The Ringer NBA Show - Are the Bucks Out of Answers for the Raptors? | Group Chat

Episode Date: May 24, 2019

Kawhi Leonard had one of the best games of his career en route to a surprising Game 5 road win over one of the best teams in the NBA. Will Mike Budenholzer have to shorten his rotation in Game 6 to avoid getting eliminated (1:30)? Plus, we react to the All-NBA team announcements and the potential salary cap implications for some of the league’s biggest stars in Kemba Walker, Damian Lillard, and Klay Thompson (33:00). Hosts: Justin Verrier and Jonathan Tjarks Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to the Ringer podcast network. I'm Liz Kelly. Fresh off of Talk the Thrones, the Ringer is introducing a new live Twitter after show covering season two of HBO's Big Little Lies. Immediately after each episode, the Ringer's Amanda Dobbins and ESPN's Mina Kimes will be going live to give their initial reactions and break down everything we saw in the episode. And to kick us off, there will be a special season two preview airing on Friday, June 7th at 12 p.m. Pacific. So join Amanda and Mina for Big Little Live every Sunday on Twitter. Basketball is very good. Seth Curry is the best curry. The Sixers should trade for Landry Shanath.

The playoffs are better without LeBron. Basketball is very good. Hello and welcome to The Ringer NBA show. I am Justin Verrier and joining me in studio, the Malcolm Brogden of The Ringer.com. I wish I was that reliable. It's Jonathan Sharks. Joining us, as always, our producer,

our loyal and lovely producer, Bobby Wagner. It's a very special group chat. It's an intimate conversation. Bobby's part of the group now. I'm happy to be here. Yeah. Chris Ryan is no longer here. We're free of his tyranny. And does Bobby get to say more?

Bobby works like 20 hours a day. He's always here doing something. This is what I decree for this episode. I didn't have a saying that, Chris. I'm sorry. We're just going to edit you out anyway. All right. So a basketball game we've played tonight.

Game 5 of the Eastern Conference finals. The Raptors win 105-99 to take a 3-2 lead. In the last remaining series of these playoffs, what a game, probably one of the best games of the series thus far. And we were talking about kind of just general takeaways before we got on. I think the best place to probably start here is you wrote pretty recently how LeBron had dominated the Eastern Conference for so long. I don't know if you've heard of him. But he has since kind of seated the floor to Janus, and it seemed like Janus was very much ready to take up that mantle. He had blown through his first two opponents.

they'd only lost one game going into this Eastern Conference finals, and everything seemed ready and willing to coronate Janus as the next guy in the East, perhaps even in the NBA. But then Kauai steps in in this series, in this game, perhaps one of the best games of his postseason career and of the postseason, this postseason specifically, 35 points, 9 assists, 7 rebounds. Let's start here.

Is Kauai the best player in this series? I mean, this is like the Kauai game. Like, this was an all-time performance. Game 5 on the road at conference finals. I mean, he's dominating by scoring. He's dominating by passing. He's shutting down Yanos on defense. He's doing everything.

It was like, Nubarak goes crazy to me. He had nine assists in this game. He's only had more than six once this season. It's just like an all-around performance by Kauai. It's incredible on both sides of the floor. Right. So he's doing the things that we typically expect from Kauai, especially after a few games of where he's just dominated offensively.

But as you allude to with the assist there, he's doing things that we probably wouldn't expect from him. Danny Chow, actually, no, you wrote this. I almost gave Danny credit for this. How dare you? You wrote about how the last thing Kauai needed in order to become truly great, truly like one of the best players in the league,

was to evolve as a passer. Because that just wasn't his strong suit. Is this the type of game you kind of like, you look at him and he just has the entire package going for him? Well, yeah, because like when he's passing the ball like this, he can just really take over. Like, everything goes through Kauai now. Like, it's not just like Kauai's

scoring everyone else is like doing their own thing. It's like no, Kauai's their scoring or he's getting guys open threes. And it was like, it's as simple as this like the adjustment of the game for the Raptors was benching Danny Green and playing Van Vleet like 40 minutes. Because like Kauai's so dominant, if you can just give guys or they can

knock down open threes, then that's all you need. Right. So we're basically at point Kauai. That was what this was tonight. Yeah. And it's interesting to see on the opposite side because that's essentially how the bucks operate. It's just Yannis creates or he drives into the lane is able to hit out, hit those open three-point shooters

who have been so dangerous throughout the series. Obviously, some of those three-pointers weren't following this season. And it's interesting to see the Raptors almost beat the bucks at their own game. Yeah, that's like the game you got to have to win. It's when you have, like, the best player on the floor, either he's going to score or someone else is going to get a three.

Right. Like, that's like basketball. It's like its simplest form. As you get deep into these series, like the secondary players get shut off, all your plays get shut off. It just becomes like, I have a guy who's going to score one-on-one or create open threes and like he's getting the ball every single time.

And what's interesting about, I think also with Milwaukee, because they're so transition like dominant, because Toronto's scoring in the half court, now Milwaukee's not getting any transition opportunities and they're going to, they're really, it's like a rebound effect. Right. It's like if because Toronto's scoring in the half court, Milwaukee's not getting in transition, so it's like even more powerful Toronto points. So taking away the, the offense of Milwaukee too.

They're controlling the pace. Yeah. With stops, basically. Yeah, I mean, and that's the advantage of having Nikoi on the other end. you'd expect, again, you'd expect that to be Yonis, you'd expect us to be talking about how Janus switched on to one of their perimeter players and all of a sudden the defensive player of the year stepped up.

It's just so interesting to see Kauai kind of take the narrative by the neck and really control not only this series, but these playoffs. I'm trying to think if anybody even comes close to what Kauai has done this entire playoffs. I mean, the closest thing I could probably think of is Steph. I think he had 36 or 37 points over four games to beat the Trailblazers

without Kevin Durant. And obviously, all those performances are going to be heightened by the fact that Durant is out and now they're playing like they used to. But throughout this entire playoffs, Kauai has been the most consistent and the most consistently dominant guy. Two-way, and then, like, he'd complete control

that Philadelphia series. Right. He won that thing by himself by the end there. And now he was doing it again. Literally, because he hit that final shot. Yeah. And in game five, like, he's dragging his leg. He's not 100%. Like, this is, like, this is like,

this is like, Kaui is doing, like, YMCA. I'm going to hold the ball. I'm going to wait until I get my shot. I'm controlling the game completely with his mind and his game. It's like this whole Raptors team. It almost felt like the Mavs heat in 2011. I was watching this.

You have like an older team that can shoot really well holding the ball. It's really surprising. You compare someone to the Mavs. Well, you have your references, right? Justin has his Yukon basketball. He's Yukon hoops. I don't get to use that one as often with the NBA these days. But, Charks, for the listeners at home, is wearing a Texas hat.

