The Ringer NBA Show - First-Round Matchups We’d Like to See | The Mismatch

Episode Date: April 2, 2019

With the end of the regular season in sight, which first-round matchups would be the most interesting (0:56)? Plus: even more NBA draft takeaways from the NCAA tournament (30:43). Hosts: Chris Vernon, Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Welcome to The Ringer NBA show. I'm Chris Vernon. And join me as he does every Tuesday from The Ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, A.k.a. Kevin O'Bomber, aka Kevin O'Connor, A.K.A. Kevin O'Bomber, A.K. Kevin O'Bomble, A. Kavanaugh. Just keeps on going, Chris. How are you doing today? We only have a few games left in the NBA season. This is the very end of the home stretch.

I'm ready for the playoffs, Chris. Come on. I am ready for the playoffs too, but we do need to figure this out and who we want to be facing each other in these playoffs because there is still a lot to be decided in terms of the matchups. I went to ESPN puts together their BPI, which is just a way of projecting out the rest of the season through statistical analysis. As of today, their odds say in the Eastern Conference, it would be, and I'm going to go one through eight, Milwaukee 1, Toronto 2, Philly 3, Indiana and Boston, 4 and 5, 6, Detroit, 7, Orlando, 8, Brooklyn, with a 77% chance of making the play. playoffs with Miami on the outside looking in, which I found intensely fascinating,

especially because taking a quick peek at the schedule, Brooklyn, who has lost three or four at the worst time ever, is closing their season. Listen to the last four games, Kev, Toronto, Milwaukee, at Indiana, Miami. I'm not sure Brooklyn's going to get there, which would be unbelievable because, Because I thought for sure, Brooklyn, I mean, I've just always been under the impression. Brooklyn's going to be a playoff team. And obviously, they still may. And the odds favor them to be there, even given their remaining schedule.

But that seems very, very tough for a team that's obviously lost three out of four. It's probably going to come down to that final game, though, Chris, against Miami on April 10th. Final day of the season, Brooklyn versus Miami, fighting for the honor to be the eighth seed. That could be the case, depending on what Orlando. does because for the magic, there's no guarantee they get in either. I mean, they're on a nice little street hair, but with them, like, they could always slip as well. It could be that Brooklyn and Miami getting as expected, but it's not easy for Orlando.

They face the Knicks on Wednesday. That should be a win. But Atlanta's been tough on Friday. Then Boston on Sunday, maybe you get good Boston, maybe you get bad Boston. And then they face Charlotte final day of the regular season at Charlotte. Could be Kempa's last game as a Charlotte Hornet. A lot of emotion that building. It's not easy for Orlando either.

So despite Brooklyn having the toughest schedule of those three teams, they still have a little bit of a cushion than I feel confident that they'll get in. All right. Which of those three, if you had to take two out of the three, would you most want to see playing in the playoffs? Orlando, Brooklyn, and Miami. Well, I want to see Brooklyn get in there. I would really like to see the Nets get in there.

They're ahead of schedule. They have a lot of fun players. Daniel Russell, the progress he's made. He probably won't win this most improved player of the year, but it's been great watching him develop. Karas Levert getting playoff an opportunity

after the injury he's suffered. I hope we see the Nets get in there. And I also would like to see the magic, too, man. I think that would be pretty dope if Orlando were to get in there, another team that people expected to be in the toilet this season. If they were to get in, that would be cool.

Given that I don't think any of them are probably going to put up a tremendous fight, Brooklyn, because they have, obviously Miami is the one that's been there the most. And I am kind of torn because... We've seen them a lot, you know? We have, but we also saw, like, you remember,

there were a couple moments in time where, and it's not going to be for seven games, but for one or two, you'll get the Dwayne Wade that is, like, possibly the best player on the floor for that given night. And it is his, like, one last dance, as they say, and whatever. So I certainly wouldn't mind seeing Miami there. I will tell you, I am incredibly impressed

with Orlando. And I will give you full credit at the beginning of the season. You said that you thought it was a team, though you said they're still going to stink. And I guess you could argue they do. Right? With these bottom seeds in the playoffs,

that they were going to be a fun watch. They have gotten less than nothing out of their top five draft pick in Mo Bomba. They have gotten an all-star year, literally an all-star year, out of Vucevich. This is a team that does not have a point guard that anybody would

care about. You're not a fan of DJ Augustine? Not a fan? As my backup, I would love him. As my starter, um,

no, I'm not. I know. I'm right there with you. To put it lightly. In fact, I will tell you, I've been covered in the NBA

for a long time, no one has ever asked me that question. Should we spend like 10 minutes on DJ Augustine here? I would rather not. So I thought they would fade. I did.

I thought they would fade down the stretch. And instead, they have really surged. And you got to give this guy an immense amount of credit, Clifford. I mean, I always thought he was a very good coach in Charlotte. What he's done in Orlando is really impressive. And I know that you're big on bright futures. Like, there's actually, that is a group of young guys. and lottery picks and whatnot that have kind of thrown it together,

it doesn't fit all that great. And yet here they are with four or five games left in the season and a real chance at making the playoffs. I give them immense credit, I do. For sure. I mean, they're a good story this season. And as you mentioned, you know, their rookie Mo Bamba has not contributed. He's been out, I believe with a foot injury,

if I remember correctly, past couple weeks. Jonathan Isaac, another lottery pick of their. drafted 6th in 2017. He has made progress, especially in the defensive end of the floor over the last couple of months. And he's somebody who you look forward, you're talking about bright futures,

the bright future magic. Jonathan Isaac is going to be a key cog in that as a versatile defender, a guy who compliments other players on offense. But the big story, though, ultimately is Nicola Vucevic, Chris. He is the hub for them on offense. All the playmaking that he does from the center position,

extending his range to three-point land the last two years, shooting 36% this year from 3, scoring over 20 points per game. Vosovich has turned himself into a really, really good player. Like, he's part of the continuing trend we're seeing with centers across the league

extending their range. And for Orlando this summer, Vosovic is somebody entering the year. You may be expected to get paid in the 17, 18 million. I'm talking Mosgoth money right here, $18, 19 million a year. Now, what is he going to get? He's going to get 20 plus million now, think, right?

