The Ringer NBA Show - Lottery Reactions! Plus: The Rockets Blast Off, Don’t Worry About the Lakers, and the Sixers Roll Over | The Mismatch

Episode Date: August 21, 2020

Verno and KOC react to the 2020 NBA draft lottery (1:16) before discussing the ongoing first-round series in the playoffs (24:07). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Welcome to The Ringer MBA show. I'm Chris Vernon and joining me as he does every Friday from the Ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'Bomber, Kevin O'Colmper, Kevin O'Compelder, Kevin O'Compkinson, Kevin O'Brien, Kevin O'Oversh-over, Kevin. Lottery night, Chris. It was lottery night, and, you know, I pulled up the official order because you always know when somebody gets skipped, that that means that there are teams that have moved up into the lottery. And the extremely rare, almost never, I don't know if it's ever happened, the double skip

tonight with two teams in a row moving up in the order. And of course, to add to more drama, that meant the Knicks slid down. they would have had or certainly had a chance at a higher pick, but by virtue of two teams behind them, moving up ahead of them, they get a worse pick than even if they didn't just get in the lottery, a worst pick than they would have expected. And so it's so odd because usually you have one team that has jumped up,

and now you've got this conversation going about what's going to happen with that one team and what pick are they going to be when they unveiled the top four. But when it was two teams in a row, it really got so jumbled so quickly that it was hard to process everything that was happening. And so, I mean, look, it's good for those teams that moved up. It was pretty bad luck for Leon Rose and the new brass at the New York Knicks. It was kind of weird for me. This is my first time, and I don't know how many years that I can remember, I didn't have the long. lottery live on TV as it was happening because I was doing the a live lottery show with

Bill Simmons Ryan Rusillo and Raja Bell and I don't have a TV in my bedroom where I was recording and so like I was confused on what was happening and then it was then we got it straight with with who moved up and for New York I'm sure for Knicks fans they don't love the fact that they're falling into the eight spot where they took Jordan Hill in 09 one pick behind Stefan Curry and where they took Frank DeVoskeena with the eighth pick just a couple years back. So for the Knicks, they haven't had great luck with any home runs in the eight spot. But I will say this.

With this year's draft class, I think the sweet spot is the mid-first, mid-lottery, mid-first. There's still good talent to be had. And the guys up top that now, Minnesota with the first pick, Golden State with the second pick, Charlotte, third, Chicago, fourth. those teams are obviously going to have the top choice, but those guys up top have a lot of question marks. So for the Knicks and the Pistons and the Wizards, obviously you'd want to jump up,

but there's still some solid prospects to be had in the middle of the first round. Well, and we've talked about this 100 times, Kevin. It's not necessarily the pick that you have. It's nailing that pick. So it's nailing it and drafting Donovan Mitchell. It's nailing it and drafting Paul, George. It's nailing it and drafting. Even if you go back to, you know, a year ago, getting Tyler Hero where Miami did. I mean, this guy is a big contributor for a very good

playoff team immediately. And so you can. Even PJ Washington. PJ Washington had a really good year for the Hornets. Yeah, you've just got to hit it, right? No matter what slot that you end up in. And so it was not great, though, for you had, for everybody that doesn't know what happened last night. New York moved down two spots from where they would have been projected. Detroit moved down two spots. Atlanta moved down two spots. Cleveland moved down the most. They moved down three spots. And then you have Chicago who went up three spots. Charlotte, who went up four spots. Five spots. Five spots. Yeah, for Charlotte. And then you have Golden State who went down a spot, considering they had the worst record.

And then Minnesota, who went up two spots. And how odd was that to watch it come down to the last two with DeAngelo Russell, no less, representing Minnesota. And it is the team that traded him away and the team that has him now as the two that are battling for this number one spot. And Minnesota ends up getting the number one spot in this track. And the team that also has their top three. protected first round pick next year.

Right. Because Golden State still has that pick at their disposal. And that pick could have more value than any of the first round picks this year if we're just being honest with how great next year's draft is. But congrats to Minnesota, Golden State, Charlotte, and Chicago for moving on up.

What a fascinating next couple of months. This is going to be for the draft, Chris. Minnesota up top, like with Cat and DeLo, Guard, and Big. When the last likely guys that you would draft up there are guards and bigs. There's going to be some positional overlap with their pick unless maybe they go with a surprise like Denia Avedia or maybe they trade down, which I'm super into. It's going to be really, really interesting to see what these teams do.

And by the way, Gerson Roses, their general manager, did say tonight, he wouldn't rule out trading out or down. So that's something to keep in mind for the coming months leading after draft night. Well, life is leverage. And they did. So you obviously want to keep all of that. as it should. Regarding the guys that, the guys that were talked about

as a possible number one pick, and they had lamello ball and they had Anthony Edwards on the broadcast. There are other names that could possibly get in that mix, most exclusively James Wiseman, for sure.

But look, all you need to know about this draft is, I don't know, I know you were doing the ringer show, so you weren't seeing the broadcast, but of course they do

what they usually do, which is they'll have Jay Billis, you know, swoop in, and then he'll tell you, you know, they've got his board up there, and he's going to tell you about the prospects, right? Why they don't let Mike Schmitz do this, I'll never know. Because Schmitz is great at this, and it's his life's the best out there.

It's just bananas to me. Like, this should be his night. Like, why is he not on there? Why am I listening to Jay Billis? But whatever, Jay Billis says, and I like Jay Billis. But, I mean, college basketball played like 20 games this year, too. He says, the only questions with Anthony Edwards are his efficiency, decision making,

shot selection, and if he'll be a good defender. And I'm like, what the only question? I'm like, Jay, I'm like, you just question

literally everything about the guy. Like, other than that, it's like certain like commercials for some medicine or whatever. It's like all these side effects

afterwards. It may cause this and that, blah, blah, blah. Here's all the things that need to be addressed with Anthony Edwards.

But, I mean, so look, if you're shooting off with those kind of things for the guy that we're talking about being number one, like, that just tells you what kind of year this is. We don't have a John Wall or Derek Rose on the guard side. We don't have an Anthony Davis or a Carl Anthony Towns or, you know, one of these guys on the other side. We don't even have a John Morant.

No. A guy who went second. We don't have a jaw for that matter. I mean, Jah last year, you look at him and you're like, yeah, maybe you have questions about a shot. Maybe you have questions about what is defensive upside can be, but you're like, there's no denying this guy is going to be a pick and roll playmaking threat.

There's never any question about that. How about this one? Hey, let's go a little bit further. It might not be a Barrett. Maybe not. Maybe not a Barrett, yeah. I mean, maybe not even a Barrett. If I throw Barrett in this draft,

even knowing what you know from his rookie year, would you take him number one? I feel like, even knowing like knowing the rookie year stuff, I would rather still just do everything I can to trade down. We've had three years in a row now where a top five pick has been traded down with, you know, we had Fultz for Tatum three years ago.

Two years ago we had the Luca, Trey Young deal. Last year we had DeAndre Hunter for multiple picks and players. To me, I look at this year's class and I'm looking at the way this shook out too. And if I'm Minnesota or I'm going state, I'm thinking, does Charlotte want to move up and get Wiseman here? Does Chicago or Cleveland want to target a player that they now have missed out on by falling down?

Do the Knicks want to try to move all the way up to 8 and make a splash with Lamello or something like that? To me, like the fact that some of those teams that clearly have a need, maybe there's something to be done there if you're Minnesota or your Golden State and try to trade down. To me, like, that's my number one preference. I don't know if there's a deal available that makes sense to do. I'm just speaking hypothetically. But to me, that's my first choice, is a trade down for a prospect that you still like. Because to your point, it is that type of draft where all these top guys have a lot of questions. But it's also the type of draft that there's a lot of players like from 8 to 40 where I'm like,

yeah, I wouldn't mind taking a shot on him and seeing what he can be as a role player for me. Or, oh, I'm going to take a risk on this guy at 25 and hope he turns into something. there's still a lot of those guys this year. It's just up top, those are also the same guys that may just have slightly higher ceilings. And you think about this, Kiv, those top two teams, they want to win now. If you're Minnesota, you've got to win now.

