The Ringer NBA Show - LeBron No Longer a Laker. Plus, Kawhi Back in the Six! | Real Ones

Episode Date: July 1, 2026

LeBron James will not be returning to the Los Angeles Lakers, and will likely finish his career elsewhere. Just where might that be? Logan Murdock, Raja Bell, and Howard Beck discuss LeBron’s departure and where his next landing spot will be. Could he return home to Cleveland, where it all began? Maybe Miami, where he captured his first championship? Or could he reconnect with Olympic teammate Steph Curry in Golden State? Plus, Kawhi Leonard is headed back to Toronto after the Clippers traded him for Brandon Ingram, Gradey Dick, and picks. Where does this put the Raptors in the hierarchy of the East?(00:00) Intro (0:32) LeBron not returning to the Lakers (20:14) How will LeBron be remembered in L.A.? (26:12) Jomi farewell to LeBron (28:21) Possible destinations for LeBron (52:55) Raja defends LaMelo (1:06:30) Kawhi traded to Toronto (1:11:27) Jalen Duren and Pistons standstill (1:15:27) Ja Morant trade review Hosts: Logan Murdock, Raja Bell, and Howard BeckGuest: Jomi AdeniranProducers: Victoria Valencia and Clifford AugustinAdditional Production Support: Jamie YukichProduction Supervision: Ben Cruz and Conor NevinsBuy any two Ferrero Brands and you could win $1 million. Visit GoAllInAndWin.com to learn more.The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit https://fanduel.com/playwithaplan to learn more about the resources and helplines. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping? Real Ones. Logan Murdoch here. Roger Bell and Howard Beck in a minute. We go long on LeBron. And then a little bit on Kauai. And then an epic rant from Howard Beck on Jiam Moran. All that next. Cliff, Victoria, Ben played a theme music. What's popping? Real ones. Logan Murdoch here. Roger Bell there, Howard motherfucking Beck in the cut. Man, I don't even know where to start. Yes, I actually do know where to start. LeBron James is a free agent again. You know, it was building towards this, everybody.

And, you know, there was so many rumors throughout the season. Will he be back in L.A.? Will he be gone? We finally got a little bit of clarity. One is that he's not going to, he's going to play next season for the 26, 27 season, but it is not going to be with the Los Angeles Lakers. And there's rumors abound. We are going to try to make sense to those.

And we are also going to try to talk. about his legacy and then we have another trade, you know, that we're going to talk about later in the program. Kauai Leonard is going back to Toronto. But first, let's stay in the West Coast for now. LeBron James leaving the Los Angeles Lakers. I want to start with Howard Beck here. Why didn't it ultimately work out with LeBron and the Lakers after eight seasons?

I mean, it worked out for eight seasons. And they won a championship. and they were pretty good and they were relevant and he brought them back. So like before we talk about the ending and what went wrong-ish, I think we still need to at least acknowledge how much these two parties needed each other. LeBron James needed the Lakers in 2018 when he went there

and the Lakers badly, badly needed LeBron James in 2018 because it had been a long time since they had been good. Kobe had been retired. His last few years weren't so great. great. Like, LeBron made the Lakers the Lakers again. Let's not forget. So there's that. And then he brings Anthony Davis there. And they went a championship. Where things went awry, sideways, some sort of direction that wasn't straight? Is that out of the blue, Nico Harrison gifted them Luca Dantich. And nothing has been the same since. And like, that's it. Like, if Luca Dantuch never becomes

available and he never should have been, I think LeBron James is still a Laker right now. I don't think that's a stretch. I don't think that's hyperbole. I don't think that's a crazy narrative of any sort. He became expendable. They found their new tent pole, their new foundational piece in Luca. And while they've played well together, and while at times the Lakers have still been very dependent on LeBron, especially with Luca and Austin Reeves.

out in that first round series a couple months back. But the fact is you cannot build cogently, coherently, and sustainably around Luca, which you now have to do as long as LeBron is still present, taking up a lot of oxygen, and on the books at a really high cap number. And I think we should have all seen that this was coming a year ago at this time when the Lakers did not offer an extension. LeBron opts into the last year of his deal, makes him an expiring contract for the first time and forever.

And like it was all telegraphed then. We were inevitably getting to this moment where LeBron James and the Lakers were going to have to look at each other and say, you know what? We had a great time. It's time to move on. The Lakers need to start building around Luca. And LeBron needs to figure out where he best fits in this final stage,

whether that's a year or two or whatever it is. but they don't make sense together anymore. I think this is the most logical conclusion. This episode of The Ringer NBA show is presented by Ferreiro. The world is watching. Go all in for your team this summer with Ferreiro. Enter for the chance to win a range of prizes just by purchasing your favorite treats. Like Kinder Bueno with an irresistible chocolate wafer and creamy hazelnut filling.

Or Keebler Chips Deluxe cookies with indulgent and rich chocolatey chunks. Or Ferrero Rochay squares with crunchy hazelnuts and milk chocolate wrapped in iconic gold. Go All In. Buy any two Ferreiro brands and you could win $1 million. Official rules apply. Learn more at go all in and win.com. Do you agree with that, Roger? Yes, I thought LeBron was going to leave the Lakers. There was, I mean, I've come on before and talked about how well I think he transitioned, what a good soldier he was in terms of being able to kind of acclimate to new roles on the fly, both on the court and probably in the locker room,

definitely within the organization. That doesn't mean he had to love any of that, though. And I never got the sense that he loved that. Everything that Howard said is true about the Lakers and what they need to do. But LeBron had a choice. And, you know, it's not unlike Jalen Brown, except it's completely different than Jalen Brown

in that there's a level of respect that you think you should be shown or given. And if that's not what you're feeling, you know, there are times when you, if you have the opportunity, you may move on. Now, where he winds up is going to be very, really interesting. Like I've heard a lot of things. I'm assuming it's going to be about chasing championships,

but is it going to be about championships and and desirable city to live in? Is it going like what how he parses out what that next step looks like for him and what's important and what the priority is is going to be interesting. But I never got the sense that LeBron was happy about the way it is unfolded there in L.A. I thought he handled it gracefully. I thought he played phenomenally even better in some spots than I thought he would trying to make that adjustment. But I never got the sense that he was really, really excited.

and happy to be doing it. Well, I mean, we'll get to the reporting part of it at some point as the reports come out, right? But like my thing was, you know, going into this free agency for LeBron was, you know, the Lakers offer everything that you could theoretically want as a, even as a, you know, second on the call sheet or however you want to put him on the call sheet behind Luca Dotsuchin and Austin Reeves, he's still LeBron James and being a Laker as you're on your way out has his advantages, right? and retiring as a Laker has a certain advantages.

And I always thought that, you know, that had a big chance of winning out in this situation, right? You know, the new ownership and just say, hey, Brian, what do you want? We'll figure this out for one more year because you are a Laker for life in our eyes, right? And that's also going by the old guard, you know, the old guard in which Howard Beck is covered once upon a time. And I just thought that that that could be the best option for him. Howard, how did, why wasn't that the way? Because throughout our history of watching the Lakers, you know, Kareem is getting a farewell, you know, magic, Kobe.

If you want one and you feel like you are a Laker for Life and you are institutionalized as one of those guys, you get that. Why couldn't LeBron and the Lakers just figure that part of it out? in the end, right? And I know it's a weird set of circumstances, but why ultimately couldn't they just figure that part out? I mean, not everybody got their, like, happy romantic sendoff. Like, Shaq got traded to Miami Heat and, you know,

took years before he was, like, kind of welcome back into the fold with the statue and everything else. So, like, it doesn't always go that way. I think, yeah, this is, from a standpoint of just history and tradition, and honoring your greats, this isn't the ideal send-off. You're right, Logan. Like, this should have been his last stop.

And again, would have been, if not for Luca, because where they would have been instead was a team based around LeBron and probably still Anthony Davis with some okay role players that was a first round out that wasn't going to go anywhere. And it would have been like the later Kobe years, right? Now, the later Kobe years, to be clear, Kobe had to overcome and Achilles and all that other stuff. so he wasn't himself.

