The Ringer NBA Show - Chris Paul Is Headed to the Suns, James Harden Reportedly Requested a Trade, and More | Real Ones

Episode Date: November 16, 2020

Chris Ryan joins Logan to briefly discuss Chris Paul being traded to the Phoenix Suns (0:01). Then Logan and Raja jump on to talk about the rumors absolutely flying around about the Rockets’ possible implosion this offseason (17:30). After that, they get into Raja’s experiences with free agency (41:00) and what actually happened in the locker room between Raja and Ty Corbin during the 2011-12 season he spent on the Utah Jazz (52:50).  Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Guest: Chris Ryan Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, what's good? This is Logan Murdoch, and this is the real ones. We recorded an episode earlier, but we need a topper because Chris Paul is a Phoenix son. Wow. So we couldn't get Chris Paul, and we couldn't get Roger because he's out there, like, fighting wild alligators off the coast of Florida. So we got the second most important Chris on the planet. We got Chris Ryan of the ringer. What's popping, bro?

I'm short. I like telling people what to do, and I can sometimes get myself into a bad mood. So I'm basically Chris Paul. Yeah. Do you flop? In certain circumstances, yes. Yeah, totally. Okay.

Chris Paul is a son. Yeah, we knew that. We kind of had a feeling that was going to have to rate. We had a bit of a feeling that was going to happen. But it pairs them with Devin Booker. I just want to read a tweet from a friend of the show, Kendrick Perkins, who said, Devin Booker DeAndre Aden with Coach Monty Williams

makes the sons a top five team in the West. Carry on. do you agree with big perk no about this trade no I do not I mean I think it makes the suns more interesting and I like this idea of later period CP3 getting paid $40 million

to go around and like do kind of like extreme home makeover on teams and you know you just walk in and be like you have the good bones of a house here but I'm going to knock this wall down so you can open up the kitchen floor plan you know what I mean like that's what I think he's kind of his sort of later period

career. I hope he goes to a new team every season and a half now. This is kind of cool. He's renovating, he's renovating kitchens right now. He's putting enough stuff. He's painting the walls. You know what I mean? There's a new couch coming in. But, you know, so everybody was high on the suns given the way they play in the bubble. rightly so.

I think that they had a good vibe to them with the players that they had. They probably felt like they were a piece or two away from being serious contenders. Chris Paul definitely legitimizes this team. Does he make them drastically better?

Yes, he does. The reason why I think he makes them drastically better is in the way that he made the Thunder drastically better. I see this is another situation of quite like OKC, where you have a bunch of guys that you probably think is

maybe a 10, 9 seat at best. Chris Paul makes them at least a sixth seat in my mind. Just with, I hate to use the word intangibles, but the intangibles, the smart, and the game. Last year was a bit of a Chris Paul redemption story, right? Where, you know, he has the time in Houston. It doesn't really work out with him and James. He gets traded to OKC Thunder and they wound up beating the rockets. You know what I mean? But that was

in large part of Chris Paul. I'm kind of liking this Chris Paul little redemption story that we got going on here, you know, and I'm curious to see what that does. I think it's going to be a repeat of last year with the Thunder where, yeah, the team's probably supposed to be a 10 seed, but Chris Paul makes them into a six, maybe a five seed. Maybe they go to the second round of the playoffs. Yeah, I'm happy for him because the other version of this story is playing out the rest of his days in Charlotte or Orlando or the Knicks and kind of getting hitting your head on the ceiling of the Eastern Conference first round or something like that. And I don't think anybody really wanted me. I think no matter how you feel about Chris Paul, like you have to respect what he's done for

the game and respect his career and really hope that he gets as many shots at a ring as possible. I don't know if Phoenix is that, but it feels like a much more relevant third act of your career to be playing in these scenarios than to just be why. whiling away somewhere like Atlanta or Washington. And no disrespect to the I-95 teams. I'm just saying like, it's cool to see him do that. So who do you think here if you're like, okay, Woj definitely credited Robert Sarver with pulling off this deal,

which while I know James Jones is there in Phoenix, you know, like they have a very hands-on owner in Phoenix with Sarver. Who do you think got out made out better in this deal? I mean, obviously like Phoenix is going to probably be the better team next year. But so we got, Who do we have going back the other way? We have Kelly Ubray. Ricky Rubio, Kelly Ubray, Ty Jerome, Jalen,

a couple other guys in draft compensation. Well, the draft compensation is important, though, because it's a first in the, it's a protected first in the 2022 draft, which is a double draft, right? So that is, that's the money right there. And now Sam Presti is sitting on 16 first round picks over six years. So, like, San Presby can pretty much, like,

call his shot right now. 16 first round picks, he just did. He can trade for assets again. Like, he can trade for another Paul George type player. He can trade for, you know, to pair alongside SGA. Or, you know, he could, he's shown that, I mean, I don't know, he did draft a guy by the name of Russell Westbrook, you know, James Hardin. He's a pretty good drafter. Yeah.

You know what I mean? So I think that long term, I think the Thunder do better. I'm still not sold on Phoenix's infrastructure just yet. I'm just not. I think that Chris Paul could be a one year, maybe a two-year guy if they just think about flipping him again. And it still comes down to DeAndre Aden and Devin Booker long term for me. And I just, I don't see that just yet, just being a contender right now.

Without Chris Paul's size. I think Chris Paul makes him a six seed. But if you take him off the team, then I just don't, I don't see it. So one thing that I thought was interesting is that last year when Chris Paul went to the Thunder, they essentially redid the entire team on the fly. They bring in SGA. they bring in, you know, they have Gallinari in place. They bring in Chris Paul.

They have Stephen Adams. But for the most part, they've remade that entire roster. This Phoenix team has some sense of identity. They had some sense of accomplishment, I think, even going where they went in the bubble with the undefeated bubble run. Do you think that there's any chance that this is the bad version of CP3, Extreme Home Makeover, where he comes in and he starts breaking people's balls in practice and yelling, yelling at DeAndre Aiton for not like rolling harder to the rim or screwing up on defense

and barking at these guys and that the good vibes that Phoenix had disappear. You're pausing because that scenario seems plausible. Yeah, it does. I think I'm curious to see what it does with Devin Booker, right? Because this is Devin Booker's show for lack of a better. This is his team. but inherently with a CP3 CP3 is going to make this his team

no matter what like that's just the type of guy he is so I'm curious about that friction because you know Devin's been there for a minute it's his city, it's his team and then you all of a sudden you have an older guy who's like hey yo check this out this is how you do things this is how you're supposed to do things this is how I'm going to run this team

I'm curious about that though but I'm not so much for Deandra 80 no more so for Devin Booker how it's going to affect him Chris Paul was able to seamlessly work with Shruder and SGA and have that sort of three-headed monster in the back court. And that was awesome. But those guys were also all really committed to playing good defense, I think.

I think that was part of the reason why that back court worked is that the three of those guys were essentially a defense-first back court. And that's not necessarily Booker's signature. Or Aden's. But also it's a mindset, though. I mean, I think if you're held accountable, you can at least try on a defense event. And I think that Chris Ball is going to hold them accountable.

We do have a reaction from Roger Bell. He just came in with the reaction. So we're going to listen to that and we're going to react to the reaction. Shasa, play the sound. Oh, shit. Okay, sons, I see you James Jones. CP3 to the desert. I think it's a nice move, man pairing him with Devin Booker and DeAndre Aiton.

