The Ringer NBA Show - Does Kyrie Have a Point? A Deep Dive Into the Relationship Between NBA Players and the Media | Real Ones

Episode Date: December 14, 2020

Logan and Raja start off the top with Kyrie’s most recent comments on the media and Raja’s experiences with the media-NBA player relationship (7:00). Then they get into Giannis’s evasive language regarding his future in Milwaukee (31:00) and whether good or bad performances in the preseason mean anything at all (42:00). Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping, real ones. Logan Murdoch here with Roger Bell and Sasha on hand. We had a good conversation today about players versus the media. I thought it was going to be like a, I thought it was going to be like a Larry Holmes, like drag out fight or something. It's a pretty good conversation, though. Yeah, life is about relationships, bro. I mean, come on, man. It's a, we all work hand in hand.

Yeah, yeah. We talked about media. We talked about Janus. We talked about Laker Nation. And we got into some good stuff. man, temper your expectations. We talked about my nanny when I dropped 21 on MJ. Tap in.

What's popping? Real ones. Logan Murdoch here, Roger Bell. It's good, bro. How was your weekend, dude? Listen, can you see my face right now? It's two-tone. I say listen a lot.

I realize that. But look, you see the two-tone in my face? Yeah. That's called mask burn. I spent my whole weekend on a football field with my son's wearing the mask. Oh, okay. I thought I saw it, but I was like, nah. And then I'm looking at myself in the Zoom call, mask burn out.

Oh, I do see it. I do see it. I don't know if this part is going to get on video, but I definitely see it. It's like Florida up top in the winter, and it's like Montana on the bottom in the winter. It's right there. So, yeah, when you said mask,

I thought you were just getting like the mask work done, like a mud mask or something. You weren't getting that popping off this weekend? No, no, my God. I lost all calls in the beauty department. Like, I don't even mess. I used to. Like full disclosure, dog. I was a vain dude. I'm gonna keep it a bug, bro. Like, you got the Farrell face right now. You know what I mean? Like, you got like, you know what I'm saying?

Shout out. Listen, it's a hopeless. It's a hopeless effort now, dog. The age is starting to kick in the wrinkles on the forehead or are pronounced. It's, yeah, you got to go gracefully, though. I'm not fighting it. Okay. I'm not fighting it. All right. You ain't going, you ain't going to drop the skincare routine no time soon. Nobody. The street, the streets, the streets is waiting for the Rajabelle's skincare routine. Is this all I'm saying? The streets is waiting for. You're bugging. You know, so, so I was, I was, this weekend, I was, you know, I was just on Twitter like normal, right? And I keep, I kept getting mentions and texts that a Raja Bell was named dropped in a rap song.

Oh, indeed, sir. Indeed. By Jack Harlow. By Jack Harlow. You made my sons, like, my sons are aware that I played in the NBA. They are NBA fans, but not huge NBA fans. So, like, they don't really realize that at one point, like, if you were walking the streets in Phoenix or somewhere like that, I was a big deal. Like, I'm not saying, like, across the country, but in Phoenix, like, you know, or in Philly in 01, I was a big deal.

You got free beers. You get held down in Scottsdale. Yes, correct. I could get in if there were no tables. And, like, I could do that at one point in my life. I can't anymore. But when my name was in that damn song, I was like, I mean, I don't. It was the best day of my son's life, apparently.

Yo, what's it? I want to get to a day where I'm named dropped in a rap song. Did you listen to the song? What's the feeling like when you hear the lyric? What's going on? Yeah, no, I mean, full disclosure, like, I'm not all into, like, today's rap scene. So I don't know. My sons are, they thought it was super dope.

I mean, it was, like, my wife was like, damn, okay, like, you got name dropped in a song. Like, kind of teasing me, like, how are you feeling? People, you know, it's been a long time since somebody, like, you know, felt like that about. So it was cool, though. We had a little moment. I got a bunch of texts, my little cousins and shit. And apparently, like, Jack Harlow is kind of hot right now, right?

Like, apologies. He's actually kind of hard right now. Apologies, but I'm just not in that, like, genre of music. You know what I mean? I mean, he's in the streets, man. Like, he's one of the ones right now. Kentucky dude, like, lived in Arizona for a long time, right? So it kind of makes sense.

He probably came to a game and watched you play live, maybe? You know what I mean? And was like, yo, I like this guy. I like this guy. My first and probably last name drop. I appreciate that, though. Shout out. Hey, man.

You know what I'm saying? Like, who knows this podcast might be popping? We might get a real one's name drop. A real one's name drop. Or, like, and this is going to be like, I'm going to do a little play on words. How about let's get to the shits? Ooh. Like that?

Like, because you see how it goes both ways, right? Let's get to the shits. Okay. All right. For sure. All right. All right. I think, okay, I see where you going with this.

All right. You all talk about, you know, talk about getting, you know, rap lyrics dropped on you. Okay. Because we both know that if it was to go down, that Sasha would be, is the most big time one here and she would get the name drop over all of us. No, 100%. Hey, but real talk. Tell us why you're excited, though. Like, you tell us why you're excited.

We're used to telling people why we're mad, son. Yeah. Tell us why we're excited. Bro. I am so juiced right now because. E40 and too short are doing a versus this week. Okay? They're doing it versus this week.

The Bay is on the map. I am about to be so insufferable all week talking about, y'all don't know nothing about this. We influence everything. Shout out to the Bay. Shout out to the town. Shout out to the Vallejo. Shout out to E40.

