The Ringer NBA Show - Adam Silver’s Latest on Morey and China. Plus: The Five Things That Have Stood Out Most in the Preseason Thus Far. | The Mismatch

Episode Date: October 8, 2019

We discuss Adam Silver’s press conference from Tuesday morning following up on the NBA’s statement regarding Daryl Morey’s Hong Kong tweet (1:10). Then, we share our top five biggest takeaways of the early preseason, including Anthony Davis’s dominance and the new look Pelicans (31:51). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today's episode of The Mismatch on the Ringer podcast network is brought to you by State Farm. The moment we've all been waiting for is about to arrive the official start to the NBA season. This offseason was filled with a lot of big changes and fresh starts. The fresh starts in your life, talk to a state farm agent, so when it comes to insurance, you don't have to go at it alone. A bunch of guys we're going to be talking about in this episode are going to have fresh starts. You've got the new look Lakers and Anthony Davis. You've got Lonzo Ball in New Orleans, shooting all the threes that he shot the other night.

You've got the Knicks with a bunch of new players. Talk to a State Farm agent today about combining your home and auto insurance and get a teammate who can help you prepare for the big changes in your life, State Farm. Welcome to the Ringer NBA show. I'm Chris Vernon, and joining me as he does every week from the ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'O.comber, aka Kevin O'Connor, Kevin O'Conflict, Kevin O'Conment, Kevin O. Canceled, A.k.a. Kevin O'Connor, A.K.A. Kevin O'C.C.C.1. Berto, what's going on this morning? How are you doing? Well, first things first, we do want to thank all of our listeners over the years for listening to the mismatch. And we are very excited to announce this morning that for this upcoming NBA season, starting this week, we are going to be moving to two days a week for the mismatch on the Ringer podcast.

network. And so you will be able to hear the mismatch not only on Tuesdays, but also on Fridays. So thank you to all of you that listen and we're super excited about expanding the show. Love working with each other. And I guess that's good news. That's good news for it. It's great news, Chris. I'm excited about it. I guess the plan is we'll be recording sometime Thursday night, even before the Thursday night games in some cases, but oftentimes after the Thursday night games because boy there's so many dang great Thursday night games this year so hopefully I will have a lot of those in your feeds for Friday morning we're excited about it thank you everybody yeah and a big thank you to all of you that have listened over the years and we're super

excited about expanding and doing two to two shows a week all right Kevin there has been a lot going on in the last week and not necessarily what we would have expected because the biggest story that has happened in the NBA has taken place off the course with Daryl Mori. I did it. I did it for you. Darry sending out a tweet that has caused

a geopolitical conflict, no less. And you have Adam Silver now releasing another statement this morning, as we were recording on Tuesday morning, about supporting freedom of speech amongst its constituents in the NBA, whether it be players,

general managers and whatnot, and you have Chinese a great opposition to this. Now, I am, as you are, not well-versed in geopolitical politics. But here's what we do cover on a regular basis is basketball. And this has real basketball ramifications dependent upon how this plays out. look, this is about money when it comes to China flexing its muscles with its NBA contracts. And the players get 51% of money that is brought in to the league. And you have salary caps and you have a luxury tax based upon said projections. And so one of the things that I have not heard discussed all that much is the potential

economic impact and how that will affect basketball teams because it could have a tremendous impact. And while Adam Silver, you know, kind of, I mean, I guess the best way for me to say is for him to say, hey, we'll do, we'll do us in the way we believe and you do you. And sometimes those things are going to intersect and people are going to get upset. But we have these business deals and we hope we can continue to have these business deals while still feeling strong in our own ideals. But does it blow over? Does it really cause everything to change dramatically? I mean, that's a $1.5 million or billion dollar, I'm sorry, 1.5 billion dollar contract that

10 cent in China has with the NBA. What do you think? First of all, I think for me, Daryl Morey tweeting what he did. was sort of a wake-up call in the sense that, especially over the past seven months, my life's been so busy and everything. But even more so the past couple of years, I've really just ignored especially global politics. And like you said at the top, like, it's not like you or I today are experts in this or

anything like that either. But I was a bit surprised over the weekend with the amount of people who are like really, really angered by the initial statement Adam Silver and the NBA made because, you know, yes, it is about the money. That is obviously part of it here where Adam Silver S. Commissioner, his duty is to grow the game and make it as profitable as possible. However, it can be about the money and also about the people too. And I think that's sort of been something that's been a little bit overlooked here

where it's not only about like the money coming into the league and how that could affect business on the salary cap and what teams can spend, but it also affects people in the sense that if the NBA were to say, flat out, say, F you to China or leaving, that affects so many people around the world who are employed by the NBA, people in China, people in Hong Kong, people who have jobs, whether you're a janitor, whether you're working in public relations, whether you're working in strategy. And the way that money trickles down is it could end up, a lot of people could be losing their jobs here if the NBA were to leave China or if China flat out bans the NBA,

like they did with Winnie the Pooh, like they do censoring movies in Hollywood. If that happens, that a lot of people are going to be affected by this. Not only that, but I don't think the NBA taking that initial stance that they did necessarily means that they're bowing down to China. I think you could say that.

I understand that viewpoint, but also the people in China, 1.4 billion people, not every single one of those people, agree with everything that their regime is doing right now. They don't necessarily agree with every single word, just like we in America don't either. So I think for the NBA, it's not just bowing to China.

It's also sticking with the people there who love the game, who view the game as an outlet, just like you and I do and so many other people do as well. Because the people who do disagree in China, and this is really one of the things that I feel like has sort of been overlooked here, is that they are not allowed. to speak up. They are censored. And if they do speak up against the government, oftentimes they can get

thrown into jail. And it's a different world there where the fans, like we're seeing bots in people's mentions. We're seeing a lot of negativity because that's what's being sent out through Twitter, which, by the way, Twitter doesn't isn't allowed in China. So the point is, is that I think there's a lot of people who are going to be affected if this continues to go south. But not only that, you're not just bowing to the government in China. You're you're sticking, with the people who do love and truly care about the game. Well, here's what I would tell you. Never be surprised with people getting angry about something.

