The Ringer NBA Show - Bradley Beal Gets Extended, Buddy Hield’s Feud, and Zion’s Knee. Plus: Final Preseason Takeaways. | The Mismatch

Episode Date: October 18, 2019

We’re shocked by Bradley Beal’s extension (1:00), confused by Buddy Hield’s public feud with the Kings (0:00), and dismayed by Zion’s knee injury, which could derail the beginning of his rookie season (5:00). Plus: We close the NBA preseason by each sharing the four stats that interested us most over the last month (42:30). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today's episode of the NBA show and the Ringer podcast network is brought to you by State Farm. The moment we've all been waiting for is about to arrive. The official start of the NBA season. This offseason was filled with a lot of big changes and fresh starts. For the fresh starts in your life, talk to a state farm agent. So when it comes to insurance, you don't have to go at it alone. There's going to be a lot of fresh starts this year. We're going to be talking about Dejante Murray.

We're going to be talking about Michael Porter, two guys that are going to have fresh starts this year. Talk to a State Farm agent today about combining your home and auto insurance and get a teammate who can help you prepare for the big changes in your life. State Farm. Welcome to The Ringer NBA show. I'm Chris Vernon, joining me as he does every Friday now. From The Ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, A.K.A. Kevin O'Connor, A.K.A. Kevin O'Connor, A.K.E.K.A. Kevin O'C.? Kevin O. Kavanaugh. Kavanaugh. Kavanaugh. What's going on tonight? How are you doing? You have a good day over in Memphis? Everything's good. The season is right around the corner and we woke up to big news this morning because it was very early that Adrian Wojianowski from ESPN broke the news that Brad Beale had signed an extension with the Washington Wizards. I was shocked. Were you?

Yeah, I was quite surprised. I think with Bradley Beal, you look at, you know, if you're Beal and you are, on the Washington Wizards bench, and you look down, you just see Mo Wagner picking his nose. You see John Wall wearing street clothes, recovering from his injury. Then you look at the court, and it's just a bunch of guys that, you know, are going to be on who he play for this year on TNT, and Charles Brockley's not going to be able to get the answer. And then you look around the league and you're like,

wow, everybody would love to have me. I'm surprised in that sense. I'm not surprised in the sense that Beal everything I've heard is a loyal guy. that he's tight with John Wall now, that he, you know, wants to see this through with Washington. But, I mean, I think for him, it's pretty clear what's happening here. His contract aligns with John Walls.

It goes through the 2022-23 season. And so now Washington has an additional two years to try to get this thing rolling in a positive way. Yeah, two years, $72 million was the max extension for Bradley Beale. And so I guess he is going to see it through. I mean, well, there's, listen, it doesn't make him less tradable. No, it doesn't. Not at all.

It doesn't make him less tradable. It makes him more tradable. Yeah, right. So, I mean, it doesn't make him less tradable. But I do think that, you know, there is the commitment that he made. They sold him on this in Washington. And I think that's what was surprising to me, that he was sold on staying in Washington. and playing there.

Because I just didn't see necessarily him. I just didn't see him making that commitment. That I thought that this was going to be something that hung out there throughout the year. And I think that that was probably, well, I mean, you know,

it was a big selling point for them. Like, do you want to talk about this the entire season? Or do you want to just go lock this down? And we can, you know, we can start playing basketball this year and this can go away. And that's the buddy healed situation now,

or he's just constantly talking about it. Okay. That's a whole different thing. No, let's move to that. That is insane. I broached this topic on the Tuesday pod, but Kevin, this is insanity.

It's pretty wild, man. No, it really is. Look, that team, if you are building a team and you have a dynamic point guard who is still getting better and better and better in Deerrin Fox. And then you have Marvin Bagley,

who you just drafted number two, overall in the NBA draft a year ago. You just said before we record it's going to be MVP this year. The sophomore MVP. So I do think that he's going to be a star. Like the best thing you can have is the ultimate floor spacer. And that's exactly what you have in Buddy Healed. And the money, it's like you are infuriating this guy, clearly, over five million bucks.

and you went out in the offseason and spent money on Trevor Riza, and you gave the new contract to Harrison Barnes, and you signed Dwayne Dedman, and you signed Corey Joseph, and you signed Rashaun Holmes, and you, like, you had money for all this, but now you don't have, you know, the extra, not that much for Buddy Healed, and now he's already mad before the season starts if this doesn't get done. Oh, and, by the way, you just signed Bogdanovich like two days. ago, right? So you've got all these guys that they spent money on and buddy's the one without

the deal. And, you know, he's already talking about, you know, wanting to get traded somewhere if they don't get something worked out. So he's obviously been super hurt by all of this. Right or wrong. That's the truth. He has been hurt. This has bothered him a great deal. And just basketball wise, it makes absolutely no sense to me. You know, one of my tenants has been, you could talk to me about overpaying, but overpaying good players is not my problem. Like, if you slightly overpay for somebody that's really good,

that's much less of a problem than overpaying for people that don't impact winning at all. That was one of Darrell-Morries points at the Vegas podcast that did with Bill that wasn't released, where he said you can't overpay for good players. You can't. And Buddy Healed is freaking good. and he's about to enter

you know what age I know his age got older last year you know we added a year without it's 41 adding a year he's 41 he turns 41 in December stop but we're talking what the next five years his age is 26 27 through 31 32

I mean those are great years to have a guy especially a guy that's a shooter it's what he is I just I don't understand it he's only 26 he's entering his prime right now He turns 27 in December, not 41 for what it's worth. But he turns 27. He's still super young.

Yes. And if you're talking about like, oh, well, he's not worth that, right? Again, let's talk about the guys that suck that aren't worth what they get paid. Not the guys that are good. I mean, so we hit this on Tuesday, I think. But what he said after the game pretty much, I mean, he just bashed the king's success in free agency this whole century when he said, name one big free agent. who's come to Sacramento. He sounds like a hater on Twitter saying that to the media.

I mean, he's not wrong. But it's just kind of, it's just an interesting approach. I, this level of transparency and honesty from a player is both sort of nice, but also a bit like, chill out, man.

