The Ringer NBA Show - Discussing NBA Prospect Victor Wembanyama With Ben Golliver and Interviews With Alonzo Mourning and Gary Payton at Art Basel Miami 2022 | Weekends With Wos

Episode Date: December 9, 2022

On this special episode of 'Weekends With Wos,' Wos is joined by writer Ben Golliver from The Washington Post to discuss the biggest prospect of 2023, Victor Wembanyama, and where they see him going in the next year (2:00). Then, Wos shares two interviews he did with former NBA legends Alonzo Mourning (28:45) and Gary Payton (38:31) at Art Basel 2022 in Miami. Host: Wosny Lambre Guests: Ben Golliver, Alonzo Mourning, and Gary Payton Producer: Jade Whaley Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Peace! We're out of here. Back, ladies and gentlemen, to the latest edition of Weekends. I'm your host, Big Was, Waz, A.k.a. Waziland Bray. And I'm joined, man, by the greatest white American in the history of the Pacific Northwest. Ben Goliver of the Washington Post was cracking with you, man. Not too much. I got to call you out, man. We're taping this on a Thursday.

When do you start your weekends? I mean, how many days do you need off so that you can clear your schedule, probably partying in Miami? God knows where else. First of all, I was working in Miami. I was working after this discussion. We're going to air two interviews. I talked to Alonzo Morning and I talked to Gary Payton at Art Basel. Took in a lot of great artwork.

MBA did amazing work installations over there because, you know, the MBA is culture. So first, that's one. I was in Miami getting that job done. Okay, so please put some respect on the name of my work, Ben Goliver. Well, that's what people always say about Art Basil. such a serious working environment where no one's having any fun whatsoever. I hear that all the time was.

Oh, man. Art Vazeling got nothing on the Sloan Analytics Conference, Ben, which of course is another big meeting ground for NBA people. But yo, man, we don't do the prospects in the future, blah, blah, blah, stuff. We don't do that here on weekends, generally speaking. But when I'm talking to you,

I do want to talk about that stuff because you're legit. legitimately excited about you legitimately get me excited about these guys and you are so deep into the weeds of all of this and of course everybody's going to remember your memorable appearance here on this very show where you were you know let's face it you were evangelizing about the last white hope chad home grin you was up here preaching literally preaching the gospel of chet homegrin and then i'm on your instagram this is months ago

when one Victor Wembeyanama had a game I'm thinking this was Nike Hoop Summit, right? Wemeyama came to Henderson, Nevada for like a two game set up you know, they played them against the G League Ignite and Scoot Henderson. It was like a classic made for TV,

made for NBA scouts. So it wasn't even like an event. It was just like, no, just come to America and let's do this. Yeah, it was not quite like Arra Basil. It was more like the Sloan Sports Analytics Conference honestly than R. Basil. I mean, if you're talking about who was actually there because they were selling tickets for it.

But I don't think that Victor Wambayama was like a household name for the fans yet. So pretty much the only people in attendance were like NBA executive scouts and then just like every media member you could imagine. But like a guy like Sam Pressy, Oklahoma City Thunder GM, I mean, he's sitting courtside like at the arena like an hour early. I mean, you've got like the San Antonio Spurs executives are like buddy, buddy with Victor's coach, you know, trying to like, you know, form. the rapport just in case they get lucky and like not coincidentally. When we're talking right now,

the Spurs are on an 11 game losing streak. Haven't won a game in a month, you know, so again, right on schedule for what their plans are. But it was like a summit for all the basketball dorks for people who want to see what the future of the NBA could be. And even I'm willing to admit, was, you know, Chet didn't bring him out like that. All right. Chet got me excited. But Victor has everybody exhilarated in a way that I have never seen since covering the NBA. in 2007, whether it's Kevin Durant, whether it's Anthony Davis. We've seen some big time teenage prospects come up. Victor's on a different level, man.

He's on a different plane. And, you know, I made some jokes about Chad Holmgren, but I do want to know how you came to find, because look, my natural inclination when the frenzy is happening, you know, just as a jaded, cynical New Yorkers to just be like, come on, give me a break, guys. That's just my natural thing. Like inside of me, I want to zig or I want to zag against this one bin yama thing. But then stuff started happening. I was like, no, I literally, I literally cannot do this.

