The Ringer NBA Show - Celtics Put Pressure on the Heat for Game 6 | Off Guard

Episode Date: May 27, 2023

Austin and Pausha are back to preview Game 6 of the Eastern Conference finals (02:00). Then, the guys talk about LeBron’s retirement scare this week and his impact on the NBA (28:00). Later, Callie Curry joins Pausha to add to the Celtics vs Heat dialogue (54:00). Hosts: Austin Rivers and Pausha Haghighi Guest: Callie Curry Producer: Jonathan Kermah Additional Production Support: Ben Cruz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You may find this hard to believe, but 60 songs that explain the 90s. America's favorite poorly named music podcast is back. With 30 more songs than 120 songs total. I'm your host, Rob Harvilla, here to bring you more shrewd musical analysis, poignant nostalgic reveries, crude personal anecdotes, and rad special guests, all with even less restraint than usual. Join us once more on 60 Saws that Explain the 90s every Wednesday on Spotify. What's up everybody? Welcome to another episode of Offguard. I'm your host Pasha.

Joining me as always, my guy, Austin. How are you doing, man? What's up, bro? How you doing? I'm good. I'm good. I'm in, uh, I'm in the, what is this? The Rivers office right now? You're in my house and I'm some hotel that doesn't have Wi-Fi. It's insane. I just love, I love recording in your office the last few episodes, so I definitely wanted to keep it going, but I'm in your chair. For anyone that watching. They could see the mural in the background. Didn't somebody make fun of me for having a mural of all the teams that I played in? Well, also, you didn't leave enough room for the Timberwolves looking at it right now.

Well, that painting was made, you know, a little bit of time ago. There's not like the Knicks on there. There's not the Nuggets on there. There's not, uh, the Timberwolves. First of all, the reason people were even talking about is because that pool Reefs thing was, was everywhere. I did not know that was going to just go across. the internet. People really took a liking to that. I mean, it has to do with the markets, right?

You got the Warriors fan base and the Lakers fan base, probably the two biggest fan bases in basketball alongside with the Knicks and Celtics. So anytime you touch on those players specifically, I think it sparks reaction. Yeah, but also people weren't listening to the full pod and they heard you say pool is a million times better than Austin Reeves.

If you listened to the whole thing, you gave both of them a lot of compliments. You said, you know, you made your point. I'm not even going to go into that because I don't even care. I'm past the point of trying to justify to people what I meant or what I mean and them taking the wrong thing. If you don't put in the time, and I'm not saying you've got to listen to the whole podcast, but if you actually are scrolling on your Instagram or your TikTok and you're seeing like

12 second clips of somebody talking and form an opinion after that, then you're not, doing social media right. Because everyone should know at this point that social media is all about clicks and views and that they're only gonna use a clip to portray whatever narrative they're trying to portray. So they took that one clip of me saying the stuff about how Jordan Pools a million times better

and they cut out the part where I talked about all the things that Austin Reeves is better at, boom, boom, boom. I mean, I try to implore people that if you're using social media, when you see these little shorts, these clips, like just understand

that there's probably another 15 to 20 to 30 seconds to that sentence that was cut and understand that a narrative has been created, just understand that. But whatever, man, I mean, here we are. Just listen to the full pod. I mean, come on. What are we doing, people?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's, I mean, that's best case scenario. I obviously listen to the pod, but yeah, this is, this, that's, it is getting old that, like, I'll say a comment and it's cut up however people want. I wish people were held accountable for that.

Yeah. So why don't you tell the listeners what you're doing in L.A. right now? I'm in L.A. right now working with ESPN, doing some stuff, working with Malika, R.J., Perk, Vince, doing some of the stuff. Get Up, early morning, ESPN action. It's been fun, and it's been exciting. And actually, not the Get Up. It's NBA Today? Yeah, NBA Today.

So it's been fun. Yesterday was a good experience. Today I'm on for like two hours, which is really dope. So a lot more TV time, a lot more segments. Yesterday it was more so like probably 30, 40 minutes of work. So this is like double excited for today. I got to go in like an hour and a half. So I'm grinding, man.

I'm out here working. I'm doing like the full media tool. That's awesome. What's been the biggest difference? Obviously you've done a handful of podcast episodes. What's the difference when you're, you know, on set live. I guess the difference would be,

you know, we're the main voices in this podcast and it's, you know, it's our show. You know, I get to be as loose as I want. It's, you know, any topics. It's not live. I can mess up and cut it out. I can get up right now and go to the bathroom and we can figure it out.

Right. When you're live on TV, you've got to like, you got to be sharp and you've got to be ready to talk. You've got to have your points down. You got to remember your points. you can't get caught up in your own head, stuttering or like getting lost. It's also not easy doing it next to someone like Malika because she's very talented at what she does. So, you know, even and RJ as well, Richard.

So, you know, those guys go on TV and kind of just get going and you're like, man, you know what I mean? So that's why the next question for you was I wanted to ask you, have you seen anyone out there that you've just been so, you know, impressed by where you're like, wow, this person is just really good at it. They just hit a switch when, you know, the camera's on. I want to make sure I say this the right way. I've always been a fan of Rachel Nichols. And when she had been kind of, I don't want to say replaced, but removed whatever the situation was,

I think a lot of players felt a certain way about it because we all liked Rachel. And I think she's fantastic at her job. So when Malika came, myself included with a lot of other people, it's not like we didn't know her or believe in her. It's just like, you know, whatever. And working with her yesterday,

I had to like sit back at my chair at one point and be like, okay, I get it. Because she's, you know, she's the real deal. She really is. Not saying Rachel should have been replaced or anything like that. I'm just saying Malika, Malika's a star. So it was pretty cool working with her.

And RJ's really talented as well. He's so natural and comfortable in front of the camera. It's not easy to do. It's not easy to do. I was going to say, so what was your favorite, like growing up, you know, ESPN personality, or it could be Fox Sports, whatever. Who's been your favorite?

Are you Stephen A. Smith guy or, you're like growing up, I love Stuart Scott. Stuart Scott would be number one. Stephen A. Smith has always been entertaining. I mean, there's a handful of them. You know, are you talking about just media personality or, like, actual, like, gang cat? Like, what are you saying? Oh, anything.

Anyone that, seeing what you've seen. in the last few days in ESPN. What was your favorite? Who was like the idols that you had growing up? Not idol, but people that you were really excited to see on TV or even their takes. For example, I love like Colin Coward. I agree with a lot of the things he says.

Even when I disagree with what he says, I like the way he backs it up. You know what I mean? He makes good points. I kind of tend to agree with all the things he says. Who's your guy? Column's great. Stephen A. Smith is great.

Scott Van Pelt is great. Obviously, Stuart Scott, bless his soul. Rest and peace. He was obviously a legend. There's a handful of guys that I've always kind of grown up. You see on TV and they make you feel comfortable watching their segment and they're able to give their points with so much fluidity. You know what I mean?

Those are the guys that I pretty much like the most. All right. Let's get into the games. Is this happening? Are the Celtics coming back? Are they going to be the first team down from 03? This was my take. I called it yesterday.

I said it on ESPN. I said that Boston was going to win this game, and then it was probably going to be a blowout. That's exactly what it was. They are the better team. And that's what's so unique about this situation, is this isn't a team that was down 3-0, like a superior team.

