The Ringer NBA Show - NBA Panic Meter | Group Chat

Episode Date: November 12, 2023

Justin, Rob, and Wos join to discuss their varying concerns about the teams that have struggled throughout the first three weeks of the NBA season. They start with the Los Angeles Clippers and explore the impact of the James Harden addition and what needs to change for them to find success (4:22). Later, they cover the Memphis Grizzlies' disastrous start to the season and address their serious lack of success on the offensive end (27:22). Then, they talk about the Milwaukee Bucks' defensive struggles and examine their coaching, effort, and personnel issues (34:27). Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny Lambre Producer: Jack Sanders Additional Production Supervision: Ben Cruz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What would you do if you got scammed? Would you suffer in silence, or would you do something about it? Well, I got scammed once, and this is the story of what I did. I'm Justin Sales, the host of the Wedding Scammer, a true crime podcast from The Ringer. And for seven episodes, we're hunting a comment. A guy with a lot of aliases, a guy who's ruined a lot of weddings. And with the help of some friends, I just might be able to catch him. Listen to The Wedding Scammer on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.

Group chat. I am Justin Verrier, joining me, as always, Rob Mahoney, big Waz. I got to say, I was looking at your Instagram before we came on here, and I thought, he might be a little low today considering you were out last night, but, man, you were fresh as a daisy, sprightly even. Listen, guys, that's the beauty of having an event during the day. So I was done by 9.30, at home by 10, in bed by 11. It was incredible. I woke up at 6.30 this morning. Just the picture of sleep hygiene right there.

Incredible. Made breakfast, everything. Everything was firing on all cylinders. But I have to confess, Friday night, I landed from New York, was home for like an hour and a half and immediately went out and met up with some friends. Not the best idea. So yesterday, I essentially, I drank one beer and five or six, seven waters. And so, yeah, like, that's the key kids. That's the key kids.

Just, just go out the night before and be forced into responsible behavior. Yes, sir. I just thought you were like Steve Nash and you had just gotten professional about the way you've handled your, you're on and off court responsibilities, and that you'd be able to peek in these sorts of moments, despite whatever happened. Is that not what he's saying? I guess so. I'm able to, but I was definitely aided.

by my own Friday night activities and being like, yeah, today is not a day to play around, especially with a, you know, basically a 9 a.m. be ready time. So, yeah, I feel great. Feel amazing. That was another good part about it. I got to catch up on a lot of in-season tournament yesterday during the day.

It was just great. Just a great calm day yesterday. Well, I'm glad you got the calm out of the way because I know today we're all panic here on group chat. We're ratching the levels up. We're sounding the alarms. We're making crucial phone calls on red phones, screaming into them looking for help.

Justin, like, what do we have in store today exactly? That's right. So today's panic meter. If the other day was the positivity, the sprightly, the encouraging surprises, today are the teams we have to worry about or maybe not worry about. We have five teams on the docket.

And for this, I've created our own panicked. meter, I basically appropriated the DEFCON system. So 5 being the most okay. You don't have to worry. Everything is fine. One being the most like just nuclear level disaster. DefCon 5, we will look at as small sample size theater. Nothing to see here. DefCon 4. You have part of my attention. You have the minimum amount. DefCon 3. Rob has to reluctantly write a blog post about it. Keyword reluctantly, I would say. DefCon 2. Ramona Shelburne publishes a big feature entitled Courage under fire, hurt feelings,

and too many options at the Cheesecake Factory, why Team X is standing at the crossroad. So the team would be in such disarray that that sort of feature comes out. DefCon 1 is Fire Everyone in All Caps. All caps crucial. Yeah. I mean, yeah, where is fire everyone lowercase? Is that, is that like between Defcons 1 and 2? I would say between you writing a blog post and the big old honk in ESPN future. Okay, good to know.

All right. Well, surprisingly enough, we have to start with the Los Angeles Clippers, a team that after only three games of the James Hardin experiment finds itself on the panic meter, O and 3 with Hardin, first two games couldn't break 100 against the two New York teams and then gave up 144 to Dallas the other day. including a 69 to 25 run. I should mention before we get into this that we're recording it's at 10 a.m. Pacific time.

I believe they're playing the Grizzlies in about two hours here. So we'll factor in that game. Well, I mean, it's great news for the clippers. Like, hope is the thing with feathers for our friends of the Los Angeles clippers. Like, if when you're down bad, play the Memphis Grizzlies. Because I assure you there are teams in this world

whose lot is a little bit worse than yours. That's true. Was, where are you on the clippers after only a few games? Are you worried? Where are you on the panic meter? I mean, I was definitely down on the trade from the beginning just because of the redundancies that are presented by having James Hardin on this particular team, right? One, Kawhi Leonard, the best player on the team has never been a guy who needed to be set up. So theoretically, the things that James Hardin does well.

For instance, things that he did well for Joelle Embed, like just an incredible pick and roll partner for Joel. Kauai doesn't need that. Neither does Paul George. So what was James Harden doing to elevate them? And then finally, a team, you know, gets Russ to play in a sort of optimal way. And James Harden plays the exact same position as him. And we've seen it again when Russ was in L.A., the reason why he couldn't play there, because him and LeBron played the same position.

And obviously, LeBron is 10 times better than him at it. And you can credibly say James Hardin is better than him. at that position. So now you marginalize Russ. James Hardin has never been a guy, even if Philly and the best of times, refused. We talked about it on this show.

Refused to take a spot-up jumper. Just has to dribble it, has to do something with it. Can't just catch and shoot. Yeah, a few of those record scratches for him already. Just like not taking those shots. And so it's not surprising that early on this hasn't looked like it's humming

because it was an awkward fit to begin with. And so for me, me, I'm at a DefCon 2, for sure. I don't think people need to be fired necessarily, but like, I don't think this is going to get better fast.

I'll say that. DefCon 2, after three games. Yeah. You would have to write a blog post about it, though. I would say we're out of three. The person, and also, Rob, but also Rob, you got to consider the personalities involved, too.

Sure. When it comes to Hardin, when it comes to Russ. I don't know if you guys noticed this at the start of the Clipper-Laker game where, you know, right before Tip where everybody does the obligatory DAP, Russ was on the opposite sideline as to avoid dapping up his former teammates.

Right. Okay? That's just good planning. You know? Well, yes, it is. Minimized confrontation by removing yourself from the problematic areas. Right.

