The Ringer NBA Show - Is Ace Playing His Cards Right? Plus, Raja’s Richter Scale for Recent Trades. | Real Ones

Episode Date: June 27, 2025

Logan Murdock and Raja Bell discuss the first round of the 2025 NBA draft and in particular the Ace Bailey story. Ace didn't work out for any teams before the draft and landed with the Utah Jazz at no. 5. Did Ace make the right decision by not working out for teams and still ending up as a top-five pick? Raja questions the mentality of some of the young athletes who make demands before proving anything. The guys quickly touch on V.J. Edgecombe going to the Sixers at 3, his post-draft interview, and the mentality he'll bring to Philly. Then they go to Raja’s Richter scale for the recent trades. How does he feel about the Boston-Portland trade involving Jrue Holiday and the Pelicans-Wizards trade involving CJ McCollum and Jordan Poole? Plus, Real One of the Week! (0:00): Welcome w/ Logan Murdock (1:12): State Farm Ad Break (1:37): Show Start (2:43): Thoughts on Ace Bailey (33:25): V.J. Edgecombe  (37:52): Raja’s Richter Scale (44:56): Portland’s Next Moves (49:07): Real One of the Week Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Audio Producer: Clifford Augustin Video Producer: Victoria Valencia Additional Production Support: Ben Cruz Hit the mailbag! [e-mail] The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping? Real Ones, Logan Murdoch here. I have a great show for you. It's being a Raja today. We go down Memory Lane. And we have one of those vintage old school Real Ones podcast where we just shoot the shit. We talk about Ace Bailey. And if he's has too much dip on his ship, if you will. And then we talk about how that manifests to the culture of the NBA. And then we play a little game we like to call Raj's Richter scale.

We talk about all of the trades that. went down over the last week and how much they really resonate from a league perspective, right? And also, we always talk about what's going on with the new apron era, quote unquote, and how that's kind of affecting deals. And we've had a flurry of deals. You talk about the Christophe's Rizingas trade to Atlanta. You talk about the Drew Holiday trade that I'm still like about to Portland. We also talk about the Portland side of that trade. But there's going to be a lot more of these trades going on as people get their books in order as a lot of the contracts of Grandfather. into this apron era. So it's going to be really fun and a lot of topsy-turvy things happening.

And we get into all of that. So great show for you. All the bleep. This episode is brought to you by State Farm. On the basketball court, the best players know when to pass. And off the court, you still need teammates who are there when it counts. That's where State Farm comes in. With agents and online tools to help you find the coverage you need, you could focus on what really matters, whether that's hitting game winners or just getting through the day. State Farm with the assist. Coverage options are selected by the customer, availability and eligibility vary by state.

Bob is the Lerdaq here. Rajabelle there. This is going to be a draft, ruins. We'll see how this goes. You know, you know how we do. You know how we do?

It's not necessarily our cup of tea for draft, but I think we're going to get through it. I think we're going to get through it. Yeah, and our straight guys not here. So like, like, you know, Howard Howard, Howard, you would say Howard's probably a straight guy, right, of the trio? What? Yeah.

Yeah. So like without that, who knows? We're going to talk a little Ace Bailey and then we're going to play a game of Raj's Richter scale where I throw him some deals. And we see how much it registers on the Roger Richter scale or if he gives a fuck or not. How you been, buddy? I'm good, man. I'm good.

I'm good. We are, uh, what are we doing? We're getting ready. We're getting ready to chase Ty to Atlanta this weekend. So we're leaving tomorrow. We're fired up, bro. Summer's going well. Man, that's what so happy.

Yeah, how are you? How is it has a little one? Solid. Let's talk about Ace Bailey, though. I, uh, so this came across my, my desk over the last couple of days where Ace Bailey, um, wing from Rutgers is, uh, seems to be feeling himself a little too much right now, right? he, at least going into the draft, where he just refuses all workouts, including with Cliff's Sixers. They asked him about it during the, during the pre-draft, the pre-draft telecast media availability,

and he just played Fane, like, didn't really want to talk about it. And he dropped down to five to the Utah Jazz. And when he dropped down to the jazz, he was like, I didn't. even know if they wanted me, even though the jazz asks him to work out for the team. So it seemed to be a little dip on this chip throughout this draft process. I don't know how much you've been following it. But this seems like your wheelhouse. And I wanted to talk about like, what does this say about where we are?

Because this isn't a new thing, guys trying to get to not working out for teams strategically and wanting to get to a certain team. But it seems like something without a necessary plan. So what did you think of the situation and what does it say about where we are right now with draft prospects? Yeah, I haven't really been dug into the draft in fairness. I have been kind of following superficially. So I had heard that he wasn't working out. I heard reports that it was to try to get him to a desired location, which was somewhere, you know, on the eastern seaboard.

Look, it's your choice, whether you work out for a team. or not, slipping, especially when we use the term slipping to describe being drafted fifth overall, right? Like, let's be real. Like,

if you're saying we slip and we wound up at number five, we certainly have some choices in the matter. We have some leverage as a player. Like, we are coveted, right? You can choose not to do what you do. Well,

you can choose not to go in and work out. But, and I don't necessarily hold that against anyone. Like, real-will dude. And like I try to tell my kids, like, you can choose to do what you want as long as it's legal. But then you're going to have to face the repercussions of that, like, or, you know, the ramifications of those decisions. And so, you know, there are probably teams in those top four picks that may or may not have drafted him had he come in and worked out and kind of done the

usual, you know, let's check all the boxes in terms of, you know, having you in the building and having a meal with you and the interview process and all of that. But like, you know, you don't, you don't have to. And, you know, I don't know. I haven't seen any reports that say he's disappointed to be in Utah. You know, Utah, Utah is, it's going to be a different place to live for a kid, you know, because it is a different culture in Utah. It's a great place to live. I loved it. My wife loved it. We visit. But like for a young kid, especially he's a baby. Like my nephew played for for Rutgers last year and was like one of his close friends. So like he would be at my godson's basketball games and they'd go out to eat together and stuff with the family, my

former college roommate. And so I know him through them. And he's a really good kid, but like super young. Like and and relatively not just young in age, but relatively like inexperienced, right? like he's been in, he's been in his basketball bubble. So, you know, Utah, could be an adjustment in and of itself. But in terms of being on the court, you know, I think,

I think he's going to be fine. I think it's going to be a good fit. There's a lot of opportunity out there. You know, the process itself, Logan is, look, you saw you saw your door to some degree. In the NFL draft, right? Like, you chose to do that.