Texas forever y'all Texas forever I'm going home tomorrow people Are you going home to your ranch Are you going to go graze some cattle This is why I assume your life is like I wish man I think the other thing that's fascinating here is just It seems like Kauai is having

Sort of like a myth making postseason For sure I mean I feel like if he had more personality He'd be the story like this is like But this game here tonight This is like one of those games talking about forever This is like Kauai's He's one of finals MVP But like at this level

To be carrying a team this far It's like this is like the game This is the game of his career I think Yeah I mean it's sacrilegious to talk about Jordan I can compare them to any player And obviously Kauai that's a It's a high bar that he will never

Probably ever surpass But it's interesting to see him do certain things And your mind instantly flashes to Jordan So he has that play Where his giant hands He basically it just sucks into The ball sucks into one of his giant His right hand

and he palms it immediately. And from there, almost like one touches a pass to somebody else that triggers this possession where the ball is moving and I think ultimately ended up with the Fred Van Fleet like missed pull-up two-pointer, which was disappointing to see. But all I could think about was like how Jordan used to always like palm the ball and like deny the defender when he was kind of facing him up, right? When he was like sizing him up.

And then he's doing these things while playing on one leg sometimes. It didn't, he seemed slowed a little bit more. But at this point, considering what he went through this entire season, I guess I'm just used to that. But last game, I think most players, we would call that like the limp game. This would be the type of game that we would all be talking about. But for some reason, with Kauai, it just doesn't seem like it ever gets to the level where people want it to be as thrilled about it.

Probably because he's just not as big of a celebrity as Jordan ever was. But it does seem like he's doing things that are on that level. Yeah, and this is like the playoffs stage too. So before he was in the Spurs, he's part of that system. And then his first time they'll have his big moment was in the OSA in that finals where he got hurt by Zaza and knocked him out, that he was out last playoffs. Like now this is like his first playoffs where he's the man

on one of the last teams left. And we're just kind of seeing him. Yeah, right, you just had to ride his own legend. Like, well, we're talking about it now. These are the kind of games you have than like it changes everything on how he perceives. Yeah. And this is what we expected from Janus.

And I think throughout most of the playoffs, this is what we got from Janus. And it had been great to see. It just seems like this entire postseason was shaping up to be the honest playoffs. And I think a lot of us were already starting to prep our finals columns and our Bucks, Warriors, clashes. I'll never, I'll never admit it, Justin. Never. I'll take the blame because I definitely was.

There are a few slacks in the Ringer archives. You could definitely see us prepping for that. All of a sudden, like, maybe we need to erase that and get Paulo to do some different blogs. So sorry to Bolo. I think too, like you're talking about like Jordan and Kauai. It's like that mid-range jumper. Like Kauai can get that shot whenever he wants and he always makes it. Whereas like Yonis or even LeBron sometimes, the jump would come and go.

Whereas with Kauai, you have that physical dominance to create a shot he's always going to hit. Like he's just going to score. Really the only guy can guard him was Malcolm Brogden, which is the real star of this podcast. We'll get to that. We're going to do 30 minutes on Brogden later. But I do want to talk about Janus quickly. It did seem like for a while he is this physical freak. a while he was just dominating based on sheer force.

And the Bucks definitely have set up this system that takes advantage of his best attributes. They fill them around with all these three-part shooters. It's kind of similar to the way the 09 magic were. It's basically you're playing four-out just with an evolutionary, like supporting cast and evolutionary center at the middle of it all. And the numbers reflected his dominance. But the past few games, it has seemed like he has stalled to a certain degree. he had 12 points three games ago, 25, and then tonight he ended up with 24, 6 assists, 6 rebounds,

which is good, 9 for 18 from the floor, 2 for 3 from 3 point land. It seems like he's evolving that 3 point game, he's shooting with confidence. So Kauai himself seems fine, but he definitely seems kind of gunked up. It definitely doesn't seem like he's moving as freely as he liked to. and my mind instantly thinks, well, are they too predictable? Is this Bucks offense too programmatic? Which is always ironic considering that Kauai's a robot,

but it does seem like the Bucks's structure, there's almost like there's like a wrench in the gears and all of a sudden things just aren't operating as efficiently as they should. Well, it's like what you're saying, like it's so based on Yonis dominating his matchup. And he's still getting points, but he's not just overwhelmingly dominating Kauai. And then he's not getting in the transition.

And so Yonis is getting like, Like, just slowed on a bit and that's holding everyone else back. To me, the thing, like, I'm saying with the bucks, like, if you have Janus as your center, then, like, to get Kauai off them, you got to put him in a pick and roll. So if Yonis is the screener, who's the guard, I saw a couple times as he had Bledso running that play. And it's like, if you have Bledso as the guard in that two-man game with Yannis, they're just going to go under that and let him shoot all day. Right.

So to me, it's like finding ways to get Middleton and Brogden in the two-man game with Yonis in space. That, I think, is the big adjustment for Milwaukee. as get Kauai off him. Then you have Middleton or Brog making this decision to shoot or pass. So, I mean, we should give credit to the Raptors' defense. Oh, yeah, for sure.

We're probably affecting that. And I think Kauai was one of the big adjustments putting him on Yannis even more than he had been. But they also put Siakam on Bloodsoe. So, I mean, defensively overall, like, was it just a Kauai thing in your mind? Or was it... I mean, too, they've had, like,

also Lowry's been guarding Middleton. Middleton's two for nine in this game. Right. And he's supposed to be your second guy. So they're slowing down Janus. They're slowing down Middleton. And then everyone else kind of eats off those two normally. Yeah.

And so if those two aren't getting theirs, then it's kind of like things, it looks stagnant because your guys who create shots for everyone else aren't creating them. Let's talk about Melton briefly. My guy. You are the president of the Chris Milton. I keep my faith.

I'll never let go of that one. Is he from Texas too? A&M. Yeah, he went to A&M. Oh, do you really? Yeah. This is all. I sense a theme here, my man. All right.

So I think for a while the rest of the ringer staff has been measured on Chris Middleton. I think we used to do those top 30 players at certain checkmarks in the season. And it was always funny to look at the individual kind of rankings because all of us were somewhere in the middle on Chris Middleton. This is always really high. My guy. You wrote about him. And clearly he has hit another level this season. He made the All-Star team.

He's in a contract year, which I'm sure provides some semblance of motivation. But throughout, it does seem like they need a competent number two to go to, more of a consistent number two. And I'm starting to get some Siakum vibes from him where perhaps he's not up to the moment. Yeah, he's not been consistent. So he had like the big scoring game in Game 4. Then this game he had 10 assists but only had six points. So it's like consistent, it's like that consistent scoring, shooting, and creating for other people. It's like all having all three of those things together.

Like to me, if I'm looking at the Bucks, I think you've got it's three guys are Janice, Brogden, Middleton. You've got to play them more minutes. That's him you go into a game six on the road. You've got to shorten your rotation. You've got to play your best players. There are just way too many minutes in this game where you don't have... Look at the numbers, when those three guards are all in together, when you have three guys, Janice Middleton, Brogden,

they're like plus 35 in the first four games. But, like, in this rotation the bud has, he's always taking one out. He's rotating guys. He gave 10 guys minutes in this game. To me, it's too late in the series to play so many guys off your bench. This is like go time. You look at the Raptors. They only point eight guys right now.

you have the guys you trust and you go with them. You wrote them, right with the main minutes you can possibly play them. Yeah. And this is what Bud got dinged for in that game one loss of the Celtics, right? Yeah. We all of a sudden started criticizing him for perhaps not playing playoff basketball. Because apparently it's a pop thing to kind of in the face of adversity sticking to what has worked for you. And the logic, while I don't know specifically what he's following, it does seem sound, right?