You got DeAngelo Russell in his prime. And this is now getting an Anthony Davis territory with Kat, you know, Devin Booker territory with Kat. Yeah, you paid him. But how long is a guy going to be happy? not being part of the postseason every year. And so this Rosas guy, you know, he's trying to throw together a team. You may just say, hey, look, the number one pick is probably going to be Anthony Edwards.

I'm fine paying Malik Beasley and restricted free agency and putting him next to DeAngelo Russell as my two guard. So let me find a partner out there that can get me a really good veteran because I could get maybe a hell of a player if I'm moving off this pick. and obviously you know that's the case with the second pick. Like they're not drafting somebody for the future. They want to use that asset. They want to use that asset. I think they want to use that asset. Maybe.

The timeline with what they've got in the luxury tax, the timeline is not long for Steph and Clay. I mean, this is, and Draymond, this is a win now proposition. So I'll start with Minnesota. With Minnesota, I look at it like this. You got three years, three years until Russell's deal is up. three years until Kat is entering his final year, the 2023-24 season. And those guys are friends.

They want to play together for now. You got three years until DeLo hasn't had a chance to leave. So for Minnesota, yes, the time is now. And for Golden State, it is also now, considering you have multiple Hall Famers who have won multiple championships on your team. But I will say this. I do think for Golden State there is some logic to keep in the pick or trading down and keeping whoever you draft like at seven or whatever

because you get that guy in a rookie deal and if you feel confident that that guy can be a contributor and help you win now and you get him on his rookie deal that gives you more flexibility moving forward and he could be that guy who in a couple of years maybe you're ready to move on from Draymond maybe you've moved on from Andrew Wiggins and his salary at some point maybe then you're more likely to be able to pay him

rather than trade out now with the pick and Wiggins they could go anyway I mean they could go any direction here, but I do think there's logic to them drafting a guy who does help now, but also could help later. And Avdia stands out to me as somebody like that, if his shot is for real. Devin Vassell, a wing

from Florida State. Isaac O'Coro from Arburn, if his shot is ready, there are guys in that area that makes some sense for them. I'm not so sure if the lamellos of the world or the Anthony Edwards of the world makes sense. James

Wiseman, that's an upside swing pick. Maybe that's what you do. Do you take a swing or do you go for a safe pick? To me, if I'm going to say, I want to swing for the fences, baby, swing. I think Wiseman's safe with them. Like, I think, like I talk, I talk to you about him and I talk to you about the fact that in this conversation is for months ago, that's a kind of place that would be perfect for that kid, you know, going into a situation where, you know, you go to Charlotte and they got the billboards, you know, all counting on you. Wiseman's the savior there.

He's a savior. But in Gold State, he's just another piece who you hope turns into something special. But he's not the savior. There's no expectation for that because you already got the savior and stuff. Right. And he can develop and he's not got a lot on his plate

and he'll get well coached. And he's playing next to somebody like Draymond too. Right? You know, like I just think, Wiseman, to me, the fit, just for the kid, because we always talk about, like, that's ideal, obviously. Any kid that gets to go there if they do keep the pick, even if they trade down a little bit.

But if they keep that pick, you know, we talk about guys going into situations and being able to achieve their, whatever their ceiling is or whatever their destiny is going to be, are they able to do that? And some guys, they just get drafted to the wrong place. And I think with the lack of pressure that you will have, you know, we always wondered for so many, you know, was it, was it the Spurs always nailed it with guys? Or did they just consistently find guys, you know, that were down in the 20s or whatever? And that there might have been a bunch of different guys that if you would have put them in that structure and you would put them with that coaching and you would put them with that culture would have been able to develop. Same with Miami, right? We're seeing that with Miami. They clearly, there are some of these franchises that are just very good at developing young talent.

And I do think, you know, the lack of pressure and you know, you might not even get a billboard. You won't even get a bobblehead. You know, like nobody even like nobody's like you're not even close to the star at Golden State. You're an afterthought. And I do think it's ideal for somebody to develop. And that's why I thought for Wiseman to be great. Listen, I mean, the truth is it's ideal for anybody. Yep.

Really, really anybody. Even like Anthony Edwards, you mentioned all those flaws that Jay Billis outlined. Yep. All of that is 100% the truth. If you're drafting Edwards, you're drafting him because you see a guy who looks like a defensive end, who is built so strong, ready to play from day one, who has shown great athleticism and speed, ability to create off the dribble. You're drafting him hoping that he,

he becomes a guy who consistently plays hard on defense. You're drafting him because you're hoping he becomes a guy who not just create space, but also can actually finish the play and hit a shot. You're drafting him hoping that he can improve his decision making. Like some guys do, he's only a teenager. As he gets older into his 20s, maybe Golden State can help there by putting him into like a simplified role.

Edwards, your goal is to play hard on defense, just grind every single possession, defend opposing scores at guard, wing. He has versatility. and hit spot-off threes, and occasionally attack closed us and do some stuff off the dribble. If you simplify a role for Anthony Edwards, that also could be good for him.

Less pressure on him, like we see with R.J. Barrett in New York, where he's in a less than ideal situation that's asking him to do too much, Anthony Edwards could grow slowly alongside winning players in a winning culture. So for Golden State, if I'm any prospects, I want to go there.

And if I'm an agent, I'm trying to steer my client to the Warriors for that reason, too. And you got to be honest, there are, there are questions on Edwards, but there are certainly videos you can go watch. And when you watch the video, you are left going, okay, I could absolutely see this guy being an NBA star. There's no question he has flashes of, wow, this guy could be very special. Like, he has very, he does some stuff, you know, that other guys just don't do. He's clearly a real, real talent. And so, you know,

crazier things of epic, Kevin, we might look back at just regret thinking that this draft at the top end isn't as good. And we look up in five years and Anthony Edwards is an all-star and Lamello's an all-star. And maybe it's possible. It's possible. I mean, I'm not sure it would be regret as much as like,

wow, these guys all really popped. Yeah. Because there is undeniable that Edwards has questions, Lamello has questions. Wiseman has questions. Even my first ranked prospect, Killian Hayes, even he has questions.

And I love him as a prospect. Yeah, yeah, yeah. In this draft, I wouldn't have him ranked one in many other years. But like Danny Avdia, a guy who was a high IQ player, who's a great defense player,

who always seems to be in the right position, who's a good cutter, plays hard. I mean, he checks so many boxes. But then you get to shooting and it's like, oh, wait a minute. He shot 30% from three with a 50% free throw percentage.

maybe I'm not as high on him as much as I wish I did. Everybody that's going to get drafted in the top six or seven has big question marks. Everybody does. Yeah, and you may be dead on in terms of where the best players might be found a little bit later. I mean, we've currently been watching a playoff series led by two guards that were not top five picks from mid-major schools. You know what I mean? And they're like maybe the most devastating back court in the entire NBA. So it's about nailing the pick more so that it is, right, what pick you have.

And we'll see what these teams do. But it was interesting the way the lottery played out to say the least. I mean, there is no franchise savior, at least on the surface. And so now it's just about finding the guy that is actually going to be a really good long-term NBA player. Absolutely. I mean, you mentioned Dame and CJ there. You could also say similar. Granted, they were top picks, but Hardin and Westbrook

both also came into the draft with question marks about how much can they actually run the point? How much can they run your offense? What are they really? Is he a combo guard? There's all those questions of the day. And they've turned it to something truly, truly special, MVP talents. And that's true for everywhere in the draft,

whether it's top 10 picks or whether it's late first or second rounders. it's to your original point when you were talking about the Nix. It's not always about where you land in the draft. It's just about nailing the pick. And that's like a very like in some ways a no-daw thing to say. But it is representative of the fact that for teams tonight that my fans tonight who might be feeling disappointed like again, again we fell down in the draft. I feel like this year don't.