How did you yourself find religion on this cat? Well, you know, first of all, I'm kind of just a weirdo. And when it comes to physiques, anytime you see a physique that's different that you've never seen before, it like makes you stop. And that was part of the deal with Chet, right? Because everyone wants to screen this guy is so skinny. And it's like, all right, well, how is he having so. much success playing basketball when he is this skinny. I mean, there's got to be something else going on. So it just makes you dig in. And let's just be honest, when it comes to Victor's physique, man, you could be

the most casual of casual, the biggest hater imaginable. When you see a guy who's seven foot four and has to duck his head down to walk through a metal detector to get into the building because otherwise this eight foot metal detector is probably going to hit him on the forehead. You know you're dealing with something different. I mean, he's got the longest feet I've ever seen. I mean, it was something like, size 20.5 off the charts. Nike doesn't even sell his shoe size on their website, right? I mean, not to be even, you know, more like kind of dialed in about it, the longest toes of any player I've ever seen in my entire life. He's doing all these like barefoot stretches before the game, like kind of like karate kid type, you know, core exercises. And I mean, he's just a wild.

No, he's different. And he was juggling tennis balls and a tennis ball looks like a ping pong ball in his hand, you know. So he's just, everything is stretched out. It's like everything you love about Kevin Durant just stretched out even more. I mean, he could practically dunk without jumping. You know, he was doing windmill dunks with his feet like maybe two inches off the ground. And so you're thinking, all right, well, this guy is going to be like an interior presence. But then he takes you out to the three point line. He wants to spend all day long gunning three-pointers like a seven foot four, J.R. Smith, man.

He's, you know, people want to ask, does he have the dog? This guy has the dog. I mean, he wants to be the gunner, the guy who has the ball in his hands late. He wants to create off the dribble. He could do a lot of different things as like a pick and roll, big man too, going towards the basket, dunk it in the paint, that kind of stuff. But he's really in his element on the perimeter, ball handling, you know, doing that, those kinds of things. And you just don't expect that from a 7 foot four guy.

So that's why I say everyone, once you get the chance to watch this guy, is going to come away enamored on some level. Yeah, I think some skeptics would say the sort of, you know, he's really light, right? This idea that he will get pushed around is there. But like to me, he's really young. I don't know how you're supposed to, you know, make these grand proclamations about how weak he's going to project out to be six and seven years from now considering his age. I think some people would say that. And some people would wonder, like, what's his competition been like? Who's he playing against?

Who's he been delivering against? Well, absolutely. In terms of the strength factor, he's really skinny. his legs. Like, his legs are really thin. So I'm not worried about him getting pushed around as much as I'm worried about kind of those lower body injuries that sometimes big guys get that just kind of take their careers off track, right? I mean, people forget about Kevin Durant. He had some foot injuries earlier as OKC career that I think required multiple surgeries and kept him out for a while. Those are the kinds of things you would worry about, I think, with someone like Victor. But in terms of

being pushed around and all that, bro, he'll just play over the top of you. You know what I mean? He doesn't even have to be in position on defense to block a shot. All he has to do is just stick his arm out and he'll meet you at the rim, right? And no one's really going to be able to push him off the ball on the perimeter in the NBA. I mean, everybody can kind of get a shot at this stage. So I'm not worried about the strength stuff as much. He's also a very mature guy and he's very self-confident. It speaks perfect English.

So he's one of these guys who's coming over as the total package. He's ready to dominate. Now, in terms of his competition, so he's in the French League, not the World's Greatest League, but they're not slouches. I mean, when they were doing the exhibitions against the G League Ignite, which is, you know, a team that's kind of developmental trying to bring teenagers into the NBA, it was a really, you know, even kind of a back and forth game. And obviously, you know, Victor was the big star who kind of pulled them over the top.

But they're not like a bunch of bombs, right? But if you look at his stats this year in the French League, he's averaging 23 points, nine rebounds, 2.5 assists, 3.1 blocks. And he's playing less than 32 minutes a night, right? So if you put that in per 36, he's averaging 26 and 11, right? And again, he's a teenager and he's a guy who. Against grown men. Sorry, that's just like those are impressive stats if you're doing that against professionals.

Even in, look, the French League is not the Spanish ACB, which is the best league in the world outside of the NBA. But it's not, you know, he's not playing in Puerto Rico or something. Correct. And the most important thing is his team is winning and he's sort of like the best player, right? So they're right at the top of the standings. I think there might be a half game out of first place as we're talking right now. So this is not just like, hey, we've got this crazy sensation. Just feed him the ball, get him a bunch of numbers to kind of help his draft stock.

You know, he's really exerting himself against the competition over there. So I think there's a lot to be excited about. And, you know, the other aspect that we haven't talked about is he didn't shut it down. Remember Lamello? How fast did Lamello shut it down in Australia? Right. As soon as he kind of was, yeah. Yeah, I'm going to be a very high lottery pick.