Yeah. It's worked all season doing it. If you play fewer minutes, theoretically, your best players will be, like, fresher. Not only if the series goes long, but in the entire game. There are statistics that and analytics that all these teams have at this point, if they don't, they're probably way far behind that says a player's maximum minutes is X, and after that point, it's all diminishing returns. So I get where he's coming from, but it does feel like Bud is someone who's sticking

to these traditional values, whereas Nick Nurse has kind of emerged in this posties, and even in the regular season is kind of a maverick. Yeah, hey. No pun intended. He's just being aggressive. That's the thing about nurse as a coach. He's like,

he's aggressively looking for the right lineups. He's aggressively trying things. And he's maneuvering quickly. I feel like with like, with like buddy, even something as simple as like Game 4 with Brogden. And they kept them on that bench

to the extra game. Oh, because it's worked well in the season. Like we don't, but you went to it in game five because you know that's your best lineup. So why waste the extra game by not going to it? You're teasing me with this Brogden talk.

Do you want to just go full bore into it? Yeah, future Dallas Maverick Malcolm Brogden. Future Dallas Maverick, Malcolm Brogden. I think we are all, this has been the Kool-Aid for one, Malcolm Brogden. And we were talking about Chris Middleton, perhaps not being their second best player. I'm starting to think that Brogden is, if not their second best player, then perhaps their second most important player. I mean, he's been the best guy to guard, Kauai. He's done a much better job of Middleton.

He never, everything too, like, Brogden, he doesn't miss open shots, and he doesn't turn the ball over too often. So this is. But he'd have that big turnover off his leg in the 29 second mark. Right. Well, you know, you can't blame me for having legs, you know? He almost artfully dodged that, that bounce. That's true. He got the call the first time.

High IQ player. Right. So he ends up with 18 points, 11 rebounds for our guy Malcolm Brogden that leads the team. Six assists, eight for 17 from the floor, two for six from three. But, you know, the entire Bucks team wasn't shooting particularly well from 3. Land 10 for 31 on this game. And so I guess if you have some hope going forward, like a lot of those shots,

this is a plus three-point shooting team. So it was funny because I think there's some turning in our slack that a lot of these shooters just weren't making it. Our intrepid producer, Bobby Wagner, suggested that the Eastern Conference Finals is going to come down to a three-point war between Marcosol and Brooke Lopez.

You hate to see it. Do you know? Kind of. Yeah, most of the time you do hate to see. see it. We got our 7 for 300 pound Euro stepping guard, Rook Lopez, taking the ball of the cup. It is crazy to see it. Softly laying in, finger rolling it in. But Gasol, like, had one of his better games of the year.

Shooting still dreadful, one for six. That offensive board, though, was his play of the game. They were up three with like 25 seconds left and got the board on Lopez. Somehow Lopez gets the seal, but Gasol stands him up, essentially. Yeah. And the biggest possession of the game that Janus just happens to not be out there because he rolled an ankle, like, the possession before. Which is another thing, like, going back to buttonholes.

Like, you've got a... It's a call it timeout there. Keep on the floor. Yeah, the timeout was questionable. And also, let's talk about how Kauai is playing through basically not having one leg. And then Yonis can't just, like, limp for a little bit. Like, is this a bad take? Like, I feel like, Janus is the biggest game of your career?

Maybe just, like, suck it up a little bit. We'll be okay. Just figure it out. Like, yeah, Kauai's figuring. Let's go ahead. Kaui has gang. green over here. And Yanis can't sit through a boo-boo?

Is this what you're telling me? Welcome to Ringer Talk Radio. Yeah, well, it's almost 9 p.m. on the West Coast, so things are getting pretty loose. This is the point where Bobby knows that the podcast starts to turn from the worst. Okay, let's talk about going forward. What's the adjustment here? Do they even need to make adjustments if you're the box?

I mean, to me, the adjustment is you quite, like, especially on the road at game six. Like, this is going to be such a high-pressure game. You've got to go with your best players. Like, I'm, I tend to be on the more aggressive side of things comes to minutes in the playoffs, but like, I'm telling Janus, you're not coming out tomorrow on, what's it, Saturday? You're not coming out. Going 48.

I'm giving, I'm giving Middleton 40. I'm going to Rodden 40, 45. I'm playing those three guys as much as they possible can. This is the season. I'm not having Pat Conantton, Sterling Brown, like, or Ilyossova. Like, this rotation is getting cut to like six, seven guys. And we're playing our best players. We're playing our best players when they beat us, they beat us.

But I'm not letting them beat my second string guys. I mean, on the road. Janice's postseason high right now is 44 for this postseason. And that wasn't an overtime game, wasn't it? That was in a double overtime game. Otherwise-

I was like, 51 in that game. Like, this is, go for it. Right. Like, Nick Nurse is going to like run Quai into the ground to win this series.

He doesn't care. Well, he also doesn't have to deal with the repercussions because Kauai's going to leave. Oh. But has to ride Janus for hopefully like five or six more years. That's true.

But you're 23, man. Like, let's go for it. Now is the time to do it. I mean, it is interesting to see it because, even though the Raptors are the older team, and perhaps that's what it is. Maybe they're older, they have more desperation,

they know that this is the window. Like, Marcusol is not getting another chance at the NBA finals. Kyle Lowry's last stand, yeah. Probably not getting a chance at the finals. So you're probably more willing to play through an injury or two, if you know. It's that classic thing where we consistently think that when a young team breaks through that this is the start of something,

where the Thunder probably thought they were going to the NBA finals like four straight times with that core, all of a sudden James Hardin isn't there. A couple injuries happen, and then it all falls apart where you lose all three, well, two of the three MVPs that you have.

Yeah, and then like an older guys know, like the value of each game. Like the bucks, they were up, they were, they had game three won, right?

They lost that in double overtime. That's 3-0 in the series. And it's like, but like when these older guys, they know they've been around, this is it. We're going for it right now. I mean,

let's talk about like with LeBron, like LeBron would go 40, he went 48 minutes last year in a game seven. Like, LeBron was like 34. 48 minutes. That's how, like, at this level of the playoffs, like every minute matters. You got to have good lineups all the time.

You need your best ones for all the time. You can't afford your best players not to be out of the game. Yeah. And like, LeBron can do it at 34. Let's see, I want to see Yonis at 48 minutes. I want to see him getting better matchups. Because, like, if Anas is playing 48 minutes, Kauai can't guard him that whole time. Yeah.

That's freeing him up for more opportunities. Yeah. I mean, even though this is perhaps the coronation of Janus, it's interesting because the one thing we've been talking about lately is just how much of a window. does this Bucks core really have? So if you look at the roster, a lot of these guys are younger. Brogden is only in his third year, I believe. You know, he's dealt with injuries,

but who's to say? I mean, Milton's still late 20s. There's still some growth to be had here, but all of a sudden there are a lot of free agents on this team. Middleton is unrestricted, probably going to take a max, if you want to bring him back, which means that all of a sudden

the back year of that contract, maybe you're dealing with some decline years. Malcolm Brogden, we're already talking about him as potential max restricted free agents. We're talking about. To be fair, no one else is talking about that. Well, we're starting to now, though.