I mean, relax here. I just, handle his mind closed doors in some ways. Yeah, he's pissed. He looks around and he sees what? Like,

how, everybody in this, everybody in this locker. room got paid. How would you... And I have busted my ass. I'm curious. How would you feel three years from now?

Jaron Jackson does this in Memphis? How would you feel if this happened? Absolutely furious, but I will tell you... Furious about what? About the team not just handing him money. Let's say he's in the healed exact position. But no, let's say he's not an obvious max player. He's exactly in healed's position.

How would you feel if he's like just trash in the organization saying he feels disrespected? Would you at all, would any part of you think? I would be mad at the organization. Okay. So you'd be, okay. And here's what I'll tell you. And this is what part of the Memphis success for some years was built upon, Kevin, is everybody always got taken care of.

Everybody. And they were overpays. At the time, everybody thought they were overpays, right? So if it was, Zach Randolph signed multiple contracts. Mike Conley and Markasaw both signed multiple contracts. even you go all the way back, they signed Rudy Gay to a Max deal. And the point was, and I did, and this is actually a great topic, because at that time, I thought you should just let him walk, right?

Now, they never got into contentious or it never got into what he wanted versus what they were willing to give. None of that ever happened. But I thought this guy is not worth Max money. You're going to hamstring the organization if you pay someone. like Rudy Max Money who can't carry the load. And the point was made to me at the time. And I've never forgotten this.

It was if you pay them, if you pay a guy like Rudy, even if it's an overpay, Rudy Gay is really good and he's always tradable. So if it doesn't work and it does start to hamstring the organization, then guess what? You can move off of it, which coincidentally, they did. They did. And they were proven right. You can't trade. But it is always better to take care of your guys. And I think it is paramount in a small market to take care of your guys. I would tell you that that is part of the reason for the elongated success that they had making the playoffs for seven straight years was because they always took care of their guys. And I think you realize in a small market, you don't want to be the one because it's hard to get. them. If you're not going to get him in the draft, you're not going to be a big player in free agency. Buddy Heald is dead on right. And, you know, I can't believe they pissed him off this much. You know, is he at all, okay, it's my, this is not anything that I've heard. It's just my sense from

just reading the situation from the outside has to be the fact that this got to be him in his circle, like his agent, trying to create some leverage here. Has to be, right? I mean, I don't think, you go this far publicly in front of the media with microphones sticking in your face and say the things that you said this week, essentially saying the kings have never signed a big free agent, saying that you feel disrespected, and that you'll go somewhere else, find a new home if the kings don't want you. To me, it seems to at least suggest that they don't have leverage to get the money that they want, which would turn this into a prove-it year where he would enter a free agency next summer. I think that's true. I think that's true. Obviously, the kings have the

leverage. Because, I mean, he's a restricted free agent anyway, right? And they don't have to pay him right now. They don't have to. But again, it makes no sense to piss him off. None. They didn't have to pay Boggian Bogdanovitch either. And they sure as hell didn't have to pay

Harrison Barnes and Trevor Reza and everybody else under the sun. And that's where I'm with you in the sense that it's like, yeah, they made some other moves, especially the Harrison Barnes one. But the point is that this is what contract negotiations are in any industry.

It's about leverage. It's about having an opportunity and using that opportunity and leveraging it against your employer. And right now, and right now, Buddy Hill does not have that leverage. I get it, but you've pissed him off. That's the problem. I mean, he did. You pissed him off, but then you have, then next July, maybe he's cooled off by then.

And he's happy to sign on the dotted line after. Hell no. Maybe, maybe. If they don't sign him by tomorrow, this is an est storm. But he's an emotional. guy. He always has been. And if you're the Kings, you know him just as well as anybody else in the league can. So you get to assess the situation here and think to yourself, is Buddy going to be the type of guy who holds onto this for the long run? Or is he going to be the type of guy who he's overreacting now as part of some theater to create leverage? And that come July, when you get to give him the money, you'll be happily do it then. And it all will be forgotten. And the next three or four years will all be great and glorious. you'll make playoff. What have we learned, though, Kevin?

The guy that wants the trade, the guy that asks out, and if they don't get that deal done, you better believe his agent and him are going to talk about wanting to be out of there, right? They usually get their way. Because you just don't want it in the locker room. You don't want a guy that's all right. He's not going to be all in.

What if the galaxy brain move here? What if that's what he actually wants? What? Out. No, I think he wanted the money. and they're not giving it to him. And they gave $25 million to Harrison Barnes and he looks up and goes, I'm better than this guy.

Well, when we record Tuesday, we'll know. And you know what I mean? He is better than Harrison Barnes. He is. Next Tuesday, we'll know because the deadline's Monday. But I promise you, that's the thing that happens. You don't want that guy in that locker room anymore. If he don't want to be there, they would find a deal.

And you could get a ransom for him. Get over it. I mean, like, seriously, if you're not, that's part of, that's what the league is right now. You're a restricted free agent, and if you don't get your money now, you get approved over the course of the year, just like any other player does. He's not entitled to get a max contract right now. He's not a max level player. And ultimately, I think right now it's a big overreaction.

I think for Buddy He'll, he is right to feel slighted. He is right to feel like he's a max player because, as he said, every player should be trying and working hard and trying to become that max level player. But right now, the Kings don't feel like he is. I don't feel like he is a heck of a lot of people. He didn't even ask for the full match. didn't even ask for the full max. Well, he asked for the full max, but he's willing to take a little bit less than the full max. Yeah.

We're going to know next time we record. And it's just going to be weird if going into the season, if he's not signed. All right. Buddy probably could have handled this better. The point is the kings are stupid. How do you, how do you screw that up? You've got the point guard, the shooter, and the big. I don't, I don't agree.

I tend to. This should be easy to build around. It's not. Give me those three guys. If he, I can build a real team, man, for a long time. You make the strong point that they made some other signings like Harrison Barnes that they shouldn't have made. They are, you know, they've extended other guys. They have some veterans, 12 million, 13 million signed for multiple years.