I think it's a great fit in terms of skill sets and a guy that can kind of set the table for those guys, get them some easy buckets so they don't necessarily have to work as hard, although they're both gifted with the ball. And if either one of them shouldn't be cooking, CP3, can go out there and carry on his own. I think it's a really good look. Plus, I'm not even mentioning. I probably should his presence in the locker room as kind of a tutor and mentor, if

you will, to those guys trying to take that next step into another level of stardom is only going to be helpful. So I think it's a good move for the sons. Well done. James. Cudos. Well done. Said of like a Chicago sausage salesman.

Yeah, well done to you, sons. Well done. Well done. Well done. What done? So one thing while I was listening to that sound is that also this gives a great opportunity for Devin Booker to play off the ball, which is something that we've been trying to see for a minute. Just put him in that two spot, see what he can do when he doesn't have to be that little hybrid point guard role. I know they try to do that Ricky Rubio, but let's just be honest, Chris Paul is a better player than Randy Rubio. And to have a threat like that, to keep book off ball and be a guard and just focus on scoring, that'll be interesting to see. Yeah, for sure. I want to ask you really quickly about the thunder situation. I don't know if that matters at all. But if you're, so if you're SGA and you hear this news, are you like, cool, it's my team now and we've got the cavalry coming from the next six drafts. Or we could package these guys and trade for one of my friends if I, if I ever go to Presti and I'm like, I'd really like to be paired with Kentucky Player X, you know, from the Calipari fraternity. Or are you like, man, this team is just always going to be doing two steps forward, one step back. No, I think it's the first one that we could trade for anybody that I want

because Presti's done such a good job of being aggressive but also being measured, right? Like when Kevin left, right, he got a Victor Oladipo. And Victor Oladipo, he flipped that for Paul George, right? But when Paul George, when it was time to let go of Paul George, traded him, got a ton of picks. And Chris Paul. And Chris Paul. Then came back, Trader Russ. Yeah, got Chris Paul and got a host of picks from that, right?

he is told the line between being aggressive and being measured. And I think that if I'm SGA, I'm chilling right now because I know that he's going to make a move for the betterment of the team. He's not just going to sit on those picks. This is the weird tree where I feel like everybody's happy. I think that the thunder got a lot for a guy who just by the math is on the downslope. He's 36. And I think they're going to be competitive. I mean, Kelly Ubre is a really good player.

You know what I mean? And I trust what Presti's doing. They might not make the playoffs this year, but I think they're going to play hard. I think they're going to be entertaining. So, you know, we'll see what happens. But it was really good to have you on, Chris. Man, come on to show some other time, man.

All the time. Not just, this time of big, you know what I mean? Big fan. I'm more than the real ones. I'm happy to come on and just chat. You know, I'm more than just news reactions. Come shoot the shit with this, man. All right.

We're going to have to go to a break real quick, and we are going to go to the full episode of the real ones. Thank you so much for coming on, G. You got it, man. What is popping? Welcome to another edition. of the real ones. This is Logan Murdoch.

I'm here with Roger Bell. We having a little conversation about weather. He is in Florida. I'm up in the Bay. It just got a little cold up here in the Bay, Roger. Like a little cold. Cold is...

Cold is waking up to like 57 degrees. Okay. Chilly. A little chilly, right? Right? It's the beginning of like hoodie weather, which I love, you know what I mean? But it makes for really cold houses.

You know what I mean? 57 degrees. in Florida. You just said hoodie weather. That's full ski suit weather, dog. Like, we are in full beanies. Cannage jackets. Yeah, straight up.

Like, snorkel jackets, the whole nine. I don't, I don't know, man. Like, we just talked about this all fun. I don't like Florida, bro. I don't like Florida. I don't like Florida weather. I just, we, like, we just saw there's the weather. And then in the real ones group chat,

I put it in the chat that there was this big motherfucking alligator that was walking casually through the neighborhood. The weather sucks and then you have alligators. The weather sucks. Did you really just say, well, the gators are like the wildlife down here is, it's really dangerous. Like you don't get caught slipping again near a freshwater body of water or taking a stroll through the damn Everglades. But like, if you know, you know, so just stay to fuck away from it. But in terms of the weather, I would challenge the bay having any smoke for Florida.

If you told me, like, if you told me Southern Cal or something like that, we can talk, Phoenix area all through the winter. I can have that conversation. But, dog, like, our coldest is, you know, we might get 58 on like two days a year. That's it. And it's sunny. I mean, a lot of rain, though, but. I, exactly. That's the other thing.

The rain, and I hate humidity, bro. If you're telling me to go to a beach city or somewhere on the beach, I can go to, I would go to L.A. A million times out of a million over Miami. But the water is cold. Like the L.A. water is cold and brown. Like, we have clear water and it's warm. Yeah. What you, I mean, if you cry, what the baby going to do?

Like, yeah, there's some humidity. I mean, shit. I'm cool, bro. I think that the California has way better weather than Florida. I like Cali weather. I'm not going to front. You know what I'm saying? Southern Cal.

I can't get down with the dreary. Like, if I want that, I'm going to go to Seattle or Portland. The bay, I lived in the Bay. Like, I was up in Piedmont. I was running the streets of Piedmont when I was a young bar. There's something. there's something a bit you wouldn't you wouldn't understand because you're an outsider bro and actually actually sasha do you have your mic real quick sasha come on real quick this is our producer sasha

she spent some she spent some time she went to cow berkeley she spent some time in the bay i brought some ammo here you are an outsider you wouldn't understand what it's like to have to wake up and it's cloudy and there's a little romanticism to that bro there's a little like vibe that you that you like when you're just going on a stroll it's a you're you're you're just going on a stroll it's a you're You got your pedagonia on and you're going to get some coffee in the morning, bro. You wouldn't understand that being in Florida. You wouldn't get that, bro. It snuggling up with the hoodie weather.

Sasha, back me up on this, please. Yes, I'm with you. I like the clouds. I like the rain. And I hate the humidity. I grew up in St. Louis, so I know what that's like. It's not like I'm just a complete, you know, do-do. But I have to say Florida beaches really are so.

much better than SoCal beaches. It's not even a question. Logan, how do you feel? You just brought in your closer. Sasha, and she won the game for me. Look, I said, I'm talking about beaches. When I'm talking about being in Florida full time, that's not for me. It's all got to factor in though, Sasha.

It's all got to factor in. Like that gray, that gray, I mean, it's an equation. It's a delicate balance, right? Because that gray you speak of, I too, don't mind waking up somewhere, you know, like, in the Bay Area or Portland or Seattle. Like there's some charm to waking up gray out. Like go get my cup of coffee, warms my bones.

Like I fuck with that for like a week. For like a week. Come on, bro. No, no. I'm saying, come on, bro. Now you can't take my. Come on, bro. Florida.

Florida and the South in general. I might get some pushback as you know. Everybody's particular about what the South is. But the South and Florida in general, bro. I hate humidity and I hate being outside. outside of like one in the morning and I'm sweating for no reason, bro. I like cold evenings. It's always cold in the evening in the bay and I really love that.

Like if you don't really want to be like if you're in the, this is particular, but if you're in like the club, this is not happening right now. But if you are in the club or you're somewhere, you're in a bar and it's super sweaty and then you go outside in the bay, you're like. The brisk. Like it's fantastic. And that's July, bro. And that's July.

Listen, man. I'm just going to, I can respect all of that. I am a well-traveled NBA vet. So I love a lot of cities for their weather. I'm saying I had a choice to retire in a lot of cities, and I chose Florida because like I'm going to be outside. I like outside activities. And yes, it's a little hot.

And the state taxes don't hurt either, bam. Damn, are you just going to do me like that? Okay. All right, I'm glad. That did not hurt. That did not hurt. You feel me? All right, all right, all right, for show.

