The Ringer NBA Show - Are the Phoenix Suns a Superteam? Plus, Big NBA Offseason Story Lines! | The Answer

Episode Date: June 20, 2023

Seerat and Michael start the pod by sharing their reactions and insights to the blockbuster Bradley Beal trade. They dive into how the deal affects both the Suns and the Wizards and postulate some fake trades to strengthen Phoenix’s top-heavy roster. They end the pod by examining their top story lines heading into free agency and the draft (27:28). The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming, please checkout theringer.com/RG to find out more or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Hosts: Seerat Sohi and Michael Pina Associate Producer: Chris Sutton Production Supervision: Benjamin Cruz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's up everybody? It's Austin Rivers from the Minnesota Timberwolves. It's a new year and I have a new podcast here at the Ringer, Offguard, hosted by me and my guide, Pasha Higigi. Austin and I go way back and talk so much hoop already that we figure those time to fire up the mics and let you in on all of these conversations. Every week, Pasha and I will hit on the biggest stories happening in the league. And get Austin's perspective of someone currently hooping in the NBA. Tap into Offguard every Friday on the Ringer NBA show feed on Spotify or wherever you get your podcast.

Welcome to a pre-draft pre-free agency edition of The Answer. We've got Michael Pina here. We have a Bradley Beal trade that will be doing some of the final reflections on here and thinking about where the suns go from here. And then we've got six NBA storylines that you guys should be paying attention to with the draft coming up. There's a lot to talk about. You know, I feel like the Nuggets.

won a championship about a week ago, and since then, we have pretty much forgotten about them, and we've gone full speed into trade, NBA, free agency draft speculation. But rightfully so, I feel like this Thursday could be bananas. We always say that it could be bananas. But, man, I don't know, I feel like a lot of, I'm just going to be waiting to see what Portland does. I feel like they're kind of the first domino to fall. But first let's get into the Bradley Beal trade. Mike, how's it going? It's going great.

This is our first conversation since the Nuggets won the title, I believe. And I could spend an hour talking about the Nuggets. I love them so much. They're the most enjoyable team to watch. I know that we have to move on, though. We can't linger there. fortunately. So the Bradley Beal trade, that happened on Sunday. And why don't we, I'll just start, I'll just throw first reaction that you had when you saw the news. Were you like taken

aback by the low return? Were you shocked that he went to Phoenix in the first place? Just what was going through your head when you saw the news come across the ticker? I was most taken aback by what has now been characterized as exploding through the second apron of the new CBA. Yeah, that's, that's, that's, that's probably a good place to start. So now I think it's between Aiton, Bradley Beal, Kevin Durant, and Devin Booker. The sons have 161.5 million dollars accounted for in four players. And the, the second apron, which doesn't kick in until next year, but those salaries are going to be even higher next year is 179.5 million. That gives them like less than 20 million to play around with to build the rest of their roster.

And they know that. They know that and they didn't care. And this is like you said coming off the heels of a championship run that was defined by continuity and the chemistry, the incredible chemistry of the Yokic Murray two-man game, which basically was the fuel to, like, this scintillating Nuggets offense. The sons don't care. The sons don't care about continuity. They don't care about the new CBA.

They wanted to build their super team. And if there's anything that NBA history tells us, it's that when you have a magnetic superstar who wants to build a super team and you have a, like, a third star that wants to leave their team, they can just leave. Like, Bradley B. turn the no clause, the no trade clause that he got, basically incentivizing him to stay into a power move that allowed the sons to basically get Beal for pennies on a dollar.

But you wrote about the return. I agree with you. I don't think it's, I think it was to be expected. But yeah, like, tell us about what you wrote this morning. Yeah. So from Washington's perspective, I thought that they were somewhat unfairly criticized for, getting back, no first round picks, Chris Paul's expiring and Landry Shamitz's non-guaranteed contract. And I understood the outrage from the perspective of the Washington Wizards were, I mean,

this was just a delayed transaction, right? A delayed blockbuster. They should have made it, they could have made it in 2019 when John Wall was on the $170 million max deal and he tore his Achilles. And it was like, okay, what are we doing here? Like, are we, we're not going to be good for a long time and we're already in Capel. So maybe we should move off of Bradley Beale and see what we can get for him, which would have been a lot. Instead, they kept him signed this two-year $71 million extension, basically kicking the can down the road. and then they were bad in all of those years. And eventually, Beale signs the $251 million max extension last year with the no trade clause,

which was the worst, in my opinion, the worst, by far the worst contract in the league, but one of the most destabilizing contracts in NBA history. And to get a no trade clause, there's a lot of different things you need to qualify. in terms of how many years you're in the league, how many years you're on the same team, et cetera. Some of the best players in league history have gotten them. Steph Curry wanted one a few years ago. The Golden State Warriors would not give it to him

