The Ringer NBA Show - Breaking Down the NBA Trade Deadline With Sam Amick | Real Ones

Episode Date: February 13, 2023

Logan and Raja are joined by Sam Amick, senior writer for The Athletic, to recap this year’s momentous trade deadline, discuss some of the most significant moves around the league, and highlight some of their favorite trades from last week (1:03). Along the way, they talk about Russell Westbrook’s next landing spot and his strained relationship with the Los Angeles Lakers (16:55). Later, the guys talk about the new-look Dallas Mavericks and Kevin Durant’s decision to leave the Brooklyn Nets for the Phoenix Suns (33:02). Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Guest: Sam Amick Associate Producer: Jonathan Kermah Production Assistant: Kai Grady Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping everybody? This is Logan Murdoch from Real On I have some big news to share. On Saturday, February 18th, the Ringer NBA show will be hitting the road for All-Star weekend for a live show in Salt Lake City. You heard that right. We are taping the pod in front of a live audience in Salt Lake next month and we want you to join us. Pull up on us at the Stateroom in the heart of downtown Salt Lake. You can grab your tickets now at thestateroom.com. That's thestateroom. Doors open at 9 o'clock. Show is at 10. It's going to be a 21 and up event. come hang with the gang and chat midseason updates draft preview and even have a Q&A with us space is limited so grab your tickets while they last at the stateroom.com or click the link in the description of this show hope to see y'all in there what's popping real ones logan murdock here

roger bell there roja we have a friend of the show he's been here probably more than you in the last like you know several months we got we had we're recapping the trade deadline so we had to get the one and only, Sam Amick senior writer at the athletics to kind of just help us make sense of the trade deadline. How was the trade deadline for you in comparison to recent trade deadlines? Because this seemed like when we look in a few years, this is something that we're going to look back on. Like this was a monumental time for the league and where it's going.

It was a lot. A lot. What's good, gentlemen? It was a lot. We talked offline for a minute about the buildup. I mean, it was. for two months. You know what I mean? Like just no action in terms of talks and even the smallest things, you know, with all due respect to Matisse Stibble and even John Collins, like the people

we were talking about were not high profile guys. And then the Kyrie things, you guys know, it broke the dam and we had fireworks. But I did not think we'd have the kind of star power that we ended up having. But it was that slow, slow, slow build and then 11th hour last couple days, you know, things go crazy. But it was good. I told you, I'm dragging a little bit.

I was in L.A. for a couple games. And then I watched the new Mavs up in Sacramento for a couple games. So it's been a good stretch. Man, I feel like, first of all, for me, when we played, there was movement. But it was, you know, it almost felt like it was reluctant movement.

Like it feels like this new day and age of general manage and owner like they're they're ready to rock and roll they're dealing like these cats are it just feels that way I could be wrong but it feels like as of late maybe across the spectrum of sports general managers are approaching it a little different man they're ready to swing I want to get into the Kyrie since you were at the Kyrie the games in Sacramento that Kyrie played with the Mavs some of his first with the Mavs I want to get to that in a second but what I what I want to ask first Sam is And it's something that I've been thinking about over the weekend and just as I'm reading and like kind of looking at the trades itself. A lot of second round picks and draft picks being exchanged at a rate that I don't, I can also ask Raj that that I don't think that I've seen before, right? Where you are, maybe it's the sign of the times, but a lot of teams are giving away their future or giving away a lot of these things for these big time players. or we're just seeing a lot more willy-nilly trades of draft picks when they what is their importance in this day and age and why do we see so much movement on that front? And what are teams looking for when they are trading these picks at such a rapid rate? And we're seeing more of a like the second round picks, which is something that historically have been easy to get. You pay for a second round pick or you trade at the on a trade deadline for one.

But now we're seeing them getting traded so much earlier. Is there a trend there? What's the, where are we going, where are we going right now with that right now? I mean, I don't know exactly what to make of it other than you got the obvious that in terms of value contracts, you know, you got first and seconds. The first you save for your stars in terms of star trades. You know, you got to put those in the cupboard if a KD becomes available, if a guy of that caliber becomes available. You know, the seconds have become, you know, that thing where it's wild to me because, all right, the two-time MVP in Denver, was a second round pick. You know,

Roger, go back to your days, Mono Genobli was a second round pick. Draymond Green was a second round pick. So there's part of me that looks at it, says, man, these things get treated like they're just nothing. And, you know, and they can pay off. And that's where I think the teams that get them, of course, if they're building as far as the value on the contract,

you know, that gap between the scale, salary-wise, of those first and seconds, and then all of these max deals just gets wider and wider and wider over the course of the years with the cap going up and the league doing as well as it's doing. So, you know, the value is the interest to the teams that are going after them. And you play the hand you're dealt, you know what I mean? And that's where you see these teams doing this. Hey, is there a move, I mean, aside for maybe Katie or Kyrie, is there one that you like more than the rest?

Or, yeah, is there one that you think, I mean, just from an early prediction kind of standpoint that you say, yeah, that was a good one? Well, I mean, Roger, my mind kind of goes to, it's part of the 14 Westbrook stuff. Vanderbilt going to the Lakers, you know, it's a second level move. You know, but to me, part of it is I'm based near Sacramento, and I know the Kings were pretty disappointed that they didn't get Vanderbilt. They were in on that. They were trying to, I think, do two seconds, like we talk about the second conversation. You know, Vanderbilt for them would have been a guy where they've got major defense. of problems and could have done some things for them.

And I think he's going to help the Lakers. They go out, they beat the Warriors granted without Steph and Lakers without LeBron, but they have a nice show out in that first game. I mean, that guy comes to mind. I just think, like, good player, two-way player, and a guy that, and that, it fits into the Lakers story, right? They have had to now pivot from trying to go all in on nothing but Star Power. The Westbrook thing obviously doesn't go well.

They finally pivot away from that. And now the way they're constructed with Vanderbilt being part of that is a lot more resemblance of what they did to win the title in 2020. You know, more depth, more role players, more guys that compliment each other. So I thought that was a good one. So one of the things we talk about on the spot, I'm glad you brought up the Lakers, Sam, because when at least from my vantage point, when I see what the Lakers are doing at least this season, we do know that LeBron is about titles. And if he could have it as way to win a title this season, but it's not looking like that is going to. happen. So it seems like with the moves of to get a Rui, right, to get a Vanderbilt, like you said, and to shed a Pat Bev and a Russell Westbrook, is this team gearing for, I know that they want to

get as far as they can in a playoffs, but is this team gearing to build out the rest of their team, get to the summertime, maybe get a star, maybe that's Kyrie, maybe that's someone else. Are they just trying to gear to get to the next season where they can't have a fully formed team? What is the thinking behind the Lakers in this trade deadline? What do they want to do and what do they want to accomplish this season and beyond? To me, it starts with kind of cleaning house right now. And we kind of wrote about that. And it was, you know, listen, it is what it is.

