watch in a sense and trying to gauge how this situation is going to work. Just like they're looking at Zion, just like they're looking at every superstar who could potentially theoretically, hypothetically be available. You do want to be ready for those moments. And yeah, the fact that Kyrie is on the record saying this, that Luke is on the record not even a week ago saying this is as frustrated as he's ever been

during his Mavericks tenure so far when they're losing back-to-back games to the Hornets. Look, that's notable, you know? Like, yes, zooming in on an Embed talk at half court after a game and putting too much meaning on it is probably reading too much into the situation. But this is not a good place that the Mavericks are in right now. You want to know what else is notable? The four years left on his deal. motherfucker ain't going anywhere.

It's notable until it's not was. He's not going anywhere. Yeah, I don't know, man. James Hardin will be traded seven times in that four-year span, so I don't know. Anything is possible here? So I don't know.

Do anything else we want to say about the Sixers? I actually do think, you know, to our point about them just kind of like turning it up when they need to, the fact that Philly has gotten into a place of comfort with just like, Hardin and beat, pick, and roll. we're just going to space perfectly around it.

Our guys know exactly where to be now. The past, pass action that leads to like maxi-3s in the corner, or PJ Tucker's not always in the corner anymore, and now sometimes he's like lurking along the baseline for some dump-offs and things like that. They just like slow burn their way into like one of the most efficient instant actions

that any team can dial up in this playoff run. And that's why that they feel real in a way that they haven't in the past. Like that chemistry is significant. And the fact that the fact that these, these guys as a unit as an eight nine man rotation make a lot of sense. It's a, it's a huge deal. Like, this team is a real threat to win everything.

And that can feel ridiculous to say about the Sixers. It always feels like we're kind of getting a little bit of ahead of ourselves when we start to praise them. But that's the kind of roster they have. I see you, Oz. I see your skimper. The smirky emoji over here. I just, you know, they, they look good.

They look as good as they've looked since the Jimmy Butler. era. And so, yeah, I'll give them that. They're really talented. They get, like you said, they can put together stretches where they look overwhelming defensively. And, you know, they're the rare team that can put together an overwhelming offensive stretch. Like, there's not a lot of teams left that can do both, right? And they have stretches where they do each one of those things. Yeah, I think theoretically, the theoretical version of this team could win everything. I just would like to see this happen against real teams in the playoffs. Well, one thing to put in your back pocket is I guess James Harden, even though he came back

from this Achilles soreness, he said after the game that it's something that's been bothering him for some months. So that's not good. No. Definitely look tentative, but after coming back from a bit of a stretch off, I think you would expect that. We got that from Kevin Durant as well in the nightcap here. But Um, with him, it's, it's kind of always the same push and pull there. Like, on the one hand, you're going to need him to play like Vintage Charge at some point in the playoffs. But I do think him being so deferential in pass first mode, you could see just how dangerous he is, almost like stationary and orchestrating out of a post up. And all the stats get thrown out every single game about him and MB and the connection and the assist totals, yada, yada, yada. I mean, he's just so good when he's just orchestrating and, and, and, and, playing the symphony. Even if he is hobbled, I still feel like this team could be effective

with him out on the floor. Yeah, that's what makes like this run and games like this one kind of convincing in their own ways. You could look at the Sixers and say, how many players on the Sixers had a good game against the Mavericks? Like George Nyang,

De Anthony Melton, that might be the end of the list. Hardin played below his standards, Embed played below his standards. Tobias Harris played all right, but was kind of invisible for long stretches of this game. played well enough, but no one was great. And yet, yes, they had times where they were down, but whenever they needed to be, they were in control. Yeah. And they have all of those guys who

they could play or not play. Nyang hits a bunch of shots, but he doesn't have to play in a series against someone else. So I don't know. I'm finding myself more bullish on the Sixers than I ever thought I would be. Waz, unfortunately, hasn't joined the bandwagon, but we'll see. It's never happened. Okay. All right. Second game. Kevin Durant, is back, although wasn't quite the rousing reunion, I guess, on the floor in Phoenix that I think a lot of people were expecting started over six. Looked really tentative, especially earlier in the game. I don't know.