So if these are where a bunch of go along to get along. Let's just say these were like four Tim Duncan's or four Steph Curry's, right? The, you know, the fact that these pieces were clunky and how they fit would bother me a lot less.

But when you compound the fit issues with the personalities involved, that's when I become even more worried. Man, four Tim Duncans. I mean, one, what a team, two, what a land party, that would be. That's true. Yeah, I think the biggest,

concern is that after the Dallas loss, Paul George was talking about how he was lamenting going into the game thinking that he had to be the glue guy. And I guess it's good that he is since corrected that thinking, but the fact that he was already trying to work his way around Hardin or change what he does to fit Hardin or even Russ is the biggest concern for me because it does feel like Russ in particular, who has this long, long, long track record of being hardheaded, Rob. He doesn't seem like he's doing much of a change. Hardin is to a certain extent, but also, is it moving a lot off the ball? He never has, Justin.

He never has done that before. Yeah. But the net result of both of those things, of Hardin and Russ being who they are, I mean, I think it's reasonable for Paul George to come to the assumption that he was supposed to be the glue guy because who else is going to do it? And because of that, he really has looked like a total afterthought, offensively for the Clippers in some of these stretches and in some of these games. It's been disastrous considering before the Hardin Trade, he was playing so well.

He was scoring in bunches. He looked awesome, looked explosive, looked good in ISO. I was really impressed with what we were seeing from Paul George. And to see that consolidated in addition to Russ being minimized, in addition to Kauai being put in some awkward positions sometimes where he just kind of like parked in the corner waiting for a pass that may never come. It's a lot of weirdness right now. but it's so early, and this is such a dramatic change for the clippers,

you have to remember that not only are they incorporating another high usage ball handler type in James Hardin, but they've never had a point guard even remotely like this basically during this entire Clipper era. This isn't a team that's accustomed to this style. I would think that James Hardin is going to take time or need time to get up to speed. I would think the Clippers are going to need time

to figure out how to play with that kind of guard. I would think this team collectively is going to need time to sort out the, rotations of who plays when. Like we're starting to see kind of, you know, some staggering in terms of hard and playing with the second unit a little bit, you know, without like specifically Kauai and Russ, which I think will help. But a lot of this stuff is just going to take a minute.

And I'm at an easier level of concern. I'm probably more of a DefCon 4 right now just because it's so, so early. But the indicators are pretty bad. And if those do not change quickly, I think we're going to start ratcheting up the alarm in in pretty short order here. So on our last episode, I think it was our last episode, we briefly talked about the Pacers

and how they're playing, right? And I get it. I'm obsessed with the Pacers. But if a team can make Obie topping feel like he has ownership of an offense, it's by nature of the system of ball they're playing. With Hardin, it's this ball domination. It's not going to move.

They don't have this movement-based structure. It's a structure based on guys individually beating their one-on-one matchup or individually, you know, crushing a pick and roll. It's not necessarily continuity and movement-based where everybody is part of the whole on every single possession. And that's why I'm just like, I don't think they're going to institute that. Like, that just doesn't seem plausible, given the pieces involved. And we've said it a trillion times about Russ and Hardin specifically.

And Hardin, he did the whole show about he played within the system. It's nonsense, man. It was the Houston thing with an MVP on your freaking team who was way better than you. So, of course, you passed the ball. He wasn't playing some vastly different version of Hope from what he played before in Brooklyn and Houston. And the same with Russ. It's like the times that we've seen him thrive recently. Houston had to trade every single center on their roster.

Kauai and Paul George had to go down in the freaking playoffs. Like the context that these guys have thrived in has been so specific, man, and had to be so, you know, tailor-made for the style of play they insist upon playing. You know, I don't know how a change is brought on. Maybe Tailu has the cachet to be like, yo, guys, we got to do something different than this. Who knows? I think there were some shades of difference in Brooklyn and Philly from Houston, right? It wasn't fully James Harton, ISO ball in quite the same way.

But he had the ball all day every day, Rob. Inarguably, ball in his hands all the time. The idea that he was not put in a position to make plays is fucking ridiculous. It's absurd. Absolutely ridiculous. But, again, when things were really clicking in Brooklyn, they were clicking in a way where the ball was in James' hands, and it worked because Kyrie and Katie were moving.

Paul George plays that way and can absolutely thrive that way. Russ usually does not. Kauai will run off some basic stuff and can be a weapon, but he's a more methodical player who, if you're playing to his strength, is not necessarily operating in that fashion. Like, he's not a quick fire come off the curl and release guy. And can't Kauai even do that kind of stuff?

Like, all of this moving around on that, gimpie, like, I don't even know if I want him doing that. Yeah. Well, I think he made the key point about the role. players there. And the clip of Terrence man glaring from underneath his phone is Hardin came to the locker room. He's amended that situation. Well, I mean, he's issued a statement.

Whether or not he regrets it or not, it seems like ominous foreshadowing because the effect that these guys have had and Hardin in particular on some of the role players is like noticeable. Norm Powell is basically a shell of himself since Hardin has got to the team.

He has the worst plus minus on the team, like just ghastly numbers since there. He kind just looks a man out of country, just doesn't know what he's doing out there. And I also think if there's a takeaway from the Dallas game is that the foursome was a slight positive in that game, but any of the other players were just giant negatives. And any time you tried to mix and match with these guys,

it just was awful. There was a lineup at one point they tried out there, which was Bones Highland, Russell Westbrook, Norm Powell, Terrence Mann, and PJ Tucker. Like, I don't think any of those players towered beyond like, nine. And on the one hand, they're dealing with the Mason Plumlin injury, which was a bad timing, and it seems like Harden in particular is feeling the effects of that most, or at least saying that he's feeling the effects of that most because he's used to playing with the big and the pick and

roll. On the other hand, I just, I don't know. Like, how do you make sense of these team, like the remaining parts of this team with those guys? It just seems like a very complicated Jenga piece at this point, Rob. Yeah, I think some of those mismatched kind of lineups you're describing where we're just like throwing out a bunch of guards and PJ Tucker. I think some of that was like they were getting

absolutely destroyed by the Mavs. Like that game was over before it even really had a chance to start. And so they were behind the eight ball so much offensively like how do we get scoring on the floor? Because we just gave Dallas like a 50 point second quarter. Right. They tried to blitz at a certain point because they couldn't do anything else. Yeah.

