The Ringer NBA Show - Ep. 16: Game 7 Reaction

Episode Date: June 20, 2016

The Ringer's Chris Ryan, Juliet Litman, and Tate Frazier discuss Game 7 of the NBA Finals, where the teams go from here, LeBron James's transcendent performance, and more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I'm Chris Ryan. I'm Tate Frazier. The Warriors are now owners of all the most important records in NBA history. They have the great ignominy of being the only team to lose in the finals after being up 3-1. Happy summer, people. The NBA season is over. Guys, what a game last night. I feel like first off, I got to face the music.

Kyrie, I was wrong. We were so wrong. Kyrie. It's our fault. We dug his grave too early. No, but I was just like, this dude is not an all-star. Yeah. And now Kyrie is just, he's an NBA champion.

And when LeBron was obviously conserving his energy down the stretch, I feel like he very smartly, here's my vision. LeBron saw what the end of the game was going to be. He knew that he was going to need to have like incredible feats of athleticism down the stretch. And I feel like that's when he was passing to Richard Jefferson, letting Kyrie take all the shots, trying to get other people involved, try to stretch the defense. And Kyrie did it, man.

He was there. Yeah, he was there for it. Kyrie, it seemed like he couldn't miss. 17 second half points. That's insane. Kyrie Irving. I couldn't believe it. Like, when he had 12 in the third quarter, I was like, that's Kyrie's 12.

Yeah. That was like his big moment. Like, that's his third quarter. He's not doing anything else. And of course, I should never say these things in my head about Duke people. Because they come back and just haunt me. But he, yeah, he played incredible. Do you think he should have been the MVP?

Yeah. Well, I mean, well, no. No. I mean, there's no way he would be the MVP, but he had an incredible game. Let's stop this. Let's stop this. It's boring, but we're here. He's the best.

LeBron is the best. He is the best in the league. He has been the best in the league for a long time. 13 years. Yeah, a decade. He was so far and away the best player on the planet during the season. And during the series and during the postseason. Those playoffs, he was incredible.

He's just been, I've never seen anybody to play basketball like this. And he was even making threes. Like, and his whole. whole like up until the finals, like his postseason run was that he was great, but he had changed his game. If he was making threes, they just wouldn't need to play the game. Yeah. Yeah. And like that dude right there, yeah, he's probably going to win every title. He like, clearly heard everything everyone was saying about Steph. He just was keeping in his mental drawer all season long and he was just like, no, fuck you. I'm here. I'm the best. It was pretty

cool to watch his greatness. Do you blame or do you knock Steph at all for not responding to the, not responding to the challenge? I can't believe he didn't respond to the challenge. Really? I have not come to grips. I still can't believe that it happened the way that it happened. And I really thought that Steph or Clay, I thought one of them, they both no-showed. Jermann was incredible. Jermont was amazing.

He was incredible. He was like the one who deserved to win. Like he really did. That was a great game last night. He carried them. The reason they were even close in the first half is because of him. The reason they were in the situation in the first place because you punched the bra on the ball. That's a great life lesson.

Don't punch someone in the balls because it'll come back to honor you. Several times. kicked out last night too. Yeah. kicked out of Kyrie on the ground. In the final second. I'm sure it's compulsive. Like,

I'm sure he doesn't have a ton of, he's just playing in a way that provokes that kind of behavior. But, like, still, man, I mean, like, he could have gotten teed up for that. It was really amazing. Where do you think both these teams go from here? Like,

we were so ready to trade Kevin Love. Does Kevin Love stay with the Cavs now? Well, I think that the Cavs have actually now a little bit of house money to play with. I think the bigger question is, you have to imagine like I was watching LeBron

at the end of the game last night and I was like he looks so tired just probably coming down off the adrenaline of the last three quarters and he brought it back up again but you could see in his reaction this is the culmination of something that when you think about it

this is the culmination of his entire career is to win this championship that he's ever looked for yeah so what do you do next if you're him and can you retire? No but would you I wouldn't leave he's not retiring you're not going to leave Cleveland

but like Lebron I could does Lebron going to play like 30 minutes a game next year, 20, 28 minutes a game next year? Like, when does he cycle down a little bit? Does he cycle down? Cycle off. Who knows?