It's like, when we were down 3-0, Minnesota to Denver, Nobody had like a belief that we were going to come back because even if we won a game, maybe even two, they were the better team overall, especially with all the injuries that we had. So just there wasn't a lot of belief there or there wasn't a storyline there. This situation is so unique

because Boston is the better team. They are the spirit team, in my opinion at least, and I think most people's opinion. Everybody going into the series thought Boston was going to win. Miami kind of puts the foot on the pedal. Boston comes out slow and a little bit, you know, just all over the place. But now they're finding a rhythm, they're finding confidence, they're finding something as a team to hold on to,

and that's like the first team to come down, you know, to come back from 3-0. That's what they're kind of holding on to right now. And it's possible because you can win four in a row. I just saw the Nuggets beat the Lakers four times straight. So it's not impossible to win four times. straight. It's all about narratives and mindset. Forget being down 3-0. Understand,

is it possible to win 4 straight? It is. It happens all the time. And the reason it's never happened before because usually the team that goes 3-0 is the better team. In this unique situation, you had Boston fucking around the first three games. Miami goes up three

games, and now they've been able to hit a switch and kind of turn it on. So it's just like, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Is this real? And with each game that goes by, I'm looking at these press conferences. I'm seeing Jimmy and them. And first, you know, smiles and laughs, and we're not worried.

Now we're, now it's, we're winning game six. You know, hey, the narrative is just slowly, the energy is slowly, the momentum is slowly changing. However, Miami wins game six. I don't think this goes seven. I do think Miami wins game six. Yeah, Miami wins game six.

by the way, how great is this for basketball? How great is this for basketball that we have this? The series prior to this, even though they were, you know, Miami was winning and it was a story, it was boring, man. Like a Miami Denver finals sounds, no offense, and I love the game of basketball. It sounds fucking horrendous. I mean, it's just like, and even if Miami wins, at least. I mean, I'm into anything that revolves basketball. So, I mean, guys like me and you would watch, you know, I played in Denver.

I'm definitely going to watch some of the homies. I've always been a fan of the culture of Miami. So I'm watching that series. But for the fanfare, I think the reviews and the ratings would probably be the lowest ever. It would probably be the lowest rating finals in the past 10 years. Man, it's crazy because I think Yokic is just must see TV the way he plays basketball. But like you said, those are people that like basketball. You're right.

Yeah, we appreciate basketball. So me and you can watch Yokic and be in awe of him and really have an understanding and, like, gratitude of his brilliance and greatness on the basketball court. whereas a lot of people see his game and because he's not jumping in the air doing crazy dunks or step back threes even though he hits a crazy three here and there. That's not really what they want to watch.

Denver plays good basketball, not fun to watch basketball. And they have a little bit of spurs-like in them. And people used to say the same thing about the spurs when they'd be winning championships and stuff. People were just like, yeah, they're a great team. I just don't really want to watch them. You know what I mean?

And that's what people say about Denver, but it's usually people who don't really watch the game. So I'm going to watch the finals, but again, would Boston and Denver be a little bit of a better matchup and a little bit more popcorn? Yeah, I believe so. With that being said,

I think Miami wins game six. This reminds me a little bit of, I think it was 1993. First round, the sons were the one seat in the West. They were down 2O to a worst team, the Lakers at the time. And they came back in one, the next three, and back then it was, you know, best of five series in the first round.

That's exactly what you just said. This isn't a situation where if this was ever going to happen where a team comes back down three-o, it would be this situation because the Celtics are, everyone thinks the deepest team in NBA. They have the sixth man of the year. They have great guys coming off their bench. They have star power, you know, maybe the best team in NBA, like all season we were talking about.

And this is a Miami heat team that lost their first playing game. They're an eight seed. This is the perfect storm for it to happen. down 3-0. With that being said, yeah, it's going to be tough. That game 6 is going to be crazy. If they, all playoffs long, all playoffs long, we've been hyping up Jimmy Butler.

This guy's, in the all-time rankings, he's boosted up like 20 people. This has been a crazy Jimmy Butler run. It's done amazing for his legacy. Same with Spolstra. If they are the first team to lose a 3-0 lead in a series, does that all go away? Or are we just like, wow, that's a great season.

they shouldn't have been in the conference finals anyways? Or are we looking at them like, you guys choke, that's crazy, and it wipes away everything that they've accomplished? It doesn't wipe away anything they accomplished, just because similar to the Lakers run. I actually made a comment on the Lakers' Instagram page, which was kind of unique for a player to do. When they lost, they had a lot of negativity in the comments.

And I literally commented, you know, Lakers fans, take a deep breath. Relax. You guys were in a playing game a couple weeks ago, similar to Miami. You guys advanced all the way to the conference finals, only to lose to the team that's probably favored to win. You've had young guys develop playing roles that they've never been in and get experience. You have talented assets and tradable assets. You have a big market where everybody wants to come to your team. LeBron James showed he's still great. 80 actually, ended a season healthy, even though he didn't really look himself,

but now he has a full summer to get right. You have a lot of positive things to build on and go off of. Why don't you take the positive out of this and understand there's only one winner, and you guys weren't even favored to win anyways, so losing shouldn't be such a catastrophic, you know, thing. And it's the same thing with this Miami team, man. You had key guys go down, Hero, Oladipo, some other guys. Gabe Vincent Strauss getting this playoff time.

you know, Martin getting this playoff time, Duncan Robinson finding his groove again after kind of really being benched all season. You have guys out there performing and playing well, and you found yourself one win away from going to the NBA finals and the conference finals. It would still be a season to be proud of if you're a Miami Heat fan.

The only reason it's frustrating is because to go up 3-0 and only have to win one game posture to go to the finals, it's just something you can't drop. you can't drop it if you got four chances to win one game it has to be done it has to be done I can't wait to see what the narrative is

if they are to lose what are going to go fire spoultra some of the bullshit garbage that I've heard over the past couple of weeks of how many good coaches have been let go just because their stars didn't show up in the playoffs or in vital games

it's beyond me or blows my mind they wouldn't dare do that to Eric Spolster because everybody knows he's regarded as one of the better coaches in the league. But they've somehow managed to do that to four or five other coaches that are unemployed right now, which won't be for a long other, you know,

but still, yeah, I think it's something to be proud of, but at the same time, Pasha, yeah, they got to win, bro. Got to win this. Make a fast break to Fandul during the NBA playoffs because right now, new customers can get a no-swet first bet

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Call 1-88-78-98-9-7777 or visit CCPpG.org slash chat in Connecticut. Call 1-8009 with it in Indiana. Call 1-800-522470470 or visit KSgamblinghelp.com in Kansas. Call 18777-770 Stop in Louisiana. visit www.mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Call 1-800 522-470-470 in Wyoming or visit www.1-800-Gambler.net in West Virginia. The Miami Heat, what they've done during this playoff run for sure is proven that the regular season doesn't matter like it used to. All year they were kind of whatever.

Obviously, they're the eight-seed. They had seven best record in the east, but they ended up being the eight-seat because of the playing. And then they turned it up in the playoffs. Is this heat culture thing real? Everyone talks about heat culture. You know, I just picture Pat Riley like mafia style up there. Like the way they run their players, this and that. Is that real or are we overrating it?

No, it's real. It's a known thing. And it's not built for every player. But for the players it's not built for, you kind of have to question, are you really a hooper? Because the things that the Miami culture really ask of their guys are to be in like elite shape, Well, as a millionaire athlete, you probably should.

You know, you have to do your body fat like every two weeks to make sure that you're eating right. Well, as a millionaire athlete, you probably should. They ask you to be early. They ask you to be on time. They practice hard. They practice a lot. Well, as a millionaire athlete, you probably should.

Everything they ask are things that, like, should be the standard. But like a lot of organizations, they don't set that, which is why, no offense, you see so many misrun, poorly run organizations. I've unfortunately had to play for a couple of them. But it has nothing to reflect the team in the city or the fan base. It has everything to do with who's running the show. And they are a handful of people that, like everything in life, sometimes the boss isn't the greatest guy running the show.