This job can be tricky sometimes. And so I don't love, you know, it was not a real positive story that we had on Russ and how toxic things got at the end. And one thing, though, to start there that I felt good about was like, listen, we identified the situation as toxic. and the point being that it goes from Russ to everybody else. We talked about the fact that people have different opinions, but LeBron tweeting about Kyrie the way that he did, talking about Kyrie the way that he did publicly,

that it just created the kind of tension that for them was not something that they could sustain for the rest of the year. So they do this deal. You clean house, and now you're looking forward. To your question, Logan, I think they positioned themselves well when it comes to the chance to see what they have

with these new pieces, have a trial period for a couple of months, but then contract-wise, they're set up pretty well to just then make all those tricky decisions in the summertime. Do you do a new deal with Rui with some of these other guys? Or do you go back to the Star Route, create the cap room, bring Kyrie in, and do something like that. They're pretty flexible when the summertime comes around, but I also think it's really important as far as all the different relationships still being okay is like LeBron has to look at them and say, okay, like you hustled and you got some stuff done here,

and you didn't just leave me twisting in the wind with the same exact team. I mean, we'll see when he starts playing again, but they got some work done. Well, and that's interesting to me because Sam, we talked about it, I mean, maybe a few weeks ago. It was kind of a similar conversation about minus the championship run. What do you do as an organization for LeBron, right? Because you got to do something for him, right? that's that's kind of what I landed on was like look this isn't going to maybe we it might not be right now but we will be doing whatever we can do by way of taking swings manipulating the roster

creating the flexibility so that so that you can see what we're trying to do right like we're not just going to you can never be stationary with him it can't be a hey we're in pause mode while just bear with us like he's not going for that shit so it's always got to be look here's how we're moving but it might feel like it's neutral, but we're consistently moving and shaking to try to put pieces around you. I want to ask you both, because I've been on a seven-on-seven field all week,

and I really wasn't tapped in. But a sneaky one I kind of liked was my man Trent Renan and them down there with the clippers, like in L.A. Like the Eric Gordon and Bones Highland, like I, at least in my beautiful mind of what offense could look like and trying to guard everything

that you could have on a court, that's crazy. No, I like it. I mean, first of all, Trent, shout out is a good one. They got a loaded front office with the Clippers, and Trent does good work. And I think that the Gordon thing defensively, you know, he's giving you a whole lot more than Luke Kinnard. Some folks questioned, you know, you're losing that shooting, you know, with Luke going out. That's a little tough. Bones, I think that's, you make that deal every day of the week if you have a roster spot to tinker with because he's got a ton of talent, had gone a little sideways with the Nuggets organization.

I think just different priorities and where they needed him to... I mean, you can't have Bowen's Highland being, you know, the guy who depend on most coming off the bench. You know, they needed to change things up there. So, no, I thought the Clippers had a good run. I mean, I think the Clippers had a really good trade deadline. However, but it doesn't matter, in my mind,

what the Clippers do on the ancillary pieces because they need their stars to be good, right? As long as their stars are healthy, then they'll be fine, right? But like, no matter what, how good they do as a front office, the questions comes back to, is Paul George going to be healthy enough? Is Kauai going to be healthy down the stretch of seasons? And that's just the, that's the tricky dynamic. Like how, I guess that's my question to you, Sam. Like, how do the clippers continue to be able to, you know, not kick the can down the road?

But how are they going to be able to keep going through these seasons where every season seems the same, right? Where they're like, okay, we got Kauai back and healthy. we have Paul George back in healthy. Oh, wait, no, we don't. Not yet. Not yet. Not yet. But they will get back.

How long can they keep doing this, I guess? Because it's always seems like it's a holding pattern with them. The ceiling is always could be very high, but then you always have the two stars where it's like, damn, can they get healthy and get right to be able to, you know, justify all the supplemental pieces? I mean, they can't do it forever. I'm staying in the obvious there. But as far as the mood, you know, there have been times during this season when I was

around them a little bit. And you feel that angst, you feel that impatience. And Tai Liu comes to mind. You know, there's a lot of folks who know Ty this year have been like, all right, this has been a really hard year for him. And one of the points that somebody made to me recently was that everybody kind of saw last season as a success because they did so much with the guys out. And it feels like internally, that might not be the way that it felt be the way that it, you know, was perceived.

that this is not just a year this season of frustration, impatience, that not having those guys, that they didn't have any warm, fuzzy feelings about last year just because they did more than folks thought they could do without Kauai and PG. So you now have a longer runway of angst that they've kind of experienced as humans. And now you have the questions going forward. I mean, Steve Bomber is probably, you know, he's one of the most impatient guys in the league in terms of being an owner.

And I'm looking contract-wise, you know, PG and Kauai have got options in 24, 25. You know, that's kind of around the corner. And in terms of roster construction and who they are as a team, that point guard situation continues to be an issue, you know, the fact that, and we'll see what happens here, but Paul George is out there publicly talking about Adam Russ. You know, he obviously, you know, rocks with him still, you know,

shows you at minimum that, like, Paul thinks they need more and Paul's trying to recruit and get that thing done. The other night, they lose to the Mavs when they got Kyrie and No Luca, and somebody on Press Row had said to me, like, man, it's one of those games where you look at it, it's like they, Clippers played pretty well, but they lost, you know, and they've been playing well lately, but like they lost, and they just look like they didn't have enough. And, you know, it feels that way. I mean, lightning in a bottle, if they have all these kind of circumstances come, you know,

the right way at the right time in the playoffs, of course, they can be championship caliber, but you know it's so hit and miss with them. That's just so like the worst part in the league though, is just to be in the middle, right? Like it's just you don't, and that's where the clippers are at this point, right? Yeah, the worst part is to be in the middle, but the even, I mean,

if you were to take it a step further, would be to have all of this like tangible talent, all of these things that, that should, you know, the teams are in the middle that don't have the stars. Like that's one thing, right? It's a bad place to be. But when you've got that high end talent

and it just, for whatever reason, injuries or, you know, disconnect, whatever you have going on. If you stay in the middle with that, I mean, that's an even tougher spot to be in. And so it's not, you know, when you have that, it just everything is under a more intense microscope. The time feels like it's ticking quicker. You know, it's the same with LeBron. Like when you have him, it's a gift and a curse. You got a great talent. But that fucking clock starts moving like triple time.

Do you know what I mean? So like, you're like, hey, man, we got to get to. this shit right. And so when I hear you talk about T. Liu and inside the building, you know, maybe not feeling like it was as much of a success or at least a moral victory last year, it makes sense because you're on that, you're on that expedited clock. Like, it's time to work. And you expect those, you know, those results. And so that becomes even worse than if you're just a middle of the pack team because you have middle of the pack talent. And to hammer that point, Roger, like, why is that? It's because this is a title or bust team. It just is,

you know what I mean? And even to give a quick contrast in my neck of the woods, like, take the king's situation and apply it to a bunch of other different teams. The kings can do a victory lap this season if they get in the playoffs. You know what I mean? Like that, they might throw a damn many parade if they get in the playoffs. That's not the reality for a team like the Clippers or a lot of these squads because of the star power. Because when Kauai and Paul came to town, you know, they thought they had the cheat code. And it just hasn't worked out that way.

