The Ringer NBA Show - Luka and the LeBron-less Lakers Keep Rolling. Plus, Difficulties in Dallas. | Real Ones

Episode Date: November 7, 2025

Luka Dončić has found himself in the history books yet again to start the season. The Lakers have looked good thus far, holding second place in the West without LeBron James logging a single minute on the court. Logan Murdock and Raja Bell discuss the Lakers and how they should operate when LeBron returns. Luka’s former team, the Dallas Mavericks, find themselves in the bottom of the West following a loss to the Pelicans. Are they mismanaging Cooper Flagg’s development? (0:00:00) Intro (1:05) FanDuel ad break (2:30) Luka’s historic start to the season (5:12) What will the Lakers look like when LeBron returns? (23:04) FanDuel ad break (24:14) Cooper Flagg’s development (41:11) Raja’s thoughts on tension between Ja Morant and the Grizzlies (51:57) Real One of the Week Hit the mailbag! ⁠⁠[e-mail]⁠⁠ Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja BellProducers: Victoria Valencia and Clifford AugustinAdditional Production Support: Ben Cruz and Conor Nevins The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please check out ⁠rg-help.com⁠ to find out more, or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping? Real ones. Logan Murdoch here, aka Logie Boonauta 2. Went old school today, just me and Rajah on real ones. We talked about the Lakers, man, the gift that keeps on giving, and Luca Dachich and how they've been playing great and how they should continue to play great once LeBron is back in the lineup. Then we talk a little bit about a Cooper flag and how his development has been maybe tainted or has it actually been a good thing for him. Hmm, Raja makes the point for both. And then we get into a little Jaya situation.

We hadn't heard Roger's thoughts on the Jaya situation. It's very nuanced. There's a lot of moving parts within that. And I don't think it's talked about a lot. And I think that we had to do a little bit more, especially we haven't talked to Raja about it in a long time. And his perspective is so invaluable. So it was really good to lock in with him on that.

A couple housekeeping notes. You know what it is every Tuesday. Real Onesmailbag at gmail.com. Real onesmailbag at gmail.com. Real Onesmailbag at gmail.com. I've got a question for you. Do you need me to repeat it? Real onesmailbag at gmail.com.

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in D.C., Kentucky or Wyoming, gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Helph.com. Call 188-789-777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut. Cliff? Play the theme music. What's popping? Browardock here, Roger Bell Dare. Cliff in the motherfucking cut.

All right, man, we're talking Lakers, the gift that keeps on giving. We're talking Cooper Flagg. we're going to be talking maybe some Jha and some Amin Thompson if we get to it and then we're in one of the week. But first, the Los Angeles Lakers, Raja, who are 7 and 2 near the top of the Western Conference. They are 13th in net rating. They are in the Raja zone in offensive rating at fifth in offensive rating. But they're not quite in the Raza zone yet in defensive rating at 18th. but Luca has been on a tear.

He's averaging 40 points, 11 rebounds, and nine assists on 50% shooting. He's the first player in NBA history with 200 plus points, 25 plus rebounds, and 25 plus assists through the first five games of the season. He's in 100th percentile usage rate. And, man, he looks skinnier than me. He's running the break. He's looking like White Magic Johnson. It's a sight to behold.

We had, me and you both have. had some, you know, both reservations and also some optimism on what the Luca led team could be. Not necessarily Luca, but just the team around him. I remember being at opening night and seeing just basically it was give the ball to Luca and like everybody else run around and have the offense around him. And that gave us both some pause. But now we're like two and a half weeks in, Roger, like how far can he take the Lakers by himself? I know LeBron might be coming about a couple weeks, but what have you seen from Luca? What do you like from Luca? And what do you like about this Lakers team this early in the season? I mean, what have I seen from Luca? You see, I mean,

Luca just looks physically really, really good. He looks like he's dedicated himself to getting in the type of shape that allows him to do what he does already for just longer stretches of time and more effectively and more efficiently through the course of the game. And if you extrapolate that out, like hopefully through the course of a season, right, without having to endorse some of those injuries. So like, from a play perspective, he's doing what he has always done. Like, when he's been healthy and you put the ball in his hands, he's the type of player that, you know, I've said this before. Like, there are very few people that can, that can really, you know, kind of marionette the game and just pull all the strings the way he can pull him and move the pieces around the chessboard. So that's not

surprising to me at all. Seeing him at this kind of fitness level with these kind of legs in the passing lanes out on the break, dunk in the ball a bit like that, that's refreshing to see, and that's exciting if you're a Laker fan. Austin Reeves continues to take steps. You know, when Luca was not available early, you know, Austin was, Austin was cooking. like he was cooking and he's been he's a solid real solid number two right now like i i'm not i'm not going to hate like i'd be interesting to see if he could carry that out like when lebron comes back if you know here's here's the thing because i'm rambling but here's the thing what happens they look really well put together around luka as currently constructed as they're out on the

floor right now he's got the ball he's got the usage rate the pieces are around him in a way that he really feels comfortable and allows him to be the best version of him. What that looks like when you reintroduce LeBron, if you reintroduce LeBron, is going to be interesting to me. Like, it's going to be very interesting for me to watch that dynamic, both on the court, at the post-game presser. That's going to be interesting because right now they have it rolling and it's, there's a sweet

spot for a player, what he likes, what he likes to have around him. how he likes to handle his business that puts him in like the best the best emotional state, the best physical state to be successful. Luca's in that spot right now with the pieces that you have on the floor with him. Yeah.