You know what I mean? And you see it, it affects it trickles down throughout the organization, whereas Pat Riley and Spow have been able to build a culture that is, it's something that's a standard. And because they've had success, it's something that doesn't get to waver or be held to by choice. I mean, if you see that you're in or you're out,

there's been a handful of players that have gone there and tried to do it their way and it doesn't work out for them. So it is real. It's the real deal over there. But I respect it. I've always wanted to actually selfishly, I'll be honest, I've always wanted to be a part of it.

I've never played for the heat, but as a Florida kid, and just I think people know kind of how my energy is and how I play. I do think I fit into that culture well. Part of me kind of wants them to lose this series in a weird way. That way they think they need more or they need help or they need new assets. And maybe I can just sneak my way in there.

Is that selfish? This is why we have the pod for you to promote yourself. If you're not, who will? Yeah, exactly, exactly. I got to, you know, who else are going to do it? For sure. The heat culture is so strong, actually, that. So when LeBron left the Cavs the first time,

they got the number one pick three out of the next four years. They were awful. There were nothing. And the LeBron leaves the heat. And, yeah, they had those Dionne Waiters years and the Hassan Whiteside years. They had some weird years there. They lost Wade. They lost Bosch.

And they were in the finals a few years later. The turnaround's crazy. They drafted Bam and Tyler Hero. I don't think they were top 10 picks. They got all these undrafted guys. They hit on all these guys. They completely skipped out on the whole tanking and rebuilding thing. And, you know, other teams that they'll tank and rebuild for five years.

years, the heat just completely skipped it. LeBron left in 2014. They were in the finals in 2020. So that's just a testament to what people are doubting the heat culture. So you don't believe it there. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. I mean, it's been proven.

And you could ask any former heat player or current heat player about it. And, you know, they could probably go into full extent or length. Maybe at one point we'll get a heat player on here. but I think they're one of the better run organizations in basketball. I think everybody, a lot of people would agree and say the same thing. It is a culture, it is a standard there that people have to buy into. And those guys do that. You know, those guys do it.

I've always been a fan of it, like I said. I've always been a fan of Eric Spolster. I think he's one of the best coaches in basketball. So, you know, part of me is a heat fan being a Florida kid, but I'm also conflicted with the Boston Ties. This is an interesting series for the fam. For sure. Do you think the Celtics would be favored against the Nuggets if they advance? I think the Nuggets would beat the Nuggets.

I think if Miami wins this series, the Nuggets win a championship. And I think if the Celtics are able to come back and win this series, with that momentum of coming back from 3-0, I strongly believe that they win the finals. I also think matchups are everything. And, you know, Boston's got some big bodies. And more importantly, they have elite guard play and guard defensive play. You have Derek White, Marcus Smart, Malcolm Brognan, you know, good defensive guards.

Jamal kind of hasn't seen that yet. You know, he played against Phoenix, who doesn't have really the best defensive guards. They have great offensive guards, but not the best defensively. And, you know, they went against the Lakers who don't really have a defensive guard. You know, they had like Schroeder guarding Jamal Murray. Schroeder's a good defender, pesky one as well, but just with the size matchup there,

they just, you know, Reeves isn't, you know, they didn't really have anybody to guard Jamal. So Jamal's kind of just been running through the West, and he's looked in fantastic form and shape. But Boston would be the best defensive team he's seen and they've seen. And I think on the flip side of the offensive end,

Yokinj would be in a million pick and rolls with Tatum and Brown. It would just be, I got to be honest with you, I think it would be a great series, but I have Boston winning. I think the Boston's the best team left. I really do. The Nuggets have played great basketball,

but Boston's the best team left. But they've been messing around. They've been fucking around half of the playoffs. They've been inconsistent, man. And no, I don't think they'd be gasped. I mean, if they were the first team, yeah, if they were the first team to come back and it was going to be a seven game series,

they had to win four in a row, grueling series. The Nuggets are going to have over a week off if that happens. You don't think the Nuggets would just be so fresh and the Celtics would have to come off that seven game series. They would be fresh. I mean, you know, Denver would, and the Celtics might be a little bit banged up and bruised up, but what are we talking about here? I mean, are we talking about a team not having energy for the NBA finals?

Boston? Like, those guys are fine, man. You know, I mean, like, they'd be fine. Look at the Celtics last championship they won with my pops back in 2008. Every series was a seven-game series for the most part. You know what I mean? Like, you get to the finals, man. Like, that's your, that's where you, you know, re-energize, man.

I made it to the finals. I'm not thinking about being tired. I'm pumped and ready to play the fucking NBA finals, though. They also have a couple days off. You get some time to rest. These guys have every sport science, medicine, and treatment possible. Listen, you're playing a hard game, sure, three hours worth of work. And then after that, the rest of the day, man, you know, you lay on your back, bro.

You know what I mean, these guys would be fine. They'd be fine. Now, and they have home court advantage. I don't even know how to explain this or get into this, but my hotel that I'm at just lost complete Wi-Fi, which is frustrating considering it's supposed to be a five-star hotel. So I'm here paying all this damn money to stay here. And I have no internet.

And the lady said, if I want internet, I'm quoting her. She said there's a Starbucks four blocks away. The closest Wi-Fi is four blocks away. That's what she said? Yeah, she's like, well, if you want Wi-Fi, you can, go to a, there's a Starbucks like three blocks away. I was like, are you out of your mind? What do you, to people walking by you right now, what do you look like? Like, what do you look like you're doing? I don't know. I'm catching eyes right now and I'm just trying to stay focused

because you're holding a microphone and looking into your computer. No, I'm not even on my computer. I'm on my phone because I have no Wi-Fi. It's been a catastrophe. But I want our listeners to understand how important this podcast is for us and the lengths that I'm going through to try to get this through to you guys today. We woke up extra early. I've been all over the grounds of the hotel at this point. I might have all work here. I've been in back stairwells.

They're a hostage. Whatever. We're making it work, man. We don't want the audience be jarred by the sound effects. If somebody does like a little punch on the side of, you know, you hear a car going by fast or something like that, I'm okay. There's no worries. but I am outside and I am next to a street.

This is insane. I don't think anybody's ever even done a pod like this. I'm talking to you in a Toyota Croller just rolled by me, just like 10 feet away from me. But you're outside at the place with the best weather in the world maybe, right? L.A.? Weather's got to be good. It's crisp.

Imagine if you were somewhere else. You know what, man? My experiences of L.A. so far this year have been awful. But it's the weather like right now? It's a little chilly, but it's like not really sunny. It's just like kind of muggy out. also like I love LA because I lived here. Did you say mauggy?

Muggy? Moggy. Moggy's just not a word. I mean, it's just not a word. Can't make it, but Moggy is not good. What is it? Muggy?

Sounds like soggy. I don't know. It's not good. You know what's crazy is even though it's not good, you know exactly what I meant when I said. And that's all it matters. The point of the language, the point of the human language

is to say your feelings and express your feelings and have the other party understand exactly what you meant. So even though it's not a word, magy sounds bad. And the fact that I said the weather looks magy and you knew what I meant, it's all matters.

Carry on. I don't think, okay, we'll move on. We'll leave it. You're in some magy weather. Okay, so you were talking about how the Celtics are going to be favored against the nuggets, talking about the Nuggets run. I wanted to talk about the Lakers a little bit with you. Do you think,

let's talk, everyone's talking about LeBron. Is he going to retire? Is it attention seeking? I have a question for you. How come every time one of the goats, someone great, like, you know, Tom Brady or anyone like that, near their last years at the end of every season, especially if they were deep into their career, they always left it or they'd never answer if they were coming back or not. They always left retirement on the table right after their last loss. So why is it different now when LeBron does it?

