The Ringer NBA Show - NBA Opening Night Thrillers. Steph Stuns Lakers and OKC’s Double OT Victory | Real Ones

Episode Date: October 22, 2025

Logan Murdock and Howard Mf’n Beck are back with another edition of Real Ones fresh off a visit to Crypto.com for the Warriors-Lakers season opener. OKC also began their championship title defense with a double OT victory over the Houston Rockets. Plus, Michael Jordan makes a resurgence into the basketball hemisphere. Hosts: Logan Murdock, Howard Beck, and Raja Bell Producers: Victoria Valencia and Clifford Augustin Additional Production Support: Ben Cruz Hit the mailbag! [e-mail] Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please check out rg-help.com to find out more, or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping? Logan Murdoch here. Howard motherfucking Beck there. Real ones. Yeah, where's, uh, where's, where's, where's Roger? He texted us in the chat by the way or not. Uh, where is Roger? Let's see.

It is 1 a.m. Eastern time you're asking me this question. I'm going to guess Roger Bell is sound asleep. Tucked away in sleepy time in Miami, Florida. Oh, yeah. We're live from Los Angeles. Live-ish. We're live. Okay.

What are we doing? Okay. Anyway, so we're talking to you guys minutes after the Golden State Warriors beat the Los Angeles Lakers at Crypto Arena. First of all, we're going to talk about, we're going to talk about this game. We're going to talk about the Rockets, Oklahoma City. We're going to talk about Michael Jordan later. But first, I just want to talk about Howard Beck back in his old stomping grounds really quickly. It was a sight to behold, brother.

I just want to set the stage here. I was trying to leave at the end of the third quarter, right? I wanted to see, you know, a lot again, I wanted to people watch. I don't go to crypto that often. You know, Laker games are very great people watching settings. It's a great atmosphere. And Howard wanted to leave at halftime.

So I said, let's just get to halftime and figure it out, right? And then I was just like, you know what? Maybe I'll see my homies here in Spotify a little early. Maybe halftime is the way to go. Forget it. Let's just, let's do. I did my schmoozing pregame. I saw all the people I need.

to see. Let's go. Let's go home, right? The amount of people Beck went to go say, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. I'm going to say hi to this person. I'm going to go say hi to this person. I'm going to go say hi to this person. It was astounding, ladies and gentlemen. What was it like to be back in your old stomping grounds? Your first home opener for the Lakers since 2003. Yeah, that's still fucking with my brain when I realized like, oh, this is cool. You know, like kids have gone all the way through college since your last. You're killing me, man. Yes, I know. Your last appearance. It hit me. I'm sitting in media seats next to Sam Amick, Malika,

and we're sitting there, we're talking about stuff, and all of a sudden I said, you know what, guys, just hit me? I haven't been a Lakers home opener since 2003, Shack of Gobi's last season. But that's because I live in New York now, Logan. I'm not usually at L.A. Openers, but still, it is weird. That building has a lot of resonance. Like, I won't lie. Every time I go down, there's a staircase we go down through the media entrance to go down to the press room and you walk right across like the loading dock area where the players are coming in. And it's like I've made that walk. I don't know how many hundreds of times. So yes, it's, it's different because the building feels different now.

It's got a different name that I won't say. But yeah, it's a thing. And also, like, they've built up the outside. Like, they've done a really great job with that plaza outside. We were walking by it. That used to be an open street. now a plaza completely pedestrian-oriented. They got all the statues out there.

They got the Kobe statue, multiple Kobe statues. And it's like, I love how much they have celebrated their history. And obviously not just basketball. They've got statues first and the other sports, too. But no, it's good seeing people. And one of the reasons we stopped on the way out that I delayed us a little bit after I was the one who pushed to leave it halftime because I wanted to get back so we could catch the end of the game here at Spotify Studios here at the ringer

before we I wanted to be able to watch. I had to stop say to hey to my old buddy Bill Plashky from the LA Times. And for those who don't know, Plashky, not only legend, of course, of the L.A. Times and legend from around the horn

for people who know him from there, but Bill wrote an incredibly moving column over the summer about how he has been diagnosed with Parkinson's and he has taken up boxing, like in a boxing gym, with a bunch of other, mostly older people who are going through Parkinson's, and this is a way to kind of keep it at bay.

And Bill being Bill just wrote an incredibly moving and incredibly soul-bearing and very brave, I thought, Collum. And I hadn't seen him since that appeared. And I really wanted to just kind of be able to touch base with him. So that's why I delayed us. I did say a few other hellos. Other people we probably won't name. I don't need to name drop all of them. Not all of them.

But, yeah, I will say that was like a, there was an annoyance. And I gave you a look when you were like, let's hold on. But then I saw you go up to Bill, who's a legend in the game. And you guys had a moment and it was, it was pretty special. We won't get into full of the details on this platform, but like it was definitely, I would say, a very special moment. Also, by the way, you run that fucking building.

Not even. Okay, so let me just feel back to curtain. I promise we'll get to the games and stuff. But before the game, I'll just say that Howard was, didn't really know his place in the business in a bad way. I had to tell him like, yo, you're Howard motherfucking. Beck and he's like, I don't know how they're going to see me. I don't know how this is going.

They put this motherfucker front row next to Sam Amick and Malika Andrews, friend of the, two friends of the program and you just were like in your bag, bro. So it was dope to see you in your bag. Appreciate you, like you, I haven't been here in a while. They did take care of me. That was nice.

Yeah, they put me and Marcus Thompson in the back of the bus, but it was cool to see that you guys were, you know, there on this great. Let's talk about the game for a week, you know, get canceled. It was a This was going to be an interesting game going into it Because I really wanted to see how these two teams played against each other Because they're so identical in terms of age

In terms of statutes in this league In terms of what they want to prove in this Western conference And they felt like they were on parallel tracks But once the game started It was very clear at least from the Lakers standpoint That this was Luca's offense And when he's off the floor they have a problem And when he's on the floor,

have a very big defensive issue. DeAndre Aden couldn't stop anyone. I don't think anyone, Reeves couldn't stop anyone. It's one game, but the Lakers should have some real concerns. And by the way, there were a lot of camera pannings to LeBron James who did not seem animated in any way. It seemed like he was going to, Cliff knows this very well. He was going to do a A.J. Brown, like, tweet or something.

It seemed like that was on the horizon, maybe a subject. tweeted in the next couple of weeks. But we'll see, what did you think of the Lakers performers? Let's start on that first. It didn't seem great, but I do want to get your take. By the way, LeBron with like the throne look there, right? He had like one of my colleagues... He looked like the top of Wizard Kelly. You're not going to get that reference.

