The Ringer NBA Show - Can the Lakers or Bucks Amass 73 Wins? | The Mismatch

Episode Date: December 16, 2019

With the Lakers and Bucks on a crash course to meet each other with identical 25-3 records, we wonder whether each team can continue its torrid pace (11:30). Also, Luka’s twisted ankle (2:25) and trades that could change the league (28:49). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today's episode of the NBA show on the Ringer podcast network is brought to you by State Farm. Just like basketball, the game of life is unpredictable. Talk to a State Farm agent and get a teammate who can help you navigate the unexpected and help you handle whatever life throws your way. Unexpected like Luca Donchich getting hurt and maybe out for a couple of weeks, right when the Dallas Mavs have a very tough schedule. We'll certainly talk about that today. Get a teammate who can help you navigate the unexpected.

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Don't wait, this amazing offer won't last, and it's only for our listeners. That's drinkworks.com and use our code, RingerNBA, R-I-N-B-A, R-I-N-B-A at checkout. And remember, please enjoy responsible. Drink-Works Home Bar is currently available in California, New York, Florida, Missouri, Pennsylvania, and Illinois, with more states available for pre-sale today at DrinkWorks.com. Welcome to The Ringer NBA show. I'm Chris Vernon and joining me as he does every typically Tuesday, but this week we're doing on Monday as we have made a trade with heat check on days this week.

Kevin O'Connor, A.K.A. Kevin O'Bomber, A.K. Kevin O'C. Kevin O'C. Kevin O'Cle, Kahn, Kevin O'Cleck, Kevin O'Clein' Kevin O'Klein'Kin'Kin'Aid. Kevin O'Conflict, Kevin O'Hredor. Is this our first-ever Monday show? I believe it is our first ever Monday show. It feels completely different. Throw it off the whole week. It is thrown off the entire week. We still will be back with you on Friday, so we will have the end caps of the week.

A lot has happened since we last spoke on Friday. The biggest news, of course, is that Luca Donchich heard himself and could miss up to two weeks with an ankle sprain. We all know that Luca is having this crazy season, 29 points, 9.6 rebounds, 8.9 assists. And this is one injury that is, is going to be very difficult for the Mavs to cope with because of the timing of this all to deal with

their schedule. This is maybe the worst possible time for this to happen. They have just won 11 of 13. They lost the game over the weekend to the heat that he went out in. And they are in the midst of playing four Eastern powerhouses, the Bucks, the Celtics, the Sixers, and the Raptors over the course of the next eight days, Kev. And so, and we, know that we're to look up at the end of the year and there is a very high probability that it is a matter of a game or two that is going to determine seating between these teams. But this is a tough spot for Dallas. I'll be very interested to see how they can fare over the course of the next eight days without him. It's a shame for us as fans knocking the sea, Luca versus

Yonison and Akupo tonight. I've been looking forward to this game for over a month now. Ever since I I wrote an article about Luca and Yanis. I've been excited for this. Never mind, the Eastern Conference matchups later this week. It sucks for us. And obviously for Dallas, Chris, you're right. This is something for the next week or two. They could slip easily from that three seed currently where they're tied with Denver for the third best record in the West, maybe down to the sixth spot where it's currently occupied by Utah.

But it's going to be interesting, though, to see what this team looks like without Luca. How does Chris Staps, poor Zingas, his usage change moving forward? Who were the guys that they lean on without Luca? Tim Hardaway, Jr. in that game against Miami, took 22 shots in that performance. It scored 28 points. Is he the guy that steps up? Do we see Jalen Brunson really get on track at this point? Because he was very solid as a rookie, but this season he has not been totally himself early in the year.

He's been better as of late. but does he make a leap with more opportunity, playing more minutes? It'll be interested to see what happens for Dallas without Luca. Yeah, you know they're going to count on more, more Brunson, more J.J. Barreya, probably more Delon Wright, who they got in the offseason. But that's a lot of, there's a lot of pieces to pick up because the guy puts up monster numbers every night and he is, you know, their team. And they've had the second best point differential in the entire Western Conference.

You know, there's only, going back to what I was originally saying, there's only two and a half games separating them and Utah, who is in the six seed right now. And so any kind of losing street could really change things dramatically. You know, clearly this seems like a year where you really don't want to be seven or eight. You know, those are, those are death sentences. And then, you know, three through six is okay. as long as you can hold the fort down to where you are not you are not in danger of being a seven or an eight this year. I think that should be the goal. And if you could win a game or two out of it, I mean, look, they're going to be underdogs in all of those games for certain.

Bucks, Boston, 76ers, Raptors. But, you know, they can catch one of them. That would be, I mean, look, I would take one if I'm a Dallas fan right now. Oh, yeah, sure. And by the way, just you mentioned how Luca is their team, just to put that numbers behind that statement. Luca is third in the league and touches per game behind LeBron James and Nicola Yokic. He is second. He's third in the league in time of possession per game behind Trey Young and James Hardin.