There's two ways as this can go with LeBron. There's the sulking LeBron or the egotistical LeBron that is seeing his mortality, not just as a career, but also in a Laker uniform. And he just fucks things up and, you know,

with subliminal, little, you know, LeBron stuff or, you know, tweets or whatever, what have you. Or there is the other brawn that I think is probably more realistic here. I want to tell a story about a couple years ago. Well, not a couple years ago, but in 2001, during that Lakers run, where Kobe Bryant, I think he missed like eight or nine games throughout the regular season of that year. was during their back-to-back title run during the season. And at the beginning of that season, he was going gung-ho scoring, gung-ho scoring.

I'm trying to prove to you guys that this can be my team. And then he got injured. I forgot what the injury is, but he sat his ass down. And Shaq went on a run. And he was able to see what Shaq was doing on the court, kind of scout from the sidelines. And you know what NBA players, especially of that ilk of Kobe Bryant and just the all-time stars, he kind of got to see where he fits in alongside Shaq and put together both what he was doing aggressively scoring

and then also feeding Shaq to where he needs to go and then they went on that 15 and one run which in the playoffs because Kobe had best of both worlds where he was both facilitating and he was being aggressive. I think that's what Braun can be because I think one of the things that we've seen from Luca, not just this season, but throughout his career, is that you've seen the same.

also with LeBron too, where they're guys that you could just put dudes around them and the team will be successful, right? LeBron isn't that guy right now because he's 41 years old, but by and large, that's been the kind of guy he's been throughout his career. It's really hard to get to that point. You have to be really great to do that. But just give me a group of dudes, we'll figure it out. That's the type of player that Luca is. And I think for the first time in his career for this to be successful, LeBron just has to be one of the dudes on there, right? And he needs to just be like, yo, I'm going to break with you. You need me.

I'm hauling ass, right? I'm playing off of you. Whatever you need, I'm playing off of you, right? Because it is a Lucascentric offense right now. And maybe they stagger. Maybe JJ Riddick staggers both of them where, you know, Brian gets his, because, you know, Kobe and Shaq used to stagger all the time, right? Where it'll be a Kobe time and it'll be a Shaq time.

I think that would be the best recipe for right now where, and then when they are together to close games, you can pick your poison on who's hot. But I think the best way to go about this is LeBron to fall in line, especially because they are, you know, they're rolling right now. You don't want to mess up that vibe. You just want to enhance the vibe. And I think that, but the way that you do that is just like falling in the line,

yell, I'm in the corner of you need me. I'm cutting. I'm hauling ass. I'm in the post. I'm picking, rolling, whatever you need, Luca. I'm here to add to what you are. doing as opposed to getting my own. And LeBron is a smart enough player.

And also, he's been engaged a lot on the sideline. I saw him against the San Antonio Spurs down the stretch of that. It was, you could tell he was revving to get back into the flow. He was coaching guys on the sidelines. He was, you know, calling charges, excited, slapping fives. And it was a good thing. But I think that if he just enhances the vibe, he's going to be fine. If he tries to take away from it, which I don't think he's going to.

because one thing about LeBron is if he and you've had this experience when he sees that the team has a chance to win, he is locked in. Like he is, he is in it. And this is a chance for, I think this is one of those things where he sees a chance to win in a winning group. And I think that he's going to fall in line. A few things, a few things. I don't, there's no part of me that thinks LeBron will come back and try to, you know, try to be, you know, pissy about the situation. trying to cause a little chaos in the media. I don't think so.

He's too much of a professional to do that. So I don't think that would ever be his intent. You mentioned the Kobe Shack situation. That offense kind of organically, the triangle, will lend itself to like them being able to kind of, you know, equally distribute the ball, the touches and scoring areas and be able to kind of navigate needing two people to work like that.

It's just set more. It's more of a set offense, right? there are movements that are going to happen almost every time down the court. There's more structure there when you're trying to get said player. You talked about Luca being able to put four or five guys around him. LeBron used to be able to do that. The people who can do that are advantage creators on their own. Like what they do is get by their man in some capacity, collapsing defenses,

given that they have the space to do that. And then they have the uncanny ability to always know, what play is the right play to be made with the pass when their ability to score is taken away. Like, not everybody can do that. LeBron surely used to be able to do that. And so when you play LeBron and Luca together, the question then becomes if LeBron is in this headspace where he is going to help and add to the vibes to use your term, does he have the skill set that complements Luca's ability to beat his man every time and then pass the ball?

Right. And so he has become a better spot-up shooter for sure. He did compliment him in terms of getting out on the break last year and kind of let Lucas spread his wings and do his thing. It will be interesting to see how good they can be with LeBron in that role. Because that's not LeBron, if you understand what I'm saying. Like, that's a role player. Yeah. Right? I mean, I don't mean to marginalize LeBron at all. LeBron has been Superman forever. But if you're asking him to do that, then he's not LeBron. He becomes a 3-and-D guy, essentially. And if we're going to let Luca just keep doing our thing. So it's going to be interesting.

And this is the – you can have all the intent in the world. Your intent can be fantastic. You want what's best for the team. I have no doubt to your point that if LeBron sees a team with an opportunity to win, he's all in. You can never underestimate how much a star like that is used to being a star like that. And when it's not available to them in that way anymore, you can't quantify what happens. There's no way to predict it. You don't know. You just don't know. Right. And so we're going to sit back and watch. And I too hope that he can make that transition in a way that very few

I mean, very few players have been able to make a true transition like that. Do you, I mean, from like, I am the guy, like the face of the league guy to like, hey, bro, you take that ball. I'm going to go run over here in this corner. I'll outlet to you on the break. Yeah. I mean, I'm thinking about Will Chamberlain when he led the league and assists, right? Was like a real towards the back end of his career to win that 72 title. I think about Kareem towards that in.

