The Ringer NBA Show - Ep. 55: Jimmy Goldstein

Episode Date: January 6, 2017

The Ringer's Chris Vernon is joined by NBA superfan James Goldstein to discuss pioneering NBA fandom (3:00), growing up a Milwaukee Hawks fan (6:00), Goldstein's rivalry with Kobe (10:00), his love for Dominique Wilkins (13:00), Clippers fandom (16:00), Durant signing with the Warriors (20:00), potential NBA rules changes (24:00), the history of the Lakers (31:00), almost buying the Bucks (39:00), hosting Rihanna's birthday party (42:00), and the Ray Allen shot in 2013 (45:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to The Ringer NBA show. I'm Chris Vernon, and this is the treat of all treats. NBA superfan Jimmy Goldstein. We have come to the Goldstein estate to meet him for this podcast. Thanks for doing this today. My pleasure. So I want to get to, I think everybody that's a big NBA fan has seen you on the sidelines for many years. You're at all these games. You're all over the playoffs. And they say, who is that guy? So I want to find out who is that guy. Now, you can go back and look and just doing some research. You find that you started doing stats years ago in Milwaukee. You grew up in Milwaukee, right? That's correct. All right.

So from Milwaukee, your love of basketball started when? Well, I started playing basketball at the age of five had a basket on my garage in the driveway. And so I loved the game right from the time I was a little kid. And at the age of 10, my father started taking me to the Milwaukee Hawks games. At the age of 15, I was offered the job as a statistician for the radio and TV announcer for the Milwaukee Hawks. And once I had that job, I was totally hooked on the NBA. There weren't many people in those days. that liked the NBA or that followed the NBA,

the typical attendance at a game was maybe 2,000 people. And it was hard to even get news about the NBA. The high school teams got more coverage than the NBA in those days. Wow. But I was a so-called pioneer. I loved it from the very beginning. I touted it to everybody. I wrote my term paper in high school about the NBA.

So it's been an amazing climb for the NBA over the years that I've been following it. And I'm just as hooked on it, if not more, today than I was when I was a young kid. So when you were young, your friends didn't care about the NBA? Nobody cared about the NBA except me. My friends followed college basketball. They thought I was crazy for following the NBA. That was not just my friends, everybody. So after you get done, I suppose you have that job through high school. And now it's time to go to college? Oh, okay. And then the Hawks moved to St. Louis. So I wasn't able to do it anymore after that. I used to listen on the radio to the Hawks games after they moved to St. Louis, I could pick up the St. Louis

station with a lot of static, and that's how involved I was. And that was really your means to keep up with what was going on? Yes. So listening to, I suppose, it was probably KMOX, because that's a super station. Very little television. The playoffs weren't on television. I had to call the newspaper from time to time to find scores of games, even the NBA finals. Wow. So where'd you go to college? I went to Stanford University, and that was my introduction to California. There was no NBA team in California at the time I started.

but eventually the Lakers and Warriors moved out here. Okay, so why did you go to Stanford from Milwaukee? I wanted to go to a top school. It was a choice between Stanford and the Ivy League schools, and the lure of California just was more attracted to me than going to the East Coast. What did you do after college? after college? Yeah.

What happened? You graduated from college, just like everybody out there, and then you're figuring out what you're going to do with your life. What did you do? Well, besides going to all the basketball games in Los Angeles, I got a job with a company dealing with property investments. Property investments. And that started early in your life?

So that started right up to. college. Right after college. At what point are you going to, I suppose, right, once you graduate from college, now you're out on your own, how many basketball games are you going to then? Even when you're young, are you like a season ticket holder? Well, I should interject that after Stanford, I went to graduate school at UCLA. So that brought me down to Los Angeles. At that time, the Lakers had been here for a couple of years. So I went to all of the Laker games. And games while I was in grad school, I was doing that. In addition, there was an ABA team here, and I went to all of their games as well. Wow. Now, you did not have a favorite, you still to this day

claim to not have a favorite team. Well, at the time I moved to Los Angeles, I was still a very rabid hawks fan. And by that time, they had, I believe they'd moved to Atlanta. But when the Lakers played the Hawks, I was rooting for the Hawks all the way. And I had no reason to root for the Lakers just because I moved to L.A. didn't suddenly transcend me into being a Lakers fan. So the Lakers were the biggest rival of the hawks. So I started rooting against the Lakers. And I've been rooting against the Lakers ever since. Really?