Shout out to the hillside. Shout out to the crest. Shout out to everybody. Shout out to C.C. Sabathia of Vallejo legend. You know what I mean? We're about to be really out here in these virtual streets, okay? We're about to have our scrapers. I don't know if you know that because you was,

I don't know if you know what that even is. Because you was a Piedmont. We're going to have our scraper bikes out. We're going to have our scraper cars out, you feel me. We're going to have our AAA black hoodies on. We're going to have our Aver X jeans. We're going to have our black forces and our A's hats. Okay, we tap it in.

It's really out here. You know what I mean? Shout out to the burses. Shout out to two shorts. Shout out to E40. Bro, we out here. All right. That's why.

First of all, you are going to be insufferable. That was almost insufferable. But secondly, AverX makes jeans? Aver X, they used to make Leathers when I played, but they make jeans? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We don't get that.

We're going to have the Aver X jeans. We're going to have the Jibot jeans popping. You know what I mean? We're going to have the liquor store teas on the, I haven't decided if I'm going to have the triple X or the quadruple X T on. Do you go double T or single T? Do you go A T under the white T?

No, so like the white T under the black tea. Oh. You know what I'm saying? You know what I mean? You know what I mean? We're on real 07 energy right now. We're going to have the clear forces popping. I'm so excited right now.

Like, we were, I don't know if there's, there's probably going to be like 30 viewers on that thing, but I'm about to be, I'm about to have like 29 devices just ready to go. We're ready to rock. I'm going to hop on. I'm, I'm going to mess with both of them. So I'm a hop on.

All right, man. Let's, let's get to the shits. Let's get to the shit. I asked you to, let's get to them. But I had, we had to talk about 40 is short, man. We had to put on for the bag. Stop it. Let's go.

So we talked about a little bit about this on with Big Perk, friend of the show last week about Kyrie Irving. He was phenomenal, by the way, right? We can agree. Yeah, perk was really great, bro. Like you said in the pod, we need to have him like bi-monthly or something. We need to get him, like, we just need to have our correspondent perk just rolled through. No doubt.

We were talking, you both were talking about it. I just let you guys get the baton on this one. But we both talked about Kyrie. and how it's going to fit and how he's going to be on the Brooklyn Nets. Now, after that happened, Kyrie Irving put on IG story after he got fined $25,000 for not speaking to the media and putting a statement out there, he put on his IG story. I pray we utilize the fine money for marginalized communities in need, especially seeing where we are in this world presently.

I'm here for peace, love, and greatness. So stop distracting me and my team and appreciate the art. We move different over here. I do not talk to Pons. My attention is worth more. And Pons was, it was thought to be talking about the media, all right? Okay. We don't have to talk about Kyrie as much as I do want to talk about the relationship between players and the media.

Right. And I do want to get started. This all started because of Kyrie's comments on the aesthetics podcast with Eddie Gonzalez and Kevin Durant where Kyrie says some stuff about LeBron. LeBron says something back and forth. And then they're going back and forth about that. And then Kyrie goes and says, I want to put a statement out there instead of talking during Media Day. And then he calls his pawns. So why is there something?

from your vantage point, as a former player, why is there such a contentious relationship between players and the media? Like, what do you, why do you think that is? I don't think every player has a contentious media relationship, like, or relationship with the media. I don't believe that to be true. But I think there was, you know, when I played,

we didn't have nearly the voice that the players today have. Like, we didn't have our own pods. We didn't have these, these social media. accounts that had millions of followers for the most part. So we couldn't really get our message out. And at times, it is, it is frustrating and almost feels helpless when you're a player. And the only narrative that can be put out there is that of the journalist or the club, right? Because, you know, said journalist might be a beat writer. And no matter what you do in some instances, like, that's, that's just what the narrative is going to be. Right. So I think, you know, if you don't fall

or sound relationships with the media, then that can be the case, you know, especially when I played, because you didn't have these outlets to have your voice heard. It was only coming from the media. So I think it kind of, you know, stems from like that type of relationship. But what I'll say to the relationship in general, and especially as it pertains to like Kyrie and today is, like, as long as you were a good dude and you stood up and you did your media responsibility and you weren't disrespectful for the media. For the most part, those guys were fair. Now, they might not always write a glowing review of what you did, but you might not have deserved a glowing review of what you did. There's always an asshole. There's always an asshole, a guy who

write shit that no matter what you do or how nice you are to him, he's going to write negative shit. He might not, you know, everyone has their own taste of player. And not everyone, Logan, can be impartial when writing, right? Like, I've seen that on multiple teams and multiple markets. But as long as you fostered good relationships, you did your job, you stood up, you answered questions, you know, you could even have a bad night and say something like snarky. And most dudes would give you the benefit of the doubt because they know that you are, you know, in the heat of the battle and so on and so forth. I think what happens to players now, and I, Kyrie falls into this category at times,

they just say too much. Like there's no, you don't, no one says that you have to bear your soul to the media. No one says that you have to tell them everything that's on your mind. Because if you give a media member something good in terms of a nugget of information that's going to be inflammatory or something like that, I mean, that's their job in a lot of, you know, you're trying to get the clicks. You're trying to be the guy who can break the story. So, you know, you better believe they're going to do it. I don't hold that against them. I hold it against whoever it is that opened their mouth and said something that they wouldn't want written, you know, in every publication across the world. And so I would say to these guys, like, you could still do your job and get up in front of the media. No one says you have to bear. your soul every time someone asks you a question. You said something that was really interesting about narrative, right? About a narrative that can get put on you. How does that happen?