But I'm still saying California and, you know, the background, you feel me, Bay Area is the way to go over Florida. I'm sorry, it just is what it is. And I'm just going to go and say it, East Bay. East Bay. All right, Sasha, okay. I feel you. I ain't arguing.

Who are now? All right. East Bay is a lot, Abraja, East Bay is better, right? Because it's a little warmer and you don't have the fog. Definitely, absolutely, 100%. Yeah. I'm still reping Pete Mott. Please don't do that.

You don't have to do that, I promise. There'll be, don't, please. All right, let's get to the show, man. Let's get to the chat. Chat, what time is? All right, well, what's happening? Is, like, there's a lot of stuff that's supposed to be happening. Is it actually happening?

I was just about to ask you, man, because you know, you're our intrepid Nets guy. The James Hardin, will he or won't he leave the Houston Rockets? That's the big question. Now, there's been some conflicting reports out there. The Athletic and Shams and my guy, Kelly Eco, they reported that James Hardin is reportedly, is not reportedly, that he's locked into this season, that he's locked in with the Rockets, right? Right. Then there was some reporting when ESPN and Wode saying,

that, you know, they're not looking to trade James Hardin, but if he were to want to trade, the Brooklyn Nets are a prime destination because of Kevin Durant, who obviously they're still, they go way back, and Kyrie Irving, and just the load of assets that Brooklyn has that can trade for James. Now on the Houston Chronicle, they're saying that James wants out, that James Hardin wants out.

Mm-hmm. First off, Roger, what do you think about these rumors and what do you think about James Harden if this is all the case, him going to Brooklyn? The rumors, I wouldn't doubt did James Hardin want out. Like, what's transpired with the rockets over the last, I mean, I don't know, 18 months has just kind of spoken to like a lack of direction and just kind of swinging for whatever was out there. I mean, to some degree, I understand what was taking place there. Like, they were trying to really maximize that window that they figured they had. And so you go out and you take a swing at Russ. And then, you know, Mike and company go to small ball after they lose Capella.

But all of it is, like, in disarray. Can you dig what I'm saying? So if I'm James Hardin sitting back and then there were rumors that they really wanted Tailu and you went with Stephen Silas, although I think Steven Silas is a great coach, if I'm James Hardin and I'm watching that, I'm like, this, hmm, not looking great, not directionally. Where are we going? Like, what is this looking like?

And to me, it would look like we're, you know, we deem the window to be semi-closed at least, and we're going to start, you know, infrastructurally building for the future. But that doesn't serve me if I'm James Hardin. So I'm not surprised that you would hear that James Hardin is, is interested in leaving. And I'm not surprised that Brooklyn would be mentioned from James Hardin's camp

as a place that he would want to go. Like two stars, you know, hunger there to come back off of injury for Kyrie and Kevin Durant. They kind of align with James Hardin won for a championship. I don't know that that works though. Me either. Yeah. I mean, look, all fantastic players, Logan.

Like, I'm not going to argue with that, but damn, they all need the ball. Bro, I don't see this working. I don't know if it'll happen or not. I don't see this working unless you trade Kyrie to use it. I don't see those three ball dominant players. like that, right? And obviously we know that Kevin has played with Superstars before and Golden State, obviously.

But the difference there is, there was just one other ball dominant player there. And that was Steph Curry, right? That needed the ball. You could, you could, Draymond doesn't need the ball. Clay doesn't need the ball. He can get off catches shoot, right?

I don't see that with the, with the nets. You talk about a guy with like James Hardin, who just takes the ball at the top of the key, brings the ball down, and takes all that time off the shot clock. And then you see Kyrie Irving, who needs the ball in his hands to be successful. And then you have Kevin Durant,

who's historically better than both of these guys, just standing around, right? Yep. I don't see that working. But with Houston, I agree with you with how James Harden might feel, right? This league is all about familiarity. And nobody from, nobody of power from the time he got traded there is in the building anymore.

Darryl Moore is not in the building anymore. Mike Dantonie's not in the building anymore. Russell Westbrook, who we're going to get to it a second, wants to dip. Right. You are, that is your team. But come on, man. Everything is all about familiarity. Nobody, he's like the Will Smith do.

He's like the Will Smith meme where, you ain't on Twitter. You don't know anything about this. But the final scene of Fresh Prince of Bel Air when he's in the house just all alone. looking around. That's James Hardin right now. So I don't see this. I mean, I see why James Hardin would want out, but I don't see it being in Brooklyn, bro. I don't see it working in Brooklyn. You hit the nail on the head. I'm not so sure that Brooklyn

wouldn't try to pull the trigger, but I would be, if I were counseling anyone there, I would be really, I'd be very cautious about that. That would be my advice to that. When those three were healthy the last time, that was what? 18, 19, regular season, was that? right? Is that correct? Yeah. Yeah.

Top 15, all three of them in usage rate. That doesn't, to your point, like big threes take place and they work. One of that three has to submit and sacrifice his personal game for the rest of the team. It's always happened. I'm talking Kevin Love. And Kevin Love wasn't the guy that you know in Minnesota. that wasn't winning championships. But those numbers, he was a number one in the NBA,

getting a lot of numbers. Chris Bosch, the same in Toronto. You know, those things have to take, you have to take that backseat. It was organic in Golden State because Clay and Draymond can be off the ball as much as they are. But you put three dudes in there

to need the rock like that. It's not going to, and from my man, Steve's perspective, as a first-time head coach, that's a lot of shit to deal with. Here's the thing. You talked about one player, to take a back seat throughout all these times,

it's going to have to be Kyrie. It is. That's not happening. And that's not happening, but in a perfect world, it's going to have to be Kyrie because he's not better than James Harden. He's not better than Kevin Durant. But that's not going to happen.

That's not happening. Listen, what happens with Kyrie, it's really interesting is like, Kyrie, to some degree, like, you and I would sit back and the average NBA fan would sit back and be like, yeah, James Hardin, better than Kyrie.

Kevin Durant better than Kyrie. And like, yeah, there's a good argument to be made for that. But Kyrie is so talented, dog, that when NBA guys get in the gym with him and see what he does every day, I'm not saying that they don't believe that they're not better than him, but it ain't that clear because he's really, really special. But that's also why you, yeah, that's also why you see him in the finals making all those shots and just doing crazy stuff. That's not the thing.

His highs are really high, but his lows don't balance out. No, I'm with you, but what I'm saying is that there in lies some uncertainty as to like who takes the back seat, right? Because if you're in there with them every day and you're like, damn, dog, look at what this. Look what he does with the ball. Those lines have to be clearly like, and then the roles have to be clearly established. You know what I mean? We talk about that all the time, Logan. And when they're not and you have three alphas out there who all need the ball, it's a recipe for disaster.

If it's not very, very clear that Logan is taking the back seat to Rajah and Sasha or, or Raja's taking the backseat to Logan and Sasha. I am taking a back seat to Roger and Sasha. Like, that's just what it is. You know what I'm saying, though, right? Like, that's, it's really tough. So I agree with you. And, you know, ain't nobody asked me.

So, you know, I did. But if I were advising in Brooklyn, I'd be like, yo, dog. I feel like you have all these assets. Do you, if you're in the Brooklyn Nets, do you just want to see how this goes, like, at least for a little bit? You haven't seen the roster. You haven't seen Kyrie and Kevin even play yet together.