Even though you're a season ticket holder and you sit on the front row and you witnessed these literally amazing teams, all manner of them, right? The Jerry West teams all the way up until the magic teams and then Shaq and Kobe, etc. Never did you start to wish they would win? The better they were, the more I rooted against them. I don't like to follow bandwagons.

I don't like to root for the superior team. I liked rooting for the underdog. And everyone in L.A. was so biased in favor of the Lakers. Their radio announced at the legendary Chick-Hurne was so biased in his reporting of the games. That made me very angry. And it made me root for the other team. But then you got to know all these guys. That's the other thing that's strange to me is right.

Like you get to know magic and you get to know Shaq and likeable characters over the years personally, right? And it still had no influence in terms of you carrying. I think it's very strange to go to every game, sit on the front row, know the guys, like the guys, and still wish them ill will. Yes, it's true. I knew the Laker players. I got along with most of the Laker players. They knew that I rooted against them, but they were still nice to me with the exception of Kobe. He was not nice to you? But I also knew the visiting players, and it was very exciting for me and still is. to see the visiting players come in, who I only got to see firsthand, a maximum of four games a year. Right.

It excited me much more to see them than to see the same players that I see night after night. Right. So you always were into the visiting teams. You think I'm not letting you get past the Kobe thing. All right. Well, Kobe and I had a. I had a rivalry, which I totally understand because he was so competitive.

So every now and then, maybe at an all-star game, or I remember one time running into him in Tokyo, where it wasn't the Laker game setting, he would come up and say hello to me. But on the day-to-day basis of the Lakers season, he did not accept the fact that I was not a Laker fan. And you had such good seats. So that's obviously a problem, right? The guy sitting on the front row is not rooting for us. So I want to get your thoughts on this whole history of the NBA because there is, there's arguments that come up all the time from basketball fans.

and they want to compare eras. You know, could, so it's okay. You're even hearing it now, inevitably with Russell Westbrook in the ridiculous season he's having, and they'll bring up Oscar Robertson, and they will try to compare and contrast and what was going on.

Your thoughts on the level of player now versus the level of player that you were watching 30, 40 years ago. Well, overall, the players are more athletic, now than they were 40 years ago. There's no doubt about that. And the conditioning methods, the training, and so forth is so superior today than it was back then. Players' longevity is much greater now than it was in those days because of that. And so I'm not one of these fans that. It looks back at the old days and says, you know, it was much better then. I don't believe that.

But there are other changes that have taken place as well. The rules have changed. The defensive strategies have changed. So there's some things that are hard to compare when you're talking about the great players. But overall, there's no question the game is superior today. Do you think that all of the players of yesterday, right? And Hall of Famers maybe even. And I'm not talking about, say, the 80s, but even going back further, that they're great players no matter the era. Do you think great players are great players no matter the era?

So if I put, say, Kareem, Will Chamberlain, whoever, name the guy. And I put him in today's NBA, he'd still be amazing. In the case of those two players, definitely, yes. although I think that the defensive methodology today might put a crimp in Kareem's skyhook because he wasn't getting attacked from the opposite side in his day. He was being guarded one-on-one primarily, so he was able to get off that sweeping hook. But for the most people, part, I would say the stars of

yesteryear would be stars today. So what Charles Barclay says this is the worst the NBA has been, you don't buy that at all. I don't buy that. I mean, it was more physical in his day. They didn't have the hand-checking rules.