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at least from a player's perspective, their pursuit of Russell Westbrook. They're not even making this a secret. They're like, hey, anybody, any, anybody, if you have your recorder out, come here and I want to tell you that we want Russell Westbroke on the team. How likely is that to happen? And what is Russ is kind of standing in the league right now, right?

because, man, it was rough. It was rough with the Lakers, right? And it really did a lot for his reputation. His reputation is, however you want to call it, it wasn't good for Russ, that experience right there. What is the feeling about Russ around the league and where, what is his most likely landing spot at this point? Because I know the Bulls are out there as well.

He's currently with the jazz, but the Clippers have done, pun intended, the full core press for Russ. Like, where does he kind of, where is he at in this universe so i mean i don't have total clarity on on where we should handicap those you know landing spots but clippers heat pulls pulls thank you the chicago thing to me on paper looks really really smart and if you're russ you might want to just get a different vibe than l a after what just happened now granted family wise everything set up for him out there

maybe he would disagree and and he's got the history with paul and if he has the full backing of the Clippers group, then maybe he feels confident enough about the Clippers move. I got mixed signals when I was in L.A. about how they saw that situation. It feels like one of those where the players are going to be on one track, front office,

maybe on another one. So we'll see how that turns out. In terms of desperation, though, which is always part of this calculus, I think the Bulls are more desperate than the Clippers for somebody like Russ. One of our guys does a good great job covering the Bulls at the athletic. Darnel Mayberry actually used to cover Russ in

OKC for the longest early in his career, knows him really, really well, wrote a piece today kind of saying, you know, hear me out. Here's why Russ works for the Bulls. And he kind of had me buying it as I read his story. So, you know, I don't know where he's going to go. But the Chicago thing does feel if you're Russ and you're obviously trying to extend this runway on your career, you don't want to go the way of Carmelo and just have a long absence where you're not even employed. And the perception being that you just couldn't look yourself in the mirror and come to grips with where you were as a player, you know, maybe in Chicago could have some promise is the way I see. I think Clippers, you know, you go there and it's messy.

Guess what? You're the fall guy again. It's going to happen the same way it did with the Lakers. Yeah, that was, I'm glad you said that, because that's where I was kind of going with that. if I'm Russ, the interesting part is what are his priorities when making the decision? Like what what weighs heaviest and factors into that decision the most for him and just haven't been a free agent? There's a lot of play there, right?

Like there's winning. There's, you know, I mean, he's made all the money in the world. And so when I say finances, I don't mean right now. But in terms of, you know, stretching that career out and still being viable as a, you know, as a player on a good championship level team, like in restoring the faith in that. there's all kind of stuff that goes in. And I would just say, like, if I was Russ, not that, but I am a Russ fan. If there's any disconnect at all between front office and players, I'm staying away from

that at all costs. That's what I'm supposed up. I cannot afford that to the last point you just made. I'm going somewhere where they're like, yo, we want you. I'm looking the owner in the face, the general manager in the face, and you know what this is, and I need you to tell me that this is, you want me here. And that's how I'm making this decision. I'm not basing it off of fields, playing with dudes,

like wanting to win. We're going to restore this. We're going somewhere what they want. When did it get to the point, Sam? And I agree with Roger, bro. You want to go where everyone is on the same. Everybody's loving you, bro, where everyone is there. When did it get to the point with the Lakers where it was just too much to bear?

Because, you know, me and Roger see it on television. And, you know, I see the Lakers a few times out the year. but you're locked in one of when did it get to a point where it was a point of no return because there was a time watching the game at the the the the lakers game when when brawn breaks the record it was just an interesting microcosm and how that team is right now or was pre-trade deadline you got lebron going for a record you have russ playing very angry and one of the most interesting 27 point games i've ever seen right where he's clearly just like in defiance of the whole of the whole or organization and also probably knowing he's about to get traded. But when did they get to the point of that level of toxicity with Russ? Or as an organization in general, when did that point get to where it was just too much to bear? And it was like, okay, we can't even get through this season with Russ. And we have to get rid of them and put them off the roster.

So before I jump into the timeline, I would probably say to me, what we can't forget is like they technically, like they did not ever do the deal to just get rid of him. You know what I mean? Which I think it gets kind of framed that way. They did this deal because they got a lot back. And part of that was they also obviously part of ways with Russ. But the whole time that this situation was unfolding, going back to last summer all the way through the year, I would debate with one of our guys about this, like, who covers the Lakers, Yovan Buha.

Like they're not saying yes to these trades where the only objective is to part ways with Russ. And I think that nuance kind of matters. And that remained true until the end. But, you know, capital B, but things got really tough at the end. And honestly, if I look back on it, it starts when AD gets hurt. Because before he got hurt, they're winning some games. Russ is buying into his six-man role. Things are going okay.

In mid-December, I think it was, I go down to L.A., and I ended up writing that, like, I was told from somebody who 100% would know that at that time, it was pretty unlikely that Russ was going to get moved because they saw the fact that he had bought in. They were playing games and the people around their winning games, people around him were no longer pointing the finger at him. So he wasn't seen as a big part of the problem. But when AD got hurt, now you're losing games. Now the fingers come out again and it got more and more and more uncomfortable. Then, you know, and this, you know, this stuff could wind up in a book someday. Like, then you get into LeBron coming up on the scoring record and the optics and the way everybody moved during that time.

I almost feel like that was, you know, salt in the wound, if you will. Like, Russ is already kind of on the outs. And now the entire vibe is just all hail LeBron. Like, that's kind of how things are. And in Russ, I think, you know, not just ever speak for a guy, but like it feels like he's looking at it like, all right, we're trying to play ball here. and now you've got all this pomp and circumstance happening. And for it to kind of peak on that night when he breaks the record, you know,

when there's all this studying of AD on the bench and what he's doing and all these things, like the mood was not good for any of them. And LeBron's kind of out there on his island celebrating with his family. So at the end, it was bad. It was really bad. And it's crazy. It was weird, man. It was weird.

I mean, this was a long time ago, Logan, I don't know if you remember this, and we talked about Russ. And I really felt strongly that for that to have any success and for Russ to buy in, it had to be consistent. And so he had to be in that place and in that role. And the things around him that would stop him from playing a bigger role had to consistently be there, like be available, and be playing up to the level that would clearly. you know, mandate that we, this is where you need to be, Russ. We're winning. These guys are doing their job as the alphas. And so here's how you fit into that equation.

And any wiggle off of that script, i.e. like injury and person out of the lineup or people not playing well or even losing was going to let someone like Russ and allow him the wiggle room to get up out of that box and then the shit strokes started again. Right. And like, but that's for me, I mean, it's bigger picture like broader strokes. you know, their inability, like, again, it's not AD's fault necessarily. But when you're injured as much, it's really difficult for any team, not just the Lakers. Like we were just talking about the Clippers, when people aren't available and they're in and out of lineups,

and they're injured and we're going on stretches. And we don't know if they're back for 20 games. That shit's really hard for even professional athletes to figure out how to win in that environment. What about there's also the LeBron element to this, as you know, Sam, you're running a Lakers a lot. I don't know if LeBron necessarily has veto power, but he does have a lot of power within that organization. When did the disconnect between him and Russ become too much to bear in that way, right?