I mean, it does suck. It does suck for sure. But like don't dismiss the fact that I think in many people, people around the league think that the sweet spot in this draft is the middle of the first round. To me, you know, from like eight to 25 is a good place to be for finding a good role player who maybe can tap into something more than you expect. But if you have six or whatever they were supposed to have, you got a lot better chance, you know, to be, there's only, there's only five guys off the board.

Yeah. If you have five, you can also trade down. Yeah, right. And get more assets. I mean, I'm not saying it's great. good that you didn't win the lottery. I'm just saying it's not necessarily the end of the world. Well, and I don't know if, like, look,

that's obviously not been the avenue for team building for their franchise. And you have, I think, going into tonight, it was 14 consecutive years for Sacramento, 10 for the Sons, and

seven for the Knicks. And then it was four for Charlotte. And then the longest playoff drought outside of Charlotte is three years. I was actually impressed by that. You know what I mean? Interesting. You only had four teams

that have been there at least four consecutive years. And some of them I mean, look, the Kings are one off of the consecutive non-playoff years, the record, which is the it's the Clippers that had that record for 15. They're going to get there.

Who are they kicking out of the playoffs next year? Colan State back in it Minnesota with a full year of cat and Delo Phoenix Memphis with Devin Booker and Aiton getting better Bridges getting better Memphis getting better Norland's getting better

I'm sorry but like if you're the kings I don't know when it's going to stop I don't know when it's going to stop you got to nail that 12th pick yes that's for sure so that was the lottery which took place tonight we've got

talk some games and what we have seen in these series so far. We'll do that right after these words. Today's episode of The Mismatch is brought to you by Buffalo Wild Wings. Playoff basketball is finally here. Catch all the postseason action with Buffalo Wild Wings. There's no fans in the crowd, but that doesn't mean the real fans aren't at home, cheering louder than ever from the edge of their seats. And they can still get that sports bar feeling with wings from B-dubs. Get boneless or traditional wings in over 24 of your favorite sauces and seasonings like Parmesan. garlic, honey barbecue, or mango habanero. And for a limited time, get a wing bundle with 15 traditional wings and 15 boneless wings plus fries for just 2999. That's enough wings for the whole

house. The playoffs are here and there's no better way to watch than with Buffalo Wild Wings. So order at Buffalo Wild Wings.com or through the Buffalo Wild Wings app today. At participating locations for unlimited time, bundles only for takeout or delivery through Buffalo Wild Wings app or website and not valid with any other offer. And now back to the mismatch. All right, Kevin, let's just hit these one by one in terms of the games that were on Thursday. So the first game that went off was the heat and the Pacers. We're not going to go mad in depth into all of these series,

but I will tell you, on the Heat and the Pacers, you know, sometimes you watch the teams and you think, man, I really wish I could see them as they're supposed to be. and the Pacers are very, very high on that list because if they've got some bonus in this thing, I think this is a war. I mean, these are already, it's not like it's been non-competitive. It's just the heat are better than them. And I don't know if they'll end up sweeping them. I mean, Indiana might win a game.

Maybe they'll win two games. I don't know. But I will say that losing an All-Star out of your lineup, And it's pretty clear after watching Ola Depot, he's not the Vic that we saw, you know, become an all-star, become a guy that was like one of the best guards in the Eastern Conference. There were those big questions as to whether he was even going to play in this. You know, then it came out that it was going to cost him $3 million if he didn't. So maybe there's a little extra incentive to play in this, even if he wasn't planning on doing it in the first. place. But anyways, when you've got an Ola Depot who is not that, like, he's not ready to be one of the

best players on the floor. And you have the loss of Sabonis. That's a tough ask when they're playing against Miami. And I will say, I think Miami's look good. I think they look good because even in the games where they have not hit threes and like game one, Hero and Robinson were not hitting those. They can win without that, but they've got that in their arsenal and they can really be devastating when they're cracking. Definitely. I mean, just on Indiana real quick, yeah, it's a bonus. It's just disappointing that we don't get to see that. I'm not so sure he'd swing the series here. I think Miami still can pick things up even more if they have to, because ultimately it comes down to Oladipo here. And if you're in a close game situation late in

the fourth quarter, you know, last minute, last two minutes. Oladipo's not the guy that you're leaning on right now quite as much as he was prior to the injury. And it's going to take time for him to maybe get back to the guy that he was pre-injury, because that's a major knee injury that he had. And it's unfortunate, but we're seeing for Indiana how they're at the crossroads right now because you don't know what Oladipo is going to be. Whereas for Miami, it feels like this is a team that's constantly ascending, getting better and better

and better. You get Iguidala and Jay Crowder mid-season additions who didn't really get a chance to get integrated into the team because of COVID. But now you're seeing the value with them being out there in fourth quarters of the defensive versatility that they provide. I mean, those guys play so freaking hard,

the both of them. And you look ahead to the Bucks series in the second round, they're going to be a tough out. I'm not picking Miami to win over Milwaukee in the second round, but they're going to be tough, man, with their ability to defend. How good is Dragich looked? You know, Drag it just kind of moved into this.

He ends up to have in 20 today. And, you know, there hasn't been a tremendous amount of reporting about this. You know, it's kind of like the heat culture and it just like stuff that happens just kind of goes away with them. But the Nunn thing is weird because Nunn's going to be on a lot of rookie of the year ballots and played an immense amount of minutes. And he left the bubble for personal reasons. And then he came back. and this dude has not only lost his spot, Kev, he's lost his spot in the rotation at all,

which is just crazy. You think about this was a good team. This was like a top five seed in the Eastern Conference throughout the year. This guy is going to be getting rookie of the year votes from a lot of people had a very good season. He's going to get that third spot or even second spot for people who left Zion off their ballots. Yeah, and had a really good season. And it's just like he wasn't on the team.

You know what? I wonder and like Spolster would never give an honest answer about this because Spoh gives the most cookie cutter answers to media than everybody in the league than any other coach, except for maybe Terry Stott's on Portland. I mean, very bland. They're on the all bland coach team. But Spow, a guy who preaches defense as much as he does, I would imagine that if he's,

trimming that rotation, none probably would have been part of it anyway, and that his absence probably made that choice a whole lot easier because none, despite how great he was on offense from Miami this year, didn't play a lot of defense on a team that a lot of guys did play defense at a high level individually. And none did not. And so if you're talking about playoff rotations and you need to stop dribble penetration at the point of attack, none probably doesn't have much of a role there with the other guys that you have with Crowder and Igwadala and even for that matter Robinson and Hero at the wing position or guard position play better defense than none does so at a nine-man rotation i'm not sure where the

slots are for none to get even back into it well look he you just got to wonder now i have not seen if so forgive me if there's been reporting on this i haven't seen it because i kept i went to go try to look it up. And everything I found, it just kept saying personal reasons. And which is just, it's odd, right? When Zion left, there was a family thing. And when Mike Conley left, it was for the birth of his child. And when Lou Williams even left, though he did get in trouble while he was gone, he left because there was a death of somebody very close to him. And he wanted to be able to attend a funeral. With none, like, there wasn't ever, I could never find like a reason given. And you wonder if his absence was frowned upon within their organization.