And so the game has definitely changed so that the small player can do more today than Berkeley's era. Who does? do you get most excited about watching? Who did you and who do you now? When they would come

through town, that was what would really excite you the most. The players that excite me the most are the ones that have amazing athleticism and amazing moves on the court. So Dominique Wilkins was certainly one of my all-time favorites. Today, and I might add, I like to praise the players that maybe don't get as much recognition as they deserve. Dominique was one of those players,

even though he was pretty famous. He was always taking a backseat to people like Larry Bird. when the 50 greatest players were announced, he wasn't one of them. So I always defended. You always rooted for a guy that you didn't feel got enough credit. I liked the fact that he didn't get as much credit as he deserves, so I like to be behind him. Today, that holds true for Jamal Crawford because he's got

amazing moves. I've always loved watching him. And the last few years that he's been playing here in L.A., I've gotten to be a very good friend of his. And so I always say that Jamal is one of my favorites. Who is the guy that you always thought got too much credit? Overrated. The great player that you just, you didn't get it.

You thought they were praised too much. Yeah, there's always some of those, but just off the top of my head now, I can't think of who to pick out. But let me come back to that. All right, we'll come back to that. When you see, oh, I have not mentioned the Clippers. Now, Jimmy, I've been around L.A. for a week now. Everywhere I went, people were telling me,

when they would ask me where I'm from, and I would tell them Memphis, they'd say, hope you beat the Clippers, hope you beat the Clippers. And at one point I turned to somebody and said, who likes that team? Now, evidently, there was a lot of fans at the game last night. This is clearly not a Clipper town if you walk around and I couldn't find a Clipper fan anywhere. It was crazy. Well, you could have found them last night at the game.

Yeah, no, no, no. Last night, then they obviously are there. Every game is a sellout. Right. Which I'm very happy about because the Clippers definitely do not get recognized. in the west side of L.A. where I live. And all over the United States and all over the world, wherever I go, I'm walking down the street and people come up to me and say, go Lakers. And I always say, what about the clippers? Nobody ever says, nobody ever says,

that to me, go Clippers. It's always go Lakers. And people come up to me and say, oh, you're the Laker fan. I said, no, I'm a Clippers fan. You know, they don't get it. They don't even understand what I'm talking about. So I have a

very deep resentment for the way L.A. fans react toward the Clippers. I've been told that when Clippers scores are announced at Dodger games or Clipper players are introduced at Dodger games. Everybody booze.

I mean, something's wrong. Do you find yourself as someone, you know, they're not exactly the underdog because they've clearly been the superior team recently. And they obviously have a lot of fans that are going to the games. Do you, have you found yourself over the years pulling for them because they were the team that, you know, you have this ongoing thought process of rooting for the underdog. You like Dominique because he doesn't get enough credit. Did you find yourself kind of liking the clippers and rooting for them to have success

because seemingly they were mistreated in your mind? There's no question about it that added to their attraction for me. And in recent years, when the Lakers' were 29th or 30th best team out of 30 in the NBA. And the Clippers were one of the top four teams in the NBA. You'd think some fans would want to go watch the Clippers just to see good basketball. But no.

In L.A., that made no difference. They still had no interest in watching a Clipper game. Jack Nicholson. the guy who's gotten so much credit as being such a great basketball fan has never gone to a clipper game in L.A. He doesn't even go when it's a Clipper home game against the Lakers. Do you like their team competitively? Do you like that Clippers team? I like the Clipper team very much.

Do you think they should make a move? Do you think that they should keep riding out with? Chris Blake and DeAndre? Do I think they should? Yeah. Do you think they, do you think they're good enough to be able to take that into the playoffs, assuming they're healthy, and deal with Golden State and deal with San Antonio? Because they have been at that team, they should have made the West finals a couple years ago and they blew it against the Rockets, obviously. But they have been that team that has not

gotten to that highest level. Would you pull the plug on it or would you just wait in your turn, maybe. That's what all the Laker fans say. All the Clippers have never gotten past the second round. They're one of the top four teams in the NBA. I'm happy that they're as high as that. I'm not complaining that they haven't won the championship. I don't think they can beat Golden State.

They did beat San Antonio coming off San Antonio's championship year. a couple of years ago in the first round. They've beaten San Antonio twice this year. So they could beat San Antonio. I don't think they can beat the Warriors, but I don't think that's such a bad thing that they can't beat the top two teams in the NBA. Right.