Like, there's no law or rule that says you have to act a certain way. But if that comes, back to bite you in any way, shape, or form. Like, you don't get to turn around and ask why. Yeah. I mean, how much of this, like, because you brought up a great point with your door, and that's been, again, a comparison that Ais Bailey has gotten over the last few weeks. And it feels like between those two things, I think people forget that this is such a people

business, especially the NBA. It's a very small. It may seem big to a lot of people, but it's a very small community within, the professional ranks. And you don't really serve yourself well doing this, right? Like it doesn't really help you, right? And you spoke to his youth in a lot of different ways. And he kind of alluded to the maturity part of this.

If there is a player like that, how important is it for the players around or the people around him to be like, eh, I don't know, right? Critical. Because if you're doing this, right? If you're making a decision like this, once you get in the building, it seems like there's going to have to be even more coaching than, I mean, coaches like to coach. Coaches don't necessarily like to mentor at this level all the time. You've got to be really lucky for this to happen. You have to be.

And then Utah's a really young team. So you're just going to be with other young dudes who are like minded, who aren't necessarily going to put their arm around you. Right. So how important is it for him, whatever happened to figure shit out relatively fast? based on the position that he's in right now. Because if he would have went to like the Sixers or something, it would have been more of a veteran corps. Now he's just kind of out on his own

in a place he hasn't really been to before trying to figure it out. And it doesn't seem like it would bode well for the attitude he has right now. Yeah, that's interesting. Let me just go back to like not wanting to, or coaches at that level not wanting to like mentor you and maybe develop the human being as much as they just want to focus on basketball.

Well, I think now in this NBA, coaches have to be a lot more willing and accommodating in that regard because guys are coming in so young. Like, these are babies. Like even Cooper's a baby. You know, these are really young. Bro, the decisions I was making it 18 years old? Come on, man. Who would you have done if you had cameras, buddy? No, no, no.

I mean, who knows? Because I was, I was apt to just do dumb shit all the time. Like, I was like, you know, anything flashing in front of my squirrel. I couldn't stay focused on anything. So I think the coaches are a little better in that. I think, you know, I've heard some people, you know, debate like former pros kids and, you know, why some organizations are interested in former pros kids or why coaches might like former pros kids.

And like, I've said this before. when I sat in the front office with the Cleveland Cavaliers, the number one, the number one thing that would give you a percentage chance advantage as an infant of being a professional athlete coming right out of the womb was whether one of your parents was a professional athlete or not. Like that's real, right? Like if you had two that were high-level, you know, athletes,

that gives you even more, right? But let's take that aside. Like, it's not really, it's, to your point, the people and the messages in some instances that they're getting are coming from a pro perspective. So when you ask how important is it for his camp to talk to him about like what this process looks like and what means what to people in these organizations, someone was missing. Like the agent is just out there shopping you as this commodity and trying to do whatever they can to like and you're you're he doesn't seem to be in this instance

talking to you about hey man like you're a commodity right now but as soon as someone drafts you this is a relationship business like there's got to be a level of humility there's got to be a level of uh of responsibility and understanding and no you might not want to um do this but we're going to sacrifice and do it because it's for the betterment of the team and I trust that this coach and this organization is putting me in the right position to to chase this championship. Like there are things that go along with with the process that if you don't have someone in your camp telling you, it doesn't mean you won't be successful. It doesn't mean that you don't figure them out, but you have a head start if you know these things, right? Like you have,

you have a head start if you understand some of these things up front. And then look, again, this is a long, this is a long race. I think Ace Bailey would be fine. I actually think that Utah, If you're talking about a younger player, well, I said like it'll be an adjustment for him to live out in the Salt Lake area. It is a really sheltered type of environment out there. You're not going to get in a lot of trouble being out. You know, there's not a whole lot of stuff going on that you could find if you were predisposed to finding bullshit and being in it.

You're not going to find that in a lot of places. So it is a, it can be a very good environment for him. It's just like, look, the reality is you don't see a lot of people to look like So if you're used to that, that can be different. There are just some things that are different about it. But I think it'll be okay. Long way to answer your question, Logan, is it becomes critical to have people around you if you're trying to achieve certain levels of success in athletics or in any field

that can shed some light on what's important within those fields. Yeah. I think, I mean, to that point also, right, like, you know, I'm seeing this in my backyard with Jonathan Camingo, right? He just put out a piece with the athlete. He just got interviewed for a piece in the athletic where, you know, he's talking about, you know, I want to be an all-star. And I want to be all of these things. And I want the bulk of the shots. And I was just taken aback because, I mean, yeah, I think he has the talent to be an all-star. But the way you be an all-star, and I'm bringing this back to Ace Bailey, right, is you do all the things within the offense and do all the things within the confines of team success to where you still.

stick out enough to be an all-star, especially if you have the ability, right? And when it comes to Ace Bailey, that's what it means like with maturity, right? You see that. You see in the ways that ways you can affect winning. And you see the ways that you, that's when the maturity comes in. I remember being at the finals where Coach Dagnall was talking about how J-dub did all the things that he was supposed to do coming off the bench at such a high level that there was no reason why he shouldn't be that he could keep him on the bench for that long of a period of time right and jdub is went from a guy off the bench now where people didn't think he was going to be what he is right now to being what he is right now which is the second best player

on a championship team who can be a one be in my eyes um to a certain extent right that's what i want to see out of Ace Bailey and like I think a lot of kids and I feel like I'm getting older especially from the time that we first started this podcast I'm starting to talk more and more like Raja and Howard but I think like kids that are coming up right now um and I think historically uh tend to just get caught up in the bullshit you know when you're young and like in your 20s you get caught up in the bullshit and a lot of which just doesn't matter right and um you know some some players and some people continue to stay within the bullshit. But that's why a lot of players aren't successful is because they just think about all the other stuff that doesn't even matter towards the game.