to kind of contextualize how rare this is. And when you gave it to him, when Washington gave it to him when they acquiesced, they found themselves in a situation where they couldn't trade him for whatever they wanted or put him on the market to the highest bidder. He got to pick where he wanted to go. He got to pick more importantly what pieces could be involved and not involved in the trade,

which I think is kind of an un-talked about or an overlooked element of this where it's like if he wanted to play with, let's say the Wizards wanted DeAndre Aiton, which I don't think they would have. But let's say they wanted DeAndre Aiton in the trade instead of Chris Paul. But Bradley Biel wants to play with DeAundre Aten. Andrei Aiton, there's no deal because he can just no trade it. So just a totally terrible, embarrassing, humiliating, comical perk of Bradley Beale's contract that I don't think we'll ever see again. And it led us to the situation where they only get back what they got back. But I feel like if you're Washington, getting off that contract without having to give a draft equity.

without having to take back long-term salary was great. It's a, you know, rip the Band-Aid off, fresh start for the Wizards. I think that they should be really excited about, I mean, it's, I don't know, relatively speaking, they should be excited about where they are, which is probably the worst team in the league next season. But that's wonderful. It's better than just perennially being the eight seed and having that be as good as you can get or keeping Beal, resigning Kuzma,

extending Chris Staps for Zing. It's like that would just be way worse than the situation that they're in right now. So I think that Wizards fans who are frustrated have a right to be because this transaction should have happened a while ago, but better late than never, I think. And it's good that they got off this contract.

So a round of applause to Michael Winger, new president of the Washington Wizards and the new front office. there. But I feel like, even though I wrote about the Wizards, they're like not as interesting at all to talk about here. Like, we should be talking more about the Phoenix Suns and how good that. So, like, my question to you, just like, Durant, Booker, Beal, and, well, for right now, we'll say Aidan, because he's technically on the team, although I can totally see a trade coming in the future to kind of alleviate the tax bill. And then also.

fill out the roster with more necessary pieces. But just those four players, I guess, like, is that enough to beat the Nuggets? Do you think? Is that enough to win the NBA title? I think it comes down to who you put around those guys. So they can resign most of the guys that they have on the roster using bird rights right now,

which is I think what they will do because one of the things that is part of this Sun strategy with going over the second apron is that, well, let's go through some of the things that they can't do now. They can't aggregate salaries into a trade, meaning, I mean, not that they have that many salaries to aggregate, which is, there's a funny irony to the sun's floating the second apron because a lot of its consequences aren't necessarily things that they are going to care about moving forward, such as that. they can't use their non-taxpayer mid-level which will that's that's one that they should care about

they can't trade their a 2031 first round pick considering that that that is like the only pick that in 2030 are like the only picks that they have or will have at their disposal it's probably good I feel like the NBA might be saving them from theirs from themselves a little bit

that pick the biggest consequence is probably going to be that year when, you know, in the likelihood that this son's team that never wins a title, you might be looking at 2031, who knows what that team looks like. Probably none of these guys now will be on it. Them bottoming out and then having to pick in the bottom of the draft, because that's what happens to that pick if you stay above the apron for three out of five consecutive years, which these guys do not seem at all concerned about.

Because the other thing is in four years, those four deals that we talked about are going to be worth $200 million. So me personally, I don't see, I don't see Aiton being traded right now. I mean, it could happen. We can go through some of the deals for him, but he's kind of at an all-time low in terms of trade value. And they have a new coaching staff coming in. Obviously, him and Monty Williams for the last two years or so, just haven't been able to see eye to eye. there was a hilarious play in the in the amazing highlight reel that was the quote tweets to the tweet that was like this was the funniest NBA season ever not going to lie I don't know if you saw that but eight and just standing so good

aaten standing there while Kevin Durant is just fighting for his life to get a rebound which I put a pin in next I want to talk about that at some point it's a bad time for Eaton's trade value And it is kind of the perfect moment for him to try to refurbish it for furbishop his career. I would hope that playing with three stars is somewhat motivating. Obviously, it, you know, marginalizes his role even more. And you need him to, you know, double down on rim protection and rebounding and setting screens. I don't know if he will do those things. If he does do those things, he becomes a lot more valuable. And maybe you eventually probably have to trade him down the line no matter what.

what I just kind of I could see them going with him this year signing resigning the guys that they have and they're trying to pick up some some guys with with minimum deals you know like there are the the Tristan Thompson's the the Dwayne Dedman's of the world to to help back you up they're probably try to bring back Beombo um so yeah that's all that said to answer your question um I don't think this makes a title team look I don't think anyone's beating the Denver Nuggets like Like if the Nuggets stay healthy, that team is, it's a juggernaut. Like, what are we talking about? Are they win 16 and 4 in the playoffs?

What was their net rating? Like, plus 8. They have the best player in the world. And what I love about the argument that you can just add ring chasers if you're Phoenix, vet men contracts. If you're a ring chaser, why would you go to Phoenix when you could go to Denver? Like, that's a question that I have. Like I would much rather play with Nicola Yokic on one year.