I don't know. Because it stands to reason that a guy that was starting virtually all friggin year, who is not playing at all. I get what you're saying about the defense. He also started the guy the whole year. He's going to be in the rookie of the year, top three for God's sakes. And now he's just like he's not on the team. He did start him all year,

but sometimes you fall into something and there's no reason to ever fall out of it. But in the back of your mind, sometimes you can know this needs a change for us to reach the heights that we need to. And that defense ranked 14th this season, despite having two guys who arguably both should have been all defensive team players, Jimmy Butler and Bam out of bio, and a team that just added Jay Crowder and E. Andre Aguadala. I feel like if you're Spoh, you're looking at it like maybe the offense that we lose from him can be made up from Goran Drogich with a bigger role, can be made up from from Bam doing a bit more on nights that we need to, can be made up from

from Jimmy Butler turning on playoff mode when he is handling the ball more at the end of games. Who knows what it was exactly? I haven't heard anything definitive either. My conversations or reading stuff online. But I have a hard time imagining that he's going to change from that nine-man rotation that he has now, unless it's like removing Olinic or Derek Jones from the rotation and then plugging in none to take their spot in the event of a different type of series. you're not facing as many bigs.

Well, I'll tell you this. Look, I don't think they'll just, I don't think they'll just give them a series. I think as we move on to the next game, the heat, like, they have a chance to, like a real chance to beat this bubble bucks,

if that's what we're calling them. Now, they got a little bit more on track today, but let me tell you something, Kevin. This Chris Middleton thing, that ain't flying. You know, if you're playing against Miami. Like, Janus has got to have somebody rolling with him.

And I know the guy had a really good season. But my God, these first two games, what the hell is going on? Like, have you ever seen a guy have this precipitous of all? I mean, this is, he just fell off. He's like a 50, 40, 90 guy. These are outstanding player throughout the season. He makes another All-Star team. He obviously made a four.

They paid him a fortune. In the off season, this guy comes out and has two. Like, this is like must win stuff, right? Where you've got to really respond as a team. And Janus comes back and, of course, is awesome today. But the Middleton stuff is just, what in the hell? How is, he's gone from being this guy who had one of the great offensive season. in the NBA to a guy who in the first game,

he can't score to save his life. And then he turns around, place 30 minutes, one of eight, two points, four turnovers. Like, what? Like, this is the benefit of being Chris Middleton, the All-Star that is constantly underrated that nobody talks about. Because if you are of any caliber, you know, star-wise,

people just destroy you for this. kind of stuff. But what on earth? What is happening here? It's weird, but I'm not overly worried about it. I mean, it's not like he shot 10% in the seven games that he played in the seating games. He shot over 40% from three. This might just be a two-game aberration where he's just struggling. He's had moments like this in past playoff series as well, I believe, against Boston. He had a couple crappy games and then he just turned it on and he couldn't miss at all. Middleton's had stretches in his career before where he can't miss. So I'm not overly worried, but it's definitely worth monitoring because you could also say similar things about Eric Bletsso

with some of the poor decisions made in game one by him. Yonis does need that second guy to elevate their play to an even higher level for them to get through what is going to be really challenging for them moving forward. Miami can match up nicely against the Bucks with Spolstra and that team, a lot of the veterans on that roster, you can't rule out an upset. You just can't. It's two, though, Kevin. It's not like he had eight or it's not like he had a shitty game like Paul George did last night. It's two points on one for eight.

I mean, like, this is extreme stuff. Like, you never see all-star caliber players play 30 minutes and have two points. Like, that just doesn't happen. Much less against the magic. They're playing the eighth seed. It's not like they're in the, you know, they're not playing Boston. They're playing Orlando.

It looks rough. All I'm saying is I'm not reading too much into it. He's had these types of stretches before. Okay, well, then I don't want to talk about Chris Middleton anymore. I don't want to talk about him because if he does this kind of stuff before, then that's who he is. And I don't want to talk about him anymore. You'd rather talk about Brooke Lopez.

I don't want to hear about how awesome he is. Oh, my God. Is Vucci Maine going to average 50 this series or what? Vucci Maine. Vucci Maine is letting out all of his aggression after Mark Gassau shut his ass down and made him unplayable last year. Now he's taking it all out this year on the Bucks.

It is the one thing, though, that, hey, that does guide our thinking a little bit in the Miami series. With Vucci Mane, they've spread them out a lot. Orlando has spread that Bucs team out a lot, and Miami can do that. You know, they'll throw a bunch of shooters when they play Dragich,

and they play Robinson and they play Hero and they play Butler and obviously Bam can kind of play anywhere on the court, they'll be able to stretch them out. And that seems to be they don't have the guns to necessarily pull it off every night. But they created themselves a lot of space and stretched out that buck's defense. And I do think that's instructive in looking forward to a better team that has a big that's also mobile like that that could stretch them out too. I will say this. I feel like Kendrick Nunn could have more of a role in that series and he does in this one against Indiana because of the fact

Milwaukee plays so much more drop coverage with Brooke Lopez, none is a guy who can maybe make them pay a little bit with some off the dribble 3s. All right. So that's just, I mean, we're talking way ahead here with Miami, Milwaukee, when these series are still ongoing. But I feel like it's kind of hard to not look ahead, considering how likely it is. Should I concede the thumb?

under. Yeah, you should. I should. I should just give them. They can't score. Houston's defense is so good. That's 17-0 run is just unbelievable. I mean, it's devastating when they are knocking down.

And this was not a good Hardin game. And they don't have Westbrook. It's the damnedest thing. I'm watching them. And even down the stretch of that game, you know, they spread you out five wide, right? And there was one time they come down. I mean, Hardin just throws it over to the corner.

to PJ Tucker. Stephen Adams is eight feet away from him. And I'm like, what the hell are you guys even doing? Like, why are you so disconnected from the shooters? What do they have to do? They've shot 55 frigging threes. Like, why are you not standing out there with them? I get that it makes it harder.

And I get that you want to be able to help on defense. But, like, somebody, and it ain't Billy Donovan, has got to be able to come up with a defense. scheme that can deal with this because watching them deal with it today, I mean, when you're deep into the fourth quarter and you still, you know, obviously have very little idea how you want to try to attack this defensively, then you're dead. Like, I really wonder, like, are they even, are they going to make the necessary adjustments? I mean, they were so disconnected from shooters still. It's like, this is what they do. This is how they play.

play. And why are you, why are you six feet away from them? I just don't get it. Because they will shoot that shit. They shoot it 55 times. Houston beating Oklahoma City today feels like a defining win to me just because of the way they want it. You know, Harden going two for 11 from three, five of 16 from the floor. Eric Gordon going 0 for 10 from three, six of 20 from the floor. Houston could not score efficiently tonight, and yet it was their defense that won them that game. Harden not getting a bucket with him off the floor at one point, late third, early fourth. The defense just turned it up as part of that run. Every guy in that roster, Hardin included, was just playing so hard on defense with their swarming style, real aggressive, perfect rotations.

Talk about a connected defense that hustles, man. And while that, that was happening with Hardin off the floor and Russ still out. Hardin and Russ were the two biggest cheerleaders on the sidelines, rooting for what was happening. This looks like a team that is playing together and understands who they are and what they have to do together to win. And that win today, to me, was a true team victory. We see Houston wins so often with Hardin, or in recent years with Hardin and Paul,

or this year Hardin and Westbrook. But this was an all-around team victory. that says a lot about what this team is right now and what it can be in potential future series, maybe against the Lakers. Well, and I'll tell you, Kevin, if you would have told me James Harden goes 5 for 16, two of 11 from three, and Eric Gordon goes 6 of 20, 0 for 10, I would have told you that they got smashed to your point. Yeah.

