The Ringer NBA Show - Identity Crises: The Knicks, Timberwolves, and More Intriguing Teams. | Group Chat

Episode Date: November 14, 2024

Justin, Rob, and Wos take a look at four teams that they believe are still searching for their identity and discuss what kind of team the Knicks, Timberwolves, Nuggets, and Heat should be moving forward. Knicks (8:50) Timberwolves (26:50) Nuggets (42:12) Heat (52:35) The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny Lambre Producer: Isaiah Blakely Additional Production Supervision: Ben Cruz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey y'all. Sirot Sohi from The Ringer here, and I wanted to let you guys know about a new show that I'm hosting. The Ringer WNBA show. We're going to be talking about all the biggest personalities, breaking down and analyzing the latest happenings that make the W so fascinating, featuring some of the best guests and experts from around the league. Tap in with us on the brand new Ringer WNBA show feed on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. For group chat, I am Justin Barrier. Joining me, Rob Mahoney, Big Was. Guys, we come here for fun to talk hoops as just friends, but I have to talk about something serious right off the bat. I have noticed that neither of you are following me on Blue Sky and we need to fix that immediately.

Would you say your blue sky presence is as abrasive as your Twitter presence? It's actually not existing at this point because I started an account but I have not tweeted nor have I really figured out how to follow people or to track people. So I'm a babe in the woods out there. I'm not on Blue Sky, therefore I can't follow anybody. So, sorry about that. But, yeah, I'll be on there by the end of day. I got the pink from Howard back. I'm going to be up there tweeting stuff.

And, like, yeah, somebody just a couple of ads last night got on my nerves on Twitter. And I was like, you know what? Y'all don't deserve this heat. I'm taking my business elsewhere. I'm taking my ball home with me. Rob, where do you want us to meet? Where do you want to hang out with your legion of fans? Not on social media.

Well, I mean, with legions of fans, I don't think that's good for any of us. I'm in the touch grass space. Go for the real blue sky. You know what I'm saying? Like, let's get out in the world. Let's try to be people in the actual physical universe. But also, look, I am a professional in this industry. And so I, too, unfortunately, will be on blue sky because I am beholden to this, Justin.

I am an addict like the rest of you. and clearly I can't cut the cord on some sort of stream-based social media platform. What about those people that give out a number? I don't think it's the real number, but it's like a lot of influencers like, hey, you can text me

and it's a whole like text relationship with people. Are you interested in that at all? This sounds very only fans. What exactly? What kind of content are you talking to? I don't know that that's for me, but I'm with Waz. Look, like we got to take,

we got to take our quality, content where it is appreciated, where it is deserved. I will say some of that has been on Twitter historically, even for this podcast. We had lots of inquiries as to why we did not do a pod on Monday. I appreciate that we were missed, you know? We took a day off for the holiday and people really felt our absence. I think it was one, one inquiry. No, there were more than, there was more than one.

Pay some damn respect to the veterans, please. This used to be a major national holiday. Shouts to the management up at Spotify, recognizing the importance of being a in recognition of the great sacrifice that our veterans have made for every single person in the U.S. And so I was happy we had a day off, y'all. I'm sure you. Was this happy we had a day off.

Yeah. I had no idea. I don't know what to tell you. But look, it takes a Swedish company to appreciate the U.S. military. We all know that. That's right. You're welcome, NATO. So we're in the midst of NBA Cup season.

do you guys think that since the NBA Cup games hit different? Do you think this pod in the midst of Cup season will hit different? Is it Cup season though? Like the games are happening intermittently on Tuesdays and Fridays, I believe. Yeah, they got those fancy courts with the like the sublimated like just graphics now. We got roses in Portland. Yeah. I dig it.

I dig the competition of Cup season. I dig the courts. But the games in between don't really feel like Cup season. So it is kind of cup season, but also just regular old standard issue basketball season. That Mavs' Warriors game alone is justification for all you need for up into Annie during Cup season. I don't know if it was more Cup or stick it to Clay Thompson season, but the Warriors were super duper keyed up for this game, particularly Draymond and Steph.

like they were on 50 out of 10 on Tuesday. And that was one of the more enjoyable regular season experiences of a while. Even, you know, the wacky heat pistons ending was incredible. You guys know, I'm fully bought in on the Emirates Cup. And so shout to the NBA for putting this together. We knew we can count on you to get the branding, right? Yeah. Well, it's always paying those checks, man.

Absolutely shameless stuff. Ridiculous. It is fun to be out there. The courts are weird and gimmicky in a fun way. It's also fun to see a lot of players out there pretend like this is a huge deer. There's just a lot of people buying in almost as if Adam Silver has like the gun pressed to the back of their spine right there. Oh, come on. It's a little, you know, a lot of people trying.

I appreciate the effort. I appreciate people who try. And I think we're all trying. I think we would all love for November and December basketball to mean more. And so there is a vested interest as part of the basketball community. And like, look, let's take this stuff a little bit more seriously than the other games. And I think the scheduling does help in that way, was like, you're right that the matchup, you know, Clay Thompson's return to the bay.

That's a juicy piece of basketball to put on television. In theory, you know, Nick Sixers is a juicy piece of television to put on after their playoff battle. And so it's like the more you can get those sorts of games in the mix, as the sort of like cup groupings allow. I think the better off this stuff is going to be. Rob Mahoney bought and pay for by Emeritus. You could follow him at Rob Emeritus Mahoney. Emeritus.

What Emeritus? What is Emeritus, my guy? What are you doing? Oh, my God. Somebody's clearly never been to Abu Dhabi before. Not yet. If we try hard enough, maybe they'll get me over there. All right.

since we're talking around the Knicks, let's get to the matter at hand here. The bit today is, who are you? You know, not just you as podcasters, but these teams that we're going to talk about, teams that are kind of out of sorts to start the season. We aren't totally sure what their identity is or they had an identity or we thought we knew who they were to begin with. Kind of shifted over time. Rob is looking at me quizzically as if he could see me just reached it in order to try

to put this all together. But that's the bit. Any questions? Oh, well, I was promised an audio drop. Oh. So we didn't do anything in advance, but I think I could do a live performance for you guys. I would love that. Who are you?