He's a restricted free agent. So if any team did want to pry him away from Milwaukee, like the one way you're probably going to get him to sign an offer sheet is with a size of a deal. I would kill half of him as my third option in Dallas behind KP and Lupa. That would be really nasty. I mean, how many 3-&D guys are there out there? Like competent, heady, 3-D guys are alive. And not 3-&D guys.

Three-N-D guys who shoot 40-50-90 who can also pass the ball, who can guard Kauai in a playoff series. Like, there's a handful guys in the league who can do that. To me, this series has been clarifying for the bucks in terms of all these free agents. Like, to me, the core of this team is Janus, Middleton, Brogden. Those are my three guys. I got Janus, and I got two two-way wings who can kind of do everything on the floor. Everyone else, to me, is like movable, is like replaceable.

But that's my three-man group I'm riding with going forward. Well, they're- I don't know Milwaukee sees it that way. They're kind of going to be at a crossroads moment with filling out the rest of the roster this off-season because, well, one thing I wonder is in this. series in particular, they've had so much success with Brooke Lopez. He does a lot of the things you'd want from a stretch four, let's say, next to Janus.

But he's probably going to take a bigger deal than they got him for this year. I mean, for sure, he's thinking $3 million this year. And he's the type of player that other teams will look at and be like, oh my God, he's like a revelation. We need to overpay him. And especially with there's so much money out in the market this summer, I do wonder if a team is going to throw him

the bag, as the kids say. Okay, now that we're deep enough in this pod, I'm just going to go drop some more takes. But like, you're talking about Oklahoma City, and I'm thinking that with Milwaukee in terms of Hardin, where it's like, okay, we've got these, all these young guys, we can let this one go. But I think if Milwaukee, Brogden is not as goes James Hardin, I'll be somewhat reasonable here. But it's at that level, that role in the team, that's the third guy. They could let him walk the summer and like really regret it down the road. And I think to me, that would be like the big tragedy of this.

If they lose him this summer, and like that's the third piece they needed going forward. They just don't have them anymore. I mean, and how are they going to recreate something like that? Yeah, you don't find players like that. just, it's like, I feel in the playoffs at this level, it's all about finding guys, like, KOC had an article last week about that, and how like guys, the holes in their game get exposed. Yeah. And there's just very few guys who have no holes

in their game like that. And if you have one like Brogden can be a two-way player, and the lead shooter off, Yonis, you've got to keep them. I mean, the Bucks, traditionally not a sexy market. Maybe they'll have more luck getting guys to play with Yannis, although we said that about Anthony Davis and nobody really wanted to go play with him. Clearly, different

success and trajectories. But, I mean, they got rid of a 2020 first round pick. They have their own this year, but they did. But I mean, that pick, I bet it's moved. I bet they try to package off like, because they're paying Tony Snell $7 million a year. I mean, more than that, they're paying on like $12 million a year.

It's funny because we're reaching peak rumor season. We just started up the rumor monger live blog on the ringer.com, so check that out. Let's please drop that rumor. Bucks may package a number 30 pick to get off Tony Snell salary. Well, it's funny because I opened up Hoopside today, which is my Bible. And the big picture was Tony Snell on the market?

Like, this is the point where we are, where I will eat up any rumor, but you're really asking a lot of me to click on Tony Snell content. But yeah, you're right. I mean, Janus only has two more seasons under contract. And as we've seen any sort of disgruntled star conversation, exit plan starts way sooner than we think. And I'll stop myself right here because we're getting very doom and gloom about the Milwaukee Bucks. But these are like...

This is a time to overreact, Justin. They just lost a big game. We're doing the after. We can think radically tomorrow. Let's overreact. Ethan Strauss has this bit like, who cares about overreacting? Overreact.

This is what sports are for? If we're not going to overreact, what are we doing this for? So, as I was saying, Yonis is leaving. No, but, I mean, he only has two more years on the contract. At the very least, you need to prove to him

that this wasn't just the flash in the pan. Like, going back to the Anthony Davis comp, like everything seemed rosy rosy in 2014-15 after they made that first playoff run gave the Warriors or stern push, even though it was a four-game sweep, and we thought everything would continue on. Things don't happen

that way. And so, you have both Mirich, you have Brooke Lopez up for free agency. I would be surprised at this point if both of them came back and perhaps neither of them will. And then you're left, well, maybe it's Erasani Losovo next, a guy that they signed

longer than Brooke Lopez. Then he's the guy next to Janus. And these are the little moves on the fringes where all of a sudden, Katie comes in New York, Kyrie goes to Brooklyn, and everything is way tougher, and we're starting to look at this team a little bit differently. I think, like, these are, like, it sounds

extreme, and it is. But these are the things that happen. It can all change on you real fast, for sure. Life comes out of you fast. Okay, let me, you want to go... Wise words from Char. You want to go with some real...

Let's really fantasize. You're the Mavs. So the Mavs drafted... I was his name, the younger Anza Tocumpo, Costas. I'm the G-League team. Yes, they did.

And I'm saying, you know, you know he's perfect next to Yonis would be Luca. That would be the best one, too, of all part. You know who'd be best next to Yannis, another potential MVP candidate?

But I mean, like, you look at the Warriors, you have two of them guys in the same team, then you're going to win for sure. I bet you, it's a lot easier to get to Europe from Dallas

than it is Milwaukee. Not to say anything about the Milwaukee transit system. I'm sure their airport is quite level. We are the hub of American Airlines. and Southwest. We're a real airport hub.

I am an American flyer, my friend. I've been through Dallas plenty of time. I've gotten lost in that airport plenty of times. I've been to the Chili's 2. Oh, chill, yeah. Bobby? They don't start dayback ribs there. Bobby, do you know about Chili's too?

I don't. Okay, so it's like a Chili's, but it's 2. It's T-O-O, which means that it's not a proper Chili's. It's like Chili's also. Oh, so it's like we're not going to get sued type of chili? No, it's a Chili's brand. Oh, okay. But it's true.

But it's not like a full chilies, it's a smaller chilis. They didn't have bayback ribs. I was like, what is going on here? How is even chilies? Are you kidding me? I got to tell you what I didn't bargain for was airport food talk. What's your favorite airport food, Bobby? Like when you go through the airport, so I always have something that like I know that is probably unhealthy but not going to kill me.

Orange Chicken Panda Express. God, that is my weakness. I love orange chicken, man. This has been a good talk, guys. I'm glad we ended up here. So, long story short, how are we feeling

about the Bucks's chances in this game six? You seem optimist. I think there are moves they can make to win this game. Okay. Where are they make them? I don't know.

What are those moves? I mean, just shorten the rotation. I think get Janus and pick and rolls with Brogden and Middleton and just like run your, run those guys,

run your best players and see how far it gets you. Like, if you're going to switch, like, they were switching in the fourth quarter and they're switching Lopez and,

Ilya Sova onto Kauai. If you're going to switch, you got to play your lineup where you go, they never play this lineup. They go, they're small one, the Bledso Hill, Brogha, Middleton, Janus. I was waiting for you to get. If you're going to switch, like, that's you got to play. You got a guy so you can switch. Otherwise, if you're switching to get Ilysova on Kauai, like that's just crazy. I mean, could you.