They're pretty desperate in that circumstance. But I this is a team that's going to have those moments. And all of these things we're saying about Hardin and his effect on Russ and his effect on the composition of the starting lineup, it all trickles down, right? When you have James Hardin, Norm Powell is just a less vital player in your offense. Bones Highland is not going to have the opportunities to do the things that Bones Highland loves to do. So your key reserves right now, again, with Mason Plumley out, like, this team is not great

shakes on the bench. they don't have like a murderer's row of guys coming in. And the guys that they do have are now less valuable and less impactful because of the new construction of your team. So they're going to need to figure some things out pretty quickly in terms of like who actually can work together. But the days of like the plug and play, we have so many options. Clippers, those days are done.

This is a team that's going to have to play like pretty specific lineups with very mindful spacing and ball distribution to make this thing work. Yeah. And look, I think, Todd. Lou, ultimately, I feel like he's probably going to start going with these smaller ball lineups supercharged and just spreading people out and being like, I don't think you have enough perimeter defenders to guard Paul George, Kauai Leonard, and James Hardin at the same time. But Russ can't be in those lineups. It's just the fact of life. Sorry.

Yeah. So Lou, after the game against Dallas, says, I'm telling you, it's going to be good. That's all right, we'll be all right. They better take advantage of it now, which is very reminiscent of Dion Sanders after getting blown out by Oregon. I'm coming. I'm coming. Which, I don't know if you've seen Colorado recently, but I think they've lost four in a row.

So didn't actually work out, but maybe down the road they could figure this out. All right, let's flip now to the New Orleans Pelicans, a team that I am definitely in the DefCon 2 region. Sheesh. Really? Obviously, there's something missing with this team.

And clearly they're a roster because they're hurt. Thank you. You stepped on the joke. There are many someone's missing on this team, including potentially like a starting lineup. But there's just like there's a lack of life to this team that I'm particularly concerned about. They don't rebound the ball.

They don't share the ball particularly well. They aren't shooting the ball particularly well. They aren't getting into the paint all that well despite having Zion and Brandon Ingram. And my biggest concern, honestly, is that. the Ingram-Zion pairing just hasn't been effective at this point, especially on offense. And I think the play to lose the game against the Rockets at the end was pretty indicative of that where Brandon Ingram pretty much just pounded the air to the ball at the top of the key,

while Zion Williams maybe moved one to two steps to his left and right on the low block. Ingram hoist the shot, misses, and that was functionally game over. I don't know, man, there's just like something not quite here. and I guess you could blame it all on injuries, but Rob, I'm probably a little bit more pessimistic. Where are you on the Pelicans? I'm more of like a, again,

like a DefCon 4 type situation with them because it's so explainable, right? Like, I think ultimately, this is at full strength a pretty complex roster. I think there's a lot that New Orleans will need to figure out in terms of how, again, like how to put all these pieces together,

what like the optimal arrangement of it is. Like, just getting to the bottom of the Ingram-Zion partnership I think is going to take a delicate touch. But right now they're just wrecked by injury and they don't have any shot at coherent offense with the guys that are out. Specifically, like the spacing with no CJ and no train Murphy, like,

yeah, your offense with your two stars on the floor is going to be a disaster because there's no room to get to the rim. Like, it's not any great mystery to me why they can't dribble penetrate. There's no room out there to do basically anything. Yeah, I'm less, I'm definitely, less disturbed by their early season performance than Justin.

At the same time, there's just points in games, even when CJ was playing, that they just felt listless. There's no verve to what they're doing. And that is concerning to me to have Zion back and to be like, yo, you know, we got our team back, our superstars back. And, you know, Zion with his first ever serious professional offseason of his five-year career. You know, we got all of this stuff back and it just didn't feel like there was any juice to what they were doing. And so that's a little bit concerning. You know, I don't want to fire coaches this early in the season. But I wonder, I wonder about the coaching over there, right?

Just the disunity that it feels on court. It's not like, I don't think these guys hate each other or whatever. It's just the rhyme of reason to what New Orleans is doing on all. offense specifically doesn't always seem the click for me. And that's why I just, you know, I'm a little worried at a four. But again, the talent drain from injury is a lot. Like Herb Jones is a ringer all-star. Everybody loves that guy.

And he hasn't been able to play. Of course, Murphy, Alvarado, Queen's finest. Come on. He hasn't been able to play. And of course, McCollum, who is their sort of pressure release valve with what he does in the mid-range and his ability to stretch. These are very key components. And more importantly,

Herb and Alvarado are key components to an identity that they've had in the past as far as toughness is concerned, as far as moxie and that kind of thing. And so, you know, as far as the juice you're talking about, right? If you're talking about who's bringing the energy with this team, Zion has a bit of that James Hardin-y thing in the sense that it's kind of all or nothing.

if he has the ball or even if he just knows he's involved in an action in a particular way he's going but if he's not he is very much not and so yeah you have to summon that energy from somewhere and it's great when you can get it from an Alvarado from

Herb Jones locking up from forcing turnovers and getting out on the break but you guys are right that they don't look very dynamic like there is not a lot of verve to the way that they're playing I just wonder how much of that comes from the fact that they know they're just slogging through the mud every time they try to score right now.

So here are the guys that they've played already this season. Darren Sebrin, who's a two-way guy, Kaiser Gates, who played one game and has since been waived. Isn't that a Mercury model? Yeah, I believe so. I think it was a Mishibishi. Jeremiah Robinson Earl, who was waived by the Rockets just on October 23rd, who had since played come over from the Thunder.

So new addition there. Matt Ryan, who was waived by the wolves on October 20th, who's actually been pretty good for this team. Pretty important. Yeah, pretty important minutes, which is already dire. I think, I think we're just saying the problem is the same thing. I'm just looking at it differently because these guys are just never healthy. Like, yes, they could be good if everyone was healthy.