Like, just go work out. Does it really matter? And I know that there are players like that don't strategically, but you didn't do it. And it seemed like you didn't do it just because you thought you was feeling yourself. At least whatever the truth is, that's what it comes off as. and it seems like Ace Bailey is getting caught up in the bullshit way too early right now. Well, process.

I look, again, that can be fair. And I'm telling you through, through my best friend, I know this kid, right? Like, this is someone whose children, like, I'm godfather too. And I spent years and decades, like loving like a brother. Like, so I trust his word. He's a good kid. A's a good kid. I would put this one in the category of probably getting poor advice about the process.

I don't think that this was a kid just saying, I'm that dude. I'm not coming to workouts. I don't believe that from what I know of the kid. Now, I could be wrong, but I think this would fall for me from the outside looking in into like an agent or an agent. or someone steering him and advising him on this process to try to get a desired end result. I do want to touch on the comminga thing because we've talked about him a few times. And I was on record as saying like he's too talented for Golden State not to find a way to use him. I stand on that.

Just because they were throwing bodies out there that just did not have the same level of talent and stuff like that. Yeah. The only caveat that I remember saying and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I said this was that if he was just standing in the way of Steph Curry doing what Steph Curry was supposed to do, if you are that disillusion and you are and you are like, this is my show, then I do support where he was because that's crazy. And from the comments that I saw, the ones you just referenced, could have been that. Could have been where he's just that

disillusion and and I always cringe like this is just me dude like I always cringe when I see young athletes high school college pro and it's me me me I I like it's just it's just such a turnoff you know what I mean it's just such a turn off and especially especially when when it's not yours yet you become shade jilges or like the joker or somebody like that and you want to talk about like you know, me because you're carrying the weight. It's yours. Yeah. Yeah, but you haven't done a thing yet.

And it's the me, me, me. I want to have my own team. Bro, do you realize where you were? Do you realize where you were? Bro, you were in one of the most fertile learning grounds for a basketball player in the planet or on the planet ever. Because that is one of the best players ever. And you're sitting right there.

You can learn from that dude every day. Like you could soak that up. Banking. and then maybe turn into the dude that you want to be, the I, I, I, I, I, me guy. And you can't even see that because of the I, I, I, I, I, I, me, me, me. And it, that's the other thing. It's like, and that goes back to my thing when I was saying earlier of,

you want to, you say a me, me, me, I want to be an all star. But, like, there's been plenty of players that have been all stars on that team that have been deference to Steph Curry, right? Like, Draymond Green, great example of this. Clay Thompson, great example of this, right? But he wants to have his, he wants to be number one on the marquee, no matter what, right? And that was always a class throughout the season. It just was, right?

Throughout this season, in previous seasons, and, you know, the staff would just be. And there's people around him who kind of feel like-minded like you, Rajah, would just be like, yeah, you get your 18, 17 points. But we don't win when you do that. Like, we just don't. Like, you'll get your 20-something points, look off all these players, and we're losing, which is why we had to get Jimmy Butler. Right? Like, if you stepped into that number two role and the role that you say you want, we, we, and I'm thinking on the Warriors' behalf. We absolutely needed that.

We absolutely wanted that. We would love for you to be an all-star here in Golden State. But it just never happened in that way because we've talked about this. Like not all 20-point and 15-point and 18-point games are created equal. And it was always the little things that they wanted from him. And it was always, well, I want to be an all-star. And it's like, well, if you do these things, he'll be an all-star. It's so, but listen, today's not, but I'm not, I don't mean to make it sound like the majority of kids get this wrong. They don't. But there's some that just don't understand the value of like development of and, and you, you can wind up being what you want to be. It might not, it, it, it, it might be that you're just not ready to be that right now. And that might not even be from a skill set perspective. That might be from a, from an understanding of the concepts, from a, from a, a, from a, from a, a, from an understanding of the concepts, from a, from a, from a, it, it, it, it, it, it might be.

from a general BBI Q, like for any number of reasons, you might physically be able to go out there and any given practice and dominate a practice. Yeah. But there might still be something missing. And, you know, what do we talk about? We talk about this all the time, or at least I do, about young players coming into the NBA,

young quarterbacks going into the NFL, and where you get drafted to, and that system that fit, that developmental component being critical to your success. You go to instability as an organization, used to losing, put stock in the wrong shit all the time. The success rate is a lot lower for players in that situation. You are on one of the best franchises of the last decade, two decades.

I mean, I don't know, but like, that's gold, bro. Not to mention the stuff component I just gave you, like, appreciate that man appreciate that like play the role that you need to play you know it i always find it i always love the stories of i'm sorry dog i'm just i'm just ranting this bro let's fucking go bro i like the guy who learns how to be everything in an organization i like the guy who learns how to be the dude who gets people water i like it i like my young fellow that like i like my superstar to have known what it feels like to be the 12th man on a roster this isn't always the case Like some dudes just come in and they're great.