I still am torn on what the big guy market is going to be. I'm being sarcastic. I'm saying Mosgoth money, by the way. No, I know. But in terms of big money out there, do you think there's going to be a lot of big money out there for the big guys? The DeAndre Jordans, the Jonas Valentinuses, the Nikola Vucevich's, the guys that are out there. It feels like the going rate on them.

Like, if you're buying stocks, I don't necessarily think I'd buy. stocks, certainly I'd buy more stocks in wings, possibly getting paid slash overpaid, than I would big guys. But I'm not sure. I think maybe dependent upon what happens in these playoffs, it might actually affect that because you know that the league is a copycat league. And so if you have somebody that plays extremely well in the post and creates a massive advantage for a team, other teams may look to that and say, you know what?

everybody's trying to do it the other way. They're all trying to have a bunch of six five to six nine guys that are multi-positional. It could switch on defense or whatever and rim runners and whatnot, whereas it's nice to have the asset that is Yang when everybody's yinin, right? As they say. And so get somebody that can create you an advantage like that. And there is no doubt in my mind that Vucevich has benefited from that because you have so many guys that now maybe wouldn't have been playing center at all, certainly five years ago,

wouldn't have been playing center. And so if you've got somebody that can really post score, it creates quite the advantage for you in an age where a lot of these guys are small and a lot of these guys are face-up players. Yeah, I mean, it's going to be interesting. You know, with Clint Capella, he signed the five-year, $90 million contract to stay with Houston last summer. And he's a great center. And with him, I do wonder, with other.

teams was a concern about his system fit, how he is just in the perfect situation for Houston and another team may not be able to replicate that. I get the most out of Capella that the Rockets can and do. With Vucevic, I wonder will he be somebody because he can fit into more different types of situations with his role, you know, spacing the floor, a little playmaking from him as well, will he be somebody that ends up getting paid a little bit more? Or are you right, Chris, that somebody like DeAndre Jordan, first of all, like DeAndre Jordan is not good anymore. So that's one of the reasons why he didn't get paid. But he still got the big

one-year deal at $23 million. So perhaps that's what ends up happening with some of these centers moving forward. They get big short-term deals rather than long-term contracts. I don't know. But it's going to be interesting. I would tell you, regarding Capella, I 100% agree with those teams that think, listen, I'm not giving his fit full credit, but it absolutely maximizes what he is. and he would be a radically different player, possibly a forgotten player, playing elsewhere. It's just perfect for his skill set. Look no further than what happened when he was out and they acquired Kenneth Farid, a totally forgotten player, completely forgotten.

But they're able to, you right, can you set the screen and can you dive to the basket? Because you have two of the greatest pick and roll players to ever play in the NBA. And can you catch lobs and can you finish those lobs? and if you can and if that is what you are, if that's what you're elite at, it's the perfect fit. Whereas on a lot of teams that aren't playing that way, I do not think it would accentuate his talents in the least.

And so part of that is he's worth the money to them. I think another team paying Capella that amount of money without the type of players that they have on the perimeter would be incredibly foolish. I do. Yeah, I'm with you. you know, you would. I'm with you on that last part with Orlando paying him.

Part of the reason why I like the Bright Future Sun so much is because of their cap flexibility moving forward. I'm not sure Rusevic is the guy you want to be paying in the $16 to $20 million range into his 30s. I want to see if this can shake out the correct way. I kind of want it. As just a fan, I would like to shake it out just a little bit differently. So I don't think that either of them are going to be, you know, taking a. Milwaukee to the brink anyway. So I kind of like the John Hammond.

That's at least a good storyline. John Hammond leaves Milwaukee. He goes to build up. And so now this is kind of what Milwaukee would have looked like a couple of years ago as he is putting together that roster in Orlando. So at least we kind of have that storyline. The guy that used to run that team now runs this team. That at least intrigues me a little bit.

And you can see some of the fingerprints on the magic that were obviously left. on Milwaukee. And I just think Brooklyn, Toronto could actually be a pretty good series. And you remember, if I'm not mistaken, that was the one, you know, those teams played a couple of years ago, and that was Maasai Ujiri walking out to the, what's it called, and Toronto wasn't that the one where he walked out on the platform? Oh, yeah, yeah, before the series began. And it was cussing about the nets, right?

Wasn't that the one? That was the Paul Pierce KG Nets, correct? Yeah, right. So I kind of like that too I kind of and I think Brooklyn Toronto could have some wildly entertaining game By the way, isn't it crazy how quickly Brooklyn has dug out of that hole? So I actually feel like this team has a future? I mean, all the draft picks they traded for those old geezers

And their player development being their player development being so good In retrospect, they robbed the Lakers for Russell. Sure, yeah. They hit on. Lavert for sure. Some of the free agent signings have been very good. They picked up Joe Harris off the scrap heap. Yeah, adding Ed Davis on a low contract.

