The Ringer NBA Show - A Ringer NBA Investigation: Who’s to Blame for the Lakers Tailspin? | Group Chat (Ep. 386)

Episode Date: February 14, 2019

We parse last night’s news through the lens of some unnecessarily hot takes—Luka is the next LeBron, Jake Layman is first-team All-NBA, Buddy Hield is better than Jamal Murray, and more (2:00). Then, we steal a bit from Chris Ryan and Jason Concepcion and do our own 'True Detective' investigation: Who is to blame for ‘The Flat Lakers’ (28:55)? Hosts: Justin Verrier, Paolo Uggetti, Haley O'Shaughnessy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Before we get into the show, I wanted to let you guys know about podcasts on Spotify. If you didn't know, you could listen to the Ringer MBA show on Spotify. I've been a Spotify listener for probably five or six years whenever they kind of opened it up to the premium services. And I've recently started to migrate over to their podcasts on that platform. It's really easy to use. I looked something up just the other day. And I got right to my favorite shows, including the Ringer MBA show. While we're here, State Farm has over.

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Jimmy Butler is actually a good teammate. Saabonis is the most important front court pacer. The air and Fox is better than Donovan Mitchell Basketball is very good Hello and welcome to the Ringer NBA show This is the group chat Paulo hit it What's up? No I was gonna group chat

Oh no I can't do that All right well that's Apollo Getty Group chat And that's Haley O'Shaughnessy Anytime you do that I always think of Blues Clues The Meryl I was thinking about that the other day

Wow blues is a deep cut I love Blue's Clues It was great. Mailman Steve? Yeah. Happy Valentine's Day. Hey, guys. Just spreading the love via hoops talk here.

Have you guys seen some cool Valentine's Day cards that NBA teams are sending out via social media? I saw one today about Kevin Knox that was put in our NBA Slack. Did you see this one? Yes. I do not. It was Knox Knox, be my Valentine, which is not actually how that works. No, it's not. It's your Valentine.

That's a little creepy. that's that's just great a lot of good meaming going on in the NBA world but we are here to talk about hardcore hoops guys we're going to grind some tape we're going to get into the particulars later in the show we're going to get into some some Lakers talk we're going to do our own version of a true detective after show where we're going to get into the flat Lakers but first we're going to get into some news you know we're kind of in that dead zone in the NBA

where it's like we're kind of after the deadline right before All-Star everyone's kind of checking out right now but I think there's some really interesting stuff going on kind of underneath the surface. We're going to cruise through some recent headlines based on last night's action. I call it taking news. I like it. Which it's the news, but just based around a take and take form. It's really creative, guys. That's great. The first one, this one comes... Maybe we could get ads for that. We should. Anyone want to sponsor that? Isn't Take 5 a candy? This is great. Guys,

this is a great synergy. First one, this one comes via Dwayne Wade. I don't know if you guys have heard of him. I'll start pretty good. His take is that Luca is the next LeBron. Last night, the Dallas Mavericks and the Miami Heat played for the last time that Dwayne Wade was going to be in that game, or at least was going to be active, I guess. I don't think he ended up playing. But Tim Cato from The Athletic had this quote from Wade after the game. Quote me right here where I say this, it's LeBron James like from the standpoint of how he's able to rope that pass to shooters in the corner getting blitz. He's talking about Luca Dantius, by the way. There's not many guys who could do that and put it right there.

He's done an amazing job of it. Luca, the next LeBron. What do you think, Paula? He should have gotten his jersey too. Yeah, he should. No, he had to get Dirk's. It was, come on. You have two jerseys.

Well, Luca has LeBron's, right? Remember, we witnessed... When we were there for the Laker game, LeBron sent out a jersey of his jersey sign to give to Lucas. So maybe LeBron can trade with Wade and send a couple picks and get the jersey back. And then eventually in the future, when he's... Lucas teammate, he can just trade jerseys with him then. I just want to say, I love the old-schoolness of this.

I think Wade is going to be the last player we have who is going to utter the phrase, quote me right here when I say this. Like, players do not say that anymore. Well, also, you're always being quoted because all of this is just going straight to social media. But I just love that he, like, had to emphasize, like, call me right here. What do we think, though, Haley? Luca, next LeBron? I mean, you can see it with the passing.

Luca has this vision and kind of this maturity already to where when we see him, him to have those kind of passes that Wade's talking about, which he's been on the receiving end for many years with LeBron. It's not necessarily that he's just, I can't believe he's a rookie making that pass. It's just that I can't believe he's making that pass. You know, there's like a level of understanding, I think, that's always blown us away with LeBron. It's not the most exciting part of his game, but it maybe is the most impressive that he can read what's going to happen before anyone else even knows that it's going to happen. And the same is, that's the same I think quality of Lucas.

I think the interesting thing is Wade specifically pointing out the passing because, you know, from LeBron, from the LeBron standpoint, like, there is passing combined with, like, great athletic performance. And Luca is definitely not there yet. So I think it's going to be interesting to see. And maybe this is just like more praise toward LeBron that he can combine that athletic performance with also the passing. But I do think we might see versions of LeBron in different players going forward, like maybe Lerbren. Luca will have the passing and maybe Zion will have the like athletic ability or you know what I'm saying like I think there's going to be pieces of him. Yeah. The thing I see in Luca, that's LeBron-esque, is just the way that he uses his body and the pace that he plays at. LeBron can play fast, but he's always kind of playing at LeBron's pace, especially in these last couple years of his like his career where he's actually just slowing things down and wanting to conserve energy.

Luca just kind of, I don't know. I don't even know how to describe it. He just kind of uses his body in weird ways. He's like he's thick with two C's, kind of like LeBron has always been, and is able to leverage that and also his kind of uncanny vision to kind of hit guys. He's got a contorting in a way when he still keeps balanced. And it's interesting you say that because LeBron's body is obviously so different than Lucas, but they do use it in similar way. Yeah.