He couldn't carry a team. LeBron still kind of can, right? He's still better than 90% of players in the NBA on his best nights, but 82 games is a lot to ask of him. But in a world where they don't get Luca, you've got a middling to maybe top five-ish, top-sixthes playoff team, and you ride LeBron until he retires. And that's it.

And maybe you hope somewhere along the way you find a guy to be his heir, but that's really hard. It almost never happens. So in the scenario that they do have, you now have to make hard choices that you would have never had to confront before. And so I don't think anybody wanted this. I don't think Jeannie Bus or Rob Polinka

or the new ownership for that matter. I don't think anybody would have wanted it to end this way where it's like, we'll just shake hands and say it's been real, but our path and yours diverge now. But I think everybody's a realist. LeBron's been in this league a long time. Rich Paul's been around this league a long time. These guys understand it, I'm sure.

I'm sure they're not thrilled, but they got to understand it. Like, there's, it's, you just hit a fork in the road. It doesn't make sense for them to continue together. Even if LeBron were willing, now, I should stop there.

If LeBron were willing to take a fraction of what he's been making and was okay with that, in addition to being essentially a third wheel next to Lucan and Austin Reeves, then maybe. But that's still, it's still a tough path for the Lakers to go down because what they really need to do

is completely reimagined this roster around Luca now or around Luca and Austin Reeves. And that's super, super hard to do with LeBron still there no matter what he's making and especially if he's making a substantial amount. So I don't think there's any good answer here and we'll, you know, drips and drabs of reporting will come out in the days and weeks ahead

as to how they got to this exact conversation point. Like, what were the Lakers willing to do? to keep him? Would he have been willing to go there? How much was he? You know, I think it's interesting the way this unfolded. It came from LeBron's camp that LeBron has decided to move on, not that the Lakers had decided to move on. I think there's probably a hell of a lot of nuance and gray area there that we don't know yet. And I think it's fully possible that this was actually the Lakers signaling to LeBron's camp. Listen, we have to start rebuilding around Luca right now. We're on the clock. This dude's in his prime.

he's a top five player in the NBA. We have to do this. And you say it as respectfully as possible. And then LeBron and Rich Paul take the narrative and say, we've decided to move on. That's probably what happened. Yes. How does that make you feel,

I mean, you guys would know better to me. How does that dynamic make you feel? No, I mean, I'm not tapped in like you guys are, man. I'm running around here. And I'm speculating, Roger. Some of vibes. Yeah.

But I heard, I heard that like he was unavailable to the Lakers for golfing reasons over the last week or so when they had the exclusivity of talking to them. I mean, that's the report that I heard. So, I mean, I don't know. I certainly don't know in any way, shape, or form. But as soon as I heard that, I was like, oh, oh, yeah, that, that's not good. I mean, that's the interesting part of all of this, though, Roger, right?

because you were also like in the 2014 wait and see like era of LeBron going to the Cavaliers. But it's like there's always two forms of LeBron and for agency. There's a very engaged LeBron in the off season. Like I'm going to help out. And then like there's also the hands off approach. Like I'm not going to answer any calls. You could just go to my representation. Like how do the, what is it like being on the two sides of that?

Oh, I've been on. I've seen that from every side. And before the 2014, I was caught in the last. whole like everyone's going to wait to see where LeBron goes when was that that was oh 2010 2010 the decision was that when he went to Miami yeah um so like I mean myself and probably a large part of the league that wasn't a superstar was just sitting around and free agency was not moving until that domino fell so you know um that was frustrating I mean that was you know I had some some real anxiety that time around the block just because I wanted to know where I was going to go.

I wanted to know what my future was going to look like. That year in the front office, I don't really remember that one clearly because I was kind of in, I was going to the Cavs that year when he was going to the Cavs. It was pretty quick. That one didn't strike me the same way as being a player and basically having to wait until his domino of free agency fell. and then the rest of us could kind of shuffle around. But at this point in his career, I don't imagine it is that for that many guys.

Now, there are going to be some. I would imagine that if he can land with a really, really nice group, he'd be attractive to some probably fringe guys that would come in and kind of supplement in that way. But, you know, my most interesting time around the block with LeBron as a free agent, obviously 2010. Yeah. You brought up a great point, though, like the people circling the wagons for LeBron, right?

And I think it's like we're in this social media age, in this new age that is very different from the other times of LeBron has been here. Right. And I feel like his agents and his side of the story is trying to put out feelers in the old-fashioned way of like, hey, we're going to scour the league and see who gives us the best opportunity and the best market and the best, you know, everything, right? And I don't know what the landscape is going to be for LeBron right now, Howard. Like, what is your, what is your gut telling you about what the landscape of, like, who actually wants him? Now, we are going to get into the teams that, like, just we think he could be cool, a cool fit for later on in this segment. But, like, where is your gut telling you about the market of a LeBron James at this particular point? Well, the market isn't, you know, like, once upon a time the market was, are you important enough, cool enough and in a good enough city or with emotional ties to even get LeBron's attention, right?

So like in 2010, it's both LA teams. It's Chicago, big market, New York, big market, New Jersey soon to be in Brooklyn, big market, Miami, glamour market. Those are the teams. And then Cleveland, of course, trying to keep him. But the market for LeBron, when it comes to like what you can pay him, LeBron's not getting the max at this stage. He's 41.5.

And I don't like the only place he could get anywhere near his old salary was to stay in L.A. That's obviously off the table now. He's worth over a billion. I think he'll be okay. But he is now having to weigh things like someone who has the taxpayer mid level versus the non-taxpayer mid-level versus the, you know, room exception versus like we're talking about a guy who's got who's worth over a billion is now in theory considering whether Miami versus Cleveland versus Golden State versus whoever. can give him like 10 versus 12 million or what I it's it's almost like preposterous to even talk about but the market in terms of teams that could use him that he be useful for every team in the NBA every fucking team in the NBA I was just saying this so I'm I'm hanging with with friends out

west right now and they're not all like real key to in the NBA and so I was trying to explain the landscape today I was like listen here's what I can tell you about lebron james at age 41 and a half he's still better than 430 out of the 450 players in the NBA, and I'm still being a little conservative there because that number is probably even higher than that. He is still an impact player. And that said, you know, he has to decide where he's going to be happy for his last whatever, it's going to be a year or two.

That was always L.A. for the last several years, for the last eight years, because his family liked it there, he liked it there. You know, he was able to get Brony on the Lakers. that was a thing that happened. Like there were advantages to being in L.A. Now it's about what do I want my swan song to be? And is it the emotional return to Cleveland and the sentimental ties there?

Is it a reconciliation with Miami? And that's already been reported, that they're open to it. And look, they just got Janus. They got Janus. Like Janus and LeBron and Bam would be really interesting, right? LeBron with Donovan Mitchell and James Hardin and Evan Mobley would be really interesting. LeBron and the Warrior scenario.

That's the thing, too. Like, this is not, we know this is not necessarily sudden or leaving LeBron the lurch because we've been hearing warrior stuff for literally months. Um, and even some Cleveland stuff and even a little bit less than that, Miami. Like the obvious teams have been kind of preparing for this for a while. Yeah. As a possibility. Now, whether there's anybody beyond those three teams.

I think Sam Amic just reported Minnesota, just before we started recording. So, and Minnesota, look, you know, Tim Connolly's not afraid of chasing anybody, right? They may be the long shot in all this because LeBron has no ties there and it's cold. But that's what I was saying. You know? I mean, I'm sorry. Who says no, right? Yeah.