Spencer Dinwiddie been... Adding the right veterans, Damari Carroll, a guy who Kenny Atkinson as an assistant coach with Atlanta had before. It's very important to have the right veterans on your roster. They've made so many smart moves in recent years. It would be great if they were to get rewarded with a chance to make some noise in the playoffs. even if they're not going to win a series against Toronto or in Milwaukee. But just to be in there, I think they give the team a platform to show what they can do.

Not to turn the knife on Lakers fans who have endured this ridiculous season because at least the hopes weren't high the last couple of years, but now this year the hopes were high. You look around and you go, I mean, imagine if they keep Gianjillo Russell, imagine if they keep Julius Randall. I mean, these are guys that they drafted. that are elsewhere and got nothing to show for them literally i mean i guess if you want to say kuzma which they took with one of the picks that they got back or heart but i mean whatever like

i mean i like kuzma just fine de angelo russell the guy was already an all-star this year and it looks like he could be an all-star for years to come and i'm still a big julius randall fan i mean you would if you think about that lake roster and you think all right who would you rather have, I think you'd be hard pressed to not say you'd rather have DeAngelo Russell and Julius Randall in the mix there. And so I think that is

obviously a massive part of this with the Nets. The Russell Ascension has caused this in large part. Well, he's put that team on his back. Yes. So many times they've fallen behind and he has dug them back with his perimeter shot making

improved playmaking. And lately, Chris, DeAngelo Russell has also been driving to the rim more frequently as well. The last five, six weeks, pretty much since the All-Star break, he's been getting to the rim more. And that's going to be the key ingredient for him moving forward because that shot is not always going to be falling. You can't be solely reliant on that when you're not an elite shooter.

Russell's a very good shooter, not an elite shooter, shooting 36% from three on the season. He's not Seth Curry out there, which is fine. He's not James Harden out there. It's good. So he needs to overcome that by getting to the room more often. So it's nice to see that development from him right now. He's not where he needs to be yet. But Russell has obviously entered the season making a leap.

He's made a little bit of a leap during the season as well. Probably not going to win most improved player of the year. He deserves some votes. I hope some of the people put him number one on their ballot. I'm probably going to vote for Pascal Seacum. But Russell is a very deserving candidate. And it's nice to see him make progress entering the season and then during the season. All right.

So you and I are on the same page regarding the Eastern Conference. I guess, you listen, we're fine with Orlando and Brooklyn being teams that have not made it in a while that would be there. If Miami makes it, the Wade story is at least a bit intriguing and it would be fun to see him take over a playoff game, maybe one last time. But with the way that they are in the standings, I would prefer Milwaukee, Orlando, Toronto, Brooklyn. You with me on that? Yeah, I would like that. That would be cool. Okay.

And I'm fine with Philly playing against Detroit. Whatever. Yeah. Detroit's fun. I just hope like Giffin, you know, stay healthy. Hey, they've been really good the second half of the season. Yeah, they've been great. Andre Drummond, under Drummond is a guy who has rightfully been knocked.

Oh, I didn't even think about this. We would get the Drummond Dembead trash talk. Yes. And Drummond is on another level right now. I didn't even think about this. That would be unbelievable. That would be great. Yeah, that would actually make, if I could pick the opponent for Detroit, that would be it.

Because we would get, oh, my goodness. would be great. I like the odds of that actually happening too. Yeah. Because Philly is fixed in that three spot right now. And Detroit moving forward, their schedule is Indiana at OKC, who is just not a good team right now,

versus Charlotte, versus Memphis, and then at the Knicks on the final day of the regular season. They have five games left. I like their odds of staying in the sixth spot. We already talked earlier about Brooklyn has a tough schedule. I'd be surprised if Miami were to pass Detroit or Orlando would somehow jump up

to the six. That seems improbable. So I like Detroit in that six spot. That would be fun. Drummond versus M. B. Let's go, baby. That would be good. That would actually make that a lot more entertaining, that particular match. How many games does that series go, though? Like, how deep does that go? Oh, I wouldn't be surprised if Detroit won a home game. Yeah, five game, a fun five game series. Yeah, right. Well, and you could see Blake being the bus player on the floor for one of the games. Yeah, yeah. I could see that. Maybe two. Maybe one or two of them. Yeah.

You never know. I mean, hey, they have been really good in the second half of the year. It'd be pretty cool if they could win a couple of playoff games for Dwayne Casey's benefit, considering he got ran out of Toronto. I mean, he's done a very good job there. He's done a very good job there. All right, let me get to the Western Conference. Golden State and Denver, in fact, we will tell you that is our NBA watch of the night tonight. And this is a huge game with Golden State hosting this.

Denver Nuggets on TNT tonight 1030 p.m. Eastern Time. And remember, if you want to watch every NBA game, subscribe to NBA League Pass on NBA.com or from your preferred video provider. This is right now a game that could very well decide who ends up getting home court advantage in the playoffs. Because if Denver could win, now that's really in play. And it feels like if Denver loses tonight and obviously they are a real underdog. I think the Warriors were eight point favorites tonight. But if they could, if Denver could pull the upset and win tonight, now that totally puts possibly getting the one seed in play, if they lose tonight, it ain't happening.

So we have high stakes game going on tonight, Kev. Well, when I was in Denver to write my feature, the first game against Portland, the crowd It was just nuts. It was just a great Denver Nuggets crowd. But that second game against the Golden State Warriors, first of all, Warriors fans travel well. But that was the game where Golden State travel.

