The Ringer NBA Show - Ep. 32: Covering Superteams and Positive CBA Talks With Tim Bontemps

Episode Date: October 11, 2016

The Ringer's Chris Vernon brings on Washington Post national NBA writer Tim Bontemps to discuss the new-look Warriors (6:00), Steph Curry taking a backseat to Kevin Durant (12:00), who's the second-best team in the West (18:00), the NBA's need to avoid work stoppage (23:00), why the Knicks will be horrible this season (30:55), the health of the Grizzlies (36:00), and the best League Pass team this season (40:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to the Ringer NBA show. A very special guest today. Tim Bondemps is a national NBA columnist for The Washington Post. Timmy. So, Verno. Hey, man. So let's start with you and the life of an NBA reporter because what a change. I guess the outhouse to the Penn House.

You were for the New York Post. You're primarily covering the Brooklyn Nets, who most people expect to be the worst team in the world. Then you get this gig with the Washington Post. but you don't move away from New York. And now I understand that you have moved to San Francisco? That is all correct. Though I was covering the net. I covered the nets.

And then, yeah, this year, you know, if you cover the NBA and you can be around the Warriors, talking about bosses this summer and decided to move out here for the season and should make for a very interesting season for me. All right. You mentioned about being there for the interesting time of the net. Let me ask you about that first. So you got the beginning of Prokeroff, you had the Garnett-Peer stuff, you had all the craziness with Jason Kidd. Like when you think about covering that Brooklyn team when they first moved to Brooklyn and all that stuff, the ProGraw stuff, the kid stuff, and whatever else.

Like what are your overwhelming feelings about that time and covering that particular franchise? It's hard to – I mean, you know, I'm really fortunate to have this job. I think I have, you know, the best job in the country. The reason I have this job is because I cover the Brooklyn Nets. Like if I covered some, you know, generic team X, Y, or see whether it's, you know, you're in Memphis, the Memphis Grizzlies or the Milwaukee Box or the Charlotte Hornets. I mean, if I just covered some kind of regular run of the mill, covered a team with a Russian oligarch, made this giant crazy trade for a side of a team and hired Jason Kid to Milwaukee when he couldn't get it. But nonstop, it made for a lot of interesting cops. You know, as you were going through it, you kind of didn't realize just how crazy it was.

looking back on it now, it's just kind of hard to believe everything that's happening. If you think I'm going to let the whole Milwaukee Bucks Memphis Grizzlies analogy fly, you are out of your mind. What? The only reason I've met Bill Simmons because the Grizzlies made it to the West Finals, Tim. How dare you put the Grizzlies in the same sense? Hey. Well, listen, the Grizzlies have had their fair share of craziness too,

but I don't, I think it's fair to say that basically every team in the league outside of maybe the Clippers hasn't been as insane as the net. So that's really all it was going at. All right. So you end up moving out to California and you're going to live out. Which is more expensive, by the way? Is your place in California more expensive than your place in New York? It's basically the same. Basically, I moved to the only place that's as expensive as New York in the country.

That was bad planning. So you saved literally no money. in this transfer? Literally no money. Literally no money. Didn't spend more money, but I didn't save any either. I think it's interesting that it's a break-even proposition. All right, so now you've been around the Warriors. Last year, they had this historic season. Then, of course, they blow the 3-1 lead in the finals. Your first impressions after, like now being around them, going through their, watching their training camp, the first couple preseason games, just what it's like being around the Warriors on a daily basis.

Verno, it's what I expected, honestly. I mean, this team, if this team doesn't have any, there's just, they have some other teams to stop. I mean, I know it was only a preseason game, but that first cone game at Oracle against the Clippers last week, when it's left the game halfway through the third quarter, 89 to 38, if they're firing out, coming down on the break, you know, if you had a decent defense,

you could usually track them and kind of keep track of what was going on and not let them get off too many wide-open shots. when you have Steph Curry, Clay Thompson, and Kevin Durant running down the court. This team is special as maybe any team they really think unless they have, you know, significant injuries. Anybody beating them. I really can't. Within that organization, both players and management, coaches, et cetera, do you think last year is considered a disappointment? Yes, I think so.