I mean, like that highlight earlier this week where he is dribbling one way and goes underneath, like I don't even know what to call that, like kind of like a hesitation underneath his legs and then pulled up for a fadeaway jumper. When I wrote about Luca earlier this year, I said that it's like watching someone who's really bad at driving a stick shift. Sure. You know, and that's always what he reminds you. He's so herky, jerky, and a lot of times,

that's exactly how he's able to break away from defenders that he might not be able to because he's a little slower. He'll lean so much to the right before he goes left, and it's incredible he can do it because he doesn't look like the most athletic guy. I think my thing would be that he's more the next heartened than he is the next LeBron. Yeah, for sure. And obviously the stepbacks are a big part of that But I don't know

I see a lot of LeBron and him A little bit of Ben Simmons I guess Simmons is the obvious LeBron comp but I don't know I guess it's just that like That big man passing thing That we don't really see from anybody I guess Blake Griffin was the model T

Of the LeBron like model In that regard yeah Just a guy who can handle Who could pass from that size I guess the only other one that we think of is Yokicch yeah Yokic is basically Sabonis what No no I mean I would not put Yokuch in that like

realm, if you will. As a great passer, who's the big guy? Oh, it's a great passer who's a big guy. Yeah, but if we're talking about like the handling, combining that with the handling. Oh, yeah, no. I meant like passing. Yeah, for sure.

Yeah, I'm curious to see where Luca stands in terms of like when Zion gets into the league. Yeah. Like, do we automatically just like lose our Luca love fest because Zion is just Luca plus like Larry Johnson? No, we don't. The backlash will come. The backlash will come. It comes for everybody.

It comes for everybody. Unless he says something problematic. I'm just, who hasn't it come for? But, like, Janice is probably the only guy who's, like, been safe from. And even him, like, there's people out there who are like, oh, well, he doesn't shoot threes. Mm-hmm. So, I don't know. Well, the thing with Luca, I'm curious about is just more like how much he appeals to, like, a broader audience.

I think every, like, hardcore NBA fan loves him. And he's also has, like, a really adorable personality, I think, like, with all his Fortnite, like, skittins that he's talking about. He dresses like he's, like, going to, like, high school, like, sweet 16 birthday birthday. Like, he really does. Right. He's on Fairfax going to, like, supervise. like after games.

But yeah, I'm just curious if like Zion becomes like instantly the next like face of the league whereas Luca is maybe just like a better overall player. I don't know. It's just going to be something curious to watch. From Luca Donchich to, I don't know, the American Luca Donchish. Our guy, Jake Lehman. Very low rent. This take is from a good friend of ours, one Chris Ryan.

I don't know if you guys have heard of him. Jake Lehman is the best player in the NBA. I don't know if you saw our guy Lay last night. He's pretty good. I've called him the new Rudy Fernandez. I don't know if you guys were deep in India. But yeah, Ruhranan Legend. Portland Legend.

Just like had all these like really exciting dunks and was kind of, I'm trying to think of the modern equivalent of who he is. So last night I was looking up his final line, Jake Lehman. And I found this CBS headline that says, Jake Lehman, Standard League Relevance continues. Okay. Sounds about right. I think I made a joke like last week and he was like he had a good game where I was like

He should be like the Mendoza line is for baseball for NBA players because like if you're above it you're like it's like sign you're good and it's like He is like the ultimate threshold if you're better if you're good if you're better than Jake Lehman you're good and if you're worse than Jay Laman you're back Would you call him the ultimate wing? There you go No The ultimate layman That's what I would call him No that's good

Yeah but last night the Blazers took it to the to the Warriors late in that game. I mean, they just took off as soon as, like, things started getting chippy. I think it was good to see the Blazers. I feel like win one of these games. It feels like they never win those, like, Warriors games in the regular season because, like,

the Warriors have just come out of nowhere in the third or the fourth quarter. And I'm like, all right, like, here, we'll put a stop to this or whatever. And they just went cold. And I, like, looking at the standings, like, the Blazers are now in the top four. Like, they've been there.

But, like, staying above the Rockets, I feel like it's very important to keep that home field. I mean, home court advantage for the first round. least. I'm encouraged by what I saw there. And the two things I took away from are, one, that they're not going to be afraid of anybody. There are a lot of guys in that team that, like, won't back down. Like, Lillard, Calum. And now they're about to get Ennis cancer, too. Exactly. He, like, totally helps that. Do you guys remember at the beginning of last season when Nerkich was like, we're the bad boys? Oh, yeah. We got to lean into being the bad boys. Okay, last night, you can kind

see the vision. They have enough spread out. You know, Lillard always has a chip on his shoulder. Yeah. Nerkid just constantly, you know, like, kind of wants to be that, like, big bully guy. And his Cantor has an attitude against everyone he plays. Talk shit to LeBron, you know? I also think somebody

pointed to say, like, Zach Collins was playing the way he was playing because Cantor might take some of his minutes now that he's in there. So, that'll be interesting to see, too. Yeah. And the other thing I thought about with them is they're just super deep now. They got Rodney Hood also at the trade deadline, who's a guy. I've never been the biggest Rodney Hood,

but if he plays more like Utah Rodney Hood and not like Cleveland Rodney Hood, I think that's somebody... They're iffy deep. Yeah, but then like, even like Mo Harkless. Like, he blocked Clay Thompson for a three in the corner, and I was like, whoa, Mo Harkless. Maybe for most games,

but like, I wouldn't call them like deep, deep. Yeah, I mean, I will say one of the things with this team has always been that their first, you know, five or six guys are good enough to be like a really good team. And then after that's a huge drop off. Like, that's stouts because, like playing meaningful minutes for them.

No disrespect to him. Well, a little disrespect. Yeah, meaningful minutes at the early part of the season. And it was going great. I remember, like, we wrote a piece about how they were, like, jelling and how, like, they just had continuity. But then you started to see... We wrote a piece, or...

Did you write a piece? Did we write... I mean, the collective ringer universe. Sure. And then you started to see them fall off a bit in terms of just... They just can't keep up. It's a little bit like the Wizards of a few years ago where, like, the starters were so good and the bench.

not. Well, it's almost like a fraction of the starters are so good, right? Like, same with the wizard's like, that's always been said about, you know, the back court, but then they're like, well, they've got to do something. And that's always been the question of like, should they trade one of them to try to even it out more? I think there was a rumor and I would have to look it up to look at the specifics where they were, where they tried to get Paul George from Indiana and like almost it, which would have been very interesting. Yeah, that's a great what if. I mean, but as we're saying, I think our guy Jake is kind of the inflection point with this team. I looked this up. He is second in field goal percentage right now among

non-bigs. So not a center or Paul? Did you look at who's first? I did. Oh, well, amongst non-biggs? Do you guys know? Like, can you get, do you know who it is already? I looked it up. Paolo, can you guess? So not a big man. He leads the league in field goal percentage. He plays like a big

man, I guess. Ben Simmons? Yeah. Okay. Ben Simmons. Oh, no. It's Jeremy Grant and Rudy Gay. Oh, this was like, well, Laman doesn't qualify because he only takes like, I could have six shots a game. I should mention that. Amazing.