But when are they ever healthy? It's like, it's not only just McCollum, who, by the way, is dealing with another collapse long after he dealt with it in Portland. And that one I believe somebody having two collapsed lungs. That's kind of crazy. scary situation. We wish the best for him. We love that guy. But he was out 17 games the first time. I don't know if it'll be a similar situation there. That could be months long injury. Trey Murphy, months long injury. And even Brandon

Ingram, who's back on the court in this game, has already missed three games because of a knee tendonize. And so it's just like, when are all of the pieces going to be there anyways? This is not just like this era of the Pelicans. This is like the previous era and the previous era before there. I have no idea what the fuck is like going on with the franchise. they're just like cursed in a way that I could just not figure out because they can never get the right guys on the court that they need. Yeah. And because of that,

they never really have a sense of who they are. I think that's what made that one brief moment in time after the CJ trade, like so enticing and so interesting. What drew so many people to that team was like, they had such a clear identity. And so much of the energy and the moxie we're talking about. And the Pelicans historically,

even when they've been really talented, have not had that. They haven't had like a very cohesive, sense of who they are and how they want to play. And I don't think this team has it yet. And they may never have it, Justin, to your point, like, if guys are constantly going to be in and out, we just may never get to the bottom of whether this particular construction of a roster can even work.

It might be the curse of Justin Varyer. Ever since he started covering that damn team, just awful things have been happening to them over and over again. I mean, story of this podcast. Not really, but a podcast, too, if you asked me. He got off the beat, Rob. It's still persisted. That the funk, the smell that comes with Justin, it cannot be washed off.

They can't win without me. They couldn't win with me. Yeah. I don't know, man. I just, I see the vision with this team. It just has never been realized. And even when all of the parts are on the court, I still worry about the defense. They're 20th right now.

That hasn't been the biggest concern. The offense has been just absolutely dreadful. But like sometimes I'll watch Zion on office. offense and just marvel how a guy that size can move that quickly in the way that he could just get by virtually anyone, even like a Julius Randall type who's like similar enough to Zion and that he's a big guy who can move well, just to like he leaves him in the dust like he's the flash. And then he'll be on the defensive end. And Dario Sarich makes like one quick, like one slow move and all of a sudden Zion is just like spinning around like a top. It's just the,

there's something about a processing speed with that guy. And he's at the point where he was getting kind of picked on, at least in the Hawks game and some of these other games. And I do wonder, even if fully formed, they're not going to be the top of the West team that I think they were at times last season. I think people are hoping they can get back to. Yeah, I don't think they're necessarily on that trajectory. The good news is the West is a lot more open than I think we projected coming into the season, right? The nuggets are clearly at the top of it. But some of these other teams that have been risers, you know, the Mavericks, the Timberwolves, like they're taking advantage in part of

some of these underperformers, teams like the Suns, teams like the Lakers, teams like the Clippers that so far have not really been able to get a foothold. And so I think so long as this continues to be the shape of the conference, there's a good window there for the Pelicans to have two good weeks,

and all of a sudden they're in fourth place in the West. So I'm not counting them out yet. I think we're all, again, we're fundamentally agreeing on what the issue is. And the issue is, this team is in such a state that they have to get Matt Ryan on the floor just for a little bit of relief.

if that's the case, they're not going to be very good. If they're able to get a more fully realized version of the players and the roster they actually have, I think they're going to be significantly better than we've seen. Do you know who is fourth in the West right now? Who's that? It's your Houston Rockets at 5 and 3. We're going to talk about the Rockets at some point.

This is the other thing about the Pelicans, you know, panic meter. They lost that game to the Rockets. And I think you could argue there were some, you know, borderlines. You say it's a good loss? is a quality loss? I think losing to the Rockets is a quality loss right now. Maybe. Rockets are playing really good basketball.

That's fair. I think they've played six home games in a row, the Rockets have, two of which against the Kings without Deer and Fox. And this Pelicans team, which is not very good. I think, like, metrics-wise, they're one of the five-worthings. The Kings without Deer and Fox put a hurting on your boys this past weekend now. Come on now. Who are my boys?

Rob? No, the OK City Thunder. Oh, I see. Those are our boys. Yeah, that's fair. Don't take that away. That's fair. My child does play for that team.

Well, the one team that I think none of us are going to want to claim is the Memphis Grizzlies who are at the bottom of the West and the NBA in general at one and eight. Haven't won a home game this season despite being 35 and six last season tied for fourth worst point differential. One of the worst offenses of the league. was where are you panic wise with the grizzlies at this point? I mean, it's a three for sure, right? They just look so goddamn bad. And in the past, I think we were like, Memphis is going to be decent enough,

even without job. I think we discounted how important it was to have Brandon Clark and Stephen Adams. And I got to say, Dylan fucking Brooks. You know? Like the identity, those guys were so integral to the identity that they created. And yes, you know, Desmond Bain can still flex at people and show off his biceps. But it matters when you have these other incredible defenders behind you. You know, when Jaron Jackson, the third, oh, excuse me, Jaron Jackson, Jr.

You keep adding to the Jackson family. It's just the three Jays just trips me up. Jaron Jackson, Jr., you know, being buttressed by Stephen Adams and Brandon Clark and Dylan Brooks and all of his defense behind him who's obviously he's all NBA defense himself. I think that talent drain in toughness and defensive talent is what's killing these guys. In the best of times, guys, they weren't getting buckets when John Miranda didn't play. That just was never the case. They weren't some incredible offensive team, but they would grind team.

to a dust. They would bludgeon them on the offensive boards. They would get the scrap. They would do the scrappy stuff. They were a pretty scrappy bunch, you know, around Jaws, just, you know, sinulating talent. So it was that sort of yin and yang that they presented that just doesn't exist anymore. It's just not there.

Desmond Bain, God bless him, got his bread, which he absolutely deserved. And he's, you know, the usage has gone up. And, of course, he's scoring more because he's been called upon. to, but, you know, he's not the type of player. He's not Luca Donchitz, for God's sakes. Like, he's not going to just carry an efficient offense on his own. And so, you know, as much as we wanted to think defense and toughness would carry a day like it did before, that talent matters, man, and losing all the talent that

they did, particularly, you know, on the part of the floor where they hung their hat, which, again, not to be redundant, was defense. We're seeing the result of that. yeah Desmond Bain has scored 30 plus five times in these nine games only Luca and Shea have more 30 point games

right they just haven't even had a shot in many of those games at all I think as presently constructed this is just the least offensively capable team in the league and you're going to lose a lot of lot of games that way I am more concerned I would say and some of that

I'm probably a I'm probably a DefCon 2. I'm probably you know, I'm Ramona. Cheesecake factory. I hope you have your barbecue like Rex in order,

you know, like start setting up your meals. But for me, I like, I'm starting to think, Jock comes back from a 25 game suspension. Is 5 and 20

a good outcome? And if that's the case, like we're sounding like, that's crazy. Right? That's crazy. Yeah. Yeah.