And how did you get a narrative? Did you, I feel like you got a narrative put on you? What is the feeling like that from a player's perspective? And how do you break that, if at all? And is it fair that we put that on you? Well, again, I mean, I've had good narratives. you know, like when I was in Philly in 2001, and, you know, I kind of captured lightning and a bottle in that little bit of limited time in the finals. Like, the narrative around me was really

good. I mean, I wasn't ready to really contribute, you know, heavily on an NBA team, but I had played well in that short window of time and the narrative around me was good, right? Like, so it was, it was cool. Like, my narrative in Phoenix was really good. I was hardworking part of what they were doing there. And, you know, I was really cool with all the media guys. But the narrative around me, the flip side of that was the narrative that transpired in Utah towards the end of my career. And I talk about it a lot, even though I was good with all the journalists out there at Brian Smith and, you know, all the people that worked at Salt Lake Trib and all of that, Gordon Munson, I think his name was like, I had done a lot of work with them, always gave an interview,

was always forthright, never rude to anyone. Utah is the jazz and the jazz is Utah, right? And so no matter what transpired in that, in that like, you know, season, the narrative was going to be what they wanted the narrative to be. You understand what I'm saying? And so that was super frustrating for me because I got a lot of hate from jazz fans for a long time for a situation that they were only getting one side of, right? And like, all I was asking, like, if you hear my side of it and you still want to hate me, cool, like, no problem. but if you never hear my side and I can never get it out, like, that sucks. And that's just, you know, you couldn't control that at the time. Now, Logan, I would say, like, if you asked me a question, you know, I'd be very guarded about my

response. I'd give you what I want you to know as a journalist. That way you can't write anything else. Anything else would just be opinion. It wouldn't be factually based. And it would just be purely opinion pieces. And then I would also use my social media accounts or my platform if I had a pod to get my narrative out there.

And I wouldn't be condescending and demeaning to the media. That's counterproductive because, again, it's a relationship business. When you say that, like, what was your side versus what was put out there? Well, like my side is, you know, what had transpired between myself and the club leading up to the outburst in Philadelphia, right? Like all of the, you know, all of all of the help that I actually tried to give to the coach leading. up to when him and I just couldn't work together anymore. And none of that was depicted in the relationship, right? Like, this was just, the narrative was, I got salty because Gordon Hayward was now starting and I wasn't. And then I started, like, beefing with the coach. But that was, that was

absolutely not what happened. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, I was championing for Ty Corbyn. Like, I was a young black man in Salt Lake. I was aware when I walked around the streets that there weren't that many people that looked like me. I thought it was super dope that Ty got that job. So like, I was in the locker room trying to hold him down. Like I was that guy for a while. And then things started to happen behind the scenes that soured our relationship. Those were never told, right? And so the narrative in Utah was what it was. And that's that as a player can be frustrating. So I understand that. Can you be a more specific on this part, this part that you just said where you can't say anything? How does that feel where you're,

like, bro, y'all ain't telling the whole story, but I can't say that just yet. I have to wait 10, 12 years to do this on a podcast with Logan Murdoch, just wait on it. How do you, what does that look? What does that feel like? What does that feel like? You know, you kind of bury it. I mean, it's, there's no way to really feel about it. It's a little fucked up. Like, you, you know, shit, Logan, not for nothing. Like, I probably lost like another minimum contract on a team like as a good dude that I might have otherwise got because I wasn't a good dude anymore, right? Like the narrative around me had changed. Now I'm not- In your quotes, you weren't a good dude, right? I weren't a good dude, right? And now I'm not saying, like, look, I fucked up by what

I said to the coach. Like, I had as big a part of that as anybody, but I couldn't explain that. Like, there was no way, no one wanted to hear it. No one would write it. And it just was what it was. Like, and I was okay with that. I had to sleep at night feeling like, hey, man, like, pushed me to a limit that I just, I did what I felt was right and I can sleep at night. But I'm going to be, I'm going to keep it a buck. Like when I told the story the other day, like I was sitting outside having a beer later in the day. And it never really crossed my mind.

And I was sitting there and there was a level of satisfaction because I actually got to tell the fucking story. And I had never got to tell it. You know what I mean? Like no one had ever heard it except the people close to me. Got it. Well, do you feel like this is what, this is how I feel. And I feel like right now.

now in a way that it hasn't been in a while. I don't know if there is at least the, how am I going to say this? I don't know if there's at least a recognition that inherently both sides need each other, man. Like, we need y'all to, you know what I mean? We need y'all to do our jobs. And in large part, you guys need us to do your jobs, right?

Like, but I think that there has to be respect in that, right? Like, we have to tell your story, and there's a responsibility to telling your story, right? And then, on the other side, to get your message out, like, even with this player empowerment and social platform movement and all of that, y'all still need us, just like we need you guys, right? I don't feel like there is that recognition anymore. Is that fair? Or it's eroding. I feel like it's eroding. I think the relationship is getting more and more contentious.

think it's fair to say that it may be eroding a bit. I do think there's still some really solid relationships between players and journalists. You are absolutely correct. The whole thing, the whole industry works together. It works hand in hand. You know, players don't exist without owners. I mean, you do, but you don't have this platform to play in the NBA, right? The NBA isn't what it is without the fans. The fans have access and are engaged and get insight through the media. And so it all, look, it all just works hand in hand. And we all like, here's another thing, though. Like, I think this is even great point right now is like, yeah, you can have your player platform. But when you want to leak a trade to somebody, you're not going to do that on uninterrupted.

You're going to do that to your media pot and be like, yo, man, I'm trying to get up out of here. don't put my name on it, but like, yo, I request it. That's 100%. Like, you use the media, you need the media, and I'll take it a step further. And let's not even, I'm not going to say Kyrie in this. But let's use LeBron, for instance. Without the media, without the media, do you think LeBron is who LeBron is? I mean, LeBron would still be, have been the most gifted, like, physical specimen to come into the NBA.

But let's talk about, like, the media coverage that LeBron got since he was in, like, middle school. Do you know what I'm saying? Like the media coverage delivers you this. Now you have to hold up your end of the bargain. I don't mean to take anything away from LeBron. That's the furthest thing from what I'm trying to do. I'm just trying to say that that level of icon status takes like your ability and the media coverage of said ability working together to create what you have.