But our guy is Jordan struggling against the Warriors. He did the LeBron push-down thingy, which I don't really know what that means. He needs to either lose that or improve it because he's like half-hearted doing the LeBron thing. It looks so lame. Do you know how like Mega Man takes someone's like power and just. Yeah, guys, just go with me. That's the layman. He does your move against you.

Except he wasn't even playing LeBron. Well, I mean, you know. there. He's eclectic. But I don't know. I'm encouraged by what I'm seeing about the Blazers. It's always good to see the Blazers show something because I just throw them into this kind of middle ground where I don't really know

what to do with them because they're always this ham team. Does it really matter to you if they show something at this point in the season though? Probably not. Last season, you know, they're just like always fools gold to me. Yeah, and this was the last game right before the All-Star break for both teams, I think. So we'll see. But another team I'm a little encouraged about after

last night, our own Minnesota Wolves. Who's Missed on a little? Well, someone, someone out there, some very sad people. They beat the Rockets last night. So the past two wins against the zombie clippers and the Rockets. Coincidentally, one Andrew Wiggins did not play. I call this the Mello Theory,

who's when your worst player doesn't play and you're all of a sudden better. What do we think about them? They're 27 and 30 right now, three and a half games back. The Clippers for the AC, they only have a 9% chance. According to 538, Do you guys think they have any shot of getting back in the mix here? No. The only way the wolves are going to stay in any kind of race is by identifying who their best defenders are.

And that's obviously very limited. I think that, you know, and Robert Coveyton has no timetable. So that's discouraging. But, I mean, if you want to look at any straight difference between Wiggins being out and Lle-Dang starting his place is it's going to try on defense. I looked it up yesterday. Lle had eight rebounds, four-sist, two blocks. those are all higher than Wiggins' averages.

And they absolutely should not be. A guy paid the max should not at least be averaging one of eight rebounds, four assists, or two blocks. And also last night, Teague was very good in the game, and that's uncommon. You're not going to get that all the time. Even the guys who you've brought in, Dario Sarich, it's hard to keep him on the court

because that means you're probably taking Taj off the court, which is taking off their entire defensive core, basically. I guess my thing with them is, you know, we can talk about their defense and Kat is a game. better, but if they were to like be real with themselves and zoom out, it's like the West race is way too crowded already. And they could easily get a top six draft pick if they started, you know, losing right now. I think they're like within four or five games of that six pick. And it's like, why not get another nice pick? Because they have an interim coach. They have

an interim front office essentially. So I think that's why they're really like unactive at the trade deadline because they don't really have an established direction. You know, if they make a move that doesn't work out, these aren't permanent positions, but they could be. Yeah. It's what they were saying when they let go of Tibida. Yeah, I think at a certain point, a Tenging team like this just needs to put their foot in the ground and just say, we need to figure out what we have.

They have so many young guys, their team is based around two max guys who really haven't proven to be max guys. And the one thing I've liked from Ryan Saunders, who's what, all 32 years old, trying to coach a bunch of guys where Lual Dang, your starter is probably old. than him is he's trying a lot of different things, like trying to put Luwolding, like, unearthing him from literally like the depths of the bench and starting him in a game. Started Sarich too at one point. Starting starch over Tajikovsky starts.

That's a big one. Josh Akogi starts. And as we've seen, Joshua Kogi rules. Yeah. He had that nice block on Hardin kind of when Hardin went for a step back and at the top of the perimeter. That's one of the biggest frustrations from when Tibado was coaching. He very much was never somebody who would give a Josh Akogi a chance, even when he did

show, when he was forced. too because of injuries or, you know, having a shorter rotation that night and he was forced to and a kogi would play up to it. He never really was somebody who would give the young guys a chance, which is really awful in retrospect because they are just a young team. And when you think about if it would have been different and maybe someone else would have been in there and they would have had Krista and they would have had Zach Levine, even Tyos Jones, maybe things would have been a little bit different for them and they wouldn't have had felt so locked into the contracts that they've signed now.

I mean, that's the thing. There's a version of this team that's young and fun and has a bunch of, you know, wait and see, but also, like, stars like cat in the making. And I think we, we could have had that version.

And yet it was, you know, it was always, right. They're still so young. We don't even think of them as, we don't throw them in with the young teams. Yeah,

exactly. So, well, I think the one thing is, like, the whole Tibbs losing him mid-season was just addition by subtraction. Like, you get to see these guy play a little looser.

You get to see what you have in Ryan Saunders. And I'm also curious, like, if it's just like they're going to be better on defense simply because they're not running Tibbs' system. Like so many coaches I talk to and like league personnel types for that defense story I did earlier in the season were just like, Tips doesn't know what he's doing anymore. He's like he's sticking to this icing scheme and it just, it doesn't fit what everybody else is doing. And it doesn't matter how you're deploying or like who you play in that system. It's just not going to work. And I think I don't think it's a coincidence that we've seen guys like Josh Akogi. Robert Covington when he got into the mix was good.

So if there is any hope for them going forward, which is minimal, as we've been saying, I do think if they get Covington back healthy and maybe mitigate the Wiggins contributions, I think there's like a nice sweet spot to, at the very least, go into next season with some encouragement. Yeah, I was going to say they have the pieces. Like they have more than a few young guys who can be very, very good. And I think that what you would want is something like the Kings that are having this year, where you go into next season with that young group of players. and have that improvement that you, that the kings are having.

They just already piled on expectations that, that fast forwarded this development of this team's core. And even though the reason those were fast forwarded Jimmy Bellar is gone, they kind of still remain with the team. Yeah, that's fair. Pivoting to a team that probably is already a safe bat to make the playoffs here and maybe even get the one or two C, the Denver Nuggets. Isaiah Thomas makes his triumphant debut in a Nuggets uniform last night.

8 points on 3 for 6 shooting to assist two turnovers in 13 minutes They won against the Kings It was a pretty fun game If you watched the take Paolo Isaiah Thomas will be the most impactful post-deadline edition in the NBA So we're talking about guys who are already kind of on teams That will be like a second half boost Because the other day Bill was talking about with KOC

Just Gordon Hayward like a healthy version of him Would be like a deadline edition Isaiah Thomas. Is he another guy like that? I don't really think I buy the premise of like somebody already on the team being like some sort of addition. I get that like guys can improve over the course of a season. And with Hayward specifically, it's one of those things where he just needs to get more playing time and get more comfortable. So that makes sense.