Send me back home. I'm done. But was he in Serbia or Australia? He was New Zealand. He was somewhere ridiculous, though. He was Lithuania, and then he came back, then he went to Australia, played like 10 games. I mean, it was a pandemic situation, so I understand maybe that had some influence. But, you know, so many of these young guys who come in, I mean, even a shade and sharp from last year, never even really got to see him play.

James Wiseman at Memphis, he ran into some different kind of issues. But there's a lot of times where you have these highly ranked guys, they know they've gotten the feedback that they're going to be super high. shut it down. And Victor's gone the other way. It says, I want to play. And not only that, I want to be the leading score on one of the best teams in the league. I think scouts really appreciate, you know, his mental makeup and his composure, like I was saying.

And he just handled the scrutiny in Henderson so well, man. Everybody was looking at him. The whole NBA universe, there's a lot of pressure in that environment. He flew halfway across the world for this thing. And this guy's draining one-legged, fallaway three-pointers, turnarounds. He's doing dream shakes. He's blocking shots. I mean, you know, Scoot Henderson, who's the projected number two pick in that class,

tried to test him on a dunk, and he just wiped them out, you know, completely on the defensive end. So I don't know. I can see why everybody has started this season off with this tanking conversation, why, you know, a team like San Antonio, you know, things are right on schedule as we're joking earlier. Utah, what are you doing? Right. People getting mad at Utah for winning because they're like, hey, don't you want this guy for the next 10 or 15 years, right? I mean, I've even heard from Sacramento Kings fans. I mean, they're on track to break a 16-year playoff drought.

And I've heard from a couple of them who are like, yeah, you know, but like, is Sabon is really the guy? Like, we could potentially have Victor here. That is great. You know, and because, again, you're keeping your ear to the street of this Winbenyama stuff. And because I know you, I know you're going to be very meticulous about it. And this, you don't need to. NBA guys, I think it was Paolo Bonciero. You know, Bo, Bowl is finally looked like an NBA player.

after three years of just like, all right, who is this guy? What is he? He's finally sort of taken shape into, oh, this is what this guy can be. And Ben Chiro's like, y'all talking about Wimbuniamma? What about Bo Bo? Look at what he's doing on the ball. Look at how he runs the court. Look at his link.

Look at his skill. You know, why is Bull Bull not an incredible comparison to maybe what, you know, Victor Wimbeniama might could be? Well, let me say this. have this philosophy that's called non-comparable. There's going to be certain guys who can't compare other people to. You remember what? Like go back to Lamello.

When he came up, people are like, he passes like Magic Johnson. No. No. He passes the ball well. Magic did something completely different. It's insulting to magic and, you know, disrespectful to magic, but it's also unfair to Lamello if you make those comparisons. Now, a player like Bull Bull, he's just been trying to get put on.

So I think Palo is looking at it like, I'm just trying to do my teammate assault. Nobody talks about the Orlando Magic. let's get this guy a little bit of buzz. But when you look at those two players, not all unicorns are created equal. Just because you're big and tall and you want to do everything, it doesn't mean you have that same package of skills, right?

And there's just a fluidity to what Victor does. I think that there is a little bit more of a locked in, intense persona on the court, a little bit more of a killer instinct to what he does. With Bull Bull, he looks like a guy who's way over seven feet trying to kind of stumble around there with a ball in his hands. and he still gets it done. I mean, it's remarkable what Bowl Bowl can do on the court.

But, you know, Victor, it's just, it's so much smoother. It's so much more effortless. It looks easy. Whereas with Bull Bull, it often looks difficult. And I think on the defensive end, people really do challenge. Bull, they try to get it to his chest. They try to get him into foul trouble. They just try to take advantage of him inside. And I think Victor, by the time he's Bull Bulls age currently,

he's going to be just because of his physique and his length, his wingspan, and those kind of things, to be a defensive player that year candidate just based off of his body. And the crazy part about saying that, I don't even think he necessarily loves to play defense. Like, I think he's out there trying to get 30. Like, that's, that's sort of his mentality. So if you have a player who's like wired like that, wants to get 30 on offense, but is also has the body to be a defensive player that your candidate, now you see why everybody goes so crazy for him. And I look at Bull and I just don't really see quite either side of those equations, right? Yeah. But, you know, some of these other

younger bigs we've seen recently, Evan Mobley, Jaron Jackson, Jr., what do we always say about them? It's like, man, I wish these guys could get a bucket. You know, maybe they could pass a little bit. And so that's where I'm going to go with this, Ben. That's it. You damn near read my mind, because I'm not going to lie. The highlight packages that you see on Insta and Twitter when, you know, he's doing all of this beautiful stuff on the perimeter. I say to myself, I'm like, this doesn't look like KD. It doesn't even look like Brandon Ingram, is what I'm saying.