If you don't want to go that small, could you even just play Mertich? Yeah, he's more switchable. I mean, he did fine playing next Anthony Davis for all those years. It just seems like he's been diminished. Well, because he came off basically. like they put Roggan back in the starting lineup. I'm with Maritich on the bench. And now he's playing with Ilyosov.

And it's like, you need two of those guys on the floor at the same time. And not really. No, neither of them has been particularly effective. Okay, and let's look at the other side of this year. Is it just, at this point for the Raptors, you just ride your best seven guys on the floor? Because they did play eight guys, but Abaka only got 19 minutes.

It wasn't particularly effective. Norm Powell minutes are hit and miss. He's basically a warm body for a lot of the time. He had a big game the other day, but I'm just not a big norm. I mean, you're just finding guys. you can shoot around Kauai. That's what it comes down to.

So, like, Green's not shooting, bringing Van Vliet. Van Vlis not shooting, bringing in Powell. You're rotating through your guards because you know Kauai's going to score. And now he's passed on the ball, too. So it's pretty simple. It's like, you're just fighting your guys who can space the floor for Kauai. I think the one thing I worry about with Toronto is like, the Milwaukee's really playing off Siakam.

And so when they're playing the bigger lineups where you have Seacum and Gassau together or Siakam and Abaka, they're playing off two guys, let's them crowd Kauai. So to me, it's like, you're going to space, you're spacing it for Kau as much as you can. you're trusting your defense to carry the rest of the way. Yeah. All right.

We'll see what happens in game six on Saturday. We're going to take a quick break and we're going to come back and talk about All-MBA and we're going to get to know Jonathan Charks a little bit better. Oh, now there's your there's your teaser. Let's have all-M-B-A talking about the charts. Coming up next. Talking to All-MBA. I'll tell you why.

Malcolm Brogden should have been a third team selection. Today's episode of The Ringer NBA show is brought to you by Capital One. Capital One knows life doesn't alert you about your credit card. That's why we created Eno, the Capital One assistant, that catches things that might look wrong with your credit card, like overtipping, duplicate charges, or potential fraud. Then it sends an alert to your phone and helps you fix it. It's another way Capital One is watching out for your money when you're not. Capital One, what's in your wallet? See Capital One.com for details.

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That's helixleep.com slash ringer for up to $125 off your mattress order. All right, we're back. We just talked about the Eastern Conference Finals. Unfortunately, we do not have any Western Conference action to go through any more. The Blazers were not up to the task. Doing us blog boys a favor, though. I guess I have a couple days off. I got to tell you that Wednesday night was lovely.

I had myself a night. Bobby had a nice, he drew himself a nice bath. A little Kiante action. A little Marvin Gay. You all need it sometimes. I'm just telling you. I wish that was every Wednesday. All right, but we're going to talk about all-NBA voting because those results were distributed to the masses today.

The first team, Steph Curry, Hardin, Janice, Paul George, Nicola Yolkich. No surprises really, except for perhaps that center spot. I want to get back to that. Second team, Damian Lillard, Kyrie Irving, Gai Leonard, Kevin Durant, perhaps the two dominant players of this playoff so far. Somehow, this is how they ended up in the regular season, Jewel and Bede in that second team center spot. third team Russell Westbrook. Kemble Walker, hailing from the great state, well of New York,

but he played at Yukon. Blake Griffin, LeBron James, your third team forwards. $50 million to Kemper Walker, making that team. And then Rudy Gobert, Charks, let me set it up, man. You're jumping ahead. I'm already thinking about Kemper money, man.

That's just so much. You already cutting that cash. You talked about this today with Kevin O'Connor and Bill Simmons on the Bill Simmons podcast. But I still want to go through some of the results here. For you is the takeaway, just Kemba?

I mean, I feel like the implications are so big for the Hornets for him. Yeah, it's fun to talk about the teams and the players and argue about it, but like, there's no real real real implications normally, but like, this is major. Not all you're Charlotte, you're looking at, you got to pay this guy $220 million because he made this team. What do you

even do? Do you let him go? But like, how can they really build around him at that kind of salary point? Right. They don't have a lot of money coming off the books this next offseason. So They're pretty much committed to what they have thus far. Now, toward the end of this season, I definitely saw that they started to lean more into a youth movement. You saw a little bit more, Dwayne Bacon, who, I don't know going forward if he's going to be a guy for you,

but Miles Bridges, clearly a first-round pick. It seems like he showed some stuff. I liked how the fact that he didn't make the all-rooky team, and people were probably defending him and asking why he didn't make it. And he's like, no, I actually didn't deserve it. I played like trash, but I'm going to be better next year. The only thing better than that if he had not tweeted at all. That would really invest me. That's the takeaway always.

If he's going to tweet, that's a reasonable tweet. But if he was really about that life, like no tweets. Kauai, I'm out here tweeting about nothing. Yeah. So on the one hand with Kemba, I feel like the Horace probably did a hard swallow just based on the fact that if they want to keep him, they're going to have to pay him that, what, 80 million more? I think it's 50. Something crazy.

Something absurd. That's going to be on the table and he's going to be expecting it if you want him to suffer. If I'm going to stay here, do you got to get me all my money for sure. For sure. On the other hand, it provides an interesting dilemma for Kempa himself

because all of a sudden he's choosing now between an ungodly amount of money and perhaps going to a situation that he's never played in before. There are a lot of suitors out there for him. And while I think there's going to be some fluctuation with the point guard market,

it does seem like maybe a guy like Kyle Lowry, Kauai leaves, and then all of a sudden maybe they look to trade him or maybe he wants a buyout, he wants to go play for a team. There's a lot that could happen, but Kempah's really that next guy. If you don't get Kairi, just get a guy who offensively can approximate what Kairi brings you, perhaps not even a bigger liability on the defensive end.

But he can help a team out. Clippers would love to have Kamba playing with Kauai, for instance. I mean, it does kind of seem like Kempa and Kairi are linked. And then you have like LeBron and Durant and possibly there's going to be some combination of those four guys, right? You could see, like, if it's Katie and Kyrie in New York, then, like, at Kemba take the Maxpon to the Lakers. Or if Kyrie goes back to LA, play with LeBron, all of a sudden it's Kemba and Kyrie, New York.

It feels like a natural fit for one of those guys. I personally want to see him in Madison Square Garden. Just the good vibes of, like, potentially recreating the iconic step back on Pittsburgh moment that I have running through my mind all the time and perhaps on my computer once a week. Oh, there you go. Yeah, the five overtimes, whatever it was. I also think it would be really, yeah, with Syracuse, which I have to say, people always bring up the fact that Syracuse won that game. When you get to five overtimes, is it really basketball anymore?

Yeah, you just, you just played that much basketball. It's impressive. It's a war of attrition. It's a different game. I will go down to my death defending this point. No, but I think it's interesting. I think in addition to probably like just being accepted by that crowd immediately, you have Deezis and Mero pretty much being out there, beckoning Kemba to New York. on the other hand, it creates this interesting dynamic where I think Kemba would be instantly beloved in New York, whereas Kevin Durant perhaps would leave the Warriors seeking some sort of validation and would have to now contend with Kemba Walker,

another small point guard and three-point shooter who probably instantly becomes the guy there. You know what it is, man? It's the last temptation of Kemper Walker, right? Do you want to play relevant basketball or do you want all this money? That's how life works sometimes, Justin. Like, the money is one thing.

