The Ringer NBA Show - NBA Potluck: One Player, One Team, One Take

Episode Date: November 23, 2022

Thanksgiving is here and Justin, Rob, and Wos hold the annual 'Group Chat' NBA potluck dinner. Each of them brings one player, one team, and one take to the table to talk about. They talk about Ben Simmons, the Sacramento Kings, Anthony Davis, and much more. We want to hear from you! Email us at [e-mail]. Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny Lambre Associate Producer: Isaiah Blakely Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey everyone, it's Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'Bomber, aka Kevin O'Connor. Wait a minute, you're not Chris Vernon. No, Kevin, sadly, I'm not as cherubic or as raspy as Verno, but it is I, Jay Kyle, man. And folks, basketball has been and continues to be so very good. That's exactly why Kyle and I are hosting a brand new basketball show on a brand new podcast feed, the ringers NBA draft show. We're going to have you covered every week as we go in-depth and deep dive in hopes of answering an ever-important question in the NBA. Who's got next?

Whether it's an international phenom like Victor Wimbenyama or the G-League Scoot Henderson. Or stars from Overtime Elite like A. Men Thompson, as well as a full-blown swarm of talented prospects from the promising 2023 NBA draft class. For sure, Kyle. And we're also going to get into players from the college ranks because this is a loaded class. for us to discuss prospects rising and falling, and we're going to revisit and redraft recent draft classes and get into how the league's evolution could help inform what's valuable in a prospect of the future.

This is a podcast for a fan of every team, whether you're losing and have high draft lottery odds or you're looking for sleepers later in the draft. We're going to be covering everything in the months that come, so please make sure you follow and subscribe to the Ringer NBA Draft Show. And hit us with those five-star ratings. Welcome to Group Chat. I'm Justin Verrier joining me.

As always, Big Waz, Rob Mahoney, gentlemen, should we like the beam? What is it emitting from in audio format? You know, like, can the Spotify app have a beam coming out of it? It's my phone, and I'm just going to turn on the camera light. That's something, I guess. There we go. On today's episode, we have a little bit of a group chat tradition.

I think this is third annual. maybe fourth annual. This is the NBA potluck. We are one day out from Thanksgiving. So hopefully this will catch you in your podcast feeds during your Thanksgiving commute or maybe a tomorrow on your trip to your feasts. But we are going to go through and bring a smattering, a smorgasbord of NBA offerings to the table here. Each of us picks one team to talk about, one player, one take. I, you know, I've been noticing a lot of things. Thanksgiving themed NBA podcast episodes. I just want everybody to know that it started right here.

The bullshit starts here, my friend. We invented Thanksgiving is what you're saying? Exactly. Yeah. I thought Christopher Columbus invented that. We're not allowed to talk about him anymore. How do you guys feel about a potluck, though? What's your overall potluck approval rating?

I'm all about it. I think as long as everybody, like, if everybody, Everybody decides like, all right, you're bringing this so that we don't repeat dishes, a bunch of yams in there. You know, I'm happy with a potluck. I love it. It's definitely like a test of a family or friend groups communication skills and organization. It's very easy to end up with, as you say, was like just a table full of yams. I find that it's the only way to do a friend's giving, though, because nobody is ever going to take the reins and say, I'm going to do all 15 things myself.

Everyone needs to contribute. year for this to work. Yeah, I actually had a Friendsgiving before I flew here to Georgia last Thursday that was the Friends Giving in. You know, I made a mashed potato and a cream corn. I was quite impressed with myself from both offerings. It was delicious. Here's the problem, though, is I am that guy, Justin. I am the guy who wants to do all the things. And it brings me no joy to say that. It's just, that's just who I am. I'm the guy that's going to let you. That's why you get the invite was. So you're serving it up tomorrow? You're you're making everything. You're carving up the bird. I'm attempting to end like our guests are insisting on bringing

stuff. And I've tried to repel it at every turn. I've tried to I've tried to let them down softly. It hasn't worked. But look, I'm planning the full menu regardless. They're free to bring what they want to bring. But it's going to be here. The, you know, full meal is going to be on the table when they show up. You've got a curated menu. You've got a curated menu. You've got a flow to the entire evening set up. It's been in the works. Okay. That's great.