With Isaiah specifically, I don't know. My thinking is he'll be more impactful from an energy and like motivation standpoint rather than a actual statistical standpoint. He's a weird type of player and energy to where you're not sure if he would actually be something in the playoffs, but he's shown that he has been before. Yeah. Something where it doesn't make sense, you know, between like his playstyle and the opponents he's going up against, yet somehow it is working out. I mean, that was like basically his entire story with the Celtics. Right.

And with the nuggets, they actually might need something like that because although they have all these guards, they have Jamal Murray, Gary Harris, Malik Blesey, Will Barton, Morris. A lot of them have never been to the playoffs before. Right. Yeah. And so they might get into a situation where being able to fall back on him is very fortunate. I think that he could be their DeMarcus cousins, if only from like an emotional standpoint. Like you've gotten to the point of the season where we kind of know who they are.

They're mostly a young veteran team who's proven themselves. So what's like the next thing that's going to motivate them over the course of like, the last however many games, 30 games. I just think, like, having that energy to throw in there is really valuable. And I also think, to Haley's point, like, I'm looking at their bench right now. And yeah, they've had a bunch of injuries. But, like, who's coming off that's going to kind of, like, jolt them at this point? I think that's valuable to a certain extent.

I mean, maybe we don't think of those guys as such because they're younger, like the Montemortes or the Malik Beasley's. And I think that their guard rotation is so packed with players who have out, you know, gain their expectations. that you, from like a logistical standpoint, you look at it and you're like, where is Isaiah going to fit? But I think maybe to Haley's point, you know, you're right. Like, he could be that guy who extends the leads in the second quarter with the bench unit or in the fourth quarter, you know, going into, like the game is tied, for example. Like, I could see him, you know, going off for like five or six points like he did last night. And so I think that would be. Yeah. And it's, and for him, it's, and for him, it's kind of like the perfect situation, too.

He doesn't really have that much expectations. He doesn't have to play. huge role. Well, the other guy that I'm worried about with Denver is Jamal Murray. Like, I just don't know on a game to game level, like, what I'm getting from him. And to that point, like, he had 10 points in a game against the Kings who don't have a great defense. And it's just like, where are you guy? And he's kind of the guy. We had a piece from DJ Foster on the ringer early this season. Like, he's kind of the one that needs to kind of step forward in order for them to have any shot in the playoffs because he's going to be up against a lot of the good guards in the Western Conference. And I think he's just like that second guy that they need if Yokic isn't going to be on.

This takes me to our last one here just because it's always interesting, I think, because Murray got taken after Buddy Heald in the draft a couple of years ago. I was in New Orleans. I was a big buddy healed pessimist, let's just say. And definitely in that first half of the season, he was not good at all. I used to say it was like he was dribbling. It looked like he was trying to avoid a minefield because he just didn't know where he was going. but they played last night and Buddy was kind of spectacular

and I got to the point where I was like, all right, I can't knock this guy anymore. He's like really, really good. So the take is Buddy Heald will have a better career than Jamal Murray. I've always loved Buddy Heald. I was the opposite. But I think that now their draft order doesn't matter as much as in context as the expectations that are going to be put on them.

So when you think about it, we have already identified Jamal Murray as the guy that needs to step up for the Nuggets to be able to take it to the next level. Buddy Heald is a guy who was coming off the bench last year. He got moved to the bench. He was someone who, you know, the coaching staff was saying, this guy is better coming off the bench. You know, he was even shooting really well last year,

but that was still the case for him. And now all of a sudden, you can see that he's this really amazing off guard who can perform this job very well. That's kind of almost like a more, it is more minimalist and not as much pressure as a point guard. Do you know what he's shooting from three of this year? you're shooting 45% on volume

on a career high 7.6 attempts right and if you're doing that and during the season expected to be like a really good sixth man then your expectations have already shot up

also there's the context of their teams right the nuggets were already supposed to be good the kings were not supposed to be good also it's the context of the roster too because Murray has to be more of a playmaker more or less with the nuggets

than Buddy who just has to be this guy next to Deer and Fox and take open shots. Yeah. The one thing I saw last night is Buddy is just super confident. Yeah. Like he had that one play

toward the end of the game where they didn't call a timeout. I think they were down two or something. And he just rained it down their throat and then got to the rim, which I rarely see from Buddy. And I was just like, man, he thinks he's the best guy in the court.

And I often think like it was probably better for him to leave New Orleans, which wasn't a high profile situation, obviously, but they needed him for a very specific role like immediately. He needed to hit threes for them to have any chance of making the playoffs that year, and they didn't, they ended up trading for cousins

and went a whole different directions. But being able to hide in Sacramento, I think, is almost like allowed him to regain his confidence that maybe he lost when he struggled early on because he wasn't shooting until, I would say, midway through his rookie year. Yeah, and it says so much about Sacramento that he's like, quote unquote, got to hide there because he did and he got to regrow whatever he was going to be in this league. But at the same time when he got traded there, the owner was basically like he's going to be the next step curry i mean look at the numbers look at the numbers all right we're going to go deep on the lakers here in the second part of the show but first i want to talk about the watch of the night guys it's a big one okay c at new orleans right

before the all-star break uh this was going to be a pretty exciting game just in terms of gameplay uh just anthony davis going up against some of the thunder guys paul george for mvp but i think the side show of this one is particularly interesting you have anthony davis sort of playing and you have guys like not really knowing what to do with them. They're in New Orleans. And so the crowd is going to have to figure out whether to boom or applaud him. Have you guys been watching this lately? I just want to know who's going to have Fass and more. Anthony Davis or your date tonight at Valentine's Day. Wow. There you go. I don't know if I can add to that. Yeah. Are you looking at Paulo or you're looking at me? It's a rhetorical question for everyone

listening to this podcast. Oh yeah. Because I'm going to be watching Househunterners guys in addition to this game tonight, which is on at 5 p.m. Pacific on TNT. And remember if you want to watch every NBA game subscribe to NBA League Pass on MBA.com or your local cable or satellite provider. Let's take a quick break here and talk about some conspiracy theories with the Lakers, our favorite. This winter is a great time to check out Hotel Tonight. Whether you want to take a spontaneous ski trip or escape to a warm beach, Hotel Tonight makes it easy to book a room with one of their last minute deals. There are tons of empty hotel rooms out there just waiting to be booked.

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Combining the purchase of your home and auto insurance is easy with the help of a real-life state farm agent. Go to statefarm.com to find an agent today. All right, we're back, and we just talked about some news around the NBA from last night. We're going to talk about the Lakers here. It's one of the teams that it gets talked a lot about, but I think they've flown a little bit under the radar. in terms of just like everything that's going on post-deadline. We've been excited about some East teams. The Lakers? Under the radar?