I mean, those guys were so devastated. I covered the playoffs last year. I covered the West finals. I covered the finals. being in an Oracle for game seven and seeing, you know, talking to some of the coaches after the game, seeing the players after the game, like those guys were really devastated to not finish off that 73 win season. Just luncheon yesterday, he put a positive 73 games and how that may never happen again. And, you know, they had a lot to be proud of even though they didn't win it.

But I think if you go ask any of the players or coaches on the team, especially, you know, those guys are going to live with never quite being able to finish off that season, and probably for beat the Cavs, that's the greatest team involved by us. You know, I think the fact that those guys were that close to having that, I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anything. You did post this interview with Lake Up, which I'm going to get into, but first I want to ask you about just him. I only know him, and I think a lot of NBA fans from afar,

just know him from his quotes, which some have been goofy, obviously got mocked a lot for the whole light years ahead of everybody, whatever. Right. Now that you've been around them, I mean, you did this interview with him. What's he like? What are your impressions of Lakeham? So yesterday was the first time I'd really had a chance to have an extended talk with him. And he's an interesting guy.

You know, he's spent, you know, he's a guy that stuff, and I think you've seen that, you know, with the Warriors. They didn't, people including me, thought they should do. This was a team, the 173 games. You know, I agree. I think he certainly, you know, the light years ahead comment and some of the other things he said have certainly led him to be. betrayed a certain way in the media, and I think the fact that the wars are just really good anyway has led to that. But he's a pretty interesting guy. I mean, he might not be, he might be quite as interesting as the last owner I was around a lot, and Mikhail Brokroff, who's a, you know,

Russian holocair, but he's an interesting guy. And I think a little different guys you probably would expect than the one we see just in the quotes here and there. I don't know what your background in psychology is, but I'm going to ask you a open-ended question. and you answered however you want to. Why is Kevin Durant on the Warriors? This is a lot. And I really think it just came down to, he looked at the Warriors.

This would be really fun. It's kind of hard to blame him from my classic team. If he'd stayed in Oklahoma City, I frankly would have picked them to win the championship this year, finals last year thinking I think you look at this warrior team, it's kind of hard for me to blame the guy for coming here. Like, all right, I can go play with three guys that I'm already, friendly with. If you had Andre Boudal of four, their core pieces, we make just about the same amount

of money here this year as there as staying in Oklahoma City. So if you just, if you just go down a list of reasons why you would choose the Warriors, like I can see, I can see why he would do it. I think, you know, if he had to come here and the Warriors had to tear the team apart, I don't think he would have come here. But I think the fact that they could basically keep the team with the way it was, and probably win multiple. You know, I can see why people are mad at him that he left the thunder, obviously. And I can understand why people in Oklahoma City go,

how could you leave this team that was on the... I think if you just step back, it's just going to be so much fun to play on this team that, you know, I think a lot of people, if they were faced with the same choice, probably would make the same one he did. Is he the man there? Well, that has kind of been the fast season.

And there's been a lot, you know, there's been a lot of people through the first couple weeks who, you know, after every preseason game or even after every practice, there's been, you know, reading in between the lines on things that happen on the court or things that are said, got about everything that happens. But one thing that people have really gotten wound up about here is that, you know, so far, Steph Curry's really taken a back seat. All every time he touches it, that's not changing no matter who's on the court. but, but, which is, I'm giving me, you laugh, but it's 100% true. I mean, I've laughed at people saying Clay is going to have to take a back seat. All Clay has to do is catch the ball and then shoot it. He's going to get just as many shots up as he did before. But Kevin Durand is being.

Didn't he have that quote, I'm not sacrificing shit? Yeah, exactly, exactly. That was him. And he's not because all Clay does is catch and shoot. So it doesn't take very long to have the ball to catch and shoot. So he's going to keep. keep doing that. But with Kevin Duran has been kind of the guy so far to these first couple games. And Steph, like, I haven't looked exactly what Steph's numbers are in the last couple days,

but I think he scored like crazy game yet. Clay's had 30 in a game. They're all getting a few assists. Steph taking a backseat to Kevin. Is he, you know, is he just handed a team over? They all right, maybe he's really taking a backseat to Durant, but playing with these guys. And then when there's regular season, Jack, they're doing Steph Curry things. But, but that is something people here are already, I think that, you know, be the guy and back the MVP awards because long, Steph Curry is thought to be validated by, you know, his peers around the league as a true.