He's coursing out his meals on Thanksgiving. I like that. Well, on this episode, we're going to share the burden a little bit. And I guess I'll start with our player section by presenting the turd and the punch bowl here. Because I'm going to talk about Ben Simmons of the now Brooklyn Nets who last night on Tuesday made his triumphant return to Philly. I got to say, for Ben Simmons specifically. It didn't go that bad, you know? I think you're starting to see not only in this game,

but over the past few games, Ben is starting to look like he's playing with a little bit more verve. Like, he has his confidence back, which is like a big part to see because I think as we talked about in the past, like there's two issues here. One is, is Ben kind of all the way there? Is he back to feeling comfortable on the court? And then there's the fit concern.

And, Waz, I don't know how you felt, but last night I'm like, you know, it's great to see him do the shrug after he makes the two free throws and shushing the crowds. It just feels like he's, he has a little bit more oomph to him, which is a positive side at the very least. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not going to do the negative thing and point out that, you know,

he had a lot of confidence going in because the three best players from the opposing team all sat. But watching him attack the basket, watching him even though he was bricking his ugly ass turnaround, but he's taking it. And it's a four-foot shot, you know, like even if he misses it. Like, I feel good that that thing has a chance. of going in when he takes it against a guy who's smaller and not as strong as him, right?

And so he's taking it to the rack. I thought he had, you know, the word you use, verve, that's a beautiful word. I thought he had some verve on defense, you know, hounding guys in the back court, hounding guys on the perimeter. And so, yeah, he did play with some oomph and some force. Brooklyn lost because they refused to guard anybody in the most ridiculous, mundane miscommunications on switches against like Melton. And I'm just like, oh, guys, like, anybody can switch on to De Anthony Melton, guys.

Like, literally, you know, this is in John Morant we're talking about here. But, yeah, Brooklyn didn't guard. But Ben himself, he looked alive and he seemed to want to be out there, which we couldn't say was the case early on in the season. Like, again, I don't want to overstate, like, and say that he's, all the way back, that he's fully the Ben Simmons that we knew and debated and maybe kind of loved sometimes.

But it does mean something for a guy with a back injury to be hitting the floor, fighting for loose balls. It does mean something for him, as you said, Justin, to be shushing the crowd, to be showing that edge, to be giving it back to Philly fans in a way that I thought was just like really heartening

to see him put himself out there like that because we haven't seen that side. So all that stuff is really good. It's just like, we're really talking about he had a good week. and let's see if we can hopefully get some more good weeks and some more good months and hopefully a good season for him going forward because we know he has that game in him to be at least this kind of player in games that aren't this highly emotionally charged game against your former team. We know that he has it in to be that on a more regular basis. We just got to see it. We've got to see it in a more holistic way.

Well, the activity is good because offensively, I don't know what else he's going to bring. like he's going to move the ball. He's going to make a couple nice passes a game. And he's going to like roll hard, cut all of that. And so I think it's good that he's doing that stuff. But it brings us to the bigger picture question is like, how valuable is that to a team that probably needs to be playing a Nick Claxton and even more defensive players in order to make up for the defensive shortcomings?

I just wonder overall, Rob, like, are we going to get to a point? where regardless of how active Ben is, how well he's even playing, this isn't going to work because the fit is too much of a concern. I don't know that that's entirely the case. Like in this game against the Sixers, there was a lot of stuff going wrong. But I think overall we're seeing that just getting Joe Harris and Seth Curry and some of these other shooters back into the mix has helped manage some of the fit issues with Ben. The defensive stuff is just so much bigger than even Nick Claxton or Ben or any one guy.

There's just no connective tissue there at all really defensively for that team in a way that's pretty concerning. But I think what we're seeing is like he can be the things you described. He can be a good roller. He can be a good playmaker. What he's not and what they're kind of pigeonholing him in, at least in some of these matchups, is that backup five. And we saw like Paul Reed just work him. Like that's not going to inspire a lot of confidence necessarily in him in that kind of role. But as a guy who's queuing up that team in transition and getting them going, he can do all that stuff.