But it's always the best choice for your life. Like, do you want to have big? everything based on money. I mean, there's consequences to that. But it's a lot of money, so I can't ever hate a guy for taking his cash. Yeah. Yeah, I definitely always take the money. My point, exactly. I rest my case. Now, what team would you want to mostly Kempa play on? I think either playing with LeBron or Katie, one of the two. That would just be awesome. Because then it could be like, could Kamba be a Kairi? I mean, my gosh, who has Kamba ever

played with in his life on these teams, right? This is my favorite polar game? Like, who is Kemba's best teammate? Yeah, it's like, we did the math when you're looking at it. Like, it's either, don't laugh. It's Josh McRoberts that one year when they made the playoffs. It's definitely not Josh McRoberts. Or similar, Al Jefferson or late stage L. Jefferson had one good season. Kembo was there, I guess, that year.

It was one playoff run. The playoff run where Jeremy Lynn was on that team, like Lynn had a pretty good season that year where they were playing off each other and playing two guys, like two attacking point guards together before. A guy who can't even get minutes in the series, Jeremy. Well, he's older now. Yeah. Kemba caught him at his, well, not his peak, but maybe like his slightly post-peak. Yeah, he got like a, he had like Nick Batum before Nick Batum fell off real hard.

The one Nick Batum season before he got his own bag. Oh my gosh. Yeah. He was very good. Batum was probably the best player on that team. This was before Kemba really became the Kembo we have now because he probably wasn't shooting as proficiently from three-point as he was as he is now. He's basically step flight at this point for a while. He couldn't even really hit threes. that's a really good question Marvin Williams is also very good on that team now we're just naming Hornets

who most of which are still on the team they're still hanging around yeah Algin paid really well so props to MJ for paying us guys there you go but I think it would be cool to see Kemba in a number two role off a player like LeBron like that would just be an interesting it'd be interesting when a change of his career

changed his kind of path selfishly I want to see him on the Clippers like if it's not in New York I do want to see him play off of Kauai I just think, like, everything they have there. I don't know what it means for Landry-Shammett. They kind of have that shooting guard spot locked down. Actually, both guard spots locked down for the foreseeable future

if you just wanted to bring Kauai in there and build around there. But I don't know. I think he just needs a stage. And it would be great to see that. I think everyone is rooting against the Hornets, which must be a really tough thing if you're a Hornets fan. I mean, at least I know you exist, I guess, right? Right.

But once Campbell... It's tough, though, for the Hornets. Because, like, if Campbell leaves, then you're, like, doing 2011 all over again. when they tank for MKG, it's like, it's like, how can you have any confidence

on an organization to rebuild after what they've done the last decade? I remember when, so I covered the Hornets playoff series against the Miami Heat.

Oh, that was a brutal one. Well, it went seven games and if you're a traveling beat writer, that meant I got three separate stays

on South Beach. Oh, that's fair. I begged it different. I almost got to go to Toronto. I think it's a nice flight, like a Charlotte Miami's real quick.

It's a nice flight. It was great. I had a lovely time. Moving on. Damien Lillard The other guy that had some interesting implications here Also super max eligible Apollo Getty wrote about it for the ringer

Earlier this week It seems like this one's a more cut and dry decision It just seems like The Blazers are back to square one They're back to where they were last offseason And the two before that Where we know that what they have works To a certain degree

But can I get past what it already is? I think for me, when you're looking at where Portland is and where they want to go, it's almost like you don't even worry. It's like you go even beyond like rosters. It's like, like, I've got Dame. Can Dame convince someone else to come play with him in Portland's? And if he can, well, then we'll move players, move contracts, we'll trade picks. We'll get off guys.

Like, could Dame talk to Jimmy Butler and say, come play in Portland? I don't know if that would work. But that's what has to happen. He has to convince a star to can play with him. Or maybe like, Kauai. Dane meets another player like that. How are they going to get him? I don't know.

I guess if you're an optimist, you look at some of the progress that Zach Collins has made. I mean, I love me some Zach Collins. I mean, no question about it. But like, for it's really, it's like can Zach Collins become the trade piece that gets? Like when a Jimmy Bullard becomes available or when a Kauai becomes available in a trade, if you're a Portland realistically, you're never going to get those guys to come. You've got a trade for them. You've got to figure out a way to get like package like CJ Zach Collins and like Anthony Simons and try to go after a star.

That's not bad. I mean, it's a package. And I think for up until. then you could tread water with like a Collins, Nurkich front court. It doesn't seem like a Minu is like, he might come back, but they do have some luxury tax concerns. Yeah, they got a real, like, weird cap situation coming up. Yeah, and then Rodney Hood is another guy who, if, if you really want to invest some of the few dollars that you have available to you, do you want to like pat out your wing, especially the way that both Aminu and Harkless shot during this postseason?

I think it's an interesting conversation to had there. I don't know. I mean, Cantor is another guy they could bring back. I am, I am optimistic that if Nurkish, can get back in there and you're looking at a Nurkich Collins front court, I don't think they lose that much. I think there's a lot of cynicism and pessimism around what the Blazers can be next season,

but it does feel like they've baked in some escape valves into what they already have. Yes, they are capped out and if Lillard is making 35% of your cap, if C.J. McCollum, is he making Max? He's making close to Max. I think he's up for an extension too, if they want to give him one.

So, they keep paying, their guys money. And on the one hand, that's just a direct route to never really changing what they have. But what they have works, it's just they need to,

they need to strike gold on the fringes, which like you could say for most teams. Like, and until then, don't you just want to like win basketball? Like, look what Dame did this postseason.

Yeah, he ran out of gas eventually. But he gave you the most iconic moment in recent playoff history. Yeah. Well, it's one of those things, too, where like you see, just like how rare it is because of the conference finals for most teams.

And like, think about how, think about like, Dame had to hit that shot against Oklahoma City. They had to have the game seven against Denver just to get to the conference finals. And we were talking about with the Raptors how, like, this was Mark Asall. This is the biggest game of his career.

And you think, oh, well, he's been around forever, but he's been on a lot of good teams. I made the conference finals once. And then he was swept that conference finals. But I forget who it was. But like, that's how, like, you get to game five, game six, game seven, to the conference finals.

Like, that's such a rare thing. Was it so much? It was the Thunder, I think. No, the Thunder, maybe. No, it might have been the Spurs. Yeah, it might have been the year when they went to the finals and beat the heat. I love that Grizzlies team, though.

Yeah, that was the year that Westbrook got hurt and got in the conference finals. That's right. That's the thing is like, unless your team has like multiple superstars, like the Warriors, it's a given, they're going to make that far. Most teams, everything has to go right. Yeah. Well, look at the Grizzlies.

That Grizzlies team is an interesting parallel to what the Blazers have. they didn't get farther than that one conference finals, sure. But we kind of revere that team in what they built and what they meant to like, even not just Memphis and Memphis basketball, but just like the NBA at large. They really defined a certain era.