They're not traveling. They live in those cities. Trust me. Regardless. There's no. Regardless. Point is that was the game where you think they're coming from Oakland, the Denver for the game?

Come on, Kevin. I don't care. Every city around the country. I don't care how they got there. I don't care if they took the train. I don't care if they traveled. by helicopter Kobe style. I don't care if they walked there.

They were in the building. That's it. They travel. Talk about like their Nebraska cornhoster fans. That's irrelevant. What matters is that was the game where Golden State scored 51 in the first quarter.

And I've never seen a quarter that explosive. And I think a win tonight for the Nuggets is just preventing that from happening. That's all. That's all. It's going to be hard to win this game in Oakland against the Warriors. It's not going to be easy. I think with Golden State moving forward, with how Denver has sort of slid as of late,

Golden State is probably going to get the one seed. But you must admit, with this particular Warriors team, we have no idea. If they came out... I think we have an idea. No, I'm saying if they threw out a clunker, it would not be the most shocking thing ever. And if they went out and scored 45 points in the first quarter and had 100 by halftime, it wouldn't be the craziest thing in the world. Like, we have seen it.

It was just a few weeks ago where we talked about Boston. When everybody is down on Boston, they get to go play there. And they beat the brakes off them. So, like, this Warriors team, it's been, obviously, boom, more than bust. But, like, there have been games where it's like, what happened there? You don't necessarily know. They have not been the model of consistency in terms of performance. And if Denver plays like their whole life is on the line, I don't know.

I wouldn't think it's necessarily a foregone. Obviously, we know if the Warriors are locked in. nobody has that has a great chance. But they haven't been locked in a lot throughout the year. Do you think besides Houston, is there a team in the Western Conference that you feel confident could actually beat Golden State? Or is Houston not even in that?

Like, can Denver beat Golden State in a seven-game series? Can Utah? OKC would have been the one to me. OKC would have been the one. And I'm totally out on them. Totally out. Okay. All right.

I would have told you during that three weeks span where George looked like, where he had thrown himself in an MVP conversation, first team all NBA, the whole nine. Then I thought to myself. He's having an all-time season, really. Yes. Right. Like, he might not have won MVP, but just unbelievable.

But it's obviously not the same right now. And so I still think OKC might could win a game or two against them, but I don't think that they are a real threat. If it's not Houston, as you say, which, of course, listen, anytime you've got Hardin and Paul with Capella, you've got a chance. But I would think that God, that team's fun to watch. Outside of them,

shut up. Utah. Utah would be my other one. If I thought like somebody could play them tough, Utah would be the other one. But do I think anybody can beat them? The answer is no.

Yeah, I'm with you. I think Denver can make it an interesting series. I don't. So you think, are you talking sweep here? I think Denver. West of Commerce's finals. West of Commerce's finals has goal

and state vent. Like how far do you think that series goes? Because it's not going to be the way. Denver would not get past Houston if it's two and three. Yeah, true. I guess it depends on how it shakes out. Yeah, right now, if you told me to predict, I would tell you it will be Golden State in Utah at Denver, Houston,

with OKC having a chance. I don't know. Who do you want to play against Isaac? Your clippers. In the first round you're talking about? Yeah, you'd rather drop to seven than play Houston. I think Denver or Portland is probably the ideal matchup for the clippers. But you would certainly rather play Denver than Houston?

Oh, absolutely, yeah. No question. Okay, well, then you need your team to drop a spot. Yeah, I mean, we'll see. I mean, I don't think it's that unlikely that the Clippers could be the five-seat by the end of this. Oh. We'll see how it shakes out.

The jazz are quite good. But it's not completely unlikely. Yeah, not completely unlikely. Of those bottom three, wouldn't you agree with me, Kev, that you would believe probably an Oakland? Oklahoma City the most. I know I just crapped all over them, but I still would, just because of the two guys, right? You've got two cracks. Of the best player on the floor. Of the Cruppers, Spurs, and Thunder? Yeah. Yes. I don't know. Maybe this is recency bias slipping in here, but I'm not so sure that it is. Because so much of the confidence in them at the time was in Paul George having an MVP caliber season. And without him having that, his shooting efficiency has just fallen off a cliff since he,

came back from that shoulder injury, just falling off. We've talked about this before. We've spit out the stats. It's the same. I don't know if I can feel that way anymore. I think with San Antonio, the defense that they've played as of late, there are different styles that they take on depending on which

personnel is on the floor with Aldrin and DeRosen, more mid-range, and then everybody else shooting a lot of threes. They have a lot of good players on their roster and they can play different ways. Now, obviously they have Greg Popovich as well. And then with LA Clippers as well, another team with a lot of good players.

It feels silly to say I would take them over O'KC right now, but I'm not so sure things are the same anymore. I think with OKC with Paul George's regression or whatever's happened with him with the injury, it changes everything for that roster as a whole. They just don't have the amount of depth that some of these other teams have. I think I would take both Clippers and Spurs

over O'C entering the playoffs. Unless Paul George, unless Paul, if you're telling me Paul George doesn't get better from what he is now, I would stand by what I just said But if you're telling me, Paul George gets back to 85% of what he was

when he was at his peak this season, that things would change. There just has been no reason to believe that he will. There's something wrong with him. Would you at least agree with me on if I told you Oklahoma City beat Denver that you would not be totally blown away? I would be surprised.

You would? Yeah, I think Denver's a really good team. They have slid as of late. But that's another team that has depth in the ability to play different ways, depending on who they throw out there. They have options. And if anything, that's been one of the issues as of late is like they have so many guys. Yeah, I know.