Like I like him to know what it feels like to be number eight on the bench coming in, you know, for sporadic minutes, never really being able to get a flow, but still having to figure away how to contribute to winning. Like I like when he's in the starting lineup as a supporting cast member and the ball's not yours yet, but you still got to produce and do all the things that contribute to winning. When you get to be the star, well, you have an appreciation for everybody on our fucking roster. You know how to lead them. You know how to lead them because you've been them. real. Right. And so running away from being like some of those things on your way to being the

star is it's just, it's a really myopic view of it, dog. Like embrace that shit, man. Work your way up. Be the dude when you're supposed to be the dude. You know, it's crazy, man. Like, I'm in my early 30s right now. And I got a lot of like people that asked me because I got it really young. I'm not going to lie. Like I got to, you know, I got to be pretty young like that really changed my life. People were like, yo, man, how do I get to where, how do I get to where you are? How do I do I get to, you know, how do I get to this beat when I, you know, at this age, like, you did. And I'm like, well, y'all didn't see like, you know, 17, 18 doing high school and like very unglamorous work and then going to the assignment desk, you know, getting people

coffee and shit and like making sure that they're, um, making sure that like the little things were done. Now, did I always do the little things in that stages? No, but that's kind of the point, right? Because you learn to mess up when you're young and you learn to do these things. And that's why I got so much love for producers, bro, because I was that one. I was that once upon a time, you know. And you see how when you do get to this stage, you see how all of this thing mechanically works, right? Who you got to talk to when I need this for the podcast? Who you got to talk to when you need this for a live show?

Like, how do you present it? Right. I know that because, like, I was, when you're. one of the people behind the scenes helping present such things back in the day, right? And so, you know, it was funny. I saw when I went to the finals and I saw Shea play, I was just thinking back, I was like, damn, man, this is the first time seeing Shea play at a stage even close to this since 2019 when I saw him play in the first round as a member of the Clippers.

When he was not a first option, when Lou Williams was getting the majority of the shots on that team. Not necessarily because Shea Gilgis was not as good of a player is because no, Lou Williams was on the pecking order, bro. He had, you know, he was Mr. Sixth Man and Montres Herald was getting a lot of looks on the offensive end. And Shea was figuring it out. And then he got traded, had to start from the bottom in Oklahoma City, had to figure out a way to win. You ask anybody on that Oklahoma City staff. And I did. I asked all the people I knew when I was in Oklahoma City. They all said, I was like, did you know that he was going to be a star? He was like, they were like, oh, I'm like, no, absolutely not. We just thought he was a good shoeing for the deal.

We had to get, you know, we had to get something and he was really talented at the time. And, you know, fuck it. We're, we're taking a flyer and he becomes an MVP. And then when I think about like the Ace Bailey's or the Kamikas, and I want to tell them like, bro, you could get everything that you want because you're that supremely talented. And in the league, it's not all about talent. You got to be, there's a difference between, what did I say? I had a bar that I was telling somebody other day. It's a difference between being talented and good.

Like, everybody talented in the league. In order to be good, you have to be the little things. You have to, like, set that back screen, get that back cut, you know, and help the helper. or maybe pass on a shot that you think is going to get you to an All-Star and just pass it to the best shooter that's ever played the game. That's going to be. On a certain position to get back, right? That's what it is.

Yeah, I know, I agree with you. And if I'm being honest, like, I watched a lot of their games this year. Who we talking about? Ruckers. So Ace Bailey. Sorry. I apologize. Bad podcasting.

But, yes, I've watched a lot of Ruckers and Ace Bailey this year. Shot selection is going to be critical for him, especially as a young player. because if I'm being honest, I told you I think he's a great kid from everything I've, but I also watched him and I'd be like, dude, what is that? I mean, Rutgers didn't even make a tournament.

No, no, they had him and Dylan. Like, and, and it just didn't produce like that, right? And, and, and, um, you know, this is, this, this is, this is, this is, this is, this kind of is my point though, right? Like, those two top five picks on the same college team with, with, with pieces around them, couldn't figure out how to win enough to get into the NCAA tournament.

And that's no slight at them. The point is they're young. Like you're in a lot of instances, even in college now, when you're that young, you're not going to know how to win yet. Like you're not going to know how to do all of those things yet. So like it's critical that you trust the people around you and that those people have a sound understanding of how to get you to the place where you ultimately want to be if you are talented, to make you good.

to help you understand what it takes to be good, to preach the things that you just preach, Logan, it becomes really, really important, right? And for Ace, like, he got pushed around a little bit last year in the games I watched. Like, you, what elite, the, for those who don't know, if it doesn't come across on this television screen,

go sit close to an NBA game and see how physical that is. Like, he's got to work, he's got to get right to work on that body and, and grown men, bro. That don't even think that even, like, like says what I'm trying to say, bro. Like superhuman grown ass men in the league, dog. That are not, that are not averaging 20 points a game. I'm talking about like people that are averaging like five and five

that will give you an arm bar that'll change your life. Bro, they will stop. That's only job, like feed their families by coming out there and not letting you do what you want to do. So like, but he'll be okay. I think he's a good kid. And Utah has has a very sound structure, bro. They are well coached.

Like they are going to do it right. Like they're not an organization that typically, you know, has a level of just of inconsistency and a track record of just fucking things up, right? Like there's a culture there when you go to Utah. There really is. I mean, now, full disclosure, I'm not like in their organization. I haven't been for a long time, but for whatever, whether I left there in a good way, bad way, or what have you, when you went to Utah, there was a culture.

You know, it was understood. And so I think, I think he's going to be fine, but going to have to have people and trust people. And maybe, maybe I'd advise, maybe when you get to Utah, listen to some of the people in the building that are around you every day and let the agent just work on the contract deals. Because if that was his idea to not go to the workouts, we're going to go in a different direction in terms of our decision making. Yeah, man. Before we get out of the segment,

what's your advice for him this, like from now on, from Ace Bailey, from June 26th on? Well, what's, just get to work, man. Get there. Get to work. That has already happened. You know, what I would have told him previous to that prior to that, It's like, look, dog, like, whether you think it's needed or not, whether you think you need to go to all these places, number one, this is going to be as much about the human being as it is about the player, right?

And they don't, they don't, they can't get to know you via Zoom and through a phone call. Like, they want to be with you, man. You see your body language. Want to know how you look at him in the eye when you're talking. Want to see if you can carry conversation. Is this somebody that people want to be around? Like, can, can he drive culture here? Or is this just like, you know, there are things that. they can't ascertain through, you know, distance. So that's one of the reasons why you should go. The other reason why you should go, because if you're that dude, we're fucking showing up. Tell me where to be.