You're right. It's just the offense with Bainting on the court at the very least they have Bain. But when he is not on the core, everything is running through Jaron Jackson, Jr. and it is absolutely atrocious. And like, a lot of it's running through Marcus Smart, too, which is like, Marcus Smart initiating offense has not, it's not been good. No, Marcus Smart trying to break down the defense, not off of, you know, attacking closeouts and things like that. It's

no. Jaron Jackson's like face up game off the dribble stuff is like a nice little bonus whenever you could throw it out there. But if you devise an actual NBA defense around stopping Jaron Jackson, when the other players on the floor are like not Desmond Bain, yeah, they need it. That's not hard. Yeah. They're running second unit offense through Jackson at times.

And it's just like, it doesn't work one. And two, I don't know if they try anything else. Like, who are they even going to? There's just like, not any options. And to the point where they're now starting Jacob Gileard, who wasn't even really starting consistent. in the G League last year. He averaged nine points

and seven assists in 18 G league games last season. Respectfully, there was already way too much Jacob Gileard happening in Memphis. And then they started him and played him like 35 minutes.

It's a disaster. It's a total disaster. Like, you know, we all love a fun little water bug point guard, but if your offense is relying on a dude who's that small just to get some things moving,

you're in a really bad spot. you're in a really bad spot. If I were to play optimists here, which I'm not sure I really am, but last game against the Jazz, clearly there's still some fight in this team. Maybe that's directed mostly toward the refs in that game

because it was such a shit show that Taylor Jenkins had a few terse words after the game for the referee and Jackson got ejected. Yeah, he said a love, baby. 400 to 500 words, I'm guessing, on the transcription for that thing. That's how you lose $25,000 right there.

but they did play their asses off and almost came back in that game and won it with a bunch of spare parts in Bain. On the other hand, it was the Jazz, who I believe were two and seven coming into that game and are equally struggling this season. So I don't know, I guess it depends on where your expectations were for this season. I kind of always thought that this was going to be a bridge season just because of the Morant situation. I never expected it to be this bad. I don't think anyone expected it to be this bad. But I guess at this point, you got to start to wonder if this is just going to be, development year. Like get guys like Roddy, La Ravia out there, just try things out.

Like, get Jaws feet wet again later in the season. It's a lost season. Yeah, it probably lost. I mean, if they had designs on doing something serious this year, it's a lost season. Yeah. The play in does provide some more hope for these types of teams that previously didn't. But this time last year, there was only one one-win team, and that was the Rockets at one and nine.

So obviously that didn't work out. did work out for the Lakers and the Warriors and the Kings who were two and six, three and seven, three and five. But yeah, it's pretty brutal. It sucks for the Grizzlies, but I don't know how they get out of this tailspin.

Shout it to Bismarck, Bionbo. He's been trying, man. He's been doing his best out there. Playing reasonably well, but, you know,

they are what they are, the Grizzlies. All right. Next up on our list, the Milwaukee Bucks, who find themselves at five and four, but specifically we're going to talk about the Bucks' defense, which comes in at arousing,

25th overall in the league. They just got blown out by the Orlando magic in Orlando the first times, and I think in years that they've lost to the magic, which I think is a sign of perhaps things coming and going, perhaps in the future power rankings. Rob, what the hell is going on here with the Bucks defense? Real passing of the torch moment with the magic beating the Bucs. Yeah, exactly.

I mean, look, it's a total train wreck. their transition defense, dear Lord, it's so bad. It's so dreadful. And I think this is one of the ways in which we may have understated Drew Holiday's importance. I think we all had an, like,

obviously Drew's an amazing all-world defender, but specifically who on this team is getting back in transition? Because it's not going to be Brooke Lopez, who even on a good day is like just not beating people in a foot race. Yonis is going to be crashing the offensive glass on a lot of possessions. Chris Middleton, when he's on,

on the floor. You know, not exactly breaking speed records out there. And so then your first line of defense on a lot of its possessions is like, can Pat Conitin bust ass down court? Is campaign going to be there in time? Malik Beasley.

Will he be able to stand in front of a person trying to score the ball? The new Drew, according to him, the new Drew. I think you're just seeing a lot. You're seeing a lot of cascading issues from a team that doesn't understand how it is supposed to defend. And I think some of that's coming from the kind of whiplash between the systems we've seen so far in the adjustments from Adrian Griffin. But just like a team that does not understand how it's supposed to be balanced on the floor, who's supposed to be getting back, who's supposed to be accountable for what, who is rotating where.

They're just in disarray in a way that I did not expect. I think we've seen obviously enough drop from the bucks this season that you would think they could go back into it and kind of find their bearings somewhat quickly

that has not really been the case and maybe some of that is enough of this team is new that they're having some trouble compensating for that newness so far I'm worried not to assign myself work but I'm a Depcon 3

let's get the blog fingers stretched out and ready to go yeah I mean I'm definitely Definitely monitoring the situation, right? Especially when Dane doesn't play, who's allegedly some horrible defender and the defense doesn't get better, right? The stuff that they're failing at, you know, oftentimes we talk about defense just being about want to. Transition defense, more so than any other component is literally about just getting back in a timely fashion.

It's just about hustling back and getting into position. Unless your roster is like kind of big and kind of slow. That's fair. And that's fair. That's definitely one of the tradeoffs of playing a bigger lineup. I just think transition is definitely something they can tidy. I refuse to believe that an NBA team can't get back on defense. You know, especially when it's not like most of the league is like, you know, shoving it down your throat, running it back.

It's just, y'all just playing lazy. It just feels like they've come out the gates. with this idea of just like, this is a roster constructed for the playoffs, and we have our eye on that. In the regular season, we're not going to go as hard. And there's been other mitigating factors

where teams are shooting better from three than you would ordinarily respect, better from mid-range than you would ordinarily expect. But against a drop defense, it's kind of one of the things that you give up, right? And so I'm not three yet. I'm definitely still at a four where I'm, monitoring because, you know, I think of two examples.

And offensive bonus is a whipping boy here. But there's nothing you can do about a center who's six, nine. You have a center who's six, nine. You're going to play him all the time because he's one of your best offensive players. Your defense is going to be compromised because of it. I watched OKC play Sacramento and Chet, who I love, who even in defeat, just showing me things, getting me very excited about his future. It's been very exciting.

But at the end of the day, they were just attacking this guy. He's a rookie. He's small. It's like he wants to play good on defense. But he can't, he's just not capable of doing it right now. I don't think that's the case with the Bucks defense. I don't think their problems are intractable. You know, I think some of it is effort.