Kyrie's 24, so he's basically like, Kyrie, you've had this moment. You've basically proven you can be on the big stage. Here's the keys, and I'll take them back on the next big time, you know? Like next year where they're in the finals again, given the East being so bad, like, he'll turn it up. But the regular season, why would he kill himself? He did this year. He coasted.

He's kind of ready to like enter his Dwayne Wade face. like Dwayne Wade takes off a couple games here and there. I don't know, he could. I would understand that. One thing I noticed when he was passing out of the post last night is a lot of it seemed like he was just trying to avoid getting hacked. Like, not only is he conserving his energy, but also, like, avoiding getting attacked.

Because they can't really stop him except to, like, basically, like. And he would play on the far, sometimes he would go to the corner, the far corner from love in some plays where Kyrie would be up at the top of the key. Yeah. Man, there was just so many incredible things. If I was, the Cavs are going to lose, RJ is retiring. Yeah, get out before he gets, drug tested.

Probably. Congrats Richard Jefferson. He's got a title, man. Yeah. That's incredible. Yeah. NBA champion Richard Jefferson. Probably lose Moscoff.

Yeah. Moe Williams probably wrapping things up soon, I would think. Probably. We hope James Jones can finally retire. Like, James Jones, just go. That dude's got three rings. Yeah, retire, man. You did it, James.

He's not a great career. Yeah, you did it. So let me ask you guys this. Do you think that if Kevin Love is playing against the Thunder or the Spurs, he's more effective in these finals? I don't know why he wasn't. Well, I think for him a really big turning point was Bogot being out. And just because, like, he started out really,

rebounding really well in the first quarter, which I think was a lot big result of Bogot not being there. And that just kind of changed things for him. So I actually don't think he plays better against the Thunder. Maybe this burst. But I think, like, he's not athletic enough to stick with the Thunder. I don't know what his trade value is. I feel like he's still in the block,

but I don't know what people, like Cleveland doesn't have to trade him. So I feel like people will give them offers that aren't that great, and then they can just say no now because they're naming a champions. Yeah, it's really like his trade value is whatever Cleveland wants to do next. Exactly. If Cleveland wants a like for like, like another second tier star,

I don't know who they could get. You wouldn't do Butler for love. You know what I mean? Like you wouldn't you wouldn't do... I think his shooting being so much worse, there's just a testament to how his knees are. Like, yeah. I think that's probably why he's just not shooting as well as he was like three years ago, right?

This is also the longest season he's ever played. Right. That's crazy. That's so, Kyrie too, right? That's so wild for both of them. And the monkeys off their back now. Like, they can almost, like, the pressure is not on Kevin Love. He's like, I don't have to win a championship from a Brown. They can have like a spurs season where they go, they win like 50 games next season in the regular season and just be chill.

You know what I mean? Like they do the season? They give me the two seats. It doesn't matter. Yeah, sure. It was really wild just seeing them all so happy. J.R. Smith was so moving. Oh my God.

His speech about his parents and his tears. That was the best. part about the finals that J.R. Smith won. Yeah. And I, well, so what do you guys think? It was funny, it was Juliet and I watched the game together and she was like, right before the game started, I think you were like, I'm kind of cheering for the Warriors, right? But then as the game went on, I think that it just became like kind of a cosmic. It was really cool. Sort of like, this has to happen. You can't have LeBron have that block and have them not be rewarded. You can't have Kyrie make that shot against Steph and not

have them be rewarded. You can't have Kevin Love play that defense against Steph at the end of the game. You can't have JR go back to back threes. There was that one second where Clay and Steph hit back to back threes. And it was like, oh, it's about to happen. They're about to win by nine. Every time that you thought it was going to turn, it was like LeBron, he refused to let it turn, just because he was the best player on the floor. Yeah. And also they just

they didn't get psyched out. I was thinking about that. Like, composed to the Thunder, who just beat themselves, basically, the cat, like, LeBron would not let that happen to the Cavs. And I was rooting for the Warriors, like, out of like a completest, like, kind of compulsion. Like, okay, they wore 73 and nine, like, let's just bookend this season.