And he'll probably boost my value and make me look better than I am. And then I can go get more money on the market the following off season. But I think this team will be, I think Phoenix will be very good if they stay healthy, which is a big if, I think, considering the injury history with KD, with Beal, who's missed like 74 of the last 74 games over the past, only played in 74 games in the past two seasons. And Booker, who seems to always have a soft tissue injury that keeps him out for extended time. If they stay healthy, like, I think the offense will obviously be amazing.

I think they'll have to shoot more threes. And I think that they'll, you know, have a spaced floor. They can do the ISO thing where, similar to what the Brooklyn. that Nets did a few years ago where basically you just isolate as much as possible, draw two, kick to the open man, wide open three, wide open three, wide open three. That could just be their offense where I think that they really fall short. You're going to be like the new Bruce Brown, basically. Yeah, exactly. Defense is just like a huge question mark for me. Like, Frank Fogle, awesome coach won the title in 2020, had Anthony Davis. This,

team does not have Anthony Davis. DeAndre Aiton is not Anthony Davis. So even if you were to keep him, I, who is the wing stopper on this team? Like who is, let's see, let's say you're in a playoff series against the healthy clippers, Lord willing, we get to see that happen. Who's guarding Kauai? Who's guarding Paul George? Who's guarding Russell Westbrook if he's there? You know what I mean? I just, because we know Devin Booker couldn't do it in the playoffs this year. So it's probably going to be Booker. Yeah. And that's not the answer. I mean, that's just, where it is not fair to him either in my opinion.

I'm not saying he's a terrible defender. It's just not fair to him. No, Devin Booker is a good defender. We have to get over this. He's okay. I think he's a good defender. He is a more than okay defender, especially in the postseason.

I don't think that means, I don't think that makes you being able to guard Kauai Leonard. But we have like, we now have like three seasons of sample size proof that Devin Booker is above average on defense. and I just think that we need to collectively get over this. It's like, it's kind of like, you know, like sometimes superstar players, what happens is a narrative builds around their defense.

And we just never get over it. But every once in a while, there's a person who's willing to tell the truth, you know, sometimes in the form of just a really, really biting column with some really good stats comparing them to, you know, perhaps a rival MVP candidates for him protection. I'm just saying, I'm just, I try to follow in the footsteps of people who inspire me. Okay, I've carried that bit on far too long. My point is books above average. But the issue, and this is an issue that, you know,

I want to get into it probably more so with Kevin Durant, is that he's going to also be asked to be the, I mean, at this point, the primary playmaker on this team. He's now the best playmaker on, you know, a post-CP3 trade. Right now, they're looking at starting campaign at the point guard slot. I don't think that necessarily is a viable long-term solution with all due respect to campaign. But he's, yeah, he's going to have a huge offensive load. And so is Durant.

And I think the thing that has made super teams work in the past is a level of self-sacrifice and adaptability that I don't think I, see enough in these three guys. I just don't think that they necessarily have the skill set for it. Kevin Durant comes closest, right? Like, we have seen him, you know, fight for his life for rebounds. We have seen him be a rim protector. He's a true seven-footer. He can guard three to five in a lot of scenarios.

And it kind of reminds me a little bit of maybe, and I wrote about this this morning, but like of a Chris Bosch type role, you know, in Miami's Big Three, like where he had to be the self-sacrificial guy and do a lot more of the dirty work. Because the irony with having a super team is it actually, because of the way that the roster has to be built from there out, it requires a lot from the stars, like a lot. And we just, I don't know if at this juncture you brought up the injuries,

if that's the type of load that you can put on 34 years. old Kevin Durant, right? That you can put on Devin Booker who's going to be asked to probably be the number one scorer on this team. And it's just not, frankly, something we've ever seen from Bradley Beal, who I think, you know, if she really goes for it, I think he can be an average defender. But that's not necessarily saying much, right? So this team just really badly needs, this is what they've always needed.

They needed rebounding. They needed a little bit of toughness. they needed a little bit of room protection. Like these were the issues after the Nugget series, right? And yeah, they got Bradley Beal, but they haven't really mitigated any of the, and the bench, you know, like, man, Kevin Durant was playing crazy minutes. Like the book and Katie were playing crazy minutes. CP3 gets hurt.

That's it, right? That's, yeah, like that's a net story too. And that would not surprise me if that was the Sun story. Like, I don't think you can necessarily just put three guys together and say, okay, we're going to make it work. Like you have to have very specific characteristics. You have to have just a lot. Yeah, these guys are all the same in what makes them really great.

And I don't know. I just don't know where you get like that yang. Yeah. I think that there's for sure positional overlap and skill set overlap that is not exactly what you want. It's not the most complimentary big three. It's not ideal like you said with Wade, LeBron and Bosch or even LeBron, Kyrie and Love or KG, Pearson, Ray Allen.