Do you want to see that first before you make a drastic trade? Or would you just say get it over with us? If we have a chance to get James, we just go get James. Well, again, I'm on record. I don't think James is the best fit there, not because there's anything wrong with James, but I just think the fit isn't great with those two guys. So if you gave me a more complimentary piece, in my opinion,

with Kyrie and Kevin Durant, I would make the move. Like, you know, it's like I'd make it. I just, you know, again, I'm not so short at James is that piece, but I would not be worried about sitting back watching and seeing what I got. I know that they feel like there's, you know, there are moves that could be made that really helped them, I think. And from the conversations I had, it kind of revolved around, you know,

leadership, toughness and stuff like that. So there are pieces out there that I think they would want to get if they could. Yeah, there's also, we're going to get to, I want to get to Russell Westbrook in a second, but I think this James Harden thing and this Russell thing who just, Russell Westbrook, who just requested a trade, what do you think about these players having this much, or forcing their way out, right, or forcing these types of big moves? We saw this with Paul George. We saw this with, even in Free Agency, with LeBron and Kauai,

and all these players. Do you like the players, I mean, you are a player. Do you like the players having this much power to force their way out? At first, I didn't. Even as a player, you didn't. Well, I was, you know,

you were kind of brainwashed as a player, like for lack, a better way to put it. Like, we were brought up where, you know, under an old system, there wasn't a lot of player movement when I grew up watching the NBA. And so I was used to seeing my stars be, you know, almost lifers with their team,

or at least until the tread was off the tire, and then they'd wind up finishing somewhere else. That's just what I was used to watching. So it was uncomfortable for me at the start. But that went away pretty quickly. And so I'm all four players leveraging the position that they have. Even if it's not to leave a team and just hold a team accountable, make sure that they're building the roster around you the way that you want to build,

like LeBron did in Cleveland for the last couple years on the one-year deal. I like the idea of players understanding what kind of people. power they have and leveraging that. I have no problem. The NBA's been healthy. I don't, I don't care what the owner's going there and say, and collect the bargaining in the smaller markets. And the NBA's been great, man. It's, it's been fantastic to watch the last few years. So I'm in. When did you, when did you get to the point where you were like, this is fine versus players shouldn't be able to do this? When did you get, when did you switch? It was in that first probably year. Like, I mean, look, when it first started,

happening again. And I'm admitting there was a little brainwashed a little bit, like to, to not really be on the player side, even if I was a player. Like, do you know what I mean? Like it was, it was an interesting feeling for me. But really quickly, like I was like, bro, what the, like what the fuck? Like, these dudes drop us. They, you know, they cut us. They ship us off after we've just had babies. Like, any number of things, they don't care. We're commodities to them. Like, I've had these conversations behind closed doors. You all are assets. We are.

We are. And that's fine. We make a lot of money or I made a lot of money to do that. And guys are making even more astronomical figures now. I'm okay with that. But then on the flip side of that, if I have some power and some leverage in a situation, I'd be damned if I'm not using it.

And I won't hold that against anybody. Yeah. I get that. People do have the argument. Well, and I guess this comes from the owners. Well, why, you know, if you guys don't give us a commitment, we can't build around you. But I think that's just like,

just do your job, man. Like, this is just, it is what it is. You know what I mean? Yes, there's the, look, it's life in the city as my uncle likes to say. Like, that's the business that you're in. The same way you would look at me and tell me after trading me away, hey man, it's just business.

No shit. It's just business. Yeah, exactly. Well, speaking to just business, Russell Westbrook also wants out of Houston. He has a ridiculous contract. Shout out to player empowerment. And shout out to get to the bag.

He has $40 million, $41 million this year. $44 million, $221, $47,000, $22, $23. Shout out to Russ for getting to the bag. No doubt. But he's going to be 31 next season. By the end of this deal, he's going to be 33, 33, 34 years old, right? this isn't a young guy who this isn't a young guy and he relies heavily on athleticism can't shoot particularly well yeah can't really you know he could score he could fill up

the stat sheet but we all all know the conundrum of russell westbrook do you take him on with that way because i'm gonna just say i wouldn't who am i those who are you who are you are you anyone you're anyone okay no okay we have names let's go names all right i'm gonna throw some names at you If you could do this as a team, the Orlando Magic. Interesting. And this is coming. I got some of these names also from, I just want to shout them out.

Dan Devine wrote a really good piece on Russell Westbrook. You guys should check it out. And these are some of the names that he put into his column. So go check that out. But the first name is the Orlando Magic. I might if I were the Orlando Magic. I might. I mean, you have to forgive me.

I know we're an NBA pod. I don't know their entire roster. like and and I haven't evaluated how they fit. But it's fine. It's also a free agency and it's also and I think it's to the preference of like this isn't a relatively small market team. This isn't like the, you know what I mean? So who doesn't just get star power?

They don't get star power. And they're like, you know, they're young but lacking like that guy. Do you know what I mean? Like they don't have the guy. Not that, you know, Russ hasn't proven that he can be the guy on a championship team. But I think he's better than the guys. they have. So yeah, if I were Orlando, I probably would in a vacuum.

Like, I don't know what I got to give up. Okay. What else? The New York Knicks. Oh, no doubt. No doubt. No doubt. No doubt. So it's funny because I feel like the New York Knicks, obviously they're a big market team in the biggest market in the league, right? But they're in that same boat as the magic, right? Where they just need to get a star power. They just need to get

somebody, right? But you fall into the tribe that the Knicks fall into so many times in the past where when you get these guys, and you don't foster an environment where they could succeed or you get the guy at the end of the road or the guy that

has played well but like Zach Randolph's it just doesn't work there right or someone that's it's just not a fit but you got him because he was a name or you get the name and it doesn't work out like a Carmelo Anthony

well Melo yeah Melo they went to the playoffs one year there with Melo right but yeah not what they would have expected See, I think I think Russ still has something in the tank. I don't think he's going to be the guy from three seasons ago. But I think this year, like he was playing fantastic. Pre-bubble, Russ was playing arguably as well as, you know, most people in the NBA. The numbers were pretty ridiculous.

And for a team like the Knicks who aren't in a championship hunt right now, I think you could get two more years out of Russ. The problem with the Knicks and Russ, as I see it, is Tibbs is coaching the Knicks, right? Is that right? Yeah. Yeah, I don't see that being a good fit. So, you know, after a little bit more thought, maybe not. But if Tibbs wasn't there and the Knicks were who they were or who they are,

I would say yes to Russ. Okay. The Pistons. You're just going to hit me with all of these teams. All of those, like, yeah. Yes, another team where, like, all of these teams fall in the same category for me. Like, they don't have a guy. So if I was a team, and they're not.

close to like vying for a championship. Russ for me as a player where if I have a guy and an established hierarchy and my guy's good enough and I'm close, I don't know that I want to upset that Apple cart. You know, but like all of these teams that are, except for New York, you're naming teams that are a little bit of ways off. They don't have a true number one. Two smaller markets out of the three that you mentioned. All of those are destinations I think would be good for Russ. Not contractually or anything. like that because again, I'm not digging into all of that. Well, when you're getting to the magic or getting teams like the magic or

even maybe to Sacramento Kings, somebody like that, or these smaller market teams that just want to star, man. Like, they just want to be, they want to be relevant. They want to be in the conversation of things, right? They want to at least be on a national TV games, right? The way you do that is get it. Sometimes you just got to take a chance to just overpay a guy. Yep.

Right. But they're doing that for relevance. They're not necessarily doing that for it. championship. Are the Charlotte Hornets going to win a championship? No. No. Are the magic going to win a championship? No. That's why you get a player like Russ. It's kind of like for credibility in a weird way. Absolutely. Mike DeAntoine used to say, you know, only one team's going to win a championship, right? Like, we wanted to be that team. But anything short of that, at least be exciting. You know what I mean? And that's the way we played. It's the style he liked. And, you know, at the time, I really, I guess,

hear what he was saying. But that's what entertainment is, right? Like, hey, listen, bro, we're trying to win championship, but we have to be excited enough for people to tune in. And if we are, you know, that gives us more swings at potential players and whatnot. We might be able to get to the Holy Grail. But be exciting if you, you know, if anything, be excited. Yeah. And I don't know, man.