Why is he catching heat? I think he caught, well, do we call it heat? Oh, yeah, everyone's saying he's taking attention away. of course he's coming back. He wants to play with his son. Why would he say that? Now it's not about the Nuggets anymore. It's about LeBron retiring.

I don't think LeBron said it thinking, let me take away attention from the Nuggets. Nobody's giving them attention anyway. That's just the fact of the matter. And it has nothing to do with the Nuggets. It just has to do with the market. And at the end of the Los Angeles Lakers are always going to dominate the market.

And then you compile that or combine that with the fact that they have arguably the greatest player of all time on their team. They're going to dominate the news. So that's just facts. The deal with LeBron James is simple as this. When you lose in the moment, it's frustrating and it's an emotional experience, especially in the playoffs, especially they got swept.

And it wasn't like it was a close. They got their ass beating. And I think for a competitor like LeBron and a guy of his greatness, I think in those type of moments, you know, there can be a little bit of frustration to where you question whether you want to do this again or if you want to go through something like this again, because in the moment you're not feeling great. So I think he threw those comments out there loosely.

Again, we're all speculating. I don't know. You don't know. But yeah, I think he took heat because you look at LeBron James' play in the playoffs. His last game, he had 40. So you're talking about a guy at the top of his game, still one of the best players in basketball, you know, 20 years in. And, you know, this is a guy that people just don't really see retiring or believe he's retiring,

especially, you know, you add to the fact he's already alluded multiple times that he wants to play with brawny or playing the league the same time as his son which is a dream of his and lebron lebron's just too good of a player at right you know right now at the moment i think to consider retiring and that's just again um a tribute to his greatness him being that old and being that great but he's still at his age in his current state one of the top tier players in the nba and i think the lakers have a little window right now for the next two three years to possibly do something and i think i think he i think he keeps going because i think we've been both know. If he wins another one in that uniform, things start to get, you know, I think it's

like super validated. If it's not already. For sure. You know? For sure. It also, you guys, he hinted at retirement, possibly retiring after his 20th season. He hinted at it for the first time. Michael Jordan retired three times. Like, what is he, a boxer? Like, who retires three times? Yeah, yeah. But LeBron, after his 20th season, can't retire, even hint at retirement, like, it's crazy. Of course it's coming back. And I, that's a great point that you just said that. And I think that is just due to how well he's played and how important he is to the game. He hints at retiring and people lose their fucking mind because it's like basketball without

LeBron just doesn't even seem right. Bro, when I was in the bubble, we had a meeting with players only meeting to ask whether we wanted to continue playing or not. This is after the bucks just decided not to show up and not play that one game. And everybody kind of was like, wait, wait, wait, what going on? we had a players-only meeting and pretty much everyone was like giving their opinions, but nobody was listening.

We're all just waiting to see if LeBron was going to play or not. And if he was, if he wasn't, then people were just going to move on and now want to play. You've got some literally grabbed the mic and gets up and goes, hey, yo big bro, what are we doing?

Because if you ain't playing, he goes, if you ain't playing the heater out, and he drops the mic. Drops the mic. That's great. Pat Beverly, like, spoke up for the clippers and started talking and no one was listening. It was catastrophic. The meeting was ridiculous.

But the point, the point being is LeBron is so important that if he's not playing, nobody really cares. And the fact that he's a huge part of the game, he's embraced the game and embodied the game and took the game from new heights. And I think people just don't want him to go, especially the guy just scored 40. He's still playing elite basketball. I just don't think right now him retiring is realistic, but you have to understand playing 20 seasons, being in the Olympics, how many times,

all-star games, how many times, press tours, how many times? The guy has to be exhausted. Has to be. It's crazy to think that next year is going to be his 21st, say that out loud,

it's 21st season that is coming back for it. If someone was born when LeBron, look at you, Donis Haslam. Look at you, Donis Haslam. He's going in the 20th season. Have you seen him play?

And that's no slight to you not as have them. I don't want to know what I'm going to look like. If I were ever in a situation to be playing in the NBA, my 20th season, God knows what that would look like. Like I'm saying, they'll be nice as hell. Get out of here. Okay, listen. If people were born, I can't stop looking at you and laughing.

I'm like, I hope it rains. I wanted to rain so bad while you're outside. If it does rain, I would still power through, and we're still going to do it. Yeah, rain, sleet or snowy. like a fucking mailman. I'm really proud of you, though. I appreciate it. By the way, you're outside.

You haven't even thought about this part of it. You're outside right now doing the pod. I mean, your house right now, I'm probably going to open up maybe some food here, some drinks, have myself a little day here, enjoy your pool, and you're in the streets right now. I'm not only in the streets. I'm in the fucking...

Okay, let me get it twisted. You're in Beverly Hills. You're not in the streets. You're in like the nicest streets in America. No, I mean, it's actually beautiful out here. I'm surrounded like roses and bubbles, and it's insane. All pretty good weather. It's all good.

This episode is brought to you by Mikhailobotra. They say consistency is the key to success. They weren't wrong. But it's only worth it if you enjoy it. Mikhailo Volta is consistently smooth, consistently refreshing, and consistently late. It's the perfect beer for watching what unfolds during the playoffs, as teams try to keep every point and rebound consistent on their way to getting the trophy in the ring. Austin, Michael Obotcher's tagline is, it's only worth it if you enjoy it.

What's something that you think about when I say that? I mean, honestly, this podcast, I'm currently sitting outside and what's the where we used, Moggy? I'm currently sitting outside in muggy, muggy weather. LA posted outside with a microphone with doing this on my cell phone because there's no Wi-Fi at this hotel, running around trying to do this for you guys. It's not the most convenient. It doesn't always go to plan, but it's something I generally,

really enjoy doing, you know, since we've started this podcast, it seems each week that goes by, I just embed myself more and more into this. The feedback I get, I almost feel better. Like if someone comes up to me and says, hey, man, big fan of your game, or, you know, I loved your mixtape, or I was a big fan from Duke. It feels cool. When someone comes up to me and compliments my podcast, because it's a new frontier for me and kind of like this new love and passion and, you know, I don't want to call it a hobby, I call it a job. It feels really good. And it's worth it for me. this is worth it for me and we're having a blast doing this

and I look forward to the future. You know why you like it more when people give you a compliment on the podcast instead of your basketball game? It's because I think it means that people like genuinely like you because you're the one on the pod, it's your personality,

and it's better than people saying, I like your crossover. I like your step back three. So I think that's why you like that, right? Good point. Mickelop Ultra, the perfect balance of taste and refreshment, only 2.6 carbs and 95 calories.

Head to michelobultra.com. It's only worth it if you enjoy it. Must be 21 years of age. Enjoy responsibly. Can we talk about how Nicola Bolcher sounds like a 6-6-6-wing from Slovenia? Court division and a jumper on them? I think the Oklahoma City Thunder, with one of their 90 picks they have in the next couple years, would take a flyer on Nicola Boltra.

I think there would be a little bit of interest. Why not? They have nothing to lose. It's low-risk, high reward. Let's be honest. Nicola Bolcher. I have a couple questions for you to kind of wrap up the pot. Is that cool?

Yep. I know, the last couple podcasts have been a little doc heavy, but I was going to bring up that he is a finalist for the son's job I just saw. What do you think about, what are your thoughts on him taking that job? Obviously, there's a lot of star power there. Your dad's really good at, you know, managing personalities, coaching stars. What do you think about that? Would you want him to get that job?

Here's the thing about that job. I think my pops would be great in Phoenix, and I think he'd be great for that team, and I think he would be able to solve a lot of issues that they have there. With that being said, I would like him to go to a team where he kind of, has like a new beginning and kind of has like a you know a young core he's just been in so many pressured situations over the years and the media kills him because of it the only reason he's

lost game sevens is because he's in the fucking playoffs and he's in game sevens the whole bunch of coaches who have zero playoff experience or when they do it doesn't go well no one talks about you know what i mean and everybody uses anything you know especially the game seven losing record against my dad and he's lost three one leads you know all this empty stat bullshit we've already gone into that and why it's empty. Or part of it's empty at least. You go to the Phoenix and you're essentially throwing yourself right into a similar situation to Philly.