That's like the ideal big threes. I do think they'll be fine. Like, I think Beal is willing and able to operate off the ball. You can say the same about KD and Devin Booker, who, by the way,

this is a different conversation, but I think Devin Booker might be the best player on this team. Is that a crazy take? Is he, is that insane? No, I don't think that's a great. No. He was the best player in the playoffs. Yeah, I think he had the best playoff performance. He was the most consistent. He's an above average defender. There you go. The list keeps going. So I think that they, you know, anytime you have just even a debate where Kevin Dren is your second best player,

like you're in a pretty good situation. But for me, the depth issue is so glaring where if KD, you know, tweaks his knee as he does every single season and misses 20 plus games nowadays, if Booker misses 20 plus games with a sprained ankle, if Beal misses whatever, you know what I mean? Like, I honestly think that this team is closer to the play in than the NBA finals. Like I just, I think surviving the rigors of an NBA regular season, 82 games is not even, easy and you need depth. Like, that's an important thing. Trying to get that pull quote.

Trying to get that pull quote. Let's go. It's just, I'm not trying to be salacious here. I just think, honestly, like, when we talk about the CBA killing, the super team, it's like, okay, you can get three superstars, but like, you don't have anything else. And it really hurts. So I think this brings us to the need to eventually trade D'Andre Aiton. I have one fake trade, fake DeAndre Aten trade that I think works.

Should I lay it on you? Yeah. Okay. DeAndre Aiton to the Dallas Mavericks for Javelle McGee, Tim Hardaway Jr., and Reggie Bullock. That's the trade. And then Javele McGee is your starting five, your rent protection through It was a course of four playoff rounds.

Javail McGee is your starting five with... I would start Biombo. Sure, you got Beambo, Joccalandale, and McGee. Those are your centers to deal with Nicola Yokic in the eventual playoff series there. But, I mean, the reason that you do this, obviously, is just like, we need supplementary pieces on the wings and forwards and three-point shooters and all. Like, Tori Craig, God bless him, shot the lights out in the first round. to Clippers and then just absolutely dropped off the face of the earth in round two, because that's Tori Craig.

Like, I think you need more talent, backing up Booker and KD and Bradley Beale. So what do you think about that trade? I like it. I like it. You bring back Javille, too, and I think that there's also the opportunity to really, really piss off Aiton by bringing back his backup, who at times when Ayn was out that, like, at the two of a year. a year ago, like, because his numbers were often similar, because he could also catch lobs or a lot of people that were like, hey, what's really the difference between these two guys? I think it's a lot more nuanced than that, but that would be for, you know, just a, just a little C plot to that trade.

Can I throw one at you? Yes, please. So this one's tricky because you need both these players are free agents, so you need them both to be, want to join this team. But I think, think you could actually make the sons into a contender and you can get pretty close to the salaries that they would demand in the open market. But Fred Van Fleet and Yaka-Purdle double sign and trade for DeAndre Aiton, like if Fred's going to walk anyway and Fred signed with clutch and he opted out of his deal and the guy wants the bag. If he's going to leave anyway. Then I feel like the Raptors who have been linked to eight in the past, that's a pretty good consolation prize. And the sons get their starting point card. They still have, like,

they commit a lot of salary to those guys, but you have your starting five at that point. And that's maybe the best starting five in the NBA. And not second best, second best starting five in the NBA. And I don't know. at that moment. Then I'm feeling like, okay, you're kind of locked in. Like, you know what you're doing. You've got some perimeter defense. You've got some shooting. You have your rim protector. And probably two salaries that you won't be able to aggregate in the future, but are more tradable. I, I love it for Phoenix. Of course. How could you not? Why would, so Toronto's doing this because they just don't want to.

to lose Fred. Yeah, it's like when you take back DeAngelo Russell, because Kevin Durant's going to leave. Yeah. Okay. I think it's fascinating. I do think that that would be the best starting five in the league. Like, maybe easily. Like, I know I love Denver, of course, those are the homies.

but Fred, Booker, Beal, KD at the 4 and Yacobirtle, who is amazing and super underrated at the 5, that's just an incredible group right there. I, wow, that's a lot better than my trade, I think. So congratulations to you. I think you beat me. I like your trade. I like your trade.

I have a couple more. Please. The one that I threw you through you is by far my favorite. There are the, there's like the perpetual John Collins, you change, like change of scenery. Collins, DeAndre Hunter, trade. I wouldn't mind that. That shores up your wing defense.

You get a little bit younger. Maybe you can actually run a little bit. I think Collins on offense basically plays the Aiden role while also being able to space the floor a little bit. It takes him back to his. natural position. He's a plus defender. Makes you smaller than I'd like. That's the only thing I don't like about it if you're the sons.