Like, I don't know how real I think all of this perimeter shot creation is going to translate into the NBA. I don't see him as some guy clear out, top of the key. I'm going to break NBA level guys down and create and generate, excuse me, efficient offense.

Are you there? Do you really think he's going to be some type of efficient, lanky, taller ball handling creator at the next level? You really think that? I'm telling you, seeing it in person, it was like an arena-wide revelation. Man, I was sitting next to your guy, Kevin O'Connor.

Man, I was jaw, it was just dropping. I could hear his jaw drop. I'm telling you, everybody was sitting there looking at these shots like, holy cow. And the thing is, he doesn't actually have to create that much separation off the dribble because he's seven-foot-four. And his release point, you know, nobody can even really challenge his shots.

outside of like a Jaron Jackson Jr. and Evan Mobley, maybe a KD, who else is even going to be able to get a hand up on that, right? So there are some concerns like his three point percentage this year in the French League hasn't been great. He is a little bit of a gunner. So if he's cold, he could hit, he can miss three or four threes in a row and maybe take you out a little bit of your offense. But when he has it going, man, it's really, really fun, entertaining to watch. And these are not just like random things. It's part of his routine before games. That's where he practices his shots as soon as he gets in the flow.

That's what he's trying to go to. He views himself that way. He doesn't want to be a back to the basket big. And I think he's coming up at a time in the NBA where like nobody's going to want him to play that way, right? Everybody's going to be completely fine with him being a stretch five on the perimeter handling the ball. Now, are you going to see him bring it up and like initiate possessions?

Well, probably not regularly. But if he grabs a defensive rebound, he can go with it. Man, I'm telling you he's that fluid. And that's actually one comparison point to Chet where, you know, Chet likes to do that stuff too and get out in transition a little bit. And I think both those guys are going to be comfortable. And I think you just kind of have to, not just you specifically, but in general, we got to get used to it, man. The unicorns are about to take over the NBA, like the real ones. You know, these guys are coming. They want the ball in their hands.

They want to be as big and long and active as possible. They don't want to be standing in the corner watching somebody else do things. And what's interesting to me is the fans are catching on. So I heard a stat this week of all the players in the NBA. I'm going to include Wembenyama with these guys. Wemba Nama right now ranks sixth in terms of total social media views so far during this NBA season. And he's only played about half as many games as the NBA players have because their schedule is a little bit different over there in France. So you're saying who's generating the most social media views per game in the entire world right now? It might be Wembe Nama. And he doesn't have like the Lakers fan base behind him, right? He doesn't have the Celtics fan base

behind him, but he's already up there on that same level as like, you know, with Steph and John Moran and like the NBA's biggest hitters. So to me, that's wild because if you rewind three or four years and said there's going to be some random seven foot four French kid who's going to be able to get as many eyeballs on him, even though he's not in the NBA as the biggest NBA stars, I would have called you a liar, right? I mean, it's just impossible, inconceivable. And yet here we are and he still got, you know, I think like four or five more months to play of his current season. So you guys heard it here first from the evangelist himself, Ben Gulliver. We are looking at the next Ali Jordan cultural figure on the global stage in Victor Wembingyama.

Y'all better get ready for Victor Mania. This is going to be crazy. No, I'm obviously saying that tongue in cheek. But honestly, man, talking to you honestly gets me excited about this kid and what it will mean for our league and our game. I got a question for you, boss. When you were watching LeBron in high school, were you still hating? No, no, no.

LeBron, so see, the LeBron thing in high school was different for me because I was a high school athlete. And I was like, this is impossible. You're like, don't make me guard him. So, you know, in high school, anybody who's six-eight is a center and cannot chew and walk and chew gum at the same time, much less handle the rock, throw, no looks,

have a 50-inch vert, make three. That this just was not a thing that happened in our sport in high school. So LeBron, I was automatically on board because I was playing against varsity high school athletes every day. And I was like, they don't do this. And like, for LeBron to be a junior doing all of that, I was like, this is crazy. This, and you know, I'm older and I'm just like, you know, as my man Sue Gautz would say,

do it in the NBA and then do it again in the playoffs. Right. I think he understands that burden too. The difference I would draw between the two of them, they both had sky high ceilings, right? With LeBron, it was like people were saying he's the next Jordan. He has the possibility to be that. Jordan, magic rolled into one, all of that, yep.

Right. So Victor also obviously has a sky high ceiling. Like if he hits, you know, he could be one of the all-time leading scores in the NBA and he could be one of the best defensive players ever. I think the difference between the two is the floor. And the floor factor would come from injuries, ability to stay healthy. Sure.