Yeah, I mean, they were like, they like stood in as like the last of a dying breed. Like you're going to remember them. And I think too, like with all these teams, like if you just create a team that gets to playoffs for a bunch of years and has big series, that's what you remember down the line. Like that's where you make. You know, there's a playoffs.

Everyone's paying attention to you. Yeah. I mean, I think if you were to ask a Blazers fan, they would say all that extra money and perhaps not having that much more of a ceiling is worth it when you have moments like these. I guess you're a thing to keep in mind, so Paul Allen died this year.

Paul Allen, that the Blazers owner, he was always one of the most, he did not mind spending a bunch of money. If you go to Paul Allen and say, I'm going to pay $250 million to Allen Crabb, Myers, Leonard, Evan Turner. And he said, all right, let's do it. We're going to make this team.

Most owners would be like, like, few owners will pay the luxury tax. Now Paul Allen's died. His sister runs a team in absentia. She doesn't seem like he's a very committed owner. So that obviously is something really interesting to watch. And it's like you forget the value of an owner for these kind of organizations, but you've got to spend money to compete.

Especially like, if you don't spend money, you're just a little Martin for air. You make one mistake and there's no chance. I mean, you remember like Dame Demand to talk to Paul Allen about the last year? What about Will Barton? Yeah, he was like, what happened to my trade? why did you trade my guy Will Barton, right? It's like the owner does matter on a certain level. And so for Portland, that's something else to watch is how does that, how does that affect, if

team ends up getting sold, how does that affect everything? Like, you look at Houston, the guy for Tita bought this year and cut payroll a lot, and that changed everything for them. Yeah, they had to dodge the luxury tax, although they, I don't think they've ever admitted it, but it seemed like pretty clearly. Yeah, we can like follow the transaction. It's not hard to figure it out. Menevers, yeah, you don't give up a first round pick to get off of Brandon Knight's contract

unless you want to dodge some luxury tax payments. Yeah, so it's a lot of it's just. It's interesting to see that. I'm a believer, but I guess we'll find out. Any other kind of takeaways from these three teams? Are there any guys that you particularly objected to, either making that spot or perhaps not being on the first team? The one that jumps out to me is,

after watching Kauai Leonard in this playoffs, the fact that he did not make first team, and Paul George did. I mean, I get it because Kawhi only played like 60 games this year. But to me, like, having George over KD, I just feel like, what are we even doing here? Is the anyone think Polar's better than Kevin Durant? Kevin Durant was incredible this year.

He was like averaging career high and assists. He was carrying the Warriors and stuff was out. Like he was a two-way player. He's seven feet tall. He's just better than Paul George. That's me with these awards sometimes. I'm like, well, who even cares? Yeah.

Well, that's the kind of question that all NBA begs. Is it a snapshot of this season? Or should it be who we think is the best at this time? I know some people look at MVP as that sort of voting as, based that on specifically how that player did this season, what he meant to his team. This is more about, is he the best at his position? And it's really hard, as you mentioned, to vote against Kevin Durant. Yeah.

Especially considering what he did before he got hurt here. What I thought was interesting is that there weren't a lot of disagreements in the voting. It seemed like there was pretty clear-cut options. And though perhaps like maybe you would have Kauai in the first line and someone would probably have him on the second, all of the 15 guys were widely agreed upon, it seemed like the only spot where there was some sort of disagreement was on those last two guard spots. Obviously, Clay Thompson did not take his rejection

to not making the third team all that well. I mean, I guess that's another thing, too, talk about big implications. It's saving Golden State so much money. Because it's saving them a super max for Clay. That's actually not I think about really big because that changes like their long-term payrolls situation a lot.

Like, that's like, because they're in the repeater tax, so extra $30 million, $30 million is like $60 million. It's so weird how that way it's like the warriors are probably celebrating their butt off today. The guys in the front office and ownership. Yeah. And I mean, Draymond, he memorably said that he was going to go for a supermax. He didn't get defensive player of the year, so that's not happening now for him.

He did not get a defensive player of the year. He did not get all NBA. But that was like, so they're checking off all these extra payments, which, considering that they're moving across the bay and opening the Chase Center, they don't need any of this money, they're going to print money. And if they aren't already, they're going to print more of it pretty soon. But they are kind of getting off here. And I think, too, like what we were saying, like, what are we doing here? Like, with Clay, like, to me, there's not, there's not six guards who are they having a playoff series than Clay. There's like two or three, like consistently

every year. Like, Clay had some quote where he was like, you know, if you go to the finals every year, you can't have two or three guys. You've got to have a lot of really good players on your team. And I feel like Clay's value to a winning team is so much higher than, like, like, like, Like Westbrook, even, or I mean, just like what Clay brings to a court in a playoff series is so valuable. To me, he's like a super Malcolm Brogner. Can I say, can I give higher praise? I don't know if that's praise, but I guess if you made it this far on the podcast, it should seem. We're just talking to ourselves here, Justin.

Let's be real. No, you're right. There aren't six guards better than Clayton. He didn't even finish better than Bradley Beale. I think it's interesting because, so the real advantage the Warriors have in Key, him now is just that extra fifth year. Otherwise, the money is similar enough. So it does open the door if he did ever want to consider playing on his own team, seeing what it would be like to be his own Bradley Beale and name a team, Dallas, for instance, I do wonder that the, the, the, the,

it's a more level playing field. I would think if he'd go somewhere, be the Lakers. And he could be like playing off LeBron and LeBron could be, I'll just feed you open shots all the time. pretty interesting situation because LeBron is only going to be LeBron for another year. Maybe he's not that already. I wonder. The team is yours and yet you get to play with a young supporting cast

that will see what they become, but like that's the building of something. You can at the very least turn it into something in a trade and you still have LeBron orchestrating it and perhaps you could sell him or he can sell you on being that guy. There's reports today that we saw that he's already recruiting Jimmy Butler

for that. same sort of situation. You know, LeBron's blowing up texts all over, wherever he can get to come in here. Well, he did show up at the practice facility the other day for the Frank Fogle press conference. And as Brian Winhor said, I believe on just like a video clip on ESPN, that like that is a pretty big deal for LeBron. He doesn't typically show up in these sorts of situation. He doesn't make his presence known one. And just by being there, he is sending a message both to the organization.

perhaps to the world at large that he's willing to play more of a role in bringing this team up. Now, the flip side of that is he better because I don't know what else you're selling to free agents other than perhaps being like his next guy and feeding off of him and still

reaping the notoriety perhaps. Well, that's what Magic said. That thought all the things he was saying was the one where he's like, hey, never cut anyone out. You put LeBron in a room with someone. He can like convince him. It's like, what is like LeBron's selling point now?

like, how is she going to bring? Can he bring a younger start to come and play with him? Like, can he, like, sell it on being, I'm the older guy. I'm the mentor. I'll play off you. And it's like, this is like his chance. Where Kobe in the end of his Lakers career was, I'm still the best player. I want to dominate the ball.

Like, I can't accept being in a smaller role? It's like, can LeBron accept that? Can LeBron convince someone he will take a step back? He will kind of follow in line. Like, LeBron would probably talk to Kauai this summer. Can he convince Kauai that I'll be your number two? I don't know. Well, I mean, if you want to like take advice from anybody on how to build a consistent winner, it's Magic Johnson.