The other thing that is frustrating, like Russ is who he is right now, right? Like, I don't know if I, do you see Russ is the guy that that caters his game? down the line for a team that, you know what I mean, for a championship that just says, I'm going to take a back seat for a chip, right? Russ plays one way. Look, I'm a Russ fan. Me too, me too. I love his style.

I love how hard he goes. I like the chip on his shoulder that he's always played with super respect what he does. This year was a, this year kind of showed me the answer to the question you just posed. Like, I thought he would go in there. I thought he would really commit to being a best. better shooter. You know what I mean? And, you know, because those things can carry you into the twilight a little bit more gracefully in today's NBA. And I, you know, I'm not saying that he didn't try to become one, but, you know, it didn't look like it translated. And so then it begs a question,

can it, can it change? And then I don't think it does. I think he exists in the NBA because of the way he plays. If you ask him to play a different way, I don't think it works. I don't think he is the guy that we're saying would be a star in Detroit and get them nationally televised games. in the long run, like short term, yes, but you're asking him to take a backseat to people and play a different way. I don't think he is Russell Westman. Yeah. And another thing, though, like, and also I don't know if I can, I trust Russ to get you to the playoffs, but if it's his team, I don't trust, even when he has a guy alongside him and he has to be the lead dog, I don't trust him in the postseason. I mean, you talk about after Kevin Durant left, right, loss in the first round,

the second year after Kevin Durant left lost in the first round the third year after Kevin Durant left lost in the third in the first round. Did I say third round? No, he lost in the first round in the first round every year after Kevin Durant left

except for this past bubble season. He was a seven games, he was a seven game series away and in the final minute away from potentially going out in the first round again to his former team after somebody got traded straight up for him, right? Yep. He almost got traded.

I mean, he almost got beat by Chris Paul who got traded for him. Yeah, look, that all speaks for itself. I think it's the style, Logan. The NBA, you know, I hate to oversimplify it. But if you play hard, I mean, you have, there has to be a benchmark for how talented your team is, right? But let's say you've met the threshold for minimum talent that you need to win games in the NBA. Some teams don't.

But let's say you do. just by playing hard through the course of 82 games, you can win a lot of games during the regular season in the NBA. Like real talk. Like you just by playing harder than the next team. And Russ is going to set that tone for his team every night. That's who he is. So you're going to make the playoffs.

Like you're going to get in the playoffs with a guy like Russ who keeps everybody fired up, keeps teams playing hard, like never is taking a night off leads by example. But stylistically, when you get into the playoffs, there have to be nuances to that game. And Russ doesn't necessarily have the nuance to his game. He plays one way. Now, he plays one way better than I could have ever imagined playing one way.

But you can counter that when you're a team in the playoffs, really sit down, dissect what he's doing and game plan for that, which makes it exponentially harder for him to do it. How do you guard Westbrook in the playoffs? How would you guard him? How would I guard him? I would back up. Would you just give him the Rondo treatment?

Like, yo, here you go. Yes, I back up. I'd have my bigs catch him at the rim. You know, not even really try to block the shot. Just come over and wall up, be real big, straight verticality. You know, and try to get him caught up in the disrespect of backing up. Because he's going to shoot it. If you back up, he's going to shoot that thing. Right. And that's what I want. Like, I want the volume of shots from Russ. And even if, even if, you know, he attacks me, because sometimes if a guy backs up off of you, you know, it's an easier down. Hill because you got to run and start at him. And Rush used to attack that a little bit more when he was more athletic. Like he didn't settle for the jump shot.

He was still coming at you. But he had more bounce. So he was finishing. Now he doesn't finish it the same way. So I just want to get you caught up and trying to score. Even if, you know, I'm disrespecting your jump shooting ability and backing up, get you caught up and trying to score the ball. I feel pretty good about that.

We're recording this 9 a.m. Pacific time. Free agency is about to start, Grasho. Yep. But before we get to that, let's take a quick break. And we're back. So Raja, free agency. It's coming. Yeah.

It'll probably be commenced by the time this podcast comes out. How did you approach free agency? Were you nervous right before that? Because usually it was at like midnight. It was really, it was like late night. You're staying up. You're talking to your agent. Your agent's probably talking to a GM.

You're on pins and needles about what's going to happen. Yeah. How did you approach that? Because everybody says the like, man, I'm going to let my agent figure that out. I'm going to do it. Like, but come on. Come on.

You're paying attention. You care. I don't want to hear the BS. Right. How was it the night before a free agency? It was like Christmas Eve, man. It was like Christmas Eve where you're waiting around trying to find out like what's in that big box. Like, what do I, what do I got?

What's going to be in there? And so I would be really, really excited the night of free agency. when I was a player that was going to be in the first wave. See, most agents know, or at least mine, would tell me your first wave guy. So first wave guy means I'm getting a call at 1201 from teams or he's getting calls, and then they're calling me setting up meetings and trying to come down and see us and whatnot. If I'm not a first wave guy, then, you know, shit, I'm go to sleep and read about it in the morning. And then there's some anxiety as guys start to go off the board to different places and money starts to get spent.

and you're trying to figure out how that works out for you. So some of it depends on where you are in your career. But generally, if you thought you were first wave guy, I mean, that she was like Christmas Eve. What was your first, tell me your first wave experience. First wave experience. I got calls.

They started at 1201. I was in a shower. What year is this? What a year are you at first wave guy? This was 05. Okay. Yeah, it was 05, I think, is that right? Or 04.

the year I went to Phoenix is the year I signed a deal. So my phone started blowing up. Like it was it was 12. I had like three meetings set up for people to come into Miami in the next couple days and like Kevin McHale and I think he was in Minnesota at the time and a few other places. And then, you know, my agent called me and Phoenix had had made an offer. And I hadn't heard from Utah. I really wanted to go back to Utah. And so I, Phoenix called and they put like a take it or leave a deal kind of on the table where it was like, you know, it could be gone in the morning. But the money for me was great. Like at the time.

How does it take it or leave a deal? They're like, hey, check this out. Or are they saying this to your agent and your age is throwing this to you? My agent said it to me. He's like, I just got off the phone with Phoenix. You know, he called me. I was like, look, I've spoken to X, Y, and Z. I got meetings lined up.

He was like, okay, well, this is going to be interesting because I got a call from Phoenix. Now, let me rewind. before we went in to free agency, like I already had an idea of like I had written down with my wife like five of our destinations from one to five

like where we wanted to be. Tell me the destination. It was Utah. It was Phoenix. At the time, damn, I don't even remember. Those were my top two. That was kind of my wish list

and then I had, I don't know if it was Chicago after that. There were a couple other places that I would play, but those were the two that I wanted to play in. I had been in Utah and Steve and then

were playing. playing a style of ball in Phoenix where I was like, that shit could be really cool, you know? So those were my two places. My agent hits me as like, look, I got some interesting, like, an interesting deal from Utah. Here's what it is. X, Y, and Z.

You know, they say it's a kind of a take-it-or-leave-a-deal. They want to get it done within 24 hours. So I'm like, oh, shit, like, feed her to the fire. The money was better than I had anticipated because I had never been anything other than a minimum guy. So I was like, man, that's a lot of money for me. can we get more in free agency? He was like, well, you know, we might be able to,

he got a few more and we might lose a few in the process. He was like, this one's a hard one because it's a number where, you know, you're going to have to make a decision. I said, okay, we'll call Utah and see what Utah wants to do because I'm coming from Utah. I really want to go back there. So he called Kevin O'Connor with the jazz. Kevin, KOC.