But again, Kareem? That's really hard to do. And like Kareem has been very open about. how hard that was him to see that responsibility. And that happened, that didn't happen. I imagine, I mean, I wasn't, I was watching, but like I wasn't like locked into team dynamics at that point, body language, etc. I imagine that happened gradually for Kareem and with a little bit of pushback from Kareem.

You know, so like, so, so how quickly they can make that dynamic change on the fly is going to be like, to some degree. it's going to be the tale of the tape for what their season can ultimately be. Like, I, too, agree that LeBron is as smart a player as there is out there. I know that he knows championships, like, are directly tied to, like, the ultimate legacy that he leaves. So will he be chasing them for sure? You just don't know what it's like to not be the guy until somebody tells you you're not the guy.

Yeah, I'm really, I want to give credit to one JJ Reddick who has had to manage all of these things. And I think what I've seen, especially during the super team era, by and large, I guess, like towards the back end of the super team era, is when you put guys together, stars together, you kind of just, I think coaches get into the way and they kind of just resort to, okay, their great players are going to figure it out. I think what JJ has done, especially on the fly here, and I think that's why he needed some coach the year consideration last year, is he's able to, put star players within the framework of a really good motion offense where he puts them in different places, right? Like, one thing that I've really been happy to see with Luca is they've been putting him in different positions to score, right? I think in Dallas, it was, you know, similar to Hardin, yo, dribble up.

If you've got a pass, pass it off of a, you know, off of a drive or step back three, right? That was pretty much his offense. I'll pick and roll or ISO. Exactly, right. Here, you're seeing him going to the post. You're seeing him kick to somebody else, go through an action, get the ball back. And LeBron is doing the same thing in the offense when you saw it last year, right? Which is why I think they can both kind of eat within the framework of the offense.

And it's not going to be like, okay, yo, you get the ball. No, I'm going to get the ball. No, no, no, no. You get the ball. It's your turn. And make it a lot of very predictable. because when you have stars, you stars still want to get easy buckets too.

They can get hard buckets and that's something, but they want to get the easy ones. Like there was a play that I, that kind of went viral, but I thought it was like, it was really indicative of like just how easy it has been for Luca within this offense where they, it was against the spurs.

They get him in on a post. They double him and he just goes right through and gets a layup. That was, it was just, it was beautiful to watch. Even LeBron and AR was impressed. But things like that and getting him in places where he's not normally able to get to has been great.

And, you know, Skinny Luca has just unlocked something completely different in his game. And if he can stay at this weight wherever it is, it's going to be great because he can probe people. He can run the break by himself. He could put so much more pressure on the defense. And I think that can really unlock when LeBron comes back because he's a different Luca than he was. It's like they traded for Luca and then they got another Luca than six months.

later that has that is this ball in well you know it's interesting like not not i'll have a thought on that but the move he made against san antonio i was bugging off like what was everyone bugging about he stepped through and laid the balling like yeah he just stepped through and laid it that was interested in me but like he's playing fantastic and you are right in terms of you know i always loved when scorers or primary you know focal points of offenses are moved around the court. Because then as a defender, I don't have landmarks. I talk about landmarks a lot.

I talk about, you know, knowing where you're going to be. And if I know where you're going to be and already have that figured out, I can devise, you know, different ways to try to, you know, limit your ability to be effective. But when you're moved around and you're catching me in different places on the floor and you're exploring, you know, where I'm the most vulnerable as a defender, whether that's out there in space or whether that's, that's, you know, putting me in some sort of like help situation or whether that's in just purely

putting me down, you know, on the post. Like once you find that, then you work that scenario that night, right? But like probing to find where he's going to have the best success that night is, I love coaches when they do that. I tend to agree with you in like motion when the ball's moving and LeBron and Luke could both being able to eat. But we all know that that's 85% of the game. and then there's 15% of the game when it's time to win, maybe only against the teams that look just like you or that are slightly better than you, where it's going to be back and forth

for the last half of the fourth quarter. And we're going back and forth, and we're not in that motion anymore. You watch NBA games. Like all the ones that really matter, they boil down to what, like with eight minutes to go in the fourth quarter, back and forth.

Best player with the ball, how are we going to get him to ball everybody else kind of hold a little bit and then let's figure this out. Like it just it just works out like that. That's the area that I'm interested in. Yeah.

Do you know what I mean? Like that's the area that because that's going to dictate winning and losing. Like if you can get that right, I'm not worried about all the stuff leading up to that. They're talented. I was LeBron James. It's Luca.

Like you got, you know, Austin Reeves playing great. They're going to win a lot of games. But like that portion of the game against those level teams is the area where I'm talking about really, really drilling in and watching this dynamic and what they're going to do with the ball. And really what one person is going to do off the ball in that scenario. Yeah, I can't wait to see the first game against OKC when they're all back, right? Or the Denver's.

Or even the San Antonio's. By the way, that San Antonio game was so fun to watch. I definitely am getting old because I, um, I was watching the game on West Coast, and I was like, I looked at the time. It was like three minutes left. And I'm like, bro, it's 10 o'clock. I'm tired. I'm going to sleep.

And I go to sleep right before the barrage of threes and like just where all the action went on. I'm like, oh, I don't think I've ever related to Roger Moore, like, or Beck Moore. I'm here. I don't even attempt, I don't even attempt to watch, though. That's just a tape. That's an immediate tape. Like, we'll catch that in the morning.

Yeah, we catch that in the morning. But, yo, did you, real quick, and this is our Wimby time real quick. Just give me, I'm just two minutes on Wemby Dog. Did you see him at how crazy he was, even though he fouled out? Like, they put him like on a switch with, I think it was Marcus Smart, where he just like, he sizes them up. No, it was on Dalton. And he sizes them up. I, I, one, two, three at the top of the key.