You're right about that. But they have that. That's their circumstances. And so the point is what I'm making here is for Sacramento. Yes, you want to keep Buddy healed. But right now, do you want to give him that money before his season when like you don't know if he could suffer a major injury. For you as the Kings, it also makes sense to wait until July because you already have so much financial commitment to other players. You don't want to really

hamstring yourself by giving the money to a guy who, he could get hurt. I mean, it could just happen. Somebody else could get hurt. And then that money is what's weighing you down. So you need to retain your flexibility if you're the Kings. And I think right now, if there's a number where you're comfortable, but then there's a place where you're not, and that's the max or close to it. I would wait. I think it is insane that they are not signing him and that that is not part of their core, that they don't look at their core as Fox healed and Bagley. It can be both.

And then build around that. It won't be. It won't be. And I remember. I look forward to Tuesday. I remember Bobby Marks tweeted this early this morning. While talking to teams regarding the philosophy of rookie extensions, this comment resonates. the last thing you need is for a player to mentally check out before the season even starts.

And that's the situation they created by paying everybody else but him. And now they're going to deal with it. And I think it's a shame because that's a team that had playoff hopes. And I know you say, we'll know by Tuesday. Maybe they'll get it done. Maybe they'll get it done. And this will be water under the bridge. But if they don't, I think that's crazy.

I think it's absolutely crazy. All right, Kevin, moving on, a story that has come out tonight is that Zion Williamson did not travel to play in the last preseason game for the New Orleans Pelicans. And according to Adrian Wojianowski, it seems like more than just, hey, we're getting him some rest before the season starts. Sounds like there's going to be some test run. And, you know, obviously we got our fingers crossed right before the season starts. Boy, I hope there's nothing bad wrong with him. Yeah, Wodge reported a couple hours ago as of recording. It's sick specific right now.

He said on ESPN that the Pelicans are being cautious with Zion's injury, and they hope to know more in the next 24 hours, but this isn't a typical preseason arrest situation. So they're not making excuses here. There's an actual injury that they're looking at. That's scary, man. It's scary because with Zion Williamson, you think about at 6-6, 275 pounds, whatever he is, it's a heck of a lot of weight and load on his legs, on his knees as somebody who is so athletic

and has so much power. It's scary, man. He already had that injury in college when his shoe exploded and the fact that they're already checking this out now. It's a bit worrisome. And, you know, it brought to mind my buddy. Brian Sutterer, he makes YouTube videos, and he's a doctor as well, and he talks about sports injuries and injuries across sports, but especially in basketball. And he tweeted, I think it was last

week, about Zion's walk, his gait. And Brian had mentioned how he has like an inward alignment with his knees, which is something that historically can have lead to a greater risk of ACL tear, not that that's the case here. But it's just a bit scary. I mean, I think for Zion that any athletic player, you know, that jumps into orbit the way Zion does when landing, it's scary sometimes. And I think that's really my only concern for his future in the NBA is durability. And so hopefully this is nothing. And hopefully it's that.

It's the landing that you talk about because when you're dealing with any of these fast-twitch guys that are so explosive. and that is the, you know, every time you see Russell Westbrook going flying down, right, and landing. And he has been exceptionally durable. And obviously the one that comes to mind is Derek Rose, right? And having to land. And so when you're talking about landing on 280 pounds, right? Like, I mean, you're always, it's going to be hard to hold up. but here's hoping that this is just something very minor

because there would be, I mean, you want to talk about deflating with the season starting. Oh, I know. If there had to be an extended amount of time that we don't get to see this kid, I mean, hell, they put them on national TV 30 times because of him. That would be awful. So let's just cross our fingers and hope that it's, we know it's more than a precaution,

but here's hoping that it, It's something very minor. Hopefully by tomorrow morning, Friday morning. We get some good news. Hopefully we will get some good news by tomorrow morning. We'll take a quick break. When we come back, we're going to talk about the GM survey that dropped this morning. Today's episode of the NBA show on the Ringer podcast network is brought to you by State Farm.

The moment we've all been waiting for is about to arrive. The official start of the NBA season. This offseason was filled with a lot of big changes in fresh. starts. With a fresh starts in your life, talk to a State Farm agent. So when it comes to insurance, you don't have to go at it alone. There's going to be a bunch of fresh starts for this rookie class, and we're going to be talking about guys like Tyler Harrow and Carson Edwards and others. Talk to a State Farm agent today about combining your home and auto insurance and get a teammate who can help you prepare for the big changes in your life, State Farm.

All right, Kevin, so the GM survey dropped this morning, and the GMs, uh, 46% of them picked the Los Angeles Clippers to win the NBA finals. I guess I was a bit surprised that the Bucks got the second most amount of votes at 36%. The Lakers were the team that followed them at 11%. And then this was interesting to me. And we're not going to go through every question they were asked, but I did want to touch on who they think would win the NBA finals. So they had clippers, then they had the Bucks, then they had the Los Angeles Lakers.

The also receiving votes were the Warriors and the Blazers. How about that as teams, right? I mean, like, and this is the 30 GMs around the league that responded to 50 different questions. John Schumann does an unbelievable job with this on NBA.com every year. And so on that survey, but I was just a little surprised that those, I certainly expected the Clippers, the Bucks and the Lakers to be mentioned. The Warriors and the Blazers being the other teams that GMs mentioned was, I don't know, just a little surprising to me. You know, I'm most surprised, though, by the 11% for the Lakers.

We don't know how many GMs actually voted. He said it wasn't 30. But if it were 30, that would mean only three voted for the Lakers with LeBron James and Anthony Davis to win the championship. That's a bit surprising to me. I know. And the other thing is... I feel like they've just been overall underrated. We've hit on this a bit before and we will again

when we do like a season preview thing next week. But yeah, I feel like they've overall been underrated with AD and LeBron and their supporting cast. Here's the other thing that stands out, Kip. Only one Eastern Conference team. And it wasn't the Philadelphia of 76ers. Right? Only one.

Only one got a vote. And that was the Milwaukee Bucks. Everybody else was a Western Conference team. And I think that speaks to what this season is going to look like in the Western Congress. You want to talk about a war. I mean, for those eight playoff spots and the seedings that go along with them, this is not going to be easy to have, I mean, some kind of like a 60, 58 win season. It's just not going to be easy.