KOC. Shout out. He called Kevin O'Connor with the jazz. And Kevin O'Connor said, we'll talk tomorrow. like they didn't want to they didn't have any interest in negotiating with me that night and so I felt kind of like all right well fuck it like if you guys aren't going to negotiate this is a takeer to leave it I don't know if it'll be there tomorrow like I'm going to take it so we took the deal and me and my wife got dressed and we hit the bar oh wait so you were wait so you took the deal from phoenix and

was like well let's do it I took the deal from phoenix um I don't know if I call Steve or not but I I took the deal from Phoenix. The money was more than I could ever have imagined I would make, like, in retrospect, it's funny to say that when guys are making that, like, in one year now who do what I did. But at the time, it was fantastic. So we got dressed and we went out. We celebrated, man. I was, I was, I was, Miami Beach.

Oh, okay. Oh, you was, you was, oh, okay. Yeah, so we were out. Yeah. Yeah. Hey, boo, the bag just landed. Let's go. We're good.

We're good. Drinks on me. But how, okay, so how often are there, because I was, I was sitting in on a Zoom with the Warriors G and Bob Myers, and he was talking, he alluded to the fact that a lot of, that free agency will go by fast, right? It'll go, it'll go faster than anticipated. And what I gather from that is that a lot of these deals might be set in stone already, right? Oh, yeah. How soon before a free agency are the deals kind of like, yo, wink, wink, you know?

How much, how sooner do you agree to a deal before it's actually done beforehand? Well, before you can actually sign it? Before you can actually sign it. Yeah, like before like the- There's a more torum, right, or whatever that's called where like you're going to agree to the deal. Like, I agreed to that deal the night of, I don't know, what it was in August 1st or whatever it was. And then I couldn't, July 1st. July 1st.

I couldn't sign that deal until whenever. So that's a weird time because. Before the memoratorium, though, do you, do you like have little fillers? Obviously, people talk before then, right? Yeah, like, well, so I knew there would be interest. Like, so let's say that last time I was a free agent, right? I had been living in Piedmont. And yuck.

Once I told the Warriors, I wasn't going to play that year because I was coming off that torn wrist. Like, they wanted me to play the last four or five games. I knew what teams were going to have interest. you know, from my agent. Like, they had already talked to my agent before I got cut. I would use my pregame routine to kind of audition. Like, I was out there working hard in pregame, showing whatever, you know, other club was in the building, like, that I was healthy.

You was really out here, like the equivalent to Instagram now. You was doing the workouts. He was full sweat. Like, ah, he was like. Oh, word. Like getting up and down, full court shot. Like, how many times you see a dude working full court in pregame? Like, I was that guy.

I was working full court. Just let everybody know I'm healthy. So I knew who had interest, but I didn't have a, like, we weren't talking numbers. You know what I'm saying? So what happened to me was teams like Miami who really were like, yo, you know, Pat Riley was like, yeah, we really have interest in him. Like we think, you know, I didn't know that LeBron and then were getting together that year, but they had expressed interest. By the time they called me the next morning when Eric Sposter called me, it was for the minimum. So you, so this, so let's let's let's revert.

Let's let's go back a second. Let's go back a second. Right. You said something, this is 2010, I'm assuming, right? It's 2010. Correct. Because you said, because you said LeBron James. Yeah.

You could have played with LeBron, but the bag wasn't right. So you could have played, this is some real ones history. You could have played with Kobe, but the bag wasn't right. And you went to Utah. That's the same year. Right. Wait, so you, okay, so bring me through this, right? So this one year with the same summer where you're about to talk, you talk to Kobe,

and you were having the same lunch with Kobe, and you took the bag in Utah. So that year. Kobe called me. So I got a call from my age and at 1201 saying he spoke to the Lakers, right? So I was like, all right, bet. Now, the Miami thing didn't sort itself out right away, right? Like, I wasn't a first tier guy that year.

So the next day, so this was, I don't know, July 1st during the day. I was in the street in Melville, New York with my sons, and Kobe's number popped up. So I took the call. And, you know, he told me, you know, what was popping in Miami. He was like, they're getting his team together. they think they're going to run away with it, you know, but we're not having it. We're going to try to do our own thing down here.

And he literally said to me, anybody who could close line me in a playoff game, I want that motherfucker on my team. So I was like, bad. Like I have, yeah, dog, like, I want to get down. Like, let's see what's going to happen. But they spent their money up too. So, like, the money that they had. Who did he spend their money on that year?

Stevie Blake, pieces like that. Steve's my man. So, you know, I didn't have no beef. But it is what it is, right? So I had to say no to that. Logan, I had miles to feed, bro. So tell me. So, and then how serious was Miami, though?

Like what? So you see, you see the decision on television. Are you like, I can play here? Well, what, how did that go? I was like, yes, I could play here. So when Eric Spolstra hit me the next? When does Eric hit you? All right.

I don't want to be wrong with this. Eric Spolstra, I'm watching it go down. Like, so they sign, I'm pretty, LeBron and thing happened. Then they re-inked Eudanis and they got Mike Miller, right? So money starts to be spent. And when Mike goes, I'm like, well, shit. Like, that's kind of what I do.

So, you know, where are we going? Because I know they have interest, but it looks like I'm at the back of the line in terms of interest, right? So Spoh hits me and he's like, yo, it's finally time for you to come play at home. And I'm like, okay, but correct me if I'm wrong. Like, you guys only have the minimum left. And he was like, yeah. And I was like, no, that's no. Can't do that, bud.

I'm sorry. It's about the bag, bro. Raja is about the bag. That's one thing we've learned about this on the real ones. He is spurred two organizations. He has spurred two championship opportunities because the bag was just better. You could have went home. You could have had that Miami weather you talked about, right?

No doubt. You could have had that L.A. weather that me and Sasha talked about, the California weather, right? She was like, nah, I'm going to get this bag, bro. I'm going to go to Utah, eat this falters every two weeks. And I'm going to figure it out. It was Cochina Tuscana at the time. He didn't have vultors yet, but it was still banging. So it came down to them and the Bulls.

And the Bulls were offering me more per year on a two-year deal. And the money was about the same. And Utah was spread out over three years. So we were going into a lockout, and I didn't know how much of that first year I was going to lose, percentage-wise, right? So I'm like, well, it's probably better if we spread it out over three. I take less of a hit on year one.

I can recoup it in two and three. So we went to Utah. Okay. So Utah did the three-year deal for you? Okay. And okay. So, all right. I get that. I see it. We forget. What's up? Listen, Daw, I could have, I mean, in retrospect, the Miami thing could have been a good look. But once you start playing for the minimum at that point in my career, I don't know that there's- That's all you're going to play for. Yeah, I don't know if I could play enough more years at the minimum to make up the roughly 10 that Utah gave me. You know what I'm saying? So that was tough. But my career probably,

wouldn't have ended the way it ended. It was, it was like when, when me and Ty Corbyn got into it, that was some shit. Yeah. We're going to talk about that at some point in this podcast. Just y'all stay tuned. That's why y'all listened to the real ones. But that is going to be, listen, if you want to hear what really went down, like some wild shit, I'm going to tell you exactly what happened in that locker room that night. Okay, I'm trying to get messy. Well, we actually I want to get to that. Actually, you just, the way you said that, let's get to that in a second. One second. But there is also another side of that, right, where If you do play for a Miami Heat team, that's historic.