It is incredibly fair to say he is their team. Yeah. Another injury that took place over the weekend, Eric Bledsoe, with a fractured. fibula, and so he is going to be out for an amount of time. I actually saw the bucks in person over the weekend, and Kevin, I was just, I'm blown away at how good they are. You know, you see a guy like Middleton in person, and he never has a highlight. He never has a, you know, now it did not stop him from getting $100 billion in the offseason. But you never see him like, look what Chris Middleton did.

on social media unless it's like, you know, maybe a game winning shot or something like that. But a super solid, one of the best two guards in the league for certain. And I thought there was a little difference in Janus this time around. And I tweeted about this over the weekend. You know, I felt like in years past, and even last year, the MVP year, there were at least portions of the game or sometimes even quarters or halves where I felt like everybody else is cooking. and so he can just kind of blend in because the team is great.

This year, like he never blends in. He is always doing something. He's super talkative on defense, and he is always just imposing his will on the game all the time. And I watched him in a game where he had whatever, I think it was 37. He only played 26 minutes, Kevin. I mean, he is a devastating force of nature right now. And you mentioned last week that he's pulling up and shooting threes.

I think he's what, five attempts a game. And it doesn't look bad when he shoots it either. He is something to behold. And that Bucks team is something serious. Yeah, with Yannis, he is doing something unbelievable every night. Every single game isn't unbelievable for Horace by him. Last week I tweeted how Joelle Lambede had an unbelievable game for Philadelphia against Boston. And some Bucks fans were like, really?

tweeting it when a bead, Yannis says this every single night. And it's understandable why Bucks fans, Bucks fans may be sensitive about that because nationally, the discourse about Yanna so often is about, oh, well, is he going to, what's he going to do in 2021? Is he going to leave? Not simply just about the sheer unbelievable performances that he puts on every single night, which you saw over the weekend, Chris.

But it's the type of thing where it's not, that anybody should take it for granted, it's just the type of thing. It's become the norm from him. That's when you know a player has reached the level where they are in the conversation to be the best in the league where this is the expectation every night from him. And you alluded to how he's now shooting threes off the dribble. That really is what is everybody knows. Everybody for years has wondered what happens when Yianos gets a jump shot. He still isn't even near his peak as a shooter, most of his shots off the dribble come off one dribble. He pounds the ball with his left hand and then gets into his one drill pull-up.

But if this is only the beginning and then eventually that turns into two dribble pull-ups, three-drible pull-ups and he continues expanding in that way, there's still room to grow, Chris. That's the scary part here. What we're seeing now, there's still even more room to grow. Yeah. And, you know, losing Bledso, again, because of there's this incredible level of depth that they have, they'll be just fine. They'll just plug

George Hill. George Hill will now be the starter there. And they will keep on humming along. I mean, that is the thing that stands out. It is Spurs-esque, which is interesting because Boutenholzer was a long-time Spurs guy. It's Spurs-esque in that they bring

guys off of the bench and going back to something I talk about a lot. I never say, that guy sucks. Like ever. DJ Wilson, Robin Lopez, George Hill, Brown, DeVincenzo,

Pat Knotten. Like, everybody they bring off can play, you know, and a lot of them play almost 20 minutes. And like I said, they'll lose Bledso for a couple of weeks and George Hill will play. And they've won 18 games in a row. 18 in a row right now.

And they, we are very close. We brought this up a little over a week ago. We are very close to that collision course between, them and the Lakers. There's only a few games left before they've got to get to that where they will both have possibly simultaneously the same insane records and they play the TNT game.

The Bucks have won 18 in a row, Chris, you still can't get Pat Conantin's name right. Yeah, I know. I'll never get it right. I'll never get it right. I've said it like that since Notre Dame. I know.

It's funny. But no, to your point, though, if they're both at the 25 and 3 record heading it to Thursday's, matchup, they'll both be on pace for over 73 wins. How wild is that? That is insanity. How wild is that, Chris?

And at this point. Yeah. And I saw, I saw yesterday, did you see the thing, the Frank Vogel thing, worried about, you know, stagnation or, you know, because, you know, with the winning and everything. Yeah. Because they played what ended up being a tighter game than maybe expected against Atlanta. And I'm like, bro, your team was just. in Atlanta on a Saturday night.

This is the most common thing that ever happens. Go watch teams play in Atlanta on Sundays. It is one of the most fun cities for them to go to. And when you catch, like on a Saturday night, if you ever see teams playing in L.A., Miami, or Atlanta on a Sunday, if that team has, if you get max effort and they look like themselves, then God bless you. Because those are absolute traps. So I had to chuckle when I saw that because you could see that coming from a mile away.

Chris, do these teams feel like 73 win to teams potentially? Do you see that in them, in the Bucks or the Lakers? Do they make a run at that, that Warriors record? I think the bucks more than the Lakers, and this is why. Because the bucks with the crazy depth, okay? They got the crazy depth. They have, while the east at the top is, I think, totally in line with the West at the top. Certainly behind the Lakers and the Clippers.