He had one of my colleagues called the Phil Jackson seat, right? Because Phil always had the extra padding there. LeBron just like looming, like even from across the court, you could just see him looming over everything. But yeah, every camera pan, he's like stoic as hell. Like, there's no expression whatsoever. He's not getting up for like, and

when one of his teammates scores, he's just stoic. Right. And I'm not going to like, let's not like get crazy about reading between the lines of whatever. But like we know the backdrop. We know the backdrop for this. Like no extension. Rich Paul's statement in the late June about, you know, keep LeBron in mind. We know you're on Lucas timeline.

But like there's just some stuff simmering. Like LeBron's put on a good face in the preseason, a media day, everything. But like that stuff is still simmering in the background. He's on the clock. This is his last season potentially with the Lakers, at least certainly the last contract. the last year of his contract. So like something's going to give. I'm not saying there's going to be a blowup,

but like, I don't know. It's just one of those things. And then when you see him all stoic, you kind of just, it makes you wonder a little bit. Like, we can't judge the Lakers too much until LeBron comes back. Maybe that's in a couple of weeks.

Yeah. Because like he's not going to fix any defensive issues they have. Clearly, he might exacerbate them. But he does fix the playmaking issues. And the whole point of the exercise of having LeBron and Luca together right now is you have still an, still an elite playmaker for all 48 minutes as long as you're staggering them for parts of the game. They don't have that. And when Luca was off the floor, to your point, yeah, the offense looks like garbage.

Like the ball is not moving. Nobody can get an open shot. Arden was pretty bad. Aidan was pretty bad. You were referencing Marcus Smart who like had a really nasty, like you almost took Steph's arm out of the socket. It was, it was gross. I mean, this was this is the problem, man. Like I like this their off season was Marcus Smart, Deion. Andre Aiton and Jake La Ravia. That was it. And losing Dorian Finney Smith in the process. Marcus Smart looks like he hasn't played in two years, which arguably he kind of hasn't. La Ravia was okay.

Aitin was, I mean, like none of these guys are changing the Lakers. And none of these guys are the missing pieces that when they first got Luka in February, like, oh, okay, now you just got to reformat around him. Like, this is what you got? Like it wasn't, it wasn't great. Again, we're not going to overreact to one game, but I think what we saw from those guys tonight is the limitations that we already knew those players to have. And yes, Marcus Smart had an incredibly erratic game, including nearly yanking Steph's shoulder out of his socket for reasons. I don't know. And then argued the point once he got called for the flagrant after they did the review and was very demonstrative with the refs after arguing his point. I don't, I don't. I don't. I don't. I don't know what Markets Smart was doing. My favorite thing was a possession later or possession two later, he gets fouled by his own teammate and then looks at the ref.

Like what the hell happened? Yeah, arms out, like going back down. The Markets Smart experience, ladies and gentlemen, it was really a frustrating watch if you're a Lakers fan. There was a lot of frustrated fans in there. I don't know what the expectation was for them. I know there's Lakers exceptionalism out here, but like all they really got was their offseason was basically

in February when they got Luca Donchitz. And the other addition that they got was Luca Donchis losing weight. Yes, right? Accurate. And, but it seemed like a very worst version of the worst supporting cast that he had in Dallas where it's like Luca do everything.

And then maybe we can just keep it at bay and maybe Luca can impose his will. But I don't think that the Lakers or the, excuse me, the Warriors aren't a necessarily great matchup for Luca Donsets in that way, right? Because they have so many people that they can throw at them. And then they also had the anecdote of multiple scoring options on the other end that were just like punishing the Lakers defensively, right?

Like there was so many picking rolls where there was a mouse in the house, whether they have Aiden on a switch against Steph or they have Dachets on a switch against Steph and they weren't getting offensive rebounds. It was just, it was an ugly performance from the Lakers. And I don't know what they're going to be, but they got a tough schedule coming up, man. got it on Friday you're going to be at this game but they got the timber wolves coming up they got a couple dates with the the Portland trailblazers are pretty a hard out like I it could get ugly I don't know if it'll get ugly early I do think that even if they're just like 500 in the games

that lebron is out there's going to be some angst about it right yeah and like there is a clear pecking order at the very top of the west right Oklahoma's defending champs won the night against the rockets I think Denver is the clear number two. And then the Rockets who wanted to be in that tier, I think right now are in that next tier, which is jumbled, right? Like it's Houston, it's both L.A. teams. It's the Warriors. It's Minnesota, right? Like, I think that is the group that's chasing Oklahoma and Denver.

Like, somebody from that group, that just massive teams, one of them might emerge to be the team that can break through and maybe make a conference finals run, if they're the one to knock out Denver or Oklahoma somehow. Yeah. And you can make a case for some of them. Like you can find, like, you go best case scenario, right? Oh, best case scenario for Minnesota.

You know, Anthony Edwards makes a leap. Julius Randall is a lot more comfortable in year two with them. Rudy Gobert has kind of a throwback year as a defensive anchor. You know, little Dante DeVincenzo, a little Terrence Shannon. Like, you could like put it together. Like you can create a case for all of these teams if you want to say they've got a chance to break through and at least get to the conference finals and have a puncher's chance. But some of those teams have a stronger case than others.

I don't know that the Lakers case is all that strong. And because it's so much relying on the fact that LeBron is going to come back from some point from Syattica and then turn 41 and then try to get through a season playing at an all-MBA level in year 20, whatever this is. Yeah. It's a tough proposition, right? Like I made the joke that the Lakers would probably want LeBron's salary slot over LeBron at this point. And tonight was a reason why.

They need more playmaking. They need more shooting. They need like, like Luca just needs help. Like there's nobody. Like it was funny. Also, it was very clear that this is Luca's organization from when you saw all of the things that were on the Jumbotron and like the little, a lot of Luca. Like even like the games that are played during the timeout and stuff. that you see from Media Day.

It's very much Lucas' organization, and wherever he takes them is where they're going to go, but it's just hard when you have the supporting cast. I don't want to, like, linger too much because it's just one game, but I do want to get quickly on the Warriors' point of view on this one. We left at halftime, so I had a different impression of Jonathan Kaminga when I left the arena versus when I came back to the studio.

He was terrible in the first half, And I'm like, this is, it was looking like, man, like, this is the statement you want to make after you called all of that over the summer. And he just bawled in third quarter. And they're going to need that. He was great. Jimmy Butler was great. Went 16 of 16 from the line at 31, made timely shots. Steph made, like, probably the shot of the night, which is what Steph does.