You're always going to be linked to that team and you're always going to be able to bake bread because you're just in the, you were in that locker room, right? And you'll always, you will, that's the thing about the warriors too, right? Like, you'll all, because you were on that team, you will always be remembered and always be able to capitalize on that, right? Yep. That's another argument to that. But you just, we just got, we just, you just got some stuff.

What happened with you in Utah with Ty Gorb? So Utah is not unlike what we were talking about. with Russ, you know, a minute ago. And even James Harden, although, let me make it clear. I'm not comparing myself to the, like, that type of player in a startup. You're not Russell Westbrook?

No, but, you know, part of going to, and I talked about choosing the bag, and we were talking about the bag, mind you, none of those teams were bad teams. Like, they were all, like, obviously Miami with LeBron and then were going to be closer to a chip, like you had Kobe,

but Utah was a really good team with Darren Williams, and they were bringing in Al Jefferson. you had a young Paul Millsap, Andre Kirillenko, Memito, Cork. That's a good basketball team. Do you know what I mean? I've been making the playoffs and bringing an owl at the time. I thought we were going to be really good. Chicago was a really good team.

So I wasn't choosing to go to bum teams. Like I was going to go to a good team for the most money. So that season like was a shit show. They traded Darren. He got into it with Jerry. Like their thing happened. We were losing. Ty Corbin got the job.

and then, like, you know, I was Ty's guy at first, bro, like, real talk. He pulled me in. We were in Phoenix. He was like, hey, I'm going to need you as kind of like a voice in the locker room to kind of, you know, have my back. And so I was like, oh, I got you, bro. Like, I was excited. But I do got a head coaching job, like in Utah.

Like, this is cool, man. I got you. So, you know, we started like that. And then we just weren't very good. And Ty and I started getting a little sideways, like off some, you know, I stopped into the family room. on the way out to see my wife and kids were babies, man. They were little.

They were excited to be at the games. I'd go high five. It was a buddy giving him a kiss and shit. And Ty would call me in and be like, hey, man, heard you in the family room. Like, what you're doing in there? How do you think that looks to people? And I'm like, what the fuck?

It don't look like shit. Like, you know, what are you worried about? Well, it looks like you're talking about me. I'm like, bro, you worry about the wrong shit. Like, I'm in there to see my wife, you know, kiss the kids, bro. It gives me a little refresh at halftime. I'll come out and do my job. Don't worry about it.

Oh, so you would do this during the game. You would go to the family room during the game and say what's up. At half time, because it's right, it's right in the tunnel. Like my kid's standing in the tunnel, right? So, like, I take him back in, kiss my wife, and then I walk right back out the tunnel. So, you know, but I heard where he was coming from. I had never had that problem in the NBA.

Then the anthem thing, like I would kind of, you know, I always had the BGs like when I was young in my career. So I would kind of go back, use the restroom stretch and then come back out. It had never been an issue. And then Ty jumped on me about that. So I'm like, damn, is he just, he's fucking with me, right? like this isn't like I've always done this I did it with Jerry a month ago and it was never an issue so as that starts to happen like I start to get you know whatever then they you know they tell me

Gordon's going to start starting and they tell me before the game that was a little messy for me and you know the media started a game like right before the game dog so I'm like whatever it's your it's your choice to handle it like that it's your right to handle it like that but we are in Philadelphia um I am pissed right he pulls me out of the game I'm not playing well uh it's Philly, for context, is Philly one of those cities because you had a history area that you just want to ball in, that you just want to like, that the cities that you like to play in? Yes, you want to represent in Philly because that's where you started, right? So like I want to do well in Philly, but it didn't really have any bearing on what happened that night. We were just bad.

We were a selfish team. He didn't ever address it. Guys were going for theirs. And I didn't play like that. So, you know, I pull me out and I go down on the end of the bench and I said some shit like, give me the fuck out of here or something like that. Right. So, you know, he doesn't play me again in the first half or the second half and we lose the game. Mind you, that was like first quarter.

So we lost the game. And I'm sitting in my locker and he comes in and he's, you know, saying this, that and that. And he looks over me. He says, and then you, you know, you go over and, and all right, I was feeling bad about what I did. So what I was going to do was what I tend to do like when I do dumb shit is just be like, hey, man, I fucked that up. Like, I shouldn't have done that. Like, that's my bad. And keep it moving.

This is what he did prior to me getting a chance to do that. He was like, you know, you go over there, you come out of the game and say that shit. And we can't win a game because of that. And I was like, what? I said, wait, I said, bro. Now, we're the whole team's around. I'm like, dog, wait a minute. You're saying that what I did coming out of the game cost us the game.

Like, I lost us the game. And he fumbled. He was like, well, you know, what I'm saying is. Yeah, yeah, that's what I'm saying. You lost us the game. And I said, well, then you're a stupid motherfucker. And he said, what? Bro, he said, what?

I said, you're a stupid motherfucker if you're saying what happened between me coming out of the game in the first quarter is the reason we lost that game. And bro, like, the whole locker room looked around like, uh-oh, right? Like, everybody, dog, yeah, like, just like that. Everybody's on their phones and then they literally like,

dog, everybody. So silence. We all get dressed. He calls me in a locker room. He's like, hey, man, you're not going to come on the rest of this trip into the coach's locker room. I'm like, whatever, bro. he was like, you know, we're getting a cab.

You have many more games you guys got? One game, two games on the road trail. Like, it's short. He's like, we're going to get cab to come get you, take you back to the hotel. You'll have a flight tomorrow. I'm like, all right, bet. So, you know, I'm waiting in there for the cab don't come.

So now I got to get back on the bus because they can't leave me. So I get on the bus. Like, you know, I walk past him on the bus. He's looking crazy. And everybody in the back is like, bro, you know, oh shit. No, you really did that. That's exciting.

shit that happened all season, bro. So, um, they get me to the hotel. They go to the airport or they go to the airport. I'm on the bus. Then the bus drops me at the hotel. And then I get back to Utah and I meet with him and Kevin O'Connor like two days later when they get back. And, uh, I go in and Kevin's like, well, you know, um, I'm assuming you're going to ask

me for a trade. And I was like, nah. I was like, I'm not, I'm not asking for a trade. I was like, look, that shit happened. like I probably shouldn't have said that but I've never had a loss blamed on me in an NBA game whether it was my fault or not and it surely wasn't my fault the other night

so like they triggered me bro like you blame a loss on me that I ain't got nothing to do with and I lost my cool but I'm not asking for a trade like I'm a grown man like I like living in Utah I signed up to play here like I could get past that like if he could get past that

and I said Ty if you can't get past that let me know now and I will and I'll say let me go he looked me in the face he was like no we're good I said, all right, the motherfuckers buried me. Buried me underneath the bench. Underneath the bench, bro. Did you have to suit up or just straight DMPs? Oh, they suited me up and DMPed me.

Suited me up in DMP. Nice. Which was fine. Like, hey, man, like, now I know that I can just fucking play golf because, like, I'm never going to play. So it got so awkward, dog, that, like, we were in San Antonio for the playoffs. And he would, we made one three. Look that shit up.

We made one three in a playoff series as a team. One fucking three. He would not put me in the game, ever. Ever. So, like, I was like, this shit's just comical. So I would be coming back from the golf course with my clubs on my back. Like, and he would be going down for the first bus to go to a playoff game. Like, and he'd hop out of the elevator.

I'd be standing there with my golf clubs on my back looking at him like, hey, bud. I go up and change. I was a fuck-dose situation, though. I've never ever said what happened in that locker room that night. But, yeah, I call him a stupid motherfucker. Oh. You wanted it.