But that's like that's from no, from being around him just a little bit, like that's why I said, what I said before is like, they're going to, that's a, I couldn't see him in a city like Minnesota. You know what I mean? Howard, like no disrespect to Minnesota, but that, that one would just be really weird for his career. Sorry, anyway. Hasn't, no, no, hasn't been his MO, right? Like, yeah, he was in Cleveland twice because he's from Akron and they first, you know, they got his draft rights initially in 2003. And then he went back there out of, you know, emotional and familial ties, right? Like, but that's the only city like that smaller market, cold weather market that I could kind of see him in. Like, I don't see some scenario where suddenly he's going to like, not a cold weather

city, but I don't see a scenario where he's suddenly going to like Charlotte to join, you know, Brandon Miller and Concanipple, right? Like, like, there's a, I think we can cross out all the usual teams that we would normally cross out for a superstar of his caliber. Um, and the thing is even the ring chasing thing, normally you get to this stage of a career for a superstar and they're in play, it's well, go to the team, no matter where they are, that can get you the, give you the best chance to win a championship. He's got his rings. Like, I'm sure he'd love to have, what, would it be a fifth? But like, I don't see him going to the Thunder or the Spurs, even if those teams wanted him. Um, I don't, I, like, I know we talked about him to go into

the Knicks a thousand times, especially back in 2010. Hey, you're messing up. No, no, no, no, no, you're messing up the segment, man. Stop doing the negative stuff. We're about to have some fun in a second, Howard. Hold on. I got a question. I don't have a run down in front of me that tells me anything about you mentioning the Knicks? Hey, man, we having fun. We're having a lot of fun. That's why that's why we didn't do the rundown. It's why to give it to you because I wanted you to have some fun, man. I didn't know what I was, I can't know what I'm spoiling. I hope that's a, I hope that's a beer in your hand right now. Anyways, one last question. I'm trying to cover the label so we don't violate any of our advertising

concerns. Last question. Before we get to the teams that we would, we would like to see LeBron on and like some fun scenarios. But I want to ask this. A little fuck a few years ago, I think that I made Raja almost blow a damn gasket when I said this. But I don't believe even now that LeBron is leaving the Lakers as a top 20 beloved Laker at this point. I'm talking about beloved. I'm not even talking about best, right? And I want to ask you, I want to put this question to the panel. Is he that?

And what do we think that L.A. is ultimately going to remember him by? And then what are they going to remember him by and what should they remember him by? Howard Beck first. When you say 20, like, I mean, who's on this list? Like, Devin George and Norm Nixon? Like, how, what are we doing? I'm talking about, okay, okay, cool, cool. Magic.

Talking about Kareem, talking about Will Chamberlain, Jerry West. That's four. Okay, Jerry West. Then Elgin Baylor. Five. Shaquille O'Neal. Six. This is no in particular order.

This is just 20 people that I think would be more beloved over it. Kobe Bryant. Kobe Bryant. James Worthy. Michael, James Worthy. Michael Cooper. Nine. Byron Scott.

Bob McAdoo. 10? Okay. Bob McAdoo. 11. Powell Gasol. Kurt Rambis. Kurt Rambis.

Who else? Roger couldn't even say. say it without laughing. What the fuck are we doing? What are we doing? Robert and Derek Fisher. Robert or Eric Fisher? Now you're getting caught. Robert, I'm cooking with grease here. We're at 16 right now. Okay. We are at 16 and you're like, I don't know. George Mikean. George Mican. Lamar Otum. Lamar Otum. Shoshavujovitch. Stop. Stop. Stop. Okay, but a legitimate list, I have about 18 and there's two people that could be, that can be more below. All right. I'm not going to get in. Mark Madsen. I'm saying, I'm really, I know you're saying beloved, not greatest.

I'm saying beloved. I'm not saying greatest. Gail Goodrich, that's what I don't know. I don't know Laker history well enough to even participate in. I don't know. I will say as a former Laker beat writer, there's some stretches in there, Logan, but I get what you're saying. Brad Turner, it's Kim Kawakami, Howard Beck. Bill Plashke, Jay, Dade.

No, but I'm being serious. Okay. So, but the question that I have, though, is. that this is leading up to is how will L.A. remember LeBron in the era and how should they remember him? I do think there was a lot of resistance when he first got there, right? There was still a lot of LeBron versus Kobe stuff. And the Kobe stands in particular were not all that welcoming. And I'll never forget one of those early records that LeBron got within his first couple years there. And they like stopped the game or whatever. And it didn't even seem like the applause was that loud.

Was it when he passed Michael Jordan for the scoring for the scoring record? I think. that was what it was. It might have been, yeah, but it was one of those markers, one of those milestones, and it just seemed like a kind of a tepid response. And you could just feel like, damn, man, if that had been Kobe or even if that had been Shaq, if that had been magic, whatever, it would have been much different. And because like the emotional ties to him were just different. He was already a made man before he got there. He had his three championships before he got there. He'd been in the league for a long time before he got there. Like, it's not the same as when it's your own guy or if he'd come to you needing that that the power of the laker brand again the laker brand needed

lebron as much or more than lebron needed them at that time but the fans don't have to care about that the fans just care about do we love you do we embrace you and i think it took time i think by the time this thing ends which is now i think lagerdom kind of warmed up to him i do think like he is embraced. I do think he is part of that. It's not the same tier as the guys who were either Kobe who's homegrown, Magic who's homegrown, or, you know, Kareem who got there at a specific time and place that resonated and plus the partnership with Magic. Like these other guys occupy a different space. I agree with that, Logan. But I do think he'll be remembered as a guy who put the Lakers back on the map after they'd been years in the desert post Kobe or just post his his final.

championship in in 2010, right? It had been a while. It's in its 10 years between titles. LeBron put them back on the map. LeBron got them another banner. It sucks. They never got to really celebrate that one right because it happened during COVID. So no home, you know, no home celebration for it. No parade. Even ring night. I can't remember ring night was probably real muted too because we weren't putting everybody back in the buildings yet. It was still. So, But listen, he'll still be remembered as an all-time great Laker, but yeah, on a different tier than the other ones, some of the other ones you mentioned.

I think he's, I think he's comfortably ahead of Mark Madsen. We'll see. Let's let the real ones aside in the comments. Roger, well, how should they remember LeBron James? Look, any, I've said this before. This is what I will say to that question. Anytime you, as a fan, get to regularly, if you attend games, or if you're watching every night,

watch greatness. and we're talking about a select few. I mean, that's a goat, right? When you get to witness that and it's running around in your jersey championship or not, you should cherish the time that you got to witness it performing for your team. If you didn't, then shame on you, right?

Because that doesn't come around often. There you go. Good shit, man. That was very good. Let's take a quick break. And we're going to play a fun game. that Howard might walk off the show for. Yo, you know who would be, Joe Me, back on Real Ones.

You guys know why. LeBron. LeBron, LeBron, LeBron. What do I even say, man? You know, it's been a hell of a run. Truly. I want to, I can't get to say everything I want to say because it's not my show.

No, it's Logan, Raja, and H. Bezies. But I'll always remember the good times. I'll always remember you coming down here, we didn't have to. No, we was in the mud back then. You didn't remember those days, man. Tim O'Fa Mazzdorf, L'A. Mazdorf, L'A.L.D.

You know, we was like, I was trying to give Kendall Marshall All-Star votes. You know what I mean? It was a brutal time. but you changed all of it for us. You know, I know that injury on Christmas Day against the Warriors was tough, but came back, got A-D,

you made the run, man. That 2020 championship means a lot. I'll always remember you standing there, you know, after Kobe died, and you were crying along with us, you know? You did it for being, and so that, I can't be mad at that. You know, hey,

first in-season tournament. That was us, you know? Like, we did that. I say we as if I was on the team, but you know what I mean. So, thank you. You took the Lakers from a shell of their former selves, you know, irrelevant, poorly run, just a decrepit organization to be frank, and brought them back to where they're supposed to be.