Every time. All the time. Bro, tell me where to be. I ain't running from shit. Now, might not be great that day. You ain't going to draft me. But my fucker, if I, if I play basketball or like, I tell Dia, people say to me, like, you know,

about Dia and shit like that, I'm like, listen, he'll be there. Because I asked him and he's like, yo, where I need to be. And they're like, well, you know, tell me, I'm like, well, because that's what he does. So if there's ever a time where he's afraid to do it, we got a fucking problem. Raja. Raja. I grew up a huge USC Trojans fan.

So it goes against every bit of my being to fucking buy anything Longhorns related. That just got me so fucking pumped up. Got me so fucking fucked in. Let's leave D out of it. Like, I just use that because people are always like, you know, you know, recruiting is a weird process, right?

I want you to come to camp. You're like, why does he keep going to camp? Why does it? I'm like, because that's what he does. If he's saying that he wants to do that at X, Y, and Z level,

that's what you do. You pop out and show him, bro. Like, if I can't get this done, then I'm not supposed to be at your school. So like, ace, if we can't go out and get this work, out and show these people that we can jump over the rim and knock down a bunch of jump shots

and run a down and back in this amount of time or whatever they're asking you to do, are you supposed to roll out of bed being able to do that. And more importantly, if you're not the dude and you show up to workouts and you impress somebody, this goes back to my point of the league being really small, that's the difference between if you flame out somewhere and you go overseas to, oh, we're just going to give him another shot. like he's a good kid we're going to bring him in for whatever right like i don't know man i'm getting old but anyway i think that's all it is it's all good my recommendation to him would be this is all in the past all of what i just talked about is in the past that would have been of advice that would have been a bit

of advice that i've given to you prior as you were going through the process trying to determine whether or not or how you were going to you know conduct yourself now that's all in the rearview bro let's get to work put your head down put your head down and work i mean that's my favorite saying, dog. Put your head down and work. If you do that, you're going to be all right. If you're talented, if you're in a right situation, right, which I think he is, if you got good people around you, which I think he will have, it is going to take care of itself. You will start to see the fruits of that labor. When? I don't know. But it's like a seed, dude. That thing sprouting roots under the soil. Like, it's growing. When it's going to pop up above the soil,

I don't know, but do that right now. Get to work. Let's take a quick break and do this gimmicky-ass segment. And we are back. I wanted to do the gimmicky segment, but we're going to, we might get to it. But you were about to say something about Vijay, the Sixers pick.

And you were saying it in the break. And Cliff said, no, fuck that. Say it during the second. Well, it's nothing really. I was just going to tell a little story. Like my, I used to coach at a local high school around here when the boys were really young. And I helped my man out Kenny Kelly over at Western High School. And so like in the summertime, we'd be in a gym. And, you know, dudes would come through like Dia was young. I think Dia was hopping in the runs at that point. He was probably like, you know, 14 or something like that. And, you know, there'd be grown men coming through to who. Because Kenny had coached at like, he had coached another high school, Miramar High School and also at a junior college. around here. So some of his former players would be coming through the hoop. And one day he came in the gym with like, I think it was his younger brother or maybe his cousin or something like that. And, you know, he was like, look, we're looking for a high school for him. He's straight out to the Bahamas. Right. So, so we were like, oh, okay, because like you're always looking for

somebody to add to a high school team. Yeah. This, this Joker made like, I don't even think we were playing yet. It wasn't a move. But you know how you're like warming up and like people are coming through and they'll shoot a few and then you bounce on a ball and they do a layup and then they kick it back out to the next. This dude did something athletic and we were, Kenny and I looked at each other like, what the fuck was that? What was that? He's just a freak athlete, just crazy. Yeah, so it didn't work out. It didn't work out where he was able to play in the high school. So they took him, I think, to a prep or something like that because, because I don't know, something with the transcripts coming from the Bahamas to the states and the disconnect, right?

like he wasn't eligible to play in our high school. But we had seen him then. And I kind of lost track of it until like, I don't know, I was watching the Bahamas in one of those tournaments and he was in the McDonald's game. And we were sitting around at dinner, I think. And Kenny said to me, man, you remember that kid? I was like, nah, dude, he was like, that's the same kid that was in our gym back then. And it blew me away, man, because we had seen him.

I mean, he was probably 16 at the time, maybe 15. He had come through the gym, bro. might have had him on our high school team. We missed out. Sixers got lucky, though. He's going to be a dog. Cliff, how you feeling, buddy? Are you good?

Does that make you feel better? Listen, man, I'm great. I sent you all the video in the producer Chad, me, you, Vic. And he said, man, we used off a generator for seven years. You don't see young boys like that in the NBA no more. They come in just already with that chip on his shoulder. A lot of these kids grew up in the AAU circuit. A lot of these kids, you know, grow up in, you know, rather good circumstances,

which is great. Like, I'm not, you know, faulting anybody for having a good circumstance growing up. But you already know, he's coming from a place where it's like, look, man, I got to eat or it's kill or be killed. You know what I'm saying? We don't grind. We don't eat. Yeah. So I like that mentality, man.

I hope he produced as well for the Sixers. Already has a good jumper from what I've seen as far as his form goes. Also, if he like that, he's going to really be endearing himself to the city, right? If he plays like that, he's going to, y'all love that shit. You love defense, right? Like, the first, Roger was like, the first thing, Philly. He loves the defense, right? You love a great dog on defense who's going to go out there every night and put it all

in the line. So I think VJ is a guy that could do that. If his offensive game picks up a little bit, like he still just looks like he just goes off of his athleticism. That's why he's so good. But if he develops like a mid-range, he can come off some staggers, pin downs, whatever, and then turn around and just pop it, it's scary, scary, scary hours. Yeah, he's going to be just fine.