Well, I mean, like the AD thing is like taken over, but I think like there's some really big concerns about the actual existing product. I don't know. Maybe it's just my personal silo. But we do a lot of sleuthing at the ringer.com here. They do the True Detective after show. So we're going to take a little spin off of that. We're going to do True Detective the Flat Lakers.

We're always trying to be Chris Ryan. That's 100% true. But shout to Bobby Wagner, our producer for that name. So, guys, who's the blame here? Who kidnapped Dora LeBron? Jeez. Like that? Man.

That's good. Okay, so we're just going to go over a couple of suspects that we think could be the source of some of their woes this season. They're what? They're two teams back of that A-Spot right now. I think they're in 10th place. It's the longest into the season. LeBron has been under 500 since his rookie year. I believe that was a Mike Adams thing.

stat on Twitter. The first suspect, suspect number one, one Magic Johnson. I don't know if you've heard of this guy. But recently in a one, in like a five-minute press conference, he dropped the following tidbits

or incited to the following drama. He said the Pelican didn't negotiate in good faith, which seems like it was true based on everything he's heard at this point. He leaked that Ben Simmons wanted to work out with him. For what reason, I do not know. Setting off yet another tampering investigation.

I think we're at 10 this year. And he basically told his young teammates that he tried to trade all of them, almost literally all of them, and lost Ivakazubatch in the process. Shots to him. He told them to suck it up. Children should laugh.

Children should laugh. That's true. Paulo, what do you think about Magic Johnson? Is he the one to blame here? If I were like in one of those first take sports debate shows, I would open with like the massive. is gone. Oh, yeah.

That's what I was open. But I'm not going to do that, even though I just said. I think magic, we're going to get into more of the roster I know going forward in this segment. But I think like everything that has happened since the season began has been a way to try to undo what they did in the off season. It's like they prepared everything to get LeBron. They did. And then everything else they did is backfiring on them. And who else to blame it in that case?

than Magic and, you know, Rob Polinka who will get to. Yeah, I just think Magic made a lot of bold proclamations. And Jackie McMullen was talking about this on a recent podcast on ESPN. And Jackie obviously knows both Larry Bird and Magic Johnson really well. She did a book with both of them. I think he even worked on that documentary a little bit. It was basically like, this is Magic not getting what he wants. And for a guy who's probably been successful at literally almost everything in his life,

just business and then obviously in his. NBA career, you could definitely tell like he's taking that approach that he can kind of just do whatever he wants and is not getting that. The league is pretty much like, nah. Yeah. And I think it thought it was interesting when we went back and we looked at how he kind of promised that he'd get a marquee free agent around this time last year. His reasoning was, I'm Magic Johnson. Well, first of all, he's a Leo. Second of all, selling names and history, I don't think has ever mattered as little as it does now in Free Agency. Mm-hmm.

I mean, we see that by guys listing the clippers and the nets as places they'd want to go. Those are still big markets, but those teams don't have the history that the Knicks and the Lakers do. Well, I just think it's interesting, like looking at what they've done. Even before he got there, their plan, if they had a plan, was basically just to rebuild to collect picks. But those picks haven't been very good. They haven't developed a lot of them. And ultimately, it's going to fall on some of the top brass. who was around for a lot of these guys.

And I mean, I've said this before, but it could turn out, and it's looking pretty probable that DeAngel Russell is the best draft pick they had among some of these first rounders. They made great picks. They found good players. In terms of like Kuzma, for example,

like, so obviously they had picks in the, yeah, picks in the top. Josh Har, Zubage. Right, exactly. They had picks in the top five, you know, a few times, and they got, you know, Randall, Russell, Lonzo,

Ingram, et cetera. And I think it's been more about, like you mentioned, the development when those guys get there. And I think that might be, I wonder, this is,

you know, a little bit out of ignorance, but I'm wondering how those two kind of philosophies contradict or how are they able to coexist in a team like the Lakers

where you know that the goal eventually is to get a free agent and it was always to get LeBron. And with the other side of the, the team where you have to develop these young players. And it feels like they weren't able to sort of do both at the same time.

Well, they also swung and missed on the other part of that, which is getting guys around them. Sure. Their free agency, this offseason was so bad outside of LeBron. Yeah. And we laughed at it then. But at this point, I mean, reflecting on it, it was so bad. And there are players that they could have gotten in place of the signings. And really, when you look back at it, Rondo.

like they should have done run. Everyone else, I don't think that they should have signed. Yeah, I mean, the way I rationalized it at the time or at least attempted to figure out what they were doing was that their shooters were going to come in house. That Brandon Ingram theoretically is a three-point shooter. Right. Kyle Kuzma is theoretically a three-point shooter.

But Kuzma is barely scraping 30. I don't even think they were expecting Kuzma to have this much influence on the offense. I mean, there's no way they could have been. He's probably at times their most consistent non-Lebron. Yeah, definitely. He has been for sure this season. And I think it's low-hanging fruit at this point, but you're talking about a guy like Brooke Lopez, who was literally on a team last year.

And they probably could have kept them, you know, like you said, instead of some of the other guys they signed. And instead, he walks to Milwaukee and becomes like a lethal three-point shooter who would be amazing on this team. They just traded a young center who was giving them valuable minutes in Zubatch. and now they have to figure out how to cope with an aging Tyson Chandler and Javeal McGee who's also inconsistent like they ran out a lineup against the Hawks

I think it was a Bronner to 5 for a bit and that might be something that they have to do because those other two guys can't be as consistent. The thing about Chandler and McGee though at the same time is that they are not playing worse than we expected them to. This is just who they are. They signed a bunch of people we all know who they are

we knew who Beasley was Lance Stevenson was and now nobody's surprised that it's not good enough. Yeah, I think the center position, it seems to fit what they want to do overall. They want to run really fast. They want to get those slender, like, rim protector types. And I guess I could see the thinking there just because, like, you could find centers more easily than probably most other positions.

But as we just discussed, like, a lot of their, like, ball handler defense types over shooters has made no sense. And I just love this idea in the NBA and everything else. Just like, little decisions you make ultimately have big effects like year or two down the And we're seeing it now at the trade deadline where they had to get rid of some young guys and whatever you think about Svi and Zubach. Like, I don't think they're going to be much, but there's something. They're like, they're lottery. Lottery tickets.