Some of it definitely is personnel where it's a little bit slower and a little bit less dynamic. But I don't think they're just, you know, a team that's incapable of playing the 12 best defense in the NBA. I refuse to believe that. And so I'm not worried as of yet. Some of it is, I think, coaching too. I would not say Adrian Griffin Griffin has covered himself in glory to start this season. And I'd want to be sympathetic to the fact that first time head coaches do need time to kind of figure some of these things out, sort some of these things out. Unfortunately for him, that's not what this job is. The Bucks do have the regular season to tinker, but this is a team with massive expectations. But hold on, Rob. I don't want to hear that first

time head coach stuff because recall my man Will Hardy last year, stepped right in, like, a roster that we thought was lottery bound from the get-go, one of the great stories of last season. He put his imprint. It's like, wow, this is like good coaching on this team. Everything they do is like sound strategy and makes absolute sense that he elevated the hole over there. Adrian Griffin has not done that this year. But I just don't want to, I don't want to make some like ironclad statement that he's some horrible coach because for the first few weeks on the job. But I'm not there yet. But I'm not afraid.

I'm not like, oh, we can't do that. No. I think the conversation about how good Adrian Griffin has as a coach is going to be open for a while. I'm sure we're going to revisit it at points in this season. But he's going to have to show more. I think more of an understanding of what he has, like what this personnel is capable of, what kinds of systems they're capable of executing.

because right now I'm a little more concerned than you are wise about the personnel I just expect it a little bit better from the bones of this team and I'm starting to get a little worried about where they can ultimately be I don't disagree that they can be

the 12th best defense in the NBA I just think that they might need to be better than that yeah my question in addition to the Griffin stuff is how much is this ultimately going to fall at the feet of Brooke Lopez who has been quite bad so far this year. They weren't in a drop for, I believe, four games,

and they switched to the drop. He looked good, but then since then, it hasn't been any better offensively. He hasn't really been helping much. He's the worst net rating on the team. And on the one hand, they're doing him a disservice because they don't have,

not only Drew, but they don't even have a single good wing defender at this point. I guess Drake Crowder would be the closest thing to that. They've been trying to put him on wings at times, wing scorers. It just has been pretty mixed, to be honest. On the other hand, I do wonder, like, how do you solve that main issue?

And it might be by having to trade Brooke and maybe try to replace him with a wing defender because otherwise, I don't know how this all works out. And I guess, that's the question. Do you think, like, Brooke could be a pathway to a different look, or do you think that he could still make this work by selling out at the rim, the two bigs with him and Janus? I think if they dedicate themselves to a way of playing defense, whether it be drop or something a little bit more aggressive, that they can get themselves to competence on defense.

And to be honest, man, in the playoffs, again, when your core components aren't physically compromised, you can paper over stuff with paying more attention in your assignments and being more deliberate. about execution and you will be better. It happened. We see it all the time. People get to competence on defense.

We're just like, wait a second, what? How is this team so good on defense? It's just like when the game starts to matter more, teams just, we just see people get better at defense. We just do in ways that it just doesn't happen on offense. That's why I'm less concerned about it. But we also see people like Dame, like Malik Beasley. we see some of these guys get worked in the wrong matchup, right?

Like they become glaring targets in ways that even the drop can't necessarily cover up all the time. Yeah. So I will say they did not have DAME for the past two games. And therefore, they did not have the offense, a counterbalance some of the defensive deficiencies. Like Dame can outscore a lot of teams and has at times this season. But we've even seen Yannis go off for 54 even and they couldn't beat the Pacers, in part because they could not slow down Tyreys Halliburton and pretty much all the other wings that they have on the Pacers.

That game was a layup line. It was nasty. Both ways, honestly. The defense, quote unquote, being played in that game was, wow. Well, Rob, what do you think to the idea of maybe trying to swap Brooke for a wing defender? Do you think there's any logic to that? So would the idea be that you play Janus at the 5 or do you start Portis with him? What would you think?

What would you do in terms of your overall front quarter? court, do you think? I guess you'd have to start Janus at the five at that point. Maybe Crowder at the four, Middleton at the three, or you could go Middleton at the four and then Crowder at the three and then I guess it depends on who you get, but you're basically trying to prepare yourself more for playoff defense where you're potentially switching things where you're having to guard wing scores at the end of games as opposed to now where you're just trying to protect the rim. I think it's worth thinking about. I think the issue you're run into is Brooke Lopez is probably going to be more valuable to the bucks than he's going

to be to a lot of other teams. And those other teams, like in terms of the wings, you would potentially be getting back. If that's the value proposition, you may not be getting someone who really moves the needle in any kind of meaningful way. I think we're all agreed that they need more perimeter defense and that they could be shored up a little bit that way. How they do it is tricky. If you're not trading Brooke, this is a team that's already kind of leveraged to all hell

in terms of its future first. Yeah, Janice is my full-time five. I'm not crazy about either. Why is that? I just think he's better when he's roaming the floor as a sort of, you know, help defender, disruptor kind of guy.

Just straight up be like, all right, you got to guard every single five in the NBA now, full-time. Like, all of your minutes on the floor is you guarding NBA Biggs or centers, excuse me? I don't know, man.

I'm not crazy about that. There's also a reason why the bigs who play that role, who are, you know, like kind of pick and roll options on offense and are guarding the pick and roll, possession after possession after possession. It's like the primary big on defense. That's a taxing combination of responsibilities for a guy in Yanis who's also going to be gunning it in transition,

bringing the ball up, trying to create an ISO. That's just a lot to put on him. Look at Jaron Jackson, who we kind of feel is more of a natural five than Janice is for whatever he's, even though he's not like that much bigger or anything. But he's struggling with that transition to full-time. It's a lot to ask. That's why I don't know. I would be more willing to ride out, establish success with these two big guys,

anchoring pretty decent defenses. And also, we've seen the Bucks come. out and play defense that was beneath their standard in the regular season since that championship where they haven't always come out and been like, are, we're just going to kill people on defense all year long. They've had slow defensive starts before, but maybe Rob is right. The cavalry isn't coming, you know, in the form of the personnel that's already in-house. I agree that their effort, I mean, it jumps up in the playoffs, obviously.