There's too many good teams in the Western Conference. I'd imagine it will be rather bunched up. All right. So I said, we're not going to go through all of the different answers. But let me just ask you, were there any that particularly stood out to you that the GMs answered and you were surprised by their answer? Yeah, one in particular, the fact that Brad Stevens was voted as the best coach last year, but he didn't get a single vote. I mean, I really don't understand. It's pretty weird how quickly perception of him changed in the eyes of general managers.

How about the best small forward being voted Kauai by a very healthy margin and LeBron James being second? LeBron got some votes at point guard, though, I noticed. He also got some points in power forward. So maybe they should have delineated on this. Maybe we should just stop using positions. I think that might be fair maybe or just switched to guards, wings, and bigs.

Center was a very interesting one though. I was surprised that Yokic had so many more percentage of the votes than Joe L.M.B.

I thought that would be more more than Anthony Davis. Yeah, and Davis. I thought that would be more split but Davis obviously got a lot of votes. He was ranked as the second best power forward. So, but those two guys are centers.

Like when you think, of centers, I would say right now, young centers in the league, the debate would be Yokic and Mbid. And I would have guessed that that would have been a closer vote between Yokic and Mbid

amongst NBA general managers. Which one would you rather have? Who's the better player do you think? NBeed when he's at his top of his game because of his defensibility. Right. But I mean, like with AD not getting the most votes, it's partially because of durability concerns. And that that would be the concern there than Bede.

But if you're picking a guy totally healthy 100%, you would take him Bede for that one game. I think so too. And that's why I was a little bit surprised at the difference in percentage between those particular teams, between those two players. There wasn't really all that many surprises

in the defenders. And you know it's like, it's generally the same guys, right? You're talking about Kauai and Rudy Gobert and Draymond Green and that group. And so the GMs feel just like the fans and everybody else. You mentioned the Brad Stevens thing. He did get votes. He was second in making the best in-game adjustments.

So at least they gave him that, right? He was ranked behind Rick Carlisle. But I don't understand. How can you vote for the coach? to be second and best in game adjustments, which is a critical component of coaching. But he doesn't get a single vote for best coach,

which, you know, like, just interesting. All right. The other one that shocked me was that the GMs voted the Denver Nuggets as the most fun team to watch. I love watching Yokes. I just didn't expect that to be their answer.

But I guess, in fairness, a lot of the, like, really good teams, we don't know what they're going to be like to watch. You know what I mean? This year, like, what's it going to be like to watch the Clippers and the Lakers and even Philly's going to look a lot different? We kind of know what the bucks look like to watch. The Pelicans were ranked second on that.

So you can't say that it's not like, you can't say that they're not looking forward because they're obviously looking forward. Nobody was sitting there going, God, that Pelicans team was fun to watch last year. That wasn't fun to watch. So they're obviously looking forward, and yet they didn't look forward with some of the new teams with the new acquisitions. Nuggets were also voted Best Home Court advantage, which that stunned me, too. Oh, no, that doesn't stun me. The air is, that's real.

Just because, okay, the air, I understand. Yeah, that makes sense. Well, that's the reason they get that. That makes sense. Yeah, yeah, true. And that's why Utah's second. Yep. Yep, very fair.

I mean, it's real. I'm thinking crowd. I'm thinking crowd noise and all that. And especially when you travel there. Like if you if you've got a back to back in Denver, just go ahead and chalk that up as a loss. Right. Yeah.

I was thinking more crowd noise. You know, that's where like Golden State comes in mind. Toronto, Boston, Portland. Oh, no.

These guys have trouble breathing. Yeah. Very fair. That makes sense. That's, that's the problem. The other one that stood out to me was breakout player, which was Deeran Fox.

And I could totally see that. I also thought it was interesting for the second straight year. Jamal Murray got a lot of votes. Like, didn't Jamal Murray have a breakout last year? I thought he did. But these were the votes. Deeran Fox. And then you have Jaron Jackson Jr. and Jason Tatum.

And then you have Brandon Ingram and Jamal Murray. There's a lot of good name. on this too, by the way, that I could see. But Deerrin Fox got the most votes. And then he was followed by Jaron Jackson Jr. and Jason Tatum and then Brandon Ingram and Jamal Murray. Now, of those, didn't you think

Jamal Murray's breakout was last year? It can't always break out again. It's like Yonis. Break out again? Yonah is always in contention for most improved player. I guess, but do you buy that the breakout player, like the one

that flies onto the scene? as possibly an elite player in the NBA. Is Deerrin Fox? I do. The Kings need him to be. That's for sure. Kings, I wrote about this. Especially now they pissed off Buddy Healed.

Well, I wrote about this this week on the ringer where with Sacramento, I mean, as much as I, there's so much to love on their roster, they need to be better scoring in the half court. And so much of that is going to have to do with Deeran Fox continuing to extend his shooting range. He's better off the dribble last year, better in catch and shoot situations. but needs to be even better, needs to continue getting better,

drawing files, getting to the free throw line, and every bit is going to help that team be more and more efficient in the half-core. They need that if they're going to be a serious play, have a serious chance of making the playoffs. So the NBA GMs, when they were asked who will win the 2019-20 Kia MVP award,

said Janus Antitacumpa, we are throwing that off of the board, and we are going to make our own MVP cases with the help of Google Assistant. Now we're going to take turns and talk for two minutes each about who we think will be the MVP for this upcoming season. Kevin, you're up first. It's like a high school debate style. I love it, Chris. Hey, Google, set a timer for two minutes. Okay, two minutes. Starting now. All right, Chris, since Yana Sanza de Kumpo is off the table here, my pick for MVP is Stefan Curry of the Golden State Warriors to win his third MVP in his career.

And the reason why is there's a couple of reasons why here, Chris. For one, look at the last couple years. The last three seasons without KD or Clay Thompson on the floor, Stefan Curry averaged 38 points on 27 shots per 75 possessions. Now let's compare that to James Hardin of this past season. when he put up just an absolutely historic offensive season. Harden had 37 points on 25 shots per 75 possessions that last season. Of course, James Hardin didn't win MVP, and that is, you know, a bit of a concern here.

But should it be? Should it be? I don't think so. And here's why? Because James Hardin is not well liked across the league by voters. He's just not. You and I have talked about this before, and we've debated about it back. And forth, a lot of people just don't like the way James Harden plays.