Yeah. And you're right in that instance, right? because media isn't just your local paper and beatwriter. It's ESPN. It is Warner Brothers who was in partnership with LeBron. Like LeBron, yes, LeBron is a multi-billion dollar entity, right? He is by himself. But he is partnering with a media company to do his, to do what he, to get his message out there.

If there was no media, he would just be a generational talent on a basketball court with no one. And that's just facts, right? But also, we need players like LeBron to market. And we are in this together no matter what, right? Like, if you, for any media, any guy that's trying to do, like, his own media brand, who does he partner with to get legitimacy? A media company. It just works hand in hand, man.

Like, I think that we just, I think we just need to, I think players need to recognize it. And to some extent, journalists need to recognize that, like, yo, we need each other. Well, let me ask you, because I've never been a journalist in a locker room looking to get a quote. Like, I've only been on the other side of that mic, right? So, are you beefing with Kyrie right now? Like, if you're, if you're, no, not right now is Logan Murdoch. But let's say you're walking, let's say you're on the Brooklyn Nets beat, right? Like, are you beefing because he's not doing media or are you like, look, man, my fucking don't want to talk?

Like, he's not going to talk. I mean, how do you guys feel? Some people are up in a, I've read some people's opinions on it. People are in their feelings on both sides for sure. I think if I was a beat writer, I don't know if I'd necessarily agree with him, but I at least would try to understand him, at least would make an effort to, which is also hard to do during COVID because, like, there's a bigger barrier right now between the media and players.

But say there was no COVID and I'm in the locker room, I would at least try to understand him. Like, yo, why do you feel this way? What have you read to get you to this point and this change? Is that a call? you make to his people? Do you grab him in the locker room? Like, I'm really interested in that, right? Because he's not giving any access. So how do you, how do you achieve that? So usually when I try to do it, like, I'll try to do it in a locker room, right? And I think that this is something that we're taught in general, um, as journalists, that's something that I've been taught is

you do not this is, that's a conversation you have without the recorder. You're like, yo, hey, what's up? Kyrie, doda, da, da, da, like at least try to maintain that relationship or at least try to cultivate a relationship where to where you can speak on authority what he's actually talking about, right? Right. Now, it's easier said that done sometimes because some dudes just don't want to talk.

Like, you go into a pre-game locker room and ain't nobody up in there, no one. And I think it's, and I'm not speaking on, Kyrie, I'm just speaking in general because he's not the only one that feels like that. Like, if you're never giving me an opportunity to get to know you, you can't be mad at me when all I'm working with all I have, right?

Yeah. That's fair, right? Like if I'm trying, if I'm going into the locker room pregame every time, and I'm not saying this, because I'm not in Brooklyn, I'm not saying this in regards to Kyrie, I'm just saying this in the general terms. I'm going in the locker room all the time, and I'm going to your charity events, and I'm going to the awards you get or whatever, all your events. I'm going there, and I'm trying to cultivate this relationship.

with you, and I'm trying to make sure at least your story is told fairly. Like, we don't have to agree on nothing, but at least I am making an effort to make sure that your story is told fairly, and you still just like, ah, just brushing me to the side, brushing me to the side. I can only go with what I see, and I can only go with what I'm, you know, with what's presented to me. That's all I can do. That's fair, right?

Because I'm trying to get to know you. No, it is fair because, again, you're describing a relationship, and that's a one-sided. relationship, right? Like you're making every effort you can make and someone is brushing you off. Like you're going to view things and write things from that perspective as the person who tried and the relationship wasn't like the the effort wasn't reciprocated. You know what I always did? And I like, I mean, I don't know. I thought it was helpful for me. You know, you get a cup of coffee as a player anywhere you want in an arena, right? I like to drink coffee. So I, you know, I could have asked a ballcade to get me coffee.

just about every place I went to and even on home games, I would go to the media room and get coffee. And I would go down there and I, you know, I'd meander around for five minutes or so. And it's early in the night. Like this is before, you know, this is with, I don't know,

an hour and a half on the clock. So I'm not taking away from anything the team's doing. But I'd be down there in a media room grabbing coffee. Like, you know, putting my fucking sugar and my whatever in it and just kind of talking shit with the journalists that were around. Like, you know what I mean? not in a, you know, but it was just you're putting, you're putting, you know, faces to people

outside of that locker room environment, right? And you're having a conversation that's not revolving around basketball right now, dude. I'm just here, you're here eating dinner before you got to work. And I'm here grabbing the coffee before I got to work. And we're just going to chop it up for, you know, I don't know, 30 seconds before we both go to our jobs. Those are relationship building things. What do you, this is something I want to ask you as a player. What do you look for in a journalists in terms of like fairness in terms of like because i i know players pay attention to us like you guys act like you don't but i i know i see you guys pay attention to the journalists that are working hard that are trying right at least for the most part but what do you look for

a journalist or someone that is that is covering you do you who gets the more respect in your book um let's see man for for local journalists i always appreciated somebody who you you know, asked me questions and had the relationship like you described before, where they would come to me and talk and they weren't asking me for anything, right? Like, I've had plenty of conversations with, you know, a Paul Coro in Phoenix or Brian Smith in, in Utah in different places where we're having conversations about what my kids are doing and stuff like that. Like, they're not asking me for anything.