But, you know, and if you're the hawks, it's kind of like, all right, let's see how this goes with Trey, right? Like, let's see what happens when, you know, you throw a guy in there who's probably a better defender. And it also makes Capella a little bit more expendable. I've also seen people talk about a deal like this with Capella instead of Collins. then you'd have to do some stuff to make the money work, though. Can we just play Capella, Aiton, and Akunga at the same time and see what happens? Like that would be... I would do it.

Yeah, let's go. You know what? Quinn Snyder's a genius. Maybe he's smarter than the rest of us. I want to see that lineup, honestly. That would be great stuff. That'd be fun. And you could get...

There's like no, there's no spacing and are you still starting Murray? It's like this is like the how to get Tray Young to ask out lineup. That's a great way to put it. I like that framing. So we want to talk about the, we each are bringing three for a total of six because there's two of us. Offseason, storylines, players, teams, free agents, etc. that we're most interested in talking about.

And I mean, I guess I spilled the beans on who one of mine is. So I'm just going to start right there. But Fred Van Fleet, I've been fascinated with his situation for a long time. I think he's a tad overrated, if you really want to look at his numbers and break down just how an efficient he was shooting the ball this past season and his age and his size, etc. But he's also just awesome. And the exact type of floor general, so many really good teams need. And also so many teams that are trying to ascend and trying to get to the next level. I think he can be a missing piece for them there.

Like, for example, the Houston Rockets would be a really good Fred Van Fleet team. The San Antonio Spurs would be a really, really good Fred Van Flee team. And I hope he goes there. I think that would be just awesome stuff. And I would look forward to the Spurs just beating the Sons and the play-in and just making the playoffs in year one. That would just be really good theater, I think. half that was half a joke i hope nobody um breaks that one out but uh fred's great uh sign and trade to as you mentioned the sons i don't know how realistic that is but it would be amazing a sign

and trade to the clippers if he really wants to go to the clippers or the lakers etc like fred van fleets really good at what he is and he'll be expensive but i'm just fascinated to see what team he ends up on because i think yeah his day's in Toronto are probably, probably over. You mentioned Houston. That's actually one of the teams that I have. Houston's crazy. Houston's crazy.

They can go in so many directions. I love it. So they basically, in order to meet the salary floor, which if you don't meet the salary floor and the new CBA, the fines are going to be greater for that, which I think kind of, you know, it balances out sort of some of the worry about what's going to happen to the NBA's middle class. They're all going to go to, you know, Houston, San Antonio, Oklahoma, you know, all these, all these teams that are rebuilding, but are going to have to sign guys.

But Houston, unlike some of these other teams, like, they seem very, they are enthusiastic to sign guys. Fred could be one of them. That would kind of, that would be interesting. It kind of takes KPJ off the ball. Jalen Green moves to the three. I don't, I don't know. And like, it looks like they want to take Aymon Thompson. as well. So it's everything in

Houston right now is super murky, which is kind of why they're a team that I want to watch. But the thing that I keep kind of going back to them is like, I know that, I know they signed Amy Oduca. I know Oduca is going to want to compete for, you know, not tanking, right? Like they're going to want to take the next step forward. I don't think this team is there though. I just don't see anything to suggest that they're ready to take the leap forward. Sengu is awesome. Apparently he's gotten taller. So the baby Yokic stuff is, you know, it's just going to get louder and louder.

I love it. I love it so much. I love Shangoon. He's the best. He's so great. He's so great. He's, I think he's easily the best prospect that they have. I think he's the type of player that you can build around eventually.

But, you know, you also want to start treating him like, okay, like, you know, we just saw what happened in the playoffs with the Nuggets. We could genuinely do something special here. Let's not rush it and basically start throwing the world at Jailen. Brown and start throwing the world at Fred Van Vlee, you got to sign somebody. I mean, honestly, Jalen is probably the best choice to throw that money out because he's going to be the most valuable contract. But you don't think so? Jalen Brown?

Yeah. Well, he's under contract. Let's not, you know, I know our coming at my guy right now and it's hurting my feelings a little bit. Oh, that's why you made that face. Okay. Sorry. My bad.

My bad. I thought it was because he'd disagree. great. I was going to, I was interested. No, Jalen's great. Jalen's great. To your point, I think, like,

are you, are you pro them throwing money at James Harden or are you like, stay away for the love of God? Why are you in the Kyrie Irving sweepstakes at all? Why am I ever reading your name next to Kyrie Irving? You have a bunch of young players on your team. And like,

God, they, if anything, they need more discipline. Like, yeah, so sign veterans. Yeah, sign veterans, but sign the Like guys, go after like, I don't know, go after Brooke Lopez or something. Like, get some guys in there that are professionals that will be a good example. And just realize that you are not anywhere near where you need to be in order to actually make a leap. Like they're at least like Jalen Green started showing some stuff towards the end of the year.