We were watching. It was funny. We were watching in the movie theater here at Spotify. And as soon as he made that, there was like, yeah, let's go pot. It's time to pot. Let's get out of here. This game is over with. What are your impresses of the Warriors?

First of all, Jonathan Cominga. Six assists tonight, Logan Murdoch. Six. You know many times he had six assists last season? Once. He's on par for, you know. There's got to be. He's gotten his one six-s-s-game out of it.

There's no guarantee that that's going to happen. No, listen, like the Warriors, like, I know, you've got to take everything with a little bit of a grain of salt because of everything they've gone through with Cumminga, and they need his value to be up either because it's an asset to them or an asset to move in trade, which is what we were expected from the moment. They finally resolve the contract situation. But like this organization hasn't given up on him. Like there's still, there is some optimism about I think there's one person that hasn't given up on him in the organization. Well, the most important person, the guy who pays the bills. But in general, I think that this team, they've kind of

straddled the line and they've kind of been of two minds about him a lot. And he frustrates them at times, but you can also see the potential. And I don't think anybody thinks he's a bad guy or a bad player or is not about the right things. It's just about trying to refine some of his habits on the court. And a night like tonight, look, 17 points on 6 of 11 shooting, four of six from three. You and I have both had a conversation with someone from the Warriors pregame. We was talking about like our three-point shooting is going to be a lot better this year. And it's not just because they added Al Horford and eventually De Anthony Melton when he gets healthy,

but that they're expecting Cummiga to be a much more reliable three-point shooter. smallest of small sample size is one game. But four of six, not a bad way to start, nine rebounds, six assists. Like, that's a good all-around game from Cumminga. He was, and he was giving up the ball in the right moments, right? Like, he wasn't stalling it out. He wasn't, I don't feel like he was forcing things. And those are the things that have frustrated the warriors in the past with him. They want guys who make quick decisions with the ball and who are really intuitive players. And that's Steph, for sure. That's Jimmy. That's Pajemski at his best. That's Draymond. And so, like, Comiga plays like this. The fun conversation will be in a

couple of months, depending how things are going, like, oh, wait, are they actually keeping him after all? Like, is he now too valuable to give up? Like, that, they would love to have that conversation, I'm sure, or for to have that quandary. Sure, sure. It's, there were a lot, there was a lot of optimism in the Bay Area, at least cautious optimism going into this training camp and during the training camp. about Kaminga and like how good he everybody raved about you know him at camp and like on one hand

you know we're we're uh reporters by nature so there's a skepticism that goes like are you really okay reports you're supposed to say that yeah that should be the company line he just came into training camp late you know and he had to uh get this contract thing situation but like tonight kind of validates that point at least

for a night right and he all he tends to play really good against the Lakers he played good last year late season against the Lakers so it's good man like it was it was a good first start they still playing zremont at center um and starting him at center he's probably going to start at center for most nights and then there's going to be like i think steve curse said pregame that al horfer is not going to be playing back to backs alhofer's not playing back to backs and he also said they're limiting him to probably like 20 to 24

minutes and the quandary that steve out you know mentioned there was if if you're only going to play a guy 20 minutes and you want to finish games with him and they do then it's hard to start games with him because you're going to have like this massive period in the middle of the game where he's not playing at all. Yeah. So you you almost can't start him. It's not like, yeah, like the quest, the perpetual quest of the warriors to find somebody other than Draymond to start at center all the time. They don't want him to be the full-time center. Um, Draymond played 28 minutes tonight. He started at center. I don't know how many minutes were actually technically at center. But yeah, between Horford, Quentin Post got some run tonight. you would like to have one more body there, right?

Like, can trace Jackson Davis give them something? Like, it's still a quandary for them. They're still small. I mean, also, like, it's going to be, it's going to be interesting to see what happens with them, especially with other teams, right? Like, I could see a world, and I can see a world where, like,

maybe Atlanta doesn't get off to start. Maybe for Zing is, you know. is available and maybe they kick the tires on it. Or a big is like, you know, like maybe they can make like an ancillary type of trade for a big. I don't know if the roster is set at this point, you know, like especially like if the comminga thing goes bad. Maybe they try to flip him. They have to get his value up because they basically told everyone, given the impression that they don't like him and that they've benched him for a reason and that he could be.

problem and the rest of the league sees that. So they got to get his value up. But I could definitely see them making a move for somebody. Yeah. If they win at the pace that they want to win and they just kind of, you know, one of those trades where you're going into the postseason, like, let's just make

a move to fortify our roster. Yeah. But it's, I will just say, like this was the thing I was curious about and will remain curious about for a while here because, yeah, small sample size. They played at such a high level after they got Jimmy late last season.

And it's like you can't judge too much based on the last like two months of the regular season. They were strong in the playoffs too until Steph got hurt. But like tonight was an absolute continuation of how strong they look with Jimmy out there. Butler ends up with 31 points tonight, 16 of 16 from the line. Like they have nobody else who can generate that kind of scoring from the line. And he just, the guy just makes things happen. 31 points, five rebounds, four assists, steel, just like a really great, efficient,

typical Jimmy Butler performance. And I think that's who they are now. Like, I think that there is, this version of the Warriors is going to be, the ceiling is only, how long do these guys stay healthy? That's it. Like, I don't, for every single team, most teams aside from like Oklahoma,

you can always find, ah, they need another three-point show. Ah, they could use a big, like, yeah, there's stuff. but like I don't find too many faults with the Warriors other than can all these guys stay healthy because Jimmy, Draymond and Steph are all pretty old as well as Al Horford. If they're healthy, there's nobody in the West wants to see these guys in the spring.

There he goes. Howard Beck falling in love with the Warriors again. Ben Cruz is in here also just agging them on. Stay a quick break and we're going to talk Rockets. And we are back. Yo, this OKC game versus the Rockets was very fun. Two overtimes.

Beck is very nervous about this segment because we were at Crypto.com Arena. We were not watching as much of this game as we normally would. Let's just stipulate. It was a fun game. It was a fun game to watch during, like we had the second screen up

while watching down the stretch. This game took forever. I feel like they didn't end to like midway through the second quarter this Lakers game that we were at. It felt like it. Maybe it was, what did you think?

Great game, but like unfortunate start for NBC after all these years and all the celebrated. You thought it was an unfortunate start? Because of the fact that going double over time on the first game meant they couldn't hold up the second game. You had to, like you just had to go. What's unfortunate, it's not unfortunate. Like they had two really good games.