That'd be a pretty awfully impressive. Forget if they could win more games. I mean, winning more games would be virtually impossible than what they won last year. But is there any chance they're not better than they were last year? Yeah, I think so. I think there's a chance. if you're going to say that, it's going to come down to a couple things, right? I mean, injuries obviously are a possibility, but let's set aside that.

Just with the team they have, if Zaza-Pet-Tulia isn't very – Andrew Bogot, he's a great screener. He was a perfect fit, not that he was getting out on the break, but when they got in the half court, you could give Bogut the ball, you could run screens off him in the high post, you could do a lot of stuff with him. So if Petulia can't really play, it could hurt them a lot, legitimate center playoff game. Getting the job done.

You go from Andrew Bogan and Festus Azalee at the level they were. That the level they people expect them to. That could hurt them a lot. I mean, it's really that if they get the year older. I think all those guys keep up at the level he's been the last couple of years. If he has back trouble again or if Livingston, then maybe the worst could be in trouble because then you get in a situation like the one that the Miami Heat were in when LeBron first got to my head.

Miami when they had the big three, Maul McGor, Mike Bibby, they just had all these guys, secondary guys. Everybody in the free world is going to have them winning the Western Conference. What will be interesting to see is, I bet the predictions are all over the board on who they play in the West finals. Tim Bontems thinks who is the second best team in the West? I think it's the Spurs case for them. You could make a case for the Clippers.

There are people who are going to make a case for Utah. I am not, you know, you could go, you could probably even try to make a case, you know, if a team like the one in your city, Memphis Grizzlies is healthy, just a death, but, you know, unlike in past year, kind of a giant morass, even a team like Houston, I mean, high in Houston, but I've watched them in a couple of preseason games, and they might average 125 points he came. They might give up 124, but they're going to score. I think it's the spurred ton of games again this year. and I think kind of by default it might have been in the West finals

because I'm not sold on the Clippers. But, you know, it also wouldn't shock me if some surprise team wound up there because I don't think there's anybody else that really... There has been some good news that has come out, some positive reports about a deal that could be done with the NBA and the Players Union. We're going to get to that in a second.

First, I'm going to tell you about Sling TV. It's finally basketball season. And where are you watching games at an old sports bar, you crammed onto your friend's couch, you can do better. The Sling TV, watch NBA games on your terms and your turf. The Sling Orange Service has hoops on ESPN and TNT, plus live TV on top networks for only 20 bucks a month. No long-term contracts, no hidden fees.

You can start watching for seven days free at Sling.com backslash ringer NBA. Sling.com backslash ringer NBA restrictions apply. We are also brought to you by Dollar Shave Club. I've been using them for a while now, and the shave is fantastic. What you probably don't know is that I've been using other amazing products they have too, and the quality is the best on the market. Dollar Shave Club's got stuff for your hair, your face, your underparts, for everywhere you want to keep feeling and looking fresh.

And trust me, once you're in the club, you'll see they've got the best. best grooming products on the market and they're affordable. Right now is your chance to see for yourself why so many of us love Dollar Shave Club. If you're not a member yet, you've never joined, now's the time. You'll get your first month raisers for free. You just pay the shipping. After that, it's only a few bucks. Join today.

Go to Dollar Shaveclub.com slash NBA show. That's Dollar Shaveclub.com slash NBA show. All right, Tim, so you recently wrote about Adam. Silver and Michelle Roberts and these reports that have come out, positive reports, that a deal could be worked out between the league and the players union. In reading your column in the Washington Post, it was basically, there is so much money going on right now. The owners don't really have the opportunity to cry poor.

The players certainly don't have the opportunity to cry poor. So, yeah, it's cool that we're seeing these positive reports, but they better just go ahead. They've got to prove it that this can just work out and everybody can be. be happy. Yeah, I mean, Verno, look, you and I have been around the league for a while now. And look, the bottom line is the NBA is in the best position it's ever been in. The league is as popular as, you know, you look at baseball, right? The fans in baseball are young people.