Because you could see, I don't know if that clip was, it looked like the Sacramento King's locker room or the visitor's locker room, Sam, where they have the famous video now where LeBron's like, let's go get greedy. And then Russ is like, all right guys just have fun have fun let's do that right but there seemed to be a disconnect just from those two guys and both of those guys are alpha make no mistake about it right like no matter

what happens russ is an alpha and he's used to owning locker rooms that's just that's literally how he why he's a future hall of famer but where was that when did they come to that disconnect because lebron is one of the guys that was the big biggest voices in getting russ in purple and gold now they are kind of going apart when did that when did that happen and when did they get him to a point where it was like, no, it's, I got to sweet about Kyrie coming into town now. And I got to sit down with Michael Wilbon and talk about it. Yeah. I mean, it ebbed and flowed, I think. One of these days, maybe when LeBron's a lot older, I don't care if it's on the shop or ESPN or our place. I don't care where the interview happens. I really want to see the interview where we get the truth from LeBron about the Russ experience. Because to your question, I found it fascinating all the way through, you know, when they kind of recruited Russ. They're looking at DeMar the Rosen. You know, they're even kind of flirting with Damie Lillard at that time, as you've written and talked about Logan.

All that stuff's happening. And LeBron absolutely was a driving force in picking Russ. And personality-wise, you know, my first reaction was like, oh, wow. Like, I mean, I've been in Russell Westbrook locker rooms. They can be tense. They can be, you know, intense and not always in a bad way. But, like, you know, LeBron's a light guy. LeBron's a fun guy.

You know, how's that part going to go? You know, to your question about how it, you know, when it got too bad, I think it ebbed and flowed. You know, I had somebody tell me the other day and probably oversimplifying, but it was, you know, kind of put to me that like 30 days after Russ came to the Lakers that it was already like this vibe from LeBron that, that, oh, maybe this wasn't the right way to go. You know, it's like, wait a minute. Like we had buddy healed, you know, on the table coming to the Lakers that deal with the Kings.

And LeBron wasn't making it a secret of his disdain for Russ when he did have disdain for Russ. Like he was very subliminal in how he talked about it, but you guys know, like, and behind the scenes, LeBron was really just, he would occasionally pop shots at Russ. I think, I mean, he, to be fair to LeBron, like, I didn't come across a ton of that. What comes to mind for me is early on, but this does speak to the personality difference. You know, I remember when Russ had a terrible home opener with the. Lakers. Remember that? I forget who they played. Against the Warriors. We were both at the game, I think.

Yeah. And you remember how LeBron like it was almost like he was post-game therapy for Russ publicly, like during his press conference. He's talking about how I told Russ to go home and hug his family and watch Netflix. And, you know, it was just kind of like, but the takeaway for me was that LeBron had just gotten like his first

real front row glimpse at like Russ's intensity where he, his inclination was to just kind of tell him, hey, just go find something to binge and go relax. this is not the end of the world, but that's not how Russ is wired. So you kind of had, you know, signs early on of how they were just different. And AD absolutely was part of that on the LeBron side. Like, AD's a pretty light guy. And they do, I think, off the floor have genuine affection

for him. And again, in the interest of fairness, like people speaks really, really highly of Russ as a person. And there was always that qualifier. But as a competitor, you know, this was a mismatch. And the fact that to your question about like when did LeBron feel like he was out, it seemed fairly early. And I think that made the whole thing incredibly challenging because of what they had lost to make that move. You know, they were going a different direction. They were doing that deal with the Kings. That was basically done. And next thing you know, word came down, you know, from kind of the superstar heavens that that wasn't the way they wanted to go.

just uh part of me just wants to like to your point out i do want to get to some of the other trades we'll do that after i say this but like i do want to get to a point where lebron just has true serum because you know lebron's super calculated it was like he's so calculated that i was almost happy to see him like around kareem like after he broke that record because he finally just let the guard down. But I'm going to be curious to see how he truly feels the fact that he kind of made this mess and not wasted two years, but a lot of this has to do with what he did, his decision making. I will be curious to see how he, I will know, say, spins it, but I would love to hear his truthful take on how he feels about this one day. I mean, I think it's good for the Lakers

purposes right now that they at least did enough at the dead list. It kind of goes back to the stuff we were hitting on before. They did enough at the deadline to where he might not be looking square in the mirror, but he's at least glancing at it. You know what I mean? Like he tweeted the line about maybe it's me when Kyrie went to Dallas. But the undercurrent of that to me, guys, was, you know, like he had been informed that the Lakers put both first round picks on the.

the table. And all of his frustration with the Lakers to that point had been, you remember how he's tweeting about the Rams, GM, you know, F them picks. And like that was his whole narrative was, if only they would put those picks on the table, I could get the kind of help that I deserve. And even if we had ridden that, that had been the sense. And it's like, oh, wait a minute, they did put the first on the table. And then, you know, the deal just went the other way. And Dallas had a better package. So politically right now, that's a good thing for the Lakers, because He can't accuse him of just not at least attempting to do something here. Logan, Raja, what's going on?

Realist of ones. You know who it be Jomey. And I got a quick question for the two of y'all ballers shot callers. Okay? The Lakers put Russ on a bus and brought Dilo to crypto. With all the moves they made over this trade deadline, they're like basically a whole different deal. Do they still have a shot to make a run in the playoffs?

Or are these moves just setting them up for next year? I'll take my answer off the air. I want to go to talk about the dismantling of the Brooklyn Nets and just the ramifications of that really quickly. So, and just go to the other side of that trade. You were just in Sacramento to see Kyrie and the New Look Mavs with Luca Dotsich. and just the new look Mavs in general. Where are the Mavs head at right now, right?

Because are they in the mode where they feel like they have to sell themselves on Kyrie? Because Kyrie has not signed an extension yet. What is that dynamic like? And what is the, what are the early vibes telling you about Kyrie and the Mavs and where that's going to be as a partnership going forward? Ah, man, to be determined.

You know, I think it's going to be fun to watch. You know, they lose to the Kings and the debut with Luca and Kyrie together, but you see glimpses. It's, you know, and this part was actually a lot of fun to watch. Like, it's cool to watch star. Like, you know, these are high-level stars, Luca, Kyrie, you know, go through the creative process of figuring out how to play with one another. And so it's a tight game in Sacramento and late in that game. You can see the deference coming from Kyrie because it's Lucas team.

And then at the end, and Luca spoke on this afterwards in the OT period, you know, he ends up missing a step back three from the left wing. When Kyrie had maybe had a better look off to the side, Luca says publicly, I should have passed it back to Kyrie. And so they're figuring it out, the power structure, and they're going to be good. That's the here and the now. Defensively, they're going to struggle. We know that.