You know, the highlight factory, the pinnacle of basketball of basketball. basketball. That does mean a lot. And I, anybody else who disagrees. I know people may be upset, you know, like fans who didn't want them here and all that stuff. But really all I can say is thank you. Okay. Boom. I have a list of teams, some of which Howard is pooped on, but it doesn't matter because it's about fit and if we would love to see it. The first name on the agenda is the Golden State Warriors who, I've said this all along, and me and Howard have talked about, I know me and Roger have talked about it, but I feel like the Golden State Warriors were always the team in the weeds. They were always that other person. I was like, yo, if that relationship

don't work out, I'm right here, baby. I'm right here for you. And now they're in prime position to be able to state their case to LeBron James. How would this fit? How would we like to see? What would the pros and the cons of this move, Howard Beck? I mean, Logan already knows. I love the idea of LeBron and Steph playing together. They were awesome together on the Olympic team. They're friends. They, you know, they compare notes on their careers.

They're at similar stages of their careers. Plus, listen, like the old rivals becoming allies, you know, Rocky and Apollo. Come on. This is awesome. We love this shit. It's a little weird. I will say, long-time listener, honorary real one, friend of the show, my friend Joanne up in Portland, not happy about this possibility.

This is giving her a lot of angst, which she doesn't need right now because the giants, her baseball team, have already been given her a lot of angst because the giants are acting like idiots. So like it's, it's not perfect. If you're a longtime Steph fan, longtime warrior fan, the idea of LeBron after all those battles in the finals coming in, possibly overshadowing Steph in the final stages of their careers, right? Because they're both on farewell tours of some sort now.

We don't know when either of them is going to hang it up or if it's at the same time. And like they're going to kind of like, they're going to have to share that. Much the same that Steph had to like share the spotlight with KD for a couple of years, right? And Warriors fans weren't always happy with that. I love it. I love it as a competitive thing too because I think they could actually make some noise. If they're healthy in April, May and potentially beyond, no one's going to want to see Steph, LeBron, Jimmy Butler, and Draymond Green.

I guarantee that. Will they be upright? We don't know. But if they are, nobody wants to see that. So yeah, I love it. I understand Joanne and some of my other friends who are in a Warriorsdom may not like it so much. From a purely basketball standpoint, it would be weird in the case of you would have to be basically playing with two teams, right? Like you'll be playing first the Steph, Draymond, LeBron-led version.

And then you're going to have to bring in Jimmy Butler into the fold, say like around January, around All-Star break. from a basketball standpoint, how do they fit in the first team and how do they include Jimmy back into the fold going in to assuming they're healthy? Look, I don't mean any. Jimmy's a great player. So what I'm about to say doesn't discredit like anything that he's done, but I don't see him as a great fit there. I don't know that he is the player that he was when he was taking Miami to finals years ago. and if you have a lesser version of that, it's not really a shooter.

You've got LeBron, Draymond. You know, Chris Stapp's helps. Steph is going to be, you know, the thing that just orbits and just flies around the court. I love LeBron and Draymond in that. I kind of, I don't know how Jimmy fits into it. I would have to see it. I would actually like them to get a more shot first two guard

to play with that group. Do you know what if that would make sense? Like Clay Thompson. So yeah, yeah, like Clay Thompson. Or you can give me a poor man's version, but like game that wants to do that, you know, the way Jimmy wants to, the way Jimmy needs to play, if we're being honest, to like be the Jimmy Butler from Miami. It's a contradictory style to what like LeBron's going to do. They kind of made it work with just stuff, but like you're going to put it in there with LeBron.

And then you're going to, if you're going to, if you're going to. allow Jimmy to do Jimmy, then LeBron turns into what he was for the Lakers, which is, hey man, get some rebounds run. Do you understand? Like, you're not using him to be, it's, they just, I don't see them clicking like that as a foursome, if that makes sense. Can I push back slightly though, or just theorize, Rajah? So you've got Porzengis, a three-point shooting center.

So you've got the spacing there. Dramon's a non-shooter, Jimmy's a non-shooter. And that was already a problem for the Warriors, right? Like, they were trying to figure that out on the fly. just for the last year or so before Jimmy got hurt. But I also think like, you know, and obviously Steve Kerr coaches this way. He likes a bunch of guys who are like really intuitive with the ball on their hands. And you've got guys in Jimmy, Steph, LeBron, Dremont, who are all like elite in the way they read the game.

I got to think there's a way when you've got them there, you do have still tune on shooters. And maybe you're going to stagger lineups and everything else. And that's the great thing too, right? Whether there's Jimmy or LeBron, somebody's always running that offense. even when Steph's off the floor. I don't know. A lot of intuitive, high IQ basketball players together and with Steph and Porzingis as the main shooters out there,

I don't know. Seems plausible. I mean, and LeBron's a good shooter too. Yeah, but that's not. Look, again, if we're talking about LeBron just becoming a three-point shooter, then I'm out. Not just a three-point shooter. Right.

No, I understand what you're saying. And I'm not, I'm plausible. is what you said? Yeah, I could see it. But, but, look, you got Steph running around, right? And you got, you got Chris Stabs, right? Then you have three people that, that mostly want to operate, get, like, well, Jimmy and LeBron are downhill kind of players, although LeBron can shoot the ball, right?

LeBron at his best is making plays as he's collapsing defense. Now, he doesn't do it to the same degree, but, like, he can still command a double. You have to throw the ball to Jimmy. And yeah, they can play off of each other. I don't know if I'm explaining this well. So I'm not saying it won't work, but I don't see it being the type of clicking offense that it would be if you had something

that wanted to just streamline it and be more complimentary to that threesome, if you will, in a shooting capacity. Right. From a basketball standpoint, though, just watching the Warriors' offense, like how much... do how can the warriors overcome the redundancy of Draymond and LeBron both on the court at the same time?

Not saying that they can't do it. I'm really just asking because, you know, like they basically functionally play the same role. LeBron's a way better version of what Jremont does offensively. So how do they kind of coexist in that offense for right now? Like, how do you see that happening in June 30th? Look, I think when one of them has the ball and the other one is in some sort of action with Steph Curry, you have a problem. Like you have a problem as a defense. There are three super high IQ players. And to some degree, Howard, that's what you're saying, right? You add Jimmy Butler to that

and those actions are on both sides of the floor and you don't, it could be really problematic. So that's what I, you know, that's what I would say to you, Logan, just, you know, I haven't done a lot of research on this and thought about it. You're asking me a question on the fly, but one of them is going to have the ball and the other one I'm going to put in an action with Steph as much as possible. And then we're going to see, you know, if that defense can get that right over and over again. And I've got at least two guys who've mastered it. And LeBron is such a genius. I don't think it's going to be far behind before he masters it too.

And therein is going to be, you know, how we incorporate both of them with relatively similar, you know, kind of skill sets and passing the ball and seeing the floor. You add a fourth to that. And I don't, I want to go back, Howard. Like I don't, I feel you. It would just be so dope if that fourth player and fifth player, the defenders that were guarding them had to be anchored to them. Because if they're anchored to them, then there's nothing you can do when I'm telling you I'm playing these in a three-man game,

all game. When they're not anchored to them, you bring in that fourth defender and look, they're probably good enough to get over it, but it just introduces another defender to the mix. Yeah, man. On the court, I think best case, scenario is the 22 Warriors where they go on that major run to start the season and they kind of

coast the rest of the way through and then they get themselves ready for the postseason. That's the best case scenario for this type of team and this vaulted of a Western conference. So we'll see what happens just from an all-court perspective. Off the court, it's going to be very interesting. I kind of took a peek at like Warriors, you know, social media and they just want to take anything they can get. At first I thought the premise was going to be there. There's going to be like a weird, you know, it's going to be a weird vibe of rooting for LeBron after all these years.

But, you know, it's late stage Warriors dynasty. So they'll take anything they can get. So we'll see what happens on that end. I think that Steph will be, obviously be amenable to this. I think they will figure it out. I think it will be fun. The only thing is the health. Like, that is the big boogey man in here and the age from all of those guys.

Jimmy, Draymond, out of all these guys, has been the healthiest guy. but you got to think about Steph's house. Their age is going to be a real unction. It's going to be like when Raja hangs out with all of his former sons teammates, except at my basketball. I'll see you brothers in Springfield. Straight like that. Okay.