He got a lot more efficient. He started getting to the line. Let's see more of that. But like, let's, I just don't know why they're rushing the process here. When they have one of the best young cores in the league, I just don't get it. Like, they're not, it's just like they need, they need so much more time in the oven. I, I agree. It's just like, how do you know who is worth being patient with?

Like, if I'm them, I'm like out of the Kevin Porter Jr. business. I just don't think he's very good. And the way he plays is just not winning basketball. And he sours Shangoon. Like, Shangoon should have the ball in his hands the most out of of anyone on the team. He's their best player. Play through him at the top of the key, like the Nuggets did with Yokic in his second and third season and take advantage of his

passing and invert the floor. That's what I would do. And that makes it seem like, you know, I think obviously Jabari fits and you don't give up on him yet. But like Jalen Green, what's going on there? Can Jailen Green be a winning player next to Shangoon and just how we want to play. So I love like Brooke Lopez bring him in. That's a really awesome call. Um, you know, give Chris Middell. Give Chris Middleton a physical. See, hey, how is that me doing? You want to come through here? We will give you the max. That might be a mistake. It would not be on the timeline of anything. But like you said, like they want to. Well, it doesn't matter though. You're not going to, you know, like you might as well as a throw at him. You're still in the cap. 100%. 100%.

Got to spend that money. And also, like, I think they're, what's there, 2024 draft pick is top four protected going to the Thunder, I believe. So, like, they have an incentive to win right now. Their ownership wants to win. And, yeah, just throw money at veterans like that, who makes sense. And also, yes, another great name, 100%. So they're fascinating.

Really good call by you. Can I throw out my next team slash player who I am interested in? Cam Johnson, restricted free agent for the Brooklyn Nets. He is a lot older than I think a lot of people realize, 27 years old. I don't know how much more upside there is with him. but I look at the contracts that Jordan Poole just got, that Tyler Hero just got, and the age is the age difference there,

so I get that, but I would much rather pay, if I was Cam Johnson's representation, I'd be like, this guy's worth this if you're willing to pay Tyler Hero this. Are you shaking your head at me? What do you think? Whoa.

Well, like, not to, I don't want to be the person who goes back and says it was smart to pay Jordan Poole all that money. But the thing that folks are guys is that they can create their own shot. And that is very valuable in this league. And Cam Johnson cannot. And he might be a high level role player. And he like, of the high, he's a role player of the highest order. And I don't hate to, I don't, I don't hate to step back. But he's not that guy.

And I think it just puts him at a salary. grade, that's just a little bit below that. That's just how it goes. It might be smarter. I really like the point that you're making. And I think his agent should make that point. I don't know how well it'll go over, though. But that does make him a really interesting guy.

I think he's a higher value guy than probably most people look at him as. There are teams that are not very good that want to be good this season that have a lot of cap space. and I'm like make the Brooklyn Nets match, which they don't really want to do on a high... Like, I would have no problem paying that much money to Cam Johnson, honestly, if I was the Detroit Pistons. If I was the Rockets, like we were just talking about, he just fits, if I was the Spurs, even,

he just fits in any style of play, knock down three-point, one of the best three-point shooters in the league, has shown he can show up in the playoffs, guards multiple positions, no nonsense, there's no off-court issues. He's fine with his role. I think he has a little more off-the-bounce dynamism than you might be getting him credit for.

I'm not saying he is Jordan Poole or Tyler Hero in that department. Floor's nice too. You're right. Absolutely. So I just, I like him a lot. He's still the ideal role player in the NBA. And if you've got money to spend, might as well try to get this dude, in my opinion.

So he's just fascinating to me and where he ends up. I could see like four years 98. Okay, sure. I could see that. I might go higher. Yeah. I could totally see him busting through to 100. I don't even know.

I'm just going to throw 115 mil over four years. Like that would not shock me at all. I could see that too. He could see that too. He's only 31 at the end of that deal. Mm-hmm. Yeah, making around the $30 million at the end of that deal. Like that's not bad.

That's not bad. I think it's weird. It's tough for a contender, but like these teams that you mentioned, he is a fit. I like, yeah. I think you might have convinced me. Yay. Okay. So who do you have next?

Okay. I have, the next team I have is the Oklahoma City Thunder, who are not a team that we've been talking about a lot in free agency. But I think they're in a really interesting spot. So one of the things I've been kind of looking at, trying to figure out how teams could possibly get around the second apron stuff, like other than the way that the suns are doing it, which is just by not caring about it.

I don't think that the Thunder, the type of team that are going to want to relinquish that type of roster flexibility, which I think, like, I mean, I think most, most teams will end up being,

you know, feeling that way about it. But I think one of the ways to get around it is if you have young stars in low, that don't take up too much cap space, then you can bring in somebody else. And the thunders. are in a really interesting spot right now.