There's no nugget that they're trying to, you know, unearth in the conversation that we're having. you know what I mean? And then, like, I always thought that went a long way for the trust building. And then, you know, I'm not stupid. So when you're asking me questions, I always appreciated someone who's asking me straightforward questions. Like, you're not trying to, you know, mask anything. There's no hidden agenda in what you're asking. And then thirdly, like, I know what I said to you. So, like, if I gave you a bunch of information to one point and you chose to use, like, one thing I said to another point to illustrate your point, like, then I know who you are, right? And Like, because you didn't really characterize, like, you, our conversation the right way. Like, you miss characterized the tenor of our conversation, right? So, like, those, you know, I don't know if I answered your question, but that's kind of how I figured out, like, who I like to be around and who I didn't. And so I think I think you're saying, like, not somebody that's just, that just comes around for the scrums or whatever, right? Like, it just comes around. You don't really know them like that, but they do come in, you know, tap in with you before the game or maybe tapping what you after.

See, like, yo, man, how's the family doing it? do, da, da, right? No doubt. At least understand you. No doubt. But no, everyone else in that scrum that you just describe has the job to do. So when you get up in front of me, like, and I'm getting, like, I got my clothes on and I'm standing up to do my interview, you know, I will certainly answer everyone's

questions. But I'm not going to be as forthright. This takes me back to what I'm saying about Kyrie. Like, I'll give you honest answers about what happened in the game, but I might not bear to you, like, exactly what's on my mind because I don't know what you're going to do with that. Do you understand what I'm saying? Like, the relationship guys are who I would give a little bit more to because,

I trust that you know me. You know that even if I say something like derogatory in the midst of all kind of glowing shit that I, for the most part, am happy about what's taking place and you're not just going to print the one thing I said negative. Okay, now you did touch on another point that sometimes I get, and some journalists get a little annoyed with, right?

Like, at least local journalists, that they put in all this work, that they are, you know, like that they're trying to cultivate this relationship with players and stuff like that. And it seems like it's going good, right? But then when like the big stuff pops off that you're all supposed to leak or whatever,

y'all don't hold us down, all right? That's another annoying thing that we feel like. Like, yo, man, why don't you just hold us down? Like, we've been here. Like, I don't know if you realize the stuff that jerk, we don't go on the charter jets. We do the layover joints and stuff like that. we have it hard to follow y'all all around the country.

And sometimes we just feel like, yo, man, I'm not saying specifically you, but I'm saying players in general, right? Like, yo, man, we holding you down. We've written these things about you. We have always been fair. We obviously haven't been, like, glowing all the time, but we've been fair to you. And we've gone to all your events.

And then, like, yo, somebody, you don't give us, like, the little inside scoop that you just give somebody else that's maybe deemed higher than them. Yeah, listen, I can appreciate that that's a shitty feeling, man. And that's a, you know, I maybe couldn't have, but I told you this, and I set it off air. Like, look, man, Sean Marks and Steve Nash, I was on the phone with them about a possible job in Brooklyn for a long fucking time. I held that information as a journalist, right? Because that's what I do now forever.

Like, I wasn't allowed to say shit about it. I wasn't allowed to talk about like anything, right? And then, you know, I did lightway feel some kind of way. I'm like, damn, dog. Like, y'all wouldn't even let a brother break the news. I've been holding your secret for fucking two months. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, you won't even let me break it.

You know, I got a pod. So I now know how that feels. I don't have a good answer as to why it happens except. Hey, Roger, though, check this out, though. Hey, bro, if you ever have a coaching gig, I'm looking you dead in the face right now. Don't do me how they did you. Don't do me and Sasha how they did you.

Fair. I think that's fair. And do unto others as you would have them do on to you, right? Just saying. All right. Well, for sure, man. Let's take a quick break. We're going to talk about you'll find out.

And we're back. And I want to talk about something interesting that was said over the weekend last week about with Janus Adetakumbo. He said some very interesting things in regards to his extension. He said, I'm not focused on that. My agent and Bucks General Manager and the Buc's ownership are focusing on those discussions. But I'm focused on myself. How can I get better?

How can I help my teammates get better? How can we be ready Saturday to play our first free season game? That was interesting, Roger Bell. Yeah, yeah. It was very interesting because that is the first time, I'm not saying, I'm not speculating that Janice is going to leave and he's going to get traded. He's going to be on another team. He very well can sign that ridiculous extension that he's on the table right now, right?

What I, what is noteworthy to your boy, and that's me, I'm your boy. What's noteworthy to me is this is something way different than what he's been saying all along, right? And it's interesting because it seems like this is the exit playbook for a star player that he's on. And I'm not saying that he's going to leave. I'm not saying that he's going to leave. I'm just saying it's very noteworthy. And let me tell you what I have seen over the years with star players that have ultimately left. First, they start saying, well, first, there's an initial story that leaks.

Right? That is, if such and such doesn't want a title or isn't competing for a title, then I want to leave, that I'm going to explore my options in free agency. Now, Yonis had that. He, I don't know if he leaked it, but there was a leak story to Malika Andrews of ESPN in 2019 about Janus potentially, like, if there's not a championship, I'm going to leave, or I'm going to be going to talk about leaving. So that happens.

Then said superstar denies the initial report. and saying, what are you talking about? My heart is always in this city. I'm always here. I'm here. I am such and such for, not for life, but this is my team and this is where I want to be. This is where I want to retire, right? Then the years go by, right?

And then it's like, then they re-up and they say, it's not as quite as strong, but they say, yeah, man, I'm not talking about that. I want to be here, as Janus did after the bubble to Chris Haynes of Yahoo Sports. Said I wanted to be here, right? That's my dude, Chris Haynes's good dude. Shout out to Fresno. Good dude. Shout out to Fresno.

And then after that, then that happens. And then you get a quote like this from Yonan, from that Yonis just had. It's like, oh, I'm not sure. That's between management and my agent. I'm not, like I said, I'm not saying he's about to go. It's just very, very noteworthy that he's saying this because this is the same playbook we've heard from a guy. like Dwight Howard, from a guy like Paul George,

from a guy like, even a LeBron James, who has just been like, you know, this is where I was, or LeBron, like, was way more calculated.