Yeah. But, LeBron, like, watching LeBron and, like, this performance in the playoffs is just amazing. And, I mean, I'm really happy for them. Yeah, I was kind of touring around with this idea about how, like, we thought that the Warriors were going to be the Bulls. Right. But they're actually, they're actually, they're actually going to be, like, a really

competitive team that's always in the mix for the next eight years or whatever, however long Steph and Clay or effective or however long that. Curry's like a dunking character. I mean, obviously, this is the caveat here is if they get Durant, like, all bets are off. We'll come back to that in a second. We'll come back to that, but this idea basically that the Warriors, I think we thought that they were going to be this dynasty. Yeah, and I still think that they're historically great team.

But they're not a dynasty. But when you shrink it down to the last two minutes, anything can happen. Right, absolutely. Who do you think is the biggest loser of the Warriors organization, other than Lake Up who looks so stupid? Like, who's the biggest player loser? Yeah, like who is this like the toughest for?

I think that... I mean, Dremont clearly looks the best, I think, you know? Yeah. Losing him turned the series, even if he's like, you know, doing pulling crazy shit. He, I think, had a great game last night. He's the one who rose to the occasion. It's tough. I don't want to see this, but I'm going to say Steph.

I think it's tough too. He did not have a good playoffs. And even the secondary question there is like, then Steph needed to be better about shaping his own narrative in this postseason. He needed to almost be like, I really screwed up my elbow when I went for that loose ball and my knee is screwed up. playing on like a bad left knee and a bad elbow and I'm doing my best and I'm Willis reading it out here but he kind of didn't say that they never said that and I respect them

for not using the injury as a crutch or anything but that was the game at there was the game was right there for him to win yeah and he didn't win tristan Thompson being able to guard him off the dribble Kevin loved being able to guard him off the dribble I mean it was deflating like I've watched Steph since he was like 19 years old and I've I've I've I I was so shocked last night. The whole time I was like, he's gonna hit. Even when Kyrie hit the three, I was like, Curry may come down and hit a three and get fouled.

And so like, I just kept thinking something was going to happen. But you saw it. He deflated when Kyrie hit that shot. Kierre hit the shot and hip checked him a little bit on the way. Like, inadvertently hip checked him. Yeah. And Steph kind of like jumped away.

And you could see like, he's just like, I'm so tired of getting hit. Like you could just see him just be like, almost like I want this to be over. I'm sure that's not what he was thinking. Yeah. But it looked like he was just like, did that guy look like he was like, I'm coming right back down.

I'm putting this one out of your throat. No, he did it. He never had that mentality the whole time, and LeBron was in a whole different world. And he wasn't there. And that was exactly what LeBron wanted. He wanted to show that he was on a different level and he did. Yeah. He's really the best.

There hasn't really been a staff breakout game in so long, like I think since April, at least. I mean, I know he was hurt and everything. But the Warriors, I think, going for their record makes, I mean, it just, that has to take so much focus and then winning a championship obviously takes so much focus too. Does any of the bloom come off the Steve Kerr rose for you? I thought you were going to ask about Clay to which the answer is definitely no. That's a pointless question. Clay's still fine. I think I said it earlier. There's nothing you could do to lose me. No, I don't think so with Steve Kerr. I think not even just dying on the Festus Hill. I mean, Verrajao too. The Verrajao, I don't, I would have stuck with Festus over Berrajao. Vergeau is

really not good. I feel like he fuels them. He doesn't want to play in their offense though. I think the Cavs like love when Verrajad is out there because like look at this guy who's going to flop. Like you're able to point the officials like look at him flopping. It turns the tide against the warriors. Definitely did that.