Is anybody particularly concerned or is this kind of like a wait-and-see thing? About KD? Yeah. No. No, I'm not concerned. It's the first game back. He's his fourth game period with this new team. Like, that's, I think as much as we say he's plug and play, that that's something that still needs to be taken into account.

But look, I told you guys when the trade went down, a lot of people were calling these guys some juggernaut, world beating, you know, freaking Death Star. I'm not seeing that with this team. I think Devin Booker, I continue to be impressed by him. Just his ability to control the game to, like, he has a feel for the beach. beats, right? Like, he understands, like, all right, we need to get a bucket here. Like, there's like a tsunami coming or, you know what? If I score right here, this is going to put us in position to sort of coast the rest of the way. He's so in command of what's happening on the floor. It's incredible to watch, man. And it bears mention it because, you know, oftentimes,

especially early on in these guys' careers, they get these reputations. I know you guys remember to talk about is Devin Booker a winning player? Yeah. You know, yeah. And he gets these buckets. Dude, are these empty stats? Blah, blah, blah, blah. Like, so much of that chatter around this guy early in his career. And I watch him now and it's so, it's so obvious, man.

This guy is, he's the best shooting guard in the league right now. Which is just, you know, just incredible to see. And tonight, I think, was an example of that. However, I look, I know we made some jokes about it was a nice week of Wolves' contender talk. I kind of liked what I saw from them tonight. They feel like a really good team when, you know, when they're working in conjunction with each other. Not when Rudy is going dream shake, fade away, you know, on the low block.

No, but I like the way Minnesota looked in a loss tonight. Huh. Did you? Do you not? We're not impressed with the wolves? Listen, I think it's great that we had a week of here come the wolves. I've liked what I've seen for what it portends for their future together. I think they definitely have something as long as Mike Conley can stay on the right side of being washed.

But like, I don't know, man. I've never truly believed in them this season. And watching Rudy Gobert, like, try to play through himself and try to post people up and do little flip shots and then get called for at least two that I can remember moving screens. on critical fucking possessions. Like, what is that guy doing? Like, Nasreed is already better than that guy most of the time. Let's pump the brakes on the Nasreid.

Like, look, I'm all for some Nasreid talk. I like Nasree too, but like, you got to watch him play defense. And you know what? And this is a thing, though. Watching Rudy, he is like half a step slower than the prime version of himself. He's not, and he, he cleaned up on the glass today and Minnesota did a great job of bludgeoning Phoenix on the glass tonight.

There were possessions where they literally got five and six shots, right? And he's not the rebounder that he used to be, but I still think he's... What do we have left? No, but I'm saying he's not what he used to be. He's still good, though, at both of those things. He's still good at rim protection and he's still good at rebound. He's just not a force anymore. But the Conley thing I think is it means everything because he's the one guy who is trying to stir the drink who does take on the responsibility of trying to set guys up, put guys in position, occasionally give Rudy, throw Rudy that lob to keep him engaged.

And, you know, as much as shit as I talked about Carl Towns coming back and nobody caring, man, that like pressure release valve that he provides with his, you know, 30 foot range, it's everything, man. It makes it so that these guys, these teams can't just sell out on Rudy in the paint and when he tries to get to the rack. So I just like the makings of what's coming together in Minnesota. Maybe I'm too naive. No, I'm with you, Waz. Honestly, like, I feel like they were walking a pretty good line in this game in particular of having size and leveraging it, but also having that spacing. Like Towns was hitting threes. Reed was hitting threes.

they figured out ways to keep their bigs on the floor together and not get torched. Like the Sons, yes, we may not think of them as like an unbeatable team yet, but this is going to be a very good offense. This is a team with some of the most talented scores

in the league. They shot 42% from the field, 30% from three. That's real. Like that stuff is real. Like Kevin Durant, yes, is Rusty coming back from injury. He was also being blanketed

by an all defense level defender in Jaden McDaniels who, if you just want to zoom in on McDaniels, hounding Devin, Booker, contesting Kevin Durant's shot. Like, those were real A plus level defensive play. Slow mo.