I think most teams would be, would feel fortunate to be as good as that. Who do you think? have the best shot at the Warriors in the Western Conference? I think probably San Antonio would have a better shot, but I will be surprised if the Warriors don't get to the finals again. What did you think when Kevin Durant signed there? I was sick about it.

I want competition. For me, if all 30 teams were equal, that would be my ultimate dream. dream because when I watch a game, I want the game up for grabs. I don't want one team dominating the other teams. I don't want one-sided games. I want games that go down to the wire. What did you think about last year's series and Cleveland coming back from, you know,

there's the jokes that have gone around about the Warriors blowing the 3-1 lead last year? I mean, you go to all these finals games. always there. Attendance, as you're watching that unfold, where does that rank in terms of unbelievable things that you have witnessed? The fact that that team that won 73 games didn't close it out. It doesn't rank at all is unbelievable to me. Wow.

If the NBA had not suspended Drayman Green, that series would have ended in five games and nobody would be talking about the big Cleveland comeback. I think that's probably fair. but they did suspend him, and they did lose six and seven with him. I'm totally against NBA suspensions in the playoffs. It penalizes a fan like me who watches so many games all through the season, finally getting to the playoffs, and then having a suspension change everything. That to me taints the championship team.

It happened once before when the Phoenix players were suspended in the series against San Antonio. They would have beaten San Antonio and they would have beaten Cleveland in the finals. And because of one little incident, determining the championship over an eight-month period, it just does not seem right to me. As someone that has witnessed the NBA for so long, what do you think about David Stern? What do you think about Adam Silver? I love both of them.

They're good friends. I think they've both done fantastic jobs overall. But when it comes to the issue of physical contact and resulting in suspensions, And a little incident of somebody stepping over the line who wasn't even involved in the incident, that's ridiculous that it should decide the championship. What else should the NBA fix? Where else?

Yeah, what else do you think they should fix? If I made Jimmy Goldstein the commissioner of the NBA, you would walk into the meeting with everybody and you would say, I think this needs to change. I think this needs to change. I think this needs to change. You've already given me the one on the suspensions during the playoffs. I have a problem with the draft.

I suffered through watching the Lakers go out of their way to lose games for the last two years so they would get a better draft position. I think it's disgusting what Philadelphia did to get top draft picks. It's not fair to me as a fan to go to a game knowing that the team is not playing their best players or going all out to win the game so that they can get a top draft pick. My proposal to the NBA is that the teams that do not make the playoffs, the 14 teams, be subject to the lottery on an equal. basis so that there's no advantage to losing games. That's one. Number one. As far as the rules on the

court are concerned, I have a few ideas. In fact, I mentioned this to Kiki Vandaway just the other day. he came to my house to show his son my house. I told him that I don't like the three-point shooter pump-faking, getting the defensive man up in the air, and then moving forward into the man. It's the worst. That's terrible. Terrible.

He agreed with me. That drives me crazy, too. They're not even in an upward normal shooting motion. They're clearly jumping into the guy. Yes. We should throw them in jail. That should be your penalty for doing that. Another thing that's been happening recently is the offensive flop where the three-point shooter falls on his back after he releases the ball.

And it can be they just nicked your wrist or something after the follow through. Sometimes there isn't even contact, but the official is fooled into thinking there was... Happened last night and closed out the Clippers Memphis Grizzlies game. It was a four-point game, and Austin Rivers shot it at the end of the shot clock with about a... What, was it probably a minute and a half to go? He got that exact call, three free throws, four-point game turns into seven-point game. We're done. That game's over.

I mean, let's go home. Right. So that's another thing that needs to be looked at. And then I've got a few ideas to improve the game that may be considered radical because I never hear anybody else suggesting it. But to me, the unguarded shot from the corner is no more exciting than why. watching a free throw. I don't understand why that three-point line was designed that way in the first place. Oh, the fact that it's a short shot drives you crazy.

It's a shorter shot. And almost every team, or I would say every team employs the strategy of having one man just stationary in that corner spot. And if you watch the warm-ups, the players that are given that assignment, they only practice their shot from the corner because they know that's the only shot they're ever going to get. Or take, for that matter.