The visuals are like this guy's annoying. I don't want to give him the benefit of the doubt. I think that the thing with Carr is you just realize how influence he is by Pop because his coaching performance was very much. I think Pop would have done stuck with his system. Yes. I think Zach and Kevin Arnavitz were talking about pulling Barnes and how that's like a pop. That was like the pop hook. like on Saturday they did a podcast and they were like

yeah like when you yank somebody because they passed up an open three but you'll play play through your misses but yeah but you play but you won't like you won't play scared you'll play a scared player yeah that like he clearly is so influenced by his coaching his coaching style speaking of losers we were talking about the losers for the warriors I mean Harrison Barnes I mean rough after the game four when he had a great game

and hit a bunch of big shots it looked like he was going to be fine and maybe even get like his contract settled before the season, you know, into the season, get his contract, be ready for next season, go for the 3P, that was kind of the narrative. And now you look at it, it's like, what are the warriors going to do there?

Are they going to let Harrison walk and Festus walk or take their big deals elsewhere? But like who are they going to assign to replace those guys? There aren't like wings that are 3 and D that are Harrison size and 6-8. Right, and you have to wonder whether or not Iguidala can sustain the level of play he can. Especially getting beaten down by LeBron two years in a row.

But, like, yeah. I mean, he arguably, I mean, Iguodalo is one of the best players on the Warriors, I thought, like both ways. Most reliable. Yeah. But you need somebody who's younger and who's, you have to plan for the future. That's a threat. That's a threat. Yeah.

It's true. All of a sudden, they look really vulnerable. Like, they'll be contenders, but like they said they're not the dynasty. It's pretty amazing how quickly that changed. Overnight, it can change. Yeah. I think I was really mentally preparing myself as we were coming into this finals, especially. more like when we were going into the Western Conference finals.

And even though Steph was coming off the injury, I was like preparing myself for three years of this. Like I'm preparing myself to feel like the way I did when the Bulls were going and when the Lakers were going. And it just felt like what's the point of even having a season? If you're Michael Jordan, are you happy about this out of time? So happy. Scottie Pippett is.

Oh, Michael Jordan. Pippen already chirping up on radio about, really? What do you say? Just you got to end it with a ring. Doesn't count. Yeah. Michael Jordan, this is the best thing that could have happened for him.

He had Russell Westbrook on a huge 10. like basically Red Curry. That's his number one guy on the Jordan brand. He's like, that's a plus for me. Thank you, Russell Westbrook. Goes to the main stage. LeBron knocks off this team that would have basically surpassed his team.

You know, like he's fine with that. Also, you forgot the most important thing, which is crying Jordan's been replaced by the chef curry low sneakers. So, congrats, Michael. You won. You won this round. So if you are Steph, let's just have a hypothetical here. And you definitely just take.

You've definitely been knocked down a peg or two, right? LeBron showed a supremacy. You weren't able to... I think this is a worst case scenario. So here's my question. Do you want Durant? Because in some ways we were looking at Durant going to the Warriors and it was like, why would Durant do that?

Why would Durant give up the chance to be the alpha dog and to win a title on his own with Russ? Yeah. But if you're Steph, are you kind of like admitting like I need another guy here? I mean, you already won the title. you have lots of ride out on, but I don't know. If I'm Steph, I want to show that I can do it next year with just me and Clay and the guys that we have.

Right. I want another shot, just the same way that the Spurs did. Right. But does he want barn? Like, that's the thing. That'll be the, like, does the ownership want Harrison back? Like, that's who he, that's, it's either going to be Harrison or Durant. Like, this is where Lakeb comes into play.