Hockey and soccer are more niche sports that haven't really risen to the same level as the other three. Basketball is on the ascent in virtually every category. You look around, and to me, it would be. be catastrophic for the NBA to risk any, any potential work stoppage when the purchase in the game there's ever been before. I mean, they just, they just have to find a way to get this deal done and, and make sure that labor peace, man, them to keep carrying the game forward. All right. I'm going to throw an odd deal at you. Okay. So Adam Silver will clearly get all kinds

of credit, right? If they can just work this out, never have a stoppage, him and the show, both them because there was always that strife between there's always the strife between david stern and and billy hunter but if these if these two that are both now new respective leaders of uh of who they're in charge of the players union on one side of michelle roberts and the league with adam silver they'll both get a tremendous amount of credit for avoiding it completely but should in retrospect because of the prior strife and david stern should in a weird way should stern get credit because because of what they went through a couple years ago, which was troubling for everybody with having to have a stoppage,

but because of that, it is put it now in the position now where everybody actually is better off. Well, I mean, I think, ironically, you can actually argue that Adam Silver gets a lot of credit for that because during the last round of negotiations, he was kind of the guy driving the bus for the league. Right.

You know, that was David Silver, David Stern slash rodeo. You know, he paid the day-to-gay negotiations in that last lockout. It was kind of the bulldog for the league in the... But yeah, you're right. Because the league won the last lockout, the last lockout battle, to feel good. Because since that, I think when the lockout ended, the salary cap during the lockout season, it's 58 million. Now it's 95 million. So the players are making gobs more money just a few years later.

Like, there's no NBA team that's lose the money now. And all the three years, maybe more. So, yeah, I think the way the last blockout went, as painful as it was, to your point, the situation now where everybody's up something that's going great. Yeah. And it just, they, I think they have both handled this well. It just has not been public and contentious. And it just always was with Billy Hunter and Stern.

Like, you're always reading. Yep. Right, like, and it just has not been that way. I think they've done a good job. No, those are a couple old school, those are, right, those are a couple old school guys that did it kind of an old-school way. And I think you've seen, in Michelle and Adam, I think you've seen kind of an understanding that the way media works now,

it was the 24-hour nature of things, every morsel information that gets out there gets endlessly recycled. So the more you can kind of keep things on having been negotiated through the media, you know, the better off you can be in terms of just getting stuff done behind the scenes. And I think so far, at least, you know, that's proven to be the case. And honestly, you know, I just, you know, I just want to keep being able to watch games. I'm hopeful.

I think it's going to get done, don't you? I think so, I think so, too. I've been a lockout pessimist for years, but I'm optimistic. You know, everybody I've talked to, including Joe Lek of yesterday, towards a deal. And look, I think, like I said before, I really think that everybody has looked around and said, my God, we're making so much money. It would be so dumb. I think, you know, even though the TV deal came in at just this time,

And because of that, I think it kind of gave everyone a dose of reality that, okay, like, we might have some issues, but this would be crazy to screw up because, like, we're getting $3 billion a year from the TV networks. Like, we can't. Good. And we both feel good about that. Now, there's a lot of positive vibes. We're like two weeks away from the season, Tim. The team that you are higher on than most people, from what you gather, read here and see the previews of the season coming up, who are you higher on than most people? Well, this is the team I've been talking up for months.

It's the Minnesota Timberwolves. 50 games. What? Yep. 50. I think they're going to win 50. I think they're going to win 50 games. Here's my argument.

The Oklahoma City Thunder, when they went from 20, they went from 23 wins in, I think 2008, 2009 to 50 wins the next year. He won 50 games. You know, Sam Mitchell's a great guy. He wasn't a great coach. You don't think he's in their top five. Typically, guys like Zach Levine and Andrew Wiggins, who are all over. but didn't really have any idea what they were doing on defense the first couple.

Dundlevy and, you know, all these guys that were not considered good defenders into good, I think he could turn those guys into absolute monsters. He's a All-MBA Center this year. I think he's going to be just a phenomenal. You know, they've got some young guys that could take a step forward. They drafted Chris. I thought he was the, I would have maybe taken him with the second pick of the draft this year. I think he's going to be a trip.