They don't like the way the Houston Rockets play. But you do know what voters do like. They love Stefan Curry. They love the way the Warriors play basketball. And that has to be factored into the equation if you're predicting an MVP. If you're placing a bet, you've got to factor in who the voters are. And so for Steph, voters like him. He's going to put up numbers, going to have that opportunity.

but also he has the story this year because there's no KD, because there's no Clay Thompson, there's the story that Golden State is an underdog going into the season and that if they make the playoffs and if Steph is posting MVP numbers of 15, 16 level, he's going to get their votes. And Stefan Curry will be the one hoisting that third MVP trophy at some point during the season. All right, my turn. Hey Google, set a timer for two minutes.

Okay, two minutes. Starting now. Well, that is a good pick with Steph Curry, Kevin. I am here to tell you that somehow, some way, everybody has forgotten who the best basketball player in the world was just a few months ago, and that is Kauai Leonard. Kauai Leonard has now moved to a different place. He's going to be healthy.

He's going to be happy. He's in Los Angeles, where he wanted to. to be, even though he carried Toronto to a championship last year and played great throughout that season. But we just ended a playoff run that was absolutely out of this world. I get that he doesn't talk. I get that the only thing anybody knows about him is that he's got a goofy laugh. I guess they know two things, that he's got a goofy laugh and that he is an unbelievable basketball player. He just got done in a playoff run, a playoff run averaging 30 points a game. game, 49% from the field, 38% from three, and was overwhelmingly the best player that won an NBA

championship. You know, everybody put together all of these lists going into the year. It was the first time in a long time that LeBron James was not at the very top of those lists. And in fact, the guy that was at the top of those lists with either Janus Antecoompo, who we left off the board in choosing this, or it was Kauai Leonard. Very deservingly, he is the best two-way player, and who has everybody, including the GM survey, said, is going to win the NBA championship? So what do we know about the MVP and MVP voting?

It is typically, unless there's some kind of an outlier, it's typically the best player on the best team. So if you're talking about the best player on the best team, and everybody tells me the best team is going to be the Clippers. Who's their best player? It's Kauai Leonard. So if Yonis doesn't win it, it's Kauai. All right, Kevin, you made your case.

I made my case, and we will see how those play out, which probably means that Yonis is going to end up winning it in the end anyway. But I do want to ask you about an article that you started, which is this is going to be what, like a three or four-parter. NBA tiers, a four-parter. NBA tiers, your power rank. Kings. Day one is the one that's gone up since we, at the time of our recording, the tankers, the rebuilders, and the disasters. And so you went through and you went through all the different

teams. You started with 30, which is Charlotte, and they were on press fast forward. Bradley Beal and the Washington Wizards were on that list, as were the Cleveland Cavaliers. And say it ain't so you put the bright future sons on press fast forward I mean well I mean it's there in the west how do you sleep at night

they're in the western conference well you're done they're in the west no I'm not done with the bright future sons you're done with the bright future sons I probably should have put them on the hopeful rebuilding section I feel like you're done with the bright future sons

why want I be done with the bright future sons I still have Devin Bruck Fast forward on what? Press fast forward on all this losing? Yeah, sure. Yeah, one of the top player and then they continue building upward. They still have a bright future. Is it a 10-year rebuild?

Yeah. It's a 10-year rebuild. Okay. Let me, let me take one, pick one bone. I think that the calves are rebuilding. Yeah, they are. I know. All those teams are.

Yeah, I know. But like the next group, gets the hopeful. You know what I'm saying? They get the hopeful rebuild it. I pretty much, I don't want to read into the subtitle too much, but the point was really is like with the press fast

forward, these are the teams that have like a zero percent chance of making the postseason. Memphis probably should be in that category too in that sense. But I love Jaron Jackson and John Morant and Brandon Clark too much to put them there. The Bradfordshire Grizzlies, Chris. We've been through this

before. Right. You do have. But so there are other teams like Knicks, Hawks, Bulls, and that hopeful rebuilding section where they have a shot of actually making the postseason this year. They're just ranked a little bit higher. But the subtitles, you know, it's hard to group these teams together, but they're in a similar tier.

Well, the Knicks, the Hawks, and the Bulls, the Grizzlies are not going to be a playoff team, all right? But these other teams, those other teams, but I do appreciate you putting them in that group. You're welcome. Those other teams, the Easter Conference teams, there's, there's very, I mean, look, once you get past a group of teams,

at the very top of the Eastern Conference. And really passed, I would assume Philadelphia, the Bucks, the Celtics are all going to be playoff teams. I would also assume the Pacers are for sure going to be a playoff team, right? I think the Raptors will be. But, I mean, you've got a big group of teams. And I think the heat will be, for that matter. I think the heat will be.

So, but, and the magic made it last year and the Pistons made it last year. But of those teams, Washington won't. The Knicks will have a crack at it. The Bulls will have a crack at it. The Hawks, Cleveland, Charlotte. I mean, you know, there's going to be, eight have to make it. I don't, I don't know how good Brooklyn's going to be, but we'll see. But, I mean, it's a lot harder, I think, to pencil in, you know, eight for sure's in the Eastern Conference.

Whereas you start penciling in the Western conference and you say, okay, if we knock out Oklahoma City from last year, but we put in the Lakers this year, that takes up all the spots. And so you can get to like nine or ten on theirs. But that's harder in the Eastern Conference. So there's nobody you could put in the Eastern Conference that I wouldn't buy could feasibly make the playoffs outside of Wizards in Charlotte. I mean, that's the thing with the league. And the Cavs, and the Cavs. That's the thing with the league this year, Chris, and why I think it's going to be so interesting to watch this year,

because with that Bradley Beale trade, I'm sorry, with that Bradley Beal resigning, that takes what was expected to be the best player off the trademark. And now you look around the league and it's like, maybe Kevin Love, but maybe not too. I mean, they seem committed to him and keeping, you know, having some veteran presence there as they build with their young roster.