So I'm in favor of making the three-point line equidistant all the way to the sideline. All right. I do want to go back to one of the, the things that you mentioned, and it refers to the draft, and the fact that it drove you crazy that teams would intentionally lose in order to get a high draft pick. I must ask you, because you were a clipper season ticket holder, and many accused Donald Sterling of putting out a subpar product going on the cheap, collecting the money for years and

years and years. Yet you were still a season ticket holder. Did that drive you insane for there to be so many? there was a very long time of a miserable product being put out by that organization, and it seemed like very little was being done to fix said problem, right? He was fine with having a crap team. Yes, it drove me insane. But that was a different situation.

Donald Sterling wasn't doing that in order to get top draft picks. He was doing it to save money. Right. Once a player reached a certain stature, he always wanted to go to a certain team and get paid more money and would usually end up leaving the Clippers. But Donald Sterling not only wanted to save money, he was always afraid of paying someone too much money. so he would never make the first offer to a player. He would wait to see what some other team offered that player. And then he would consider whether or not it was worthwhile for him to match that offer.

As a result, he lost a lot of good players. What did you think about his downfall? About his... His downfall, Adam Silver coming out, you know, obviously has to sell the team to Balmer, you know, and his, you know, people, he already had a poor reputation. And then when all the voicemails come out, et cetera, et cetera, I mean, they, I mean, it really just, it changed. He's, he's, he's, I would say, a exceptionally reviled character in all of sports. He's probably a social outcast in Los Angeles. I have

not seen him since that happened. And I knew him pretty well. And, you know, it was a terrible thing that he did. And I think the NBA handled it beautifully. They had a real problem on their hands, and I was all in favor of the way they handled it. After Dr. Bus has passed. There is, I'm sure you keep up with the media. There's been a lot of controversy about the running of the Lakers since that took place. Give me your take. As someone who's been there and have been around it, I'm sure you knew Dr. Bus very, very well. Uh-huh.

Well, I have not seen Jim Bus in recent years. Um, he sits up in the luxury box and never comes down. to the court. I used to be friendly with him, so I haven't had any communication with him in recent years. I think he's gotten an unfair shake in a way because the rules with salary caps and so forth and the ability of players to be a free agent and to change teams. Everything is different than it used to be. And the Lakers used to have a huge advantage, which is one of the reasons I rooted against them.

They had an advantage because players wanted to come to Los Angeles as a place to live. and there was nothing to stop them from doing it. There were no salary caps. And so the players could be paid more money by the Lakers. The Lakers were charging much higher ticket prices, making more money, and thereby paying the players higher salaries. You think he gets a bad rap?

It's unfair to. No one acknowledges that things were easier during Jerry Bus's tenure with the Lakers than they are now. Who are your favorite guys? I want to get as many questions as I can in. Who are your favorite guys in the league right now? You mentioned being friends with Jamal Crawford. But in terms of like they always come up to you, you're always excited to see them when you go to the games. Who are the guys that are your favorites?

Well, from a friendship standpoint. Yeah, yeah, friendship and like, you know, you go to the game and you're excited to get to watch them play and you think they're a good guy. Uh-huh. Well, I've reached a point now where in most cases, the majority of the players on each visiting team come over to say hello. So that's pretty great. It's hard for me to single out just a few players. We have to go team by team, particularly in the Western Conference, because I see them more often. There are so many players that are nice to me.

It's really a great thing for me. People see, I think one of the big questions is when, you know, I started this interview by saying, who is that guy, right? And then they see you at the games. How is he on the front row at all these games? They see you at every playoff game. You're traveling everywhere, right? We're in this house.

you've obviously done well in life. And then inevitably people go, what did he do? I mean, the amount of money that this must cost to be able to do this is just extraordinary. I don't like to think about it because it makes me sick when I think about how much money I'm spending. On basketball? But when I travel around in particular, fans always come up to me and say, the same words every time. I see you in the first row at all these games.