But it's just 95% of the time the young up-and-coming team has to lose before they win. And they've taken no losses yet, right? Like, you know, high stakes, playoff losses. But are you really trusting Russell Westbrook? I mean, you've lost the first round two years in a row. get it. I get it. Is there any reason to trust that they will get out of the first round this season when Paul George is playing the way he has as of late? And like I love I love the season that Paul George was having, but right now it's just not the same. He's falling out of the MVP race. He definitely isn't first team all NBA right now. I just think that they've done nothing the last 20 games for me to believe that. Okay. But if there's a switch, it could be flipped. They're sealing. If they're at their best with Russ and Paul George and Stephen Adams, that they're seeing.

is greater than the other two. Again, you're betting on a lot. You're betting on something that has not taken place in the last quarter of the season. But if it does, they're a problem. They're a real problem. Sure. 100% with you.

More so than those other teams. Like, I think their potential is top four seed, and they just have underwhelmed greatly. I do not think that those other teams have that potential. I think they've probably maxed out what they have, the clippers and the spurs. I think that's very fair. I agree with you.

Totally. But I'm fine with these matchups. You'd get the, listen, if it does shake out the way the projections are right now, it'd be Golden State and the Spurs, Denver OKC, Houston versus... No, it would be Denver, San Antonio. No, no, no, no. I'm saying the projections. Oh, the projections.

The projections, yeah, yeah. Taking into account the rest of their schedule, the analysis says it would be Golden State, San Antonio, Denver, OKC, Houston Clippers. Oh, so we get to see the Chris Paul trade on the floor. There you go. And then Portland, Utah.

That's what it says right now. Honestly, you could shuffle these matchups any way you want to. They're all pretty good in the West. They're all pretty good. Yeah. I agree with you. I think for a long time we thought that Golden State

is much more vulnerable than they've ever been, but then you look at it and you're like, all right, which are these teams you want to bank on, beating them? And that's hard. Right. I don't feel great about it. don't feel great about putting my head on a guillotine for any of these.

Kevin, we've got to talk about the NBA draft. I'll take a quick break. And on the other side, I want to ask you about the NCAA tournament and some of these prospects and how they performed. We'll do that after these words. Today's episode of the mismatch is brought to you by ship. Men, if you're ready for a new way to date online, listen up. Ship, S-H-I-P is awesome.

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I suppose by many of the mock drafts that have come out, the two highest rated players for the next level are Jared Colver at Texas Tech and D'Andre Hunter at Virginia. I'll give you my opinion first. I will tell you, I have ended up liking, Culver a lot more, and I have gotten much more lukewarm on DeAndre Hunter. What about you? Well, I mean, I'm feeling lukewarm on both of them, really. I think with Culver, he had some issues getting past NBA caliber athletes, creating off the dribble. And with Culver, he's somebody who he hits a lot of tough mid-range jump shots at this level. And that, I believe we said this last week, that's a good thing in the sense that it's nice to see him hitting tough contested shots, but it's a bad thing in the sense that his shot creation is not great.

He's stiff with the ball in his hands. He doesn't have a great first step. He doesn't have a great second step either. That move where guys just extend to create space against their defender. He doesn't have those little quirks in his game. We've seen that. He had a very inefficient weekend, even though Texas Tech had success. Yeah, Culver has a long way to go, but he looks like a good player once he does develop.

As you project his three-point shot forward, the fact that he plays. plays hard, that he works hard, all of these positive quality, he's going to be a good player. But I didn't love him this weekend. And then with DeAndre Hunter, it wasn't great. His game is just slow. He's a slow decision maker. He has a slow shooting release. I just don't see it with him on the offensive end of the floor.

Like, there was talk. I think some of the talk that's been out there about taking him ahead of, like, R.J. Barrett, I think is just ridiculous. What the hell? That talks silly, Chris. But with DeAndre Hunter, he's more like just a good role player. Barrett's the guy who has star upside. Hunter is somebody. He has a lane to be a very good role player.

In the ringer's NBA draft guide, I have Lou Aldang, Damari, Carol, and Jay Crowder as three of the shades of comparison for DeAndre Hunter. He can be a good player. But as we saw this weekend with Virginia and the whole tournament for that matter, he's just slow offensively. He's not a great decision maker, a solid shooter when he is space, but he has a slow release. There's questions with him on the end of the floor. The defense, that's going to be what can.

gives him a chance to be really good in the NBA because of his size and versatility. But I would like to see more from him on the offensive end at 21 years old. I always want to give people credit for their work when we are doing the show. And so that whole RJ Barrett Hunter talk, I will mention, that was theblindscout.com. Everybody wants to check that out. You're giving away a pretty good name for like a podcast or the podcast or a website. The Blind Scout. That's actually a really good name.

The Blind Scout. Yeah. I wonder if anybody owns it. Somebody's going to own it by 8 p.m. Eastern tonight. I promise you that. I think we should buy that. Yeah. Jump on it.

The Blind Scout. I like that. It almost sounds like maybe it's a band name, the Blind Scout. The Blind Scout. That's the guy that actually has the Andre Hunter ranked over R.J. Barrett. RJ Barrett super pissed me off at the end of that game. But I can still see the talent that goes along. with that guy. It is undeniable. He's big. He's got good vision. Yeah. And that's the thing. He has

good vision. Like that dude can pass. Well, like, how about you give it to the big unstoppable guy? Like, is that possible? So I don't get. I need to say this about RJ real quick. Yeah. I just don't understand because he has these moments where at 6-7, he has the natural height to see over the defense that he makes passes that other guys just cannot make tough, difficult cross-court passes smart reads where it's like, ooh, this guy with his size, he can be a great playmaker. And he can be.