You could throw any of those teams in the mix over there. they have Janus who like I just said is absolutely relentless and has not had the playoff success and so it still feels like he feels like he has something to prove so you've got the depth you've got the relentless Janus you've got the bottom half of the east which are just win after win after win when they're playing everybody from really the nets down nets magic pistons hornets bulls wizards calves hawks nicks like those are all they win every time they play those teams. So I would say the bucks.

You know, they won 60 something last year. I could see the Lakers getting bored and kind of maybe coasting into the playoffs. I don't know, man. I don't see the Lakers getting bored. I'm not sure about 73 wins, but it's so abnormal to see what we're witnessing now. On the Ringer last week in an article that we did as a group post, I had this stat that showed over the last 40 years, Chris, there's only been three times that through a quarter of the season, there's been at least

one team in each conference on pace for over 70 wins. And that happened in 0809 with the Cavs, Lakers, and Celtics, happened in 96, 97 with the Bulls Rockets and Jazz. And then it happened in 85, 86 with the Lakers and Celtics. So this is very abnormal what we're seeing right now with the Lakers and Bucks. And for what it's worth, at least one of all those teams, I just mentioned, mentioned in each season won at least 65 games. So I think it's fair to expect the team to win 65 and maybe push for 70. 73 is tough, though, because to your point about the Lakers, to do that, you can't get bored at all. The Warriors didn't get bored on their push for 73 wins to break the Bulls' then record of 72.

They wanted that. And if one of these teams is going to do it, they have to want it and they have to be locked in every night. and I just don't see the Lakers getting bored, though, because before the season, LeBron was talking about how this is his revenge year, and it has been his revenge year so far, and that's going to carry into 2020. Anthony Davis talked about how he wants to be defensive player of the year.

Well, I would vote for him defensive player of the year of the season ended today. And this team with the attitude and the energy and the passion, really, that they play with, I don't see them getting bored. I think what could stop. the Lakers is exactly what you said, though, that the bottom of the east is just bad. The bottom of the west is not.

There's a lot of tough outs in the west. And that's where when people talk about how the east and the west is more even now, that's true up top, but it's the bottom that makes a difference. When you have 12 teams in the Western Conference that have a chance of the postseason, Portland's not out of it, San Antonio's not out of it. Minnesota's not. Neither is Phoenix. Heck, like, you could even throw.

your Grizzlies into that only two and a half games back if you really wanted to. New Orleans and Golden State are the only easy outs at this point right now in the West. And the east, there's a bunch of easy outs. And so that's why Milwaukee gets that edge. But I don't see the Lakers getting bored. I think this is a team that they are all bought in. They all understand their roles and what they are around LeBron and AD. And they're going to make a real push for 65 plus wins and maybe get 70.

I guess we'll see. I mean, and that will tell us if LeBron is on like, you know, this supermission because... He is, man. He is. Well, look, otherwise, otherwise, like, there is no evidence to suggest he cares about the regular season record. Not in the last five years. You know what I mean? But, like, he just get to the playoffs and we'll be fine.

And I want to be, I want to feel good for the playoffs. This year's different, though. Maybe so. I guess we'll see. Look, here's what I know. He himself said he's point differences almost four. 14, Kevin. It's almost 14 points.

That is insane. That's the greatest point differential ever, right, at this point. You know what I mean? 14 points a game. So that's the difference. LeBron himself did come out yesterday, though, and said, if he's healthy, he's going to play. He doesn't believe in load management,

which is funny because in the past, he was essentially load manager. He did rest because they were pushing for the, just getting to the playoffs. Didn't matter to the seating. but but it's different this year though because they're in the west because seating matters and for lebron i wonder how much of that is is him kind of going against the grain of what the clippers and kawai leonardard is doing he's just taking the opposite stance here do you think do you

think some of it is a bit of a PR ploy there i don't know i mean the guy just had his first like real offseason in what 15 years yeah i mean yeah exactly he's here's he just had his first off season. He wasn't in the playoffs. I still don't understand the doubt before the season. I think it was too strong. I mean, you and I talked about this at the time. I wrote about it on the ringer,

and there were fair concerns about if he gets hurt. But the talk about him declining or falling off a cliff, it was absurd. And it looks even more absurd now. He's still the best player in the game. And he's coming in more motivated. than ever. It is, it is really a repeat in some ways of what we saw when Jordan came back after retiring for baseball, just with a new hunger and being doubted and saying, can he still carry a team?

That's what LeBron has done here. And we'll see how it carries into 2020. We'll see if he can indeed say healthy. We'll see if he can win a championship with this team. But what we've seen thus far does at least give some confidence that he can with Anthony Davis by his side. I think it makes some of those questions that were asked during the summer look quite silly, Chris. Yeah, and I think what I also discounted was they got rid of all the trained losers. You know, they have trained groups of players to lose on a regular basis. A, and the training worked because the Pelicans losing street continues. They are at 12 in a row.