Like the fact that they won that game, and they won the game going away, they won the game by double digits. They won the game by double digits with those two things. Now, I remember De Antony actually saying this, talking about this earlier in the bubble, and he was talking about being in the same gym, having the same depth perception, you know, you're not traveling to different gyms every night, that it's actually good for shooters, he thought, you know, that it does benefit shooters. We've got to admit, okay, so there was some real regression tonight with the Hardin numbers

and the Gordon numbers, but like there's not with these other guys. And you do wonder, like, come on, man. I mean, PJ Tucker's four or four from three. Jeff Green's three for six. Robert Covington's two for five. Austin Rivers is three for six. I mean, the percentage that these guys are, they were in the third quarter of game one,

and they said their bench was shooting 80%. 80% at that time with McLemore and Green and the rest. And it's like they have really shot out of their minds. And you wonder, is that sustainable? But that is their randomness. If you shoot it 55 times from three, the nights that you make a bunch of them and shoot a good percentage,

you're going to win going away. And the nights that you miss, you're just going to lose. Like, I mean, it is. And so can you do it four times? Well, they've done it twice. You don't mean they've done it twice already. Like what you're talking about shows the importance of how

team personnel and system interact. and we're seeing guys on this team who previously were cast aside. Jeff Green was waived this year. Ben McLemore has been let go several times. Daniel House was an undrafted player. Robert Covington was a late pick, has gone through multiple teams. PJ Tucker played five years overseas before coming a player. So many of these guys on that team have fallen into a system that just highlights their strengths

and really empowers them to do what they do best. and that's play hard on defense and shoot threes. It's a simple game. But I think that makes their lives a bit easier, too. I actually had a discussion with my friend about this the other day because, look, I've covered and watched many games played by both Ben McElmore and Jeff Green. And watching them in this Houston system and watching them playing is beyond perplexing. I watch these guys play a lot.

Okay, these guys were awful, awful. Yeah. Okay. And here's what I. think. I think both of those guys have an interesting caveat to them that if you ever talk to other players and you see other players tweeting and whatever, all those are- Jeff Green today. A lot of guys tweeted about Jeff Green. No, no. Well, Jeff Green is the biggest sweetheart in the world. I cannot stand watching him play basketball, but he's a sweetheart. He's a great

guy. All right. I tell you this, the other one is McLemore. So all these guys in the NBA they all think Jeff Green's really good, and they all think Ben McLemore's really good. And I think part of it is, guess what? A lot of them, they all play in the summers, and they play, and these guys are really good, right? Houston is more like playing in the summer and flying up and playing pickup than anything we have in the NBA. And so I was telling my buddy, I was like, maybe that's just it, that if you put them in a real offense, I don't want to take away from what they do. But it's not like the same, it's not structured where a coach is telling you, be there, be there, mad if you don't know the plays. Because Ben would constantly not know where to be on offense and defense.

But if you can just play, you're just running up and down. Nobody gives a shit what shots you take. Like nobody's yelling at you if you take a bad shot, right? And you're just flying up and down the court and playing. I was like, maybe that's why all these guys think these guys are good. because when they play against them, they are good because they're just flying up and down. And that's really how Houston plays.

I mean, shit, they play like my son plays on 2K, where I'm like, will you throw it down to the post? Like once and just get a buck, he just fucking fire it off threes, right? Every time trying to get the little green thing to show up. But that's my theory. My theory is that it is that they would go back to looking how those guys have looked if they were to had to play in some kind of a system or if they played

in some kind of structure. But the fact that it is so unstructured and just fly up and down, it really does accentuate what they are good at and makes me realize why other players think those guys are good, even though I watch them and think they're not. It's unstructured in some ways, but it's also so structured in other ways that it's, it's, it makes it easy for them to just know what they're going to do, whether it's just flying up the court, as you're saying, or whether it's just standing the corner and shoot spot-up threes. And don't worry about, like, looking for the next pass, just shoot. Like, every player on that team is empowered to shoot the ball.

There's no thought of, like, what am I supposed to do? It is, it is shoot or attack the basket. And if it's not a layup, then kick out. It is such a simple game for a lot of guys that it makes their life easier. It's very reminiscent to me of watching, like, in college football, Mike Leach is one of my favorite coaches, and you would watch his teams, and they were throwing it 70 times before everybody else was. And they had, like, five plays, right?

They ran like five plays. Obviously, it changed. It changed college football. Like, all the spread stuff changed the way football was played, even up to the NFL level in some ways. And I do think that it's like, okay, who's going to, Who's going to stymie this? Because Oklahoma City, like, they're not punishing them for playing small at all.

They're not punishing them at all. And Houston is burying these threes. And so when they do, they're devastating. And when they don't, that's when everybody says, you know, geez, you can't win doing this and whatever else. The same way it goes in football with the spread, right? Like as soon as somebody gets beat with the spread and start having a lot of three and out, and putting their defense on the field a hundred times,

then everybody's like, see, can't win like that, you know, at the biggest level. And that's really what this reminds me of. But when it's clicking, it's devastating.

There's no way around it. For sure. And ultimately, they are built in many ways to make this potential next series against the Lakers a very difficult one for L.A. With the way Houston does play and with the way they defend, with the versatility that they have. because you mentioned their lack of size thus far.

The small ball experiment to me is working in the sense that there's been very few times that I'm looking at Covington or Tucker or even Jeff Green and I'm like, oh, they got beat because they're smaller. They play bigger than they are, especially Tucker and Covington do, with the way they protect the rim, with the way they aggressively box out and attack the glass. I mean, these guys might be listed at 6, 6, 6, 7, 6, 5 for Tucker, but they don't play like that.

And I do look forward to that potential Lakers series and seeing these really contrasting styles. Houston is contrasting to everybody because they're unique to themselves. But Houston's a threat. They are a threat. All right. I'm not going to give up completely yet. I can't believe Chris Paul would go out like this. Just getting stomped on.

And so I don't think it's over yet. I don't think it's over yet. But I'm close. By Tuesday, I'll probably concede. Lakers Blazers, look, I want to throw this at you and I want to see what you think. Did you see the second spectrum thing about the Lakers in game one? Second Spectrum does this thing on, like they've shot luck for people that don't know the analytics of all of this, where they put it together, the shots that you take within the game, who takes those shots,

and there's an expected value of those shots. And teams keep track of this all across the league now, right? When was this posted? I want to make sure I have it on the screen. Yeah, second spectrum. Read it. Read it off. All right.

So this is the tweet you're talking about. The Lakers 34 of 97 field goal percentage performance in game one against the Blazers had the worst, quote, shooting luck for a team of any game since the 2013-14 season, regular season or playoffs scoring 46 fewer points than expected. And what they describe as shooting luck, shooting luck is measured as the difference between the points the team actually scored in the points we'd expected to score given the quality of shots, number of free throws,

and the players who took those shots. And the metric that I believe you might be referring to when they are is the quality shot metric that they have, you know, that teams use, as you said. And that did balance back for sure tonight. Lakers shot what, 12% in game one? 46 points, though, Kevin. 46.

I read that and was like, okay, all of this. Like, if you want to, like, if you got to take a step back, whether you buy that or not, it to me signaled that all of the analysis that's being done of this, what's wrong with the Lakers? Why aren't they doing this? Why aren't they doing that? LeBron looks miserable, all this kind of stuff. And in the end, just the raw numbers told you that here's the shots they got.

Here's what they would usually or what they would be expected to do if they got those same shots. And the difference is 46 points. To me, that tells me this wasn't like Portland playing some kind of great defense that really stymied them. This is, they made nothing. And then they turned around and beat the crap out of them tonight. Yeah. And it wasn't also like the 180th of all the games that have been played, right? No. You know, shooting luck game. It was the worst. The worst of all games and regular season.