Yeah. Right. It's like, what does ownership want? And if Steph is like, I don't want Kevin Durant, I want this team. And they get Durant anyway. then like what does that do to Steph? Because that's basically saying we don't believe that you can do it.

It's so hard for you to imagine Durant and Golden State. Is that crazy? I just like, you know, it's so hard to imagine. I don't know. I don't know what he wants. What does Kevin Durant want? I don't, I just don't know. Because like if you're, if you're him,

there's competitive competition-wise, there's no reason to really leave Oklahoma for another Western Conference team unless you want a quality of life upgrade. Right. Yeah. So if you're then talking about Miami, Washington, or Boston.

Right. Or Cleveland. Derek and Kevin Love. Bringing Kevin Durant. Right. Kevin for Kevin. Team Nike. I can see. I just think Kyrie and Kevin Durant could play well together.

I do. What if Nike built like a factory in Cleveland? It was like we have Kyrie, Kevin, and LeBron on the same team. That'd be incredible. It would be so good for Nike. They'd have all the jerseys. And just change the name of Cleveland to Nike Town. Nike Town USA.

I do like Nike towns. Delightful stores to hang out in. It's so wild. I think it's either Miami or Oklahoma City. Like those are the only two things that make sense. If you go to the Lakers, you're going to the Lakers for going to the Lakers purposes, but not for winning title purposes. And at least not for the next two years unless somebody else comes with you. If you go to the Warriors of the Spurs, you're going to win, you're going to probably win the title.

But you're doing so by being like, I needed to go to the dark side or whatever, like to the other side to win. And if you stay in Oklahoma, you stay in Oklahoma, which is like great. for me because I love that team, but I can imagine wanting to live somewhere else. Sure, although the video we had on The Ringer last week by Jason Gallagher made Oklahoma City seemed delightful. So maybe he won't leave. Yeah. Can we take a quick Lakers detour?

You mentioned the Lakers? Yeah, sure. Very quick. Agiazalia announced yesterday on Instagram that she and Nick Young are over. Is Art Nick Young and the Lakers over? I don't know, but DeAngelo Russell situation just won't die. I can't believe it. It lingers on, man.

Poor DeAngelo. I actually saw a funny trade. Rumor somewhere where they were thinking about trading DeAnglo for the fifth pick and then drafting Ingram and then Buddy at five. So you have Buddy and Ingram come in. But then they wouldn't have a point guard. And then apparently like they would want to sign Conley to be their point guard. They would or would not.

Would. So they'd be like Conley. Is Mike Conley like I need to be in L.A.? I feel like he definitely going to get out of Memphis. But I don't know if he's like that type of guy where I want to be in L.A. but I know it was an interesting thought and Buddy's been saying that he wants to go to the Lakers Kobe likes Buddy which is...

Oh really? Yeah. Does Kobe get any input though? Does Kobe have any influence anymore? Aren't they just so glad to be out from under Kobe? I'm sure that Kobe just... Is Kobe the new magic? Is Kobe going to be tweeting like suggestions to the Lakers?

Kobe's going to be the new magic but he'll try to make soccer happen. Like he's in. He'll probably go like all in on MLS. Incredible job by Clint Dempsey and at USMNT tonight. Great soccer game. The beautiful game. I just feel like Kobe being. football soccer's ambassador in the U.S.

makes so much sense. Oh, I'm going to run with this from now on. I feel like Kobe still likes Ronodino. Yeah. That's how lady is. And I mean, he grew up in Europe. It makes so much sense. He loves soccer. It's so great. Okay, we can go back to the finals now. Like, it's just amazing. Let's keep teasing out the ripple effects here of this

of this whole thing. Like, what is this mean for so if you're the Thunder, do you feel like you're like, wait, man, we're way closer than we thought. Yeah. Yes. I think Spurs. In January and February, we thought we were like, man, we've completely stalled out as a franchise and missed our window, and we had the terrible luck of having two generational players come up against a generational team. But now you got to think chances are pretty good.