I mean, Zubach had a great game last night against the Suns. I think, I forgot his line exactly. But it was a very efficient game where he played a limited around minutes like he did with the Lakers and, you know, like filled up the statutes. And they had to get rid of those guys to bring on Reggie Bullock and Mike Muscala, both of whom I really like his players. And I think they'll be helpful. but like I think it's telling that you have to really kind of get those guys in there midstream. And this kind of brings us to our suspect number two, which is Rob Polinka. And I do wonder, while everything seems to be trending toward agents running things in the NBA,

there's a little bit more power. At the very least, it's more transparent power. We're seeing it filter out more into the public. And I think even in the past two years, even among media types, like the way like everything runs is kind of through agencies. Yeah, Rich Paul has given. woe's the last two scoops. They're not even scoops. He's just told them like, Anthony Davis is going to request a trade. Yeah. And so I wonder here if they've almost like, they have so much experience in that sort of thing, basically muscling people to get their way, essentially, that maybe they're a little too

heavy on that side and not as heavy on the experience and some of the like the little things, the Sam Hinky style things in order to get to the point where you. can strike and you're not putting all your eggs in one free-indency basket. I think there are also some niceties and you have to have some manners among front office people. I'm serious. And like this agent mentality is not necessarily going along very well with that. And I think that the, you know, the pushback that we saw with the pelicans and Anthony Davis. And, you know, we heard a bunch of rumors that there are people around the league telling the pelicans, don't let them do this to you. at the end of the day, the league, it does not want it to trend this way.

And the owners don't want it to trend this way. And usually when we say the league, we think of Adam Silver in an office with a bunch of, you know, cubicles. But it's not. It's the owners. The owners are his boss. You know what I mean? That they do not want this. Yep.

Yeah, I mean, I do think that's interesting. I hadn't really thought about it that way where the way, you know, an agent operates maybe is because there aren't that many right now in the GM air, like, field, maybe does not. drive well with that with that environment. I do think to your point they it's about working those margins you know that you're talking about and those getting those I don't know maneuvering the cap in a way that it is to your benefit. I feel like Darryor Morey does all the time or like you said Hinky finding those guys who you know that may turn into Robert Cummington for example right and obviously this is all affected by the fact that they have to fast track their timeline adding LeBron and that creates a you know stress on everything but I do think there were things that he and

you know, like we said, magic could have done to make this a more, you know, because now without Davis, it's looking really bleak for the rest of the season at least. Right, yeah. And I think we've seen success with agents turning into executives on the NBA personnel side. Obviously, Bob Myers is the Sterling example of this. And maybe if, like, the Lakers had just drafted a little bit better, maybe if they didn't get Lonzo and maybe they had, I don't know, who would have come after him, maybe Adonovan Mitchell or someone else. Yeah, Deer and Fox.

DeAren Fox would have been great. Then all of a sudden things are flipping completely differently. But you're right. I think it does feel like they're doing things a certain way and the league just like isn't really like willing to help them out there. And the tampering investigations are a big part of it. And basically the spurs and now Del Demp's being like, we're not helping you is a really clear example of that. And also like I just want to point this out. Did anyone see Rob Polinka's latest metaphor? Yes. Which one? Well, he had this one most recently, which was about a trolley car. And I guess the gist was he was with his fiancé in San Francisco and they were holding hands and a bunch of people were coming on the trolley. And the takeaway ultimately, and this is like a 500-word story that when written out, and I guess he had this at a recent press conference, but it's basically that they faced the challenge of do we split apart because all of these people are coming at us? how many people are on this fucking troll? The craziest part is I don't even think he was saying like this is a story about me I think he was saying this is just a man like this is just a man I'm pretty sure that's what it was

So did he say a man in his fiancee specifically? He didn't like make her as wife Is this like a commitment thing? Is this deeper than just? I mean, I think it's like in the face of adversity you just have to stick together There are so many easier ways to say that Yeah, I mean that's Than making up a trolley story.

with a bunch of the most evil people San Francisco has. Apparently it was a pastor telling a story out of church. So it was like second-hand anecdote here. There's a lot of a metaphor. Yeah. So Rob has a history of doing this,

which at the ringer.com we love and enjoy and we want him to do more of it. I just want to do a brief recap of what he's done so far. And this is via Silver Screen and Roll, which is a good SB Nation. Lakers blog. He has compared young players

learning how to be good around LeBron to a cat learning to run. from a lion. Is that the opposite? Like, what you're supposed to? I don't know. They often interact in nature, so that sounds true. C.C.B.

As bred from heaven. Where all bread comes from. Where all bread come from. He actually read from the alchemist, which was a book, because I think it was a certain thing where, like, Kobe had give it to him. Sure.

And he saw LeBron reading it as well. So the alchemist is actually just a small side, a really big NBA thing. When I was doing the barber story, a story on NBA Barbers, One of the barbers from Atlanta, Marcus Harvey, told me that he gives it to guys who are struggling, young guys in the league.

The barber? Yes. And LeBron reads all the time. LeBron gives it to people. It's like if NBA had a book club, this would be the book every month. My barber never gave me a book. What kind of barber are you going?

Clearly not the best one. The only discussions I have of my barber who changes all the time because I just go to like one of these chains. They're not loyal. Yeah. Well, I tried to be loyal, but then he went to a different place. My guy Giovanni. That's a good name for a barbara though.

It's a humble brag. Also, just to wrap this up, Lonzo Ball as Bill Gates and Steve Jobs, Kobe as the patron. Both of them? Combine. He's an innovator. They should do a commercial where Kuzma walks in.

He's like, hello, I'm a Mac. And then Lonzo is like, hey, and I'm a PC. Wouldn't that be more like Lonzo and DeAngelo Russell? I feel like I can be more of that. I do feel like group chat ultimately becomes Haley

workshoping her tweets that we're going to see later that's a good tweet. Like three for five so far? Pretty good, yeah. Good shooting percentage. Kobe as the Beethoven Shakespeare of friendship, which is insane. Kobe also as sugar in coffee

and the young Lakers as Taylor Swift. But which Taylor Swift? There's so many different iterations of this woman. I think there also have been so many different iterations of the Lakers young players. I think that's what he was getting at. I think he was like, when Taylor Swift was just doing country, she didn't expand her horizons.

I think that's what it was. So now the Lakers currently are Taylor Swift, who's dating John Mayer. It was a dark time. Really? Whereas before... Oh, they used to date. Or they are dating. No, they are the Taylor Swift who was dating.

Gotcha. And now they're the Taylor Swift. Is John Mayer's a Bronner in this analogy? Is that what the... Who's Jake Gyllenhaal? That's all I care about. No, it's not... It's a mood.