And he can be a really good perimeter defender. hopefully in time. Yeah, I would just direct people, if you can, get your hands on the Sixers game against, they played the Warriors, the first year KD got there, and they beat them. And Ben Simmons was incredible. He was doing everything out there. He was flying around on defense. The stuff that he was doing in transition where he's like forcing the issue, you know,

he's forcing the pace. He just looked like a madman out there. And I, you know, I had kind of never been a Simmons person. But I remember watching that game thinking like, okay, shit, if he's going to be doing this, if he's going to be like the kind of like fire under his ass player on both ends of the floor, meaning I get out and run and I'm in attack mode all game long, you know, and I'm flying around and I'm using my physicality, man, that's a player. You need to get back to that.

That's a guy that can be a valuable player because, you know, again, the stuff that they need help with on defense, it is, you know, help side. It is timely double teams where, you know, Patty Mills coming with a timely double team. That's not a thing. That's not going to bother any of any NBA player who's worthy of being doubled. Ben Simmons coming on a timely double team, that can be something. That can goose a defense that has, you know, guys that are not physically able to hold up. It's not that they don't want to.

They just don't, like, Seth Curry's a small guy. Kyrie's small. Like, these guys are who they are, you know. Ben has to get back to that. Yeah, I guess the point I'm trying to circle around here is I wonder if the optimized Ben Simmons can't exist on this team because of all the particulars up and down the roster. Like, in theory, you would want Ben to be leading your transition offense, basically being your point guard,

and then maybe some sort of small ball center on the floor. But as we're saying, like, you want the ball in Kyrie and Katie's hands. And like Seth Curry had the ball in his hands a lot. And Patty Mills would be great if he handled the ball a little bit. And so he kind of seems like he's constantly feeling his way out and, like, trying to pick his spots. but that's not necessarily really bringing out the best. And then defensively, as Rob alluded to, like, he's not really a small ball center

because he's not going to give you the rim protection that this team desperately needs. But when you put another center on the floor, is that going to cramp your spacing? And then is even a Claxton, Ben Simmons, Royce O'Neill front line enough. Do you have enough wings to support a small ball lineup? Because everybody seems to be a 5'10 shooting guard on this team. And so, like, I don't know. It seems to be as much a Nets roster construction issue, as much as it is a Ben Simmons issue in Brooklyn right now.

I think offensively there's more room there than you might be giving them credit, just in terms of, like, for example, it's a zero in on what you were saying about who has the ball, like who is actually controlling the offense. I think we saw some really promising signs in this game and in some of these recent games of the ball is with Kevin Durant or Kyrie Irving, but Ben is cutting hard to the rim. Like, he's actually willing to go to the basket right now to try to,

finish or, God forbid, get fouled and have to make some free throws. And the fact that he's shown a willingness to do that, that goes a long way to making those fit things work. Because what doesn't work is him floating in the dunker spot, not wanting to finish, wanting to draw another person to make another pass when, look, when you're in that spot, when you're in those positions, when you're rolling and cutting in that way, you've got to go up with it. It's like, it's non-negotiable or else you are wrecking your offense. And so the fact that we're seeing that from him, I think allows Katie to have the ball that allows Kyrie to do more with it and still have been be a factor in what they're doing. But is he giving enough on defense to make the tradeoff worth it? Not yet. Yeah. It's a yet

issue. Yeah. But you think it's going to happen or it could very well happen. He's shown that he can be that. Like he's shown he can be one of the best defensive players in the league. And we'll see if he is physically capable of getting back to that level. If he's still kind of operating at that frequency, it's just going to take time to find out. But games like, this one and stretches like this one are steps in that progression. Right. I should also mention that Yuda Watanabe was not playing last night. He of the 57% three point percentage.

And I don't know how the team expected to win without their best player on the floor. You joke, but I know. Yudah's good. Yud is very good. And if anything, like I actually wanted to pick him for this segment because there's nothing I've enjoyed more this season than watching how much Yuda loves playing with KD. Oh, yeah. Every time he makes a shot, he almost looks to KD as if, like, I look at Rob when he makes a great point.