Well, you saw LeBron as a tank at St. Vincent, St. Mary's, you weren't like, oh, I wonder if he's going to get, like, foiled. His body was, his physique was ready for the NBA immediately. Right. And that's the difference with Victor. So I think people are as excited almost in terms of what Victor could do in a best case scenario as they were with LeBron. I've heard some very sober, very skeptical scouts be like, holy cow. I mean, this guy is just nuts, right? But then you also have, you know, in the back of your mind, you're thinking, well, there's a risk factor with this guy that did. didn't exist for a player like LeBron. And we saw that with Chet. I mean, look at Chet.

He goes out there. He's trying to play, you know, the summer league in Seattle. He's trying to do everything. And he ended up getting injured. I don't know that that's a cause, but, you know, that's it. No, I just, I say all that. But that was a concern with Chet, too. You know what I mean?

Like people are looking at his body and they're saying, all right, well, lower body isn't going to hold up. And a big injury has already happened. Correct. Before he could even play his first game. And it's really the first injury of his life or his career. So it's a little bit scary of like, okay, well, let's hope he can play an 82 game season and and kind of make this work.

So that would be the difference that I would draw between LeBron and Victor. But I do think the consensus is Victor is the best overall number one prospect in a class since LeBron. And when you say that, you're talking 20 years, right? So that's generational kind of by definition. That's amazing. All right, man, I'm hesitantly bought my ticket to the hype train. I'll be monitoring this all year. Obviously, I'll be texting back and forth with you.

I got one more question for you real quick. Of course. Where do you want them to land, right? Because, so obviously the joke was, all the Lakers are going to lose their pick and have to give it to the pelicans. If you put Zion and Victor next to each other, dude, get out.

I mean, that would be absolutely crazy. So I have two things. I don't want to see him in the prairie. Don't want to see them in OKC. Yeah, like, y'all, you know, y'all got KD, Russ, Ibaka, Hardy. Give it a rest. Don't want to see him in OKC.

Wait, you don't want the Monstars combo, Chad and Victor? No, no, I don't want to see him in OKC. I don't want to see him in Utah simply because I was annoyed with my media friends for calling Danny Agenius for trading his best players.

So I don't want to see him in Utah because I don't want to see Danny Ains rewarded and then the media just does it even larger and more annoying circle jerk. And so realistically, my preferred destination is Detroit. I want to see him in Detroit. I'm a big kid, Cunningham guy. I know he hasn't gotten off to the fastest start this year.

And I know the injury and all of that. But I would really, really love to see him in Detroit and what they're doing and building down there. So, yeah, I'm a Detroit guy. What about you? Well, actually, I like that pick because it would reward Troy Reaver. That dude loves centers, man. That guy collects centers. Like, I mean, I don't even know, like marbles or stamps or something like that.

I mean, he even went out and got bagley, man. That's how, like, you know, he's so into centers. He wants guys like that. So it would be like his best case scenario. And the fit between Cade and Victor would be unreal. The spacing that would exist on that group. I mean, Ivy would be getting 20 points a game, just walk into the rim for layups every single night. That would be an amazing fit.

And imagine what that could do for that Pistons team, you know, because Cades brought a little bit of the excitement back, but I'm not sure it's fully back. Detroit would be fully back. They would be like the center of the NBA universe for that first year. And I do just want to tell your audience, man, 23 is about to be the year of Victor. because you're going to have that draft lottery drawing in May where we find out who gets him. You're going to have the draft where I promise you he's going to come out in like Louis Vuitton head to toe. He's going to be stunting all over everyone. I promise.

Just wait on it, okay? Run this back in June. I promise you, Oz. Then if he plays Summer League, it's going to be wild. He's going to sell out Summer League. Then they have the Fiba World Cup. And Francis is trying to get him on that Feeba World Cup team, right? And then obviously you're going to go into his rookie year.

It's going to be the most anticipated debut since LeBron. Or maybe Zion, depending on how you look at it. So we're going to be talking Wembe for all of next year. That's my prediction for you. This is really, really exciting stuff. Ben Gulliver of the Washington Post. Thank you, as always, for coming on. Looking to get more out of this NBA season?

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episode for you guys this past weekend, I was able to attend Art Basil in Miami. It's, you know, it's basically a series of art exhibits and various other events down in Miami every single December. And the NBA in partnership with their partner, Mikhailo, put on an incredible event where they displayed, you know, some great artists. They got some art stuff that they're doing with Mikalob, which I think is cool because I think the NBA, more so than pretty much all of the other leagues, have a better way of just connecting different elements of culture, whether it be music, art, what have you, with their athletes and what they do with the game. The NBA just feels like it's more integrated with those other segments of our culture.