Who are you? In my... I mean, that's a weird question to have to answer, right? My answer to this stupid question always is, I'm a basketball fan. That's it. Then their mouth falls open. They don't know what to say.

say next and hopefully they walk away. All right. Well, unfortunately, the people cannot walk away from this podcast. So I must ask the follow-up question. What was your job? Are you not going to tell me? You're a mysterious guy, Jimmy. Like, I, how do I, how do you, how do I earn money?

Yes, how you earn money, enough money to be on every and all these NBA games on the front row and live in a house where the big Lobowski was filmed. And I mean, this is, you got an extravagant lifestyle. And your clothes, listen, I bet what you're wearing right now costs more than every piece of clothing I've ever owned in my life. I bet your hat does. What is a hat made of? Like, snake leather or something?

Do you want some numbers on it? Yes. The hat is what? The hat cost about $4,000. I had it custom made in Paris. And the jacket as well was custom made in Paris and costs around $10,000. You're looking at my face and you know that like this is not, that's not in my price range, Jimmy. And every six months I change my wardrobe entirely.

What was your job? What did you do? You said investments. Is it real estate? Were you a real estate guy? I've made property investments in California. Rental stuff? Like you bought the stuff years ago and rented it out over the years?

Most of it I bought years ago, yeah. Yeah. But you told you. me earlier. All right. That's a good enough answer, right? You bought a bunch of property. The property has made you money. Correct. Fair enough? Yes. A lot of money. You've got a $4,000 hat and a $10,000 jacket. I'm not a billionaire. You're not? There's some billionaires running around. I am not even close to being a billionaire. Well, if you didn't have Laker and if you didn't have all the basketball tickets, would you mean?

If you didn't go to all the basketball games, would you be a billionaire? Well, David Stern used to get on me for spending so much money instead of being an owner of a team. And in fact, he tried to get me to buy the Milwaukee Bucks when they were first offered for sale. And I was interested in that. It would have been a homecoming. But then Michael Jordan got. in the picture. And so obviously Michael Jordan was more attractive as an owner of a team than I was.

And then after the negotiations with Michael Jordan didn't work out, the owner of the bucks pulled the team off the market. So nothing ever happened on that. Did you consider it? The teams are so ridiculously expensive. you know, I couldn't even consider being an owner of a team. And my situation with the NBA is so great. I have a better situation in some ways than the owners of the team do in terms of

enjoyment, because I have an inside position with many of the teams. I'm not sure if I were an owner of one team, I could do what I'm doing. today. There's no way you could do what you were doing today. It's interesting because one of the things I would think is a guy like that would never leave Los Angeles, that that would be the reason that you wouldn't go to Milwaukee or something like that, right, to buy a team. That's one of the reasons, right? You got this spectacular house, you got the season tickets, on and on. Well, you told me earlier, you don't love Los Angeles, the town like you used to. Correct. I've I've gotten over Los Angeles.

I spend a lot of time in Europe. When I'm in Europe, I feel like that's where I belong. But I don't have the NBA in Europe. I don't have this house in Europe, which has been my, almost my lifetime project. I've been working on this house for, 35 years. I've donated this house to the local art museum here, which won't take place until I stop breathing. But this house is my pride and joy because I've been so involved from a creativity standpoint with this house. So I can't leave this house. And I've sort of set up

a lifestyle which involves five or six months in Los Angeles and the rest of the year traveling. And that balance has proven to be the best thing that I could do. This house doesn't have any stories, does it? Pardon? Stories. I mean, when we walked in, there was a club. You have a club in the house for, like, parties. You have a club.

I must say that is the first I've ever seen of that. I've seen racquetball courts. I've seen basketball courts. I've never seen a dance club in the middle of a house. Well, there are a few others around. There are. I don't think. Where'd you get that idea?