Seven years. Seven years. It's unbelievable. Unbelievable. And the Lakers, I do think, you know, yeah, it was a lot of awful shooting luck for them in game one. But also, I did like the adjustment that they made tonight, having LeBron James more on the low post, creating some passing lanes for him. creating some easy opportunities for his teammates, AD creating from the perimeter, getting towards the rim. I like what the Lakers came out and did tonight, and, you know, they defended extremely well again. Their offense was not great in game one, but their defense was holding Portland to what they did. The defense was even better tonight in game two. And so the Lakers, they had some issues on offense during the scrimmages and the seating

games and in game one. But against this Blazers defense, which is horrible, they have an opportunity to get themselves right before what's going to be a really challenging series against a great defense in Houston next round. Slow down on the great defense. Let's slow down. Houston's defense is really good, Chris. It's really good. Let's slow down. Let's slow down.

It's really good. Slow down. It's really good. Slow down. Great. Come on. Great defense. What's wrong with saying great about a team that was top 10?

Luke Winsdort. Like, let's get, let's slow down. 15th in defense this season. They're great right now. Okay. They're great right now. All right, look, the Laker game was not very entertaining in terms of competition, but George Carl out of nowhere was.

Oh, geez. I'm so happy you brought this up. George Carl tonight happens to be watching the game like us and tweets out, I heard Mark Jackson, who he tagged in the tweet. I heard Mark Jackson. is taking shots at my defensive coaching during tonight's broadcast. Remind me, how many All-Star teams did you coach, Mark? How many defensive players of the year?

How many finals appearances? How many of my teams became dynasties right after I left? And, oh my God. I mean, George Carl, just sitting around, binding his own business tonight, watching the game, gets crapped on by Mark Jackson, and just, I mean, that is flame broiled, Kev. I mean, that's just like, I mean, he just, he let it all out.

That last line, how many teams became dynasties after I left? That was great. Oh, no. Don't do it, George, Carl. Go on NBA desktop, George. I mean, don't do it, George. What did Mark Jaston say? I didn't hear the comments.

No, I guess he was, I guess he was goofing about George Carl and defense. I don't know. I didn't catch it. I had the game on mute. You'll never believe that. I had the game on mute, so I didn't hear what the guy was saying at all.

But I did see George Carl's response. I promise you that. That was unbelievable. Just unbelievable. George Carl out of nowhere. We didn't even know he was watching the game. He's a filmmaker. Everybody was just might as.

But you know what? I love the idea that George Carl was sitting around watching that game. He's like, oh, F this. And he just unloads. He just unloads on Mark Jackson on Twitter. Also, after that came up, I did look up George Carl and Mark Jackson on Google. And this was before, like, everything was like being tweeted about or rather being written about it and all that. And this popped up from July 26th headline, George Carl continues to apply.

Andre Iguidala was Mark Jackson's mole in 2013 Warriors Nuggets Playoff Series. Oh. And his long-in-rubura that Iguedala tipped off Jackson to Denver trying to hurt Steph Curry. And in an interview with Tim Kawakami's podcast, The TK Show, this was the exchange, and this is from CBS Sports who read a boat about it. Did you have any issue with Igwadala being close to the Warriors? And then he ends up signing with the Warriors. Is that an issue in your mind at all?

Quote from Carl. Yeah. I don't know what the real story is. but there were things that we saw in film. There was something with Mark Jackson and him that was fishy. He had a bad order to it. It was negative energy. The team gradually figured it out that Iggy was kind of favoring

and goal in Stakes Jackson. His comments were a little bit irregular, but he would all played well in that series. He played very well for us. Very odd. So in July, just about a month ago, there was some stuff between them. So this was brewing.

I didn't know anything about that back in July. So he was kind of sneak-dissing. He was kind of sneaked-ish. sneak this in and then George Carl. I mean, how old is George Carl? Seriously. Pretty impressive that he'd be sitting around

pissed off tweeting. 69. 69, yeah. Like, I'd just think about the idea of my father doing that is just so outward. It's outrageous. It's outrageous to me.

My dad's a little bit older than that, but still, like, he ain't the kind of guy. Like, I can't imagine. I guess George Carl whipped out his phone and fired that off. I don't know, but it's hilarious. All right, let's touch on some of these other series. I think I've been most impressed with the Raptors of anything.

Like overall, steady, consistently really good. I never sense that there's like some discussion of what's wrong with the Raptors, right? Like there is nothing wrong with the Raptors. Like they're consistent, like I get a consistently really good product, really good effort. out of them all the time. And they're up to, the Nets, I'll say, for a team that's going to probably get swept

in this thing, they're, they at least put up a real fight in game two. And they're playing for Jacques Vaughn. And this is a, this is just a thrown together team without, you know, any semblance of what their real roster is. And they put up a real fight and at least pushed

the Raptors and made them win that game the other day. even though that is clearly not the range that they want to be playing in. They don't want to be playing in a 104-99 game, but they were right there. They were. And Lavert, God. We talked about him last week. I mean, I love him.

I really do. Like, if he's the third best player on that team, they are going to be really, really good. He's five for 22 in that game. But I just feel like he's there for it. I feel like he's, it's almost like I'm impressed that he's taking 22. shots, you know, because he, it's almost like he, he functions as, like, the star. You know what I mean?

Like, he plays like he's the star of that team. And stars don't always have their, you know, make a bunch of their shot. But he clearly's the dude and he's playing like he's the guy, not like one of the guys. He does have Luau by his side who has been very good for Brooklyn. I love Luau and the draft had him ranked way too high, like eighth or ninth on my board. but this week, really this whole past month they're in the seating games too. He's been really good for Brooklyn.

I texted a couple different executives this week from different teams. I'm like, hey, do you think Luau was for real? And they said, no. Is this a rotation player? And everybody said, yeah. Oh, okay. He's not going to put up these points, but everybody agreed,

like this is some real rotation player caliber stuff from him that we're seeing from Brooklyn against the Raptors. So I agree there with their opinion. I'm liking what I'm seeing from him. And with Lavert, since you brought him up, it's going to be really interesting just to see the way he fits with Katie and Kyrie next year. But I think it can work between them.

But depending on what Brooklyn wants to do, I am curious to see if he has more value elsewhere with bringing somebody else in who isn't at their best with the ball in their hands. But there's value there too. I mean, Steph Curry played with Andre Godala and Sean Livingston guys who helped him really flourish off ball. How much are Katie and Kyrie guys? to be willing to not dominate the ball, that remains to be seen. But for Brooklyn, the fact is, is when you have a guy like Lavert, you have options with the way you want to build around

your two real stars. Yep. Let's move on to... One thing, one other thing, before we do move on, also just shout out to Maasai Ujiri as well this week, releasing the camera footage of the encounter that he had with a police officer at last year's finals, and him filing a counter suit following that. And anybody who saw this video this week and saw the reaction to that and the amount of support out there for him, after that crap he went through last year,

clearly not being the instigator, it's really encouraging to see the amount of support out there for him. And shout out to Maasai dealing with this crap that he has to deal. And that guy, he should never be security for anything ever. He should not be part of any department.

I mean, this guy is a, come on. The fact that the story came out, He couldn't work because of it and whatever. And you saw the way that thing played out. It's like, how is this guy in any authority position at all? And he had the support of everybody behind it. It's unbelievable. When his story was complete BS.

And just think about all the times around the world that cops or anybody without body cameras. That's right. Without this video evidence with cameras in the arena, with the body camera, when stuff like this happens and they deny it, they don't write it in the the report and nothing ever happens because you never see it. And it's a he said, she said. Yep. And we saw how much of a blatant lie that it was. I mean, it was just a straight up lie through and through.

And just good on Messiah and good on him to come out here and do this and fight this because he's going to win it easily. And it just sucks that there's so many people around the world deal with this. And that's why a lot of people up this year protesting for equality in every way. Just another example. Yep. Jazz Nuggets. So we've had a lot of the zigzag stuff.