Ah, rock the cradle. Ah. Just. Yeah. No, it's, it's great. Again, he's a freak. As of late, though, like, you know, point production down, teams are starting to really kind of, you know, understand where they might be vulnerable. I do think, you know, even at the beginning of that Spurs game, I was watching it and I was like, man, give him the ball.

Yeah. Like, you know, we talked about with Howard last time that Wendy is like, yo, this is my, this is mine now, right? And maybe it was too early for that, but I wanted him, I wanted them to come out in that Laker game and go right at him over and over again. Like just to say, Hey, bro, this is what it's going to be all night.

Come with your double. Do what you need to do. And there were a lot of like loose possessions for San Antonio early in that with other dudes trying to get their shit off. I just did not appreciate it. I thought, you know, I thought that was a miss a little bit,

quite frankly, on their part. But, you know, in retrospect, over the last three games, the last time I was on, I had said, you know, the deer and fox of it all, like maybe you look to move.

I actually think he helps them. You know, I actually think he helps organize, get people, you know, he's just a vet in that space. Like, you know, Harper's going to be great. But you do need some seasoning in terms of running a shell, like getting the pieces where they need to be, setting the table, controlling the tempo, making sure that we're not giving that ball to Wemby at 22 feet so they can come and get up under his feet and double him. Like, we're going to, hey, bro, take your ass down there.

Get it at 11. Like, get it at 11 where it's just make or miss at that point because they can't do nothing with you down there. Like, there's some of that that I think he will help them with. Yeah, man. Get him the ball early. You sound like me when I'm talking about talking to Chip Kelly in my mind. Like, just give Gentie the fucking ball. Just give him the ball early and often.

He is our offense. Stop fucking playing. Sorry. I'm still heartbroken from last night. Anyways, speaking of seasoning, Raja, on the other side of the break, let's talk Cooper Flagg. The Ringer NBA show is brought to you by Fandil.

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Opting required. Rewards are non-withdrawable. restrictions apply, including bonus and token expiration, leg requirements, and max wager amounts. See terms at sportsbook.vandal.com. Gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Help.com. Call 1-88-78-9-7777 or visit cpg.org backslash chat in Connecticut. All right, and we're back. Let's talk to Cooper Flag and development, both of Rogers' bags. Let's put some stats on at first. Mavericks are last in the West. Oh, in the same conference as the Sacramento Kings.

He currently ranks third in points among rookies. Second and rebound, sixth and assist. The Mavs are down bad. They took Clay out of the starting lineup for DeAngelo Russell. He had 20 points in nine, rebound in 35 minutes. But they lost to the Pelicans who got their first win. Congratulations, Pelicans. my sleeper team.

Anyways, the question that I just kind of want to go with you, and I think it's mostly like circumstantial because of just where the Mavericks are, just the fact that they traded for Anthony Davis to, quote, be in air quotes, a contender. And so they're pushing this agenda like, hey, we're going to try to compete for a title. We have players and vets.

And I think it's just a hodgepodge of guys. Whereas in a perfect world, you would just, in a perfect world for a first round pig, you would just have the roster barren and just methodically build around this rookie. They don't have that luxury right now. So I think that's why the development of Cooper Flagg is a bit off track right now.

I just don't know what you do and short of like sitting everybody else out and just letting him cook for, I don't know what else you do with this team. And it's weird to see what, like Jason Kidd, his coaching, because he is a coach for a contender, and it's weird to see him kind of like figure out Cooper Flagg through this development. And also his struggles are, Cooper Flagg struggles are magnified because he's playing out of

position and he's playing for expectations that aren't realistic. I say all that to ask, what the hell do you do with Cooper Flag right now in this scenario? What is the path forward? and how do the Mavs get there? Listen, if I had answers to those questions, you'd be on the TV. To be like, yeah, well, I'd be sitting in somebody's, like, I'd be in somebody's front office, like, you know,

I don't have answers. I don't have answers. Here's what I would say to that. Everyone understood or should understand by now that that window that, that, Nico talked about, you know, that window for winning a championship did not include this year. Once Kyrie went down, that window was no longer open as related to winning a championship. So he can say whatever he wants, forward-facing to the media, but the bottom line is this is about Cooper Flagg's development.

That's what this is about, right? And Anthony Davis's health to some degree, because if we can accomplish keeping him healthy and viable, And Cooper can learn on the job and develop. Well, theoretically, when we get Kyrie back next year, we don't have a rook, a really good first round, like, number one pick that's learning fresh, you know, out of college one year reclassed up in high school. So he's a baby. Like, we have a second year pro that understands the ropes of this thing.

How you achieve that with him and the setup for that, I think, is pretty good, though. Like while they're not like this barren, you know, cupboard of talent where you could just drop him in and he goes for 30 every night, that's never who he was. So I made the argument when they drafted him that the setup for him was really good. He's not giving him the ball and saying go get 30 for us and that's going to be your development plan, not prudent. It's just not. You have to have patience if you're a mass fan. I know that sucks. You guys had Luca.

You don't want to hear that, but that's the reality. this this is going to look good some nights it's going to look great some nights it's going to look terrible some nights um but you have to take the approach of not a day trader but like a long-term investor and just zoom out and like day trading is going to be really fluctuate it's going to fluctuate there'll be highs are going to be lows you're going to ride those waves you'll be miserable but if you zoom out and just know that if you stay invested and you stay patient you stay diversified that thing ultimately is going to keep going up that's cooper flag over the course of this year.

So have patience with him. Sit back and watch, zoom out. Don't ride the highs, don't ride the lows. Every night he goes out there, he is learning something. He's a baby. And I don't mean that in any kind of negative way. Like he, again, he reclassed up a year in high school to get to Duke early. He played one season at Duke and now he's in the NBA.