Yeah, exactly. And you have the blueprint. You basically have to have a big man that can move his feet that's long enough to like stretch Steph and clay way past where they want to shoot, which is like usually 28 feet. Yeah. Stretch them to 30. Be long and move your feet. You have it.

The Thunder were so close. Today I'm sad of the Thunder weren't in the finals. That's what this day is about. It's about the Thunder. For me, it's about the Thunder. I'm sorry that Dion Waiters couldn't have been the J.R. Smith of this party. It's got to feel bad. I want to see Dion shirtless.

It should have been D.O.N. It should have been D.R. I think the Spurs have to feel good, too, because they were close as well. I think that that's, this is like a, it's like a really good. It ratifies the Spur strategy. Yeah. You just always want to be in and around the conversation. The Spurs is,

actually have maybe a bigger off season to be had than the Thunder. Because the Spurs looked the worst in the playoffs. And because Parker and Duncan are old. Yeah. By Tony. Maybe they should get Mike Conley. I think Mike Connolly could be a great fit in San Antonio. I know.

That's who I want to go there. I would love that. That would be cool. Are you into the Spurs state? No. I like Danny Green. I just want to... Carolina.

Guys are psychos. They're so ridiculous. You know who's a big winner of this playoffs for me is Vince Carter? He is great on television. Paul Pierce was good. Yeah. He was really. really good, but I just was, I was just like, Vince, I want to hire that guy.

I love JVG, but JVDG did not answer the bell when LeBron kind of destroyed the theory of relativity with that block. That block. And Breen and Jackson were like, oh, my God. And JVG says, I mean like, the thing is, you got to make the seal on your offensive rebound, and those guys need to dive into the, and then I think he's, I don't know if he didn't see it, because when he saw the replay, when they were going to commercially, he was like, oh my god yeah he said it

but when they brought it back down the other end of the floor JVG was just like got to make a hard cut to the basket there and I was like did you not just see that this is like you should be like this should be like full Dick Vital now right he's standing with SVG

he's like you know what I'm out on LeBron just like my brother I'm not harping on it that block was incredible was that the best play of the finals that's one of the best plays I've ever seen it was incredible yeah I couldn't that was like another testament to step being like step too slow. That passed, like, it was just like a step too slow. That whole like one minute passage of the block and then we were, I mean, people on Twitter have been talking about this,

but if LeBron connects on that dunk, oh yeah. What happens? I don't know. They should call the game. It should have been like a like a technical knockout. They should have just like thrown in the towel on the warriors. Like you can't win after that. You're not allowed. I mean, I don't know what it would have happened to Dremont. Like, Draymond, because it would have happened right on Dremont. And they would have asked him about it forever to be a vine. They would play it all the time on loop. I'm happy he didn't happen.

He had too good of a game for that to happen. I know. I think that's why it didn't. The basketball guys were like, it can't happen. Yeah. If it was Harrison Barnes, you would have wrecked him. Yeah. Barnes would have just been.

I would have gone with Livingston over Barnes for much longer than they did yesterday. Yeah. Livingston had a bunch of shots, like where he took, like, basically everything the the Warriors were trying, it looked like it was going to work. Like, he took Kyrie down to the post a bunch of times. it took a bunch of those little floaters, and they just didn't make them. They missed a lot of easy shots.

In the beginning of this finals, or rather in the middle of the finals, it feels like it's been, it's been basically going on. I feel like the finals have been going on for two months. Like, I forgot the rest of the playoffs. I can't remember if the ringer was started when the finals.

We started the game before. Yeah, I know, but it feels like I can't, I can't believe that. What a gaunt that we've been through with LeBron. I wrote something about like the asterisk, like the Draymond suspension being the asterisk on this and being like the AT&T center,

um, air conditioning in game one of spurs. heat. Yeah. For you guys, like, do you think that the, is there an asterisk on this series? Will you, will you forever be like, man, if they have Bogot, if Draymond hadn't gotten suspended? I say no.