This has been a common theme in NBA playoffs, especially in gambling parlance for many, many years, right? That the team that wins, it doesn't have to make a ton of adjustments. And the team that loses typically says, okay, well, we're not losing like that again. And so then they make their big adjustments. And now they can win the next game or certainly, play it a lot closer if they

lost and and now the chess match really begins but it happens very commonly where the second game is a lot closer in some circumstances or the other team wins and you saw Royce O'Neill get thrown on

to Jamal Murray and turn him from star Jamal Murray to just a dude Jamal Murray and you're throwing up a hundred and 24 is what surprised me. I mean, you know, with the,

with, and I know they were shooting fireballs, but they don't have a ton of offensive firepower, especially with Conley not on that team in that game two. And so I am mega fascinated at what game three looks like after what we just saw because Utah look, Kev could very easily be up to O in this thing. You know, that first game went to overtime, and that was a pretty convincing win in game two.

Now, I'm not saying that Denver's dead by any means, but for them to come back the way they did in game two and throw up 124 and really wreck Murray, I mean, cheese, Utah, they impressed me. They did. They really impressed me in that game. For sure. And, you know, Quinn Seiner made the adjustment of putting Royce O'Souye. Neil on Jamal Murray rather than Joe Ingalls and Murray had a not a great game. It's like we talked about on Tuesday show. That's the big thing Tim Conley, the general manager of the Denver Nuggets has always preached to him. You got to bring consistency. It can't be 35 one night, 12 the next night.

And he had 14 points on 6 of 13 shooting. He's got to be better than that. It's just got to be better. But more than anything else, though, Denver's defense needs to be better. Yokic needs to be better. Michael Porter needs to be better. Jamal Murray needs to be better. Otherwise, even if they get past Utah, there's no way in hell that they're getting through the next round. It's just not going to happen playing defense like this. Yeah. And do you, that series is going to go long. There's no way around it.

I mean, do they get four really good Murray games? You do feel like Murray's got to be, he's got to be, you know, an outstanding perimeter player for them. You know, that's putting a lot on Porter to expect him to be the guy. So, I mean, Murray's got to be the guy that is. delivering on a regular basis. And as you said, that's always been a conversation with consistency with him. You were indignant about the Sixers, and they're disgusting, despicable, unacceptable, unacceptable, pathetic, abhorrent, P.U.

Good grief. All right. They laid down. After they started getting their ass kicked, then they really got their ass kick against the Celtics in game two. And like, I don't even know what level of analyses we can even give

for the Celtics of the Sixers because that got so messy and they looked like they didn't care. They got who you know, I talked about Jimmy Butler not being there and who's the dog. Who's the guy that's like, this ain't

happening to us. I'm going to follow me, you know? or jumps in somebody's face. And you looked at that bench and you looked at that on that floor when they were getting their ass kicked. And it's just a bunch of guys. It was just indifference.

You know what I mean? Like that's what it felt like. It felt like this indifference. Like who is pissed about this? You are getting run out. And this is the playoffs. And why does everybody look so indifferent to what's taking place here?

After that game, I recorded that very, rant about them because I was just sickened by watching it. But before recording, I said to myself, what did you expect from them without Ben Simmons? You know, you knew they were going to lose. You knew they were going to be able to stop Tatum. It's the length. And I said to myself, I expected better than this.

Yes. Despite, you know, not having Ben, despite not having an all defensive team candidate, despite not having your number one playmaker, your athletic, six foot 10 guy who just is your transition offense. Despite that, I wanted more than this from the Sixers. I mean, are you kidding me? They come out with this in the first two games. It's an embarrassing, man.

I feel so bad for Sixers fans. Ew, it sucks. And here's the thing, Kev. He's a likable guy, this Joe L. Embeded. But, bro, you got to stop with the I've got to do more. Bro, do more. Just do more. How about that?

Just do more. Go at freaking 35 and 20. It's like dominate everybody. Like, I swear to God, every time this stuff happens, it happened last year, it's happening again this year. It's like the quote I see after the game is, you know, we've all got to do more, but especially me, I've got to do more. Like, just do more.

Stop talking about how, like, I swear. Has anybody ever said they need to do more more than Joel Embed? Like, just do more than. Shut up talking about how many times do you get to say that before everybody just says, stop telling us you need to, like, you said that last game that you needed to do more. And now you got your ass kicked again. And it's like, you need to do more. Like, just go do.

There's nobody. Everybody else on your team sucks. I go do it. Like, look around. Al Horford's got four points. This Josh Richardson, who everybody was, he was everybody's love. I mean, this guy is whatever. He's a guy.

Tobias Harris getting paid $180 million. and he needs to show up with a ski mask to collect his check. They got no players. They don't have anybody. And it's like here's this awesome, transcendent player and I stick

a microphone in front of his face and he's like, I need to do more. Like, thanks. Thanks, Joel. Appreciate that. It really is unbelievable. He's a very likable guy, but that kind of stuff, I can accept

Like I told you with the Lavert thing, the kid's five for 22. Bro, he unloaded the clip. Like, it wasn't enough. And he's up against it. But he unloaded the clip. And he can rest his head. And he's not going to go to bed saying, geez, I wish I would have given it more.

But like, how many times does Joel and B. He wishes he would have played harder than he did? It's unbelievable. I'm with you in a lot of ways. I feel like there's more that he can do, despite the fact they don't have a ball handler who can clearly get him the ball in the post. They don't have a great shot creator to really turn him into something in the pick and roll. They don't have great shooters to space the floor for him.

But those are real problems that do make it harder on him. So I agree, but also like those are real things that do limit what he can be or should be in an environment that is the ideal for him. The Sixers just don't have that roster, which is why, to your point, you do have the ambixtor, concern. You also have the concern with Harris and Horford and the rest of that roster. You do have the concern with the head coach. You do have the concern with the front office and with ownership. I mean, from top to bottom with this team, there's no one thing that you can point at and say, oh, if we change that, everything will be better. Oh, that's all fixed. It's so many different things with this team. And it just, it sucks, man. 34 points is a good number. 10 rebounds

is a low, but I get it. You're taking the ball out of the net every time. One block shot is ridiculous. Come on. You're the anchor. This guy has got real defensive talent. And this team is putting up 128 on you in any kind of way they want to put 128 on you. So let's talk about that. This isn't all just the six are sucking hair. This is also the Celtics finding themselves. Oh, yeah. We talked about this a couple weeks back. You know, we talked about it after their first game when Tatum had five points and stunk against the books. We talked about it a couple other times when Kemba was just working his way back, ahead of that Grizzlies matchup.

This is a team that seems to be really starting to click now, even though Hayward is now out for some time with his ankle sprain, grade three ankle sprain could keep him out a month possibly, maybe longer because his wife is due sometime in September. So he could have that after he recovers from the ankle injury. This is a team that's going to be without him. But despite that, they have so. many guys who can beat you. Tatum has become a guy who right now is playing like a top 10 player.

There's just no other way to state it. With the way he defends how great he is offball, with the way he can create off the dribble for himself. Dude, did you see that step back jumper that he had, sidestep to his right from three? That's unstoppable. It almost looks like he doesn't, he's not even sweating either.

It's just all so smooth. Like everything about it is smooth. The offensive repertoire is crows. crazy. And I'm not so sure there was part of me when I'm watching that. And I get it. The kid, you know, I don't want him shooting a bunch of shots. But in some ways, I do like smart in that mix. You know, I think they're, they're not necessarily better, but there are benefits to having smart in that starting lineup instead of Hayward, right? That it's not to me, it is a different kind of good. because he, you know, Hayward is a guy that is certainly more offensively talented than Marcus

smart. But he is not defensively that talented. And he is certainly not that heart and soul kind of, I'm here for the fight kind of guy. And I do think that, you know, the other guys feed off of that. I saw it last night with Beverly being out. I don't know if you saw that deal. But, you know, it's what I always try to explain about having these. kind of guys on your team. They said the record without Beverly for the Clippers is 11 and 11. And their record with him was like 30.