They have a good team, but it's not like a great championship team. They have some star power, but their overall supporting tasks needs a lot of work and help. But because of the severity of the star power, it's like a win now team, which we all know, because they just fired Monty Williams because they lost. And it's like how much blame was really on money? I don't know, probably not a lot. But they got to blame somebody, and it's usually the coach.

And I would rather have my dad go to a, I'd rather have Doc go to a Pistons, a Toronto, man. No, I couldn't. But if your dad went, let's say the rocket's job is still available. I know. That's not going to work. You think James is 100% going to Houston? Yeah.

It's going to leave it at that. I think he's going to Houston. By the way, you love Houston. it could be a spot for you. I'm just saying I'm throwing it out there. I think you're saying I love Houston is an understatement. I have, Houston is one of my favorite cities in the world. Yeah, I love that city.

So maybe you should call James kind of link up. All right, we're doing too much here. All right, I'm going to ask you a couple questions. We can call it rapid fire or whatever. But no, actually going back, well, I couldn't even imagine your dad coaching a team right now that would go 20 and 62. They'll take years off his life.

He's not there for that. No, no, no, no. The opposite takes years off your life. What he just went through takes years off his life. The stress, the media negativity, the pressure. He does it year after year after year after year, after year. Like, bro, go go enjoy coaching again, man. Go get some young guys, you know, build them up.

Don't go into the season with such high expectations. Thinking your jobs on the line, every win or lose. Like, bro, you've been doing this the past how long? Like, my guy, go to a young team. You have that experience. You've done it before. You did it with the heart and hustle magic. Go go to a younger team.

lower expectations, build, coach, coach free, coach without pressure, coach young guys that don't listen because they haven't been paid $200-something million yet and they haven't been all-stars and all these things. Like go get a team to buy into every word you say and enjoy the game, enjoy coaching, relax, have some pressure off you, get a long-term deal, get some consistency. These are the things that I want him to have because he hasn't really had it. He's bounced around a couple times over the past couple of years due to the situation, the clippers, Philly. Like, bro, him going to Phoenix, you were throwing yourself into the same situation to where if they win, great, you're a hero, and if you lose, you're fired.

Like, it's just like, it's ridiculous. And I'm not saying it's right. I'm not saying it's fair. This isn't a doc issue either. This is a coaching issue in the NBA. This is a new NBA. I've seen, that's why Yokic just said a couple, you know, days ago that coaching is the, in the NBA in today's day, is one of the worst jobs you can have. I say this is a guy that would coach, because there's an adrenaline and a pressure there that, you know, at the sports and a basketball junkie, you chase. And I know my dad wants that. And that's why he's intrigued by Phoenix.

He sees that job and he sees a chance of winning a championship. And he wants it. He wants it so bad, bro. He lives and dies by this shit. And I'm the same way. That's why I would coach knowing what it comes with. A lot of negativity, not a lot of consistency, a lot of pressure, and most importantly, a lot of blame.

And it doesn't even matter if it's a lot of it's, fair or unfair. That's what you get in the Indiana. And I would rather him go somewhere just because he's dealt with it for so long. I'd rather him go somewhere and just have a chance to just, I don't want to say kick your feet up, but just like, just relax, man. And I think there's a part of him that's intrigued by it as well, man. You know, the Detroit situation, there's a couple of the situations. Like, man, like, you know, there's opportunities out there. And also, let's see how this finals, you know, conference finals unfold. If Boston losers, game six, like this, what happens to Joe. Would Boston want dock back? That'd be incredible. There's a lot of things there.

There's a lot of things to happen. I think you just kind of wait and sit a little bit longer and then make a decision. That's my take. For sure. And your dad did really well when a lot of the guys were out this year for the Sixers and he was just coaching, you know, De Anthony Melton and these guys. And he was, you know, those guys were listening to him. We got to coach again. You know what I mean? It wasn't personalities. And he did a really good job when Joel and James Hardin, everyone was out. The issue is, though, I know he wants another ring. He wants another ring on that resume. So that's why it's hard to not go to the.

You see, the suns are maybe a move or two away. It's really hard to do that, you know, turn something like that down. No, that's the intrigue. It's because he looks at that team. He sees, he sees, he sees, you know, the KD, he sees the Booker. He sees they have two talented stars. And then they're like, okay, well, we can kind of formulate pieces around them. You can always try to add new pieces.

There's an intrigue there. Also, he loves the golf. Let's talk about it. He's going to be in Scottsdale. He's going to be golf in his head. ass off every day. There's a quality of life that's really it's a quality of life. That's so

funny. I was going to call you out earlier. That's like you saying oh, I love heat culture. I would love to play there one day. I'd bring the best out of me. Oh, that's why you want to go to Miami? That's the reason because that's the key coach. That is why I want to play. I'll get over. You want to live in Miami. Okay. The only reason the main reason I would want to play

for the heat is because of the culture in Miami. 100%. 100%. The second reason would be the closeness to my son and me growing up in Florida and being able to have access to sing my son any day I want would be a blessing. And the third reason, the third reason would be, what do you want for me, man? What do you want to say the weather and the woman? What do you want? Weather and the women? The two Ws.

Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, yeah, there's a lot of positives to playing for the Miami Heat. All right. Let's do a rapid fire segment and then I'll let you go back inside of your hotel. So you're not outside just catching, I don't even know, watching the cars drive by. All right. If the Nuggets win the title this year, could you rank the 2019 championship Raptors team, the 2021 Bucks team that won the title and this Nuggets team? Could you rank them one, two, three? Say that again? If the Nuggets win the title this year, I want you to rank these three teams, the 2019 Raptors team. that won the title with Kauai, the 2021 Bucks team that won the title with Yannis,

and this Nuggets team, could you rank those three? Yes. Number one would be the Bucks. Number two would be Denver. Number three, it would be Toronto. Any reason behind that? You just think Toronto kind of caught a lucky one there with the Warriors guys being out? I'm not saying they got lucky because, oh, yeah, they didn't get lucky.

Who am I kidding? They did get lucky. And the fact is, there's nothing wrong with that because everyone has, you have to have luck to win. you need a little luck to go your way. Some of the years, the Warriors won, most of their series, a lot of times, like, a star player was hurt or like a guy was down. Like, you need a little bit of luck to go your way.

And a lot of times luck is thrown your way and it's up to the team to take advantage of it. When I played it with the Rockets, we played the Warriors. Kevin Durant goes down in game six. We could have, like, they, we could have won that series. They had no KD, but we didn't take advantage of that luck. You know, I believe Toronto did. you know, you have a couple guys go down and they full, you know, went in the full swing

and you were able to bring a chip home. With that being said, I don't think that Toronto team was better than the Yannis. What year? That was 2019. 2021 was when the Yonis won. 2019 was when the Raptors won. Raptors won, yeah.

The 2021 Bucks team, I think, is the best team out of that group. I would put Denver second out of the Toronto third. If Yokich wins the title this year, do you have them ahead of Dirk in the all-time rankings? It's hard to say that just because Dirk put in so much work for so much time. So the answer would be no. But in terms of careers thus far, as impressive Dirk's is, nobody really compares to Yokic.

So if Yokic is able to do anything even in the realm of similarity in the next five to six, seven years, I think Yokic has a chance to go down as the best foreign basketball player, international basketball player of all time. That's high praise. And I agree with you. two MVP's versus one. If he wins a title this year, they both have a title. It's just crazy being a second round pick being drafted during a Taco Bell commercial.