So basically he's basically a college freshman right now. That's incredible. And he's got all of this talent. He's got all of these boxes that he can check to win basketball games. He's always won basketball games. That's not a fluke. It's going to take time for him to develop those on the NBA scale. And it's going to take him time to figure out what he needs to be for any team to have a chance to win games.

So you let him work his way through it. Should there be some point guard playing that? I think so. Yeah. I think that's a good skill set to have. have. I do. I think that if you can learn to play that position adequately, it gives you a versatility that moving forward in your career is going to prove dividends down the road. Do I think he's a point guard? Do I think J.Kidd should look at him like himself and think he's going to be

this big pass-first magic like point guard? I don't think that's the right, I don't think that's the right way to approach that either. But some point-guard play is good. This isn't a great answer. But What I would say you need to do with that specific team as it relates to Cooper's development is take a step back, understand that that's what this year is about. That's all this year is about. And it's not going to happen overnight. This is going to be something that happens over the course of these 82 games and, quite frankly, next summer.

Yeah. Well, I'm with you on the point guard thing. And the reason why I'm with you is because in a perfect world, you would just do that anyway, and just try shit because there's no expectations. There's none of that. Like if J.Kid did this without Anthony Davis, Clay Thompson, Kyrie Irving on the roster, they would just be trying stuff with Cooper Flagg

and just say, hey, we don't care if we win 20 games this season. But like because they set this expectation of championships, that's why I think Jason Kidd is getting the criticism. Nico Harris is getting the criticism. Also, man. Who in their right mind? Like aside from Nico, Well, their right fucking mind thought they were going to be playing for a lot.

I don't think Nico believe that, to be honest with you. I think Nico was just saying stuff. He was cop and pleased just because he made a terrible decision. One person that I am disappointed in, um, and just watching is just Anthony Davis, man. This is the, this is the season of all seasons that you get your ass in shape and have one of the best years of your career. And he came in overweight, out of shape. And it's not really a surprise that he's injured.

so fast because if he is this was like the late stage prove it year this happens sometimes right like where you're like okay you've been a number two for a while people like raja uh you think you're number one but people like raja are like no no man he's actually a number two you guys are missing the plot this is how you reclaim your number one status as a player he don't think he's a number one rock with me here so so so the fact is he had another shot at that right here and I think he just it just completely just blew up in their faces because if he goes hard and he leads this team it makes it easier for Cooper flag it makes it easier for people around maybe you if this team won 45 games is in a play in then

you kind of can set the expectations of like man hey we can get Kyrie coming in next year there's some excitement going into next year maybe we can be a contender now it's like man uh you know and there's been other things lively's been hurt There's been people that have been in and out of the lineup. But like going in the next season, it's, you're even with Cooper Flagg on the roster, you're looking at a whole restructuring. Like, if I am in charge there, I'm definitely restructuring everything because it doesn't look like any hope is on the horizon, right?

You have a Kyrie Irving who is coming off an ACL. There's been whispers that he's going to come back around like December out of nowhere, which doesn't seem great. You laughed at me when I told you all that on a pod last year When you got hurt Go find it, Cliff They laughed at it It said January

Everybody's laughing at me You did, you did But even with the ACL recovery Like I'm not expecting him to be full strength For another one Until like 18 months at least right But they don't have the luxury of time And so like you're going into next year

And you're like okay Kyrie has to prove it at like going into his mid-30s You have a season where Anthony Davis was out of shape injured and the only hope you have right now is Cooper Flag. That's not great for Nico. That's not great for the front office. You got, poor Clay. Poor Clay. Clay was just trying to be on vibes. He kind of swindled people. It got Mavericks fans thinking he was going to be something and a contributor to a championship team. And I don't think really watched the last part of the Warriors, his last Warriors season. He kind of is who he is at this point of his career. But he's getting vilified right now.

It's just tough. And Maver's, I think the overall point that I'm trying to make, though, is that this should be a better situation for Cooper Flag as a young person, but it's just not because there's so many

other cooks in the kitchen that have so many different types of agendas in Dallas. And there doesn't seem like there is a laser focus on one thing. It's like, oh, we're going to be a champion. No, we're going to try to develop Cooper Flagg. Oh, we're going to wait until Kyrie comes back. Oh, is Anthony Davis?

He's still a, defensive player right? No, damn, he's out of shape. Like, there's so many different things. And when you have a young guy like that, particularly in this hard cap era, you need to be methodical and you need to make sure you're putting pieces around him at the right time. And I don't think the Mavericks are doing that. Well, yeah, I think I slightly disagree because I think you can achieve, I mean, first of all, I think that if you got behind closed doors and asked people what they were trying to achieve

in Dallas this year and you got a genuinely. genuine answer, it would be developed Cooper Flag. Now, they might say whatever they say to the media, but I think that as agenda and objective numero uno for anyone around that Dallas franchise, you're looking at your roster. I think that there would be hope, at least for me, I don't know that I don't know that I would give up on the Anthony Davis-Kir-Kuper Flagg situation rolling in the next year. I just don't know that I would because I don't I mean I again I know people think Anthony Davis is a number one I made the joke and kind of interrupted you I don't even think that Anthony Davis thinks he's a number one right like I think he feels much better being in the number two role where where you know he can come in there and just be an accent to like what you have going on in the number one spot I was disappointed in in his level of professionalism. I'm going to just keep it a buck. I don't know him. So like this might

be unfair, but sometimes I question whether he like loves it like that. Like I just do. That might not be fair to him and I apologize to any of his fans, but that's just genuine. But he didn't come into the greatest shape and that was disappointed because I had laid out why I thought he was very protective and it would be a very nice kind of like safe environment for Kup to start learning how to swim in the NBA, right? Like there was a barrier there between him and all the sharks that are swimming around in those waters, dog, and that barrier would have been Anthony Davis if he were at the best version of himself.