I'm with you on done. I'm with you on Dunn, Bontex. Yeah. But like, stop it already with the, the, added depth, Brandon Rush, Cole Aldridge, like, who gives a crap? Come on. Well, they had a terrible bench last year. Those guys are good, those guys are good bench players. Okay, okay. They're good bench players. Well, the other thing is, look, last year they were horrendous at the end of games.

I mean, I think they gave up, like, they won 29 games last year. I know it's a bull call saying they didn't get to 50, but I think they can do it. And I know a lot of people have had them as a 500-ish team. and so that's my team. Twenty-one game improvement. All right, so there's a team you are. You're clearly much higher on them than most people are.

You think I'm freaking different ones are winning the title, Bontems. All right, what about on the other side? Who is, who are you lower on than most people? Two teams for this. One I've been very public about, which is the Knicks. I think the Knicks are going to be terrible. I listen to your podcast.

I listened to your podcast with Kevin O'Connor the other day and I couldn't really disagree more with your take on them. They, they unlike the Timberwolves, they have no death. They have,

you know, they have basically their starting for brandigenics. A big guy is Kyle O'Quinn. Wait, hold on. I think their fourth backup. I'm not going to tolerate this. I'm not going to tolerate this

Willie Hernan Gomez, slander. Why are we acting like he doesn't exist? Why are we acting like Willie Hurley and Gomez doesn't exist? I legitimately think he's going to be a good backup center in the league, but he's not going to be this year. I don't think. I mean, look, they said yesterday that Jeff Hornacek said yesterday,

he's in a position battle with that's their. Hey, all right, I like Ornosek. I like the starting lineup. But here's the thing. You can't do that. You can't say, hey, Unlike the Timberwolves, who I just explained, have this crazy depth with Brandon Rush and Cole Aldridge. The Knicks don't have like stop.

Cole Alderick is twice as good as all three of those guys. What? Twice as good. Where are I? Like a 24 PER last year with the Clippers. Oh, my God. He was really good for the Clippers. A 24 PER.

This guy. Listen, man. You can go crazy all you want. Look, it doesn't even matter. Derek Rose was one of the worst. in the league last year. I don't see any reason that he's going to get much better offense where he can't shoot.

Joking Noah also can't shoot. He was horrendous last year. Stop it. Stop it. One of the worst players in the league. Shut up. Derek Gross is not one of the worst players. Derek Rose was not one of the worst players here. You know what?

I feel like we need to, this is, this is so New York of you. We need to be sitting out. instead of doing this podcast, I feel like I'm having a conversation with a guy eating like this extremely buttery bagel on the street in New York who's telling me that Derek Rose is one of the worst players. If we were in New York, I'd be saying the Knicks are going to win 55 games in the title like everyone in New York is doing. The team is not going to be good.

Derek Rose has been bad and injured ever since he unfortunately blew. Joe Kim Noah. The Knicks are getting Joe Kim Noah from three years ago, I feel great. Joe Kim Noah was on one leg, basically, at this point, and had massive shoulder surgery last year and couldn't shoot before that. Carmelo Anthony looked. I love Chris Sphorsankis. I think he's going to be a star.

The Knits went out and signed all these guys to fit in a win now timeframe when, you know, the guy that should be built around is 20. So I just thought they had a terrible summer. And the other team I'm worried about for similar reasons is the team in your town, that is Grizzly. Because they, well, I understand. totally why they signed Chandler Parsons and

I was happy to say Mike Conley stayed. They're telling me we're out of time. Tim, I'm sorry they're telling me we're out of time here. Listen, listen. I'm just very concerned about 305 is healthy. If Marka Saul's healthy, if Mike Connolly's healthy, if Chandler Parsons is healthy,

that team could be really good, really good. But maybe the worst injury of Big Man can have. So I'm concerned about him health-wise. There's just big issues that, like, I think Memphis could be really good, but to me they have as wide a range as any theme in the whole league. Because they could be really bad.

And if they managed to keep everybody healthy, they could be – I just think there's a lot of volatility with them. I think it's totally fair. I can't speak to Parsons. You know, I mean, he has not been, like, full contact five-on-five yet. I can only tell you, I mean, I see these guys every day. Conley and Gasol both look awesome. Both of them.