So you look around the league, there may not be a lot of rumors for star players this year that we've gotten used to in recent years, which means these teams that are sort of on the fence, which is one of the things that I look at in the article going up on Friday morning, a team like the Pistons

or a team like the Raptors where you could see them going either way with either adding a guy or with trading away players, same with Oklahoma City. There's not a lot out there for some of these teams to add. So do these teams,

that are sort of at a crossroads right now, do they decide to become a seller? Because they know, like, if they put their player out there, that you can be the, have the best player available on the trade market and try to get something really, really strong. That's what I'll be curious to see over the course of the season. But besides that, though, if no trades happen, this is going to be a year that's purely about basketball,

where it is an open league. And you touched on it, Chris, that it's hard to slot in teams in the Eastern Commerce playoffs. I would go further and say it's also hard in the Western Conference. You have the top heavy favorites that you feel confident are going to be in there. But I think from the six seed through the 10 or 11 spot, there's a case to be made for some of these young teams. I mean, whether it is Dallas, if KP and Luca just skyrocket this year, whether it's New Orleans, if Zion plays all 82 and he's awesome as he has been in preseason or even Sacramento,

if Darren Fox makes a massive leap again, you can make a case. for a lot of teams in both conferences. And then from there, who knows in the playoffs that the Lakers and Clippers and Bucks and Sixers are the favorites, but they're not overwhelming favorites like the Warriors were, the Miami Heat were with LeBron.

This year is everybody feels like they actually have a shot of either making the postseason or even getting to the finals and maybe winning it. It is Kevin O'Connor's NBA power rankings and is a four-part series. So make sure you keep up with all four of those. We're going to take a quick break when we come back. We're going to go through box score preseason standouts.

It's the last time that we get to do this. Things that we have noticed from the preseason box scores as we head into the season because by the next time we talk, we are going to be talking about regular season games. We'll do that on the other side. Today's Ringer NBA show brought to you by Mountain Dew. This NBA season, Mountain Dew, is all about the threes. the shot that's changing the game. As the preseason has come to a close,

we have our eye on a few great players that we think will be the leader in threes this season. All right, Kevin, who do you think? Boban Marianovic. Come on, man. Take this seriously. Of course it's going to be Steph or James Hardin, one of those two.

Steph or James Harden? Well, we know it's not going to be Clay Thompson. He's usually up there, but he's going to have to miss too much of the season. How about my man Carson Edwards? Or our guy, buddy, healed. might be buddy healed if he's not too pissed off show brought to you by Mountain Dew

the official beverage of the NBA do the do all right Kevin so let's talk about these box score standouts from the preseason I jot it down four you've got four we'll see if we overlap on these but I'm gonna bet I'm gonna bet we don't

maybe once well let's see all right the first one I've got Tyler Hero Holy mackerel has this guy been good. 25 minutes a game, 16 points, 55% from the field, 53% from 3, 5 assists, or I'm sorry, 5 rebounds, 3 assist the game.

And he's a little bit farther down. I know that Nikiel Alexander Walker has been great for the Pelicans as a guy that was drafted past the lottery. Tyler Harrow, so far in what we saw in Summer League, what we saw in the preseason looks like one of these rookies that is going to have a big immediate impact. And that's a super interesting team in the heat. But like, I mean, we saw them in Summer League and you can say Summer League doesn't matter and you can say preseason doesn't matter. But at some point, this guy just frigging makes shots like crazy. And I think that amongst, you know,

there's going to be the guys at the very top that obviously make a very big impact on their teams. But this looks like a guy that was drafted a little bit further down that could absolutely have a huge impact on his own team in his own right. So Tyler Harrow super stood out to me. Yeah, and it's not like he's just hitting some standstill shots. He's hitting shots off movement off of screens. He's driving to the rim and creating for himself. I mean, I feel like a big dummy. I had him ranked too low in the draft.

Even if he doesn't continue to what he's doing right now, I had him too low. All right. What's your first one? First one. This is overall, this is not just one team. This is as of Thursday night, NBA teams across the league and preseason have attempted 40% of their shot attempts from three-point range this preseason. What? And that's notable because if you look historically, Chris, at pre-season three-point rate and compare it to regular season three-point rate, there's an incredibly strong correlation with that rise year to year.

So even if teams aren't shooting 40% of their shots from three during the regular season, maybe it's 38%, maybe it's 39%, maybe it's even 37%. The point is that once again, the three point rate across the league is going to ascend upward. That's what we're going to see this year. And it's very possible if it is consistent with the preseason, that it will be one of the largest leaps ever from year to year. As an example, though, Chris, Houston, this preseason has attempted it's ludicrous. 60% of their shots from three. One of the more interesting teams is Washington. They're at about 43% on their shots being attended from three.

And they have the greatest difference from their regular season 3.8 last year to what we've seen this year. Minnesota being another team, they've had a significant rise. And that comes with having Gerson Roses being hired as general manager. Ryan Saunders, rather than being an intern head coach, now is the, the actual head coach. So they changed their system in Minnesota with a new front office like Washington with Tommy Shepard there now.

So we're seeing these teams just shooting a heck of a lot more threes. Again, following Houston along. Houston is still far ahead of everybody else, but this does not seem to be stopping or even plateauing. We are going to, we'll keep track of that as the season goes on and see

if this number goes up dramatically again. My number two, and this can actually fall in line with what you were saying about Tyler Harrow. Okay, Kevin, I write that article for the ringer on the players that will not fail. And I'm going to tell you that there was a player in the article that I ended up taking out of the article because I was talked out of it by NBA talent evaluators and I will never forgive myself for this. And it was Carson Edwards. and watching him the other night go hits eight threes in scores 26 points in the third quarter

and goes eight of 11 from three under nine minutes under nine minutes he goes eight of 11 from three and I am watching this and I'm going I can't believe this I can't believe it like I watched the frigging NCAA tournament and the whole time I'm sitting there telling everybody, bro, if you don't think this translates, you're crazy. But this is why I got talked out of it. It wasn't the size thing that got me talked out of it.