But sometimes it's like by choice, he puts the blinders on and just is a total black hole driving to the rim where he will not pass no matter what, no matter how much you're screaming at TV, as much as Coach Kaye is those thoughts are running through his head,

kick it out, kick it out, kick it out. He doesn't. And part of that, I wonder how much of it is. symptom, empowerment to score by Coach K because they don't have good shooters on their team. You're not kicking it out to a 40% three-point shooter. You're kicking it out to a 30% three-point shooter.

How much of it is that? His understanding that, like, I have a better chance of drawing a foul and getting to the line here than I am at kicking it out to some crappy shooter. Is it that that or is it the fact that, like, he just gets into this mode where when he sees Zion do these crazy things, he's like,

now I got to do something. I got to do it. Because sometimes it feels like that. Either way, he has these moments, Chris, where as you just said, it's great vision. And you project forward and you're like, this guy can be a great playmaker for your team. But then there's those times where he just makes these dumb decisions, dude. And it is infuriating. But I still, you know, moving forward, I lean towards the positive with him.

He's a smart player, a hardworking player, everything I've heard about him. He's won at every level. Team Canada has invested so much in him. He comes from a basketball family. I think RJ wants to be a really good player. And I think at some point, things will click for him. And some of these concerns now may persist. Maybe he'll always have moments where he makes, quote, unquote, selfish plays.

But I think for the most part, I feel good about RJ being a good player. He's gone from slightly overrated to very underrated, in my opinion. Yeah, Zion obviously lived up to the billing. The guy's unbelievable. Super dominant all year. And when the lights came on, the brightest, when you are projected to go number one, There are guys like Derek Rose who raised his level, Zion Williamson. And then there's the other guys, which maybe we should have seen it coming,

with somebody like Andrew Wiggins, who, right, disappeared completely and got knocked out by the Stanford team. Had no business. You just didn't even notice him on the court. So some guys, some guys aren't there when it matters most. And so guys are. And Zion lived up to the billing. Barrett, while I got frustrated with him at the end, I still, like, to me, I don't know, as this is shaking out, it's Zion and Morant.

That's what I told you last week. And I think there's a drop. And then I think Barrett's right there by himself. But like, bro, get this Cam Reddish thing off my mock drafts. Like, no. I don't. Like, I don't, he's been up there at like four throughout this year. I mean, listen, the guys that have been at like four, the Redishes, the hunters and the

culvers and all of these guys. Like, I do think there is a total. open door from four down. I will be stunned if the top three is not Zion, Morant, and Barrett. And then once we get to four, I mean, like at this point,

I'm looking and I'm going, shit, it can be Darius Garland. Like, if you told me, at least he's unknown. You know what I'm saying? Like,

at least I don't know. Whereas, like, I mean, the Reddish thing, like, I don't get it. I,

honestly, I don't get it. I have a question for you about Cam Renish. Okay. Yeah. Let's say, he was not the number two high school recruit. Let's say he was not number two behind R.J. Barrett,

not number two ahead of Zion Williamson and all these other guys. Let's say he wasn't. Let's say we didn't know Cam Renish entering Duke. I do wonder how much of our criticism of him, rightful criticism of his style is due to the status that he entered college with. Let's just say we didn't know who Cam Redish was.

Would you look at him and be like, ooh, those are some nice plashions. is, you know, 6-8, 6-9 from the perimeter? Certainly. What will he be in eight years? Yeah, certainly the expectations do hurt that. But, I mean, we're seeing that with, there's a top 10 high school kid that was on that Duke team last year.

I don't even know if he got drafted. Maybe he got drafted in the 50s at Trayvon DeVall. You know, I mean, Trayvon Duvall was in the top five or ten of every recruiting ranking under the sun. Duval can't shoot, though. I get it. But he just was. Well, Cam Reddish, like, where is the motor?

I know, and I'm right there with you. I agree. All I'm saying is like how much of his due to the expectations and the perception of him as a elite high school recruit entering college? Whereas like I said, if he were a non-top 100 guy

and he popped up onto the scene randomly on Duke or some other team and he had an identical season to what he had, which was not great, but he had some moments. Totally fair. Yeah, and like his defense was good towards the end of the season,

long, versatile defender. And yeah, he fades. But I do wonder, would we be like, oh, maybe he's someone who's a raw project? But five years from now, you're gambling on him figuring things out. Like, that's still true with him. And I look at those guys after the top three with Zion and then however you want to go with Morant and Barrett, I still look at Reddish at four. And I'm like, I realize I might lose my job by the time he ends up being a player.

but I do wonder though if he does end up being a guy five, six years from him, just going to take a long time for him or it will never happen because he doesn't seem to have that mindset. He doesn't seem to have that, you know,

dog in him. Like Zion said after their game, he's like, Killers Kill. I'm not sure Camerunish has that. Not sure? No, fine, fine.

I am. We know he doesn't have that. Right. We know he doesn't have that. You don't develop that, Kevin. I know you don't. Yeah, but here's the thing, though. It's okay if you don't.

have it. Like, not everybody has that. He can still be a good player and not have that. That's right. You're Andrew Wiggins. Sure. You're Rudy Gay, you're Jeff Green, you're... Right? Yeah, I mean... Sure. A talented guy that frustrates a hell like get you fired. Exactly. Exactly. My only point is with him, I wonder how much of it is perception.