All right. I have another team. I think I'm going to throw a wild card out there. Let's go with the nuggets. How do we see him in the mix with the nuggets? What's you think? I know you, I see you a little parking up a little bit. Oh, I like it.

I like him with the, I mean, what are we giving? Are we just incorporating them into their current works up? people. Oh, dude, yeah, all day. How does that work functionally? What do you mean? Well, I'm asking you. Look, LeBron played the four this year in stretches of the season and looked pretty good doing it. It's not unlike Golden State. Like, they run a lot of, a lot of feel actions. You know what I mean?

Like, where you just have to have a feel for one another. Jamal Murray, Yolkich, you know, know, if you watch them play, it's kind of like poetry at times, right? Like, they're just kind of, they're kind of feeling each other and they've got experience in that. I think LeBron fits into something like that all the time. You know, I think there's, there's a motor that he brings to a team when he can, when he can board the way he can and then be the break himself. You know what I mean? Like, he's on the rim as a defensive rebounder and then he's two dribbles burst out. You guys are flying up the court, I think that which unlocks some other players on Denver's team, if you will. And in the half court, you're going to be Yokich, Murray, LeBron, and then everyone

else is going to eat off of that. I like him for, for Denver. Does that, if he goes to Denver, just hypothetically, we're having fun. If he goes to Denver, does that basically solve all of their problems in terms of like what they have to do to retool and all of their concerns around retooling at this point? You don't think there would be another move that they would have to do. Yeah. I mean, our friends Mark Stein and Jake Fisher have been reporting that, you know, Yokic is hesitant once again to sign an extension. And it's not necessarily an indication that Yokic is upset and wants to leave, but just more of kind of like there's at least some part of that that's possibly kind of a, let me see what you guys are doing here.

Like the Nuggets do need some sort of kind of like reset, not a tear down, but like, and everything seems to be on the table right now, right? They're considering whether they move Aaron Gordon in a trade, even potentially Jamal Murray. Like they're, they're considering absolutely everything other than, you know, Yokic himself, right? If we're in a scenario here where LeBron, again, and it seems like we're pretty close to it, and you guys remember, I brought this up months ago, if LeBron were willing to take whatever a team has available, a mid-level exception, a taxpayer, mid-level exception, the minimum, whatever, he can go wherever he wants.

So I don't know if there's a sign and trade possibility here with Denver or any of these other teams, but if it's just whatever they have available in an exception, and, LeBron wants to go there without them giving up anything. And you're keeping Aaron Gordon? And listen, it's been hard to keep Aaron Gordon healthy is a big problem. You're resigning Peyton Watson still, hopefully, presumably in this scenario. You're keeping Jamal Murray. That's a badass team.

Now, like, health matters, but, like, LeBron and Yokic are both fucking playmaking geniuses. You take the two of them plus Jamal Murray, score slash playmaker, some defense with Gordon and Peyton Watson. and like you're in business. Is that enough to knock out Oklahoma or San Antonio? I don't know, but I don't know that I want to bet against them either. How would they fit, Roger, like between the San Antonio OKC hierarchy in the Western Conference? Would you just be right planted at third?

Yeah, I mean, yeah, look, they were a year ago, not this year, but they were right there with OKC. They were toe to toe. Nicola Yokic is a problem for anyone. Now, he didn't have a great, I don't have a great series against Minnesota, but he's still a problem. So like, yeah, if you added LeBron and they were able to stay healthy

and retain their pieces, yes, I do think they are right there. I'd probably put them to start in a tier below those two teams. But if they were playing well, you know, if they were playing well and looked like they were hitting their stride and health was going to be factored in all year long, I'd give them as good a chance, you know, like, real talk.

It's going to be, again, like Howard's, I never, I'm not in the habit account in other people's money. That's not, that's not what I do. So, but I would say this. At this point, if I would like to see LeBron not worry about the money. Like, if you're going to keep playing, now I'm not, you know, whatever makes you happy bro the happiest whatever is important to you in terms of like winning or where you want to live or whatever that dynamic is chase that like that mid level ain't doing shit for you do you know

you know what i'm saying like i don't mean to at this point is this is real ego yeah it would just be that it would just be that yeah where would it be the most fun or where would i have the chance to win the most and maybe maybe get another finals run whichever of those is the most important i would really like it to be that for him. Like, I wouldn't, I wouldn't, yeah. It's a great fucking luxury.

Like, how many players get that at the end of the career? It's like, you know what? I don't need the ring, but if I can chase it, I will. I don't need the money, but if it's there, cool. I'm just going to go where it's going to be the most enjoyable and hopefully win a little bit, right?

Like, that's a phenomenal luxury for a guy at his stage. No doubt. I make no mistake. He would help Denver. Absolutely. Let's keep it messy, man. Let's go to the San Antonio Spurs. Oh, man.

How does that fit, Roger? Let's fucking go. Wimby and Braun right now. Julian Champany ain't giving up that spot. I'm sorry. Yeah, you know what's weird about this? Because I just said he would help every team. If I'm the Spurs, no, I'm good.

Yeah. Wow. Wow. You just told the goat, you just told the goat to take a hike. Yeah, no, if I'm the Spurs, I'm probably telling you I'm good. And only because could he help? Absolutely. But I just think there's so many people on a rapid ascension in terms of their development.

Yeah. And it just got you like right on the precipice of winning a championship. It would be weirdly like Houston was. I don't want to stunt that. Yeah, I don't want to stunt that at all. But it was kind of Houstonish, but like OD Houston, like with real results. Yeah. Like, no, and also with like real generational talent, not like, you know, like great looking prospects.

Yeah, that sounds crazy, but I'd probably, yeah, I'd probably pass. Okay. Okay. It would be weird. Could you humor me, though? Like how it would look, though? Like, come on, man. How would it look?

I mean, I don't know how it would be able to look. I mean, listen, I keep saying this over again. He can play anywhere, dude. Like, it's just he can play anywhere. It's just what you're going to ask of him, you know, as a player. And how much of himself. And again, I think this factors in. Sorry, Howard.

I think this factors in a lot. And this is what I was watching with the Lakers. You know, as much as it's about the money of it all and feeling like you're undervalued there, it's asking to give up parts of yourself that you don't feel like are completely gone yet to fit into certain situations that may not be appetizing for people.

I don't mean to speak for him, but like I've seen, that's a struggle sometimes. But that's the part that I was, and that's why I looked like I was about to talk, Roger, because I'm glad you're making this point because I just kind of wanted to note this part of it, which is at 41 and a half,

I don't think LeBron is insisting on, on that old role at all. I think one of the most notable things that happened this past season, more so even than when Luca for Scott there was that LeBron did find a way to just kind of integrate himself as essentially a third option, sometimes second option, and then when necessary, could toggle into primary driver of the offense in the role that we've always seen him for decades. He's capable of that, both I think intellectually and emotionally and certainly intellectually. Like he knows how to do that.

I think he also knows his body well enough to know that. that I can't be old me at 82 games. So playing on a team where you had in this case, Stefan Castle, Dylan Harper, Deer, and Fox, Wembe, and it's not as much as asked of you. But, you know, you can maximize yourself as needed, and he can gauge that better than anybody. I think that's fine.

And it's the same thing as I thought in the Warriors scenario or some of these other possibilities is that he will find a way to fit in. And I don't think he's going to be leading with his evening. ego at this stage of his career. Or with his usage rate. I just don't think he needs that. Yeah. All right.

Let's blow Howard's brain off of his fucking head. Wait, would you want to go ahead? Okay, okay, hold on. Okay, let's spare him for like 45 minutes. I would agree with most of what you said, Howard. I don't think he's going to be leading. No, no, no, no. I don't think you're leading with your ego.