Like even though the Warriors Lakers game was pretty entertaining. And, you know, like they had a great opening night NBC. Like props to NBC, everything that we saw again in our limited time because we were bouncing around the arena. But, like, NBC had a good night. And getting a double overtime game with defending champs against a Rockets team with Kevin Durant, a legend, like, all good.

But having the games overlap so that now the audience is split between NBC and Peacock, like, not ideal. Yeah. It's not great. And when it was all on Turner, like Turner would sometimes do that thing and we're going to hold up the second game. And then there's a breaking point where it's like, oh, shit.

We'll throw it on TBS. We'll put on TBS. We'll put on true TV for a lot. I haven't watched TBS in five years, but I'll put it on right. I'm going to put it on for this. Just watch the start of Mavericks Celtics. And then a castle rerun or, you know, charmed or something. I don't know.

I don't watch TVS. Never. I haven't watched it in a long time. So that was unfortunate. But they did get a great game. And, you know, you can't, you can't argue with that. By the way, quick aside, as I was thinking about this with these two really good games. Everybody please take a mental note of this so that when people,

start coming with the propaganda about how everybody, all the great games are in the NBA Cup and they play harder for NBA Cup nights. Just remember that the early parts of the season are not just all guys going through the motions. These were two really entertaining games tonight where guys were playing their butts off. Yeah. There are good games that are not NBA Cup games. Before the propaganda campaigns begin, I just want to note that. We got a mini-Rouzer. We got a mini Beck Rand. I'm curious. That was nothing. That was a mini one. We'll see how I see if I can rile them up tonight. But this game had everything you could want in an opening night

and how you open a new channel and a new league partner in the marriage with that. But it also showed me like everything that, everything that I thought about the Rockets good and bad appeared tonight, right? Where Changoon is fucking playing point guard. We got a text from Rajah that I want to read on. That's for Raja to kind of like contribute to the show tonight.

He had to like go to bed early, you know. He said, Sweet dreams, Roger. This was that, uh, this was at 840 Eastern. Bro. Amma, is a man, this reluctant of a shooter? This is wild. And I'm saying this is, this is what my response.

It's really hard when one of your idols joins your team at this stage of your, you know, he's a young guy. Katie is going to probably take the lion's share of the shots. He's definitely going to defer to KD, right? And this was Roger's response. Maybe. But that isn't why he's not shooting. He's afraid to shoot in all caps.

Zero confidence in it tonight. Hopefully this isn't a season long issue, but my gut says it will be. He is turning down easy jumpers. And that's fascinating to me, right? Because that was one of the fears that I had and one of the things that I said on our season preview pod where you want a guy like Amen to grow organically

into what we think he's going to be a great player. But you have an all-timer that plays maybe not your position, but definitely is going to cover up a lot of your spots on the floor, right? And that's something that Udoca is going to have to figure out. But then there's the psyche part of it where in a big moment, he's going to defer to one of the players he grew up watching. It would seem like, right? What is the tension there do you think?

and is that something that we're going to have to look at throughout the season? I can't wait. Raj will be back with us, of course, on Friday for that show. Because I want to go deeper on this with Roger, because he, you know, as a former player, Roger is seeing the game differently than you are. He for sure. He gets more basketball than we could ever know. All of it, right?

But, like, he's so strong. And, like, that text to us to the whole chain would, like, very definitive. It wasn't just an observation of, like, oh, he seems a little bit, like, tentative. It was like, no, he's afraid, and it's going to be a problem all season. And I'm like, wow, you're basing, like, this was in the first half. Yeah. Like, there was a lot of game to go and we've still got a lot of season to go. So that Roger feels that strongly about it.

Raj is not, like, just like firing off crazy hot takes and, like, he's thoughtful about this stuff with us. So I'm very curious why his interpretation of that was so strong. By the way, like, I don't think it was like that passive of a performance by the end of it all because he took 17 shots, Thompson. and he didn't play in the overtimes because he had some cramping issues. I think he'd had a need-any thing, too. I drink your water, man. Gotta drink your water.

Hydrate. So I don't, like I say, I'm curious to go a little deeper on that with Raj on Friday. I do think of Men Thompson's in an interesting spot because partially what you said, right? Like, Kevin Durant's coming in. Like, you're going to be a little deferential

even if you're not intending to be, because that's Kevin freaking Durant. You don't have Fred Van Vliet. There were moments in this game. I can't remember it was like late regulation or early first overtime where the ball's in Jabari Smith's hands. And he comes across half court and he just like stopped, picked up his dribble and he's just stuck. He's pivoting. Oh, timeout.

They like had to burn a time out because he just didn't know where to go. And I'm thinking like, again, not to get crazy with this. But that's one of those moments where you go, oh, Fred Van Blyde. That's where you miss Fred Van Bamblite right there. Or like when you have Shangoon, who was phenomenal tonight, I'm not going to He was great. But you have him doing what he did last year where he has to take the ball full court

and just literally back down a player. I'm not sure you can even do that. There's like a five-second violation. That's the Charles Barkley rule. Right. And he was doing that throughout the overtimes, but like that is not sustainable. And that was the thing that really was scary for me

because honestly, like, OKC could have lost this game. It really wouldn't have meant anything. I know, like, tomorrow if they would have lost the NBA of days of the world, everybody. We talked about this pregame, honestly. I think it was with, I think it was with Malika and Amick, where it was like, what do you think the reaction is going to be tomorrow if this situation happened, right?

And we were going to, if OKC loss, we were going to have the talking heads talking, what's wrong with them? But honestly, it wasn't that big of a deal. Yeah. But OKC, there was some real, excuse me, Houston, there was some real flaws there that, like, I don't know can be rectified anytime soon, right?

like your preseason MVP Reed Shepard was three of 11 night right like not my preseason I don't know I heard you guys really going in on him I wrote my eyes the last you got in the season pre you guys she read Shepard at the preseason I'm like yo chill calm down he always said was he had one good game bro everybody within the rockets I remember hearing it all to the playoffs last year man hey read when he's time when it's his time you know he at this point in his career, he was the, you know, the pregame warm of All-Star who's like hitting everything and you're like, man, if he just gets a shot, we'll see what happens. But like, he's not the answer at least at this point as a full-time point guard there, right? So that means, that's going to

mean is you're probably going to have to put KD as a point guard. I think he is probably the most experienced out of all of them to leading office. But that takes away from what you want him to be. Yeah. The reason why they were bringing Shangoon in there was to make sure that he, that Kevin can get post-ups. But again, that's just such a weird, wonky lineup. Like, I know everybody was, I remember pregame,

everybody was like, yo, did you see the Houston Rockets opening lineup? How tall it is, how big it is? That doesn't, it's not NBA 2K, bro. Like, it doesn't work together. And they're going to have to figure that out. Well, first of all, flashbacks, like,

PJ Carlysmo was, like, roundly just ridiculed for deciding to make Kevin Durant a shooting guard as a rookie. Yeah. And here we all, all these years later at the back end of his career, and we're rolling out a box score with the lineup where it says Kevin Durant, guard. Like, Kevin Durant's shooting guard.