LeBron made third team all-MBA. That's one thing I did want to talk about. I had been advocating for Lamarcus Aldridge, probably the least sexy pick you could ever... I think Bill made that. Bill voted that. He voted Aldridge over Braun. I may have also tweeted this. I don't know if you've been to Twitter.com lately.

But no, I just think considering how few games that LeBron played, I think it was fair to leave him off a team for a guy in Aldridge who was the best player on a playoff team. Yeah, I mean, it's just one of those things. Over time we're voting, like, I can't get too fired out about Lamarckis Aldridge making the team or not making the team.

This is Al Horford last year for All-Star, right? Like, he was the best center on one of the, like, a really good team. And because he's just not all that fun, nobody cares. Well, to me, like, but Aldridge, she doesn't defend like Horford, he doesn't pass like Horford.

Like, Aldridge is a good player. But I don't think he thinks winning that much. He played 81 games for a playoff team. Yeah, but I didn't want to watch a lot of those games. But this is the bizarre thing. Like so many decisions, financial decisions. Anthony Davis did not get as much money as he could because he did not make all NBA one year.

It's happened to a lot of these guys. Bradley Beale will not get as much money as he should for like playing on this like disaster of a team. While John Wall, who won't play next year, most likely is going to make considerably more. It's just like it's insane that it comes down to the media dictating who gets the money, essentially. Well, we don't have any, we don't have any votes.

We can rail on the fake news media for how they're... But like, I mean, if I hear Bradley Beal and you're his agents, like, I better start button up these reporters. I mean, this is direct money out of my pocket, how you're voting. Yeah. So Brian Winhurst also has this quote about how a player could give each voting member

of all MBA, $100,000 and he would still come away with $20 million extra if he were to make the Superman. I will happily be involved implicated in a blogger ethic story about this. I mean, yeah, $100,000 is more to have to buy a few journalists. Let me tell you. More than a few.

You can pretty much buy the industry. I use buy media companies these days for that kind of money. Okay, we're going to wrap it up here with the segment that I have entitled Things I Want Charks's Opinion on. I should have led with this. We should have. So as you could probably tell from the top,

Charks has a lot of interesting takes. One of my favorite things to do is to Slack Chark a topic and just to see his perspective on it. I was eavesdropping on a Danny Chow phone call about our draft guide. I don't know what they were talking about, but it got to the point where it was like, yeah, Charks' opinions don't really conform to traditional,

like what everyone else said. So I don't know if we could do that. And I was like, yes, love Charks. Sure. Sure. Okay. But I do want to get hit some, a wide range of topics here. So who's your favorite prospect in the NBA draft?

We'll start there. I mean, Zion. Zion's so much. It doesn't count. Okay. That's too popular. Oh, to go, we want to go full-hift. I want you to lean into your full self.

Yeah, my, I think to me the most interesting guy in this draft, I mean, Taylor and Tucker, you got like a six-two, 240-pound guard. Okay. And like, is that going to work? It was a seven-foot wingspan. Where does he play? From Iowa State. Okay.

All the big prospects come from Iowa State. They had a good team this year. They were fun to watch. But, like, Horton Tucker is like this. He's like if Eric Gordon was like even bigger, Danny called him a six-four clearance weather spoon, which is like, this is an incredible comp. He's just so much fun to watch.

And it's like, I don't know if this guy's going to make it or not, but I'll be fun to watch like this fat guy trying to jack up shots to make it as little guard. You guys do a lot of great stuff on the corner three podcast. Or I guess these days it's more of the long two. Usually one of us is out with me. A less efficient podcast, but a productive one nonetheless. Okay, so as you probably heard earlier, Charks is a big fan of going smaller.

You have advocated recently for Ben Simmons to be more of a Dremont type that his future is at Small Ball Center. Yeah. You should probably be traded or they should make that happen more within their current construction. So which of these large forwards would not be better as a small ball five? Not be. So we have Ben Simmons. Well, I've already blogged about it. So I can't go back on that now.

It's in blog. It's been solidified. It's on the internet. Pascal Seacum. Ooh, you're spoiling future blogs here, Justin. No one's going to get to this far in the podcast. No, that's true. No, I like to see him at the Five.

That'd be awesome. I think in this series you saw, like, when he's not playing on the ball, I can't shoot well enough. So you've got to keep him involved in the play, which we're using him as the Roleman, which means playing him with the Five. Which we could see as soon as next season. Or as soon as next series,

if they get past the Bucks. We'll see it a lot against the Warriors. Okay, LeBron James. Ooh, maybe that's the end point of his career, right? Right? Yeah. I mean, that's basically what they had, like, drawn up going into the season. They were thinking they were going to do LeBron.

Yeah, LeBron and Coosma at the Five or something. Yeah. Kuzma was the Shane Battier, although they just slid everything down in position. Yeah. So LeBron at the Five, I could see your eyes light up. Well, I think really the guy at the Five is Kevin Durant. The Five. I think that's, if you're going to talk about guys at the Five.

Okay. Like, K.D. Well, with LeBron or just. in general. In general, I could feel like Katie could be like a grade five or like 38.

He kind of already does that, right? I guess Draymond takes all the responsibilities. Yeah. But he is like whenever he wanted to, especially in that Houston series, whenever he wanted to be like a amazing rim projector,

he would just erase Clint Capella. Yeah, I mean, it's really tough. I really feel bad for Katie being injured. He was playing at such a high level. And now he gets injured, the team plays better,

plays great without him. And people are already going to forget how great he was during the season. And it's one of those things where like, yeah, obviously the worst one about Katie. They won 703 games without him. Like, I guess

why are we that surprised that they're playing one without him? And I don't feel like it's a reflection on KD being out, just because like he joined this already great team. So what do you really expect when he's out? Let's go back to what they did before. Right. This one isn't all that interesting because I feel like we were talking about this years ago. This is Blake Griffin.

He is the prototype of this model five, right? He's not much of a rim protection. He needs some like German knees though at this point, you know? It's tough. Right. He needs that Kobe knee thing. Okay. This is my ball here, Carmelo Anthony. Could Carmelo come back?

They tried it in Houston before he got, like, for a while he was their back of five. Well, they also had a lot of other roster issues there. I wonder if, like, he's still a good enough shooter or good enough offensive player. If you could spot him a few minutes. Like, what are the Orlando match? Well, they have too many centers. So that's a bad example. But like, what are the Mavericks doing with their backup five next year?

I mean, I don't know getting to Dwight Powell talk. We can definitely. Dwight Powell opted out. he'll be back. They're going to run Cleber out there. I mean, Carmelo it's over for him, unfortunately. Do you don't like this? Bobby? I saw Bobby's eyes light up when I mentioned Carmelo

Anthony. The other team's eyes would also light up. That's true. Okay, on that note, we're going to call it a night. We will see you next week where we will have an NBA finals to discuss. Charks will be back on the corner three. I will be joined by a ringer

staff for TBD, but Bobby Wagner will always be with me unless it's That's Isaac. We'll catch you next time for Charks, for Bobby. I'm Justin. Basketball is very good. Basketball is very good.