Who, who, who, who, who. How's that? Thank you, Justin. It was exquisite. I really want to know about the New York Knickerbockers. Let's just clip that, save that for later. Drop it whenever we need. a lunch slash breakfast right now

as he produces the pod and Justin is about to make him choke on his freaking meal. Live drops. That's where we progress to now. Is there a generation of people for whom that is just the, isn't that the theme song of like

one of the CSIs or NCIS or one of those procedurals? The Miami one. Is it the Miami one? Miami and also it used to be in like car commercials or whatever. It was in all kinds of commercials

when I was growing up, man. I said WPiX Channel 11. I guess what I'm wondering is, is there a demographic that is watching CSI Miami that is young enough to not be familiar enough with the original song

to think that, oh, this is the CSI Miami song. Yeah, I think they're all on blue sky and they're listening to this podcast right now. No actual young people are on blue sky. It is strictly millennials, like strictly old enough to be ingrained in social media,

but not young enough to be on Snapchat. That's really where it is. There you go. That'll save us. All right, let's start. first and foremost with the Knicks, the team that I think we're all kind of watching curiously as they go through the start of their season,

five and six. Rob, to a certain extent, they kind of are who we thought they would be, electric on offense at times. Defense has been pretty bad. I guess I've been struck by the extremes thus far. They've seemed better and more consistent offensively than I thought they would be to start the season.

Defensively, they've been horrid at times. Yeah, I'm surprised at how quickly they have become a cat team. And I mean that not in the sense that he's their best player or their most important player, but like they have kind of taken on his playing identity in a lot of ways. They have to outscore you with brute force offense, just like raw point totals, or else they have no shot on defense. And some of that is cat himself, I think it's been awesome offensively and really just like a crucial lifeline for a team that needs a creator like him. And also maybe

the worst full-time rim protector in the entire league. Like just is giving absolutely nothing. think back there on a team that already has a lot of gaps to fill already is shallow when you go beyond the starters and mcale bridges we should say just has not played up to his level like it brings me no joy to say that wing stop can be officially retired put to bed before it even started unless we want to talk about mcale bridges specifically getting absolutely fried out there that is the only way in which this is working and applies but uh it's it's been tough sledding i think for their defense overall and i here's the thing was i don't know how it gets that that that much better. I think Mikhail can play a little better, but

overall, these are kind of their problems. Yeah, they need to change it to pit stop, because McHale Bridges is just a pit stop on the way to the rack. It's pretty embarrassing how badly he's getting cooked out there. And, look, 20th ranked defense, I'm sorry, they have more defensive talent than the 20th ranked defense in the league,

even with Carl Towns being the piss poor rim protector that he is, because again, we saw it in Minnesota with Aunt Edwards and Jada McDaniels, right? It was like, look, we have incredible wings. They have to sell out on defense in order to protect Kat. But, like, that was good enough to get them to, like, 12. We're not saying this is going to be a top 10 dominant defense in any way, shape, or form. But you don't have to be bottom third of the league.

There's no reason for that. And it just makes me feel like there's not a sense of urgency. at the moment. And I think guys just got to try harder, man. Like, it can't, like, it has to be a team effort in terms of getting this thing to above average, again, or close to average. It's never going to be incredible unless they're able to swing a trade.

Or Mitchell Robinson, quite frankly, is able to play more minutes because Kat has already learned how to play defense next to an elite rim-protecting center. And then now everybody sort of slots down on the defensive pecking order. And I think they become like a real freaking defense when that happens. But as it stands right now, they have to be able to tread water. And they're only going to be able to do that with more effort, man.

Like it just can't be this. Yeah, precious Chua isn't out there either. So their bench is really Deuce McBride and stuff. Like it's occasionally campaign. It's occasionally more Jericho Sims. And then just like a host of other guys that you thought might not still be in the NBA. like Matt Ryan is out there. When you're panic signing Matt Ryan, it's not good.

Not a good sign. No. Because they don't have the finances to even sign him outright. So they drafted him in the G League draft. And also Landry Schammett, same thing, is ultimately going to join the Knicks when he makes just enough to where they can bring him to the big boy club. And so it is kind of a mess in that regard. I think the concern is that like the defensive like issues that they're having aren't

really depth concerns. It's actually the starting unit that has been getting absolutely toasted out there. a hundred and twenty two point three defensive rating for this starting unit. I think it would have been fine for Kat to be your lone rim protector at the very least if your wing defense was up to snuff. But I think this ultimately brings us back to the McHale Bridges conversation. It's just they traded all of those picks. And I just assumed that they knew something, Rob, about McHale Bridges that we all didn't,

that they could find a nice version of him where, yeah, he would be the stopper he was in Phoenix. But we could have a version of the offense that he was in Brooklyn. So maybe it's not to that volume, but there was another level to him. He's been bad on both ends at this point. Yeah, I think in the best case scenario, he's the sort of piece of this team that modulates depending on the matchup, right? Like every contender needs those guys in like the third or fourth spots on the pecking order who, when the situation calls for it, can pop off for 25, can pop off for 30 on a great night in addition to playing a good sound team defense. I think that the defense has been the more worrying thing for me because overall offensively, like, look, we should say, oh, zoom out.

The Knicks, although they are under 500 presently as we're recording, are lights out offense and are busting teams up in general. Like, they are a winning team on balance by point differential. They just can't stop anybody. And he has to be great for them to be able to stop people consistently. Like there is no way to the sort of like league average benchmark that Wazer's laying out if McHale Bridges isn't great. And they invested him in that way.

They gave up the picks that would suggest to us he's a real. important part of this team structurally after you trade for cat he's even more important to your team defense and the reality of some of that is i think macaille is a really good defender and maybe has been a little bit overstated historically has has been maybe i'll just put a little bit too high where o g to me is one of the the very few like wing perimeter guys who is a game changing defensive force i don't think mikhail is that and he doesn't he doesn't have to be quite up to that level but he needs to be significantly better than this dude he needs to be a freaking long, rangy, six-foot-nine guy, okay?

Like, who moves his feet? Like, that's who knows what position to be in. Like, who gives, who can every now and again provide some help on the weak side in terms of some rim protection, right? Like, not that, again, he's not going to be some huge deterrent, but he has to be committed to being the best version of himself defensively. And, again, he's not somebody who physically doesn't have what it takes to be a plus defender, not asking them to be as good as OG. Like, obviously,

OG is a special defender, but like, he has to give them more than he does. And I wonder, man, and I've said this a bunch of times up here on the show, a lot of these defensive dudes, they get a little taste of dropping 20 points a game and start smelling themselves. And it's like, no, no, no, you're not that guy. You got traded from the nets and the sons because everybody knows you're not this offensive first player. You have nice things to offer on offense, and I think he's going to be able to raise his floor on offense for sure. I've even seen some things that are pretty encouraging in terms of second side stuff

that he's doing off of swings, off of what, you know, Brunson and Kat are doing. But in terms of defense, he absolutely has to raise the level. And Justin, we were talking about this where, you know, specifically when OG is off the floor, and Bridges is out there as kind of like the lone wing stopper, or really with this team, he's often kind of slotted as a four in a lot of those lineups. There's a compounding effect here of the Knicks are so small. And when they go to their bench,

they get even smaller on the perimeter. And now Mikhail's your four or Josh Hart, I guess, however you want to define it in some of those lineups. And like, there just isn't enough size out there. And like there isn't enough like physical strength and resistance out there in the way that they need. Well, I think the good thing is they barely play their bench. And so if they have enough size in the starting unit, they should be fine for the most part.