Okay, all right. Taylor's been in her self-confidence. She was dating. John Mayor are the current Lakers. Before LeBron came, she was dating Chick-Chillenhall. So I know everyone knows what that means, so just... Okay. Well, I guess the takeaway here is do we think Rob owns crystals?

And if so, how many? I think he owns edibles. I don't know where he gets them. All right. Suspect number three. LeBron James, obviously, you know, we've seen him on the court, what, for five games now after that growing injury, which was the longest absence he's had of his career. It doesn't look right totally.

The stats are still there. He's basically averaging a triple double over his past four games. But the three-point attempts are up. The free throws are down, which I think is a pretty telltile sign with him that he kind of settles for certain things. I also wonder how much frustration is playing a part of this. Do we think LeBron is probably not giving as much as he could right now?

Well, 100%, but I think it's strategic. I don't think it's necessarily out of frustration. Yeah, it's all. like it is with him very calculated. Right. Nothing is not calculated with LeBron. He's not just doing this because he's frustrated. He's not resorting to completely passing. Yeah.

But it is very noticeable, especially during that Hawks game, where he had, he was on his way, and I think he almost beat his in-game assist total. And like, I feel like that says something about the way he was playing where he was kind of like,

all right, like, you would call this trying to get other guys involved, but it could also be sending a message to be like, show me something, you know? And I think he always, also is feeling that thing I mentioned earlier where you've gone past the trade in the line. You've added some pieces, but what is it look like the rest of the way?

Is it going to be worth it going 100% the rest of the way when you might end up with the 8th seat in facing the Warriors? Right. Yeah, I just wonder how much he's the blame for just like the whole AD pursuit. I mean, it seems like this thing was calculated from the start of the season, AD getting the same agent as him. And it seems like that was the plan. And to a certain extent, you got to wonder if he's, driving the Lakers putting their aids in that one basket. Yeah, but I don't think that you can put that blame on him.

It's like the kid running wild through Target. Their parent at the end of the day is supposed to be the one not letting them do that. And that is very much a front office just because he is this powerful person and he could have gone wherever he wanted to. It doesn't mean that you should let him have control. If he comes in and he says, we've got this plan. He's going to force a trade. This will probably happen. Or I can get Paul George or I can get choir.

Whatever he's saying, I don't know that any of that is true. at the end of the day, if you're in the front office, you have to say, okay, but what if this doesn't work? What are the pros and cons? What if this all falls apart? And so it's not necessarily his fault. I don't think it's his fault. I don't think you can put him to blame when there are there is literally an entire branch of positions that are supposed to build teams. Well, I wonder if what you're saying is, does this go all the way to the top? Does this go to Hoyt? Right? If for following the true detective. Oh, okay.

Have you not been watching? Nah. It's a really good season. I just have not in the time. Just too much, too much tape. Too much crushing tape from following these hawks games. I love the hawks. Well, I bring this up just because I do wonder if suspect number four on our list,

one genie bus has to shoulder some blame here. Just because if we're saying the front office isn't kind of, isn't qualified to be making some of these moves. And she hired them. She hired him and she kicked out her brother because her brother was doing a terrible job and like nobody's going to argue with that. She definitely should have kicked out her brother. Yeah, we're doing awful. They'd pretty much just put all their money into the team of Faye Mosgoff and Luong Dang basket, which probably...

What a time. Which they're still feeling the effects from that. When we talk about like chain reactions, they had to stretch dang and they had to trade DeAngelo Russell in order to get off Team of Faye Moscoff's contract. I just wonder, man, I'd never been a big fan of what the Lakers are doing. I thought when Jerry Buss died and left the team over to his kids, I thought they were in a really perilous position because they were bred in this environment. But after like the Patriarch Falls, I do wonder it's like the classic case of the kids trying to take over. And like they haven't like gone through the struggles and they don't have the business savvy.

And they don't have like the mine. This is succession. We're just going to be a big HBO. No, but I mean just from the rumor mill. I mean, Stephen A had this. I don't even know if it's a rapport. I can't even really categorize what. I can't differentiate

what he's heard, what he's heard in his mind. It's a declaration. Think of that. Yes, but he pushed allegedly, allegedly, allegedly magic to draft Lonzo Ball. I mean...

Who did? Jeannie. Oh, well, yeah. I mean, yeah, owners often have a heavy hand in that. I think it's interesting to figure out, to kind of parse out. No, it's not unusual, but... In the context of the fact that, like,

I think the report was that magic wanted or liked Deer and Fox. a little more. And they wanted Lanzo more to like sell to the fans because Lanz was obviously a guy who was more of a celebrity coming out of. I mean, and that's what I was going to say. It's interesting to parse out what everybody's motivations are in this scenario. Obviously everybody will publicly say we want to win. We're the Lakers. We want to get back to those good days. But you know, within that there are probably factions of interest like business standpoint of things, the fan base standpoint of things. And just the ego standpoint of this with where, you know, who doesn't want to be. I mean, it would be almost too perfect of the story to have Magic Johnson come and save the Lakers and then return them back to glory. You know, there's just like a lot of these factors that I'm not sure are jiving with each other right now. Yeah, just look at the makeup of their entire organization. Your team president is Magic Johnson, perhaps one of the best players in NBA history, obviously a Laker for Life, all that other stuff.

Your GM is Kobe's agent. Right. And your coach is a former Laker great. well, McLuhan. What do we call him? A former leaker good role player.

Medium. Right. And I do think that's interesting. Mark Stein had this report earlier in January that Jeannie is backing Luke in this whole push and pull between is he a good coach?

Is he the right coach? And you also wonder about the timing here because Luke was here long before LeBron and did he predate Magic too? I think he might have. I think he might have as well. So we have a lot of like competing factions and they all go

straight to the top at Jeannie is the one who's kind of making a lot of the decisions. Well, I also think if you look at it, the entire organization, like you were just saying, there are two people in that organization who have a lot of experience. LeBron and Jeannie. Everyone else is like a first time hire. Luke Walton, new coach. Magic Johnson, Rob Polinka. First time running a front office.