And our Basel is just an incredible way that the NBA is able to display that. And so, yeah, I was able to talk to two NBA legends, Alonzo Morning, who actually, you know, Obviously, a former Miami Heat legend still works for the Miami Heat. I got to chop it up with him about various things, including what he does with the heat and why he just loves his job so much, just some of his battles in the NBA. And then I got to talk to Gary Payton, another bona fide NBA legend. Really cool interview. Now, I must say, just as a disclaimer, the audio quality is not the same as our normal stuff.

I had to take this at the event. It was basically the only way for me to talk to the event. guys but it was a dope conversation i think you guys will enjoy it but did want to give that disclaimer that the audio is different from what we normally do here on the ringer nbae feed but please enjoy my interview with alonzo morning and gary peyton from art basil ringer nbaugha show we're here at art basil in miami michelope ultra mbbae activation with the legend hall of famer all NBA All-Star teams, all defensive teams, all of that stuff. You are legend, Eliza, morning.

Thanks for coming on the show. What did you say? I said the Olympic gold medalist as well. I forgot about the gold medal. My bad, and you know, when I was doing my little research before this, I saw that Fibah also put you in the Hall of Fame. So you were Feeba Hall of Fame. Man, what is, I know, obviously you lived in Miami for years now.

This is not your first art basil. What's it like for the NBA to be doing in activation here during this time? Listen, you know, Art Basil is staple in Miami's community. When you think about the multicultural event of Art Basil and how people congregate from all over the world here to enjoy the festivities during Art Basil, I think it's a prime opportunity for the NBA, and Mikhailov and so many other brands to come together and create an atmosphere where they would expose an individual to their product. And I'm happy to be a part of, you know, the Mikhailob Ultra Team Can activation, you know, because they did it before and now they're bringing it back.

and I thought it was really a big hit, you know, and when you think about the basketball brand, and then we're slowly becoming, you know, the number one sport in the world. And to have a relationship with a prominent company like Mikhailove and to be able to produce these team cans, I think it's a hit. It really is a hit.

And I think it's going to create some amazing momentum. Next week, they're going to start selling, in the arenas and retail, so it's going to be good. Love that. So I got to say for myself, I'm a New York City guy. I know a lot of people when they think of Miami, the heat specifically, they might think a D-Way, but because of my age, to me, when I think of the heat, I think of you guys. I think of you, obviously Tim, Vichon Leonard, PJ Brown, Pat, of course, and you're still part of the heat. All these years later, why is it that you think you were, you know, some, you

came at the same time, Ms. Pat, and you've been here throughout the years, the shack years, all of that stuff. What do you think it is about the heat that keeps you guys so close-knit? Well, it's the culture, man. It really is. It's like a fraternity. When you think about when Pat came here in 95, the first thing he did is he went to got me because he felt that I could contribute to what he was trying to build. He told me what he was trying to do, and I bought into it. I drank the cool. And we started the process, you know, we built this championship culture, you know, and we attracted other prominent athletes from around the league, and everybody wanted to be a part of it.

We created some momentum. We started winning, and we put the league on notice. And then we, you know, it was easy to sell Miami. You can just put it on the hook and cast it out. You know, no state taxed it. Beautiful weather, beautiful people, great food, everything. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, once we put that on the hook, you know,

and created a championship winning atmosphere, players wanted to come. So I want to ask you about the culture because a lot of people, you know, hashtag heat culture, a lot of people who aren't Miami supporters can roll their eyes sometimes at it. But like, what does it mean? What does culture mean?

in your mind as far as the kind of people is going to attract and why they might excel in a Miami heat culture. I think it's consistent, created, well-thought-out habits that resonates throughout everyone that's a part of the organization. So it's not just coming from one person, it's coming from everybody. So when you hear it enough for everybody, it's just like everywhere you go in the organization is like wow this is the culture because nobody's speaking a different language everybody's speaking the same language and then for those that don't want to buy into it they don't last long so you come in you be a part of the culture and it's a it's a positive and impactful culture

because players have come here and totally change their careers they've changed their bodies physically they benefit from the economics of the game because they bought into the culture and they've gotten their bodies in great shape. They've become a part of winning teams and good things that have evolved from it. So I don't think anybody back

can say anything bad about it because there's so many players that have become advocates of it because they've come here and good things have happened for them, you know? I want to ask you because you could be doing anything that you want literally, right?