So the starting lineup sucks and they barely play their bench. Everything's great. Yeah. McCale played 43 minutes last night against the Chicago Bulls, a game they had to storm back into and then lost ultimately. Their starting unit is currently playing 196 minutes together. That is 30 more than any other unit in the entire NBA. And so I guess we kind of expected this.

Schedule, of course, man. They've played a lot more games. Yeah, maybe. I think we all kind of expected Tibbs to really ride the lightning when it came with a minute, especially when a guy like Bridges, who hasn't missed a game his entire NBA career. It's just like, so at a certain point, I do think they're leaning into what will ultimately be their advantage. I don't expect Bridges to be this bad.

But it does feel like they have needed Kat more than I think even they expected. To a certain extent, it almost feels like Kat was Bridges' insurance because if he's going to be this diminutive. on both ends at this point because we talked all about the defense, but the offense is just like kind of non-existent. He just kind of seems supplementary out there. He seems like he's more Drew Holiday for the Celtics when I think we thought he would be a little bit more of a number two

or number three to Jalen Brunson in that offense. And so there's just like, it seems like Kat has to be dominant and good and he was good last night against the Bulls because there really isn't much else beyond that. Yeah, I think it's more of that. I think the way that McKeel's been used offensively, for one, his skill set lends itself to working out of the corners, working out of the second side. But also, Kat has been pretty awesome as a score, specifically when the Knicks have needed it, right? Like the games where things are like a little too hard for Brunson to do heavy manufacturing, where the other guys aren't quite hitting in the way they need to.

He's had some massive scoring performances. And so he's the piece that can flex in that way. He and Brunson are the guys who can really extend their offense. McKill Bridges is going to do a little bit more here and there, but he's never going to be that kind of offensive threat for a team like this. Five first round picks, though, was... I mean, its first round picks, it matters the team you get sent to, right? Like, if he's going to be asked to be some number two score,

like, you know, initiate offense and soak up possessions, I think that's a mistake. If he's going to actually be his best version or defense, then complement, depending on matchup, which I think it's funny because like OG, and again, he got traded last year. He's so much better at calibrating when to attack, when to just take the corner three, when to, you know, find a size disadvantage from the other team and just post a guy up and get filed that way. Like he's so much smarter about when to deploy each one of those individual offensive, you know, attacks that like, I don't know,

like, Mikel Bridges, he just hasn't figured that out yet, but I think there's stuff there. And the reason why I feel confident about it is because, one, defenses are being put in bad dilemmas in the sense that if you switch a cat and Brunson pick and roll, Brunson can smoke a big off the dribble. It's good enough to do that to 9 out of 10 NBA big, so you can't do that.

And you go under on cat, ooh, chow. He is pulling that thing immediately. And so they're already putting defenses in a bind, and I think that's manifested itself in a top five offense, right? Like all the other stuff like McHale and OG and even Josh Hart are going to learn how to do in terms of crashing the boards and cutting and doing all of that stuff off of that. Action is going to come.

I'm not worried about the offensive and I'm not worried about the jumper. I'm not worried about that stuff. That stuff will come and it will take some time. But the thing that is allegedly travels, Rob, that's what I've been told my whole life. You know, you might have a shoot bad shooting night every now and again. But defense, man, you could take that anywhere. Apparently, not from McHale Bridges. He forgot his defense over the goddamn Manhattan Bridge.

He lost it in cross-down traffic. It's that easy? That's exactly what happened. Damn. I think my concern, though, is it seems like they're setting up if the defense doesn't get back to average. And it's very well could. We're only, what, 11 games? into the season for the Knicks, is it feels like they have to be one of the best

offense, if not the best offense in the league, in order to make up for the rest of it. And I didn't think that they would be in this sort of predicament where so much was riding on the offense. I thought the offense would be very good, but it would just be good enough that they could be okay on defense. And the fact that, like, we're already in this, like, kind of gripping things a little too tightly doesn't feel good if you're a Knicks fan. Yeah, I think what hurts about that from a Knicks perspective is the motivation of both of these deals was to take some of the pressure off of Brunson specifically and to make it so he doesn't have to have these like Herculia nights every time out

for you to have a chance in a playoff game, for example. The balance of that has shifted because now he has Kat to help him with the offense and Kat can have some huge scoring nights as we've said. But what they've given up defensively and the ground that they're giving up on a nightly basis still makes it so that Jalen Brunson and Kat both have to have great nights often for the Knicks to be really good. So I don't know that the overall predicament has changed that much so far. They still are a team that is quite good and that against the best competition in the Eastern Conference.

And if there's any saving grace here, maybe that the top of the East, other than the Celtics and the Cavs, is just not very good. They're fourth right now. Right. By default, they are in fourth place. And so I think they're going to be one of the better teams in the East basically regardless, but against elite competition, they are just going to still be riding a razor's edge. And that's not what you want to hear after you make. two blockbuster deals to like shore up your team. And that's the problem was.

It just seems like when the Celtics went out and built a top heavy team, they became bulletproof. Their five was just immaculate on both ends of the floor to go out and get this five and that there's still very clear cut issues that like, yeah, maybe they'll get some help on the bench and that will help things on the margins. At the very least, it will get guys rest during the game. That will be helpful. But it just doesn't seem like everything will be solved. just by getting to pressure to Chitua and a Mitchell Robinson.

And so I think you have to be worried maybe long term if like this is it and we don't have many other like assets in order to fix this, that there's always going to be some sort of flaw that might keep you from reaching the heights that you thought you would. The team was flawed before these deals. Okay. I think the like argument against the bridges and towns deals like, well, you could have waited. Like, all right. Like was anybody saying they should go all in for Zach Levine?

I don't think anybody thought that was the answer. Who are these other guys that would have been coming available? I know everybody's having a Janus pipe dream right now because the bucks are stinking to join up. Like, that shit is revisionist history as hell. Like, nobody thought there were these better superstar big swing options out there. Let me throw this at you. Would you have rather done one of the trades as opposed to both? Because I could see a world where Bridges makes a little bit more sense in like the

old version of the Knicks where it's like a bunch of dogs in depth. And I could also see the depth helping a Carl Anthony Towns version where you could probably supplement what you already have in Bridges with like Devin Chenso and some of those other guys. I would have, I, yeah, I'm always going to be with trade in Julius Randall. Yeah. I'm sorry. It's hard for me to see that as some net negative that the, that the Knicks did because I just don't think Randall is as complimentary, especially on offense anyway. where I think they had the biggest problems last year. Obviously, you know, we just said the defense has gotten worse.