I don't think he is at this point. I'm not saying that. But I am saying that there's a fine line between hey, come in here and chase this championship with us and have a palatable role for yourself. And, hey, come chase this championship with us and kind of stay out the way. I don't, yeah, I'm not suggesting that. No, I'm not saying that you are. But like, when I look at San Antonio, I guess it was the point that I was trying to make,

which is like, hey, Wembe is Wembe. We all talked about Dylan Harper and what he did in a playoffs as a rookie. Stefan Castle, I see less of a role there, if that makes sense. Because all of those dudes are just bursting at the seams to figure out exactly who they are on this championship level team

that is already championship level. And you might be asking him to give up too much of himself in that scenario. Or you're asking those guys who need the room to grow. Can't do that. Yeah, can't do that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. All right, let's fuck Howard up. The New York Knicks. What are we doing? What are we even doing? What are we even? Howard. That's it.

That's the question. That's Howard. You live in New York. I thought there was more set up coming there, Logan. No. No. No. It's funny because in 2010, LeBron dropped all these hints in that 2009-10 season.

He wore a Yankees cap, I think, at one point. He gave a quote about how, you know, summer 2010 is going to be a really big one for Nix fans. And he was doing all this cutesy stuff acting as if. And there were a lot of people who thought it was a done deal. They thought it was a lock to New York. And they were stunned when it ended up being Miami. They thought it was New York. And if it wasn't New York, it's because he was staying in Cleveland.

Well, you're trying to say the Knicks fans don't want him. That's what you're building up to. That's what you're saying. No, I'm just, no. That's what you're trying to think. No, all right, don't let me put words in you, Bob. Go. No.

What I'm saying is it's kind of poetic and funny just at this stage to consider after spurning them all those years ago when he was in his prime to come back at age 41 and a half. Y'all, what's up? Hey, remember me? Remember me? I wear a Yankee camp a couple times. Remember me? You wanted me really badly like 16 freaking years ago.

Now we got a title and now you're trying to act brand new. Yeah, I mean, that's the thing. Like, listen, if LeBron were in a position where he still needed the rings, if he was, if he were ringless, then hopping on board with the defending champs might make some sense, although it would still be kind of distasteful for a player of his caliber. But at this stage, like, he's got his rings. he doesn't need a ring chase and joining the actual defending champs would be weird. Now, he does have ties, man. Like Mike Brown coached him once upon a time in Cleveland. Worldwide West in the front office.

Yep. Even more, even a stronger tie there. All kinds of CAA ties and stuff from- Josh Hart, former teammate, you know? You know. So like, no, but no. Could it fit on court, though, Raja? Could it fit on court?

least he could fit anywhere but could like how would it would it be weird a weird fit do they have to get adjusted to him yeah i don't see i mean is he coming off the bench probably i guess so i guess you're not you can't do that no so you're bringing josh hart you're bringing josh hart scram go to the bench josh heart go to the bench yeah i mean i wasn't saying that to be funny either but like that you just want a championship like that's a hard again that you're going to ask me does it work. Look, yeah, man, you plug LeBron in, you run for, you know, virtually six, eight and downs and then Carl Anthony Towns or Mitchell Robinson anyway. So yeah, it could work. Plugging him into that is, is, yes, it could work. I just, you're, the Knicks, as much as anybody to me,

are built as this like real delicate chemistry like project. And they got the recipe exactly right. You know what I mean? And I don't, don't touch that. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like I just don't think you, you mess with that. Interestingly, I hadn't really heard it. But like, I was just thinking, in a weird way, you know, you said like you can't,

you can't go to the Knicks. They just won the championship. It's going to be hard to go to the Spurs. Like they just narrative wise, championship wise, you can't go to the Spurs. Could you go to OKC? You could, hey, listen, narrative-wise, LeBron has blown all the narratives out of the water with leaving the Lakers at this point.

He could, he's gravy. But yeah, he should. No, but I mean, but I mean, it's like, like even as a story, they had won a championship and have fallen off the pace slightly. And, you know, it wouldn't be the same narrative. Oh, he just joined OKC. It'd be like, yo, he went to OKC and got him back to the top of that.

Yo, LeBron and Oklahoma City would be like big foot, bro. Every time he gets out of his house, he would attract a crowd. It would be crazy. It would be crazy. It would be nuts. How long does it take to go around their downtown now? Howard, you've been there since. No?

Do you remember? I think the last time we did this, I said that their downtown was like three blocks long. And I got like very detailed reply. Well, actually. Anyways. I got the biggest hashtag will actually of all time. I got one more. I got one more team before we actually get serious.

And I have serious. like the serious teams. The Minnesota Timberwolves, Rajabell, because you haven't gotten your take on Lamello going there. How would he fit in Minnesota? You missed a fun Lamello conversation. I needed you badly. Were you guys killing Lamello?

You guys bashing Lamello? I had to play the part of Raja Bell last week without Raja Bell. You were a Lamello defender? Sort of. Logan is confirming. He says not. Sort of. I had to be devil's advocate.

I had to at least moderate the discussion a little. I think it's going to work at all. I think it's going to go terrible. I think it's going to be awesome to watch. I'm going to make every. LeBron will fix it all. But will LeBron fix the hubris, Rajah? Let me, let me.

First of all, let's do this. Let me allow me to retroactively defend Lamello. Yeah. I mean, every player has their flaws. He has his flaws, right? I have always said, as it relates to Lamello, we must acknowledge that, but we must acknowledge that he does shit with the basketball,

that very few people on the planet. and even in a league full of freaks with the basketball can do with the basketball. So there's real talent oozing from those pores. There is a level of dysfunction that he was brought into the league. Recently Charlotte has started to get it together. Yeah. Prior to recently, why are we giving Charlotte this level of grace that would absolve them of playing any part in Lamello's like dysfunction that he was dropped into as a young player?

And I'm only saying that because I've seen players in really tough spots to be like the best version of themselves, not be the best version of themselves. I've seen that same player when taken out and extracted from that situation and put in something really stable with real guidelines and expectations and guardrails and accountability be a completely different version of themselves. And I'm not saying that he is definitely going to do that, but I'm saying there's a possibility that he can. And I do think you have to acknowledge what he was dropped into as a baby in Charlotte for at least playing some part in who he was as a player as it relates to like whether you're winning games and so on and so forth. LeBron to the point that Howard made is automatic organizational culture. It's at it's like LeBron is like just Adwater. Here you go. Culture.

So if you're telling me you're going to a place with a young aunt who's still developing his leadership chops and a lamello who, you know, super talented but clearly needs some guidance and some structure around him. And you said, and you could get, you could get LeBron in. You could throw a driver in there. You get LeBron in there. They make a lot of tunnels in Minnesota. Just live downtown, doll. You just walk to go. I just said that.

Yo, just live across the street. Do a one of those tunnels that go to the arena, bro. See, that always walk through. the skyways, yeah, yeah, yeah. But, but no, I mean, like, I'm not even talking about on the court. I'm talking about what that would mean to a young duo like those two who, who both have real, real gifts, you know. I also think, you know, again, we talked about San Antonio.

Like, San Antonio's got Wembe, but after Wembe, what's the next biggest thing that they were running out there in playoff games? Hopefully, is Dylan Harper next year, right? Like, that's the next. No, no, but I mean just in terms of pure size, when we're talking about Minnesota. Minnesota got, yeah, but he wasn't, we weren't playing with Wembe. Right, right. He was coming in for Wembe.

So both of those teams in the finals were basically playing four guards. Yep. And a big. So in that world, yeah, you could incorporate LeBron. You're going to bring you culture. He's going to bring you some stability. He actually would add value, like on the court. And when you got DeSOMU, you still got Big Phelup,

Rudy. Yeah, like, yes, yes. But if you told me he wasn't going to have the type of role on the court, like let's say it was a similar situation to San Antonio on court, which it's not. But let's say those are apples to apples in terms of what you're going to ask him to do. He's way more valuable in Minnesota, just because of the culture that needs to be kind of in place

and would be helpful to some of that young stardom that they have. that'd be that i would want to that's my lead pass team if he goes to mucca minnesota that'd be awesome i will say this though like this is a just a little sidebar having i mean i watch him like i'm a fan like everybody else uh it i remember when i got the golf bug and it was something that i did all the time and you just couldn't wait like after you left and you worked on your chipping and you're putting after the round and then you couldn't wait to be back out there tomorrow um that's going to be interesting to see how he navigates that. Because a couple of these places, you're not, you're, you're only golfing on road trips.