It's fine, right? Like, the labels don't matter nearly as much today as they did when Katie started his career. We are in a positionally fluid era of the NBA, and that's all fine. But, like, someone has to guard the other team's guards. Yeah. Amend Thompson's always going to guard the team's best perimeter player, and he can guard one through five. That's great. Jibari Smith can take on just about anybody.

but Shangoon is only going to guard other bigs. Sorry, Michael Pina. Stephen. I'm sorry. Where's my camera? Is my camera right here for Michael Pina? I'm sorry, buddy. You know, I'll rock with you.

But you got a little bit too much dip on your chip. Stephen Adams is only guarding the opposing center. Who's Kevin Durant guard? Like, who's the other team will have two actual guards? Like, Kevin... This is the defensive condensure with Kevin Durant at this day, bro. where in the postseason, they're either going to try to have him guard a big, or he's going to switch on to Shea Gilgis Alexander,

which literally lost him the game tonight, where he fouls out two free throws for Shea. Got up in the air. Got him up in the air. And you knew it was going to happen, right? He jumped at the first pump fake. But that's something that they're going to have to do with because they're going to attack him defensively. I'm also just worried about the fact that Kevin Durr, not overly concerned,

but like Kevin Durant had to play 47 minutes tonight. And that's double over time, yes, but it was 37 in regulation. That's even high for him at this stage of his career. And the point of the exercise for the Rockets, and I know we've got this now debate about, like, all right, is it about like the youth and their long future together because they've got this great young core, to which I still say, no, you got Kevin Durant for now. And that's why I still think they need to go out and get a Fred Van Blit replacement at some point. Like, you, you don't want to, you cannot burn out Kevin Durant in the early parts of a season in which the whole point of the exercise was to have him for the playoffs. Well, this is the thing that, about Kevin Durant, like, and the Kevin Durant move that would have, that would concern, right? And we always talk about this on the podcast when it's time to push the butt.

And what I mean by that is, like, OKC was, was faced with this a couple of years ago. Remember when they were really good? I think it was, it was, it was two years ago when everybody was like, Did they make a move at the deadline? Should they trade somebody? And like, OK, see, if you talk to anybody around, okay, see, they were like, no, we're standing back. We like the group that we have. And it paid off, right?

Yeah. And we talk about the Warriors. Andre de Iguidalla was a move that pushed the button. Yeah. Right. But you don't want to do that too early. You want to do it at the right time. You push the button on Kevin Durant.

You're putting championship expectations on a roster that still needs to grow in a lot of areas. Yeah. And that's what's concerning to me because you're going to, It has the potential, this is just one game, but it has the potential to stunt Amman Thompson's growth, and he's supposed to be your guy, right? You don't have a point guard, so you're not able to really maximize what KD can do on your offense.

And then you have real issues, like down the stretch, I think, you know, of a season when you're playing against the Yoke, when you're playing against the O KC, and you don't have a defensive anchor at all. And so we'll see, right? But these were the concerns that I had for the Rockets preseason. And it's one game, but it really, there was some real concern. And look, they put up points on the board.

They put up points. They had 124. But they have to really, this is going to be a real big task for MAU doka. Now, like, he can get people in line. And I know he's great on X's and O's, but he's going to have to figure out how to have this roster adjust to a system that's going to be sustainable. Because this was, there were a lot of flaws in this iteration of them right now. To your point, in a world where they don't trade for Kevin Durant,

and obviously, you know, now Jalen Green and Dillen Brooks are still probably on the roster. And the whole rotation looks a little different. Jalen Green, you have the whole struggle of like how much should the ball be in his hands because those possessions sometimes go awry. But in a world where they did not push the button, if you and Fred Van Vleet still goes down in the off season, what are we going to do? Well, we got no mandate to win anything now. We don't have to make a deep run now. You know what? Let's just, you know, Amend Thompson's played point card in his past. Like, amend, it's yours, man.

Like, we've got a whole year to experiment with you there and see how much you can grow to that role at this level, at the NBA level. And if Van Blyte's back healthy next year, maybe he plugs back in. In the meantime, Amens now developed those skills that much more. Yeah. And you could just use the year to develop that. But there's an urgency now to where like it fucking has to work. Yeah. Because we need, we projected out as a top two, three team in the West. And we've got a guy who's an all-time great in his twilight.

This might be his last great season or maybe there's one more. And it was tough too, man, because he was dealing. Like there was a, I saw Katie where he did the old school two, uh-a-a-crossovers and just hit his shot. I was like, damn, he still had, he was sick, right? Yeah, it's still there. But you could just see how dejected he was when he fouled out. That was, that was really tough to watch. He looked dejected and he looked tired.

Yeah. And after 47 minutes at that age with the miles he's got on him, he should be. For sure. Let's talk about OKC real quick. I was impressed with the opening that Chet had, but there are still some defensive woes that he has to kind of overcome, right? Like, Shangoon was paying his lunch. Just bullying him.

But I was impressed. by how they finished. They, like, ring nights are really hard for the team that is getting the ring, right? And Katie typically plays really good when he goes back to OKC. He really thrives in that environment. So you have all these things kind of coming at you. I was impressed that they were able to win in the way that they won.

And they're going to have to slug out a lot of games with J-dub out and really kind of figure out, you know, from what I'm here, I think the OKC is kind of, kind of bringing him along slowly from that wrist up, day-du. He wants to play, but they're kind of bringing him along and figuring that out. So he'll be back at some point in the future, in the very near future. But I think they can sustain.

Like, I think Chet has to continue to, to play well offensively, but he has to get back great defensively. We'll see what happens. But I think O.K.C. is in a fine place. I think I think Houston needed this game more than O.K. Yeah, I mean, for sure. Chad Holmgren, 28.7 rebounds, two assists. Sorry, like six of six.

I got a slack from my editor, Isaac, was like, yo, Chad is cooking. He's cooking. But that's what you're going to need from him with Jada about, right? For however much longer it's going to be. Kaysen Wallace filled in well, like did his usual around. Yeah. Kason 14.