I had, I had a back and forth about this other night. Because before this game, the first LeBron championship, right, it's a lockout season. So, like, asterisk beside that season, no. The second one, Rayon hits the three. So, I mean. Yeah. Act of God. Yeah, Rayon, fate, whatever.

He's saved the day. This time, I watch. watch LeBron in those three games and I was like there's no way that anyone can say that he didn't deserve a championship. Of course. Those three games coming back like regardless of who's on the floor, like game five, if he and Kyrie have 41, it doesn't matter. Like it really just doesn't matter.

And I think Bogan on the back line would have helped a lot, but that guy was on a mission. I mean. I agree with you. I haven't seen anything like the end of that game where the end of the final whistle goes or the clock runs down. And as soon as it happens, you're like, this is. right. Yeah. This was supposed to happen. Yeah. Like when when Malcolm Butler intercepted Russell Wilson, I wasn't like,

this was, this was right. You know what I mean? I was like, this is amazing. When Chris Jenkins hit his three against Innova, I was like, that's incredible, but it's not like Villanova deserved this on like a cosmic level. No, and that's the thing about sports is that there's asterisk everywhere you look. You can find an asterisk. You know what I mean? Like the Thunder should be, they have three titles if certain things go differently, you know? Yeah. But with this, when this,

that happened and Kevin Love like running onto the court while there's still the ball is still in the air FYI like I've watched that a couple of times like you I don't know if you could have called that a tech but it was definitely crazy like love hugs LeBron while that ball is still clanging around it just felt like oh this was supposed to happen I think also LeBron is amazing and for some reason he like the like his greatness narrative does not is not like just doesn't take hold the way that like Michael Jordan does like the way that people want to to believe in staff. There's no money in saying LeBron's the best. Sure. And like, you know, so much has been made about LeBron versus Curry. But like, LeBron really is great. And like he is,

he is to me a much more, I mean, I talk about it all the time, like a much more compelling superstar. And sort of like to see him have the full package of like amazing on the court, controlling his own story, a really smart business deal. Like everything he's done, it just seems like this is he deserves this as part of that. And like it's almost like his greatness is so beyond everyone else in the NBA that's just not acknowledged properly. There's been such a tilt towards youth in the NBA and I think youth in terms of how we talk about the NBA, we're obsessed with the draft, we're obsessed with like guys on the come up, people who's next, who's, who's going to replace this person, who's going to replace this person. And this is still LeBron's prime.

I mean, this is what the prime feels like. I feel like we're almost, we have fatigue, you know, but it's still, he's the best. He really is. I mean, also the other thing I was thinking about because the Warriors have been such media darlings and they just, I've been covered so much and there's like there was a real magic to the regular season. LeBron has been talking to the media every day for what, 15 years? Like that's incredible. If I had to talk to anyone every day for the last 15 years, like I think they would like hate me or something. Let's check in in 2030.

You and I share in office. It's not going to happen. No, but it's just, it's amazing that he doesn't have more missteps. Yeah. Like think about already like the ups and downs with these warriors dudes who have been like in the spotlight for two years. And LeBron has made it will sustain like a pretty impressive track record. No scandals. Nothing too major.

I mean, that's that is a talent. Like being media savvy and the best at the thing that you do is really impressive. They've been doing it since he was 15. Yeah. At the end of the, that that block on stuff that he had at the end was kind of, you know, you could read a lot into that in terms of like how we think about basketball. ball in terms of team construction and not analytics, but like just the way that, the way that that was just like, I am just going to not let this happen. You know what I mean?