And he seems to really have a golf bug right now. It sounds crazy. But when you get it, no, it sounds crazy. But when basketball players get that golf bug, like it, it is. It's a sight to be hold. You factor for it. It just be fun to see a guy of his caliber pick Minneapolis, right? It doesn't happen.

Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It would be cool. Speaking of a place with a lot of golf courses, as Rajah knows best, Miami. Now what do you think? Let's get to it.

Let's get serious. The Miami Heat fit. Raja. So I was on the side of going back to Cleveland. I've been on that forever. You go back and listen to a pod. I said it really early. I thought he should go back to Cleveland.

Having given it some thought, a lot of that had, well, first of all, obviously Janus wasn't in my end, right? But I like the sentimentality of it. I like the swan song of it all. I kind of like the career arc. there's a part of me that thinks it may be too much. There's a part of me that thinks like emotionally,

just it may be too much for him, for the team. Like that's a, you know, unless you live there and saw LeBron there in Cleveland, it's hard to articulate just how electrifying that city is when they're good and LeBron was part of it. You're talking about Miami? You're talking about in Miami? No, I'm talking about Cleveland right now.

Okay. And so I'm saying now as it relates to Miami, it might be my favorite destination. Like I like Miami. Putting in with Janus and Bam, you know, you didn't have a kind of a guy with the ball that's making plays out there on the perimeter and kind of facilitating in that way. He's going to do that. You still have work to do on a roster, but it's probably my favorite destination for him. And you are big and you are physical and you are, you're just going to basically be the antithesis of what I was talking about with like,

with San Antonio and the Knicks, you can kind of be like maybe the Rockets or, or, okay, so we're big. Yeah. You better get big, because we're big.

Yeah. And they got a shot. They would have a shot in the Eastern Conference. Whereas if you talk about Golden State, they probably wouldn't. Another team would have a shot. Howard, thoughts on my. I apologize.

No, I think it would be really cool. Like, that's the thing. Like, I, you know, I'm going to think in terms of storylines as much as I'm going to think in terms of basketball, although I do want to see him on a relevant team, right? And Cleveland, Miami, Golden State, I think all check all those boxes, right? Fun story. You know, homecomings in two of those places. And I think all three of them are more than relevant if LeBron's there and maybe even without LeBron, but especially with him. So I like, yeah, LeBron, Janice.

Bam, the defense, the playmaking, the downhill attack. Wiggins? Wiggins? Yeah, throw Wiggins in there. Can you find a couple of shooters? They just signed Tim Hardaway, Jr. Or came to terms with him today. So, like, you need a few more of those.

And they're well coached. Very well coached. So, like, I think it'd be really cool, but I do think, like, if you're going to do a homecoming, back to Cleveland to, like, bookend the career has a lot more resonance than back to Miami. Like it just doesn't feel the same, right? But also it's like one last washed run, though. You know what I mean?

You know, one for the Gipper, right? Just one last. I'm about to just go have a sick one in Miami for eight months. It would have, it'd be cool. I think it's, I think it's more interesting for him to go back to Cleveland. Do you think that, like, Rajid, before we get to Cleveland? I would agree with that. No, I would agree with that.

I would agree with that 100%. Like, look, Cleveland's storyline. I mean, that's fantastic. I, I, I, I, and maybe I'm thinking too deep into it. It is just, I mean, it's a spectator. Like when I was in the best way possible, like it is, the city is on fire. If they're good and LeBron is a part of that. And what you can't quantify is, you know, he hasn't, LA is a different kind of town.

It doesn't revolve around the Lakers like that. You know what I'm saying? revolve around any real sports team in that way. When when when the calves are playing and they're playing well, I mean, it's what the city is about that day. You know, as I remember it when I was living there. And he's what, 10 years older than he was the last time he was there. You just like, there's an emotional drain kind of that that that, that we don't account for as fans that is that is on players at times and players learn how to manage it they don't even think about it it's just it's just you know par for the course right you learn how to like manage your battery in that way um but there's part of me

if i am thinking a little bit about it too much is wondering if like yo 30 40 50 games into that if you're like yo this is a lot people are pulling at me in every which way like the city i don't know i don't know but i would agree with you howard like that's a it's a phenomenal story right like back at Cleveland chapter and we're going to just end the book. Also he's already reconciled with them, right? He came home, like they hated him when he left. They embraced him when he returned.

He won them a championship and all is forgiven forever. And when he leaves the second time for L.A., they're like, cool, man, debt's been paid. We love you. We're going to cheer for you every time you come back. I don't think it's quite the same in Miami. Like, you won a couple championships. You left after four years.

You spurned Pat Riley, the godfather? How dare you? you and you can come back and they'll they'll cheer it'll be fine but it's just not the same as with as Cleveland because the ties aren't as deep because he didn't already have the reconciliation and all the debt paying of winning a championship after the after the spurning like it's just different yeah that you don't I mean you're in Miami would they welcome him back with open arms right oh bro my our fans are listen our fans if you're not good they're not there as soon as you're good they're all there so it I mean the sense

mentality of it all. You know, they're not going to have the attachment that the general Cleveland area has to LeBron. He's not a, he's not a hometown like kid, but if he's running around in a heat jersey and they're good, all's forgiven. So let's talk about real quick. The fit for Cleveland versus Miami for him, no. Let's talk about the encore fit though quickly. Like how does it compare and compressed for him? How would it be?

Oh, you know, there's more, I think there's, it's, it's, more of a ready-made roster in Cleveland. Like, it's easier to see him in Cleveland and what it would look like in Cleveland because you just don't know what Miami's going to look like at this point. Yeah, I like him. Look, I like him in Cleveland. That's why I said it early.

I like, I like him in Cleveland with Donovan and, and James Hardin, you can move him around. You can really move him all around the floor and do different things with him there that would unlock different people. There's room.

In Miami, yeah, there's room too, but I don't even know how you want to play. Like, I don't even know what they're going to look like because of a roster. So that's, I'm sorry, dude, that's probably not good potting. I don't know what they're going to look like. I can see him and tell you how I think he might fit in Cleveland.

And that would be you put him in pick and roll a lot, probably with James Hardin at times. If you were taking one of those other bigs off the floor, you'd also have him with the ball in his hands and pick and roll. He's another guy that would ignite break. There are a lot of things that you could do with him in Cleveland, moving him around the chessboard. Not that you couldn't in Miami,

but they don't have the roster. So I don't know what that's going to look like. Yeah. I'll just say this as an end of all the teams that are serious. I think the Warriors, in terms of like pre-retirement would be amazing for him. I don't think that they're going to necessarily get to, you know, the heights that he would get in the Eastern Conference. But in terms of like vibes, golf courses,

We have very nice golf courses in the Bay Area, Raja. I'm not sure. You have a lot. A lot, right? In San Francisco down in Silicon Valley, all in the East Bay. It's really nice. You know, good food, good, all of that stuff, right? Like, you can really just have like a real send-off, a real Bay Area send-off, right?

But I don't think they will ultimately have a ceiling. I think Cleveland and Miami, if he wants to, like, win and, like, actually be relevant come May and June, I think those are the choices. You know, you guys are the experts. But for me, I think that that's where we're headed. Before we get out of here, just in pure NBA fashion and pure clipper fashion, we're going to give them 10 minutes right after we talk about the Lakers and what their moves are. Kauai Leonard has been traded to the Toronto Raptors. He is back to the six for Brandon Egram, Grady Dick, two unprotected picks, one pick swap, two second round picks.

basically the Raptors they backslided and the Clippers got picks in return. What are the thoughts on the on the transaction? I mean, not quite the same like sentimental like swoon of a LeBron

back to Cleveland with all due respect to Toronto, a city I love. And I know dude brought them a championship but dude was there for one season. Like not even a full 12 months cycle. But that's Toronto though. Like, they didn't win a title before.