Like you've been very successful. successful in the game, obviously all the accolades and stuff that comes with it. You could be doing anything you wanted with your life. What is it that keeps you motivated and still wanting to be a part of the game, specifically on the team aspect? I've got a wealth, I've got a wealth of knowledge that I attain through experience and some amazing coaches. So whatever I can do to contribute back to players,

give back to the game so they can take that knowledge or that influence with them. Them take a different approach to their game and their life because I know that they're going to share that with somebody else. Then that's my reward. Very fulfilling. Not only am I sharing it with my kids, my two sons, you know, but I want to share that same information and knowledge with the younger players coming in. So being an ambassador for the team and vice president and everything, you know,

it's a pretty special feeling. And knowing that I contributed to the game at a high level and I'm a part of the Hall of Fame and part of the history of the game, you know, I still feel like I got a lot to share. I don't want to hoard those blessings for myself. You know, I want to share them with the younger generation. So I mentioned to you before that I'm from New York, and obviously you guys had those legendary playoff battles, literally battles sometimes. It was, you know, it came the fist of cuffs at certain points. What do you remember about those battles with, you know, Jeff Van Gundy and Pat and all of those guys back when you guys were in your heyday, and it was literally like a blood war?

Well, you know, what I remember about it is is that, you know, there was a, you know, there was a, a very fierce winning attitude. And it was heightened competition. It really was. And, you know, when you think about the game back then it was a very physical game, you know. So the physicality was entertaining. It wasn't just about shooting a bunch of threes.

It was about really getting after it and competing at a high level, not just letting people just waltz in and score easily. We made it difficult. We made it challenging. Now you got these games, man, where... I saw somebody scored 140 in regulation time the other day. It's just a different era, man.

Different mentality. But listen, the game is in a good place. It's what sells right now. I credit Adam Silver. David Stern did an incredible job. God rest of the soul. And we're planning to see that he did. and Adams took the choice, revamped it a little bit,

and he's expanding the game on a global level. All right, I want to get you out of here on this, because the listeners at home, they can't see you right now, but the man looks absolutely amazing, okay? 50 plus, he's looking as incredible as ever. Tell the people what your secret is, so I know it's Miami, you got to compete with these folks, but, golly, what was your secret?

to this fountain of youth, brother. Hey, man. God has blessed me with some amazing people in my life. So I live a stress-free life. I live a plant-based life. And I exercise. And I pray a lot.

So that's the formula. That's the formula. Stress-free, plant-based, exercise, pray-up. So, thank you for doing this, man. I really appreciate this. You're good, brother. So we had a Mickelope here in Miami, Art Basel,

with the legendary Hall of Famer, NBA champion, greatest shit talker in the history of the league. Gary Payton was going on, man. How you doing, man? I'm good. You know, a lot of people associate you with Seattle, of course, because you spent the bulk of your career there. But you obviously had your Miami run, won the championship.

What does the city of Miami mean to you? It was great, you know what I'm saying, to come here and win a championship for two years, you know, I was here for two years, got in a great relationship with Alonzo, Shack. You know, I came here with Shack. I got D.W.A. when he was only in his second year. Yes. Then his third year and stuff and seeing him become the basketball player he was. Because coming here in Miami, everybody loves me here, and I love being here. We all love being here.

Yeah, yeah. You know, it breaks it. Miami's a great city, especially for this event to come here, and then they want me to come and do it. It was a no-brainer, you know what I'm saying? Especially because Miami deserves this, deserves it, the notoriety for the cans to come out and for the Mikloom Ultra and then add a logo on there and then they can do it. So, you know, it was great for me to come back here. You know what I think is cool, too, is that you're still really present around the game, around the league.

obviously your son won a championship with the Warriors last year. I just want to talk to you about just that experience because obviously there's playing but then is watching your own kid pursue a championship. What was that like, man? Especially doing it in the Bay Area where you're from.

Yeah, well, get shots out to him today. His day is his 30th birthday. He got a big 30th day. So, you know, I just left him yesterday. Man, they played the Lakers last day. We gave him a surprise birthday party. You know, but seeing my son, you know I'm growing up from Oakland, California,

and the Warriors are right there, and then he goes back, you know, he follows me to Oregon State, and then he goes and be able to have a chance to play in my hometown, you know, but he's really from Seattle because he was born in Seattle. So, you know what I'm saying? So, you know, to come back and do it on his mom and his dad's home, hometown and win a championship and then be a big part of him.

Be a big part of the Gold State Warriors and help him do that. It was a good fella, you know, Yeah, I'm not, I'm really not trying to gas it. When he came back from his injury, their whole defense changed. And he's, he's clearly been a big difference maker on that end of the court. You a defensive play in a year recipient. Do you take any credit for that, GP? Well, you know what I hope so, a little bit of my jeans came out of him. So, you know, but, you know, for him to be around me all the time and see what I did on the court as a young kid, you would want to inspect your child to do that. And I think that he takes pride

in doing that. still in the basketball, and it's an athletic ability that he has, dunking on people. I think he takes that as a challenge for not being six years for people overlooking him for six years in the pros, and then he gets with a team that is right for him, and then he has a big-time payday this year. I think he looks forward to that, and I think he's ready to come back, and that DNA is just there. I like it because he plays defense, and he makes his defense turns into offense. Yeah.