And maybe 10 years from now, we look back and be like, oh, yeah, all those pre-draft criticisms of Camerunters were overblown, but they're not overblown because they're real. They're real. Because in the moment, they're real. But I do wonder if they end up not mattering quite as much 10 years from now. A guy at 6-8 who can create on the perimeter, who can hit shots off the dribble, create space off the dribble. I can pass as well. I juxtapose his performance and what I watched in the tournament against the kid from Carolina. Little, who obviously wasn't able to put the end at full strength.

But little who throughout the year, you're kind of like, all right, where is it? Like, why was this guy ranked in the top five, top 10? And then when the brightest lights came on, that kid, like, there's a five-minute span in one of those games. I mean, he dominates both ends of the court completely. And you see it. Like, at least I saw it. They're like, oh, okay, I get it now, right? With this dude, because he is, like, murdering everybody.

Like, that never happened. That flash of, like, three minutes where you were like, whoa, who's this guy for Duke? So I tell you, like, there's two different prospects, both incredibly. highly rated, and there's nothing more I would have loved to have seen than Cam Reddish just be the best player on the floor for five minutes. I mean, hell, you know who is the best player on the floor for five minutes in the second round Duke game? The Jones kid, Tyos' little brother.

Trey Jones. He took over the game completely. Like there's a five-minute span where he was just, like, if you didn't know anything about any of these guys, you'd be like, my God, that point card's awesome. And you saw him, he was the one breaking down the most at the time. the end of the game. Like, I love that. I love kids that care that much. And so you just, I don't know, I kept on waiting for it with Reddish. Well, one quick known on Sierra Little, I think with him, like, he has really struggled this season. I'm not high on him at all. But I will just say this

in his favor. He was a late bloomer in high school to rise to become an elite recruit. And with him, very raw right now, he could also be a late bloomer in college, right? He's not going to stay four years, but if he were, he could be a late bloomer. And, yeah, don't get me wrong. I'm not in love with the kid, but if somebody told me, hey, did you watch that, right? There was at least a time where I watched him and he was the best player on the floor. That's happened for a couple minutes.

I didn't see that with Reddish at all. Let's get to the big one. I have never seen a performance like the performance over the weekend from Carson Edwards. Oh, that was, oh my goodness. And my son, unbelievably, who is nine years old after we watched

all the highlights together the next morning, said he reminded him of Celtics Isaiah Thomas, which I was like, why didn't I come up with this? It's a good comp. Well, because he had 42 points and zero assists, right? But it is like a reasonable comp, and I will tell you that there's going to be people that knock it, like, who does he guard, and he's so small, and where does he fit in the NBA? Listen, let me tell you something.

If you could shoot the ball like that, 10 feet behind the three point line, you can be just fine, right? we'll find you a spot. That was unbelievable, Kevin. Unbelievable. And I've got to wonder. Carson Edwards has not been on anybody's list, certainly not high on anybody's list. And he's not going to go high in the NBA draft.

But he certainly, if he enters his name, goes to that combine, break some people off at those, I don't know. It's been few and far between. And I feel like you watch that, and then he'll come in the NBA. and I'll have 31 night

and it'll be like, why did everybody pass on him? Because we all saw it, right? Like, using the highest stakes game of his life, the kid was absolutely unstoppable. What do you thinking on Edwards? Well, I mean, he's somebody,

some of the questions when he tested the waters last year still persist with the playmaking ability. As you mentioned, the zero assist couldn't successfully execute that pass at the end of the game when Purdue lost. Those are still questions with him. He's small. Defense is going to be a question moving forward. So really, it's like the mold for him is, you know, you're looking at these spark plug point

guards that come off the bench and just light it up. You're not asking for playmaking for them. You're not asking for defense. You're just asking for buckets. And in that sense, and this year's drafts, I would feel good about drafting Carson Edwards. If that's what you need, I think when you draft Carson Edwards, you're drafting for need. You're drafting a young point guard who's going to enter the league at 21 years old that can hopefully contribute early on on a rookie contract. I think it's a bit much

to expect more than him being a six man for you. But that's okay if you're drafting that with like the 18th, 19th, 20th pick. I'd be happy with that, wouldn't you? Oh, you're really static about that. It's not a question of if he can get buckets. It's only a question of how many he can

get. Yeah. That guy, I've never seen anything like that, Kev. It's not hyperbole. Anybody can go back and Watch that, those highlights. I mean, that dude is pulling 10 feet behind that college three line. I mean, we guys running at him coming off screens. I mean, he was just outrageous, absolutely outrageous. And he did it every friggin round, every round.

He almost carried that team to the frigging final four. And nobody knows anybody else on that team. Nobody. He really almost put that team completely on his back and drug him to the final four. Yeah. I mean, there's still going to be questions with him moving forward, but I do like him as a gamble in the late first round.

All right. Did the Gonzaga kids, did your opinion change on either of them positively or negatively, Hachamura and Clark? Not really. My opinion really didn't change with either of them, Chris. I think with Clark, depending on who you talk to in the NBA, he's a love him or hate him prospect. Right now at 22, he'll turn 23 during his rookie season.

with his age, people question the upside, the jump shot has improved a little bit, but still not quite where you want it to be. Personally, I really like Clark. Despite some of his limitations, I think he can play a versatile defensive role for you. He's a smart player. I think some of the things he's asked to do at Kanzaga aren't things he's going to have to do in the NBA. So those limitations or those weaknesses are irrelevant in that sense. It's just a matter of where you're drafting him. Some people have him ranked in the lottery. There's others who have him ranked in the late first round. It's going to be interesting to see where he goes. Whereas with Rui, he shows some really strong moments on the defensive end of the floor, but then some moments

where he looks like he doesn't have a clue of what he's doing. Honestly, man, like, it's kind of weird to say this, but with Rui, like, if he comes out now, I do wonder if there's incentive for him to go back for one year, because he's improved drastically each season at Gonzaga. Maybe you go back and after your senior season, you make another leap. Maybe the leap this season, as a senior comes on the defensive end of the floor. This season it was on offense. Maybe next year it's the defense that makes a leap, and then you enter the 2020 draft.