But I think their most fatal of flaws, especially in the playoffs, was the offense. Like, this idea that this, you know, six-foot, 5-11 dude was just going to, you know, 35% usage his way through an entire damn postseason. Like, that just didn't seem like a smart path forward, right? And so I think the Randall deal is something I would do to eight days out. out of seven of the week. Okay? And so, yeah, maybe it's easy right now to look back and say, wow, all of those picks for Bridges was a disaster.

But I think there's still time to make this way better than what it is right now. And also, I don't want to underestimate Precious and Mitchell, like, those two guys are really good defensive players. Yep. That would really help them right now. And Precious can switch. Mitch can defend the rim. Like, they are the kinds of exact things that they need.

I both address kind of the size concerns we've laid out too. The interesting part about the McAil Bridges sort of revision, like they were going through here, this exercise, like, would you do this again, knowing what we know now? They didn't give up any current day players of import. And so, like, they would have had the flexibility and the picks to make moves, but the conversation we would be having now is like, okay, so what trade do they make? And ultimately, if you play that out to the deadline, are you getting anyone better or more promising the Mikhail Bridges. I think probably not.

Zach Levine looking pretty damn good, right? He certainly is, but he's also exactly not what they need. Yeah. Right? Like, he's not solving their defense. He's just an offense guy. I agree with you on not giving up any players. And that's why the Bridges thing did make sense.

I might only do that one as opposed to the cat trade. I still think there is a version, as you guys are mentioning, where this team can be very good. It just seems like maybe they lost something in the transfer that like we just haven't figured it out yet. It just seems like they just don't know who they are at this point. And I'm not sure the version of who they will ultimately be matches the version that Tibbs wants them to be. And there's always going to be that sort of disconnect where they are going to be an offensive first team, but he's going to want to grind them into dust defensively just to get to average. And so we'll see about that one. But since we're kind of talking around Randall,

we should talk about the Minnesota Timberwolves who were just here in town in Portland and put up a stinker of a back-to-back, losing twice to my Portland Trailblazers. It's funny, I went to the first game, didn't go to the second game. And in the press conference before the game, Chris Finch was like, yeah, this next couple games, we kind of need to figure out who we are. And I would actually, I agree with them to an extent. I would disagree slightly. Is that where the gimmick was born?

No, I was singing about this two weeks ago, at least. So it was really just to match me singing the song with something. There you go. That's how the magic is made, friends. I think this team decided who they were when they made the cat trade, which is that they were going to put all their weight behind Anthony Edwards, ascending star. And I think you're probably seeing some of the results of that, whereas, like, this team, when they're clicking, looks electric on offense in a way that they weren't under cat, like they're firing away from three. Ant has had very good games. I think the problem is Ant has also had a couple stinkers, and he can be a little too loosey-goosey,

That's why you've seen the turnover is becoming, if not, they're one of their biggest problem, then certainly probably their biggest problem. And so I just think like that compounded with the fact that he no longer has the safety net that he had before, not only with Kat, but also Mike Conley being slowly diminished, he didn't play on the second end of the back to back because he's old. It just seems like a lot of what they're hoping for is aunt to carry them through this next wave of who they are. And it just seems like he's not there yet.

And the guy supporting him probably aren't as shorthand. as some of the guys came before him. So, Rob, what do you think about the wolves as far? I think there's kind of two problems that are tangled up, but are kind of discreet in their own ways. One, I agree with everything you're saying about the turnovers. I think some of it's just like precision and focus and gameplay and execution,

going from a team that's like running through an actual point guard in a lot of respects in Mike Conley to aunt freelancing a lot of stuff, trying to learn on the fly, Julius Randall, playing Julius Randall style basketball, which is a little bit fast and loose and always has been. the other part of it, I think the wolves have a real motor problem right now. Like this is a team that has not been taking game seriously enough. And this is what happens is you lose to the Trailblazers twice in a row.

But I wish I could say it was only those games. And I wish I could say it was Julius Randall. But I've seen enough Wolves games this season where Julius Randall looks like the only guy playing hard for the first three quarters. And then everyone else is like, okay, I guess we have to try now. Minnesota is not good enough to play that way. They're not deep enough to play that way. Anthony Edwards, for as ascendant as he might be, is not the kind of game exploding star

who can get away with that all the time. Like, they have to play better and more consistently, and they have to actually try. I think it was really telling that, like, their defense, the thing they hung their hat on all of last season, just has not been there in a, you know, maybe a majority of their games at this point. It's as if they forgot what it takes to be

one of the best teams in the league and certainly one of the best defenses in the league. And on the one hand, that should be changeable, right? They have everything that they need to be a really high-level team. On the other, there are teams who lose that edge and never quite, quite get it back. And I'm not saying that's what's going to befall the wolves ultimately, but you have to really dig in and find yourself in this particular way and decide we are going to be the kind of team that is going to work hard every night defensively to get back to top three, top five defensive standing and not just have one standout defensive game

every two weeks. Yeah. Defense isn't glamorous. It doesn't get you the cheerleader. Sorry. It's dirty work. It's hard hat stuff. Lunch pale, whatever other working class cliche you guys want to bring up.

That's what defense is. And ninth in defense is okay. It's good. But with the talent that these guys have and the proven track record that the players on this roster have on defense is important. Like, bro, you didn't beat the freaking nuggets last year because you were Lucy Goosey on defense. You guys made the nuggets look average.

The first defense to do that in freaking four years, right? Like, that's what got them to the conference finals. And I understand that the face of the franchise is Aunt Edwards. And he's associated with these, like, highlight real sort of, you know, three point barrages and the beauty. beautiful Jordan shake, shake, fadeaways and the electric dunts. But that's not the identity of what made this team elite and upper echelon last year. It was grinding the hell out of people.

And, you know, I've talked about this game with Churion Thomas was early on the season. They played Boston. And they ended up winning because the wings had incredible isolation stops against two of the best wings in the NBA, you know, Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum. And not only did they do that, that's what they wanted to talk about. post game. It wasn't like these big shots that they also made. It was like, yo, we stepped up majorly

on defense to beat what is considered one of the best teams in the NBA who's very wing driven in terms of their success. And that's what they, the mentality they brought into last year. And so like to see them coming to this season and a malaise and just be like, yeah,

we know how to do that. We'll turn it back up. That's pretty disappointing. At the same time, you know, they are incorporating a big new piece. If If you guys do remember year-run- Several, we should say. Like DeVincenzo is a huge piece of this team, too. DeVincenzo is a big part of what they're doing now, too.