So did he get you anything special after he signed that check? Did he break that off with anything? No. Well, you know, I don't want nothing. You know me. People know me. I like to get my own. You know, that's my son's money.

That was his thing. I don't think I did get a ring. You know what I'm saying? I got one of the big rings that he's going to get on the 30th when he plays Golden State. So our whole family got one of them. I don't really pressure my son for that. You know what I'm saying? I don't need that.

That's his money. let him do what he wants to do. But I won't even accept nothing from him. I don't even need to do that. I mean, I got my money. I did. I do everything. I got to do.

I'm very successful still. So I'm really good. So what I wanted to ask you is, who are the guys today that get you hype to watch the league? Who are your favorite dudes that you're like, man, I really admire this guy's game? The one I really admire, and I look at him all the time is John Morant. I look at him all the time.

I think he's got that tenacity. I had, you know, where he can go at you. He, ah, and he oohing, and he plays tough. You know what I'm saying? He's a tough guy. And he's very excited at the point guard position. You know, Marcus Smart is a guy that won the defensive player. He plays just like me too.

So them are the two young ones. But it's always going to be the one that I always like, and he's doing it at the age of 37 is LeBron James. You know, once he can do that. And he can stay doing what he's doing at a high level what he is. Everybody knows he's about to break Karim's record in a minute. And he deserves it. He deserves it for being in the league for 20 years and doing the things he does.

And he's keeping it old school. And that's what I like. So everybody wants to know, especially because we do got a lot of fans still in Seattle. Is this thing happening? Because we're hearing that it's going to happen. What are you hearing? I know you got the inside track on this. GP, what are you hearing about basketball, the NBA, or rather, finally coming back to Seattle?

It's going to come. You know, you guys got to be patient. The NBA has to be patient with it, too. You know, the TV deal is coming up. The TV deal is coming up. A lot of the owners don't want to have new teams come in and get that money. Get some of the pie. Especially when they're going to have to give away some of their players.

They're going to have a draft and they're going to have to protect some players. So they don't want to give up everything. So they'll make the team's way. And I think Vegas and Seattle would be two good ones, you know, and then somebody in the West is going to have to move over to the East one team. We don't know who that's going to be, so it is what it is. But it will happen. I think what happened was when the Crackers came, the NHL team came,

and we built a new arena that really took it over the tops for a lot of people to see that that's a great arena that can be around the whole United States. And I think that was that sold a lot of the owners. and so Commissioner Adam, Sue. That's where it's going to be. Seattle should have never lost the team anyway. Never should have lost a team anyway. And it's a great sports city, a great city, period, yes, and beautiful and where you want to live.

And I think it will happen in the next couple years. So I want to ask you this last question. Somebody who I know, who knows you personally, told me that Gary Payton is the most Bay Area dude in the history of the NBA. What do you think that means? What does that mean to you when you hear that? That you're the most bay dude in the history of the league? I think people are just trying to say that I always mention the Bay.

I let them know I'm from Oakland. That's where I'm from. I was born and raised from there. That's what my father raised me. That's how he raised me up. I think Dane Bliller to come second when he went to O-Wong there for Oakland. You know what I'm saying?

But all of us from the Bay, Brian Shaw, Antonio Davis, all of us, J.R. Wright, who came and Jason Keen. We all were from the back. But I think they think that I'm more of the streetwise in there. I've got more the streets. I think I know all the people on the streets more than everybody else,

you know, everybody. I'm more of a street guy. And that's where I grew up, you know what I'm saying? So that's why they say more of a bank. You know, I'll be with short. I'll be with a E40. So the rap and stuff is my game. I'm that young, that old young generation.

So that's what I think they're saying. more of the back. GP, man, I just want to thank you because, you know, I'm 35 years old. My first memories of the NBA, you were a big part of it. Been a fan of yours for years. Super dope to see you here at Arbazel with Mikhailo. This is fire, man. I really appreciate this.

I appreciate you all the time, man. You know, I like to hear things like that when young guys and young women come and say, you know, they loved that being and they got something out of it. I like to see that because that makes me feel happy that I did something for somebody's life. and I'm glad I did something for yours. Yeah, you made me get a pair of those gloves, the Nikes. I had my dad walk me to Yudica. I have in Brooklyn.

I was like, bro, I need these gloves. So I had to get a pair, man. Appreciate you, man. Enjoy the rest of your time, man. Appreciate you, too. Thank you, brother.