Yeah, I know. There are people. I shouldn't be surprised. There are people that wake up in the morning and are looking for something to be angry about. And while I have rarely, if ever, seen anybody have strong opinions about business relationships with China, all of the sudden there is this incredible outrage. that goes along with people having business relationship with China. And I even read these think pieces and it's like, oh, well, you know, are you going to have a backbone? Are you going to, you know, stand on the moral high ground?

Are you going to, you know, stand alongside with Darryor Mourer or are you going to count out to money? And it's like, are you like, and here's the thing. And then the think piece is over. And never within the context of said think piece. is there a suggestion of what you should do? You know what I mean? Except for, oh, it's all about money and it's all about money and it's all about money. It's never like, and here's what the NBA should do despite this ridiculous economic impact that it could have.

I suppose that that's, I mean, look, that's the world we live in now. And people that had never thought of it in their lives or never cared dramatically about. it, all of the sudden cared deeply about this and started to write about it, though they never thought about writing about it in the first place. And I understand that it was brought upon by something taken place. But it was a wake up call. It won't really. But I mean, something like this needed to happen for you to understand that the iPhone you're tweeting from, guess where it was made? I mean, for goodness sakes, I'm just like, you know, if we're going to if we're going to get into the business of being upset about businesses that do business with

other nations that, you know, do things that we don't agree with, then you've got, you got, you got a long time to go, you know, you got, you got a lot of words that you've got to spout out that you're mad about. Someone with the Washington Post, I believe Sally Jenkins wrote an article about, like, don't be mad at the NBA. And she listed a long list of companies from, KFC to Walmart and never mind Hollywood that is that is effectively, you know, worked with China or sold out to their demands in order to sell product there.

It's not just the NBA, but the NBA's got to be a little careful about patting itself on the back for being so progressive all the time. Oh, yeah. That's where this, that's where this gets the hit, right? When you want to fancy yourself, then the expectation is that, you know, oh, well, you yourself on the back for being sobered forward thinking and being standing up to things and yet now you're unwilling to stand up to this because there's so much money involved and it's like all right well maybe the next time around don't pat yourself on the back so much and do the victory laps about

you know about being so progressive that's all i'd say no doubt but i do with that said i i think the the the initial backlash to what adam silver said in his initial initial statement mentioning that there's regret that people were offended over Daryl's comments. I think Adam Silver this morning with his press conference, or rather Tuesday night in China, in Japan, where he had the press conference Tuesday morning on the East Coast in the United States, his press conference, I thought, was pretty incredible. I thought he did a great job handling and answering questions and really going in greater depth of what he meant with that initial statement and with the longer follow-up statement they made this morning. And

quite frankly what adam said this morning i felt like was sort of what people wanted in the first place where he's saying no i do support the freedom of expression from everybody and and the NBA community and he outright said including members of the NBA who work in hong kong if they said the same thing against the chinese government he will support them as well yeah so for adam silver he straight up said the quote is uh if if that's the consequence and of adhering to our values, we still feel it's critically important we adhere to those values. And I really think that is the ultimate stance here that the NBA has taken and will take moving forward. And whether there are consequences with the NBA in China remains to be seen. And I hope

that's not the case for the reasons we just discussed up top. Because if there are consequences, that is a lot of money that the NBA is not going to get. And yes, it's about the money and all that, blah, blah, blah, but the money does trickle down to a lot of people, a lot of people who have opportunities to work in the NBA, to work internationally and the United States. And I hope, and I hope, I really hope that this works out for the best long term. So the game does continue to grow, not just for the money, but for the amount of people who are provided opportunities to work for this league. Well, and we are going to see, and like I said, this could have real basketball ramifications. It could. Regarding, you know, because that, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the. The. You know, that's how business is done basketball-wise. With the players getting 51% and that money being pooled together and those projections for the salary cap and the luxury tax. Here's the other thing that I have not heard anybody say. Darrell, who is very well liked amongst the media, might be the first guy to make a,

whether you want to call it a blunder or whatever and not just say I was hacked. you know what I mean? Like isn't that the line? Like if you, if you, if you, if you start right, like you just say your act. Yeah. I mean, I mean, he didn't play that card. Tillman Fertitta made that pretty hard on Darrell to do that. Because he responded within like 15 minutes of that tweet going up on Friday night.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know, man. I, I understand a lot of the criticism of the NBA. But I don't think it's, I don't look at it like the. like the NBA is doing business with a communist governments. I look at at the NBA is doing business with citizens of a communist country. And those people, you know,

did not choose to be there, but they do choose to be NBA fans. They choose to be NBA consumers. They, they, and I, I just look at that. Like,

I don't think those people, just like we, you know, in our own country here, don't deserve to be deserted. Does that make sense, Chris? That's sort of the way I look at it. Yes, it makes sense because like, right, you don't, if there are the leaders of a said country and there are the people of a said country.

And many times there are many times that the leader's views and the people's views are in line. And there are other times that they are not. But here's what we know. There are a lot of people that love the NBA a great deal in China. a lot of fans of the NBA in China. And this affects them at a level of which they have no say in the matter. And so underline that statement, literally no say. Yes.

Literally no say. And so here's hoping that the NBA can hold true to its values. The Chinese government believes and the companies believe that they can hold on to their values. And within that, you could come to some agreement that, hey, you do you, we'll do us. And you have what you believe in. We have what we believe in. And hopefully we can still have a business relationship while that takes place. Did you see the person, I think there was a person in China who was arrested over the weekend for showing their support of the Houston Rockets.

and that's in line with a law that was enacted in China earlier this decade where on their app, what is essentially their Twitter, Wibo, I believe it's called, if you post something on that app that upsets social order or spreads, you know, some type of rumor against the government, you can be thrown into jail. You can be arrested for that. And ultimately, like with this current situation, there's already been that one arrest that we know of. And ultimately, a lot of people are going to stay silent.