Seven rebounds, five assists, four steals. You know, like you know he's a great defensive. player. You know there's a little bit of offensive pop there, some development still to go there. But like, they've got so much great depth. Like you're not, I don't worry about the thunder in general, certainly not defensively at all. Offensively, if there's at least one other guy who pops on a given night tonight, it was Chet Holmgren, they're fine. I was actually thinking about the emotions of a ring night from the opposite side, which is, you know, a very young Kevin Durant with Russell Westbrook and James Hardin and Sergie Bach and got to the finals and lost. And then Hardin gets

traded and the Thunder, you know, below a three to one lead against the Warriors and the next, and then KD leaves for the war, whatever. And KD is now there, like cruel twist of fate of the schedule. Like, you know, they should have to start a five this year for KD, bro. They should have did, they should have did that. Netflix. Netflix. Hey, watch real ones on Netflix starting. We know how much, we know how much KD loves to be psychoanalyzed, especially by you. No, I mean, listen, like, KD having to watch a ring night as the visiting player. For a franchise he built. In a lot of ways, yeah.

I mean, that's, that's, and where he's getting booed. And you saw, like, you know, the cameras caught him booing back at them. Which in this stage of your career, like, you don't, you know, I mean, to tell Kevin Dredd, you don't need to boo back. That's like telling him you don't need to tweet back either. But I think that, like, it's like the relationship between Katie and Oklahoma City is just, it's, it's, really just it's a lot man like i remember going to games when he his i wasn't at his return game but i remember going to games where he returned to okay c and just the way that like i think that's a that's a scar that's i don't never gonna i don't think that's never gonna fully heal

because of i mean there's a lot of different things that are you know nuanced and um you know he did leave like for the the the uh i got i got ben here so i'm i'm trying i know that like he left for the team that everybody hated right like and i get it but i know in his mind he's like yo man like this they that was a home that really rejected him yeah and from a human level that's a tough pill to swallow, right? And I get the, I get that. And I know that, no, he's, we've talked about this, um, where just like, he, he felt, he still feels he deserves to have his, uh, his jersey retired in okay C and he does.

But I don't think it'll ever be the same, right? Like, how do you, like, from a, it's weird to see somebody like boo you like that when you he's really the reason why that and he had help right sam presti uh russell westbrook james hardin had helped building that but he was the face of that of growing basketball in oklahoma city right and not even just like growing the game of basketball there like he helped that community after a tornado after a really bad national disaster and then like you boo him like that you burn the man's jersey Like, that's got to be tough. And then the league's trolling ass is going to put him, make him see that.

On ring night. On ring night. That's so wild. Right. I get it for the ratings, right? I get it for NBC. People got to get paid. But that is really.

Right. Like you couldn't have sent Denver there. That's so fucked up. He got to see that. Like, he couldn't make it happen. And I know, like, of all of the places I think he wanted to do, and this is me talking. I think he wanted to win a ring for them the most at the time, right? Because that was the biggest attachment that he had.

And at the end of the day, it's just the game. You know what I mean? And for them to, like, do that, I thought it was kind of whack. I get it. But, like, it's still kind of whack. I don't know if the league was consciously thinking of, like, having Katie there for ring night and the emotions and how difficult that would be. I think it's more just like, we need somebody.

on opening night who is going to be an intriguing matchup for the Thunder, you've got a couple choices. You could go with, like, Denver and Houston at the time, like, before Van Vleek goes down, they were like co-favor to be the number two team, the biggest challenger, to the Thunder. So picking from one of those two made sense, right?

It's not going to be an Eastern Conference team, most likely. You already decided like Steph and LeBron were going to play each other. LeBron obviously was out tonight, but Stefan Luca playing each other. Like, you had that matchup set. I get it. You could get there as a scheduling, without it having to be like, ooh,

Kevin Durant, like, he has to go watch them, like, Adam Silver just couldn't help himself, bro. I get it. It's wrestling. I do think it's like, I've thought about this, too. Like, I don't know that Katie gives a crap about this the way that we do. But the fact that he is kind of like a superstar without a home, right? Like, Oklahoma rejects him and boos him still.

He rejected the Warriors after winning two championships with them. Brooklyn was a disaster. Phoenix was a disaster. Now he's in Houston. And it really is one of those strange things where like, yeah, LeBron moved around. But like, and we probably will always think about LeBron as more of a cavalier than anything, right?

Two separate stints, plus their first championship in a bazillion years. And, you know, there were some sore feelings with Miami, but Miami, I think Miami still loves LeBron. L.A. clearly loves LeBron. Cleveland absolutely adores LeBron despite burning his jersey way back in the day. You know what I think it is, though?

Their difference. LeBron has done a way better job. I would say, how do I, how do I phrase this? I think he's done a way better job of promoting the mythology of himself. Well, just managing. And managing, and then managing as well. But I think specific, and I get what you're saying about Phoenix. And he's had a weird career.

And I know it. I've seen it firsthand. You've seen it firsthand. But like last year or two years ago, whenever it was, when he made his first return back to the Bay Area, and he, like, again, he had a weird exit and a terrible exit for some fans in Golden State, and they still gave him a standing ovation, right?

Yeah. Because he brought him to a championship. Yeah, but there was still class there, man. And that was just, it was just disappointing that, after all these years, they still, like, that OKC crowd did that to him. I would guess if, like, if KD had announced before the season, this is my last run, and like, he'd have one more game in Oklahoma, right?

Because you know, two home, two road against every Western Conference team. But like, if, if this were farewell, I think he would have gotten some sort of tribute video and they'd be cheering for him. Maybe. Like, I think they, but like, I don't know, man, because they did the cupcake shit. You know what I mean? They did all. That's, that's years ago, right. But no, no, but I'm saying.

I think they boo because it's fun to boo. No, I think it's deeper. Very much so. I mean, like, it was like that when you're, like, telling someone that when you're covering the Warriors at the time that you're from California covering this team in an Uber in Oklahoma City, it was a treacherous task. It's deeper than that and it runs deeper than that. It was, I just thought it was, I just really thought, and me and Kevin have had like our spats, obviously. I'm just, but I'm just calling a spade, a spade, you know, and I just thought it was whack. And that's just what I thought from the whole thing.

Like, yo, man, he's Kevin Durant. I hope it works in Houston. I really do. I really do too. The guy's been an amazing player to watch. He's had a complicated career, but an incredible career. And this should absolutely be the final chapter. So, you know, I don't know what it ultimately looks like.