And you didn't ask me, Logan, but my advice, VJ would be. defend your tail off and just body people put them in the rim. Like if you can do that year one for that fan base, you've bought yourself a lot of runway to turn into the player that you can ultimately be. Like keep the hard hat on my boy. Like be, be, be Philly. And then just be patient and work, you know, in the dark to get to sharpen all the tools to

ultimately turn in because he's got a lot of. physical gifts, man. In a league full of freaks, he's a one percenter, man. He is crazy, crazy Twitch. Vijay, just play that freeway, play that Beanie, bro. Put the lights just up, light enough in the gym to where you can see shit and just fucking run sprints and go to work, bro. That's all you got to do. Um, okay. Time for Richter scale with Raja or Raja's Rikter scale. I haven't really like, I just fucking figured this out five minutes before the pot. Um, going to give you a trade. You're going to say how you feel about it. All right, we're going to start off. We're going to go to New Orleans where the New Orleans Pelicans traded their 23rd overall

pick, which turned into Georgia big man Ashenuo, and their 2026 unprotected first round pick in exchange for the Hawks number 13 pick next last night. How do you feel? How does that register on the on the Roger Richter scale? I mean, it's hard to put a number. Can I just say dumb? Sure. Okay. Because I don't have a number.

I mean, I don't know if that would be high on my Richter scale or if it's low. Like, what's the, are good trades high or low? It's your Richter scale, motherfucker. What's your Richter scale? I'll just say dumb then. I mean, that's, look. I mean, you, I don't know. I'm not a trade.

I'm not a trade like analyst breakdown taking inventory, but like, what was that? 10 spots? Was it 10 spots you moved up? Yeah. for an unprotected next year. And you're trying to build the team? Yeah, dude, no. You're definitely taking.

And you're going to want that pick as you're doing it, right? No, I'm not. Yeah, come on, man. It reminded me, like, remember Ricky Williams? The Saints traded all that capital for Ricky Williams. This might be like the NBA equivalent of that. Yeah, I don't know. I think they got Derek Queen, right?

I like Derek Queen. That's what they got, right? That's what they moved up to get. Like, is it? Am I right? Yeah. I mean, I like their queen, but like... You could have put some protections on it.

You didn't have to fucking do all that for the 13th pig. Jesus, bro. Yeah, I'm sorry. I don't know. I don't have a lot on that. Okay. It's, okay. On the Richter scale, that is dumb.

Okay. Fair. Let's go, let's stay in New Orleans. Because, you know, this hits close to home. The New Orleans Pelicans are trading C.J. McCollum, Senator Kelly Olinick and a future second round pick to the Washington Wizards for guard Jordan Poole, Sadiq Bay,

and the number 40th pick for the 2025 NBA draft. So another second this year? A future second round pick. Oh, not the 2025 second round pick. A future second round pick. Now they got one back. Oh. Yeah, that one's hard.

I don't know contractually. Like, what are you? I don't, just off the top. Like, I don't know what that does to any type of financial situation for either. team. I think the answer I would have to that is like a very, very low register on a Richter scale for me. I'm a big CJ McCullum fan. I don't see that moving the needle. Does that move the needle for anyone? I mean, outside of the scope of me breaking down how that, what it did to someone's cap or any kind of

relief they got or anything like that. Like that, that's not a move that I think makes anyone. Maybe they wanted to trade in expiring because CJ's about to be an expiring, but you took on Jordan Poole who has on a has like a wild contract. It doesn't seem like that you have to, you have a plan necessarily. They're going to trade Zion next. I'm not really sure. This trade is obviously like,

again, low on the Richter scale. But like when you do the trade that you did on draft night, it just screams incompetence on everything else that you do. Right. And right now you're pairing Jordan Poole with Zion Williamson. And I just don't have much hope for New Orleans. Like it just seems pretty bad. This falls into the bucket.

You said it. I say it a lot. What's the plan, bro? Like, we didn't just, okay, I'm in your, I'm in your passenger seat. All right? We're trying to get to, you're driving. You don't got no map. You don't got eye, you don't got an eye map out, no ways.

You got a flip phone. Neither one of us been where we're going. How are we getting there? That's what I mean, that's why, I don't know. All right. So do we have a Richter scale score? Yeah, very low. Like, I don't, one, two.

Okay. All right. It's just like, okay, cool. Right in terms of like the way I'm, like, let me explain my one or two, right? Like, Richter scale were like earthquakes or like shaking stuff. Like, so you're asking me like, how much did that shake up the landscape of anything or like what that? No, nothing. The Boston Celtics and Atlanta Hawks and the Brooklyn Nets finalized a deal that sends Chris stops for Zingas and the second round pick to the Hawks, Terrence Man.

man and Atlanta's number 22 pick for 2025 to the Nets, George Nying and a second rounder to the Celtics. Five on the Richter's scale, huh? Yeah. Look, Chris Stapps, if you're in the Eastern Conference this year, right? You're in the Eastern Conference. Boston's not going to be like Boston's out. The Pacers, I mean, like without Halley,

they'll still be a good team, but they're not who they were. I mean, the East is, you're looking at the East if you're in it right now, saying maybe. Yeah. So, so like, you know, Chris Staps is a nice piece. Chris Staps is a nice piece. Like, you know, what else they do? I mean, I don't know. I don't know what else the Hawks do, but like Chris Staps is one of those pieces. I think that like a lot of people would like to have to think that they have a shot, you know, to have some serious legs in the Eastern Conference. Completely agree with you. I think that we haven't really been fans of the Hawks over the last few years. but I do think that like, hey, man,

I was thinking exactly what you were thinking in terms of the Eastern Conference. It's wide open. You could talk yourself into, hey, Tray Young, Christosperzingis, if he's healthy, maybe we trust our medical staff. Huh, maybe we get to a five or six seat and play ourselves out of the playing race, right?

Like, who knows? Yeah. I think the Atlanta Hawks are just somewhere in the middle still, right? But they could make a run. This could be like a 2021 run, maybe, right? Like, if you're just, who is the, bonified team that's going, Cliff Sixers. Everything is on the table.