Like, love slowmo. Dude, he just knows what spots to be. He's blocking Kevin Durant fadeaways. Like, it's crazy. Like, I don't know. When the group is playing connected, like, which they weren't early in the season, like, so many miscommunications behind the play, just giving up wide open dunks and layups. Like, these guys look like they have.

have a sense of what their game plan is, what their, you know, and what their strategy is, and they're executing it. And they look way better. I'm interested to see these guys in the playoffs. I think they could give any team in the West some big troubles in the series. Yeah. Listen, I was joking mostly before, but like the Conley trade gave them clarity for what they are more than anything they had done before.

The problem is the margin for error is still very slim at this point. The bench is not deep. Kyle Anderson having five turnovers in this game pretty much sunk them because he has been one of their critical players over this four nose stretch. But they have basically just surrounded towns and Edwards with solid defenders and guys who don't necessarily need the ball in allowing them to be the dynamic offensive force. I'm a little hesitant to like start punching their finals ticket. right now, if only because, like, we haven't really seen much of the Edwards Towns combination

in this correct setup because Towns has played, what, third game since coming back from injury, and Edwards has been dealing with injuries himself. I think he was sick tonight, but somehow ended up with 31 points, the quietest 31 points that I think I've ever seen. My thing is just, like, Gobert is just, he's a killer. You know, like, offensively, like, I just think, like, he needs a killer as in he's killing his own team, he's killing his own team, he's killing his So he's killing them. And it's just the fact that Nasreid is do a contract next season and you have Gober's just like Millstone contract on there.

It's just going to make things way more difficult than they need to be. And so it's like this season, it's probably not it. I'm glad that they're showing flashes. Next season, I don't know. You're really just hoping for internal improvement with Edwards and hoping that the towns Gobert cluttered front court is going to be as good as. you hope for it to be. I don't know if they've solved everything right now.

Honestly, Justin, I think we're in Ant Edwards turning into eight to nine free throw attempts per game type of player from this, none of that shit even mattering. If he becomes that kind of guy and, you know, there was a couple of times tonight where I was just like, yo, you kind of had the angle on the guy and you didn't go all the way to the rack. And it's just, I just conceive of him as this, you know, rim running, rim attacking, you know, ball handling, spreewell type. You know what I mean? To date myself. And there's just times where he just doesn't do it, but I'm just telling you, the second he becomes the kind of guy who lives at the free throw line, none of this other stuff will even matter at all. Did he not do it tonight

because he was sick or did he do it because there's a 270 pound guy just standing, there just waving his arms around like a wacky, inflatable tube man just clogging the paint. Okay, this is getting a little unfair. A little unfair. Gobert has been bad, offensively. Let's just, this entire season.

He's shooting, like, I think, one of his worst percentages over the past five seasons. Whatever, like, anyone talking about this leap, Gobert is going to take offensively, just needs to stop. It's not going to happen. No, I'm not saying he's been any great shakes offensively. I think more so, what has made the wolves competent is their defense.

And that defense hangs on Gobert and Kyle Anderson and Mike Conley in particular and Jaden McDaniels being really competent defenders who can stand up at their positions. Even just like something as simple as Conley on the ball on Chris Paul doing a pretty decent job goes a long way. I think games like this are a little misleading

in terms of what Goberr's impact is. This is a nightmare matchup, a team that wants to take nothing but mid-range jumpers out of pick and roll. kind of a disaster if you're going to play a drop like Gobert does. And yet I thought he was still pretty effective here. Again, those moving screens aside.