I mean, if the United States someday, and hopefully this never were to happen, or to enact a law like that, sure, is how like you and I would be having a different conversation right now. We would not be spoken openly if we did not have freedom of the speech. And I wish a lot of people criticizing here, you know, sort of put themselves on the shoot on the other side here where it's not 1.4 billion people who are against. the United States, against the NBA, against the Houston Rockets, against Daryl Morey. There's a lot of people who just can't speak who are fully in support of what he said and wish they had these type of privileges that we do have here in the United States.

And that's freedom of speech. Well said. A couple other NBA news that we do need to get to. And we are going to give things that have stood out to us in the preseason so far. But Kyle Lowry got an extension and a big one, $31 million extension. when you saw the headline that Lowry got the extension from the Toronto Raptors. What do you think? I was very happy for Lowry first small because, boy, like, you're cashing in with $31 million.

Hell yeah, man. That's great. But also for Toronto, smart. And the reason why is because you are not going to be a team, nor do you want to be a team that's spending in the summer of 2020. However, you do want to continue to maintain your flexibility for the. 2020 on off season. So with retaining Lowry, you're able to stay competitive for two more years. There's the emotional aspect where Lowry has been with this team for a long, long time now. It gives them more flexibility moving forward, I think, where having Lowry entering that pivotal

summer in 2021 makes a lot more sense for that franchise. And now the question will be, are they going to be retaining anybody else? Will they at some point next summer try to retain Gasol, will they try to re-sign Siakum now, who, by the way, looked really, really good in his preseason debut this morning against the Rockets. He did look good. I saw that you were up early for that one.

I woke up. I set my alarm for 6 a.m. I had a feeling based off past years that Adam Silver would talk this morning, which he did. He talked earlier than the game, as expected, but I wanted to catch up early and I wanted to be able to watch Westbrook and

Harden. But yes, I did set my alarm for 6 a.m. Chris. All right. Next thing. Pistons owner Tom Gores said keeping Andre Drummond in the fold is a top priority and that Detroit needs to take another step forward after making the playoffs

a season ago. He was at the facility on Monday at their new training center and corporate headquarters in Midtown Detroit and he said that he was asked afterward about a possible contract extension for Drummond, the team standout center. He spoke highly of Drummond, but did not elaborate on any possible negotiations, of course. He has a $28.8 million player option for next year and has

all but said he will opt out and become a free agent. And as we know, as I just said, Tom Gore says it is a priority to make sure that Andre Drummond remains a piston after this season. would you, if you were running the Pistons, make Andre Drummond top priority? I mean, he's a top priority by default based off their salary situation. But I like Andre Drummond. I like Andre Drummond. I don't love Andre Drummond. And I think there's a price where I'd be willing to walk away just based off the fact that

he is a good player, not a great player. Well, it's interesting. He'll have the opportunity to walk away, you know, because it's a light, it's a light free agent market. And so if you're opting out a damn near 30 million, you know you don't have one suitor, you know. Well, unless your priority is getting a longer term contract where you want to cash in long term. I mean, I just think for Detroit, this coming off season, let's say Andre Drummond walks, it's a weak free agent class, but then you do have over $30 million. in cap space to build around Blake Griffin, your young

players, Dumboya, Kinnard, whoever else, Bruce Brown for that matter, if you want to throw him into that. You have cap space if you want to allocate that money towards other players. I don't think it has to be drummond. That's just sort of where I land here. He's a top

priority by default, but there's a number where I would walk away. Well, and the crazy thing is it feels like the guy's been around forever. He's only 26. I know. You know? and he just turned 26. And he's steady, he's been very durable as well.

And that's another factor to, to throw into the equation here. That's so often overlooked with players that ultimately availability is the best ability. Yeah. And he's 26 years old. So, I mean, even if you sign him to a long-term contract,

you're talking about what? 31, 32? I mean, you're getting the prime years. Whoever signs him up. Theoretically, you should be getting, you know. theoretically probably probably his best years from 26 to 31 you know did you see him take that three point earlier than night i did not uh he banked it off the the top right side of the backboard

a pull up uh pull up catch to shoot three in transition you didn't think that you didn't think that it was pretty it was it was pretty if you enjoy uh shot spanking off the glass he pulled up for a three in transition? It was a catch and shoot three. I should have said that. It was a transition opportunity. He was a trailer and he shot, he and he shot the ball and they just banked off the glass.

Very ugly. Very ugly. All right. Well, hey, look, do what you're good at. And obviously, that's not in his repertoire. And he, at least he learned in the preseason that that probably isn't the shot that he needs to be taking.

Well, we'll see. Don't. You want to turn a. everybody into a frigate three-point shooter. Let some guys suck at shooting threes, please. I'm saying he's, I'm saying he shot like 43s last year. It's not like he's not going to take them. 40?

I mean, that's not a lot, Kiff. Oh, I know, but I'm just saying, like, he wants to shoot threes. That's all. It is my opinion that he should not want to. I want him within, I would agree with that. Within eight feet of the basket is just fine by me, Andre. I agree with that. I can't believe it.

We agree. All right. I've got to ask you about this. Jonathan Chorix from The Ringer is in town in Memphis, Tennessee. And part of it is, I believe, speaking to Taylor Jenkins, who is the new Grizzlies coach, who actually went to Charks High School, no less. Wild. Was that high school at the same time as Jonathan? But the other thing that is going on is there is a massive contingent of the NBA and front offices in town.

In fact, I believe every franchise has at least a representative because by virtue of preseason scheduling the New Zealand breakers, which feature RJ Hampton on their team, which was a huge recruit who was. debating going to Kansas, Texas, Texas Tech, Memphis, and other schools had made his decision that he was going to go play professionally for a year. He is playing against the Grizzlies tonight. He is playing, I believe, this whole caravan of the NBA will be in Memphis tonight, and then they will be in Oklahoma City for another game that they have scheduled. It is an opportunity for people to see what is projected to be a very high draft pick. in next year's NBA draft without traveling overseas. And so with him having these games against NBA competition,

though it is just preseason, the NBA contingent has taken advantage of that. Early thoughts we spoke on La Mello Ball and his projection. And in passing talked about R.J. Hampton, who is also up there, top five, top 10 in most projections. early thoughts on Hampton, who I'm excited to get to see in person tonight. A 6-6-5-66 silky smooth ball handling wing who can pull up from anywhere. I like him. I like him a lot.