You know, you're like, you know what? I'm going to bring the club to me. You never have to go to a club if you got a club. I don't think anyone else has built a club. in their house to the level of excellence and the view of the city that I've accomplished. And I'm very proud of that. That club has really been in existence for the last couple of years. So the one party that I can point to that was the most fun since I've had that club was

Rihanna's birthday party. And that was an amazing party. Why? Why? The blend of attractive models and major celebrities was really fantastic. How did you stay, you know, without wife? You have all these, like, gorgeous models around, everything. that's one of the reasons

but I don't really believe in marriage as an institution I believe in having freedom being with someone when I want to be with that person not being made to feel

from a legal standpoint that I had to be with that person and I think one of the best decisions I made was never to get married. Last thing, when you talk about this particular season, the Warriors and the Cavaliers are prohibitive favorites. Is there any way you could foresee there being a different finals than Warriors Cavaliers? I would be very surprised if there's a difference. different funnels.

This has been spectacular, Jimmy. Oh, actually, you know what? I have one more. Am I the least famous person? Well, I guess Tate and Tommy are here with me. Are we the three least famous people that have ever stepped foot in this house? No, that's ridiculous. There are people here all the time.

I'm not talking about workers. I'm not talking about people. No, not just the workers. Are you going to put us to work after this podcast is over? I don't judge people on their celebrity status. Thank God. So I feel that even though I left Milwaukee many years ago, I still have my Midwest roots and I'm a down-to-earth person.

You certainly are. And this has been great. I mean, this has been a dream come true. I think so many NBA fans, I was the NBA fan that would see you on TV for all these years. And I would go, who is that guy? I think we did pretty good in figuring out who you are. I mean, besides old job thing, which you're, you know. Well, I feel that I'm in somewhat of a unique position when it comes to the NBA because I've been following it almost since the origin of the NBA.

Yeah. And I've attended over 4,000 games during the history of the NBA. And so I don't think there are many people like that. Now that you mentioned that, I'm going to people are, the 4,000 games, people are going to want to know what you're the best one was. And it's got to be almost impossible to pick out. But is there a most memorable, you got to. in the car, you left that arena and you're like, damn, I cannot believe what I just saw. From that definition of a memorable game, even though there's been so many memorable games,

the one that probably made the most lasting impression was game six between San Antonio and Miami. me when the trophy had already been brought down to be presented to San Antonio, and they lost the game. And the Ray Allen shot. I happened to be standing within arm's length of Ray Allen when he made that shot. And as I told him after the game, Ray, I, I called. could have blocked that shot. You'd have saved the title. And as a San Antonio fan at that time, rooting very strongly against a Miami team that I didn't like

because of the way they had put that team together, that was the most devastating moment for me in my basketball life. livelihood. And Popovich, the amazing coach, right, that you witnessed. Is there a best coach for you? Popovich gets the credit from everybody else, and I can't argue with that opinion. Do you think the refs are good? I think basketball is the toughest sport to officiate, and the reps make a lot of mistakes, but I don't know what can be done to change that situation. You think it's just a hard sport to officiate? Very difficult.

Did you ever believe it was crooked? No. I think that... Even when people bring up the Lakers, Sacramento, and shooting the 100 million free throws and... I think... If you ever think the NBA did something... when people say, yeah, not that the NBA's fixed, but like, that's what the NBA wanted to happen.

Therefore, subconsciously things took place to help that. Subconsciously, yes, I think subconsciously, one of the reasons the home team has an advantage is because all the fans are rooting strongly and that has to affect the official's subconscious mentality. The same thing with knowing that the NBA would want one particular team in the finals subconsciously might affect some of the officials. But crooked, no. I don't think the NBA ever said to the officials to call the game one way or the other. And I love so much how much you still love it, no matter, right?

Yeah. You really love the NBA. I plan everything I do around the NBA games. I plan my traveling. I plan even making an appointment during the day before 4 o'clock when the NBA games come on television. Everything I do is with the NBA in mind. This has been an absolute thrill.

I've kept you entirely too long. But, I mean, we are at your house, so it felt like kind of normal. All right. Well, I will be... You're going to be here. You're probably going to... Probably got something going on at the club upstairs. I will be happy to give you a complete tour of the house.

I can't wait to see it. Thank you, Jimmy. You're welcome. My pleasure. Jimmy Goldstein. Thanks for listening to another Ringer NBA show. What a world We'll talk to you tomorrow