And so when I talk about the effect it has on young players and it takes the sting out of losing, all those players that lost a million games for the Lakers, they're all in New Orleans. And you're never going to believe this, Kev. They're losing every night. Six and 21, a 12-game losing streak. Is it going to be they start trading off things or they get rid of Alvin Gentry? Something is going to have to give. It's either the players or the coach at some point.

And so what choice will David Griffin make? Well, those questions have already begun to being asked to Alvin Gentry. Over the weekend, he was asked about it and then said, I don't worry about what's out of my control, which, as an aside, is great life advice. You should only worry about what is in your control, not as what out of your control. So good for Alvin Gentry to be thinking that way. However, it could come soon that he ends up being the scapegoat. As we just saw with David Fisdale in New York, that could happen with Gentry

in New Orleans. With that said, though, David Griffin and Gentry do have a good relationship for what I've heard from what I've seen after the draft lottery this year in May, when, of course, they won and drafted Zion Williamson. They have a good relationship, but Griffin didn't hire him. And as you and I have talked about a bunch of times, general managers like to build their own teams. And whether or not Gentry is the right coach for this roster, I don't know. I I think it's unfair to pull the plug on what Gentry is doing here without seeing Zion Williamson. Not to mention that this is a young team too and young teams are usually bad. But I did think this team would be better even without Zion.

I thought their defense would be better. I thought the energy on defense would be better. And it seems like a lot of the time this team just doesn't play with the amount of effort that you would hope for and expect from some of the names on the roster. Yeah, this is, look, I've been around. I've covered a lot of bad teams and when things start going really, really wrong, people start pointing fingers

and it's either the roster or the coach. And then you have to decide, is it really the coach's fault? Like in Fisdale's case, I think there were people out there that said, really, like, who's going to win a bunch of games with that roster? And so there's a lot of people that say,

he got screwed, the roster's the problem. In New Orleans, there is no way they should be six and 21. I blame Gentry. A guy tweeted me last, night said, how many more wins does that Pelicans team have if Dave Yeager's the coach? Now, people know, I think highly of Dave Yeager, who was in Sacramento, obviously, in Memphis prior to. And I think a lot more, I think a lot more than they have right now. I do. And that's

just a, right, that's a coach that's out there. He doesn't have a job. But I think that he has not nearly gotten the best out of this team. That's embarrassing. Six and 21. And the other thing is when you hit a 12 game, when you hit like double digit losing streak, I mean, that is exclusively for just bonafide rat teams.

Usually you get in the locker room and somebody freaks out and you get some kind of home run effort after you've lost five or six. or you've lost even, you know, if it gets up to seven or eight, and the buck stops. And you find some team that you're playing against that, you know, it feels like the must win. You become very, very hungry for a win. When it gets to like 12 game losing streaks,

to me, that signifies a team that doesn't give a crap. Seriously. And you've got to change something. And unfortunately, a lot of times that means changing the voice in the locker room. sure however i think back to think about the 06 o seven celtics there were calls at the time for dock rivers to be fired there was always calls for for dock rivers to be fired um but danny and ended up keeping dock rivers and they ended up having a lot of success after acquiring kevin garnett and ray allen the players that they did that team grew and had many many years of success with elvin gentry david graver

and ownership need to assess, is this the guy that we want leading the charge here? And if it's not, who is it? Is it a current assistant on the staff? Is it somebody outside the organization? I don't know. I don't know. Only Dave Hercruven knows that answer. However, that's the question needed to ask.

Right now, I'm not sure midseason firing is necessarily the right choice. Unless you actually think, unless you really believe that a new voice is going to make this team get better effort on the defensive end, unless the team is actually going to have a better system installed on the defensive end. I would look at it and say there's no way they can be worse. There's no way. Of course there's no way they can be worse. I mean, with that roster, their roster is not horrendous.

No, it's not. And they got some good vets on that team too. I mean, if you got a back court of Drew Holiday and JJ Reddick, you got Brandon Ingram on the wing, I mean, I got to figure out four and five and I should have a pretty good team. Yeah, I'm with you. I'm with you. They should be better.

They should be better. And the other thing is, you know they saw. a boatload of season tickets because of Zion. And obviously they're not getting that attraction every night with Zion playing. But still, you have a lot of people that spend a lot of money on tickets. And this product is, that's, that's embarrassing. It's a shame too. Yes.