I mean, he's thin, I think, getting to the rim and scoring in the interior. That'll be interesting to watch against men in the NBA in tonight's game. But overall, I guess a prospect, if you're the NCAA, you've got to be really. really pissed off that R.J. Hampton and LaMella Ball, who could be two of the top five guys in the draft this year, two of the top five are not going to be playing college basketball of the season. It'll be very fascinating to see, you know, because, I mean, look, inevitably, he'll probably be on the ball against John Morant and, you know, be driving against Jaron Jackson Jr., right? Like, I mean, you're seeing him against other really good young NBA talent,

or maybe he's trying to come around the screen and Brandon Clark, you know, is picking him up off the role. I mean, this is, it's a big moment because it is going to be one of the few glimpses that you are going to see him playing against NBA competition. I mean, it's big for him because, yes, the sample size will be small, but it is going to be, it's going to be magnified a great deal. how he plays in these games is going to matter a great deal towards his NBA projection. Maybe it shouldn't, but inevitably it's going to be in talent evaluators' minds because they're all there to see him. And they are going to be watching his every move tonight just as they would if it was a big, you know, Duke Carolina game or something. and while the intensity is not nearly as great in the preseason, it's just to see what he looks like on a court against NBA players

and in fact, you know, good young NBA talent. I'm excited to see him. He was, I mean, look, these colleges really wanted this guy. He was a huge recruit. And so it was a big surprise when he decided not to go to college, but he's supposed to be awesome. It's great for him, too, to get it up. Everybody you listed on Memphis, to get those reps against an NBA team, high-level talent,

for scouts, the value in seeing that is pivotal. I mean, you ultimately want, you value the possessions a player has against other pro-level talent, whether that's a potential NBA player or a potential overseas player. That's what matters most when you're evaluating talent. And so this is as good as it gets for evaluating RJ Hampton. Yeah. And so that's why there are so many people. that are going to be watching the game tonight just to see what this kid looks like.

And they have another scheduled one too. So there's two chances, right? As I said, the caravan will head on to Oklahoma City. But your initial reaction is you really like the guy. Yeah, I like him a lot. He can score. It's going to be interesting because it's the first time in a long time that we're really going to have to pay attention to. Luca was, I don't remember keeping up with like Porzingis.

And with Hazzonia during the year, like that was still at a time where, you know, you weren't really going out and seeking out those games, you know, to evaluate, you would basically see on YouTube. But people are going to be trying to seek these games out this year to watch Lamello and to watch R.J. Hampton. To your point about them not playing college basketball, you know, it's different than, hey, Trey Young and Oklahoma's playing, you know, Texas tonight. flip on ESPN 2 and watch it. In order to decide who we think should go high in the draft, unless we're going to do it on YouTube clips, we're going to have to seek out these games to find them to see two of the best prospects of the NBA play,

which is not common. I can't remember. Luca was the one. I mean, people did go out of their way to watch Lucas games, for sure. This is an international heavy draft, so there will have to be a lot of, A lot of times you're just watching through YouTube. We are going to take a quick break.

When we come back, we are going to discuss five things each that have stood out to us in the preseason so far. We'll do that after these words. The Google Assistant is ready to help you get more done with just your voice. In the car, at home, and everywhere you take your phone. When I need to remember something like where I parked at a game, I just say, hey Google, remember I parked in lot A. Then after the game, I say, hey, Google, where did I park? The little help, hands free. Just say, hey Google, to get started.

Today's show also brought to you by Roman. With two-thirds of guys experiencing noticeable hair loss by age 35, most guys assume losing their hair is inevitable as they age. Some don't care, some shave their heads, some embrace hats. But what they don't know is there are FDA-approved medications designed to stop hair loss and even regrow hair. That's why we're excited to partner with our sponsor, Roman. Roman makes it easy to get safe FDA-approved hair loss treatment all from your phone or computer.

When you go to getRoman.com slash ringer NBA, your online visit is free. Consult with U.S. licensed physicians through their secured online platform. No awkward conversations with receptionists or reading bad magazines in a waiting room. Once your doctor ensures that treatment will be safe and effective for you, Roman's dedicated pharmacy can ship your medication to you with free two-day shipping in discrete packaging. If you're noticing unwanted hair loss, starting treatment early is key and Roman can help. And today, Roman is giving the Ringer MBA show listeners a free online visit at getromen.com slash ringer NBA. That's get Roman.com slash Ringer NBA for a free visit to get started.

Go to get roman.com slash ringer NBA. All right, Kevin, we don't have a massive amount of preseason games that have taken place so far, but there have been enough for things to stand out. And so I asked you to peruse the box scores, as have I. And though we are incapable of seeing every one of these games, what we can see is the box scores at all of those. And so what we did was an exercise. incapable and unwilling.

Yeah. An exercise in what we have noticed coming out of a box score. And we will decide as the season goes on whether or not this means something or or it was totally insignificant. What happened in a preseason game. The first one is the Pelicans, who I did see last night. and the first thing that stood out was that they started a back court of Drew Holiday and Lanzo Ball. And I thought, I think when we discussed it last week, that it would probably be Reddick as their other starter, who I believe averaged 18 points a game last year for Philadelphia.

But it was Drew and it was Lanzo to go along with Ingram Zion and favors, as we expected. But the big thing that came out was there was. were 10 shots shot by Lonzo ball. Eight of them were threes. Now, he filled up the stat sheet, as he does, with rebounds, assist, and some points. But I was surprised to see that eight of the 10 shots that he took were threes. And the form has changed a little bit. Is this now, if Lonzo is going to be off the ball, something that is going to be of great expectation

where that is that it's not uncommon to see Lonzo ball become a high volume three-point shooter? Well, you and I picked one of the same ones. The number I chose for Lonzo was three because he hit three of those three-pointers, including a very, very nice-looking step-back jumper to his left. With Lonzo, his shooting release was always pure, the release itself at the top, but it was the gather and bringing the ball up from the left side of his body to the right, I think really was problematic for him. And look, like you said, Chris, it was only eight shots, eight shots.