Side note, I thought this was a tickey tack ass refereeing job in this game. Just like a lot of weird. We're just going to give them the benefit of the doubt calls. Going like on offensive fouls, on loose ball fouls, like all over the place, really. Well, welcome to the modern NBA because this now happens once every night, unfortunately.

Yeah, the players are not happy. The grumbling in locker rooms is getting louder and louder. And obviously on press conference stands is getting louder and louder. The playoffs are going to be interesting from that perspective. I cannot wait for the first round of like my team got hosed fines to come out. They never went back after they had that tweet about apologizing LeBron, the referees. It's really been downhill since then. It might be an inflection point for an outright coup at some point.

anything else you want to well actually let's talk about the west here because the wolves are still in seventh here somehow the golden state warriors keep gaining ground in sixth place despite all logic and in actual results here do you want to play america was amazing stuff is good the rest of the team not so much um do you want to play america's favorite game which western conference play in teams do you actually believe in? I guess the better question is which ones don't you believe in? So as of tonight, the Kings, we should mention, punch their ticket after a 16-year drought. So light the beam!

Like that beam, baby. I just feel so good about that. It's great to see. It's a good story. It's very wholesome, all-American story. Wosha already tweeted out a complimentary tweet to Moni McNair for just a, brilliant job he's done constructing this team. Didn't see that one already

pre-programmed. So, all right. So after the Kings at 3, you have the Sons and the Clippers and Golden State. So that's 4-5-6. 7 is Minnesota. Eight are the Lakers, nine are the Pelicans, 10 to Thunder, who stick at

10 after just pulling a victory from the jaws of defeat with an unbelievable work from Jalen Williams, game-winning tip-in in that game. Not only, that. But Lou Dord wins a tip-off in order to jump ball in order to

get possession back. Giddy gets it, misses, and then Jalen Williams puts it back. Just absolutely incredible. I watch every Thunder game now, by the way, in case you're wondering. Justin, welcome. But it all turns on a trifle, right? Like, the Mavericks may miss

the play in because of that play. Like, that stretched out the lead that the Thunder have over the Mets. That could be a hugely consequential play in addition to all of the cluster fuckery. Wasn't there a year where the Pelicans made the postseason because of like some late Anthony Davis buzzer-beater from like half court in OKC? Do you guys remember this?

Wow, we got to dig this up. No, I don't think so. I think it was the first year that they made it with 80. Anyway. Is that the one where they lost in the first round to the Warriors? To the Warriors. Yeah, and then every good in that series. Yep, everyone was very excited about them. They sent a beatwriter down there for me, SPN, and then nothing happened.

So outside the play in Dallas Mavericks, Utah Jazz, and the sad ass fucking Portland Trailblazers who put out a who he played for lineup for all ages tonight. Good Lord. God bless them in Portland for just like not caring about whatever anyone thinks of them and just tanking so blatantly. Was. Who don't you believe in this mix? It's so crazy because it's like, Kyrie describes, you know, the sky is falling, cluster fuck. Like, the Lakers are only two games up on them in the lost column. Like, this is, I don't see how anybody can think this stuff is bleak.

However, you know, I think the Lakers and the wolves are the best of the bunch. The worst right now, I have to think the Mavericks are still better than the Thunder. Because it's a bunch of young kids who are liable to do, you know, really stupid things, but they haven't shown it on the court. It's just my brain won't allow me to believe that the Mavs are just like not going to do this. So, yeah, I still think the Mavs sneak in for that last spot and the Thunder, you know,

are the last ones looking in. was the thunder cannot be denied they simply cannot better record than the Mavs better point differential than the Mavs better lately than the Mavs certainly I could see the Pelicans falling out though like they the New Orleans desperately needed

lately though but they also just like handed over that game against the Warriors in just the most heartbreaking fashion honestly like I didn't even want to watch it it was just very difficult even just watching from home so yeah I mean the only

kryptonite for the thunder or just late free throws for any of their young guys because that's kind of how they they puked away the game against the hornets also giving up 40 something to PJ Washington doesn't help. There's a lot of like we're relying on Lou Dort because he's

the only guy who can like buy a drink of this entire team like sort of energy going on there but I guess it really depends on what happens with Shea hasn't played the past to you I don't totally know what's going on there but if he plays I agree with Rob.