And we remember when they brought Rudy in for year one. That thing took forever to get off of the freaking starting block. And so, you know, I'm not too concerned, but, like, they do need to get back to being that nitty-gritty, you know what I mean? Black-on-Black Air Force's type of team and get back to their real identity. That's what Rob was going to say about them.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I had that queued up. Are you reading my notes? Yeah, irony is of irony. It said Dante DiVincenzo has been the new edition that's struggling right now. He just can't hit anything. He's still taking them at volume, shooting 31% from three. Also growing what seems to be a depression beard because it's noticeably longer.

The season is upon us, my friends. We're getting there. You go from being the man in New York City in the garden to goddamn Minneapolis. St. Paul, I tell you, boy, I'd be growing a crazy one. Can we get seasonal effective watch with Justin Barrier? What's going on up there? It's dark out there, man. But I feel like I'm in my element. I was born in the darkness. I'm just, I came out of the womb wearing a cardigan, so we're for good here. A Bane heavy podcast, surprisingly. I was born in the Leafs. Extremely overrated movie, by the way. The Dark Night Rises? Yeah, the Bane, Batman.

is bad. That's a bad movie. I don't know that it's overrated. It seems pretty pretty mixed. Certainly has his defenders, but I'll stand up for Bain though. Tom Hardy brought it. Dante D. Vincenzo is only shooting 31% from three. I will not stand up for

Justin Varyers, Bain. That's a different question. We'll work on it. I'm really giving some voice work done on this pod. No, but I think Divencenzo hasn't been very good. I also have like, and so if you want to ding Randall just for his ranleness, I actually get the theory of him because especially if you're going to diminish Conley, you need another

ball hand or need another guy who's going to get guys involved and having the advantage of all of these three-point shooters is you want a guy like Randall to spray it out there. I've been pretty disappointed in Jaden McDaniels because it seemed like he was ready to hit another gear. Offensively, he's been terrible. And even if you look at some of the lineup data, the defense hasn't been there as well, he was pretty good in the first game where I saw live against Portland. But if you're going to ding Anthony Edwards effort and his... lack of doggedness, I think McDaniels has had that in spades, actually. He's had the kind of season where the standout efforts that you guys identified,

the Celtics game and that one Blazers game, like, they're more exception than rule for the way his season is gone. Like he looks like, to be totally honest, a lot of these nights you tune into the wolves, a shadow of himself on defense. And this was a guy who was one of the biggest, range, most versatile wings in the league. And he doesn't look anything like that. And that problem is compounded in some of these games. the Blazers case and point, the second game against the Blazers,

Portland had no problem and no fear challenging Rudy Gobert at the rim. And both of those things cannot be true. Like, Jane McDaniels has to be locked down. Rudy Gobert has to be intimidating. If both of those things work, you're one of the best defenses in the league again. If both of them are off, this is where you find yourself, struggling to kind of get your footing under you on that end of the court. Do you guys think maybe some sort of lineup rejiggering is in order here?

because one thing that they could toy with is maybe diminishing Conley in the starting unit, maybe getting more defense into that unit. They did that. They put Nikol and Alexander Walker in the second game into the starting unit in place of Conley did not go well. They also got kind of run out of the gym in that game. I mean, I think you could put Devin Chenzo there more, maybe ease him in a little bit more as opposed to taking, they were giving a little too much on his plate in the second unit. the numbers with the Vincenzo as opposed to Conley are much better, plus 6.1 with Conley minus

three. And so there is maybe like small things to do on the fringes, but I agree with you. There just seems to be something a little bit more emotional going on here that they need to figure out. They kind of just need to get tougher and find who they are with these new pieces or lean more into that direction. Be the offensive, just versatile, just all these new components here. Be that team, but just be the best version. And they have been really good on offense until these two games. I think they were top eight or something like that. I think there's still that ceiling.

But clearly, like, they need to clean up a lot of the mess in order to get there. And that's the kind of thing that I think can look a lot better four months from now, right? If you're going to invest long term in the idea of aunt being your primary creator on more or less a full-time basis with or without a traditional point guard next to him, in Julius Randall being this, like, this central to your offense in a facilitating capacity, that stuff will. iron itself out a little bit over time. And I think the turnovers will come down slightly. I'm not saying it won't always be a problem because it very well could be. Like this could be that kind of team. But the hope would be if you invest in that idea that you can clean up some of the stuff around the edges, that you can improve the spacing, that you can improve the flow. They have the players to do that. But it requires on really high level decision making from

guys who to this point have not been the highest level decision makers. Really incredible athletes, really incredible scores, really impressive players all around. but crisp, clean decision-making has not been Timberwolves' offensive basketball of late this season and even last. Yeah, so this is the team. Nikiel Alexander Walker played sticks into my head where he was harassing Jamal Murray,

94 feet just five months ago, ripping his ass in the half court, in the back court. Like, these guys were freaking hyenas on defense. I hate to break it to Minnesota. defense, y'all not going to figure out how to be a crisp, well, you know, oiled machine on offense for a little while now. And taking Conley out of the starting lineup is not going to aid in that, right? Like, you're not asking these guys to play to their strengths on offense when you ask Aunt and Jaden to, like, become better decision, decision makers and

facilitators for Julius Randall and Rudy Gobert. Now, Randall, he's had some nice interior passes. Like, Randall, you know, I think he was a little bit. You're waiting for this. I think he was talking a little bit out the side of his mouth when he said, Hey, I'm a great passenger. I haven't been asked to do it in years. Like, all right, relax, tragic Johnson. But, like, I think it's going to take a little while before they can really get that thing going.

So I think it is incumbent upon them to take the defense way more seriously. I'm kind of a believer. I do think they raise their ceiling by getting these guys in there to the point where the offense doesn't feel as gummy and sludgy as it did in the past. I think they just need to figure it out. I think they need a month or two to maybe iron out some of the mistakes here, maybe mess with the lineups just a little bit. I will also say I was one of the guys wondering why Rob Dillingham isn't playing. I think we know why. Because that guy is just chum in the water when he is on defense.

Yeah. He looks like he's so slight. Yeah, he looks like one of these guys at halftime when they throw out the like the 12 year olds playing basketball. It's like he just stayed on the floor and no one got him off. And he doesn't have the Is Smith grown man strength.

You know, like he's just not that type of little guy. He's got a long way to go. I think clearly the burst is exciting and what he can be off the dribble is exciting. But that itself is dependent on good spacing and good flow and him knowing how to navigate an NBA-style offense. And all that is going to be a long-term work-in-progress for him. I'm with you, Justin, that I think

the wolves are going to be better. Like, it would be crazy to doom them now based on these habits and these problems. Ultimately, I think their bigger issue is that the West is very deep, and that even if they are better, they could end up maybe in the play-in group or at the bottom end of the guaranteed playoff spots.