I think it'd be a little scary just because this is a weak draft. But next year won't necessarily be much stronger. It might not be that much stronger, but again, you have a whole other year for everybody to pick you apart. The unknown is always to your benefit. And if you don't get better, then it's like, oh, you got to strike while the iron's hot. The unknown is always to your benefit. It really is, unless you are,

going to greatly improve. What typically happens is you go back to school and then we pick you apart completely. He's already been there for three years now as a junior. I get it. I get it. Well, and then you got guys like Kevin O'Connor next year

saying, he's going to be 21. You know, listen, let me just say this about age, especially in this year's draft. Carson Edwards at 21, Brandon Clark at 22. Some of these guys may have, you know,

less upside because of their age. But the advantage of drafting an older guys the fact that on paper, he may be more ready to contribute on a rookie deal in a draft where there's going to be a lot of swings and misses in this year's draft class on younger guys. Let me ask you about one of the other games real quick. I do feel like PJ Washington made himself some money.

He was good, man. I like him. The Harper kid at Auburn is no lie, no hyperbole. That is one of the fastest guys with a basketball that I've ever seen in my life. That was outrageous. He is playing in a game loaded. with athletes, and it looked like he was like from like the friggin' Incredibles or something.

He's flying past everybody. Like they're all going one speed. And then this dude is like end to end. I was like, my God, this guy is faster than shit. So I feel like that's a perfect one, right? Like I don't know if Harper would enter his name or whatever, but it's like whatever the opinion of somebody is. Like Carson Edwards, he's not going to make your opinion great. of him than it is right now.

And I guess we're going to see in the Virginia game with the Harper kid, but speed kills and that kid has got it. And I will say on the other side, PJ Washington, you know, we probably, probably becomes like a high-level role player, I think is destiny in the NBA, which are great to have. But I think there's no doubt he made himself some money because he was awesome in that game. I mean, in the draft guy, I don't love these comps that we have for him, but we have Taj Gibson, Jeremy Grant, Bryce Johnson.

I'm open to suggestions on better ones because Grant is better as a defender. And so is Gibson than Washington is. Well, I actually went back. I was thinking about this and this guy's probably a better defender too. Of course, it comes to mind and it's kind of lazy just because he bears the same name. But he is a little PJ Brownie.

I don't know if that's, if you'd have been too young. No, no, I know. Maybe some of our listeners, but yeah, I know PJ Brown could be a starter on a good team, right? very good career, but role player. He's a high level role guy that you like having on your team.

And I know it obviously comes to mind simply because they're both named PJ, but he does kind of remind me a little bit of that. You know, he does. That's an all-time easy comp. Yeah, I know, right? I mean, it's not like I'm, it's right? I don't know. I guess, I guess it could have been, it could have been even late.

Hey, what is another guy named PJ? Oh, PJ Brow. But it stands the reason they are like each other in many ways, honestly. PJ Brown could stretch out and knock down a three for you. And PJ Brown played hard and, you know, was a fiery guy. And obviously Washington brings that to the table. You know who you remind me of, Chris? Don't you dare.

Chris Hemsworth. I thought you were going to say Chris Pratt. Chris Kringle. I don't know. All right. Here's what I know. the NCAA tournament now. I suppose Culver and Hunter could probably

oh, Ty Jerome. Hey, you know how I always talk to you about the Malcolm Brogdens and what's the kid's name at Nova that's playing point guard Brunson. Brunson. The Jalen Brunson's, the Fred Van Vleet, the veteran guard that gets

drafted later than he probably should. It becomes essential possibly for an NBA team. I do feel that with the Jerome kid. I like him, Kev. I like him. This year's draft class, there's some solid potential role players in there. There will 100% be the misses that we are talking about.

And then I do feel like this is one of those years where we're going to get down and we're going to go, how the hell did John Collins go 20 or whatever, right? I do feel that. I feel like you're going to be able to find people in the second half of the first round that I would not be surprised if there's a couple of them. that are in the second half of that first round that end up being guys that within one to three years' time we look and go, they should have gone in the top ten.

Sure. It's a hard draft to scout. It really is. I mean, it's a hard draft, but a fun draft in the sense that people within the lee, I'm not sure if this will be true publicly, but I think people are going to have drastically different rankings. A GM might have totally different rankings

than his second guy in command, the assistant general manager. It is going to be different. across the league on draft night there's going to be so whoa what are they thinking picks you know like draft express has this guy ranked 40 how is he going 10 you know the ringer has this guy ranked 15 how'd he end up falling to 40 like there's going to be some of that and i look forward to the madness on draft night it's going to be a good time we're less a long ways away it is but this is the last time we get to see these college kids playing yeah before it gets to that point kevin it is

always a pleasure i will talk to you next week see you chris thanks everybody for listening if you dig what you're here and go give us a rating and review on iTunes five stars five stars really helps and we will talk to you next week