It's a shame for the league. They were right to schedule so many national TV games with Zion Williamson. He's a player you want to promote nationally. people have not been able to watch him. And for all the people who bought tickets to Pelicans games with the expectation that the team would be competitive, maybe be in the running for the playoffs, and you have this bright new star in Zion Williamson

after all the excitement this summer and the joy and the optimism and the hope, and then you become a rat team, as you say, losing 12 in a row. It's just all around sad to see this happen. Well, because here's the thing, Kip, they were six and nine. and if you can hold down the fort and you're, you know, around there,

if you stay within three, four games of 500, then you get Zion back, presumably, we thought December, but maybe you get him in January, or maybe Reggie Miller's right and we don't see him at all this year. But let's say that the expectation was you were going to get him back, okay? If you're within three or four games of 500, now you can, you might be able to win eight out of ten at some point, and then 500 may get you in the playoffs this year in the Western

conference. But instead, from six and nine, they have gone to six and 21. And now it's like, well, it doesn't matter if you win eight out of ten. You still suck. You know, it's just the way it is. With New Orleans that she heard, Chris, obviously they stink. There are a couple things to feel good about. I think Brandon Ingram being the best player you got in the Lakers deal, his development is incredibly encouraging on the offensive end of the floor. You can feel good about Kenridge Williams as a role player, Josh Hart as a role player. And Drew Holliday is still himself. Numbers are a little bit down overall, but Drew Holliday is still a quality overall player.

With that said, I would have liked to have seen Lonzo Ball show more. And that is an area I look at on this roster. and I'm a bit concerned. Lonzo seems to be who he is. His shot, despite changing his mechanics, has not improved. That is concerning. He is still a guy who is afraid of contact near the rim, a guy who doesn't get to the rim a lot.

He, what is he? He is a solid overall defensive player who can pass on the open floor. But that's okay. I mean, that's solid. But he's not the guy that people expect that is the number two pick, not the guy I don't think New Orleans was hoping he could show he could be in his first year with the franchise either. Perfect segue, Kevin, because we're going to take this quick break. I think that they should just decide Lonzo is going to be our 30 plus minute per game point guard and that they move Drew Holiday.

Now everybody has become trade eligible. Drew Holliday is one of those names that we're going to talk about. We'll do it after these words. All right, Keb, we'll get right back to it. This NBA season, Mountain Dew is all about the threes, the shot that's changing the game. We'll be talking about a lot of guys that can bang threes, including Joe Harris and others, as that December 15th deadline has come upon us and guys are possibly traded. Brought to you by Mountain Dew, the official beverage of the NBA, do the do.

All right, Kevin, right before we went to the break, I brought up Drew Holiday. I mean, his name's out there. It's been out there already. and certainly given the circumstances of what's happened with the Pelican season, you know, you were talking, I would figure out what I've got with Lonzo. We say, what is he? How good is he going to be? Well, I'd roll him out there and I'd give him a ton of minutes.

And then I'd get minutes for the rookie, Nikiel Walker Alexander. Because the truth is, you know, Drew Holiday is not necessarily on that same timeline as those guys anyway. They tried to blend in veterans with the rookies and be good right now. That has not played out. So now you just decide, okay, how about we build towards the Lonzo, Ingram, Zion, Jackson, Hayes, Nikiel Alexander Walker. That becomes more of our timeline now, while we do sprinkle in some veterans so we can win games, but that they're more kind of on the same trajectory of be good in a couple of years, take their lumps in the playoffs. Then, I mean, at that point, Drew Hollidays, I mean, come on, he's way out of his prime at that point, probably.

And so right now, find a suitor. I mean, Holiday's the one to move, isn't he? He's the one. I would. Sure. Yeah, he's definitely the one to move 29 years old. He'll be 30 next year, the last guaranteed year of his contract. He has a player option for the 2021-22 season, so he can become a free agent after the

following year. He's a guy that would be in high demand. Granted, there's a lot of good free agents in 2021. There's no guarantee that he would look at New Orleans and view that as his best situation. He would be 31 at the time. Who knows what choice he would make. For New Orleans, this could be the right time to make a deal. We've talked about this with a bunch of players. We said it with Covington. We set it with Aldridge, DeRosen. Right now, it's a dry trade market. And for any team that does decide to become a seller, if they put their best players on the market,

those players will be in high demand with the open path to a championship, with the lack of talent out there in the market. If New Orleans decides to trade holiday now with a year and a half guaranteed left on his contract, a lot of teams would be interested in somebody like him who can play next to another guard, who can defend in an elite level, who can play his role unselfishly and step up in games where he is hot or he needs to. Teams would want a player like that. I think about a team like Miami, for example, they could fit him easily into their system.

there's a number of teams that could have significant interest in Holiday if they decide to pull the plug on what they have going right now, which I'm with you. I think they should. You know who is the perfect one? And this is, again, it's going to be dependent upon if you are moving forward. The perfect one is a guy,

because I say this because you brought up, hey, having a point guard, somebody that can go get you into your offense, somebody that could take crunch time shots, whatever. It's Minnesota. in the case that they are hungry to be a, you know, playoff team and they look at it right now and they say,

all right, now we've lost seven in a row, but we're still just a game and a half out of the seven seed. We had Drew Holiday, all of a sudden, we're really fighting and we're, maybe we're able to become a playoff team there. The other one beyond that was,

and I think I heard Bill mentioned this on his podcast, is what about a reunion with the, sixers to have another outstanding guard that they could have for the, you know, when it comes playoff team, another guy that could handle the ball. Another guy, you know, you'd obviously have him when you're putting Ben Simmons in the dunker spot in the playoffs because he has no interest in ever shooting the ball. And that's what you're going to have to do probably. Hey, he's two for two.