But it feels big picture very much like it's a trial period. I would not be shocked at all if Kyrie was somewhere else this summer. And even the fact that the way things unfolded after that trade went down, I think probably applied a fair amount of pressure to the Mavs. If they, in fact, want to have some kind of long-term relationship with Kyrie, you look up a couple days after you get all the NBA headlines, and now here come the Phoenix Suns with Kevin Durant in the Western Conference. And, oh, by the way, with a point guard in Chris Paul,

whose contract next season is only guaranteed for half his salary. And there's an avenue for, if you need to bring Kyrie out to Phoenix and get him back with Kevin, you can do that. If Kyrie wants to go to the Lakers, you can do that. You know, like the Mavs do not have pole position here, in my opinion. And, you know, and I don't know if they want it yet. They got to see how it looks, but the landscape changed quick. All right.

I got a few thoughts. Number one, to answer your question, Logan, that you originally asked, like, there's, it doesn't matter what it looks like with Kyrie right now. It's of no consequence because if he's proven nothing over his career is, It don't matter what it looks like right now because tomorrow he can make his mind up that something wasn't right or he was offended and he just moves different in that way. It's not even, I don't necessarily see it as a negative. I see Kyrie as a dude and an athlete as a human being that doesn't subscribe to having to like conform to what you think normal is in the way an NBA player or athlete in general is supposed to act. Like he just does kind of what he wants to do.

Now, if I were on his team, and I've said this before, sometimes that could be really fucking selfish, and it could put teams in really shitty spots. But I think he just really is a dude who was like, yo, that shit could be really good today. And I could have all the feels and really want to be here. And I could wake up two days from now and just tell you, hey, man, I'm good. I want to be out. He just, it's the way he moves, right? Like, he's giving me enough of a sample size now. I do have a question, Sam.

I don't know if you can really answer this. I'm fascinated by it. the relationship between KD and Kyrie. Like, is that, is it still really strong? Like, as you mentioned, the possibility of maybe, you know, in the future, like, did KD, like, deep down harbor any, like, kind of resentment for the way Kyrie moved in Brooklyn? Like, I don't know. I'm asking.

No, I honestly don't, I mean, Logan looks like he might know. He's not. And I don't truly know. And I think common sense tells you, I think outside looking in, we look at it. how in the hell could you not? You know, I mean, you had a plan. We know the video was at the Charlotte All-Star weekend when Kyrie and Kevin were talking about teaming up together. So it went from that where Kyrie holds the two fingers up and says they got two max spots.

And that ends up being Brooklyn. And then you add James Harden to the mix and you had a runway where you could have been champions again. But that didn't happen. It's hard to imagine he doesn't have some hard feelings over that. but also Kevin in general just I think is a guy who compartmentalizes

I really think he does and I think basketball wise if he looked at it and saw Kyrie is the best path to more success in Phoenix maybe he looks at it

and even quick final thought there like I would like to know the current state of the Durant Chris Paul dynamic you know there were times in the past

where they didn't seem to be the best of friends and you know I mean this league is you know guys just just end up deciding it's time to go to work and be professional and work together. But, you know, there's nuance, there's complications there.

But I don't know. I don't know where he's at with Carrie. Have I had to guess, I think that they're better than most people would think. You know, I think that, you know, everything that I had heard when I was out there and all the stuff that I'd seen, and I'm sure Roger can corroborate some of the stuff and stuff and stuff that he heard, whenever there was the front office stuff, it would always seem like Kevin and Kyrie were just against the front office and what they deemed were messups from the front office. And I don't think it's a coincidence that each time that Kyrie made a

trade request, Kevin was right behind him. Like, oh, okay, I guess we're leaving now. It wasn't, and it wasn't one of those things where it seemed like they were like, okay, we're here until we're not. And their partnership is in Brooklyn has always been sort of together. Okay, I guess we're going to go to Brooklyn. And if it doesn't work out, then I guess we'll do. but that's not going to affect our friendship. And I think that there, I don't know, I don't think there's a beef at all. I think that it was,

it's just one of those things where, um, you know, whether it's, it seems logical to us or not, that doesn't really matter. But I felt like, you know,

when, and I've reported this in the past, and I've said this type of stuff in the past where, you know, when Kyrie had a problem with the front office, Kevin was also like, man, why y'all not treating him good?

Why y'all not, why y'all not, why are you guys not being better to Kyrie during this situation, right? And he would always defend Kyrie. And even when I talked to him last year, he was talking about how, you know, it is frustrating that Kyrie isn't out there. But like, it's his life. And, you know, I respect him and I want to play with him for a long time.

That was basically the gist of what it was. And I don't think that that changes. And also, like, I don't think, I think that there is, if there is an operative, this is just what I just think. And I don't know if they've been in cahoots and thinking of these. things, but I could see a world where, you know, they play together again, right? Where it's just like, hey, it didn't work out. It's not working out in Dallas.

Do you want to figure this out in Phoenix? Do you want to do that? I could see that them, I could see that happening. What should take, right? You smile. Jesus Christ, bro. That's a, geez. God, that's a lot.

No, and you might be right, because I don't, I don't know KD like that at all. And the compartmentalizing thing is, is, is, is. was really interesting to me because, you know, those dudes really do have an ability to kind of, you know, when you're on a quest for legacy and championships and status as an all-time great, you develop the ability to do that. So if Kyrie is the piece he deems gets him closer to all of that, I could see that. But I mean, as a human being, like, it would be really hard for me to believe that after all it transpired there in Brooklyn, Kevin Durant somewhere deep down, in his fields.

Like it might not be the prevailing feeling he has for Kyrie, but somewhere deep down, you're like, yo man, you fucking, like, some of that was some bullshit, bro. Like, we, you know what I mean? Like, come on. On my end, it's like, bro, I came all the way out to New York, and, you know, I was slated to go to the Knicks, so now I'm going to the next.

So now I've got to deal with this? How much of it, and Logan, with all the time you spent, and we covered Kevin together during the Warriors chapter, but, you know, you've done a lot more deeper reporting with him. Like, how much of this, not to get on the therapist's couch, but like is if you look at the arc here of the choice to leave the warriors i feel like there's an element potentially here of stubbornness from kevin in terms of like if you if you admit that you're frustrated by kairie that it almost makes it like it's an indictment of all the choices you made

before you know like you chose to leave a warriors environment that across the league people would agree you know has been the healthiest out there for a long time until recently but like you know you made these choices and and if you see sit there and say, damn, I screwed up. And it's because of this guy who is frustrating me, you know, maybe you don't want to make that admission. Yeah. It's interesting. I don't really have a great answer for that

if it's a because we both know in covering Kevin, it can just be a whole period of different things going through his head and stuff, right? But I don't know. I don't know if it I struggle because I'm on the fence of, he does care about, you know, his warrior's legacy. because he always talks about it, right?

And it's always being relitigated. But in this case, I think he was a bit removed from the Warriors situation. And I could be wrong. I'm also speculating on this particular question because I hadn't thought about it. I'm kind of thinking it through as you're saying. I think that no matter what he was going to leave the Warriors that he already had a plan in that 19th season, he was going to go. I don't think he foresaw all of this happening

and I think he's more of in the now than anything. I think that he's come to grips with how he feels about the Warriors in that era. I think he's also at, I think all those parties are involved are kind of at peace

with him leaving and I think that they're all kind of like Kevin and the Warriors, at least the players, are kind of like this, right? They're kind of there, they're his relate, Katie's relationship with Draymond is really good. His relationship with Steph is really good.