So that just goes into all the legend. Yeah, yeah, no. He's on pace, man. He's impressive. He's the most unselfer superstar I've ever played with. And he just has the control and dominance on the game that we haven't really seen other than LeBron. The way he's able to control and manipulate a game,

I've only ever seen it from LeBron. So, yeah, it's impressive, man. I would give him a couple more years, and then I think he takes Dirk, and I think he solidifies himself as, especially if they win a title. Especially, he has to win a title. But if he wins a title and keeps on the face,

putting these numbers, and his team keeps having this type of success, yeah, I have him being the best international player ever. So Jamal Murray, last time he was healthy, he was during the bubble. they were in the conference finals, right? He lost in six. He's essentially injured for the next two years,

and now this year he's first year back being healthy. He's in the NBA finals. If he was healthy the last two years, would they have won a title? You were on those teams. Would they have won a title? Yeah. I think we would have been in contention.

We would have went to a conference finals. We would have been right there in the race. Jamal Murray healthy with a, obviously, Yolkich is healthy. They have probably the best two men game in the NBA. And in terms of their rapport, the handoffs, the pick and roll passes, they're dominant. And now that they have the pieces they have around them, which I thought, you know, even last year, I thought we had the pieces there. But we just didn't have Jamal.

If we had Jamal last year, I think we're in that contest. Yeah, we're in that contest. C.J. McCollin was on Ryan Russell's podcast recently, and he was talking about how the NBA is a game of trends, where for a while there's everyone was doing the big three, right? And everyone copies things. what do you think with these three teams left and let's say the Nuggets or the Celtics key

whoever wins what's the trend that you're seeing now in the NBA I think obviously we're going away from Big Three is it big two

with LeBron AD you know Yokich Jamal Murray Jason Tatum you know Jalen Brown what do you what do you think

the new turn would be or is it going to be C.J. McClellan was saying it was continuity like continuity I'm sorry

where it's keep a group together for a while Spolster's been there for a while Jimmy Butler band these guys been playing together

for a while it's not like the sons where they're just kind of make shift, kind of learning on the fly together. It's the Celtics have been together for a while. Do you think that's the new trend? If you look at the teams that's had the most success

of the past couple of years, there are all teams that have had a group that has been together for a while. The Warriors have grown in, you know, a dynasty together. They have consistency. Miami Heat, the Denver Nuggets. You know,

I'm trying to even think who else is even in that race. Well, they were going to break up the Celtics. The Celtics, they were going to break up the Celtics. How many times with Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum, They kept them together. They go to the finals. And they kept them with Marcus Smart and a couple of the other pieces they have. And they have a real continuity there.

It's real. The bucks have it. You know, if Yonis doesn't go down, man, no offense. If Yonis is fully healthy and Chris Hill, Middleton's fully healthy, that team probably could have won that series with Miami. I don't like to say that because you've got to get credit to Miami for doing it. But the point being is, you know, to get back to the point that CJ alluded to it, that that should be a trend.

And I hope that presidents and general managers and owners of the league can see this and understand that the firing and trading and signing of players every single year. Like how the hell are you supposed to build a chemistry when you shake up a locker room every single summer? And the teams that are winning are the teams that have had guys put something together through consistency and rapport. So I think, yeah, that's got to be a trend. forward. The NBA is such a game of trends too. The bigs are dead. No more centers.

Bigs are dead. Now the two best players in the league are centers. The two most dominant players in the league are centers. So, you know, at this point, you have, you know, especially if Yolkich wins. The teams start now looking for,

you know, centers again. I don't know. The Warriors shook up the whole league with their three-point shooting. You know, everything is a copycat league. So, yeah. 2006, the heat win the championship, Dwayne Wade, finals MVP.

2006 draft, Rangy Ford goes top 10. They're calling on the next Dwayne Wade. These are Dwayne Wade type. 2007, Dirk wins MVP. 2007 draft, our Jerry Bart Nani goes number one. He thinks he's the next Dirk. It's a copycat league completely.

And the Warriors, obviously, are the best example of that. The Warriors are the best example of that. Yeah, the Warriors win championships, the whole league tries to turn into them. The problem is no one has Steph. Right. Wrong.

What do you think about Trey Young? The Trey Young rumors go on to the Lakers. Do you think he's a good fit there? I'd rather see Karee. Just for the drama. You're a big popcorn guy. God, you're such a pop... You're drama horror, man.

You want to see Karee in L.A. First off, I've never been called a drama horror in my life. And that's the thing. This man is sitting... I want to think about... For the folks are listening, I want to think about the audacity of this guy. This guy is sitting in my office.

In my house, about to open my fridge in about 20 minutes from now. And just called me... a drama whore. I don't think I've ever been insulted more of my life. But back to your point, I don't even think Kyrie's drama, although his, his Instagram videos have been a little bit weird lately.

His little like, guys, guys, stop with the narratives. I'm like, bro, Kyrie, you're one of the most popular playing guards in the world. People are excited about you possibly playing for the Lakers, man. Just deal with it. I don't really understand that.

With that being said, I think Kyrie has a chemistry with LeBron James. I think he's also the better player I like Try Young but Kyrie like if you get a fully loaded healthy physically and mentally Kyrie Irving along with LeBron James and the Lakers they are a very exciting team

what was the last time you saw fully locked in Kyrie though he was good for a month this year and then he demanded a trade that's the issue that's the issue but to me Kyrie's still one of the best point guards in the NBA that's just a talent I don't know if you could pass up besides the fact the Lakers have seen plenty of fucking drama

in their past it's not like they can't handle it All right. Also, I want to keep you outside too much longer. Actually, I do. I'm really praying it rains or a car drives by and splashes you with water. I don't even know there's a puddle out there, but I'll let you go ahead and get back to your hotel, man. It was great chat with you. Thanks for taking the time out to do the pod today. I didn't think we were going to do it because you were, I know you were so busy with the ESPN stuff. So I appreciate that. Hey, no, it's any time. And I enjoyed this experience and this runaround. I have the lay of the map of the hotel just in case anything ever popped off. I know every safety exit or me. I've gotten to mingle with the people outside. I've gotten the people watch while doing the pod, which is pretty impressive, if I don't say, myself. And yeah, we were able to make this thing work. At the end of the day, our job is to make sure we get this out for the listeners. And we were able to do that. It's not perfect. I'm sorry for the inconvenience and the noises maybe in the background, but we made it work. And another week done, my guy, another week done.

We've actually got some bonus heat self-ex thoughts from someone else from the ringer, and she just so happens to be Austin's sister and host of the Bachelor Party and morally corrupt here at the Ringer podcast network, Callie Rivers. Here's mine and hers conversation. Callie Curry is going to be on the pod here right now and she's going to sub in. Callie's also the co-host of Bachelor Party on the Ringer Podcast Network. So Callie, what's up? I really appreciate you jumping in. No problem. I was actually with Pasha anyways. We are watching Austin on ESPN. So this worked out perfectly. Yeah. So wait, wait, one more thing. What's up?

Because I'm new to this pod, I need to let the listeners know. If you hear a kid in the background, I apologize. I have three kids that are running wild. And it's going to happen. You know, it's funny as the second half of the pod, Austin had to record it outside. And there was cars driving by, all sorts of noise. Busy pod. It's a crazy pod.

But we're getting it done. We mostly spoke about the Heat Celtics series. So we're going to need you to sub in, have some hot takes. Do you think the Celtics could pull this off or are the heat going to win in Game 6? I know my brother said that he thinks that he are going to win in game six. I think that the Celtics are the better team. I think the Heat have been playing better up until game four.