That's how you become a legend. He means absolutely the world to them. By the way, shout out to whoever on our ring or social channels posted the thing about quick Photoshop of Kauai was, I think, the caption in a Toronto uniform. That was fun. Probably Jomey. Probably Jomey. Shout out Jome.

That was great. But no, like, it's, he means a lot to them, but based on like, you know, a one season cycle from seven years ago, that he's now putting up. the kind of numbers and playing at a level that rivals his time back then, improbably after all the injuries, after all the games missed, is incredible. And he's joining a team with Scotty Barnes and a bunch of other very talented young dudes where in an Eastern Conference, like we have to be careful here. We got through an entire season of saying the Eastern Conference is wide open and this team

is the favorite. That team's the favorite. Detroit's got the best record. Boston without Tatum. Oh, Boston with Tatum. All this other stuff started not trying to trigger you Rajah with the Tatum stuff. But like, we don't, we don't want to say the Toronto Raptors are like one Kauai away from unseeding the defending champion, Nix. That's a little disrespectful. But I do think the margins are thin in the east. They were.

That's why we said it was wide open in the first place. And, you know, Kauai with an up and coming Raptors team, if Kauai stays healthy, I don't want to deal with them. So yeah, I'm not dismissive of that at all. And again, it's, it's, we're in the last hours of June 30th year, the last hours of June. There's a lot of summer to go. Who knows what other moves may come behind this with Toronto, because clearly this is an all in move. This is a short term. Yeah, we're going to extend him probably a couple of years because we have to, but you don't know how much more of Kauai you're going to get, but you're getting the final stage of his career. And just as we talk about with LeBron or Steph or KD, these.

are guys who are still when they're playing among the best in the NBA. Kauai is right there too. And he's going to be surrounded by some really great young talent that can carry a lot of the load. And this is fascinating, man. Like this is one, like it's, I'm not saying we never saw it coming. There was always like a little bit of that kind of speculation, but this is not when you expected, especially when it was such a big deal for him to decide to spurn them.

He's the first finals and only finals MVP in history. to win a championship and then say I'm done. I'm going somewhere else. See you. Been real. Man, I mean, it's the most Kauai move ever. I will say this, though, just to add to your point about that one year, though, you had to be there for that Toronto Raptors championship run to understand how important

that was and to understand why Toronto was welcoming him back with open arms. It was electric. Toronto, I don't think he's ever been the same since then. It was one of the greatest moments of my life. It was so much fun. It was, it was just, it was a. sight to behold. Now on the basketball court, Roger, where does this put the Raptors right now? I would just agree with Howard. I mean, I think over the course of the last few years,

you know, the parity kind of like and the inability for the teams that we think are going to have this dynastic run for the inability for them to keep that going. You know, all lends itself to like look, if you add Kauai to a group that was already really good, they're young at this stage in his career, all the points Howard just made, I think you're in the mix. I don't know that I have you, you know, as a top three team, but all you want to do now in the NBA is start the year saying I'm in the mix. And over the last few years, I think it's borne out.

Like if you're in the mix, and you got a puncher's chance, anybody could come out of that and that's where they are um you know i and and and so i don't i don't i don't know that i could put it better than howard did yeah one last thing man and i this is just something that i've been thinking about um this jeline durin situation in detroit has me baffled right i don't know if it's fumbling the bag necessarily or i know it's just getting leverage to go with the pistons but like as a former player raja and then beck i want to hear your opinion like the fact that this is taking it's so hard to get done at this point this contract is that going to have any ramifications because i think he the pistons have all the leverage in this in this deal he still talked to uh during supposed to discuss

sign and trade scenarios with the lakers in the in the kings um but if he does eventually get back to detroit like what is the ramifications of this in that locker room and just how he feels after a contract dispute like this um Yeah, I don't know that they're the same as like Jalen Brown when you're being dangled. He's restricted, right? Yeah. Is that what his situation is? Yeah.

That's a weird place to be, man. Like, I don't, do you love it? No. Are there some residual feelings about it? Probably. But I think they're easier to get over because that's, you know, I don't, I don't still probably feels disrespectful to someone that that considers. themselves like part of your fabric and things that they've done a lot for you, but contractually you're in a weird place there. So I don't think that there's much of a hangover

from that. So it's clear there's a ton of interest for him out there. And it's, I'm sure the Pistons anticipated that. I think the difficulty here, as just from a strategic point of view, from a front office trying to figure out what the state of the game is, if somebody out there's going to max him out or even just go to wherever the threshold is that the pistons are uncomfortable. And I think they've already signaled we're going to match any offer. And that's the right thing, right? He's your guy. You drafted him, you developed him. Yeah, struggled in the playoffs, but he's had an incredible trajectory. We always say this and you hate to talk about players as assets, but you protect the asset. You keep the asset. If you don't think he's worth that,

you figure it out later. You trade him later if that's what it takes. But you don't let him walk for nothing. You have to match. But by letting the market set his price, you then risk, one, paying him an amount you didn't want to, and two, having him possibly be a little bit hurt about the whole thing. Now, he'll, I'm sure he'll get over it. It'll be fine. And shit, he may live up to that contract. You may be perfectly happy to have him at that number. But you kind of need to know, through your own intel ahead of time, is somebody else out there going to max him? Because if we think someone's going to max him and we're just going to match it anyway, well, then we should just go out and make that the first offer to him right out the gate so that we don't have to go through

all these machinations and hurt feelings. That's some second-guessing backseat bullshit by me, but I do think that's part of what your job is in the front office. You need to anticipate this so that you're not in this position and then ending up paying him that anyway. For sure. All right. Sounds good. One thing that I just saw, Butler is going to be hosting the NBA Cup championship game. Not, not Jimmy Butler. Not Jimmy Butler. It's going to be at the Hinkle Field House in Indianapolis, Indiana.

I will not be there. Have you been there? You played there? It was good. Yeah, I played there in college. It was a cool place to play. I don't know what you're looking for an NBA Cup game, but it's cool place. Does it make any sense for an NBA game at all?

What's like, what's the capacity there? Yeah. Yeah, probably not. Yeah. They were just, I haven't seen the capacity to solve the communications. The NBA has overdosed on Vegas, so I'm happy to see. them trying something else. Who hasn't, right? Yeah. I don't know.

I don't know about this whole like moving, you know, whatever, traveling circus now that the NBA Cup's going to go to college. Whatever. We got through this whole pot and we're not even going to talk about the Jama Rant trade. What a bummer. I was just ready to blast away. Oh, go ahead. Five minutes. Go ahead. Go. Go. Go. Go. Go. I hate this trade. I hate it on every level. I hate it for Memphis because they finally had to cut ties with the guy who was the face of their franchise and excited their fan base. It was electric, was awesome, was possibly the future of the league. I hate that it comes

to this, even though it had to come to this. I hate the return they got, even though we all knew they weren't going to get shit for a return. I hate it much, much more for Portland because, no, they didn't give up anything to get him. That's not the point, people. They gave up nothing to get him, but now you're bringing in John Morant to a back court that already has Dame Lillard coming back off his Achilles and is a franchise legend. Drew Holiday. Oh, Scoot Henderson. top three overall pick who is supposed to be your point guard of the future. All these guys need the ball in their hands. And oh, by the way, Denny Avdia just had a breakthrough season as your primary ball handler,

playmaker score. And now all these guys are supposed to be sharing the ball. By the way, Jha isn't what he was. Jha may never be that guy again. He's taking a beating. He doesn't finish at the rim as well as he used to. He can't shoot threes. He can't defend.

What are you doing, Portland Trailblazers? That's it. I'm done. Roger can go sleep. Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hate, hey. I got tacos to me, don't. Hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hey, hey, great disclaimer voice. That has been another edition of real ones.

You know, the motherfucking vibes. You know what we do. It's all season. Summertime, ah, ah, summertime season. We go see you when we sing you. Ah, ah, all the shit. Bye. Must be 21 years and older and present in select states.

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