Stop. On corner three pointers. Stop. With the wrong hand, it's impressive. But what about Minnesota? Minnesota would be interesting. Right. I think Orlando would be interesting, too.

We talked about them as a team for DeRosen. Same logic applies with Holiday. I think with Minnesota, I don't know if he fits exactly the timeline. It depends on the urgency that Gerson Roses would feel from ownership in order to get into postseason. I don't know, man. This is already second contract time for towns and Wiggins.

They've got to start winning. You know? They're already both in their second contract. for God's sakes. I mean, at what point is the timeline? I mean, they're, you know, come on. They're done with their rookie deals. And they've lost seven in a row now.

They have New Orleans coming to Minnesota on Wednesday. That should be a win for them. Should be a win. We'll see. Well, but they've lost seven in a row now, which is concerning. Much like Jimmy Butler walked in that locker room and became the guy. Drew Holiday could do that. Like, I would, that seems to me perfect.

They need somebody like that. A veteran guy that could say, hey, This is stopping. And when the run that the other team makes, they just say, no more. I actually like that. I think Holiday, let me ask you,

let me throw you out some other names. How about guys that are restricted free agents that people may not have the money to pay? Do you think if you are the nets, are you paying Joe Harris in the off season? Or do you get something for him? Yes. Okay, well, let me ask you three guys.

And these are all shooting guards. Harris, Malik Beasley, uh, Bogdanovich, Sacramento. These guys are all going to be, uh, free agents this off season,

and you're going to make a decision on whether or not you're paying them or not. I would pay Joe Harris. I would attempt to keep Bogdan, Bogdanovich, if I'm Sacramento and Denver, they, they will explore trading Malik Beasley, um,

which is a matter of what they do. I could see them going a number of different ways with Beasley or the other players on that roster, um, in order to open up more minutes from Michael Porter, Jr. granted Beasley is on a block there, but he's a guy who could be used as an asset. Beasley, I think, is going to get

paid somewhere else, and Denver won't be that team to pay him. So you would, you would pay Joe Harris. I mean, he's probably going to get double what he makes now. Yeah, I'd pay Joe Harris. Solid defender and a knockdown shooter, both off the catch, off screens, off movement, smart decision

maker on the floor. He's exactly the type of player that you want around Kevin Durant and Kair Irving to two two superstar players. Joe Harris is an important player for that roster next season. All right. And you would wait on Bogdanovich. Obviously, the Sacramento Kings have way outperformed what we thought was possible. Yeah, I'd want to keep Bogdanovich. Bogdanovich is a, is a big time player in big moments. And he always has been going back to his time playing overseas.

And that has remained unchanged so far in the NBA. That dude's a baller. And he's somebody that I think is a winning player wherever he goes. He's a winning player in Sacramento. And I think for them, when they get into the postseason, he's the type of guy you want on your side. Woj intimated yesterday that we're about to the time where Kevin Love might start making it difficult for Cleveland, meaning get me out of here, difficult. And so it did make me think, hey, that timeline may be a little bit faster than getting all the way to February. You know, as trade season officially kind of began yesterday with the December. 15th date that, you know, he threw that out there, which makes me think that, you know,

Kevin Love is obviously not happy in his situation. And so if he is going to be on the move, it could be sooner than later. I found that a little, I found that interesting. Yeah, Kevin Love wants out. Yeah, right. And, and he prefers Portland. I'm not so sure he'll be able to get Portland. Phoenix could have potential interests as well. I'm not sure how many teams realistically would want Kevin Love, though. I mean, how many are there? Portland, Phoenix. There's not many teams that can trade for him making the money that he makes. And of the teams that can, how many of them actually would want him with his age, with his injury history, with the fact that on a team that's adding him, what is his role?

We saw him next to LeBron, James, and Kyrie Irving being essentially a $20-plus million dollar spot-up shooter. He was a glorified Kelly Olenic with some of those Cleveland rosters. And that's what he could potentially be on, depending on what roster he's on. I think Portland makes too much sense for him. And if I'm Damian Lillard and C.J. McCollum, I'm going to Neil Lulshay and saying, we need love. We need him on this team to be what we can. Oh, it's always, look, the best place for Kevin Love is the place where he's the third best player. And you and I have talked about this, you know, kind of the pecking order of teams.

If he's your third best player, you have a chance at the title. and you know despite the possible defensive struggles that they would have I mean Portland becomes a lot better they had Kevin loved of the mix you know the other one and you know who who loves stars

more than anyone in the world Kevin Houston you know he's trying to figure out how he could pull that off because again it'd be the third best player right I mean there's just no way they don't have it

they don't have the goods right yeah they don't have the salary to potentially make a deal work, unfortunately. But Houston is another team that would make sense. It's just because you can't trade Eric Gordon until after the trade deadline. Right. You would have to give up Capella or PJ Tucker in a deal. And that seems unlikely.