You asked for it. Hey, bro. Hey, that was, I was awesome. That was one of those things where we had something under rundown, bro, and it just, whoop. Now, now, it cost me, like, it cost me, like, the next year,

I stayed home that year. Like, they were like, you could come, we want you to come back, but you can't address what happened last year. You can't talk about this. This is Dennis Lindsay now. I'm like, then nah, I'm staying at home. Like, I'm,

not what the fuck i'm not coming back there with rules like like y'all just gonna be telling people what happened i can't say shit about it so they left me at home they took me all the way to like they took me on their roster all the way to like the day where i couldn't make someone else's roster for the playoffs oh i was playing tennis in a doubles tournament with my dad down in miami shores and it was the day and my agent called me he was like hey they got you i was like what he was like they they cut you i was like okay bad let's he was like but it's one day past the headline, though. You can't sign with a playoff team. Damn.

So they got me. They got you, but you still was getting, you was collected checks living in Miami Beach for a whole season, though. So who really won out to do? I was on a PGA tour. I was on a PGA tour. I was getting paid to play golf. That reminds me,

that reminds me, I mean, like, of like, Andre Godala who played last year and before he got to the heat, he was with Memphis collecting, you know, like 17 meal. Yeah. But he would

stay it out here. You could see Andre around just chilling. Working out. But he was just around. He was in San Francisco

sometimes. Was it around in the East Bay? Not a bad life, bro. As long as you stay in shape, you know what I'm saying? Okay.

And pay, bro. What you want to do today? No, I don't know, just, just chilling, bro. What you want to do today?

But good work if you could get it. Good work if you could get it. And, like, you know, the end of my career was not, it didn't play out the way I wanted it to after that.

So like I, you know- Do you have any regrets on that though? Do you have any regrets on how that story played out and also how the end of your career went because of that? I mean, deep down probably, but I mean, at the end of the day, man, like, I was a grown-ass man, bro. We had had enough. Like, I didn't even touch on all the little exchanges and bullshit we had had and

he had said and it, you know, so like, I felt really good about that. There wasn't a whole lot of tread left on my tire. Anyway, I would have probably got like a, you know, a vet minimum somewhere to play or something like that. But like, there wasn't a lot of tread left. So I could sleep at night because he deserved to hear that shit. All right.

Now, before we get to real ones, this is the thing. I just want to, like, I just want to wrap up some things real quick. We'd be remiss if we didn't talk about the Lakers trading of a former real one guest, Danny Green, to the Oklahoma City Thunder for Dennis Schrooter. How do you feel? I mean, I feel like that's a good deal. Yeah, Danny, I'm sorry, bro. Lakers, good deal. Good deal. Good deal. I mean, you know, that means, and that means Rondo's probably going to leave. Do you, is that cool? Do you think that that's... Yeah, I think I would let Rondo go. If I had Dennis Schroeder, I'd let Rondo go. I like Rondo, though, but Dennis Schroeder's very tough, bro. Also, also, I believe the, the Lakers will have their full mid-level exception. And a guy by the name of Wes Matthews is on the...

the market. Oh, another good fit. Tough. A defensive-minded shooter. The Lakers could, they could do something. What do you think about their repeat chances with the woos that they're making? Oh, I like them. Hey, listen, that was always, you, if you remember, like, my question always revolved around

what tinkering around the edges can you do to stay fresh enough? Because as they were constituted, like, a few months ago, I didn't know if that team was going to win a championship. You start getting younger with Dennis Schroeder and. And, you know, I can't necessarily say Wesleyan Matthews is younger, but I think you keep extending that window, bro. Yeah. Also, what was another thing we always said about this with the Lakers?

They need to give LeBron and AD help. No doubt. The pressure can't always be on AD and LeBron. They're two top five players, obviously. But when you get into the season and things like that, you need other guys to kind of help get some wins. Playmakers. You need playmakers.

Playmakers. Playmakers that can get some wins. And also when you get to the postseason, other guys that can step up. And if you can get a West Matthews to pair with a Dennis Schroeder and Coos is on your team and you have other guys that can do things,

it could be good, man. Deeper team. I think the Lakers are the favorite to win the title next year or this year. Yeah, until James Hardin goes to Brooklyn and then all shit's going to break loose. But look, we've already discussed that. I don't think that makes them,

I think they got about a chance running it with them too. Also, don't sleep on the Warriors. Don't sleep on the Warriors. I'm not. Listen, bro, I said something about the Warriors a couple weeks ago. Like, you were like, nah.

Like, I don't think there are, I never sleep on the Warriors. With all the, okay, with all the moves right now, the Warriors are going to be right in the thick of things. They're going to be, I thought they were going to be like a five, six seed in the beginning of this summer. But I think they're going to be right there, especially with all the time that Steph is not playing. all the time that Clay has not played.

They're so fresh right now. And they get somebody in for a agency just watch out because they can come out, they can come out swinging. Let's get to ruin of the week. Rowan of the week, someone who exemplifies everything that it means to be a real one, someone, something, an organization, whatever you want to call it. My real one of the week is DeAndre Hopkins. DeAndre Hopkins, I guess it's too.

DeAndre Hopkins. and Kyler Murray for that bomb, that Hail Mary bomb to beat the Buffalo Bills yesterday. Dwayne has, not Dwayne Haskins, D'Andre Hopkins, sorry, I'm getting a moment. So I'm not really in my football bag right now. D'Andre Hopkins just went through a sea of hands and caught that thing, Moss everybody on the field, and also Kyler Murray with that incredible fucking throw. Do you know? Going against the great.

I played football. I played quarterback in high school. Bro. You go against your body and throw a motherfucker fucking hellberry like that against your body. Right before you're getting hip, just to have a chance. Opposite way. Yeah. 50 yard rope.

50 yard rope. About to get smashed. About to get smashed. On a string through that thing. It's a good real one. Real one. Real one. It's a good real one.

And also, also. real one for DeAndre who they just straight up disrespected him and who said trading him away didn't even get a first round pick for the guy That's why Bill O'Brien is watching the game

instead of coaching one during the same time because you do dumb shit like that Come on dog Real one Real one Like well I should double down I didn't use a stupid motherfucker

You go trade him for not even a first round pick God dog All right Not a real one Not a real one. So listen, I was, I was going to go football, but I'm going to switch it up. I'm going to go two real ones. Okay.

by April. We might all be vaccinated by April. Dog, like, this shit is starting to really take a toll, like, on the mental state of families. Like, you know, I mean, like, no, straight up. Like, straight up. Like, it's real, it's been really, you know, a tough time for a lot of people, dog. So seeing a little bit of light at the end of a tunnel is huge. So real ones for that. Yes. Make sure you guys check in our other shows this week. There's a little change in the shows.

mismatch will be on Tuesdays like normal. Group chat will be on Wednesday morning like normal. But there will be two special Ringer NBA live shows with Bill Simmons, Ryan Rosillo, and Kevin O'Connor. Not the Utah Jazz Kevin O'Connor, the real Kevin O'Connor out here in these streets. And you might, you might catch Raja before and after the draft. Who knows?

Who knows? You might. There also be a special post-ringer NBA show after the draft on Thursday morning with Kevin. O'Connor, Jonathan Charks, and Jake Kyle Mann, and your regular mismatch on Friday. You'll follow all of these on the Ringer NBA show on Spotify. Also check out some other podcasts that we have. The Ringer NFL show has been doing great things. I saw my guy Kailen Jones on there, and I was tight.

Tap in with all of that on Spotify. We'll see you guys next week. Tap in. Holla.