But likewise, like, look at Donchitz is just not going to make the plan. It's just, it seems impossible. He might not. Also, speaking of 40-something points to the PJ Washington's, Drew Holiday just scored 51 points tonight. He did. Just lighten up the Pacers. Well, Yannis had like a 30-something point triple double.

By the way, the Pacers, probably my favorite team to watch to start the season, that's no longer the case. Well, they're not very interested in competing at this point. It's tough. I mean, they may be the Mavericks only saving grace. Like, if not for the fact that Indiana just did not have a lot of interest in winning that game. We could be talking about the Mavs on a pretty

extended losing streak right now. My guy Ben Matherin is, you know, he's hit a bit of a rookie wall as some people you know, do. But, yeah, they're not as exciting as they were to start the season. So we're really saying

the Mavs aren't going to make it? I kind of think they might not. It's tough. If I had to bet, I would bet the Mavs do make it and the Pelicans do not. That would be my bet. But I wouldn't be shocked at this point. Frankly, like, the Mavs have shown,

they will lose to anybody. And this was not a Hornets-only problem. They've been losing to bad teams all season long. So that is always on the table for them. Anything else from the West that jumps out to you guys? Are you still feeling moderately, bullish about the Nuggets. I feel like every episode we need to talk about this because it changes

week to week. The only thing I'll say about the West is I would really like to see the Warriors get that fifth seed, move up to five and get the suns. I would Golden State Phoenix. Really oh yeah. Really like to see that in the first round. That's good stuff. Yeah, but if I'm them, I'm not moving from six

because you have the Kings in the first round. Like it's breaking very, very nice for the Warriors if they are going to make this flip-sit shrun. Well, that was Dreymond. That was Dremont's preference, right? For the travel reasons? In the second? Yeah, it's a home game.

Honestly, it's legit. It's a real thing. What do we call it? It can't be the subway series. Is it like the Prairie series? The Sacramento Hills series, you know? Can we make a weed reference for the series? I don't know.

We'll put it in the workshop for a bit. The Bongripp series? Anything else we want to get to before we close it out here? anything on the suns? Nah, no sense for me. LeBron looked decent tonight. He's heavily leaning into that post game, which I think he's going to need to do.

God knows he's not blowing by anybody on those bad feet. LeBron looked pretty good tonight. A.D., playing like an MVP again. Hopefully his body doesn't turn, you know, into sawdust because of it. But, yeah, it's nice to see. It's hardening. Oh, and my man Austin Reeves. You kidding me?

Are you kidding me? Too small in Patrick Beverly? I don't think you're allowed to do that when he's actually smaller than you. But not substantially smaller, just like kind of smaller. It passes the fact check. Westbrook drop 40 or something crazy tonight. How many episodes you got left on Daisy Jones was? I'm up to episode five or six.

Wow. So, like, yeah, a little bit more than halfway through. Have they dropped the album yet? They have not dropped the album yet. Nope. It's a banger. I was told this was maybe a skip, you know? Maybe check out the audio book instead is what I was told.

It's not a skip, Rob. It's not a skip. Here's the thing. If you were to ask me why I like this, I couldn't come up with any logical reason. But it's, I powered through all of it immediately went on up. Dude. Well, for me, Bill was talking about season tickets people.

I'm a Riley-Kio season tickets guy from the girlfriend, from the girlfriend experience. Go watch that show. She is insane in that show. And she's damn good in this one. All right. Well, we'll end it on that.

Thank you to Eduardo Campo on production. We'll be back on the daytime schedule next week. We'll do a little MVP in all NBA Pits. We'll see you then.