And either one of those things could be an issue for them. They are one of these teams that I think can really benefit from having actual home court advantage. And we'll see if they have that in them this year. Sometimes in basketball, 30 points. could be worth more than 30 points. And now you can get a 30% profit boost on 30 plus point scores with Fandul's 30 on 30. That's right, the Ringer is teaming up with America's number one

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Fandle.com. Gambling problem, call 1,800 gambler or visit RG-dash help.com. Well, we'll slip now to a team that we thought might be in the play in as recently as like a week or two ago and might just win the West at this point,

considering the way they're playing. That's the Demba Nuggets, winners of five in a row, the longest non-Cabs winning streak in the NBA right now. I don't even know if you can call the Cavs winning streak, a winning streak. That's just their season at this point. They just haven't lost. But was, the Nuggets look,

completely different. And somehow, no, I would like to hear Justin Varyer wax poetic about Nicola Yokic. That's how I would like to begin this conversation. I was just about to do that where it's like, even Yokic looks different.

We thought he was already the best player in the world just based on what he was doing previously. Seems like he's found another gear. I didn't know that a three-time MVP could take a leap. But he's currently averaging about 30, 14, and 12. Four or seven and three teams. He's pretty good. You know what's so funny is that early on in the season,

Justin hit the group chat and was like, you know, I think the fixes that Yolkich has to come out and drop 35 points a game, right? And I think that's close to what's happening. Like he's just dominating possession a lot more because he has to. And I think the young guys who I love, I love the young guys.

They got a lot of spunk. you know, when it comes to Strother. Damning praise. They got a lot of spunk. They're very prucky, but they ain't got shit else. I'm telling you, y'all, boy. That's a little harsh. You're Hunter Tyson guy?

I like that Strother is letting it fly unconsciously. He's definitely gotten the memo that's like, look, kid, like, in order for our offense to sort of become less constrained and more expensive, defenses have to think that you're willing to take and make a bunch of crazy-ass shots. So he's gotten that memo. But yeah, I think it's just Yokic. Just taking the responsibility is just like, I just have to do more.

I have to do way more to keep us afloat. And we know that's not his nature. And the nuggets notoriously, shouts to my guy, Kerm, just walking through the studio. The nuggets notoriously like to start the season nice and slow. They like to ease into things. to sort of stretch their legs and be like, all right, the season started, but we're, you know,

we're getting to what we need to get by All-Star Break. We'll have something figured out. But I think they saw pretty early on that if they tried the cruise through this early part of the season, they would get waxed. And so, yeah, they've had to turn it up faster. Yeah, Yokic is, I mean, what more is there to say about the freaking guy, Rob? Yeah, I'll do credit to them for turning this around so quickly. a genuinely impressive thing to do when it feels like the start of the season is getting away from you.

And a lot of it really is just Yokic deciding that he's going to be the best micromanager in the league if that's what it takes. If it takes him being disinvolved, him being willing to do it is not a small thing either. Right? Like the situation,

the situation demands it, frankly, given the roster. Yokish reminds me as somebody I know who just doesn't like to do extra work. It's crazy. Who is that? Honestly, the source of, of Waz's affection for

Nicola Yokic has never been more apparent. Just hit the horse races, yeah, whenever he has free time. Hey, be great when you're asked to and no other time besides that. Well, he's certainly been great. He certainly, I think has been absolutely ridiculous and he always has known

exactly which levers to pull to make this shit work, regardless of what players around him, regardless of the state of the season or the opponent. I think the key has been turning off the part of his brain that is telling him not to shoot. And often the best lever for him to pull is, I need to bully this guy into like a sort of

mid-range, high-paint sort of floater hook shot. I need to go into ISO mode to bail out this possession. My concern with that is we have seen what happens when Nicole Yokic runs out of steam a little bit, when he's had to do a little bit too much for too long, and it is November 14th. And he has to do this every single game right now. Where are we going to be in five months,

if he has to do this all the way through. Well, Jamal Murray just signed a $50 million a year contract. So clearly he's coming to the rescue soon. We know that, right? Yeah. He's playing better. I mean, Michael Ford Jr. is alive. Thank God we found the pulse on that guy.

He's been very good of late. But you're right. Yokich is playing 38 minutes a game at this point. That's fourth in the NBA. And I'm kind of on both sides of this where, like, Yokic is a goddamn ox, who has missed 44 games his entire career. This guy is just so dependent. You could always comment on him to be there.

But if you're running up the numbers this early, it just, it gets me a little bit worried. And I think this ultimately comes back to the bench where it's like, yes, they literally trotted out a bench unit of Russell Westbrook, who is back to being bad at most of the time. I would say two thirds to three, fourth of the time he is bad. But once every third or fourth game, he is exactly the player that they need him to be. Okay. We'll go with that. Julian Strother, Hunter Tyson, Zik Naji. That was the bench unit.

Now, the flip side of that is that Peyton Watson, now in the starting unit, looks pretty good. And so when Aaron Gordon does come back, does that give you just another reliable player? You now are six to seven players deep. Christian Braun, we should mention, has been very good in that role. And the physicality that he plays with, I think gives them an interesting dynamic that they probably didn't have with KCP. More willingness to shoot, too, which is huge. huge because he's a freaking shooting guard. So it's nice that he's like, he's gotten in his head that like, yo, if you catch it on the corner above the break, you got to let that thing fly.

Again, it's so that like defenses understand that there's more to this, even though there's not, than Nicola Yokic. I think Brown playing that well with the starting group has been amazing to see. I've been legitimately very impressed by the way his offense has scaled and he's been willing to take those shots. I am seeing the comps flow out there of, oh, here's how Christian Brown's playing this season, and here's how KCP's playing this season. KCP, for those who have been watching the Orlando Magic Play, can't make the damn thing right now.

Can't make a shot. Getting by the numbers blown off the court by what Christian Brown is contributing to the Nuggets. I take the point. The pain of losing KCP was not that Christian Brown couldn't fill in with the starting lineup. It's that you could have had both. Yeah.

And that's where bringing Christian Brown off the bench right now or KCP off the bench right now, if you prefer, would be quite a luxury for a team in this position, to not have to ride with the ups and downs of Julian Strather shooting, to not have to live and die with the Russell Westbrook experience, to not have to, you know, play this game with Peyton Watson where you're trying to figure out, okay, what do we even do with him long term. Like Aaron Gordon is out right now, so he's clearly starting for that reason, but he's quite promising, quite good. They're trying to figure out what to do with him. everything with the bench is complicated. And you could have had one more guy who you could at least rely on, even though he's not shooting that well this season. That's kind of where I feel the absence of guys like that.