It's not a large sample and he hit only three of them. But I think from a functional standpoint, the shot looks much, much improved. And I'm optimistic for Lonzo moving forward that the shot will become a plus for him. He's not going to move off ball necessarily, as you're suggesting, but he's going to still have to play off ball by the nature of this roster on New Orleans. Just because Holiday is going to have the ball too, you know? So Zion. So is Ingram. So is Ingram.

This is a democratic offense where a lot of guys are going to handle the ball. And Lonzo is going to have to do what he excels at, cutting off ball, throwing down lob dunks. But he's also going to have to hit spot up threes and be an effective floor space or two, maintain the spacing that is desired by the Pelicans. And game one is a good sign. I mean, I hope for him it continues moving forward. so he has a well-rounded game because everything else is already there with the rebounding, with the defense, with the passing, and with the activity off ball as a cutter.

If the shot can be there, he's going to be a great, great player for a long time. Okay. And the other thing is from watching that, this is just a side note, is another player that they have who is great with the ball in their hands is the rookie Nikiel Alexander Walker, who both of us liked in the draft. He was on my ringer list of players that couldn't fail and I thought would get drafted too low. I believe he was. He looked absolutely fantastic in the summer league. And last night looked fantastic.

I mean, they're going to have to find minutes for that kid. He is dynamite. Yeah, I like him a lot. Yeah. Oh, and all right. So since you had that on your list, I'll just throw in another one so that we both are even at one. I'd forgotten that the Lopez twins are together. Yes.

I did not have that one, but I was considering it. And they started together as the Twin Towers, and it is just preposterous that they are finally together. I had, you know, with all the flurry and all the big moves that had happened and had gone on in the NBA, I had totally forgotten that Brooke and Robin Lopez are together on the same team and, in fact, were on the court together starting for the Milwaukee Bucks in their preseason game. it made me so happy when they ran that pick and roll together. Oh my goodness. You kidding me?

Robin and Brooke. Oh, like forget Janus. Give me Lopez Lopez pick and rolls all game long. That's what I want. All right. Number two on my things that stood out for preseason box score so far, I am going to imagine that you probably have, I would if I were you,

because we did not speak on this, you have to have Mo Bamba on yours, right? No. I don't. You don't? Okay. But I do have one person on here that I was going to pivot into Mo Baba. Well, please, please.

Tell me about Baba. Please, Chris. No, Bombas been very, very good. The island, you are going to get some people that are flying in. So be ready for travelers there. But that is not what I wrote down because I figured you did. I wrote down this. Bomba playing well in the preseason if we think that he can continue that.

during the regular season. Jonathan Isaac was very, very good in their last game. You got Markell, who's shown well so far, and we were going to keep a lookout for. I'm looking at this roster, right? And what stood out to me when I'm going through the box score is if you get all these guys developing, if you get Bomba developing and Isaac developing and Fultz and obviously Aaron Gordon, who was very, very good in their game, you already got Vucci Main. And then you've got these veterans.

in Terrence Ross, in Evan Fornier, in Al-Farucamino, the thing that stands out to me is, you know, you can do the thing where you grow them as a team together. But if these guys develop, the thing that stood out to me is they got the goods to make a big trade when somebody becomes available. If these guys, you know, if Bomba's good and Gordon's good and Isaac's good, and Isaac's good and Fultz is good, even three of the four. And then you've got guys that are good, you know, veteran players that are good to throw in a deal to make it work.

Fornier or a Vucevic or a Minu or a Ross. They have, I think, a tremendous roster right now to stack stuff together and make a great trade that could really net them something special. that's what stands out to me. And they also have all of their future draft picks, all their first round picks, all their second round draft picks. They have everything. They've just got the good mix. Like, this is what you need, right? You need guys that are not on long-term contracts necessarily or that they've got a big number.

And then young guys, you know, that people really want. That's how you throw together that kind of a trade that nets you something special. Yeah, absolutely. And the other side of it is like the one of the players on my list was Aaron Gordon. And the number I had chosen was 25 because he scored 25 points in one of the preseason games. But I think with Gordon, he's so interesting because if you're Orlando, you could easily view him as a keeper. He's a young player, 24 years old, maybe could be entering a career best season after the training this summer to work on his post game, improve his footwork and further hone his jump shot. he's already a really great

and by the way, probably one of the more underrated defensive players in the league. Orlando has put him on everybody from Hardin to Kawhi to KD. He defends players of all shapes and sizes with all different types of skills. He's really good. And I think with Gordon, you can view him as a keeper for

all those reasons. However, also like if a star player becomes available, he could be one of those appealing players to another team that wants somebody with a longer term contract that's also younger where you can upgrade. Gordon has three years left on his deal, including this season, at 19.8 million, then it descends to 18.1 million and then 16.4 million. If he continues ascending

while his contract descends, he could end up being one of the biggest bargains in the league, where for Orlando, maybe you want to keep that guy, or he's a super valuable trade chip in another trade. So Orlando, they're in a low-key, very good position right now. out. Really good. After being in the dumpster for a while. No, I mean,

that's exactly what stood out. When I was looking through their box score is these, this is exactly how you want your assets to look. I got really good young players. I'm not going to be able to pay all of them, but I got a stable of young players. And then I've got these good veteran guys, not just dead money contracts.

I got good veteran guys that also are useful. and can be eight-man rotation guys on good teams, like the Rosses and Aminus and Fornius and Vucevich, for that matter. I mean, it's a good combo, man. You could really get great value from Orlando if you got to move a guy or you want to move a guy. And one of the cool parts is that I know Steve Clifford said last week, how he hopes to use Jonathan Isaac and Aaron Gordon

as a four or five front court when he has opportunities. I'm not sure how much, how many chances there will actually be for that because Vucevich getting around 30 minutes per game, because Bamba getting, you would hope, between 15 to 20 minutes per game. I'm not sure how much of how many opportunities there will be for that. However, it's nice with Orlando that they do have the flexibility to play those different types of lineups where you can play with longer skilled lineups with Isaac at the five, but you can also play Jumbo with Vooch in there.