I also am a huge believer in momentum. Celtics have all the momentum right now. Is Gabe Vincent playing game six? Questionable. Yeah. I think that's a huge question mark because he's been playing phenomenal. I mean, his stock's only rising.

He doesn't play and they win. I mean, Celtics win. His stock is rising. He's a free agent this summer. It's all good things for Gabe Vincent, although I think the heat really want him back. I have to say also my husband, after game three, said I would bet a ton of money Celtics win in seven.

Really? Yeah. And now he brings it up after every win. Every Celtics win. He's like, I said it first. I said it first. I just think it's really hard to beat a team four times in a row, and that's why no one's ever done it before.

But if it was ever going to happen... If it was ever going to happen, it could happen. This isn't a situation where a better team has this crazy 3-0 lead and this underdog story. Which is usually the case. Right. Yes. No, I totally understand. I think this is the other better team.

The big X factor is that I believe Jimmy Butler hates losing more than anyone on this earth and will do anything in his power to win. So we'll see what version of him shows up for game six. I also think the Celtics are best when they're up 15 plus. In tight games, they seem to be a little crazy. Which is weird because they're a team that went to the finals last year. They faced adversity. They've won. They came back against the Bucks last year, 3-2 in the second round.

Like, they've seen it all. I mean, they came back with the Sixers 3-2. Exactly. But in the games they won, they were blowouts. Yeah. Like, I feel like they're not good in tight games at the end. And I don't really know why that is. They obviously have a closer.

They did it in game six. It was kind of close at the end. Jason went off, Jason Tatum went off and closed the game. I just think, I wonder what their record is. I feel like in close games, it has to be bad this year. Yeah. And maybe it's their year older. I'm not sure why it's that way.

I mean, people are going to point at the coaching. I personally like Joe Missoula. I think he's super young. So like, yeah, it's his first run ever as a head coach. Is he going to make mistakes? Yeah. I think every single person in their job as they elevate. make mistakes. Is that not true?

I think what we're learning also is that with Eric Spolstra, you know, being the coach there for a long time and Mike Malone also being there for a while, we're learning that it's let these guys learn. Other players can learn during their career. Right. Jason Tatum has made a ton of mistakes this playoffs run and no one's, you know what I mean? Like he still gets to stay there. I mean, obviously I'm probably biased, but I think if you look over the past 20 years, I wonder which teams have had the most success, right? If I had to guess, I would say Miami. I would say Golden State. I would say San Antonio, right? Is there any other team you throw in there?

How many years are we talking? I said last 20. The last 20 years. Championship success. Did you said the Miami Heat? I said Heat, Spurs, and Golden State. The Raptors have always been pretty good. I don't remember the Raptors. Championships. Championships? Championships? I guess Lakers. The Raptors won a championship. Yeah, but more than one. Like, who have been the most successful teams the past 20 years? No, that's all you get then. That's it.

Maybe the Lakers, right? Lakers. But two different versions of the Lakers, right? Shackoby and then... Three out of four of those teams, their coaches have been there for a long time. Right. Is that a coincidence? Right. The only time I remember a team winning with a new coach is Ty Loo with Cleveland.

Right. With LeBron. Yeah. I think that... And I guess you could say the same thing with Lakers, too. Like, I mean, LeBron is obviously a special talent. not taking anything away from Ty or Frank Vogel at all. I think they're both amazing coaches.

But I'm just saying I don't think it's a coincidence that the teams that ride their coaches like through good and bad and know they'll bounce back and all of that continue to have success. Right. I think that's what we're learning with these playoffs too is the teams that are doing well and succeeding, they've been together for a while. The team like the sounds that you kind of put it together, they looked really bad against the nuggets because the nuggets have been together for a few years. Yeah, chemistry's not there yet.

And I don't think, like, Moni didn't have like a ton of an opportunity. I think it sucks with the sons. They have a new owner. So, like, I get a new owner wanting to come in and bring his guy there. That happens a lot. And you can't turn on a chance to get Kevin Duran. He's that Kevin around at 50, 40, 90 season. I'm saying, I'm saying, like, coaching-wise, like, owners sometimes they want their guy.

They want the guy they hired. Sucks for money because I mean, obviously he did a great job while he was there. Turn the franchise around. But I understand an owner wanting to do that. It's just, like, sucky timing because he didn't really get a chance to actually, like, how many games did even get? Right. with Aiton, Devin, and Kevin, and CP all healthy.

It has to be under 15, right? Well, I think the reason that Monty got let go is because of the way that they've lost the last couple years, getting blown out at home, two years in a row. It's just something's wrong there. That's just had a normal way to go out two years in a row. I don't, totally. I totally.

I get it. I don't think he had an opportunity with this version of the Sons. Right. And they probably overperformed three years ago. Right. And Chris Paul wasn't Chris Paul. Yeah. I mean, he's had injuries and everything.

So I'm going to ask you this. Let's say the Celtics win in seven. During these playoffs, Jimmy Butler and Eric Spolstra have added to their legacy so much. I mean, Jimmy Buller, it's, I said it earlier, he leaped frog so many people in the all-time list. I think he's just his- I don't even, Eric Spelstra to me has been like a halting coach for a while. So, like, not shocking from him at all. And it's not like it's shocking for Jimmy, but to do it with the team that he had this year. And like the regular season, they were not good.

So to go from not good to Eastern Conference Finals is crazy. And not only, no, no, not only that, not only do that, but beat the bucks, obviously, without Yannis. I'm not sure if they would have won if Yonis was healthy the entire series, but who knows, they could have, based off how they're playing, beat the Knicks. And then we're up 3-0 to the Celtics and could still win and go to the finals. Absolutely. But what I wanted to ask you is, if they are the first team to blow a 3-0 lead, does it completely erase every day? that Jimmy is built during this playoff run? To me, no.

To media, maybe. I think it's got, internet's going to go insane. Yeah, that's what people do. Right. But I think if the better team, I mean, I, again, might be biased, but I said this again with a six or series, Celtics were better than them all year. Yeah. And I think they're the deepest team in the league.

Am I, before the series, by the way, I think everyone thought they were going to lose in five. So to go to seven with them, we had the opportunity. to win in six for sure and we didn't or the sixers didn't um and that sucks but like you still went seven with a team that's better than you so like it sucks for miami to lose a three o lead if they do it'd be the first time ever it sucks it sucks it sucks but were they ever supposed to even be in this series right so like how does that go again like it's almost like should would we be happier if they lost it four would not go against like their legacy wouldn't be tarnished at all if they got all the

Eastern Conference Finals and got blown out by the Celtics 4-0. People still would have been like, I can't believe they got that far and like, da-da-da-da-da-no, whatever, Jimmy, that. But because you took a better team to seven and lost, that's somehow bad? It's only because it's never been done before. I totally, totally get it. But has a number eight seed

ever been up 3-0 against the basically number one seed? I know they were number two, but basically... They were the number two seed, but I think everyone knows they were the deepest team in NBA this year. Yes, but has that, I don't know the answer to that. Has a number eight seed ever been up 30? No. The closest thing we have is in 1993, the Phoenix Suns were down. They were the number one seat against the Lakers. They were down. It was a best of five series in the first one. Yeah, yeah. The Lakers were up too well. The Sons won the next three. I ended up going to the finals that year. That's the closest thing. Yeah, that's a little bit different. But yeah, that's what I'm saying. So I can't, to me, no, to me, from what I've seen this playoffs, Eric Spolstra, like, I don't think it changed anything for me who's already like one of the best coaches in the league, top three for sure. But just,

Jimmy, it has been so impressive. Just because the mentality he has, I always think this. If you took his mentality and put it on a bunch of other players, they'd probably be like the best in the league. We've talked about it before on the pot. He doesn't have the craziest bag or the craziest skill set, not the best shooter, not the best handler, but. Yeah, I think he's better than we all think, obviously.