So Shea is locked up and the end of his deal is 26, 2027 where he's going to make $40 million. That's a bargain in this new climate. Oh, yeah, it is. Dort is locked up until then, too. He makes $17 million. Another bargain. I think OKC's been really smart about getting a lot of their guys signed early,

believing in them. and, you know, they're just chock full of team-friendly contracts. Eventually, the cap, like the second apron stuff is going to be an issue for them. They obviously, they have Chet. We'll see what he is. Giddy, Jalen Williams. If everything pans out, a lot of those guys are going to be demanding near max level money. We'll see who amongst those guys ends up being on that level.

They probably won't be able to keep all of them. But the thing is, Giddy's extension eligible next summer, J-dub the summer after that, neither of those deals would kick in until 2026, 27, which means that right now, they have 99 million in cap space, by the way. They have to get to 120. That's a salary floor. And right now, they have this four-year window where they could try to sign a guy to a max contract. And get close to a max.

at least, and keep them and have it not hurt their ability to sign their young guys in the future. And I think it would have to be the right guy. The guy I was looking at before was Bradley, well, it's not Bradley Beer, was Chris Middleton if, if the, the wizard sent Beale to the bucks. But I think that he's going to end up being back in Milwaukee. Jeremy Grant, bring him back home. He's one guy. Cam Johnson.

You got the culture fit with him too. The one that just to troll that I love, but also kind of works because he would fit really well in their offense. He's a young player. Pardon? No. Bring him back home. Young guy, bring him back. He can initiate offense.

He loves driving. to the rim. They're a big dribble drive team. Uh, you're probably not going to be able to keep him. Uh, the team that has his rights will probably match it. But just throw everything at Austin Reeves.

Throw everything. Oh my God. Can I just say, I was so certain you were about to say Russell Westbrook. You started saying dribble drive attacks. I was just like, she's going to say, when you said the troll move,

I was like, it's either Hardin or it's Westbrook. But I, Austin Reeves. fascinating. Throw all the money. I hope someone throws all the money at Austin Reeves so that the Lakers have to match.

That would be a good theater. Yeah, it'd be fun. It'd be fun. But the other, I mean, they're also another good, uh, Brooke Lopez destination. I think that would make a lot of sense. Give some insurance against Chet.

You know, you don't necessarily want him taking on every five man in the NBA. They obviously have room protection issues last year. They had rebounding issues last year. They had spacing issues last year. Be a good guy for him to learn from too. But yeah, I think the Thunder,

I mean, the Thunder have to spend some, money. They had a great showing in the play in. There are a ton of interesting directions for them to take. They're like a team that I'd look at and I'm like genuinely no matter what, I'm going to be very excited to watch them next season. What's so interesting about the Thunder is they have, I think like 14 guys under contract. Like it's a roster spot issue where they have to spend money, but does this mean they're going to sacrifice a non-guaranteed deal like Isaiah Joe, who's awesome.

Can't be Isaiah Joe. He's shown too much. He's the best. I love Isaiah Joe. So are you making a consolidation trade of some kind that involves like Poku and Trey Man and is Dort expendable all of a sudden? I don't know. Like maybe not.

Maybe I'm just, you know, pontificating here. But like I think it's interesting how many guys they do have under contract for next season. That's a good point. I have to imagine if there's anybody of their young guys that they look at and say you haven't necessarily shown us enough, it's probably Lindy Waters. But he also hasn't gotten a lot of opportunity either. Door is the one guy that I look at. And while he's easily the best perimeter defender on the team and maybe one of the best perimeter defenders in the NBA, don't love his shot selection. And this is a team that, like, I think could really move the ball really well. But every time it gets into his hands, it just stops. but he does also, he's also one of the guys, like he makes $15 million this coming year and the issue is they need to spend money. So I don't know. Yeah. Either way, these are better problems than most teams deal with.

So speaking of bigs who can shoot and do stuff who would be good with the Thunder, I have a, I have a free agent who is really random. but I'm fascinated to see how much money he gets and where he ends up. And it is Mr. Nasreid, formerly, maybe currently, of the Minnesota Timberwolves. Love Nasreed. I feel like no one is talking about him because he fractured his wrist in, what was it, like, late March or something like that? Right before the playoffs started, when the team was trying to make their push, And there was a lot of talk of like, oh, Nas Reid is going to get paid this summer. And I think he should still get paid this summer.

I don't know how much it'll be. I don't know if it'll be more than the mid-level. If it'll be mid-level for a pretty good team. Like, I could see the Sacramento Kings throwing their mid-level at Nazfried and having him back up Sabonis. Also, he can play. What's so great about him is offensively he can play with someone like Demontasabonis. Really versatile. Nice shooter.

Has nasty handle, nasty footwork. Just so much fun. Really young. Any team that gets him, I feel like should be really excited about it. He's the best. And I'm fascinated to see where he ends up. Yeah, I love that. By the way, that's just another domino effect of the Timberwolves trading for Rudy

Gaubert is that they will not be able to afford to bring. now as readback. Such a bummer. Just needed to throw that one out there. All right. Before we get out of here, my last one is Portland. This is a team that we could spend a lot of time on. We buried the lead here.