Everything is on the table in the Eastern Conference right now. What are you doing right now, like if you're an Eastern Conference team? You're just trying shit. You're just figured, let's, let's, do you feel like you're in the mix for stuff? Like, I don't know, Orlando is one of those teams that think that they can do something. I don't really like their roster, but who cares? Because they can get somewhere with that roster. Yeah.

Most of the time when you're saying I don't like that roster, at least me, I'll speak for myself. When I'm saying I don't like that roster, I don't like it, you know, relatively speaking, right? And that would be compared to like a really good Bucks team with Janus in the East, like playing well. Or the Celtics because they're just loaded and they got Tatum and Brown. But when you, when you're saying like, yo, they're not there. We don't know what Joel M.B is going to be and the Sixers are going to be. We, like the Pacers are without the straw that stirs the drink. Like those rosters start to look a lot better.

Yeah. Yeah. It's going to be a lot of 40-something win teams in these. It's going to be, okay, so I was, over the last week, I was, I got a stern talking to. Maybe not a stern talking to. But a lot of people in the comments were like, yo, you didn't talk about Portland. You didn't talk about the other side. Hey, I got you there.

You thought I was going to be messy. That's right. You thought I was going to be messy. Yeah. But we talked about the Jew holiday trade. in exchange for Anthony Simons. And we talked about the Boston side of the deal, but we didn't talk about the Portland Trailblazer side of the deal.

What I think about the Portland side of the deal is... Don't you dare. I don't know what Portland's doing, right? Like, on paper it seems like, oh, they're going to try to get a veteran presence for Scoot and the rest of the team and, you know, the other players that they have on the roster and, like, see what they can do in the Western Conference

because the Western Conference is, you know, equally wide open. I don't think that the Portland roster is good enough to be making these types of decisions or making these saying, hey, if we get a veteran in here, why not? Let's try to go make a run for it. I just don't think that they're there yet. And they had a nice end to the season. But like, I don't know. They don't really have a dude there.

I don't think that they can necessarily compete right now. And they look like a team that is just, making any kind of deal without a plan and that they're about to get sold soon and it'll get kicked down the road with the new ownership group there's not that much excitement in portland right now there just isn't let me just be real dude portland as a fan base and as a place to play like awesome right and every fan base feels like you're disrespecting like their team if you don't give them the same amount of attention as some other teams i can respect that like i used to love playing in portland man that's a great building to playing they got great fans

I'm with you on this one. Correct me if I'm wrong. Did I read a report or did Drew come out and say something about the trade? Did he do that or now? Yeah, apparently like he's pissed about it, which I get. And he might get traded to another team. Right. But that's, yeah.

That's essentially what I had seen. And what I'm, the point I'm making is they can be a great fan base. They can be excited. But they're not at the point where that makes a ton of sense in terms of chasing anything in the Western Conference especially. And so, like, hey, you know, I'm sorry, sorry fans. Like if someone gave you shit, Logan, I don't know. Quite frankly, I don't give a fuck.

But, but, you know, that's, it is what it is. Like, Drew's, you know, that's your response to every single thing that I bring to you, bro. Like, yo, Rob, man, fuck all that shit. I don't give a fuck, fuck them. Listen, if I'm a care what all, I don't know. Don't get me started on the philosophy of it. Hey, if you, I can't even do it.

And I go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Whoa. No, man. I mean, I mean, I, look, look. I, I mean, you can't internalize all of that.

Right? Like, you know what I mean? Like, I'm sorry. I genuinely. Like, I don't mean any disrespect to anyone if we're not, you know, covering the things you want us to cover or you're not, you know, I really do apologize. There's only so much shit you can get. to just like, you know, for the random fan that thinks you or I can sit here and watch every NBA game every night, you try to do it, motherfucker.

Bro, you know how hard is when you're going to every NBA game in your market to watch every single NBA game. Yeah. Out. It's hard. Well, I already told you. I ain't even about to try that. So don't even worry about it. But I guess generally speaking, like, you know, I respect Portland Trailblazers.

It's not a viable, like, thought to think that Drew Holiday gets you over the hump in the Western Conference right now is currently constituted. Like, that would be my opinion. It's just a nothing burger of a trade, right? Like, if you're going to trade Anthony Simons, what are you doing? You're not, are you going to get a haulback? Like, can you just, it's, it's tough, man. Where we get out of here. We don't get to do this often because, you know, we have a three-man panel and we usually do a mailbag a lot.

But let's do a real one of the week. You know, let's just, let's do it. You want to do one? You didn't even expect to, so I can do mine first. Go ahead. Yeah, go ahead. You can do it, yeah. I want to give it to one, Sabrina Yenescu, you know?

I was at the Liberty Valkyrie's game. It was her first game. It playing in the Bay Area since, which is another game I went to, since Oregon played Stanford in 2020, which was like right after Kobe's funeral. It was kind of like, it was, she flew up from L.A. to Stanford to play in that game. Pretty emotional night. But she bawled out and they ended up winning a game.

But she had a neck issue yesterday and didn't shoot the ball particularly well, but got like a timely steal and scored 11 in the fourth to help the Liberty win the game. And it was just like a really nice homecoming. Awesome. She had like 50 people that she paid for in the stands and a whole bunch of other people that was in the stands to watch her play. You're not coming to the West Coast anytime soon, but if you did, I would take you to a Valkyrie's game

because they sell out every game and it is popping. And it is very loud. So shout out to the Valks and shout out to Sabrina. And shout out to everybody involved in the Great Night of Chase Center. So that's my ruin of the week. No doubt. I tell my story about buying tickets. You just took me back to buying tickets.

Like you get a certain amount of tickets for NBA games, right? Tell me you're buying tickets. 01 finals. Magical playoff ride. I'm barely playing in them, but like my family and friends are just so excited that I'm there, that people are coming out to watch, you know, everybody wants to be there. And I'm, I to some degree got lost in the like, hey, I need this amount of tickets or I need these.