Sure, playing out of his normal role and his ideal role, but still able to, to your point, like win games and have you in a situation where vibes aren't just completely low rolling into Kyrie coming back next year. And so my hope is that he gets healthy and he's able to kind of do that and they're able to become viable over the course of this year, not in any championship level,

you know, conversations, but just in a way where you've got a little momentum. I do think you will continue to see Kupb get better. And you don't, the plan for Cooper getting better doesn't have to be given the ball and get out of his way. It doesn't have to be that. If he was going to be, SGA moving forward, that's the plan.

Hey, bro, get this cat as many touches as we can get him, get him in as many offensive scenarios as we can get him in. Let's figure out who he is as this offensive weapon. It's going to be 30 a game over, you know, for five, six, seven years in a row. If that's who he was going to be, then the recipe to develop in him is giving the ball. That's not Kooke. Kooke's a Swiss Army knife. He's going to do a little bit of everything.

So you don't have to have that unique setup to develop. to develop him. So I do think that they can develop him with what they've got going on there because he doesn't project to me at least to be that, you know, A1 offensive player, at least in the near future.

Yeah, I think the problem with that is, though, is the guys that are tasked to develop him don't have any incentive to do so, right? Like on the roster, right? You have a guy like Kyrie coming back from ACL, he ain't going to be like, Yo, I'm not going to attach my last few years in the league into developing somebody. I'm trying to win a chip.

I mean, I don't know what Anthony Davis necessarily wants to be. But like, if you see him this season, he's definitely not invested in developing a Cooper flag or else he would have came in shape. He would have been ball and he would have been like, okay, my job is to get you right. Right. Yeah, it's not a David Robinson and Tim Duncan type of situation. But like, okay. No, my bad, because I got to interject there.

That's not my job. No, no, no, I get that. Davis. No, no, I get that. Not my job. Like, I agree it. I agree. But what I'm saying is though, like, if you're, that's why, that's why I said the too many cooks in the kitchen thing, right? There's too many different types of agendas, whether they are fair or not, right? But when you are trying to bring a rookie of that type along, you need guys in there that are going to try to, where their focus is, like I'm going to, we're going to develop, I'm going to get out. We're all going to develop, I'm going to either go to another team or I'm going to develop this thing with

you. With this type of roster, that's not realistic. I'm pushing back again because like, let's go to Philly with VJ. Edgecombe. Like, you don't see Tyrese Maxey worried about developing VJ Edgecombe. Like, we're going to go out there, try to win games. I'm going to do what I do. You're going to develop because you're out here on the court. You're going to develop because, like, you're playing basketball and you've got these opportunities that night after night, and we can. keep stacking these nights and these practices, that's what happens. So like I, I feel what you're saying. I just don't think you have to have a barren desert of talent to let something like Koop develop. You can have AD when he's good and he's playing. Well, you can have Karee that's trying to win a championship.

I don't think that necessarily has to hinder Koop's ability or stunt his ability to grow. It might not expedite that in terms of his top end ability, but he can still grow. in that and see how he can contribute to winning in that window if it really exists. And then that's just a more gradual development. You know what I mean? But again, I think some of that is also tied to what he projects to be as an offensive player. Because if he's never going to project to be a 25 to 30 point a night score in the NBA,

the worst thing that you could do to him is put him in a situation where he's got the ball and he's got no help. because that's going to be really frustrating. He's going to look really bad trying to do that. Yeah. Yeah. We'll see what happens. See what happens.

No doubt. That's a good point. We haven't, before we get to ruin of the week, I want to ask real quick, because we haven't talked to you in a minute. What have you thought of, like, the stuff with Jai? It's right in your bag, bro. I don't know, man. I don't, I don't.

It's time, right? Like, we can all agree. Like, this is, like, it's, it's. It's time. I've lived in a glass house before, so I'm not going to throw stones. I became so disgruntled, so disgruntled with my situation at one point that I was not the best pro. So I'm not about to sit here and tell you that, you know, no one could ever do that and shame on him. What I will say is I know the signs of that.

And when that happens, it was easy when it happened to me. I was old and I wasn't very good. Kick him, like get his ass out of here. When you've got a talent like Jha and he's in, you know, what should be his prime, it's not that simple. I just think that

once you get there, unless there's major, major structural overhaul, there's no going back. Like you can band-aid it, right? It's like leaks on that boat. You keep slapping a band-aid on one, and here goes another.

You slap Band-Aid on that one and there goes another. Eventually, that thing's, you know, coming apart. And so I just feel like we're kind of closely approaching that with Jai. It's unfortunate. I would tell him just from experience the looks of like physical disgust when you're out there on the court or like lack of care that people, you know, kind of clip and put out there. I feel you in that. I've been there.

It's never a good idea, though. It never works out great for you. Like that never, that never is going to turn around. People are never going to be like, yeah, man, they're really, it's always going to look bad for you. So it's unfortunate. Like, I don't know. I said a lot to say very little, but I think it's unfortunate. I think it's time.