This is where I am right now. We'll see what happens. I think he did it perfectly, right? And then most recently, Kevin Durant, who also played the LeBron and was like,

oh, I'm just testing free agency. We'll see what happens. Either way, it always, whenever you're, there's doubt, if somebody casts doubt,

nine times out of 10, that that player is leaving. What do you think? It sounds like you're saying, like, while you're trying to, like, straddle the fence, it sounds like you're saying everything about the, like, the arc of his comments suggests that he's, that he is on the way out of Milwaukee. It sounds like that's what you're saying. I mean, I didn't, I don't have any. I'm saying this playbook has been used. I don't know if he's leaving them. So if he's following this playbook, then we're up out of Milwaukee. Right. Um, first of all, I would, I would, like, What would a guy say who was having some reservations or concerns about what's taking place around him that would be satisfactory?

Like, what could he say that wouldn't be, like short of saying, no, this is it. I'm in, I'm in Milwaukee. I'm locked in. Like, you guys have me for life. I don't know what a guy could say that would have people feel at ease, right? It's not what he could say. It's what he could do, which is sign of extension. Sign an extension.

But like you have leverage only when you don't sign the extension right away, right? Like, so you, once you sign the extension, you're in. And so that brings me to the next, the next question I have is, or the next point I would make, teams do that shit all the time too. Like a team would tell you in a media, I'm not trading Logan. Logan is not available. Logan will not be in any deals that we make. Logan, in the back end, y'all like, hey, Logan, what y'all want for Logan?

Yeah, what can we get for Logan, right? And as soon as that, as soon as that meets your demand, Logan is on the damn move. And so, like, you know, it's a two-way street. And a further step in that conversation would be, like, a team doesn't have any loyalty to a player. They don't. They don't. They can tell you what they want.

They have no loyalty. So I'm always going to be on team like Megastar for sitting around and holding people's feet to the fire to put the pieces in place that they think they need to win. because a team, given the opportunity, I mean, I don't know what a good name is for Janus right now. Like, I don't know what a good name is for that. But, like, if you think if Milwaukee was offered, I don't know, A.D. and Damien Lillard in some sort of sign-and-trade deal where the pieces could shuffle. You think Milwaukee is going to hold on to Janus?

That's pretty tough, man. That's tough. I'm just saying it probably. I don't know. That's tough. Okay. Maybe I made it tougher than it should be. I don't know if you trade.

I don't know if you trade. How about this? How about this? You could get AD and LeBron for Janus. Let's make it a clearer picture for you. Oh, yeah, for sure. Right. But my overall point, and I didn't execute it well, was, like, a team, once they get

something better than they think you are, they're moving you, right? Like, they're going to move you. It's what it is. Once they get a good enough deal. That happened with, I don't know the year, but with Blake Griffin, when they traded his ass to Detroit, he had just signed a big deal in L.A. and as soon as the, I think as soon as his, I don't know what you want to call it, as soon as he was eligible to get traded, they traded his ass out of town.

So it happened. That's Blake Griffin. That's Blake Griffin. I mean, so anyway, man, I guess, I mean, Janus could, in fact, be executing the playbook. Do you agree with you agree? I do. Oh, yeah. Listen, anything short of a dude, again, anything short of a dude saying, no, I'm locked in,

let me sign that. You have to be concerned. Like, you have to have, I mean... So what do you do as a front office then? If somebody is like, yo, I don't know. Are you just on pins and needles? Because I feel like this is when the desperation move start happening when you get the wild trades and you get the... Like, why does he fit on the team?

Oh, because we thought the superstar just left us wanted him. Like, that's when... I think your lines of communication. Your lines of communication with his representation and therefore with him, that being Janus, would need to be, you know, wide open and very active. so that you're not just taking wild swings as a franchise to get pieces that don't move the needle for him, right? Like, we talk a lot about, like, do you run something by LeBron? Well, you better because if you do some dumb shit and LeBron is like, that doesn't move the needle for me,

you just did some dumb shit and it didn't help you with LeBron, right? So you got to be like bouncing shit off the wall with representation. Yeah, what's it Janus feel like with that? Like, we got a chance to get, you know, Logan or Rajat. Does Janus like either one of those? No, he doesn't? All right, we'll keep digging. And then you got to be forthright with them.

Like, look, I know you guys have a, like our feet to the fire here. You guys have the leverage. We understand that. We're committed to building around Janus, provided we can do it responsibly. But we also don't want to put ourselves in a situation that if Janus walks, we're left here, like, in a situation that we can't rebuild from. So, like, we have to be responsible, too. And so I do think you have to have some real good communication and forthrightness from both sides behind closed doors. It doesn't have to play out in the media.

to make sure that everybody, you know, kind of gets what they want in a situation like that. How is it for a player that is a potential free agent and you see a guy and you're like, yo, man, I'm thinking about signing in Milwaukee, woo, but there's that uncertainty with Yannis, right? Do you take the one-year deal to potentially win a chip or do you take that security and you're just going to be in Milwaukee for two, three years? How do you, how do you do that? Well, I think that depends on who you are, what kind of deal you're. you're getting, right? Like, if you're a player like I was the first time I was in Utah where I hadn't

made a lot of money and it was going to be a big contract for me, I don't know that that would really, really deter someone for going out and get in their first bag, like the one that's going to set them up. You know what I'm saying? If you're a player that has made some good money. Yeah, if you're a player that's, yeah, your player that's made some good money or you're another star, like that it becomes really important what Janus is doing because that's, you know, you're going there more for the chance to win a championship than for the back. So, again, it's communication, Logan. Like, it can be an uneasy situation.