So I think for Clifford, he has a really good luxury with the amount of lineup flexibility he has. All right. So we lined up. We both had something with the magic involved in our second thing that stood out from the box score. The third thing, and maybe we will line up again. The third thing I had. Let's see. Let's go three for three. All right. Anthony Davis had 17 and seven in the eight. But that is, hey, it's not what I had written down. What I had written down was the starting lineup that they used. Yeah, pretty similar, I guess. And is this. And is this? what we are going to see once the season begins, the point guard less, as it were, lineup where Rondo did not start the game, but rather LeBron James and Avery Bradley

started the game along with Danny Green, Anthony Davis, and Javall McGee. Do you think that on the first night of the season, that is the Lakers starting lineup? Why wouldn't it be? I don't understand. I really don't get all the talk about. about Lakers are experimenting with LeBron James at point guard. What do you mean? He's always been a point guard. That's always ever been. I don't,

he's always been a lead playmaker. And that's exactly what a point guard is. So this is nothing new. They just happen to be playing slightly bigger or maybe that they're smallest guy in the floor, Danny Green and Avery Bradley, aren't primary ball handlers. This is what basketball is these days.

Like, your small guy isn't always your point guard. just like your biggest guy is not always your center. It's a positionless game, and I wish we started talking about it and writing about it in that way because LeBron is just doing what he's always done, and that's leading the team. And that hasn't changed.

There's many times, though, that you have had, you know, as we know, over the course of his career, the Mario Chomers or the Deladovas or whoever you want to name, they're the ones that take the ball out of bounds under the basket and dribble it across the court. No, and then they give it to LeBron. I get not always, but I mean, there have been over the course of his career, we have seen him, there has still been a point guard on the court.

And there will be, though, just because that player's not starting, there's going to be minutes for Rondo's out there. There's going to be minutes where another ball handler is out there. And look, I don't think a whole lot changes in that sense. Maybe we see LeBron pass slightly more and score slightly less than he has in the past, but I still fully expect LeBron James to put up around 27. seven and seven, just like he has for his entire career.

The interesting thing is going to be, Kevin, like, you know, people want multiple playmakers on the court, multiple guys that can break you down off the dribble. And so is that Avery Bradley alongside with it? Because you know Danny,

Danny Green's standing out on the perimeter. But I'm saying Danny Green is standing out on the perimeter. You know that Anthony Davis is going to be facing up. You know, Javall McGee's not breaking you down. So, I mean, that puts a lot on LeBron if he's the only playmaker on the court. He's, I don't think he is, though. I think Anthony Davis has been severely underrated as a playmaker.

Okay. He's not Nicole Yokic, you know, he's not that type of player. Like on the ringer today, we have an article about the generational big men in today's league with, with perimeter skills. And he's not, he's not, Yokic is a passer, but he is a good ball handler, a guy who played wing, played point guard in high school before his growth spurt. Those skills really manifested this past season for him in New Orleans. And the opportunity is going to be here for him to be a real playmaking hub from the wing, from the high post for the Lakers this season.

Well, and I get that I get LeBron is always going to have a high usage rate. But as someone who covered Mike Conley for over 10 years without playmakers around him, what ends up happening is you get down to end of shot clocks. And then it's like everybody's looking around to get the ball back to him so he can create something for someone else. And it puts a lot on that one guy if he is the creator. But if you say you think Anthony Davis is that other creator, then so be it. I guess we'll see.

Yeah. I mean, I think you have two top five basketball players in the league. And that simple fact, with a roster full of good or competent shooters, it's a very dangerous, dangerous recipe that is going to be a problematic for opponents to stop this season. Honestly, Chris, you and I touched on this a couple weeks ago, or maybe last week after I wrote the article about LeBron James's future, but also about this Lakers team.

I think that game won against the Warriors was a bit of a preview of what's to come, but this team is going to be really, really devastating. We are virtually, though we have gone a little bit with different tax. Well, we are three for three, though. Virtually three for three. With overarching thoughts with what we chose. We have overlapped three times. Try me again, Chris.

Let's go four for four. Try me again. I will after these words. Ah. All right, Kevin, we'll get right back to it. I want to remind everybody. Today's show is brought to you by Luminary. Podcast subscription service with some of the best content around.

I'm excited about Luminary because it's the only place I can listen to the Ringers, amazing new podcast. Sonic Boom, How Seattle Lost Its Team. hosted by our very own Jordan Ritter-Con. If you're a fan of sports, great investigative journalism, or both, this is definitely a podcast that you can't miss. Sonic Boom,

how Seattle lost its team for more than four decades, the Seattle Supersonics were among the NBA's most iconic franchises. But in 2008, they packed their bags for Oklahoma City. Sonic Boom tells a story of basketball and politics, wealth and power. Here from the NBA legends, politicians, diehard fans, and business executives. dive into the chronicle of the perfect storm of events, how Seattle went from an iconic NBA city to a basketball orphan. Along with Sonic Boom, Luminary also offers more than 40 podcasts you can't find anywhere else,

including two more from the ringer, break stuff, the story of Woodstock 1999, and the rewatchable spin-off, the rewatchables 1999. The Luminary app is free to download and gives you access to way more than just their own content. Get your first two months of access to Luminary's premium content for free when you sign up at Luminary. com slash ringer NBA. After that, it's only $7.99 per month. That's Luminary. dot link slash ringer NBA for two months of free access.

Luminary. link slash ringer NBA. Cancel any time, terms apply. All right, Kevin. I am going to make the prediction that we are not going four for four. Let's go. Because this is a deep one. You ready?