It was you got to be super careful where he gets drafted. Because if he goes somewhere to a coach that gets him and is like he's got to run the team point guard and not just be this fire starter, then he's going, like you, especially in the second. second round, you could end up not finding your place. And now he's just like an undersized guard who doesn't really run the team because so many teams want their backup point guard to just be the,

you know, get us in our offense, run the team kind of guy that they trust. And you've got to just kind of let him have the ball and be what he is. And I'll be damned if he didn't end up with the perfect coach and the perfect team for that. And they're obviously letting him be him. I mean, for God's sakes, I don't care if you're even making them. Any rookie takes like 11 shots in nine minutes. They may never play again for most of these coaches. You know, half these rookies are so scared to shoot at all. But they've empowered this guy and you're getting that Purdue, Carson Edwards.

I saw it in Summer League. I've seen it already in the preseason. And we know that Brad had immense success with a little guy that could get buckets once before. And I just, I, I'm never going to forgive myself. And, you know, I do that, but then I talk to people that actually make the decisions and have say in the league. And I, you know, if my whole thing is these mock drafts are stupid.

And when we look back in the years, there are guys that are way underdrafted. And that's my whole concept of doing it. And I just, I'm going to beat myself up over that one forever. This guy, this dude gets buckets, straight. bucket. So what you're saying is the grizzlies need to let go of Zach Klein and hire you a general manager. No, it is not. I don't believe that one bit. And I would tell you that I didn't even talk to any of them. You kidding me? You think they're going to talk to me about that crap? You kidding me? They stay away from you. Fortunately, we've had 10 front offices here. So I got people all over

the league now. I mean, that's the issue. They just haven't hired you. That's my point, Chris. Yeah, right. They haven't hired you. But if they would have listened to me, they'd have been a lot better off in the draft. I promise you that. If they were to listen to you, Marcus Sol and Mike Conley would still be on the team.

No, we didn't. I'm talking about the draft, Kevin. We didn't have a good draft pick for 10 years. I'm not kidding. From Mike Conley to Jaron Jackson. From Mike Conley to, that's 10 years. 10 years of no second contract draft picks.

Marker Solvi running away in Memphis right now. We're loyal to our players. We're loyal. I don't trade players. That's what you would be saying. Marcus Hall is an NBA and world champion now. Put some respect on his name. I know.

I'm just saying if you were GM in an alternate universe, Chris. Where did you have Carson Edwards in the draft? Because you're stupid as hell about this stuff too. Below Tyler Hero? I don't really remember my ranking off the top of my head. I can also look that up for you if you'd like to. I want to look that. No, no.

You know what? You go ahead to your number three and I'm going to find out where Kevin O'Connor had Carson Edwards and then I can crap all over you. I'm looking at looking at looking at least as I'm speaking here. So my second one. I'm at least admitting that I regret that greatly already. I just admitted that I was wrong about Tyler Hero. Are we comparing our faults here? Let's find out where I had him rank 33.

That's terrible. You had him right above from Terrence Davis who's a football player. Terrence Davis is not bad. Anyway, anyway, my second one, Markel Fultz, 7 of 27 from midrange,

0 of 5 from 3. Oh, boy. He's still lost on offense. That's all. That's all. I have nothing else to add. Oh, no. You used one of these

just to crap on Markle Fultz. I have nothing else sad. I'm nothing else sad. That's all. All right. My third one is rough, and that's because of the news that we had to start the podcast.

with, I was going to highlight, wait for it, Zion Williamson, who since we last spoke, had 22 and 10 on Sunday. And in those three games, he had shot 29 of 36, 23 points, almost seven rebounds, 71% from the field, and averaging 27 minutes a night. Like Kevin, he had just exploded in this preseason, 29 for 36.

What is that? So I want to mine of Zion as well. Okay. This is a hat tip to our producer, Bobby Wagner, who passed along this idea because he said,

you know, everybody's talked about Zion's shooting percentage. He's shooting 80% in preseason. But that's largely because of his shot selection. 42 of 49 of his shot attempts have been inside five feet. Good.

He's essentially playing like DeAndre Jordan. Good. Except he's not. Except he's not. His shots are like DeAndre Jordan, but the way he's being utilized is not. I mentioned in my article coming out Friday where Alvin Gentry is getting so damn creative with Zion. It's been fun to watch him running off screens towards the rim. It feels like you were saying that as a demerit.

No, not at all. Oh, okay. No, no. Not at all. I have no. It's just interesting. That is such a frequent rate. It is both a testament to the coaching to get him there with the play calling, running him off screens to get him going downhill towards the rim.

It's also a testament to his ability to get to the room from driving to the rimmer. But also, it is still one knock on him. The fact that he is a limited perimeter player. And that is an area that he needs to drastically improve. I will say this. If you can get me that kind of production shooting like that, then so be it. And if of all the knocks that I have had on DeAndre Jordan over the years, his shot selection is not one of them. He knows his game.

He's not like, yeah, right. He ain't doing something he shouldn't be doing. You know what I mean? I mean, I guess you could say, well, he should be able to hit mid-range shots. Like, I don't want him shooting mid-range shots. Go ahead and just dunk it every time you get it. And Zion Williams is 29 for 36 until he went out. let's just pray he's not injured.

All right, my fourth one. And here is a guy that we have not mentioned on a show, which going through the box scores, and he's had a good preseason so far. He's only been playing 18 minutes per game, but in those 18 minutes, he'd be getting 11 points, 49% from the field. We have the same guy, don't we?

Is this Michael Porter? It is not. Okay. So I have Michael Porter, like, right? Now 60 minutes per game, 11 points for rebounds. So when you said 11 points,

I was like, Okay. All right. So this guy, this guy that I'm talking about, four assists, three rebounds and a steel. He just turned 23 a few weeks back. And when we last saw him, we thought that he was on his way to becoming possibly something special. He had just made second team all defense. And then last year was a completely lost year. And that is Dejante Murray for the Spurs. We haven't talked about him. He's just been an afterthought, right? When you lose, he, and October 7th, I believe it was of last year, he blew out his ACL. And so he did not play. It's a totally lost season. But I think we freely admit after year number two, you know, he had wrangled that starting point guard slot away from Tony Parker.

And then they moved on from Tony Parker. And it looked like, okay, Murray's really on to something. He's already an outstanding defender. I mean, in his second year in the league, he was named second team all defense. And this could be the big breakout for him. And instead of the breakout, it was the blown ACL. And so now he comes back and by all accounts, totally healthy has looked pretty good in the preseason. And so I'm super excited.