The relationship with Clay is really good. But I think that that he's more of just like, you know, I can't speculate on what he thinks, but I don't think that it would be a cascading of like, damn, you know, I can't admit this because people will admit this about me and admit this about me. At minimum, I love the fact that like if you look at Kyrie's choice that he's going to have to make down the line, that we got into the KD complications. I mean, shoot, if he goes to L.A., you know, it wasn't that long ago that we thought it was wild to have LeBron and Kyrie under the same roof again. And now you see how, and part of it, and I've never been in this position, if you're an elite talent like that, you've got to at some point realize, like, if I'm trying to succeed and partner up with guys on my level, there's only so many of them, you know?

and you see especially over the course of time how wounds can get healed and things can get better. I mean, the idea that LeBron was recruiting Kyrie is not something I would have seen two, three years ago. I wanted to ask Rajah about this. I know he had something to say, but Ra, it isn't interesting

that the reason why Kyrie left LeBron was to have his own team and be his own man in a lot of ways. And now this could either go one or two ways. Like he there's a, I mean, there's always a chance. I don't know if like how big of it, how, how, I don't know how likely it is that Kyrie will be a Phoenix son. I don't even know where it's at. And I do want to ask about like there's a new ownership.

There's a lot of things at play before Kyrie can even think to go to Phoenix. Like I think, I don't know if it's even that much of a possibility. But isn't it kind of, you've been around Kyrie? How is it the fact that, you know, he, what does it say about him that, you know, he fought so much to have his. own thing to now he there's a potential that he could go back to lebron and could be the third best player on a team and now go back into do all that to go back into the situation that he was in a few years ago well i mean i what does it say about him i mean i think you know i think it speaks to where where he was um you know in terms of his maturity when he decided to leave lebron overall big

picture, you know, as a young star in the NBA. And I think it's a pretty natural kind of progression that most players go through where you come in, even if you are this great talent, like a lot of them, you know, in the best situations, get someone, you know, that can kind of mentor you and tutor you. And I talk about this all the time, right? And kind of, you know, LeBron, Kyrie had those lean years. Then LeBron came in. And not unlike LeBron going to the heat, where he says he kind of learned how to win. LeBron comes in, helps Kyrie get to where Kyrie wants to go and feels like, okay, and I've learned how to do this now.

I want to try it on my own. I think that's natural for those apex predators to feel like, yo, I want to take my swing at that. I think, you know, but as you mature and as you go out and as you, you know, try and either succeed or fail, you realize, hey, I can either do this on my own or that's a lot, you know, and maybe not everyone's built. for that. Like, only a select few are. And that doesn't take away any of your brilliance as a player. But like, not everybody can do that. Not everybody can carry the weight of a franchise and win

championships. And so, you know, I think as he matured and trial and error and figuring it out, I think he's at a point where he realizes, hey, listen, to win those chips, you know, I might be the most gifted player with the ball in my hands on our team. But it doesn't necessarily mean that I'm the face of this and that I'm the guy that has to carry the brunt of the of the media and and of the responsibility of being the face of this franchise on my shoulders. I don't think he operates great in that space personally. Now, I don't, I've never asked him about it. But just from the outside looking in, you know, I think that's what it says, Logan. It says like, I've matured. I understand this now. Like I tried that for whatever reason. It might not even have anything to do with my specific skill set or

the way I play. But all of the shit behind the scenes and all of the accountability and all. All of the, you know, there's a lot that goes into being that dude. I don't want that. And so I, you know, it's okay, though. That's not, listen, that doesn't. I could say all of that and say he's still maybe the most talented person in the world with a ball in his hands. But the rest of that requires a lot.

And not everybody wants that. I want to ask you a question real quick, though. I want to ask you a question. Yeah, because the last time we was on here, you and I had a little, a little disconnect on our, on our thoughts about Brooklyn as it pertain to the moves they were making and where they were. And then a couple other dominoes fell. So I'm curious, right?

I took a lot of heat, lightweight for what I said about them nets. Yeah, I took a little bit, a little bit. What are our feels about them? Because we touched on them. My thing on this, and I'm curious to get Sam's point of view on this, my point of view is this is the nets right now are probably at like, they're back at what they do best, which is accumulating picks,

which is developing guys that you might not think would be as good as they are, developing guys into being overachievers, right, and getting to a place where they can build a foundation to maybe get or trade for a free agent, right? Which is what they did in 1819. The problem is they have not proven for better or worse that, and this is also a, this is a very unique case, but they have proven at this point, and I'm curious to get Sam's point, They have proven that they at this point don't know how to handle superstars and what they can and what superstars bring in terms of baggage and how you manage that. So that's a question that they're going to have to ask for themselves. And so when that comes back around, which I'm sure they want to get into star business, they're the Brooklyn Nets.

They're in New York. You want to have star power when you're on that team. When you're competing for viewers or people away from the Knicks, when you're in New York, you want to have stars. it's going to be interesting because I think that they have the infrastructure to build back into a borderline playoff team. But I think

the next step is they're going to have to learn from this experience and figure out how they are going to manage the star player and star talent. What do you think about that? What do you think about where the nets are, Sam? But also what I said,

I mean, you're locked in as well. What do you think about that? I mean, the first question that comes of mine for me is one for the summertime and the job security of Sean Marks and his front office just being real like there had been chatter all throughout the season even a little bit going into last year that you know front office people and this is it's a cold game right so like people who are always looking around trying to figure out you know while I work here but but I wouldn't mind working over for this franchise like it these executives have a vested interest

in trying to have their finger on the pulse of who is in trouble around the NBA and you would hear the Nets group's name come up pretty regularly. And I can't imagine that all this messiness that led to the, you know, just dramatic breakup of what they had going helps when it comes to that dynamic with Joe Si, their owner and Sean. So I'm curious to see how Joe sees that this summer. How does Joe Si feel about, you know, the part that Sean marks and his group played in the way things went down, you know, because, and that matters because it's going to be who's making the calls here. You know, in terms of how they did, yeah, I mean, it's a hell of a lot better than losing future Hall of Famers and then having

an empty cupboard, you know what I mean? You're talking about five first round picks, a pick swap, these seconds, you know, and a bunch of really good players, the Cam Johnson's, the McHale Bridges, you know, Dinwiddie, Dorian Finney Smith, you know, what they got back for Jay Crowder and the buck steel. So they've got options, they've got avenues, they've got a lot of game planning to do. Within all of that, it becomes, okay, who, if you're going to get back in the star business again, who is it? Who are you trying to pluck? You know, who is up free agency-wise or who is unhappy and you're trying to look at trade-wise. You know, I know, no names come to mind for me and they might need to take a breath before they even think about going down that road. But they have options.