Yep. It's a deep dot. And it just so happened as I was scrolling through all of the different box scores and I was going over the teams that had played thus far. There was a moment in time where I was sifting through one of the box scores and I was like, oh, I totally forgot about this. And you know what it was? It was seeing the name Darius Garland. and he was four for four with nine points, few assists, few turnovers, but he is one of those guys where we did not get to see him in college, you know, and so off the radar really,

and then he wasn't at Summer League, and the guy got drafted so high. And I would say amongst the top picks in this NBA draft, I mean, it's not even close. Like, who is talking about him? Have you, I mean, nobody is talking about him. You don't read anything about it. It's like, it's just very strange to me that there is somebody that got drafted that high in the NBA draft that I will tell you that in getting ready for when I was doing my draft article, I did not have one dissenter on him. Not one.

I did not talk to one person that did not believe in Darius Garland. or not one that like questioned it or the raise their eyes are like, I don't know. Everybody I talked to thought he is awesome. Now, because of the way I did the article, I left out guys that were ranked all like in the top five, right? Because those are easy, it's easy pickings. But I will tell you that everybody loved Garland. And there I am scrolling through the box scores. And I was like, jeez, you know, talk about off the radar.

Like he's not anybody's pick for rookie of the year. he's not anybody like it's just like I don't know a guy got drafted so high everybody I talked to love the guy but by virtue of us not seeing him and him being off the radar completely it's almost i don't want to say forgotten but it's just not on the radar like you usually are when you are selected that high in the draft and people are super excited about you well people are going to know him soon enough though once house of highlights and you know sports center you know whatever is playing his pull-up threes, you know, on the break when they're playing replays of his, you know, behind the back passes to spot up shooters. He's a very creative passer, a fast decision maker. So his mind

works quickly, but so does his body. He's very quick on the floor. He's, he's fast with his movement. So he's an exciting player to watch aesthetically, but he's also a good decision maker. And I think with NBA spacing, with Cleveland, I mean, Cleveland's not going to be good, The fact is he's going to have opportunities to make a lot of highlight plays. So soon enough, people are going to know the name Darius Garland. With him, that first game, I only saw the highlights. I did not, I did not dedicate a lot of time to watching Darius Garland against the international team. I'm not sure who they were facing.

I'm sorry, forgive me. But look, man, like, it's exciting to know that already he's caught your attention, that he will catch the attention of others because he's exciting, man. All right. What was your number four? my number four was a it was a big name a big name chris who sucked last season gordon heyward oh and the stat that i have sort of cheated it's not a box score stat but the number was six because he had six attempted layups and heyward appeared very very aggressive on drives which was sort of a supportive of a lot of the

comments being made by celtics players recently saying that he looked at back that he's playing hard. Gordon Hayward looks like Gordon Hayward and he didn't have a great game. He missed some shots, but he did look a lot more like Gordon Hayward. And for Boston, that has to be encouraging because with this year's team losing El Horford, losing Kyrie Irving, they need Hayward being back to being Hayward. They need Jason Tatum to improve his shot selection. And both those things happen in their first preseason game. And Hayward especially was encouraging with his performance, I thought. Do you think that the three, and I speak of Jason Tatum, Jalen Brown, and Gordon Hayward, do you think the three can play simultaneously and all thrive? Yeah, but they have to sacrifice like they did two seasons ago before, when Kyrie was out, that there needs to be buy-in from all those guys knowing that they're not going to get as many shots as you would hope to if they were playing on the Cavaliers. You know what I mean?

Like, there needs to be that. but ultimately because there's real overlap, you know what I mean? There's real overlap. I mean, there's three traditional wings. I mean,

there's overlap, but there's also, I think, complementary skills where Hayward is more of the playmaker and Tatum is more of the score and Brown is more of the defender who fills gaps for you

on the offensive end of the floor. And I think those guys can certainly coexist because you can never have enough three and E style wings in the league. And, you know, Hayward, you know, adds the new element with a scoring and Tatum does with his go-to, I'm sorry, Hayward does with his playmaking and Tatum does with his scoring. So those guys can certainly coexist, Chris. And I think with Boston, Brad Stevens alluded to this at some point during training camp that he could be playing small a lot more this season because you look at their center position with Robert Williams,

time lord, Grant Williams, then Ennis Cantor, of course. this team has bigs, but I think that none of them are on the L. Horford level where you need to play them 30 minutes per game. It wouldn't surprise me if Boston plays with some super small lineups this season. It'll be fascinating to see with Jalen Brown because you're probably right, the fill in the gaps, you know,

outstanding defender being the role, but this is his contract year and there's a lot of money on the line. And so I think that Jalen probably, wants to get back to the trajectory that he was on pre-Kyrie. Yeah, but how do you make that money, though? Do you make that money by pouting and complaining about your role? Oh, no. And letting that affect your defense.

Do you make it by maximizing the opportunity that you're given? Absolutely. And that's what he's done pretty consistently. And what I would hope for Boston, he does moving forward and for himself, too. And like, even with Tatum, though, like, to an extent, you could say if Tatum, despite how young he is. If he were in a different situation, he would be getting a lot of shot opportunities.

And for Boston right now, I think there were times this past season where Tatum forced it. In that game one, from what I saw, again, it backed up what I was told this summer, what Drew Hanlon also said publicly to, I think, the Boston Globe, that their focus was on pull-up threes

and on getting to the basket. And Tatum took, I think, only two pull-up jumpers in that game, and he got to the basket in situations where he would normally pull up. And that has to be encouraging for Boston that Tatum is taking smarter shots. Whether that continues, who knows, man? It's just one game.

Guys can fall back into old habits. But both factors with Hayward and Tatum have to be encouraging for Boston when they need that boost after losing so much talent. All right. Last one for me. Number five. So there's been a lot made of the Knicks

and so many bigs that were acquired, whether it is Julius Randall or it was Todd Gibson or it was Bobby Portis, you know, Marcus Morris, you've still got Mitchell Robinson, Kevin Knox will be getting minutes. But that has been a topic. What has not been as big a topic, at least I don't think nationally, is there, like, how does this flush out with all of the perimeter guys? Because Dennis McJruder didn't play in the game.

they got Alfred Peyton. I will tell you, Fisdale will play Wayne Ellington. Like, that's happening. He's going to play him. R.J. Barrett is going to play a lot of minutes. And then you, so you've got Alfred Payton, you've got Dennis Smith, Jr.