I got, I got seven people coming tonight. Like, I got people coming. So we did that all the way through the playoffs. And then, you know, the playoff bonuses are coming and they're heavy. Like, those are hefty playoff bonuses. So I'm waiting to see if they'll get down on a house. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But to see, like, I'm only there for a while.

So I don't know if they're going to give me a full share. or because I wasn't there long, I get a quarter or a half or what have you. Those dues are so like just geez all the way around because they gave me a full share. But when I got to check, there was an item, there was an item line for tickets. I did not realize the total that I had rang up throughout the course of the playoffs for tickets. And that adds up pretty quick, especially in the final. So just suffice to say, my bonus was not exactly what I thought I was going to get because the tickets, the tickets took a large ticket. And no, what I was so fucked up is they'll tell you, like, the, when you asked for the tickets, but oh, yeah, good, we got you. It's cool. Just like that. Just like that. You need five? You good? All right, cool. Come on. Just like that. And then, and then, but you fortunately got a multi-year deal, right, out of that, right? Didn't you get a contract? Yeah, I copped another year on the end of the deal. So, like, it was cool. It was just a, it was, it just made me reflect on that.

You talked about having a bunch of people at games. Like, no one. You were in rolling and dough at the time like Sabrina is. I just wasn't. Let's see, real one of the week. Can I give a group real one of the week? Fuck it. So look, so look.

It's our show. We talked on the last show, like, you know, Dia was blessed my oldest to win the Elite 11 competition out. It's an amazing experience. But he was blessed to win that. And then, you know, because of that, like some of the new publications and their ranking services are coming out and his goal had always been to be the number one quarterback in the country.

Like he had always wanted to do that. You know, we talk about like, you know, that stuff's cool, but it's all meaningless and whatever, but still these kids want to try to be that, right? So like, he had done it. And today it came out, the ESPN one came out and he was, he got bumped to the number one QB in the country, right? So he's not going to be my real one. My real one are going to be all the people, his quarterback coaches, his trainers, the people

who have poured into him since he was like in the third. third grade because as much as Cindy and I, you know, try to get him where he's supposed to be and try to help him and as much work as he does on his own, it takes a village. It really takes a lot of people sharing his vision and thinking that it's possible and supporting him and pushing him and kicking him in his ass when he needs to have a kick for that to be possible. And so for all of those people, I want to say thank you and y'all are my real ones. man i just got to say bro just to echo onto that man we started this pot of 2020 and deal was a baby bro like i think he was just starting i don't even think he was in high school at the time he might

that was five years ago i don't think he was high school he was just like playing football right or maybe he was playing like i don't know he was jv or something maybe at the time i don't know yeah but like to see him blossom into this has been dope like i haven't met him yet but like i'm just so proud of him man i'm so proud of what he's done i'm so proud of tie So proud of your little one, you know, your girl, the middle boy. Zen Bell. I'm so proud of Zenbell. I've done a great job with him, brother.

Well, thank you, man. They're good kids. With the village. But like, it's great to see them, like, blossom. You'll see this. You'll see this, though, right? Because I'll be saying the same thing to you. Like, when, you know, as he grows and develops and you guys are trying to do your best,

there's no manual for how to be a parent. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you're just trying to figure it out. out, people are going to come into his life in whatever capacity or whatever field he chooses to try to, you know, chase. They're going to be people that mean more to him in that space than you can because that'll be their area of expertise in, you know, probably. And, you know, those relationships that you watch him develop will be very rewarding for you

to watch and you will be so grateful and thankful for the people that help him get what he wants. Like, it's just, it's a really cool experience. And I mean it. Like, thankful, real ones. We love you guys. All the real ones, man. It was good to get back in the lab with you, buddy. Yeah, baby.

It was really dope, bro. Like, shout out to Howard. We love Howard, real. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It felt like we got back to like, like, 2021 vibes. Yeah, we were in the crates. We were in a crates today. We took it back.

Yeah, yeah, man. That was like, that was like Bridgeton boy's shit. Like, that was like, dog, I, I love what we've built. I love everything. I love real ones. Burwins is my favorite podcast. It is my favorite thing to do. I've grown to love it more than I ever thought I would, you know,

because when you first get into it, you're like, when you first get into, you know, a job like the ringer, you're like, I just want to ascend, ascend, descend, descend, and then they're like, yo, want you to do this podcast. And like, to our point, or earlier, you're like, well, okay, I'll do this podcast. And then I'll just branch out. And it's like, yo, man, this podcast has just been so great and just brought so many blessings to us, bro. You know what I mean?

For sure. Within the NBA community, but just like also, professionally and shit, like fucking, the people that we've met doing this podcast, it's just too, like, it's just us, you know? Like, I'm in. I'm still blown away, Logan, I'm still blown away all over to West Coast when we were out there last week, you know, and in a lot of circumstances now I'm Dia's dad. Like, unless we get around people that are like NBA heads and remember that I played,

a lot of times I'm deeratized that. The amount of people that came up to me and shook my hand and I was anticipating a like, talk about my son and they'd be like, love listening. Like, bro, that's, yeah, man. That's wild. Yeah, man. That's wild, bro. And it's, like, also crazy.

Like, even, and I don't want to talk about it, obviously. But, like, even the shit that happened this week is like, yo, your voice matters this much. You know what I'm saying? Like, that's shit's crazy. Yeah, crazy. Fucking crazy, bro. It's wild.

How we've been able to grow this, bro. Anyways. Hey, Kady, come on here, man. Let me be the peacemaker, dog. Come on, dog. Come on, man. Come on. Let me make some peace between my brothers here, man.

Come on now. Bro, I've known that dude since I was 18 years old, dog. It ain't, it ain't no thing. You know what I'm saying? Like, I don't want to bring the prepod to the other pod shit, like onto the pod. But you know what I'm talking about, right? Like, it's just, it is what it is. You know, it just is what it is.

It's all we'll say. That's it. All right. That's been another edition of the pod. I think we're doing one show next week. I haven't gotten to schedule it, but I'm assuming just one. one this week. So we'll talk to you guys real soon.

All the shits. Bye!