Both of them, you would never know that they've gotten injured. And so my fingers are crossed. Because if they're both healthy, if they're both healthy, you're going to be good. End of story. Probably. Probably. The Parsons thing would be bad, though. I mean, you've got to remember that was supposed to be like a six-week recovery six months ago.

Right. So, like, that's not a great sign that that guy still. And, I mean, he basically spent all last. year on the shelf. But if he is healthy, I mean, you know this better than anybody, he's the exact guy they've been looking for for basically five years. If he can play, he'll be a perfect fit for them.

But, you know, and I hope that Mike and Mark, you know, I love being the big games in Memphis. I mean, fun team, Tony Allen and Zach Randolph are two of the more fun personalities in the league. It's just been a really fun. team to follow. So I'm certainly pulling for them to be healthy, but

you know, like I said before, I just, they have so much volatility with their good and bad. Like to me, the NICs just don't have much upside, but just the same amount. All right. Last question. We've got like a million new coaches in the league. You've already expressed your undying love for Tom Tibado, but let me ask

about things. So I'm going to list them off and you just tell me who you think outside of Tibido, since you already, you know, acted like he's a Red Arbacan it, you know, reincarnate. It was going to have a one game improvement. All right. Scott Brooks Wizards, Kenny Atkinson Nets, David Fisdale Grizzlies, Frank Vogel Magic,

Nate McMillan Pacers, Luke Walton is the Lakers, Hornacek is the Knicks. We already mentioned Tibodeau, who you are in love with. Dave Yeager Kings, Mike Tantonie Rockets, Earl Watson's sons. outside of Tibido, who has a lot of success? I mean, it's kind of a tough question to answer because honestly, I really like pretty much all the hires made this summer. I didn't really understand anything Orlando did. He had a great run with the Pacers.

I think, you know, if anybody's going to figure out how to make that team work, I think Frank will. I like the Hornacek hire for the Knicks. They're going to get to run the team. It's bizarrely on his staff. Not anything you ever did before. you know, they needed to establish. I think Scott's personality is a good fit for that team,

kind of a positive, upbeat guy. I think they needed that. I really love David Fisdale getting hired by the Grizzlies in the league. I was a little unsure about Dan Tony with the Rockets, but like I said, I've watched them play in the preseason, and if Eric Gordon and Ryan Anderson are healthy, I mean, they're not going to play much defense as a team, but man, they're going to score a million points.

I think you give that franchise some stability finally. there were a lot of good coaching hires this summer. There weren't many that I kind of looked at and said, man, this doesn't really make a lot of sense. I guess the one that I didn't really get was the Pacers letting Vogel go in the first place. It's not really a knock on Nate McMillan. I think he's a fine coach. He's had pretty good success in the past. I didn't really make a lot.

I think of five or six year run there, so it might just spend time to change things up. But I think overall it was a pretty good summer for last thing. Safe to Save Minnesota is your league pass team? I think they're going to be fun to watch. It might be Houston. I think Houston might score 120 points a game. I mean, they're not going to play any defense, and they're just going to shoot all the time.

So, you know, if you like high-scoring games, you know, you'll like watching Rocket Games because there's just going to be... But, yeah, I also know, I think they're going to be a lot of fun. So you can't go wrong either way there. Tim Bontas from the Washington Post. You are the man you can follow Tim on Twitter at Tim Bond Temps. You can read all of his stories there.

Tim, thanks, man. I appreciate you coming on. Bruno, happy to do it, man. And after you're doing well here at the Ringer, I think it was a great move. And I'm excited to keep listening. So thanks for having me, buddy. My man. It is finally basketball season where you watching the games across the old sports bar.

You on your friend's couch. You can do better. Remember, Sling TV. You can watch NBA games on your country. terms and your turf, the Sling Orange Service has hoops on ESPN and TNT, plus more live TV on top networks, all

for 20 bucks a month. No long-term contracts, no hidden fees. Start watching for seven days free at Sling.com backslash ringer NBA. Sling.com backslash ringer NBA. Restrictions apply.