Like that was just like individual will in a way that it transcends high screens and side actions and running horns and elevator or whatever. You know what you mean? No, it was like the thing about LeBron, like he refused, like some of the times in the past, like even in 2014 when they lost to the spurs in five games, it kind of looked like he had all the tools. He was doing everything great, but everyone around him just wasn't delivering.

So you were like, you gave him a pass or whatever. But at the same time, people don't give greatness a pass. Like it doesn't matter. Like you're expected to do it no matter what. Yeah. And he did it.

Like, I mean, he made some of those plays. Like, if he doesn't go 110% to run back and he had that block, that's a made lay in for Iguidola. All the momentum switch. Oh, that's total butterfly.

right there. That goes in, like, who knows what happens. Exactly. And it was just, like, huge of him to, like, put in that extra. Even if he guns down the court and does get there in time, but misses the block, he's probably, like, that's a 40-yard sprint, right? Yeah. You're probably out of the next play. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Back to the asterisk question. Do you view last year's championship without Love and Kyrie as an asterisk now? Not necessarily because I think that the, um, the buzzsaw that was that team and how

unprepared people were for the way that that team played was kind of unstoppable. Yeah, I think Kyrie would, even if he played last year, he would have had a real, like I don't think he was mature enough for that stage last year. I didn't think he was going to be mature enough this year. But I think he wouldn't play to this level last season. But this year, he just had been in that system all this time. He had been under LeBron's blanket and pressure all this time. He learned how to tune out of it. It does sound like, It sounds like Channing Fry and Richard Jefferson made a big difference in terms of the culture on that team, though. From everything I've read, it just sounds like those guys were like, you guys should not be blaming each other for every little thing that goes wrong.

You're in this, like, do you know what it's like to lose every night? Like, that's what Channing Fry apparently said. He's like, if you guys, you guys think it's tough winning games, like go to Orlando. Yeah. No, I saw it. Yeah, it's a great way to put it. I mean, it's basically like you could be a loser, a catastrophic loser your entire career or you could be on the biggest stage. I mean, maybe that's looking at it.

Maybe that got through to love. Who knows? Love was obviously just like, I don't mind effectively being a role player and a decoy. Right, right. It's also, you know, shout out to the Cavs for bringing those two dudes in, Channing Frye, midseason. Do we think that these two teams will meet again next year in the finals? I do. I do.

I think it's going to be the rubber match next season. I think it's going to be incredible. I think I thought that the Warriors were going to be like an MJ Shack, Kobe sort of dynasty, like by themselves. but I think it's going to be LeBron's league versus the New Age Curry three-point league. And you'll see what side you're on. Wow. What do you think? I do not think the Warriors will go to the finals next year.

I don't think the Cavs will. Wow. Two new teams. Yeah. I think the Warriors could, but I don't think the Caps will. I think the West is really good. And I think LeBron's never been injured. Like, look.

I'm just, there's, I'm going to start betting on attrition a little bit on one of these teams. teams. I just think the warriors are not as durable. I mean, I just think, like, we just, they're probably not going to have Barnes and Azili, and they might have Barnes. Who knows? It would all be 33 next year, right? Steph, it's coming off injuries right now. Clay, you don't need to worry about him. Clay's going to Rio? I bet he will. I really think he will. Especially now, because the thing about Team USA now is, like, it's going to be a weird wrinkle between, like, who's going to be the stars of that team. I bet Ramon and Clay will go.

Yeah, and if the war is won, that would have been like, oh, the champions and their stars. I was really surprised at Durant's going. He is? Huh. It just tells me so much for these people's personalized when they decide to go. I love it. But Russ isn't. I know, because he's married.

Yeah. It's all about Olympic Village. Russ is got to stay home. Okay. The season's just beginning for us. We'll probably have some draft stuff this week. We'll probably, and we'll definitely be getting involved in some free agency soon. For sure.

You haven't heard The Last of Us. And maybe we can get Clay Thompson to come on our podcast. What do you think? Sure. That'd be great. Sheesh. Sheesh. Sheesh.