You know, you hate for somebody, especially early in their career, to lose a whole season. But I would just tell you that a year ago, everybody was excited about Dejante Murray's third season. and becoming, you know, full-time starter and kind of just his gig now for San Antonio. And they get to add him back into that puzzle there with the Spurs alongside, you know, DeMardozen, in that back court. And I'm super excited to see him. And it was cool to see him do some stuff in this preseason. And so I wanted to give him a shout out because I noticed it.

and he's just not a guy that we thought about a lot because we didn't see him play at all last season. I hope Greg Popovich plays Murray with Derek White more in the regular season than in the preseason, which is zero. Do you have two of the best defensive players in your back court at once? It's very interesting that Pop hasn't played them together. Interesting. At least through their first three games.

The fourth one I'm not sure about. well, and your fourth on this list then is another guy we haven't seen play. Yeah, Michael Porter, Jr. I mean, I have no particular number besides his basic box score, 11 points, 4 rebounds, and 16 minutes, other than to say that I think he's looked pretty good. I'm encouraged by his performance so far this preseason. He's clearly knocking off the Russ on the defensive end of the floor. He looks sluggish on that end, and maybe he will continue to. But you don't have him for his defense.

You have him for what he can bring you on the offensive end. And for Denver, he is a major. major X-factor, not just for the Nuggets specifically, but in the whole big picture of the Western Conference playoff race and eventually for the finals, if Michael Porter can continue ascending upward over the course of the season, he provides them such a unique piece next to Nicolae Yolkich. You can run pick and roll with Yolkich handling or you can run it with Porter handling. You can use Porter off ball as a cutter. He looks very aware. I think they really have a place. here, but it's like we, it's like we talked about with Zion, though. It's all about health.

Oh, he is exactly. He is that kind of a guy that when you see him, I saw his highlights from the other night. He looks good. He looks good, man. I mean, he is a big guy, but he is great with the ball. Like, he's a good ball handler. Like, and like you were saying, like, you can have him with the ball in his hands. And he's also, you know, they, he caught one, you know, near the rim and he dunked it kind of like the Janus plays where it doesn't even look like you're jumping all that high and you can just jam it down and he's he's a good shooter. I mean, you see, you know, it kind of reminds me, you know, the early, the early Jabari Parker where you'd watch him and you go, I see what people saw when they thought that guy could be

a star. And time will tell on Porter. But I could tell you that you could only watch a one minute highlight film of what he has done in the game and you, even in that moment, you could say, God, a guy that big that's that smooth that can dribble past and shoot. I mean, you see it and you see how he was the best player in that high school class bite almost unanimously. And it's just obviously gone wrong for him health-wise since then.

But here's hoping he can put it all together because I agree with you. He looks like he could be a hell of a player. You know, speaking of injuries, I just opened up Twitter and, and, saw Patrick Mahomes suffered a knee injury tonight during Thursday night football for the Kansas City Chiefs. It looked like his knee was popped back in while he was still on the field. That's awful. I hate the fact that, you know, so many, I mean, nobody's exempt from anything in life, good or bad, but it just sucks when these talented players deal with injuries early in their careers. It saps them of their own potential, their own dreams, and us as consumers

of the sport of enjoying them in our own life. So, I mean, I hope Mahomes is going to be okay. Hope Zion is going to be okay. And hope Michael Porter stays healthy, man. Got to get to see these guys on the court. Oh, the Mahomes thing would just be awful. Yeah, that, that's, he's as big a star as there is right now in the league. That breaks my heart.

For sure. And that's, I mean, good grief. I mean, I know this isn't the NFL show, but move over, Mays and Clark. Here I come. There's only, like, I, you're coming for. Zach Kleinman's gig for the Grizzlies. You're coming for Amazing Clark. You got to do it all, Chris. Come on.

Yeah, I'll take it over. Once you, like, if there were any sure things, you got the Patriots, like probably the division winners with their Patriots, Ravens, Texans, and Chiefs, and then try to figure out who are the playoff teams. And if they lose my homes, you're taking that one off the board. I mean, the AFC is a debacle. Seriously. Can I pull a Kevin Clark real quick?

It doesn't matter because the Patriots are going to win it all anyway. Yeah, that might be so. Steal a little line from Kevin. I think he's probably right about that. That's one of his salient points that he makes regularly. Ultimately, with New England, the only question is going to be, how long do they go staying undefeated? Because that Kansas City game that they had on the schedule,

I mean, we don't know Mahomes's injury, but 6 and 0 right now, get the Jets, that's a win, get the Browns and Baker Mayfield, who was just horrific. You can't win with a quarterback. Let me just say this. NFL show. You can't, you can't win with the quarterback like Baker Mayfield. I understand, you know, the appeal of him.

I understand, yeah, he's an exciting player. But with Baker Mayfield, look, the quarterback needs to be a leadership position. And Baker has shown nothing but immaturity throughout his career, man. Oh my goodness. Look at the NFL hot. It's really a joke. I mean, when you're taking shots at other NFL quarterbacks before they take an actual snap, that's pathetic.

It's a loser. Howard over here. Did I fall asleep and wake up in some dream where I'm producing Mason Clark? He called him Kevin O'Cowardt. I mean, Colin's got a lot of iffy takes, but his take on Baker Mayfield is just so perfect, man. That is his corner, though, Kevin O'Coward.

You can't have that. I'm the back seat, man. I'm enjoying hearing him speak about Mayfield because he's right. And the Browns are never going to win anything as long as Baker Mayfields are quarterback. Damn, damn, damn. I didn't expect that. Oh, my gosh. All right, Kevin, have a wonderful weekend.

The next time we speak, the NBA regular season will be upon us. I look forward to it, Chris. This is going to be a long weekend until Tuesday because that day, boy, I'm fired up for it, man. It's going to be good. It's going to be good. I love you, Baker, even if Kevin doesn't. It's going to do it for another Rigger NBA show. Thanks to everybody for listening.

If you dig what you're hearing, go give us a rating and review on iTunes, five stars, five stars. It really helps. And we will talk to you next week.