I would say, I don't think you would give up Capella. Hey, hey. If we've learned anything, everything they do seems unlikely until it happens. And you're like, what the hell? I mean, who would have ever thought they're trading Chris Paul, much less ending up with Russell Westbrook in the deal. You know? Yeah.

It's just crazy. But we know this. We know he is about acquiring stars. You know, and even if Kevin Love has a big contract and he's got, you know, he's a little bit older now, it would, like nothing shocks me with them. Let me give you one name as we close out today's show that we have not spoken about,

but I'm going to bring up to you because this has stayed in my head. since the trade or since free agency. So if you remember when free agency was going on, Mark Stein from the New York Times came out and he said, look, they are not having DeAngelo Russell to add to this Steph Curry, Draymond Green, Clay Thompson mix. He'll get traded. Like this is, this is an asset, acquiring an asset.

Well, now DeAnglo Russell is available. Right? Like, I mean, you can move him if you want to after he signed in the off season. Their season is clearly in the tank. What are the chances? Like, that has always stuck in my mind and no one's really talking about him or that he could be on the move. But the fact that it was brought up at the time by somebody so respected that, hey, this isn't, like, if it feels like a weird fit, because Curry's usually on the ball, it's because it is a weird fit and that they are going to, they'll feel. flip that for something that's better suited to mix with Clay Curry and

Dremont. What do you think? Do you think it's better to wait? I don't know. Is it better to wait until draft night where you know where you depends on what you can get, right? Well, I mean, at that point, you know where your pick is. Maybe you package the pick and Russell for some superstar that becomes available at that point. You know what I mean? I wonder if it's better to wait unless you're getting something significant it now. And I would assume that's probably what happens if they ride out the season with DeAngelo and then reassess once they have they have certainty in where their pick is in the drafts. And you know which players may actually become available. And then you can reload.

You know what I just thought? Hey, listen, again, this is, this becomes funny season because we can just start looking at things and, and, and coming up with trades. You know what I just thought? Who desperately wanted him in the off season when he signed? with the Warriors. Minnesota, then. Minnesota. You've been talking about Covington, right? Covington could be their new like Iguodala, right?

Well, minus the ball handling. Of course, I'm saying, but he can feel, like, he's just a role, he's a role player that can bang some threes. He's your new three and D guy going forward. Is there some kind of a deal you could put together with Covington and some real assets where they could get that guy that they wanted? right? Very interesting. They wanted him.

Very interesting. I'm just spitball in here because if I'm the Warriors, yes, I would want Covington because I look at it. He fits my timeline perfect because I'm expecting to come back next year and be a championship quality team. So you're proposing a deal essentially

for like a reloaded reloaded complimentary unit around Steph and Clay and Dremont. Right? I didn't get him last year. You know what I mean? Maybe you get like Jared Culver in the deal too. Oh, God. Yeah. I mean, I'm curious if any Wolf's fans are listening to this, what would you give up for

D. Angelo Russell with Robert Covington in the trade? I'm curious about that. They give you, they give you Jordan Bell back. But maybe, you know, maybe there's some kind of a deal. All right. So what is, what is Covington make? Again, I'm just, he's 11. 11.

We got to get hot. I mean, we got to start putting together money. for sure. I mean, nobody want that, that Gorgie Dang contract, God bless. I'm looking at there 16.2. Yikes. I mean, I don't know how you get to, it's hard to get to the number. Well, Jeff Teague, Jeff Teague would be in the deal. Oh, there you go. It's, it's, it's pretty easy for Minnesota to put the salaries together. All right. Teague. But is it, but for Golden State, you have to ask the question. Why do this deal now? Yeah. What is the, what, what, what, what, what, what's the rush?

That deal can be there for you in June on draft night. It can be there for you in July during free agency. Well, it just depends on what you think of Covington. You know what I mean? Because Covington might not, to your point, you know, in previous podcast. He's a guy that somebody could go and grab. Yeah, potentially. And so you might be, if you, if you covet him, maybe you, you know, that's the kind

of thing you just go do. Sure. Unless you're Minnesota and then you're willing to wait. unless you're willing to wait and not pull a deal on a Covington deal because the potential of getting DeAngel Russell. Yeah, Minnesota, there's one, right?

We talked about Drew Holiday and we talked about DeAngelo Russell and we, you know, if you're putting something together, they need a point guard, you're putting something together with Towns and Wiggins, that that would be the move, right? And so maybe they're going to be a player for one of these guys.

Who would you rather have? between Russell and yes Russell and if I'm Minnesota I'm incredibly disappointed that we didn't get him

during the off season and I would still want him now from Minnesota more than holiday more than holiday certainly younger well for two reasons for the timeline

but also the relationship with Carl Anthony Towns those guys are close friends and I think that would be important to have with this roster moving forward they could be a fun one kef you know because you brought up the whole covington thing a couple weeks ago but now you're looking at it they've lost seven in a row like there's going to be some of these teams that are you know they are whether it's a guy that's in the locker room that like hey now everybody can be traded let's get going on this like kevin love somebody that's making it difficult or leaning on you or you're just losing every friggin night some of these teams may be very motivated to do something possibly even a the next week or two.