I've got it written down. What was the number? It was like 39 and 13 with Beverly. Wow. 11 and 11 without him. And you can just say like, oh yeah, right. Pat Beverly does. But it's you know, if you don't have

that it's the kind of guy that actually the Sixers need, right? that heart and soul, that kind of he's laying it all out on the line and it just transcends to the other players. I feel like Smart does that because these aren't dogmatic kind of guys necessarily. But yet when he's on the court, it can feel like a rough team sometimes. Sure. And with Marcus Smart, I've put it like this way for years with him. I don't know if it'll happen in Boston or if it'll happen with somebody else.

but he's going to have a moment in his career that's one of those plays that is always on highlight reels when you look at the NBA finals and the NBA playoffs. He just has a knack for the moment. He is somebody who has a never give up attitude who is constantly hustling on the defensive end of the court, always trying to make the right play to help his team. He usually does on defense.

He's contagious, and it does spill over to the rest of that team in many, many ways, Not to mention that he's just a likable guy too off the court, somebody that people enjoy being around. He's a good teammate, a good friend to his teammates. So this is a team that has that X factor that you're talking about with the talent, with the point guard and Kemba Walker,

who looks like Kemba, with versatility at the center position with Daniel Tice or size with N.S. Cantor or athleticism with Rob Williams. They have versatility on their roster to play different ways, depending on what the game needs. Well, we talked about this, Kev, before this even started, when we get the Bucks Heat and Raptor Celtics, oh my God. Hell yeah. I mean, that is high level stuff.

That is high level stuff. Hell yeah. Last one we got to talk about. Isaac Lee is back with us. It's like this girlfriend that, like, shows up every once in a while. You know, she comes back, teases us, and then she ditches us again. But he's here this week. Right after a Clippers lost, hey, right after a Clippers lost.

no less. Perfect timing. And after a Lakers win tonight. Yeah. A scale of 1 to 10, Clipper Isaac, your level of concern. By a level of concern from 1 to 10, I would put this at an even five right now.

Oh, five. Yeah, look, I'm not going to overreact to one loss. I would also like to say that there are worse players who could be going off against my favorite team, Luca and Boban,

being good against the Gilprits. Like, from a self-centered and egotistical standpoint is really great for me. But, yeah, LaLuca. Yeah, Halaluka. Like, Dallas is a great team. Historically great offense. Everyone has said, you know, everything there is to be said about this team. So, like, like, I kind of think this is sort of to be expected to happen for them to drop on.

Obviously, the ejection in game one was BS. And, you know, that game could have played out differently. But I still believe in the talent. I still believe in the talent. depth. I still believe in the versatility of the Clippers. I don't know if Pat Bev is going to play in game three. I believe the status right now is doubtful. Did you know that stat that I mentioned?

I did. I did. Yeah. That does not surprise you. That is a statistic that has been tracked by Clippers beatwriters for the last two years, actually. Oh, wow. When he's out, they don't play well. When he's in, they play exceptionally well. He's kind of the piece that makes the team work. And one thing about Pat Bev is that he's not Reggie Jackson. So that helps a lot.

Is that you're not relying on Reggie Jackson for, what, 20 plus minutes? I was laughing last night. All the Pistons people I follow. Oh, my God. Boy, they were loving it. It's a double whammy with Tobias Harris on the Sixers. Right. And Reggie Jackson now on the Clippers.

It's like, I be. They're like, I told you so. No, yeah, the Pistons didn't get in the lottery. the night, but at least they had their night last night where they were getting to hate watch former players that they had to watch once upon a time. Old Paul George probably, we're not going to have a lot of four for 17s either, hopefully for you. Probably not, but to Isaac's point as well, you know, regarding Luca, the guy he and Jason

Gallagher wrote a hit song about, he is answering the critics again, once again, entering the draft. Is he athletic enough? he goes out and wins rookie of the year with one of the all-time great rookie seasons. Entering his second year, how much better can he really get? He makes a leap to becoming an MVP candidate, a top five guy and first team all-N-Ba player. Entering the playoffs, it's Kauai Leonard and Paul George are going to expose him, 42 points tying a record for most points in a first playoff game ever.

And then he's even better in a second game by limiting turnovers. He is answering doubts every single step of the way about him and showing that he, is indeed the real deal as one of the game's next great players. Really, Karin's great players. I don't know if you felt like this, Isaac, but I said this on Tuesday show. After watching them that first game, it was like, I don't know what Doc was doing, taking Pat Bev off of him. And he sat Pat Bev forever.

And I really felt like Luca, like the second he looked up and saw there was no Pat Peave in there, he really got going. And then it was a freight train. And then once he got that confidence, because he was a mess, turned it over four or five times. Pat Bev was all up in his grill. And Doc sat him forever. And it was like, man, you let this guy get going. And now there's no stopping it.

Yeah. I mean, I think Doc might have been concerned for Pat's health. But you don't want Luca to get momentum like that. I mean, it's Luca don't just, man. You don't want him to catch fire. Like, if you're going to need a whole lot to douse that fire. Hey, last thing on that game. All right.

So this happened to me. This is a weird occurrence. So when I woke up this morning, there was the video of Bobon on TNT. And I had just reposed a video, retweeted it. I look back and my phone, like, I go through and it's like all these mentions on there. And I'm like, what in the world? The thing, I put up all kinds of tweets over the years, right? The thing got retweeted like over six.

thousand times or liked or whatever. And I was like, it dawned on me. He might have, I'm not kidding, the highest Q score of any player in the entire NBA. Would you say, like, who doesn't like Bobon? Like, and I say that as, do you how many times we have tweeted about all manner of players? I've talked about the NBA, NFL, all kinds of different things. I've tweeted about a million different. subjects over the years. I tweet about this video of Bobon, and it's a great video. There's no doubt

about it from Ball's Life. But I just retweeted it and put up his quote about Luca. And I look back and I'm like, what? And it made me think like, everybody loves this guy. Like here, I have found the thing that can bring America together. Can we put him on, by the way, can we put him on this friggin ticket? I swear to God I'll vote for Bobon if you put him on the ticket. I promise you. Biden should have him on his cabinet somewhere. Yes. Honor a member of the cabinet.

I will vote for this guy. I will vote for Boban. I guess he wasn't bored here so he can't do it. But let's make an exception. He appears to be the one thing that can bring, that everybody agrees with and everybody loves. In this world where we are all divided, Boban brings us together.

Somehow the one thing that can bring Americans together is a 7'4 Serbian guy. Yes. That's right. Who's doing big heart symbols with his arms? I know. Oh, my goodness. I love him. It was so beautiful.

It was great life advice from him too. Hey, let me tell you something. I loved it. He's obviously a funny character within the NBA. He also does not suck. Oh, yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like, he can really make a difference for you on some nights.

Really can. For sure. He can read. bound, hit some shots. I've been preaching at the pulpit of Bobon for a while. Like, he's not a bad player. He's an offensive specialist. You throw the ball to him in the post, and, you know, you see what happens,

and he'll get you an easy bucket sometimes. You know how these guys, like every center that comes in the lead, they end up working with Akeem Elijah on in the summer? Like, Taco Fall, he needs to go work with Bobon. Just all summer. Like, the same way that centers work with, the same way that centers work with, so you try to learn footwork from Akeem Elijah on and stuff.

Caco Fall needs to go to Boba just say, teach me your ways. I just want to be clear that you just compared Hakeem Alojuan to Boba Marjanovic. I just want to be very clear that that happened on this podcast. Okay.

That happened. Actually, one of them is more beloved. You're probably right. I kid. I kid. No, everybody loves Akeem, too. Who doesn't love Akeem Olajuan? Right?

All right. Well, we have had unbelievable games that have been going on so far, and there are games every single day. Kevin, have a great. weekend. Isaac, thank you as always. And we will talk to you next Tuesday. Have a great weekend, everybody.