We really did. We really did. I honestly hesitated to put them on this list because I think they're going to be talked about a lot. But just like to just to say, man, this team could go in any different direction. They're going to be the team to watch on draft night. They have the number three pick.

They could put it in a trade for any number of players. Zion Williamson, Brandon Ingram, Pascal Seacum, amongst some of those names. It seems like the pelicans are very interested in Scoot Henderson. Today, there was reporting that Lillard once again has said, that he is not interested in leaving Portland. At this point, I'm kind of at the place of like, is this actually real? Or is this a situation where you don't want to say that you want to leave? Because at the end of the day, if they don't trade that pick,

I feel like the next move after number three is just going to be like, Miami's on the phone, just spamming them over and over and being like, you think you're going to do better than Tyler Hero? You think you're going to do better than Tyler Hero? and I don't know the answer to that question. I think it's no, though. I love the report today from Yahoo's Jake Fisher, friend of the program, that the Blazers are putting together a package to get Bam out of bio.

I think that is like the biggest troll job I've seen in recent times. I don't think that's going to happen. I don't care what they are offering. But Portland has to, if. Portland wants to win now. They have to improve their defense. They have to get rid of Nurkich. They have to move on there.

I think you could keep the pick, make the pick, keep Dame, trade Simons for, like, I don't know if this would work, but trade Simons for a Wendell-Carter type, a Clint Capella type, get a real defensive-minded five, and try to balance these two timelines here. I don't know. I think that that is a road they could go down that's not impossible. But there's just so many, it's so unpredictable. I have no idea what they're going to do. The Zion rumors are like really weird to me. And Zion's got a lot going on. Zion's busy.

He's very busy. He's got a lot going on right now. He's got his hands full. He does. But if I was the Pelicans, I just like, would not trade him. He's still my favorite player to watch play basketball when he does play basketball. But just I don't know what Portland's going to do.

And they kind of hold a lot of the cards here for the entire off season with Dame with that third pick. And nothing would really shock me, I guess. Yeah. I mean, I think it's funny that of all the teams that want to trade for an injury prone number one pick that, you know, might never get to live up to his full potential at Portland.

I just don't know how many times you want to repeat history there. Great point. Yeah. Do you have, do you have one more? Do we hit all three? I don't know, but I have another one that I'll throw out there and we can wrap it up with that. The Miami Heat came so close, yet so far from winning the NBA championship.

We just mentioned them a little bit. and the BAM had a bio rumors. I don't know. That's just like so ridiculous. But they are basically, I mean, the second that they lost the title, it was like, all right, they're in the Beal sweepstakes. They're in the Dame sweepstakes. Oh, they didn't trade for Beal. Their package was low because they're holding out for Dame.

I don't know if they're going to get either. I mean, we know they're not getting Beal. And I don't know if they're necessarily going to get Dame. And if they don't get Dame, then they're, what, $4 million below the second tax apron before they resign Struz and Gabe Vincent, who were two critical starters on a team that just went to the finals. So I don't know what they do this summer to kind of sustain their momentum. And I think you could look at the run that they had and be like,

a lot of it was super lucky, and then they came crashing back to Earth in the finals. I just don't know how replicable it is, and I'm not saying, like, Kyrie is the answer there, because I don't think he is, but I think that internally this organization could look at what they just had, and the run they just had, I should say, and wonder how real it was and how much urgency there should be to upgrade. So they're just a really fascinating team and their tax situation is something to monitor. Yeah, they're going to want to bring up.

I'm not mad at them for not trading for Beale. It's fine. I feel like they can kind of enter this offseason from a point of strength of just saying like, hey, yeah, we just made the NBA finals. And we have a 20 point infusion coming back, who is also our leading score throughout the regular season. Um, so it's kind of like you either get Tyler Hero back or you try to go all in for Dame.

And I'm, I'm, I'm okay with that. I'm, I'm, I'm really okay with them not trading for Beale. Honestly, I just don't, it would have moved a needle for them. I don't think it would have necessarily moved a needle enough. But yeah, they're going to be an interesting team to watch. This, I feel like we could talk about free agency for hours and hours. But luckily, we have just so much content for, for, for, for, for, for, for, you guys at the ringer.com and on our other podcast. So yeah, just, you know, keep it locked in.

And we'll be back next week. Hopefully with a lot of this stuff sorted out. So yeah, thank you. Thank you, Michael. Thank you, Chris for producing. And we'll talk to you guys next week. 21 plus in select states, first online real money wager only, $10 deposit required. Refund issued as non-withdrawable bonus bets that expire in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See full terms at Fandul.com slash sportsbook. Fanduil is offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with Kansas Star Casino LLC. Gambling

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