I don't know if they've got what it takes in the next year or two to beat Oklahoma. I'm not sure anybody does. Yeah. But I hope it's, you know. I hope that I don't think it's going to happen but I hope okay C makes that right they should like

They will I don't I don't think that's a guarantee I think I think maybe the city won't want it as much as the organization I think the organization is a classy organization They'll do the right thing And whenever he calls it a career I think they'll honor him

Yeah one can only hope Speaking of complicated careers let's talk about MJ's butting television in the next segment and we are back last segment

because me and bed got to go to sleep bro I've been a long-ass day Raja Bell has already been in bed for like five hours he's sleeping great he's sleeping I went to the chance show yesterday

and I know I'm getting older because I was kept looking at the time like damn bro I could really get eight hours right now. And I didn't get home to like one and only got like six hours. I'm looking forward to sleeping it. But speaking of Chicago, and one of Chicago is great to talk about Michael Jordan. So he did the, so it was funny, we came into the theater after the game or after we left the Lakers game. And Cliff, I think it was Cliff who brought up the Michael Jordan segment, or maybe you did with one of the articles. And immediately,

I was just like, this can't be good, right? Like, this is like, what is Michael doing? What the hell is going on? So I wanted to watch it because I wanted to talk about it before we got here. And you put it on the laptop right there. And I was ready to hate so bad. I was like, yo, this is terrible. And I watched, it was a three-minute segment with Torrico.

And it was brilliant. He was talking about the reason why he came back. He wanted to pay it forward to the league. They asked him. Tariko asked Mike about the last time you played it, a shot of basketball. It was a legendary story because Mike always want to tell you how much motherfucking money he got.

And he was like, you know, I rented a mansion and the owner wanted his kids to come over. And he was like... At the writer, it felt like a weird space jam sequel, right? Like, you know, he gave me a ball. And I was really nervous to shoot. Do you think he was actually nervous or is he like, is this like fake modesty?

like or is he oh man is he so far because he's talking about it in the last segment you're a superstar when you know how to be great with your own mythology yeah lebron was good at it Kobe was amazing at it lebron is was amazing and it's like it's a little on the fence right now right but it was a great interview he talked about how much he missed the game he talked about like it was very emotional and it feels like i came away thinking after watching that clip after all these years, like, it feels like Mike wants to be a part of something, right? Like, for years, he's been with the league, but he's kind of hovered, pun intended, over the league. He doesn't really go to games that much.

He doesn't really do many interviews like that. You can kind of see him sometimes at a Hornets game, but, like, he's just closed off. And it felt like a guy that still, like, you could kind of see it at the 75th anniversary. I'm sure somebody's going to do a profile on Mike, hopefully is right, Thompson, who can, like, kind of give us some context to all of this stuff that's going on. But from what I see, it felt like after that 75th anniversary, when he's, like, round the guys, he felt, it felt like a beginning of, like, oh, I love the camaraderie here.

And then you see him at the Hall of Fame recently. Like, he's fucking chiming it up with Doug Collins, right, who's in a walker, right? And he's seeing, like, hey, Michael Cooper, hey, such and such. and he's like kind of being a part of the game again. And again, I wanted to come into this to be like, what is Mike doing? Is he having this, like, crisis or something? But it felt like he just wanted to be back a part of the game.

Like, he don't need the bread. Yeah. It felt like he wanted to be part of the family again. It's easy to be cynical about it and wonder, like, what does MJ possibly need with this? And considering that he has, for most of his post-playing career, stayed out of the limelight, not wanted it. And by the way, during his post, during his playing career,

he still hovered above the league. Like I think about even an anecdote, he wasn't even in video games until, I think, 2012 when he did NBA 2K12, where he had his own licensing agreement aside from the players, and he just wouldn't, you know, like, forgot about that.

I would have to create Michael Jordan on NBA Live, bro, or he would be like that random dude on the Bulls at like 99 overall, but it wasn't Mike. Like he would always try to, it was the league and Michael Jordan. He spent years as the Hornets owner without ever doing local media, Right. Like, like, not even the perfunctory.

Like, I think there was like one time he invited like Oprah like once. Yeah. He would occasionally like have some little quick roundtable with like 20 people at it or whatever. Like, and that's it. But it was, he's been very, very, very rarely heard from since retiring, since his famous last infamous Hall of Fame speech when he was inducted. Like there hasn't been a lot. We obviously we had the last dance, but that was a completely, you know, Jordan controlled. You know, I don't want to say completely Jordan controlled. It was brilliant propaganda. It was brilliant propaganda. It was riveting.

I loved the series. No, no, I fucking loved the series. It was great. But we know that Michael, obviously, was able to just tell things the way he wanted to. Yeah. Let's leave it at that. He has very rarely been heard from, and certainly not in a setting where it's an interviewer and him sitting down and you can hear a back and forth. And you can hear follow-ups and not just something that is completely controlled.

And so I don't know where this goes from here, Logan. Like, I'm really curious to see what their use of Michael is. How many of these segments are they going to do? They're calling it MJ Insights to Excellence. And it's these taped segments with him and Tariko. I assume it's going to be Tariko the whole time. I think they probably just do, they just canned one video. They probably just like at one like hour session,

they'll just keep cutting it up into these three-minute segments. They could last the whole season, right? Like, do the math. I'm sure that works. I don't know where else they go with this. I'm with you as we watched it here tonight before we started taping. We both were like, oh, man, this seems really heartfelt, right? Like, his saying, I've got an obligation to the game of basketball.

I'm paying it forward. Okay, I think I kind of buy that. Like, maybe he's missing it. And I do think, actually, the one thing that struck me most, if there's nothing else that I think I have learned in a very long time now covering this league, just started season 29 for me tonight, it's that guys like Michael and Kobe was this way to are wired differently than a 98% of the players in the NBA, where when he says how much he misses the game, that shit's

genuine. And you can see it in his face. You can hear it in his voice. There are some guys that it is so embedded in them that walking away is hard, staying away is hard, not picking up the ball is hard. Just like, I think part of his distance is maybe just because he can't be in it the way he wants to be in it. And like they're not all wired that way. I guarantee you, folks. Not every professional basketball player is wired that way. There is a sliver of them who are so married to the game, so passionate about it, who are so driven by it that they cannot extricate it from the rest of their being. And that is Michael. And so I do think there was value in like kind of hearing and seeing him talk about that tonight. Like that hit me. But the butt is that I don't know

where else they go with this. And we pulled up off announcing their summation of this. And the very last line was where I just went, oh, no. After the segment, NBC teased more from the Jordan sit down during next week's telecast. The network plans to air MJ's opinions on load management. We don't need it. We don't, like, we have heard every 90s and early 2000s player to the, like, every single one of them is checked in already on load management and modern ways of like, you know, managing minutes or, we don't need it.