You know, they're not left flat-footed, I don't think, at all. So let's get to the Phoenix part of it. I keep teetering back and forth on if Phoenix is the favorite to come out of the West because, man, the talent level is so great there. And I'm curious to see what they do with their bench. And Katie is so good. And Devin Booker is really good. And same with Chris Paul. What is, where do you see from them? What do you think, where do you think that their ceiling is?

Where do you think that they can go? And what are your, is this a, oh, we can win a title right now? or is it like, hey, we got these guys and maybe we can round out the roster when we do it over the summer and we'll go for a title? I don't know they want a title this season. What are the realistic possibilities of that happening? I think that they can get out of the West.

I do not think they could beat the Celtics coming out of the East. I don't think that they can win a title necessarily, but I do think they're obviously contender. Where do you see them right now? Wait, so you just plug, Celtics got plugged in, right? So I just, I didn't miss that. You just plugged them in. We're not even going to have a conversation about that, huh?

I'm like that conversation. Okay, okay. All right. I'm, I'm glad to here. I just, I had Janus in my head. Like, Janus got no love over here, you know. Jay Crowder just added to the mix. Like, what?

That's why, that's why you my dog, raw. That's why you my dog. We're good. I was just curious. Man, that Boston idiot. Against the Eastern Conference. I think, I think there's, they got to go up against the Celtics would be tough, against the Bucks who would be tough, against the Sixers,

if they make it would be tough, right? But I think in the Western Conference, I think they have obviously a legitimate chance to come out of the West. I should have named the other teams, excuse me, but if they go to the Eastern, play any team against the Eastern Conference,

I don't think that they're getting out of that. What do you think about their ceiling? The Suns are in an interesting place. They have new ownership who is trying to make a big splash. They are, you know, they have some older pieces. They don't have the depth that they used to. but they have a rejuvenation.

Where do you see the Sons right now, Sam? I like what they have, and I don't agree with. I think they could win the whole thing. And I got memories of covering that Bucks' sons finals, you know, the Sons being up to games, you know what I mean? And that's without Kevin Duran. This is a team that, you know, they took a downturn. They've had injuries. They've had the D'Andre Aden, messiness, all that stuff.

you know, if Kevin can be healthy, if they have health as a group, I think they're on the short list to get this thing done. But chemistry is going to matter. We got to see, you know, I hate trying to analyze these super teams because I have been wrong so many times in the past. Like, I mean, I thought the Rust thing was going to work with the Lakers, which I'd have to keep repeating because I was so wrong. Like, you got to own these. We were to. That year, I think we picked the Lakers and the Nets to go to the finals that year. That was far from the truth.

And so then, and so who knows? Kevin gets out there and D. Book is, you know, not happy that he's getting a few fewer shots. And if Chris Paul looks like he's, you know, even older than he is, you know, I don't know. But I have a great amount of faith in Kevin as a player. The guy is just incredible. And I think, you know, shown throughout the course of his warrior's tenure and, you know, the Thunder thing was different. It was KD and Russ.

But like the Warriors thing showed his ability to adapt was remarkable. And to be himself, even when surrounded by. great talent. You know, that's a blueprint you can apply now to the suns. They're going to be monsters. I mean, D. Book, you know, I talked to him early this season. And, man, things changed quickly. But like, we did this long interview where he was kind of sarcastically joking. Like, yeah, man, I guess I'm not even in the MVP conversation. When at the time, like, his numbers were just bonkers. And they were winning games. You know, then they had health stuff. Then they started losing. But Devin, when healthy, is a beast. So I like what they have.

chemistry, you know, we joke about the bucks and all that. If you just talk about the elite squads, Milwaukee and a short list of teams like that, the continuity is going to be their friend in the playoffs. You know what I mean? Like that's where they have it all over teams like the Sons and some of these other teams. But I think they could do it right now.

I think their intention is to do it right now. This is not a slow build. I mean, Kevin, with all the injuries he's been through, you cannot wait whatsoever. The key, though, Roz, Devin Booker, that's the key because we've seen what he's done in the postseason and also what he hasn't done it's a big spring for devon booker oh one 100% for a lot of for a lot of reasons but you know i think i think i hope he's at a point in his career where the priorities are

are in place and by that i mean like you know your young players you're you're trying to be that MVP. Like, that could be the focus. Like, yeah, I'm going to say way I want to win a championship. But if, if we're being honest, like the MVP, I'm not saying Devin Booker specifically, but just a young player. Like, you win a championship because everybody says that. And yeah, we'd love to do that, but my, I want to get that MVP, right? Because that's sometimes how a young player can think. And I think Devin Booker having been to the places he's been in the playoffs and come up slightly short is at a place in his career where he makes that work. At least I hope that's where we're right because i think you know the sons deserve that he deserves a chris paul deserves it um the valley

deserves it and so i think he's at that place and what's you know i look at it kind of like golden state from this perspective like obviously golden state had won a championship already but if you just embrace like like golden state players embraced the bucket that is kevin durant and what what he does in terms of freeing you up as a devon booker or a clay thompson or even a stepf curry you know offensively because he can have a bad game, Devin Booker. Now. You have a fucking bad game and you got Kevin Durant. And also on the other side of that,

Kevin Durant can have a bad game. For sure. When was the last, with the variance of stuff, when was the last time Katie could just have a bad game and they beat like his team would be okay? And Raja, too, this is your expertise real quick. Like, what about the defensive side of the ball? Like, not only can he have a bad game,

but guess what, he can guard his ass off. And from an energy standpoint, he's got a little more in the tank on that end because of the help. Sam, I'm going to tell you like this, man, people, you know, don't realize when you're talking about these stars and what they have to do offensively, right? And I didn't have respect enough for this either because I was a defensive player, right? No one really asked me to ever carry the load offensively. So I got traded to Charlotte, tell a quick story. And we didn't have a ton of, like, guys that were the primary focus of your offense. but, you know, usually is Raymond Felton, Gerald Wallace,

like those guys were our primary scores, and I was more of a role guy, but for some reason, one of them was out, and Larry Brown in Portland decided, you know, I'm going to run offense for you tonight as if I had Reggie Miller or Rip Hamilton. Like, you know, I'd like to come off screens, catch and shoot, and all of that.

And so I became the primary offensive player. I was exhausted. I couldn't guard shit. I couldn't because that's a lot of work, man, like trying to do that. And so you're absolutely right. Like, again, just the insulation that provides all around allowing you to do more things and take on extra responsibility in certain areas.

I just think it's a, if accepted and embraced, and I really believe they're at a point, well, they'll do that because I have all the faith in the world in Monty. I think James Jones is a young star. I just think that they'll get that right now. Whether they win the championship or not, you know, there's a lot that goes into that. But I do have faith in it. And I think they'll be there. in and about.

Hey, get Raja Bell in the building for a playoff game, Phoenix Sun. You know what I'm saying? We got new ownership. It's time to lock in with, you know what I mean? Get him in the building. We might have to take a trip to the desert.