Like, dog, I don't, like, you know, like Milwaukee's high on my list. Do you pick up the phone and hit Janus's people and be like, yo, man, like, I'm just trying to figure this out. Like, should I try to win your deal here? Should I go? Like, what's your plan? Do you do that? No doubt.

Like, if I, if I'm trying to win a championship and I'm in the twilight, not twilight, but maybe I got some tread left on the tire, but, you know, I'm trying to, I'm trying to be on a team winning the championship. I am certainly, if I'm going a two-year deal, going to call Janice or ask the front office, yo, I need to holl at Janus. Like, can I speak to him? Like, let's go through back channels if I don't have his number

and be like, yo, what do you thinking, Pimpin? Like, I need to know, bro, because I can go here, here and here. I want to come here, you know, but I need to know that we're going to be having a chance to win that. And that's fair. So ultimately, like I said, I don't know if he's going to leave. But how do you feel? So is this a playbook of him leaving or this is a playbook for leverage and ultimately he just signs a deal?

I think Yonis stays in Milwaukee. I think he wants to make sure that he does his part to keep them on the hook for adding pieces around him and building that team the right way. So I think ultimately Yonis stays in Milwaukee and this is just a play to make sure he gets what he needs. I'm going to go strong. I don't know. Yeah. I didn't know that we were able to hedge our bets like that. I would have said I don't know too.

But, Oh, wait, do you want me to do it? Do you want me to go in? Well, motherfucker, you got me giving the answer

like, I don't know. Like, I don't know. I say he leaves. He leaves. Like, that's where,

I mean, that's where your heart was when we started this segment, I could tell. And that's okay. He might. No, no,

no, no, but again, he said no. You said no. You said no. You said no. I say he stays.

I say he says. You say he's fucking says. I say he's, I think he's going to leave. And that's just, you want to put some on it? That's just based on his actions. All right. All right.

So we're here. Like, what you got on? Dinner. Dinner. Dinner. Dinner. Dinner. Dinner.

When I come to Florida, if he leaves, then, you know, dinner on you. If I come, when I come to Piedmont, we're going to my, my sushi spot at the bottom of the hill. What's the sushi spot? What's the sushi spot? What's going to? I don't remember the name of it was right at the bottom of the hill I lived in on in Piedmont. It was beautiful.

The geosia was phenomenal. Like it was, yes, tough. I told you about it. I got a sushi spot in Pemont. I got a sushi spot in Piedmont that's kind of fire. Shout out Simeju. What was it called? It's called Shemizu.

Okay. All right. It's on Pimai. It's right across the street from St. Leo's. I don't know how long you were there. I don't even know how long you were there. I don't know if Piedon that well.

But, you know, they got some great sushi. It's a bet. It's a bet. It's a bet. All right, cool. I want to talk about Talon Horton. You want to talk about Talon Horton? You want to talk about him?

Is that what you want to do? talk about him. I just, I wanted to talk about preseason games. And he was, he was, he's the story of the preseason right now.

Okay. Talon Horton Tucker out here bawling. He had, he had like 30 fucking strip kawai was bawling out in preseason. And the clippers look like shit. And I just want to know like,

does this mean anything, Roger Bell? No. Why doesn't it mean anything? All right. It's just two part. I just want to know on a real level because of NBA. And there's a lot of fans out there who were like,

yo, My favorite player just scored 15 points. I know he's going to be at the end of the best during the season, but like he could be the future. Look, I got into a preseason again. After that 2001 run with the Suns, hop back out in the preseason. A, I had a late surgery on his elbow.

Aaron McKee had a surgery on his knee. Eric Snow had a surgery on something else. So all those guard minutes were speedy, speedy clasting. Sixers, right? Sixers, yes, 2002 preseason. Speedy Claxton and yours truly. We were out there having a blast, getting buckets like we were about to take over the starting back court for the Philadelphia 76ers. I hung 21 on MJ, the first time I ever played him in Penn State in State College with my grandmama in the front row talking cash shit.

Like, yeah. Larry Brown, put it back in the game, son. Like put it back in the game. And I'm out there getting it. Was Graham's the mad rapper? Was she out here just like, yo, man? Grams is still doing it and still the mad rapper. But anyway, point was, I didn't know at the time, and I found out very quickly once the regular season started, that they're not even close to being the same intensity level or tuned-endedness, if that's not a word, but I made it up.

From regular NBA rotational players, they're just not taking it as serious. And so while I had 21 in that game and had a really good preseason, two weeks later, I played the Wizards in Washington. and I played like three minutes and could barely enter a ball into the post because everybody's level of play was stepped up and mine was the same as it wasn't in the preseason. Were you talking shit in preseason? Were you talking shit in preseason? Do they have it out on you?

No, I didn't know. I wasn't talking shit. I don't talk shit. Grandma, Nanny was talking shit, bro. I probably remember Graham's talking shit. Nanny was talking shit. But so what I'm saying is you realize really quickly once you've been around the block in preseason and then that regular season hits that you're dealing with a different level of intensity,

a different level of focus, a different level of game planning from your opposition. Everything is enhanced. And then I could say the same thing, Logan, from the first time you go from a regular season to your first playoff game, like that is startling too, because it even becomes more heightened

and every possession matters even more and guys are scrapping for balls that they wouldn't ordinarily scrap for in the middle of February, right? So it just levels up. every time you get to another, like from preseason to regular season to playoffs. Now I'm looking at the timeline. You, you don't be on Twitter. You're not on, you're not really outside with it, but it's cool. So I'm looking on the timeline.

And it's the Lakers, so you know everything is magnified. And they are talking about, man, Kuzma going to get up out of here, man. Like, you better, you know, you better get in gear or like Lakers have found their third star. I'm going to just, I'm just going to put a name on. it. Jomey on our social team. It was just really just out here, really just talking cash shit about how Talon is going to be out here. The next great, like the next Byron Scott.