And I don't want to keep bringing every Nuggets conversation back to what they did in the off season because at some point we just have to move on. But they are a shallow team. And the reason Nicola Yolkich has to do as much as he does is because they are a shallow team. So I'm just happy that, look, I was at an all-time low

after the playoffs of Peyton Watson stands. because I had, oh, my God, did I talk this fool up last season? But I'm back, okay? Like, I'm back to watching this guy. When he puts his imprint on the game defensively, that's when I'm just like, okay, now I see the Calvin Booth, you know, a vision, man. I saw him at one of the bars at, what hotel, at the Cosmo? Calvin Booth?

Yeah, this is during Summer League. And I was tempted to walk up to him and ask him about the offseason. But, like, I wasn't enough vodka soda's in to do so. And there was points early on in this season where I wish that I had. But, you know, he's back on the right track with me, y'all. Okay. Is that with Peyton Watson back on the Pippin track? Are we at that point?

Or are we a little bit more than that now? Maybe not the Pippin track. Maybe the Sean Elliott track. Okay. I mean, that's pretty good. good. It's a good track. I don't mind that track. Yeah, I mean, listen, the Nuggets are playing really well and credit to them.

I think we're all just a little concerned because the only thing worse than just not giving Nikoliyokic enough help is actually riding him into the ground because they don't have enough help. Yeah. And like maybe this guy is just impervious to injuries. He has been thus far in his career. But we've said that about a lot of guys. A lot of guys have gone down in part because games are harder than they have ever been to play.

That's not just Rest Warrior bullshit. It's like... guys, there was just a rash of superstar injuries as a result of this. It's just like, games are going longer, games are harder, athletes are better, and to be playing Yokic this much this early is concerning. It's something we're going to have to track. Yeah, I think Aaron Gordon kind of can't get back fast enough, not because Payton Watson isn't good enough, but they just need more live bodies out there.

Also, the center depth is atrocious. Like, we thought Sarich might be able to supplement a little what Yokic did. He's been bad. And so they've had to turn to guys like Ziknodians. For some reason, D'Andre Jordan is just still getting checks in this league. He's just hanging out on the bench. And so to not even have any sort of sentiment that's coming behind him is really tough. Respect the Wiley veteran paycheck, y'all.

Please, you need a locker room guy. The personality hire. Yes, you need a veteran that's going to show the rooks. Like, this is what you do on the road. This is what you do with this. We need more that in the NBA, not less, Justin. That's what they said about me, personality hire. Did they?

No. I was the micromanager. You're the Yokets. You're just wheeling and dealing. That's right. We're all a little bit Yokich today, I would say. Rob with his post moves, was with his interest in horse racing, I guess.

Last team on the docket here, the Miami Heat, four and six. Losers of four of the past five, and one of those was a wild-ass comeback against the Minnesota Timberwolves a team. We just talked about as not having an identity themselves. Rob,

One of them was maybe the weirdest game of the season and the overtime loss to the Pistons in which Eric Spolster tried to take a timeout he didn't have. There was a completely blown defensive possession to give up the game winning lob. Was it Ron Holland that brick two free throws that could have iced the game? Just legitimately one of the strangest games I've seen in years.

Jalen Rose giving just an all-time meme to the culture there. Hey, he had a flashback. He needed a trigger warning for that timeout from Spoke. But maybe even weirder than the outcome of that game is the fact that the heat were in an overtime game with the Pistons in the first place. And they allowed those guys to score on them. And the reason they were in

overtime is they literally could not get stops. They could not contain the ball. I don't know what's going on with that. Right. The heat offense has always been a bit mercurial. You can never quite count on it to be what you expect it to be. In this season,

I think in some good ways. Like Tyler Hero has been legitimately surprising and explosive. want to circle back to him. But what is going on with the heat defense? Will they ever be better than this? I don't know. I kind of think in the larger, who are they conversation?

They're a mediocre team through and through that feels like ultimately they might just be a mediocre team. I think there will be a little ebb and flow to where they're ranking on both sides of the ball. But I don't know that they have what it takes to get to the standard Miami Heat like fifth through eighth on defense this year. I don't see that in this group.

The nerve are you losing faith in Coach Spoh, man? It's only 10 games. I can do the math. A Portland legend, my brother. This guy's claiming Portlanders who moved 40 years ago. Yes. Yeah, the defense is horrible right now. It's just uncharacteristic in how bad it's been.

I just always believe his Sposibility to figure out a way to piece together like a competent defense to Tyler Hero stuff, although not quite Devin Booker yet. I mean, he's been at that kind of level. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's playing at that level for now. I just think with the defense, I think the defense will eventually come around.

I think Jimmy has it in him to play much better than he has. Although, hey, brother, you were freaking crying about a contract extension. It's time to pick this thing on up if you're going to make a point about actually having that happen for you. And so yeah, I think the heat are going to be fine. This is just one of the outfits that it's hard for me to get too worked up about it's like the Pittsburgh Steelers

in freaking the NFL. Like every time you look up, Tomlin has this team over playing over its freaking skis. And so I think the heat are much like that. I think this is a Tyler Hero conversation first and foremost because Jimmy Butler, not around

anymore. He missed the past two games with an ankle might be trade bait. But first he would have to play a full time. No, I'm talking about here. To do so. Oh, Hero, no, I think he might be their most important player at this. Yeah. And it's like, I think they just need something to hang their hats on. They need some sort of juice on both ends of the floor. And Hero has been that. And so this team is slowly leaning more in his direction. He had 40 the other night in that OT game against Detroit. The problem is, yeah, the offense is more. There's more to do there when Hero. is flowing. But the problem is the defense is so bad there. To the point where when heroes on the court,

the defense is awful, 117.6 defensive rating. When he's off, 97.4, that's as good as the 0405 piston spurs. And how many, what kind of sample size are we talking about? I did not look up the minutes. Okay. But I mean, it's probably been like 100 or so minutes, you would imagine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's just like, I do think, like, he is the pushing pole with this.

team where he represents the good that's happening when it happens, but also I think it is kind of taking something away from them defensive. And honestly, even the offense, though he himself has been great. They have sort of an issue right now where the starting lineup just like does not work, right? The starting lineup that they initially tried it out with Yovich at the four, with Butler and Bam and Hero and Tara Rozier altogether does not work. In particular, Jimmy and Hero and Rozier just do not compliment each other right now. Rosier is just like hasn't given them the pop that they've needed to make that back court work. And he is taking stuff away defensively.

And so you've kind of disrupted who you were trying to reach for Rozier to juice up the offense and try to kind of compensate for what Jimmy hasn't been able to give you. Totally. And the result of that is these three guys on the perimeter who are all like kind of creators in their way, but don't play off each other at all. And when you're compounding that with the fact that Bam can't hit a damn thing in the paint right now, there's just issues arising all over the place. for ultimately what they're trying to do on offense.