And during the regular season, when you play one set style, you can kind of get comfortable in you can coast out some months with not necessarily a hundred percent defensive effort and still be a really good defense. The difference is, last season the bucks were like the fifth best half-court defense in the NBA. Right now they're like 25th.

We are worlds apart. And I probably am with you, Waz, in the sense that I don't know that I'm looking at trading Brooke Lopez as my default or go-to option yet. I'm trying to figure out, like, can we get any of these wings or perimeter defenders we need

without giving up Brooke? Right. So Marjohn Beauchamp is probably the obvious one. Andre Jackson got some run in that magic game. Both were out there in the fourth quarter against the magic. I don't think it's any coincidence that Brooke Lopez and Malik Beasley were not playing throughout the entire fourth quarter of that game. And I think Griffin basically said, like, he wanted to get the young guys run. But I think very clearly there's this need for youth and vigor and some sort of like just athleticism, quite frankly. And like, maybe. Maybe those guys are the option, but they're also really young. You know, like teams that have athletes or like big wings who can move like Orlando, they're going to give you a lot of trouble if you're moving as slowly as Milwaukee is right now. Speaking of slow movers here, the Los Angeles Lakers are the last team on our list. Four and five after a rousing victory over the Phoenix Suns the other night. It seems like LeBron, as long as he's on national TV, playing against one of his Hall of Fame peers,

he's willing to just grab the team by the scruff and drag them over the finish line. Overall, though, it's been pretty mixed here was they were two and ten to start last season. So they're way better off than they were. So we're already twice as good. Exactly. But where are you on the Lakers now, what, two to three weeks into this season? The only problem that I have so far is, you know, LeBron comes out and plays 29 minutes or whatever ridiculousness it was that first game.

And it's like, yeah, LeBron is off the ball. He's cruising. He's, you know, he's not going crazy. And we see that, like, in order for these guys to succeed, LeBron has to be the one succeeding. Oh, my God. It's the same story. It's Groundhog Day, guys.

How are we still doing this? It's Groundhog Day. They made so many off-season moves, and we're still here. It's Groundhog Day. And again, it's not to say that other. Others haven't been empowered to do something. We would love to see DeAngelo Russell and Austin Reeves who struggled out the gate. Just, you know, take ownership of the offense in a way that LeBron could just coast.

And the Lakers are still pretty efficient and a respectable offense. It just hasn't been the case. They've been at their best. When LeBron is dominating the ball, he's been great to start the season. You know, it's just the bottom line is he's 50 years old. you know, it's like, it's like, we wouldn't ask an 85-year-old senior to go pull a double in a cold mind. You know what I mean? Like, that's the equivalent to what we're asking of LeBron at this point.

Is it? It is. It's the basketball equivalent. Like, yo, go do some O-T down in the mind. Oh, man. Like, it's like, bro, at this point, this guy should be able to kick up his feet a little bit and other people take ownership of what they're doing on offense. It's just, Russell and Reeves haven't been up to the task so far.

And as much as I, you know, I love Austin Reeves. It's been a struggle for him to start the season. And a lot of it is like people are taking that matchup way more serious now. You know, defenses are way more attuned to some of his, let's say, craftier tendencies. And it hasn't been working as much. But the bottom line, like, that's what we're seeing. So in my panic, no, it's like, LeBron can do it. But again, like, how much can you ride this guy at his age to do this?

When he has the ball, though, Justin, it still looks magical. It does. Can I give you my theory on Reeves' struggles? Because I have to say, we're down bad right now. Yeah, you're going to need a theory. I need some explanation from you. So I think Reeves' best skill, and this is a skill, is foul grifting. Right?

He's very good at it. Throwing his face in the lane and just taking. the punishment on both ends of the court. He's one of the best in the league. Maybe he got a favorable whistle last year, both because he's on the Lakers and maybe because he just looks so helpless at times, just getting thrown around by these much bigger players. I think the fact that he's not getting the calls this year, either because players are more aware of that, refs are more aware of that, and it does seem like we're at the point of the season early on where the refs are really trying to make an issue about the points of emphasis.

And clearly foul grifting was a big one for referees in the NBA this year. And I think not being, having that to rely on has forced the rest of his game to struggle. He no longer has perhaps the extra space he would have because guys are worried about getting their hands on him. And so now he's at an athleticism disadvantage and he can't do what he typically did getting to the rim, hitting some shots. And so I hope over time that sort of discrepancy will, will met itself. fault that like he'll get some of those calls.

But until then, like the Sun's game has been an aberration. It was good in that game coming off the bench or as I should say, he was realligned to the bench, as Darwin Ham would say. That's very respectful. He's definitely shifted back into the same tier as like some of these other like coin flip guys that the Lakers have. The Rory Hachamura is like maybe they'll play good this game, but maybe they won't play good for five more.

This is why the idea of him is your third. score and specifically a third score on a team where AD is the second guy is always felt a little bit dicey to me. To me, Austin Reeves is much more of a come and go situationally

like a guy who can take advantage of situations, right? The right matchup, the right night, the right coverage. He's essential, right? We saw that in the playoffs. He can bust games open just like running pick and roll against the like in the right moment. But if you're expecting him to come in and be a 20 point

score every night. I just don't think his game is necessarily built for that. He's going to make some smart decisions. He's going to swing the ball. He's going to try and compete on defense, even though he's a little overmatch sometimes. He's going to be useful in a lot of different ways, but being useful in a lot of different ways is not necessarily like a starring package. So I think we're just seeing a little bit of natural regression in like coming back down to earth of where he actually is as a player. I don't think he was nearly as bad as he was to start the season. And we've seen some of that. Like him started to put a little. I feel like, He's that guy from the Memphis series, though.

You think that's who he is all the time? I thought that's what he was going to be this year all the time. I still have hope that he'll be better than he has been this season. Totally. Because the three ball is not falling, and he's just a much better shooter. He's a good shooter, y'all. He's not a 30% three-point shooter. He's a much better shooter than that.

So the three ball is going to fall. Hopefully he'll be able to get to the line a little bit more. And again, it's just a matter of let, Austin Reeves and DeAngelo Russell soak up possessions and actually be the ones initiating and do something productive. Because you know, again, like,

when LeBron is right, it's just like that Clipper game in OT was ridiculous. The Sun's game was ridiculous. You know, it looks great when he's doing it, but he shouldn't have to be doing this at his advanced age. But I think they

again, they're trying. They're trying to like put the ball on DLO. hands and get him to run stuff. Here's the thing. And this is why I'm pretty concerned about the Lakers. To this point, Aiden LeBron have missed one combined game between them. One game.