All these young Lakers who have not been in the playoffs before. They are the only two with experience in that entire organization. I'm going to make a very local comparison here, but USC football is very much similar because their leadership from the top down has been very poor, you know, through all these years where they've had a bunch of coaches or whatever. And for this latest there, after Pete Carroll left, it's just been hiring anybody who's even semi-related with the glory days of USC or just semi-related with the program. And it's all been about like the program itself, but they haven't been like self-relipped

aware enough to look outside and look outside for other hires, but also like look inside and see like where's the problem? And it's like the leadership from the top down. It's not good. And I think there's some similarity maybe there. Obviously like Vini is, you know, she's going to own this team because you know, her father owned it and all that. And I don't know if it's everything on her, but it is interesting to see like you said, how many of these tentacles, if you will, are all related in a way, but also probably not on the same page. I think that that's the same story as the Minnesota Timberwolves front office. and organization overall has had the last,

I don't even know how, I guess since Glenn took it over, there was a good story. I'll tweet it out after this when we tweet this out, but there was a really good story I read when they hired Saunders that was like Minnesota just loves Minnesota's own and they love the narrative and they love the good feeling of it all. And the thing is, like, for so long,

that's what kept them in the shitter. You know, they had these coaches and, people who used to play for them and they were just recycling through the organization. And really, when they let go of Sam Mitchell and decided to hire someone who they thought was a powerful coach and who come in and shake stuff up, that was the first time that you had some indication in a very long time that they weren't just going to be, and this is what the article said, like quote unquote Minnesota nice and just keep going with the generations that hadn't improved anything successful.

Well, think about it this way too. You have that what we're talking about, this organization, I don't know if I want to call it this function, but it's new and old at the same time. And then you're adding the organism that is the LeBron camp to this. And I think that's where it gets maybe even too crazy to even comprehend. Right, because he's in a place where he doesn't have time for growth. Yeah.

This organization is one that's clearly set up for growth. Like we just said, everyone is new in their positions. Yeah. But you're inserting him, and this is the guy who needs to win right now. And so the idea was that you're going to insert him and then you're going to put pieces around him that can also help him win right now. Yeah. Because although he signed this long contract, he's not, he can't wait. And it already kind of seems from the way he's playing, he knows that this is a throwaway year,

which we all kind of knew going in that he signed a long-term deal. So it doesn't really matter. The Lakers don't have to prove something to him. He's kind of in it with them. At the same time, I cannot believe that we were having a throwaway LeBron year when we watched him do what he had to do the first half of the season. Well, that brings us to our last suspect here. Suspect number five, Luke Walton, how much is he to blame just for not organizing these guys well enough? It's tough because he's in a weird spot where, like we've already mentioned, he wasn't given the best pieces to work with.

I mean, he was given LeBron James. So there's that. But around LeBron, they weren't the best pieces to work with. But at the same time, he's made some very questionable, like, lineup decisions and just rotation decisions. And it seems like he's trying to figure out the identity of the team as much as the players are as they're going along. Like kind of like Haley said This is a situation where growth is needed Where you need patience

And now with LeBron that eliminates that But a lot of these guys are still young Yeah exactly And they're figuring this stuff out And they've been hurt too We have to pile in Luke to that When you say that He is still young

He's still figuring this out too But he was put in this position To coach a guy who's been in the finals The past how many years And expects to go back there Same draft comes as him Same draft Class of him. Luke is the Mario Chalmers of this team.

Listen, if we're sticking with the true detective theme, like time is, yeah, well, we definitely are. We're way too deep in it now. Time is a flat circle. And it seems like every time LeBron gets to a new team, there's a young coach waiting for him that may or may not be ruddy. And the difference between Eric Spolstra and David Blatt is that Eric Spolstra was a heat lifer. And he had the-backed. He was backed by the ownership, 100% and by Pat Riley in particular. And he stayed and he thrived.

Yeah. I don't know what to make a Luke, but it seems like everybody from the top down is saying that Luke's our guy. Rob Polinka came out and was like he's the leader. And Jeannie Bus, who I think is like, as we just discussed, maybe the only opinion that matters, she said that the expectation based on the Stein report is that she would back him. You know, I will say the one difference between Jeannie and the other situations that we've talked about, USC, although I'm not as familiar at that. And Minnesota is that Jeannie Bus is very much the kind of person who will change.

change everything. I don't think she has that, she fucking fired her brother. I don't think she has a fear of this isn't working. And I have LeBron James for the next however many years. And so when I pinpoint what's not working and decide that it can't change, I'm going to let go of it. And I think that that probably will end up being Luke Walton first. Yeah, I mean, it seems like it's almost inevitable that in the offseason, like I can already picture it like, Lakers squeaking to the playoffs, hit by the Warriors. Then it's like, all right, we need a reset, we need free agency, and then we need to change going into the next. next year, and the change will be the gullen is the collateral damage.

Yeah, if they don't make it, I would imagine they make a change. And I think it's interesting that the guy that's being brought up as the potential replacement based on a Rick Buecker report, I believe it was, as Jason Kidd. And just like it follows a pattern where David Black goes down. He wasn't like LeBron's guy, and they get Ty Lou in there, a guy who's already an assistant coach, but a guy that LeBron clearly liked. And Jason Kidd, they were on Team USA together. And I do wonder if it ultimately just falls and defaults to that.

And, like, listen, if you're not going to get Anthony Davis, if you're going to have to fall back on a B-level free agent this summer, like, might as well keep LeBron happy, get his guy in there. Because I don't know. I haven't seen enough from Luke that, like, shows me that. But just to wrap it up here, is there any suspect on the board that we're not considering that we should? We totally should have brought up Rich Paul because, I mean, he plays in with, you know, if LeBron did present this giant plan. Right. If LeBron did present this giant plan at the beginning of the season, Rich Paul also plays into that by saying, yeah,

and I talk to Anthony Davis all time because I'm his agent. So I know that he's in on this. I know that we could make this happen. He very much has to be a part of this equation for the Lakers to be in this situation. I mean, I remember when it happened, when the Monday morning anything happened

and, you know, Rich Paul told what was like Davis is, you know, asking for a trade. I thought it was kind of genius in a way because it was putting pressure on the Lakers to make the move now and make it work and make it happen. But now that it's backbar comes back on him and it's like, okay, so now what do you do? You know, now it was a risk taken and the backup plan.

I don't even know what that is. And I'm sure they probably do. But until we see it come to fruition, it's going to be a weird sense around that partnership. It was really ballsy and I respect it and I'm not even against it. But when you're forcing someone's hand like that, and it's with two powerful players like LeBron and Anthony Davis, and if it is Anthony Davis to New Orleans, that is everything, you have to make sure that there's no alternative that this isn't going to work out.

Or Mo Wagner is pulling the strings behind. And he's the one to blame. Sure. Guys, case closed. We did it. There you go. All right. That's it for the ringer NBA show.

We will talk to you next week, I believe, which would be the restart of the NBA calendar. For Paulo, for Haley, for Justin, that's me, and then Bobby. Happy Valentine's Day. Basketball is very good. Basketball is very good.