And you know what I mean? Just really just out here, just putting 10 on two. Also, Jomey, I saw you in the group chat player. You was out here talking cast shit about Talon being the guy. Like the second coming of Kobe. Damn. Okay. And my

question to you is, are the Clippers going to remember this? Because he took the ball away from from from from kawai they're they're panning lebron out her and lebrons out her tweeting i told you all about little bro he cold you know what i mean is this going to come back and bite talent in the ass i don't know that it's going to bite talent in the ass the clippers are definitely to remember it i mean kawai we're talking about one of the best players in the game right now i mean i'm not taking anything away from talent talent talent might be um really really nice uh He already put his jersey in the stable center rafters.

Oh, yeah, Kauai, right. Kauai is Kauai is Kauai. So yes, Kauai is going to remember it, whether the clippers can do something about it or not, I don't know. What I would say to, like, Jomi and anybody else that's telling Kuz, he needs to watch his back. Kuz is what, like a three-year vet now? Yeah.

Just won a championship. Whether you thought he lived up to the role that you guys had in your minds for him when he first came into the league or not as besides the point, he played a good role on that Lakers championship team. He's not going to be out there in preseason, scrapping and clawing and trying to score 30 in those games. Those games are for the Talents of the world to impress on the club that they deserve to be rotational players.

Kyle Kuzma already is one. So, you know, I don't read anything in to Talon's performance as it pertains to Kyle Kuzma. Now, for talent, pretty fucking cool. Like, you're out there, you're getting buckets like you were drafted um you didn't play a lot last year clearly their player development out there with phil handy and company is real and so maybe you're ready shout out phil phil hilly phil is that dude um but but you know for him those are meaningful minutes meaningful buckets

i don't think that they mean shit to kail kuzma and whether or not he's gonna be on a team he's six he's a six four like scoring guard kail kuzma's what six eight wing player like rangy you know like they're two different animals um but pretty cool story for talent Horton. Okay. Okay. I'm glad we, you know, glad we did this because, you know, there was a little excitement in the pre-in-the-pre-you should, you should have some excitement for the young fellow. Like, I'm cool with that. Like, I think, look, if I was out there scoring 30 in the preseason, I'd be feeling pretty good. He's chest up in LeBron. He's out here just like. Life is good. Yeah. Only thing that would make it better is if fans were there. Like, that would have made it better.

He would have been like the toast of the town in LA. He can't really do nothing with this right now. And he's 20. So. Yeah, that sucks. You know. And also push it. So with that argument, should we take stock into Kevin Durant and John Wall out here balling off Achilles in the preseason? Because John Wall played really well in Chicago. And I didn't look like a guy that was coming off in Achilles tear. And same with Kevin. Like I saw some highlights of Kevin last night.

Play pretty well. Yeah, that's a good question. It's a different. If I were watching those guys play in the preseason, I didn't see. either one of them play. I wouldn't be necessarily looking to see if they got buckets, if they got numbers, because again,

I'm telling you that the level of play isn't going to be the same as they see in the regular season. I'd be just be looking to see, like, where they fluid, like did they have a hitch in their giddy up, where they explosive, like those type of things, right? Because both of those guys, if they have their legs under them and stuff,

they've already proven what they're going to be able to do. You're looking to see how far Achilles tear, medicine, rehab, and surgeries have come. How far that procedure in the rehab has come? Has it made the same strides as ACL tears have made? Has it said, you know, because, you know, the last time, you really remember a significant one was probably who, Dominique in the NBA?

Kobe, Kobe, you know, there could be a lot of... Kobe was never the same. Kobe was never the same. But Kobe was also how old when he tore his Achilles? Like 30. He was like a year, what, 60? 17, 70? Something like, he was, he was up there. Yeah, right. So, I mean, have you made strides in the last however many years with that

type of procedure and that type of rehab? And do those guys look like they're moving smoothly, fluidly, and they have a little bit of fast twitch that they're going to be able to play with? Yeah, that's fair. I was impressed with Kevin and John off of Achilles. impressed with talent to but I just want to you know let's temper expectations a little bit you know what I mean

it was two months after you guys just got out of the bubble clippers aren't sharp yet like you know it's cool um yeah man that's what you get Jomey that's cool

he's talking to you Jomey Jomey if Jomey if Jomey you'd like to defend your position I think we both welcome Jomey right like if he wants to come on in if Jomey wants to come on like it's good like you know what I mean we'll talk to the right people

you know we'll talk to his people see if he can. Because I think we're both saying he needs to pump brakes, right? I mean, that's what we're saying, essentially. I think he needs to pump breaks. Pump breaks. You know what I mean? A lot of Laker Nation needs to pump the brakes right now.

It's game two of the preseason. Well, it was a good little week, man. It was good to talk to you. Yeah, dog. I'm going to go throw some aloevira on my little sunburn, you know? Okay. You know what I mean? Florida problems.

You know what I mean? You know what I mean? All right, man. Well, that was another edition of the real ones. Make sure you tap in with us on Spotify, wherever you get your podcast. Make sure you tap in to some other podcast on the Ringer, like the Ringer NBA show with the mismatch who has its own feed

and also group chat. And also, we have another new show on the feed, Raja, with Chris Ryan. He has a Friday show. It's really dope. You guys should go tap in with that. Also, Ringer NFL show. Listen to that.

Listen to the Ringer music show with my guy, Charles Holmes. Okay? Listen to R2C2 with Vallejo legend. C.C. Sabathia. Listen to C.C. To get you ready for the first is with E40 and two short. All right? We'll go see you later this week. Hala.