That's it. And I had the thought already, nine games into the season, was Dennis Schroeder even more important to this team than we thought? And if I'm having that thought, 10 games, but I think even offensively, I think just in terms of decision-making second-side initiation,

like losing a guy like that, has hurt them a little bit. I'm not saying that's the BL end all, but when that thought is going through my head because so many other things are not working, I'm concerned. The Lakers are not good at the thing they're supposed to be good at,

which is their defense has not been up to snuff. And that's putting all this pressure on LeBron to keep supplying steady offense for everyone, because if he doesn't, they lose. It puts too much on a Russell. AD is a great defensive player, obviously. I thought he would be defensive player of the year this year. but you need ball pressure still.

Even as great as AD is, there has to be ball pressure. Russell's not doing it. Gabe Vincent can't make a shot anymore, apparently. Can't do a lot of things right now. But he can't make a shot anymore, which is sucking. But I think even he has the ability to elevate what he's done just past this putrid output that he's had so far. He's going to be better than this. Gotta be.

That's why I'm not that worried about. about the Lakers. They still got Braun and AD, and these role players just have to be better than complete trash. Can they do that? You know what they need more of? What's that? Christian Wood. The siren song

is beckoning. Like him and AD, like, AD does not look more comfortable. AD looks more comfortable next to Wood having another big to help him on the boards than with anybody else. And they have been absolutely atrocious rebounding, which is a kind of a shot.

because this team is huge. Even for like big teams, they have an advantage with their size. But when Wood is out there, he provides enough stretch to provide a little bit of a space that some of these guys need. All he wants to do is stretch anyway.

So. Right. And I do think the size helps take some of the burden off of AD who is already starting to wear down a little bit from the pounding. And so I think they need to start wood and go back to the double big lineup.

Honestly, he's been really good for them. and I mean clearly important for the rebounding, which I am baffled by. This should be something that is like so clearly a strength for this team. And in some games it has been against some very small lineups it has been. But when the Lakers aren't performing well, the things they're supposed to be good at, specifically rebounding,

I'm wondering how that's going to change. And maybe some of that is just effort. Maybe some of that is just role players playing better. I don't want to gloss over the fact, though, that very quietly, the Lakers got a little smaller in terms of some of the rotation spots. And specifically,

they brought in some guys who were just absolute zeros on the glass. Two guys in particular, Gabe Vincent, which, again, Justin, I reluctantly tipped my hat to Justin on his Gabe Vincent cynicism. But the other guy who's much bigger

than 5'10 is Tori and Prince, who, and people at his previous stops will tell you this, does not really rebound. This is part of the reason teams have been reluctant to play him as like a small ball four, just not a factor on the glass at all. And so when you're going from, again, not incredible players last season, but even like Wenyan Gabriel types, more Jared Vanderbilt minutes,

who he hasn't been able to play yet because of injury. We can't do it. I'm not saying he's the solve for some of this. I'm not saying he's the solve. I'm saying the reason last year's team rebounded and this year's team doesn't, might be because this year's team is different. and they gave up some of that rebounding to try to get other things. And right now they're not getting either of them.

Jackson Hayes hasn't been a great. He's not good. Yeah. That was a flyer, but it hasn't worked out. Which is hilarious because he was one of the New Orleans picks from the AD deal. And so that he's a Laker now, stinking up the joint. Wolf. Is Cam Reddish the answer?

New starter, LeBron's favorite target. He's a safety belt. He's a LeBron kind of player theoretically. A guy who, you know, has size, can guard on the perimeter. So don't force LeBron to guard some of those bigger wings. And we'll spot up on the wing for on LeBron's driving kicks. Like, historically, he's been a LeBron. That player archetype is a LeBron perfect guy.

Doesn't need to handle it, all of that kind of stuff. You know, but again, we're talking about 39. nine-year-old LeBron, who realistically right now, he should be playing next to guys that are a little bit more ball dominant. So if LeBron's going to continue to just dominate possession and not get hurt, let's just do that. And I'll be happy to watch it. I love it.

I love watching LeBron play. But I just can't believe this is sustainable. Well, if you stop doing that, like say LeBron checks out of the game to take arrest for a single minute, before he gets hurt, God forbid. Right now, the Lakers, in 127 minutes without LeBron, are minus 86. That's not good. For the record, a nice little plus 31 in the minutes that he does play. So, I mean, he's doing his best, again, to drag this team over the finish line in some of these games.

And to empower guys like Reddish to be the best version of themselves. But I want to give all due respect to Cam Reddish, who had a nice game against the Suns, hit a huge shot to close out that game. but if we're being totally honest about what's happening here, Cam Reddish is getting the chance to do this because Rorya Chimura has not been great, because Austin Reeves has not been great, because a lot of Lakers are underperforming. And so we are at the level of cycling

where Cam Reddish is in your starting lineup already. And maybe he holds on to that spot, but I think we would probably all agree it's best for the Lakers if he doesn't, if someone else is good enough to take it from him. Reddish looks the part, man. He looks exactly like you would think a 3-D wing would look like.

he's like, wait, three and what? Three and what? Three and occasional shots when LeBron sets him up perfectly. Yeah. He's like the Hemsworth brother.

It's like, oh, he looks enough like him that he'll be able to play this role. And it's just like, there's none of that there. But I'm still at like a four with this team. This is kind of what I expected. I thought they would be better

in the regular season, but I always assumed that they'd have some struggles with having the offensive juice. A lot of DeAngelo Russell. A lot of DeAngel Russell in these games. Like, he's either doing too much or not enough. Dennis Schrodo was good, man. Like, he did be good in Toronto, too.

He has been good in Toronto, for real. The Denver series, admittedly, was not his best moment, you know, but he was damn, yo, he's so good against Golden State. He was incredibly good against Golden State. He's just complimentary to what they need. Like, Justice said, occasionally running offense, second side. and rolls, head of the snake on defense. Like, he's made himself into a quality type of guy, again, especially on defense, where

he's just an irritant. Everybody hates playing against him. They miss him. They miss Dennis. There's no two ways about it. Yeah. All right. Let's wrap it there.

Thank you to Jack Sanders on production. Thank you to Ben Cruz. We'll be back on Wednesday. We have something special for you. We're going to enlist one of our rookie experts on staff. to enter a Oh, see that.