You've got Frankie Smokes. You got Wayne Ellington. You got R.J. Barrett. And then Reggie Bullock, if Reggie Bullock plays, just because he wants a veteran on the floor. And Alonzo Treer, who they played a ton of minutes last year. So how does that shake out? That's a lot of guys that you know what I mean?

Like that you're either either abandoning or developing. I mean, you play the best guys. Who? Who's the best guys? Is it? I mean, you have to. Are you sticking with?

You're investing with. You're investing in Frank Dill Akina. You're investing in Dennis Smith Jr. They have enough minutes to throw around. They might have to go to a 10 or 11 man rotation. But, you know, I think I think there's going to have to be sacrificed on any young team with a lot of talent like that. I mean,

that's just a lot of guys. I'm glad you now acknowledged that the Knicks do have a lot of young talent on the awesome. I didn't say there was talent. Oh, did you? Do any, R.J. Barrett. Okay, if you want to take RJ Barrett, who's like the third pick in the draft,

which of those guys? Yeah. Would you start for a good team? Alfred Payton, Dennis Smith Jr., Frank smokes. Ellington Bullock. Frank smokes. Which of those five? I just gave you,

I just gave you five guys. Which of those five perimeter players would you start on a good team? I, I sort of just, I missed the question because I was just laughing at you saying, Frank smokes, sorry. All right.

With all the talent, Alfred Payton, Dennis Smith Jr., Frank smokes, Reggie Bullock, Wayne Ellington. Which of those five do you believe starts on a good team? I mean,

you might start. Frank Nalekino over LeBron at the point card position for the Lakers. Enough already. But other than that, you wouldn't start any of those guys. Oh, okay. I'll just make it sure. So finally you acknowledge the great young talent that you wouldn't start on a good team.

Just, yeah, yeah, but it's a very specific question. It doesn't mean that you wouldn't want to invest in those players. And ultimately, Oh, and Alonzo Trier, I left him out.

I left Trier. I mean, I think Trier would be at the bottom of my totem pole there. Well, He wasn't last year. I know he wasn't last year. I know a lot of Knicks fans would probably get pissed off at me. By the way,

I mean of the young guys. I mean of Frank Nilakina, of R.J. Barrett, of Knox. Not like Alfred Payton. You're playing Trier over Peyton. But yeah,

they have young talent, man. That's why you're bringing it up anyway. No, because they have a lot of options. It's actually just a collection of a lot. They, with having Smith Jr.

Peyton and bringing in Ellington, um, now it's like, okay, who doesn't, get who's who's odd out because you're not getting minutes for all those guys you're just not did uh you saw marcus morris doink uh justin anderson up the head of the ball right boy that was great look like justin anderson took it like a man

he didn't even react you can't you can't look you got a fight i'm sorry no yes you do No. You can't let somebody slam a damn ball on your forehead. You got to fight. Fighting's not the answer, Chris. Yes, it is. Hey, to quote the great Matt Barnes, violence is never the answer unless it is.

Here's what I know, Kevin. You can't get a ball just slammed off your damn forehead. You at least got to wrestle the guy. You've got to, if you're not going to swing, you at least got to wrestle him, Greco-Roman or whatever. Like, you can't just, you can't let a guy just slam a ball off your forehead and not do anything.

Come on. you need to pick your battles is Marcus Morris really the guy you want to F with. If he's the guy that slams a ball off my damn forehead, you don't have a choice in the matter. Sometimes you don't get to pick with who you got to F with. I think I'll pass on battling Marcus Morris. All right. What's your number five? Russell Westbrook.

The number is one. It's one because he only had one mid-range pull-up in the game. And the mid-range pull-up happened with seven seconds up in the shot clock. So it's fine. It was a late clock mid-range jumper. I was highly, highly impressed with Westbrook's performance in terms of the process of what he was doing on the floor. He only shot four or ten in the game. He had six to six to five turnovers.

So statistically, it wasn't a great night. But still, I thought Westbrook showed more activity off ball in one game maybe than he did in his entire Oklahoma City career under Billy Donovan. I thought he showed, you know, at least marginal effort on the defensive end of the floor for a preseason game. And I thought the pace that he played with and the offensive end of the floor was a nice benefit for Houston, the amount of variety that provided in terms of like how they slowed it down a bit last season, especially with Hardin. Then you have Westbrook speeding it up the floor in transition, creating opportunities for guys. I thought he played a really smart game overall. And for Houston with Hardin and Westbrook now,

I'm going to be especially interested to see how this develops moving forward as those guys build more and more chemistry. But game one for Westbrook, the results weren't there, but I thought the process looked good. All right. Well, I will tell you, I am waiting to the regular season to make my determination because it was a year ago,

I was in Birmingham, Alabama for a preseason game, which featured the Rockets. And we came on and we did the mismatch. and you raved about how well Carmelo Anthony was fitting in. And maybe just maybe we've got a new Carmelo. And we know how that played out. So I'm waiting until the regular season when the intensity ratchets up. But I agree with you.

He was running the baseline. He was. And, you know, look, nobody gets the ball up the court faster than that guy. And by the way, here's the other big thing. Hardin looked unbelievable. Oh, my goodness. He looked unbelievable. That's the real promising thing, right?

What does the, what does it now look like with Westbrook and Hardin? And Harden looked, you know, better than ever. The important thing, like Westbrook does need to hit spot-up threes though. At some point,

like he's going to have to be better than he's been the past couple years shooting off the catch in order to maintain that spacing that they had with Chris Paul. Understood. Kevin, it is always a pleasure. We are now just a few weeks away from the NBA regular season beginning. I will actually talk to you for the Friday show later this week.

Whoa. For the first time, I don't say I'll talk to you next week. I will actually talk to you again in just a few days. Looking forward to it, Chris. This is going to be a really fun year for us, for the NBA. A lot going on around the world for basketball right now. But I'm excited about this upcoming year. Thanks to everybody for listening to another episode of The Mismatch.

If you dig what you're hearing, go give us a rating and review on iTunes. Five stars, five stars. It really helps. And we will talk to you next week. We will talk to you on Friday.