We don't need any more. We don't need anybody else from the 90s to talk about how. players today should all play 82 games and 40 minutes a game and we were manlinger back in the day i don't we don't how does this how do we how do we how do we how do we do it right then like what what what is the right way to do this because i do want to like the thing is also i want to hear from mike you know i i do want to hear what he has to say like that's the other thing about this like i want to hear his ups and downs his flaws like i don't want to i don't want to hear like yeah a disnification of it.

I want to hear Mike. He's the greatest player. I don't know, man. There's a lot of people that are going to say, like, LeBron and all these things, right? But like, consensusly, like, from a certain generation, he is the greatest player, right? And Kareem is accessible, more accessible than Mike is.

Kareem wasn't for a very long time and then it became more so. Sure. I'm talking about at the stage that Michael is in right now, you could actually, like, feel you could touch Kareem, right? And even in the video, like, I was like, damn, is this AI like, is this really Jordan talking on this? I know, it looked, it looked somehow strange.

It looked wild. Because, like, he doesn't talk, right? And I get it, man. Like, you look at the last dance where he was a guy, like, he was so famous, like, could not come out of his dressing room at all, right? There was always somebody that wanted something from him. And he's been able to live a quiet life. Like, I think the game needs him.

I don't really, I don't really, if it's produced like that, and I know we was hating because we had this conversation before this podcast, the pre-pod. And I was like, I don't know if I want to hear but maybe I do want to hear Michael Jordan, just talk. I think I want to hear him in 2025, just talk. And maybe be an old man. It was really cool.

It was really compelling for 10 hours during the pandemic. Why not? Why not? It depends on what they do with it, right? Like, you know, if you and I got the chance to sit down with Michael right now, like what would we ask? I'm trying to do it like the cigar fishing. I don't do.

Like, he was hell of good. I want to interview like that from Mike in 2025. But like, all right, I want to hear his thoughts on Anthony Edwards who gets so many comparisons to him. Yeah. But I don't want to just hear like, oh, I see similarities in style or whatever. I want to hear what it takes to actually be able to live up to that. Yeah. And listen, there was, you know, a decade and a half at least of everybody asking who was going to be the next Michael.

It was starting when Michael was still in his prime. Yeah. And we did the whole Air Jordan. H-E-I-R, Jordan, right? And, you know, was Kobe and Harold Minor and T-Mack and Vince and Grant Hill and all these people and nobody could ever live up to it and Kobe came closest. But like, I don't know how often Michael talked about it back then. He probably did at times. It's been a long time since anybody brought up the like, hey, listen, we start doing this thing and it's understandable for us to do it, right? Oh man, Anthony Edwards sometimes looks like it. Anthony Edwards

even embraces it. I want to know what Michael thinks of like attempting that and does he think that's even a good idea and how difficult does he think that is and how difficult was it for you being compared to Dr. J or Elgin Baylor or whoever it might have been during his time. I want to hear that. I want to hear, I don't want to hear him on load management. I don't necessarily want to hear him about the three point proliferation either because it's another one that old men from the 90s, this is, by the way, it's my generation's fault, right? It's Gen X who are like clinging to the fucking 90s and at a different brand of basketball and being all cranky about I want an NBC to get the rights again for that same reason.

Yeah, I mean, but the crankiness is from people holding on to the basketball that we grew up on, and then includes the players as well as the fans. So, but I do want to hear his thoughts on like the style of play, right? Like, rather than hear him bitch about load management, and listen, I don't want to prejudge because we haven't heard it yet. But I'd rather hear like, listen, the rationale for a lot of this is the game has played at a much higher pace now than in your day, Michael. Yeah. It has played a much more spread out. than your day, Michael, because of the three-point game.

And guys have to cover a lot more ground, and they're running more miles per game. Also, they're coming in really specialized. I want to hear his thoughts on what it is like, would it be like to try to guard in today's game? Because he was an elite defender. How much harder would it have been for you, knowing how much ground you got to cover?

Also, by the way, how do you feel about all the specialization that, like, as Baxter Holmes wrote very well several years ago, is the specialization early on and all the minutes the guys are logging before they get to the NBA that are causing the injuries in the NBA. Like, I want to hear... Or did you see like this. This onslaught of European basketball coming when you played in the Olympics.

Yeah. Hey, let's get Tariko on a plane and back to Florida. But like, listen, for all we know, Mike has asked him a lot of these things. I mean, he's a great interviewer. Like, even, like, that's another thing that I really. I love that Tariko's back on the NBA. Fuck, yeah, man. Like, I don't, I think there's a, I would just say, like, from everything I've heard pregame and, like, talking to folks.

Like, I think there's a real excitement for Tariko to be just involved in this. I think you saw that, at least personally during the Olympics, when you saw the NBC apparatus and the storytelling and all of that. But there was just a calmness with those two. It was a real dance. So I didn't trust Toriko to be able to guide the ship and ask the right question. Right. Right. We don't need it to be more mythologizing. We got the 10 hours of the last dance. We don't need it to be old man shaking his fist at the cloud either. So like, I do, I'm curious to see where it goes. I was a little skeptical of like, what is this all about? Why are they bringing Michael back with NBC? Is this just a nostalgia play because it's NBC? And we got John Tesh and round ball rock.

So we'll bring in Michael too. It has to be more than that. And you know, like, Michael has, like, a special relationship with NBC, right? Especially with Dick Eversall. So, like, I think he would only come back for NBC, and there's a nostalgia there because he basically, like, made NBC as a, as a, and helped grow them into what we, and what we think it was and the reason why we wanted it back so much a lot of it had to do with Michael.

Yeah. And so there's a symmetry there. I like it. I just can't, I'm really curious to see how this plays out. because like I said, I want to hear what Michael has to say. And I trust Toriko to be able to do that. For sure. So we'll see what happens, man.

I don't know what timing is because I don't have the clock near me, but I know that V and C got a lot of work to do, and I want to go to sleep. So that has been another edition of real ones. I'm Logan Murdoch, aka Logie Boo, not the two. That is Howard motherfucking Beck. Shout out Joanne. She was really friend of the show, Joanne.

She was really pissed that I didn't. Motherfuck. She was concerned. She was concerned that I didn't motherfucker Beck. And I was just like, it's some season preview. I don't want to come in too hot. Nobody heard from you for two months. You've been off and like you came back and you were like kind of just like.

I was just seeing it. I was trying to ease my way. And I wanted to quit like 25, 5 and 5, you know. Now, you know, maybe I get you 40 one of these times. But anyways, that was, we'll be back on Friday with, with Raja. And, you know, we'll see you guys soon, man. Real ones. I, all this shit.

Bye. You.