Right now, the heat's best course in trying to score is give Tyler Hero the ball, run a pick and roll, and try to get out of the way as best you can. That is not something I envisioned for their future this season. But I want to give all due credit because we bag on Tyler Hero a lot for the things he doesn't do, even in this conversation for what he doesn't do on defense, which is legit. He's cleaned up his shot selection.

He is one of not just playing some of the most efficient basketball of his career, but of anyone in the NBA this season. This is among 20 point per game scores, the leaders in true shooting percentage right now. Number one, our man, Nicola Vucovich, Vucci-Main. I'm as stunned as anybody. We'll come back to the Bulls in a later pot, I'm sure. Number two, Kevin Durant.

Number three, Tyler Hero. Unreal. Like, legitimately unbelievable for the arc of his career, for him to play this cleanly and this efficiently, creating so much for himself, driving so much of Miami's offense. to the point where they almost don't know what to do with themselves when he's not out there driving it.

I think they have a superstar problem. I think that's what I thought going into the season. And it's kind of borne out now to where it's like they've leaned so much on hero because they need somebody like here. We'll see if this continues. It's good to see him being the best version of himself. But even that version obviously has falls that trickled down to the rest of your team. It just seems like I remember reading going into the season,

John Hollinger was talking about him and just talking about the heat in general. And he was saying, like, you know, they're not as talented. as you think they are. And they do have a lot of guys, but the ceiling is kind of just like steady reserve grinder. And there's only so much of that

that you could have before you just need a superstar to go to Superstar Steve. Jimmy has to play much better in order for this team to be, you know, what I'm sure they envision for themselves coming into this season. And just to check in on BAM three point watch, he has quadrupled his rate this season.

He's shooting 21% from. Stuff. Not what you want. Not good. I am a Jimmy Butler defender historically. I acknowledge there is no such thing as a Jimmy Butler season that is not weird. Every regular season with him is weird. This one feels different.

And it's early. And I'm not saying anything conclusive just that I want to monitor it. He hasn't been very good. He hasn't been very cohesive with the way they try to play. He hasn't been nearly good enough on defense for what they expect in need of him. I think to the extent that they have a superstar problem, Justin, I would not be surprised at the end of the season. Part of the reason that problem exists is because Jimmy Butler is not a superstar,

even in the sort of like selective big game capacity. He has been for the last like five years or so. I'm starting to get a little worried about what he can be to this team in like a structural capacity. Listen, Steph Curry, Kevin Durant, LeBron, these guys are aliens, man. I'm sorry. Like most superstars at Jimmy's age end up like mellow, end up like... He's 35, we should say.

Like, when those guys turned that, they were cooked. It was over. That's how it is for 85% of the superstars we've ever seen in the league, man. Like, there's the LeBrons and even, you know, to a certain extent, Kareem and stuff like that. But like, and Mike, of course. But most guys, even All-Star First Ballot Hall of Fame guys like a Jimmy Butler, 35, you're done.

And so we shouldn't be too surprised by what Jimmy's been able to put out there so far this season. Yeah, I mean, the heat have signed a lot of very bad extensions over the past few years. Hero might very well be one of them or was up until this point, not signing Jimmy past this season, or at least past next season. He actually has a player option. So he actually might opt in at this point. I'll be picking that up. Which didn't seem like the case going into the season, or at the very least that was what

he was projecting in terms of negotiations. And so it could be the end of the road. We'll see. He always has his inability to bounce back from this, especially in short game or short series and whatnot. But he just doesn't look right on both ends. And it's sad to see. And it does open up questions about where the heat go from here. It seems like this might be more of a bridge season than it even was the past few years, which we all thought were bridge seasons unto themselves. Well, let me ask you guys this. If one of these three things is going to change, which one do you feel like is the most likely? One, Jimmy Butler will play better at some point in this regular season for a significant amount of time.

Two, BAM's shooting and play will turn in a way where he feels like a bigger part of the offense. Or three, the heat kind of MacGyver their way to a pretty high-level defense yet again. Which of those three things feels the most likely to you? Definitely BAM because he's got an effective field goal percentage of 42. It's why. Like, he's like, absolutely shit. 30 off of his freaking career average. Yeah, I don't get it.

He's going to be way better than that. Like, under 50, like, way under 50% effective. Like, that's impossible. And so I think he's going to be better than that. And I think the defense will be better, but definitely BAM in order. I would say BAM is going to be better than he has been. Has to be. Yeah.

Yeah, unless there's some diminishing effect from playing through the summer, with Team USA. I mean, BAM's just not this bad. Like, no. That's just not going to happen. I wouldn't be surprised, though, if all three things happen, like all of those things kind of come around, Jimmy would be the least likely. I'm sure everyone would agree. But like, there's probably still a couple of Jimmy games in there. It's just how many of them are in the coffers at this point. Like, you would still get like 10 to 15 to 20 of these things. Like, is it now more single digits? And then what happens to the rest of the team as a result then? It would be an extremely heat outcome. If they play exactly this way through like March 15th

and then everything turns on all of a sudden for absolutely no reason afterwards. Like that, we should come to expect it. I think maybe I'm just like falling, running at the football to kick it yet again and it's going to get yanked away from me. But the Jimmy stuff I think is a little more

worrying in a way that I wasn't expecting to be worrying about him at this point in the season. Listen, one more win. They're fourth in the east. Everything's fine. That's not a high water mark. Don't worry about it. All right, why we wrap it there, unless you guys want to talk about Donovan Klinging for 20 minutes? I do want to do that, but in the spirit of, I feel like I've shown great restraint today in naming some guys.

And I would like to name one guy on the Miami Heat. Can I guess? I think you probably already know who it is. Is it Pelle Larson? No, it's Pella Larson, of course, as we all know. The New York Cosmos over here. Pella Larson, the other, you know, the Swedish wonder. Oh.

I think he can kind of play. I think he, our colleague. I think he can kind of play. Maybe I feel that way because I saw like the one game he really popped off against the king. So I'm a little like Pella Pilled at this point. But I'm inclined. I'm watching with interest. It feels very much like yet another Eric Spolster in Miami Heat.

Like we turn this guy out of the second round and he's a relevant part of rotation kind of story. So keep, keep an eye. eye out for Pella Larson. So if we were to power rank the end of the bench guys that most of us probably haven't heard of, are you Pella Larson over Drew Smith at this point? I am, yeah. Where's Alec Barks fall into this? Because I was told he would be a big part of this team again.

No, that's not happening. He is a part of the team. He's on the payroll. He's on the charter flights, definitely. Yeah. Okay. All right, well, we wrap it there. Thank you to Isaiah Blakely.

Thank you to Ben Cruz. We'll be back on Monday, as for usual, two pods. Nobody fret. We'll talk to you then. Must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus in present in D.C. Gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Help.com.

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