And I think he just like pulls it out when it matters most, which, by the way, I'll take that. I'd rather have that than someone kill all year and then when it matters most, we don't have it. Like I would way rather have someone like Jimmy. And even, I don't want to take anything away from his teammates because his teammates have played amazingly. But the belief he has in his teammates,

I feel like it makes them more confident. And it's, it's just, I think it's like really cool to see. I know people on Twitter were saying like, we'd never want to see a Denver heat finals. I'm like, what? That would be so much fun to watch. So the part that we didn't get from Austin was Austin went on a little tangent about how he thinks that those finals would do terrible numbers. One of the worst finals ever.

I think they would. Basketball nerds would love it, right? But the people don't care about it. They don't want to see that. I agree with him because people still doubt Denver. I'm like, have you not been watching? It's crazy. Like, yeah.

I mean, the way that their team is put together, I just, if I had to pick a final tournament. I'm going to let you know. Austin said, if the heat make the finals, Denver wins. If the Celtics make the finals, Celtics win. Yeah, I think that's just because people just like don't believe in Denver. I'm not saying Austin doesn't because obviously I think he loves half the team. He played with them. But again, the Celtics have been the team all year that people thought like they're the deepest. They're playing great. Their defense is awesome. Their offense is great. Like,

whatever. Jason Taden was an MVP candidate the first like two months of the season. So I think it's really hard for people to count the Celtics out. even down 03. Right. So if the Celtics pull it off, though, and they win four straight, they've had, they've had kind of a rocky road, right? Went six against the Hawks. A rockiest. Rockiest of Roads.

Do you think they would have enough energy in the finals to face the team like the nuggets who've just swept their opponent? They're going to have a week off? No, I almost think it might work better for the Celtics. Sometimes when you have too much time off, it like messes up the vibe that you have, the chemistry that you have, the way things are rolling. Yeah, I don't I think they'll be fine. So can we get an official prediction for Game seven or game six and seven or finals?

Let's talk about the Celtics heat. Let's finish that one off. I want to believe that Miami will win in six. If I had to bet money on it, I don't know if I could say six or seven, but I want to bet Miami. It's going to be the, I was not awesome.

It's going to be the most watch game at the playoffs. This is Saturday night, game six in Miami, everything on the line. Question. Right. If Miami loses game six, do you think they have a chance in game seven? Absolutely not. No? No.

There's no shot. That's not happening. So you think it's six or done? Yeah, I just can't imagine it. I mean, because the Celtics are the better team. That's why. We all thought that going in. Yeah, that's the thing.

If both teams play good, if they both teams play their good, play their good, the Celtics win, right? Right. The only way Miami wins is if they play good and Celtics play bad. But you're asking Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown to have four straight games of being excellent. They haven't really been doing that in the playoffs. No, the only thing, though, also is the two game sevens that I can remember Jason Tatum playing, played really fucking good. Yeah.

Really, like unstoppable. Game seven against the bucks, game seven against the six years, he was out of his mind, great. But then you have, it's a game seven, everything on the line, and you have Jimmy Butler, who's like the alpha of all alphas in the game. I know. I don't know. I don't know. But, yes, if I have to bet, I want to say Miami in six.

The reason I think if it goes to seven aside of me and be close is it's going to be so deflating if the heat lose at home, game six. And it'll be the third straight loss. I would agree with you. Yeah. Not this heat team. Yeah. I don't see Jimmy Butler rolling over in any capacity.

ever. They might lose, but I don't think they're losing in a we're giving up fashion ever. That's a good point. My last question for you is there's been a lot made about heat culture and people make jokes about it and stuff. And during this playoff run, they're saying, you know what, it's pretty legit. What do you think? Do you think that's a real thing? He culture? I think it's absolutely legit. I've never not thought it was legit. Even jokes, like, you can joke about it, but I never didn't think that it was real. Pat Riley. I saw a Twitter, was that you that said it to me. Someone sent me a Twitter, a tweet about Pat Riley that was like, if he gets to the finals, he'll be a, he'll, he will have participated in like 24% of the NBA finals.

That's crazy. I didn't say that's a crazy stat. I need to look. I need to find it. But yeah, like Pat Riley is a proven winner. Right. And it's crazy because they completely, and being awesome one over this too, they completely avoided the whole rebuilding thing. LeBron, Wade and Bosch all left. They had those weird Dionne Waiters, Hassan Whiteside years. Yeah. But they kind of went, went through. it got some undrafted guys drafted really well with bam and tyo hero really well signed jimmy beller great signing obviously at the time i didn't really get it but it just was a perfect marriage the he culture even even call lowry people questioned that i still questioned that i think it could have

better with that money maybe yeah maybe now but i do think he's like an integral part of all of this like he's been here before he's not scared we don't know what he's doing in the locker room he's probably unbelievable i think i think that he's a really big piece of this and obviously like he's not starting he's been totally fine not starting like took on that role I think having bets like that is super important. Even Kevin Love, which I still don't, I don't understand the Cleveland thing. But I think Kevin Love has been, what game was that? Game two, I want to say.

He changed the game with like football passes, was hitting three. It's like a lot of people in that situation are scared. Why would Kevin Love be scared? He's been there before. He has the experience. I just think that sometimes that's like invaluable. So your final prediction, and can we get a finals prediction also? I mean, we're going to get a lot out of you here.

You're normally doing the reality TV thing. This is the one opportunity we get to drag some basketball stuff out of you. Yeah, I think finals prediction, or no, this prediction, I want to say heat in six. Okay. If Heat win, I think Denver went in five or six. Okay. If the Celtics win in seven, I just, I get why people would pick the Celtics. But I think I just can't go against Denver.

I think they've been playing so well. and Yokic is on another planet. Right. So I'm going to go Denver and six. So either way, Denver's winning the title. I think. I ask Austin this, I'm going to ask you this. So in the bubble, obviously they went to the conference finals.

Jamal Murray was hurt essentially the next two years. And now they're back in the finals. If Jamal Murray was healthy the last, you know, during that run, would we have seen a Nuggets championship already? I don't know if we would have seen a Nuggets championship, but you definitely would have seen Nuggets Path round too, I think. Yeah. the problem here is that

I think the Warriors were a really fucking good team. I don't know if anyone's beating the Warriors when they're all healthy. It's a bad matchup for Yokic. The way that they've been rolling the past 10 years, I don't want to take any championships away from them. Right. That's a good point.

Thank you so much for filling in. Like I said, you're my favorite rivers. The Issa going to hear this. I don't care. I'm going to stand by it. Really appreciate you subbing in. And I think you should maybe jump on another part with us. Maybe I will.

I know I listen to all of your pods. I have a lot of comments on them. Yeah. But, you know, I like sticking to reality television. You can hear me at Bachelor Party or morality corrupt. Morally corrupt, Jesus Christ. All right. Great.

Thanks, Callie. Wait, I wanted to say something, but I just wasn't sure. Hold on, hold on. Oh, I was wrong. I was going to say the last time the Celtics won, they had a similar journey. Oh, no, Austin did talk about this. They went seven against the Hawks.

They went 7, 7, 6. 6. I thought it was 6-7-7-6. So I thought it was the exact same. Seven against the 8 seed. Seven against LeBron in the second round. Six against the pistons. Yeah.

And then six for the Lakers, yeah. Right. So it's possible. The same amount of games. I will say they just haven't looked like this ride this Celtics have been on. It doesn't feel like a championship ride. Just because they haven't,

They've mailed it in a few times. I mean, that came three against the heat. Does that feel like a championship team to you? But I guess it doesn't matter. It can build character. Yeah, I guess it doesn't matter.