You know, even though we thought maybe it could be quiet, you don't expect teams to be just losing every friggin' night. And some of them are teams that we think could be moving guys anyway. Why wait till February? You might be dead by then. Right now it is quiet, though. It's quiet now. And because teams are still figuring who they are and what they want to be,

but I would expect that to change fairly soon, hopefully soon. Let's get some trades going, Chris. man, listen, I'll be on that trade machine all afternoon. I'm going. I'm going, and I'm going to have a million trades going. Hey, and Iguado could move decently fast, too. It's possible. His name's been out there for a long, long time. What do you think he ends up going? Where do you think he gets dealt?

I mean, look, and I saw Windhorst bring this up over the weekend. The natural one, and we mentioned this last week, is the Dallas one. I mean, they are much better than certainly I expected. I was just wrong about them. And I know they're going to lose Luca for a couple of weeks, but they have the opportunity to be a possible home court advantage team. It's certainly top five, top six in the West. And with that being said, you are going to need somebody to throw on the Kauai Lenards

and the LeBron Jameses and the Paul Georges of the world. And they ain't got it. And he's kind of a perfect fit between Luca and Chris Stapp's. And they've got the assets, you know, some of these good teams. You know, he wants to go to a good team and they are a good team. And they actually have like the assets that make the most sense because Courtney Lee's not really playing. And he's a big expiring. And then they've got some draft assets that they could move.

They have Golden State's second round. Yeah, which is going to be what, the 31st pick in the draft probably? Or possibly 31, 32. Yeah. I think it will come down to do, does the team? team like the clippers end up giving their first round pick? Are they willing to give that up with Harkless or another salary filler to take a deal? Or does it become a dream scenario where you could get like a Malik Beasley?

You know what I mean? Somebody that somebody's not going to pay. I don't think you get that kind of a return though on an Iguodala deal. But you just never know. Unless the deal's expanded. And he's in Denver. I mean, look, he started his career there, right? In Denver.

Well, he started his career in Philly, but he played in Denver. That's actually a good. That's actually quite a fun idea. Oh, I have, you know I've coveted Malik Beasley. I love him. I would love to have him. Salaries would be tough to figure out, but it's interesting. Well, and it'd be perfect to pair with your John Moran,

Brandon Clark, January Jackson, Jr. Corps. I love Beasley. He's a two guard fit right in the mix with that. Some way, somehow. I have coveted him that I don't know. I'm a big fan. maybe if you do Mason Plumley and Malik Beasley for Andre Aguadala and some other asset or just like

I don't know if they're giving up Plumley good great oh I know that that's what I mean that you see that dunk yesterday Jesus well that's what I mean like that's the only that's the only salary filler that they can put into the deal to make it work unless it's Will Barton but even then you're not there yet where you need to be with the money now I'm playing oh no well Barton works I'm playing with the trading machine right now as as we speak But I'm not sure you're giving a partner either. No. You're not giving a part.

Well, look, they got a log jam. You know, that's why Beasley doesn't, you know, is not getting the minutes and it's gone the wrong way with him. They've got a, they got so many good players in Denver. You know, like there's not enough room for all of them with Gary Harris, you know, and, and Jamal Murray and, and Malik Beasley, Michael Porter can't see the floor. Like, that guy. has, you want to talk about assembling some talent.

They have got it. They have, Denver has a bunch of guys that I think if they went elsewhere, could put up way bigger numbers than they're even putting up where they are. But it adds up to winning, so I can't deny that. Well, I think, I think Clutch thinks the same thing about Malik Beasley, and perhaps rightfully so with the flashes that he has shown over time to be receiving, you know, on the year 16 minutes per game and only 18 games. that opportunity has not been there for him consistently because of the guys he's behind.

They have such a glut of talent. And if you're Denver, if you're Tim Conley and your role running that team, you've got to be thinking like, how can Beasley be flipped into something that helps this team? Maybe it is an EGuardedalotype. Maybe it is something else out there that we're not thinking of right now. But I think it's important. They got luxury tax problems too, you know.

They've paid everybody. But you can't lose Beasley for nothing, though. I think you have to use that asset to get something that helps you win a championship because there's a window. There's a window here. Kevin, I can't wait for all of this to get started. I hope it gets started soon. And by the next time we speak, we'll talk about this Miami Heat team who has been absolutely awesome. I'm going to get to see them in person tonight.

And then I know you are writing about them for this week on the ringer, right? Yes, sir. Great. Can't wait to read it. And I'm excited to get to see them for the. first time this year. Kevin, I will talk to you on Friday. You as well, Chris. Thanks, Bobby, for producing and thank you guys for listening. Thanks to everybody for listening to another episode of The Mismatch. If you dig what you're hearing. Go give us a rating and review on iTunes,

five stars, five stars. It really helps. And we will talk to you on Friday.