Yeah, man. I think he should look at every game right now as an audition, whether it's for, because it's very clear right now that. And we've talked about it, you know, talked about it, the live show when Beck brought, you know, got that news leak to him, right? but the Memphis Grizzlies have they've said publicly and I think this is a you know talking people around John like the limited people that I do know but um it there's this two plain uh two plain like system where we're at right now where it's like Memphis is saying all the right things and saying like we love Jai we want to be with them and their actions are proving totally different they don't give you the extension they um they piss you off at every turn they don't

get the coach that you say you want, right? Whether or not he's running the office that you may like or may suit you or not, it's somebody that you didn't like. And now we're here, right? And the organization doesn't have your back on this because they suspended you. Right. So I think that the writing is on the wall here. So with that being said, there's a lot of,

there's just a lot of character stuff with Zhao right now that other. team that is going to hinder his ability to get paid in the way that he wants to get paid and whether the Grizzlies or other teams just for the reputation. And so the only way that you fix that is you say, you know what, fuck all of you guys, fuck everything and all the noise. I'm going to lead this team to the heights that I can lead them to to up my value and get up out of here. Or I'm going to force your hand to where either.

You got to pay me or somebody else got to pay me. But we are going to exceed expectations and we are going to ball. But like right now, it just doesn't seem like he's interested in that because like, I mean, he wasn't always the greatest defender. But like some of the defensive collapses right now on tape are pretty jarring now. And like the way they're getting clipped and like him not caring and then the presser. And on some ways, and I talked about it with Beck the other day, like I feel him. Like if the organization that you, you know, the job's presence in Memphis, if the organization that you have kind of put on the map and the way that he has post grit and grind is doing you like this, especially like what he's been to that community, I'd be pissed too. I understand. It's just not helping him right now. You know, this is part. It just isn't helping him. And it's unfortunate. But it's going to be a sad day if and when they get rid of him because the writing is on the wall. He's not going to be there.

for the rest of his career. It's over. Yeah, it's sad. It's unfortunate. I think that's a great, you know, that's great advice, Logan. Like, you can, you know, there's an amount of time,

regardless of what anyone says, where things aren't going your way, you're feeling sorry for yourself and you're in your feelings, right? Now, some people don't live in that space as long as others, right? But there's always a fraction of time where you're like, oh, fuck, man, like this sucks, right?

Like, right? And then you could get over it. He's kind of living in that right now, where to your point, like, you know, you just got to say, man, fuck it. This is what it is. This isn't really even going to be about the Grizzlies. This could just be selfishly motivated. This is for me.

I'm coming out here and my singular performances, my individual performances are going to help lift us to places where I'm restoring all value and faith in me across the league. You know? And that's where he's got to get to. Like the, you know, and I'm not saying he's sitting there, oh, whoa, it's me. But if you know, you know, like, you feel sorry for yourself a little bit. Like, you know what I mean? Like, there were times in my career where, you know, I'm sulking and shit's not going right

and you're like, whatever. And ultimately, you got to have it coming to Jesus. Like, bro, you're sitting here feeling sorry for yourself. Who cares? Like, who out there is going to make this better for you? Nobody? Like, nobody? The media is not.

They want to keep writing about it. The dude's sitting behind you's not. He wants the minutes. Like, your teammates aren't there. They're trying to do their thing to get paid. the only person that can get up out of this shit is you. Yeah. So like that's where he's got to get to.

And it can be selfishly motivated and be duly and mutually beneficial. But he's got to get to that point. Chris Rock said one of my favorite stand-up specials. We're talking about, you know, having kids and his daughters and stuff. And he was saying the advice that he would give to his daughters is the world don't give a fuck about you outside of these doors. And the people inside of these doors, little on the fence. No doubt.

But that's true. No doubt. I remember just like one of the biggest lessons that I learned in this world is that no one cares. No one cares about you. No one cares about me. No one cares about this pod. No one cares about shit. Look, man.

People. You know what I'm saying? I remember. No, I do because I used to be in gyms again, man. I started coaching little jerksos in the third grade. And I was blessed. Like some of my little guys are doing some really cool shit playing at some really high level schools. Like it's really cool.

But I remember when parents would like listen to me and maybe it was a lot for like a fourth or fifth grader who had tears in their eyes and, you know, shit's happening to him on a court. And my message is like, nobody cares. And like, you know, parents, moms especially would be like that that's their baby. Like they don't want you to say that. And I'm like that. Look, do I love this kid? Yeah, man. I'm going to take them to the pool later

and we're going to have a good time. But right now you've got to realize nobody can. The team that's kicking your ass don't care. Those refs that you think are screwing. They don't care. The other, no one cares. Tighten up.

And that's where you got to get to. Like, and that's, you know, it's not an easy message. Especially, like, if we're being honest, I've said this before about camp. You have to have people in your camp that will tell you that. Like Chris Rock's telling me. He doesn't have many people. I don't know.

Because I don't know. camp, but he don't seem to have a camp that keeps it all the way a buck with him all the time. And you need people in your orbit that are going to... So look, I just got back, I told this, I just got back from West Lafayette. I took Ty up to visit Purdue, right? And I was sitting there with Coach Painter and we were talking, and he told me a story about why he chose to go play at Purdue and for Gene Cady. And it resonated with me because I've had it.

experiences like that. He said, you know, a lot of things he told the story. He said, and his dad's message to him was like, hey man, I'm not saying you got to go there, but of all the people that have come through this house, he's the only one that told you the truth. Right. And that resonated with coach and that's why he went to Purdue. And I've had situations like that in my life. You have to have people that are going to tell you the truth about shit. Because if you don't have them in your world you never get to that point where someone can illuminate for you that you sit here feeling sorry for yourself and you got to get out of your own way yeah absolutely and i feel like you know i'm like Memphis is far away from the bay and from me but you know when i you do talk to people

around the league and you do talk to you know some people that are close to to him he doesn't and then you also have the anecdotal stuff of what you see around him just being in this it doesn't seem like He has people that are necessarily, like, pushing him up. It's people that, like, have something to gain from being around him. That's what it feels like, you know, and that's the unfortunate part of all of this. And, like, it's a, we can have a whole other pot about that, and I'm sure we will down the line. But it just doesn't, you know the life, Roger. You know how this goes, right?