I might have to go out to there. I have a trip to Sky Harbor. Sam, before we get you out of here, I have some rapid fire and then we'll get you out of here. I'm going to give you, I'm going to give you three teams who didn't really

make the moves that we thought, I would give you two teams. We thought we were probably going to make a move and they didn't do it. One of those teams being Atlanta, which is obviously your wheelhouse with the John Collins situation. Why aren't the Hawks just making a decision in getting rid of John Collins? What is the hold up there? What are we?

And when is there going to be some level of, we always talk about dysfunction. Where is there going to be some function going on in Atlanta for once? Is there light at the end of the tunnel there? You got to bring the hawks up. Like Roger said earlier, he's taking heat for certain things. That heat just still hot. No, you got to bring the hawks up. Just get it.

They don't like me out there. You know, I think they kick the can to the summer. That's the, you know, one of the motivating factors at the deadline for them beyond the basketball was that the way their books are structured right now, they're going to be looking at some luxury tax problems next year if they don't do something. But there really wasn't, you know, that much motivation financially, economically to clean that up now versus the summer. So I could see John moving in the summer. I don't know what they had on the table. for John, the part of me that was a little surprise that he didn't move is that, you know, and maybe I made too much of this, I had one team telling me during the process that they had

lowered their price tag on John and really it had become like, you know, they were trying to win now, so they wanted a decent player in return for him. But it wasn't like the old days when there were, you know, I think there were times when they were trying to get like two first for John, you know, the previous regime. Those demands had kind of gone away. A deal still doesn't get done. You know, I wrote a little bit about the great interest that they had in Bodan Bogdanovich, a guy that other teams thought they might be able to pry away. You know, that didn't happen. I think partly they've been playing better lately, you know what I mean? And they obviously have to find a way to make this Tre Young-dejante Murray partnership work. So, and even, I mean, I think partly

what you're asking is like they got this new front office with Landry Fields running the show. And, I mean, maybe not the worst thing in the world to just keep. getting more comfortable for the next four or five months and really figure out the nuance of this job. And from a preparation standpoint, go into the summertime, you know, you always learn about the market at the deadline. You know what I mean? Like there's all kinds of stuff. I'm sure they learned at this deadline about their players and what's available to them down the road that will carry into the summer. And a lot of times that leads to moves at that point. But, you know, I'm okay with them, you know, not doing it. They need to win games. They need to be.

a decent playoff team this year and I think they leaned into that. Did, and I lied, I got two more teams for you. The Grizzlies, are they going to regret not making a move this trade deadline? I think so. What is this like, the Amic where it's hot list?

Like, these teams are you going on? Let's get it. Yeah, I think, I mean, it's a regret. Again, it's always hard to analyze this stuff because I would love more than anything else to know what was available, right? So you're not actually saying, I can't believe that they weren't willing to give X for OG Ananoby. Like, I don't know exactly what that was.

It was reported that they had three firsts on the table for OG. That's a pretty aggressive attempt to get a guy like that. So it's not, it doesn't appear to be for lack of trying on their part. I think they know, you know, a lot's been made of John Moran's quote about, you know, now we're fine in the West. And the second that he said that they were fine in the West. The West just became a monster. and they're not fine in the West. So they might ultimately regret it

because even the Nuggets got better. I kind of like the Thomas Bryant move, you know, like a big down low that could help them. Hey, I just want to, no, no, no, I'm not shaking my head. Yes. Thomas Brian is an all Logan Murdoch team. I love Thomas Brian. He's one of my faves.

I remember watching him in the G League. No defense all buckets. Oh, yeah. That's my vibe. Yo, man, I remember watching him at like UCLA and in the G League, Just a dude. I love Thomas Bryant. I'm on the fan club.

Yeah. And the West is just, I mean, it's crazy. Even a quick aside, like being in Kyrie's press conference the other day in Sacramento, it was kind of surreal, like, to see Kyrie in the West. And even his perspective, like, he actually talked about it. Somebody asked about De Aaron Fox and Sabonis. And he says, he's like, yeah, you know, learning Deeran's game a little more because now I'm in the West. Like, the, you know, the idea that he's part of the West with KD now again is crazy.

So the Grizzlies will, I think, probably regret it. They have an incredible core. Some of their guys, they've been trying to develop in-house are not coming along as quickly as I think they had hoped. So we'll see. I mean, they got plenty of juice, but they got plenty of competition. Last question. And this is going to put you on the spot.

And this is a question that me and Roger just have on this podcast wondering aloud. How many more years is Dame Willard have in Portland, man? because it seems like it's just for a guy of his caliber it's been time and I've talked to him I know you've talked to him he's just steadfasted Portland

loves it there but how many more years man when are we got how many more years are we going to have to continue to just go to a trade deadline where he just doesn't he doesn't want to leave

or he doesn't leave you had me Google I just had to Google Lillard age just to confirm you know it was 32 birthdays in July so 33 going into next season.

I don't, I mean, the part of me that does, I like homegrown stories, just guys that stay with a franchise, but I also like talent being showcased and being on the greatest stage. And Damon is one of those guys. So I'm torn when it comes to his situation, probably leaning towards, you know, I think it would be best for his career. My opinion doesn't matter as far as his decision-making process, but like to find a spot. Because I don't, I don't see it. you know, they don't have the pathway to being an elite team anytime soon.

I would, you talk about wanting to know how guys truly feel like, man, where is his head at with this whole Gary paid in the second situation? Like, Gary was a guy that, it was a subtle move, but when they brought Gary to Portland, he was real happy about that. That's a dog defensively that could help him out. Also somebody that he grew, that Gary grew up around Dame. Right, right. Same agent, which, you know, is part of the game with Aaron Goodwin.

and the messiness now where the health is the health, Gary just couldn't get right and had the abdominal problem. But now the optics around their controversy with the warriors, you know, it's just messy. So, yeah, I don't know how many more years, but the message remains the same. And, you know, and last I checked, it just continues that he's, you know,

he does seem to have a lot of confidence in their GM, Joe Cronin, seems to have a good relationship with Jody Allen, who gave him that. that massive contract. And I don't really see any end inside up there. Always started. It's depressing for me. I know.

That's depressing for me. This summer, who knows? Come on. Like, we know this much. Let's at least grab a quick breadcrumb. Like, Dame, and again, Logan, you wrote this. Something motivated him to engage with LeBron when, you know,

when LeBron was trying to figure out who to play with. And as you wrote it, It's been written like the story was. They run into each other. Where were they? They were at a tournament. A sparks game. A sparks game.

A spark game. LeBron kind of tells him to roll up. Ends up, you know. But like he went to the house. Like he went to the house. And, you know, I don't know about you guys, but if you're good at home and you're not looking left and right, you know, and some new person comes up, you don't go to the house. As you know this, though. L.A.

L.A. L.A. ain't that far from Oakland. L. L.A. is not that far from Oakland. It's almost like, you know, a lot of people from the Bay go down to Oakland, I mean, go down to L.A. for work.

So, I mean, it could work. We'll see what happens. But thanks so much, Amick. Appreciate you guys. For coming on, bro. That's Sam Amick, senior writer at the athletic, friend of the show. Come on anytime. And I mean that, obviously.

I literally mean that, as you know. Thanks so much for coming on. Thank you, boys.