Like, it's just, it's tough. It can be tough to manage when you're in a position like Josh. So I feel for him. But the other thing, though, there are a lot of teams right now that need a point guard. A whole lot of teams. A whole lot of teams that are monitoring the grizzly situation that can talk themselves in to not only trading for you, but also giving you an extension.

Hey. Yeah, go ahead and start playing ball, bro. Go ahead and do what you do, Joe. Like, this isn't even in a, if it came across in a hateful kind of like way, it was not meant to be. Like, I am a fan. Get your shit together personally, bro. Go out there and do what you need to do.

So you get those opportunities. That's what I'm saying. That's all I'm saying. Yeah, man. Also, the league's in a better place when Jaws Jha. Straight up. Straight up. Let's take a quick break. We're going to give our real ones of the week.

Okay, we are back. Roger, do you have your one of the week? I did not, but I quickly... Google searched. Yeah, I quickly just went through my Rolodex of shit that's happened. So I'm going to give real one of the week to one, Arch Manning. It's personal, clearly. Everyone knows, yep, my son's going to Texas.

But we were out there two weekends and last weekend maybe. for the Vandy game. And the reason I'm giving it to him is because he was putting a nearly impossible situation coming into this year, none of which was his fault. He wasn't out there professing to be the next Tom Brady or the best thing that happened to college football in the last 100 years. He wasn't doing that. He was, quite frankly, telling people, hey, I haven't done anything yet.

Like, he was trying to diffuse it, if you will. And he did not come out playing great. And Texas as a team wasn't playing great. And why I give him the real one of the week is because he stood up at that microphone. He held himself accountable. He faced all that scrutiny. He stood in the face of all of that and kept working, kept showing up, kept being what his team needed him to be. Sometimes it looked better than others.

But he has continued to get better and better and better. And specific to the game that I was just at, he looked really, really good. and he's a good kid. Like, I enjoy talking to him and spending time with him when I got the opportunity to do that, and I'm happy for him. Because that's an easy thing to wilt in the face of, and he did not do that. As a matter of fact, he came out on the other side, and he's looking better for it, and I applaud him for that.

That's a real one type shit. That's dope, man. I didn't grow up a Texas fan. In fact, I did not become a Texas fan, even in the slightest, until the nephew of the pod committed there. Me neither. But it's dope, like to just see, it made me watch Texas more and just see, you know, what Archie is going through. And that first game was, who, first game was tough. And to like, and to have to, you know, play through those expectations that kind of come on the other side of it.

Like, the expectations were coming from everybody but arch and people in that, in that locker room. And so, you know, for him, Sark, it's been dope to see. my ruin of the week is probably going to be someone that you guys are surprised for me to say maybe not if you've listened to this pot but i'm going to give it to one kendrick perkins um and that is because i watched um i watched his appearance on a out the mud podcast was a really good podcast with uh zbo and tony allen and they had him all recently and i know the big story was what he was talking about with ja and which was hilarious but uh if you watch the pod he talked about his journey from being a player going into an analyst role. And what he gave up to get into that role, all the vices that he gave up, just being an NBA player, that he gave up to work to be an analyst. He talked about, like, giving up weed, giving up just the lifestyle that can be a hindrance when you're a professional athlete that you can kind of get away with when you're a professional athlete. But when you get to the real world, it's just not conducive to, you know, just living in a real world. And he was just talking about just being productive. Being productive. Yes. And he talked about how much he worked to be an analyst at ESPN. And I don't want to give it fully away, but there's a clip on there where he talks about that. I think you guys will watch it and it'll give you a real resignation to the person that I know his perk and people that have seen him and work with him know his perk. Because like he's this dude that he'll say some wild shit. But also like say some stuff that you think is wrong. But like the people that work with him know that like he's always down. He worked really hard to get this. I remember when during the pandemic. like he was always just a text or call away to come on the podcast if I needed him, not just this podcast, but when I was back, the job that I had before this,

like, you know, just really, just being a really good person towards us, right? And like, also just like, yo, I'm down. I got you. I'm about to say you moonlighting on me, bro. You, you having motherfuckers on the pot. I'm not on the pot. Bro, we did the pod. All the, all the perk appearances you were there.

Shut up. Oh. But like, I think that he is, I really just, I really just, it really. resonated just to see that clip of him, just really talking about, um, taking the job seriously, right?

And you can say what you want about his performance on a job, but what he says, but he takes that shit seriously. And he means what he says, right? And so I'm, I'm, I'm,

my ruin of the weakest part because that clip from out the mud podcast was, I thought was a really great pot is a really good podcast and great podcast. Um, I think that you guys should watch it. And he really came off really great in that. Um, and really honest, right?

Like, he ain't perfect and nobody is, but, I really just expected the candor and vulnerability from the front of the show with Kendrick Parkinson. Carry on. God damn right. All right, man.

I got to go. I got to go up to sack and watch your guy, Russell Westbrook, play the Oklahoma City Thunder. So I can get the fuck out of here. Oh, man. Hey. All right. My bad. Arch, no disrespect.

Oh, you still a real one. Second real one. Brody. Yeah. I'm happy for you. Like, can we do that? Can we do that? Cliff?

Can we do that? I need fucking Howard back on a fucking Zoom call. Get him on FaceTime. It'll be here Tuesday. Get him on Facebook. Hey, Russ, don't screw it up before then, bro. Don't screw it up, Russ. Keep it moving.

He has a lot of time to do it. All right, guys, tap in Realones, Melbaugh at Gmo.com. Real onesmail back at gmole.com. Real onesmail back at gmail.com. Me, Howard, and Rajah, will be there on Tuesday. We'll tap in with you. Talk to y'all soon. All the shits.

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