Or, like, when I say something, I just want Rob's approval. See, I always thought of you more as like a George Nying trying to drive on me on this podcast. But it's probably more accurate, giving you a fuck you look every time. Well, Rob, why don't you take the reins here and come with your player? I would love to talk to you guys about Brooke Lopez. I would love to spread the gospel of Brooke Lopez on this podcast. because I think he was a little bit forgotten last season, dealt with a long-term injury, came back, wasn't quite himself, still helpful.

But this year, we're seeing the return of Brooke Lopez as the best room protector in the NBA, bar none, and a huge reason why Milwaukee's been able to survive the absence of Chris Middleton, who we should know, by the way, is finally getting some run in practice and looks to be ramping up. So we'll see, hopefully, what the fully fledged bucks look like soon enough. But I just, I've been blown away by Lopez on both sides of the ball. he's in that incredible sweet spot of hitting a career high in threes right now 39% and blocking a shit ton of shots and more importantly than that he's one of those rim protectors who can go up to challenge a shot and when you get freaked out midair and try

to pass it out he's deflecting those passes out too it's just a very very finite group of players who can do stuff like that and he's hitting at that absolutely elite level for a guy who like we don't know when some of these guys get injured especially big guys are they going to come back and be their full selves. This is as good as Brooke Lopez has ever looked defensively and we need to talk about it. Yeah, I mean, I became a Brooke Lopez ultimate lifer and believer during the championship run where, you know, it's two things. One, they're posting these like playoff records in defensive ratings during that run, which was, you know, if you're watching the game, it's like, all right, we have these two freaking cyborgs roaming the pain.

And if you even bothered, you'd watch guys dribble, dribble to the paint and be like, hold up, man, the yellow light, let me slow up, let me bring this thing back. And that was Brooke Lopez. And so watching him do that throughout the playoff run, you know, with the subtext being that the league is shunning centers and we're going small and blah, blah, blah. And he's like, no, we're going to be bigger, stronger than everybody and not allow. any layups. So that was cool. And then, you know, it's one of those things where absence makes the heart grow fonder when he doesn't play last year and they can't guard anybody.

You know, they spent how many consecutive years being the best defensive team in basketball, they lose one dude from that damn defense and it goes to crap. You know, how many times last year were we looking at Milwaukee's defensive rating and being like, what the hell's going on? Oh, yeah, that's right. Brooke Lopez hasn't played. And now he's back and they're back to pummeling people and doing all the things that Rob just mentioned. So yeah, I definitely echo that. And, you know, lastly, what I'll say about Brooke Lopez is like his jump shot is so wet right now, like on free throws.

It just doesn't even touch the rim. It's just swish every time. It's crazy. Yeah, if you really want to treat yourself this Thanksgiving season, just like dial up the highlights of Brooke Lopez pouring in threes against like the thunder. It's a delight. Like the games where he hits four and four. five threes. Obviously great vibes for the bucks. Obviously a good sign for their offense.

But there's just, it's, it's great to see him operating at that kind of level again. Yeah, 39% from three on six attempts of games. Those are both career highs. The athletic had a good story about we're kind of working with this nebulous, like fancy schmancy machine over the offseason and really working on his shot after slumping a little bit. I'm glad you brought up Lopez because I had something written down for him last podcast where we were going to talk about the bucks and Janus and whatnot. Because I feel like what's happening is we think about the bucks in broad terms as this big three,

the Drew Middleton, Yannis experiment. But like it's clearly like Brooke needs to be involved there. It's a four because he makes this team work in a way that they want to. And just as unique as Janus is, you need someone just as unique to fit around him. To have a guy who is an elite rim protector and an elite three point. shooter now is like where is that player like we talk about miles turner all the time but like he's not doing it at this level and so yeah lopez it's almost like when rondo eventually like assented

to being one of the marquee guys in the celtics obviously brook is like 10 to 15 years older than rondo at that point maybe but uh yeah he's definitely part of this core and part of what makes them so good yeah the fact that all of those four core guys all have like flexibility to their games that allow them to, I'm just going to be a spot-up guy for this possession. I'm going to be an off-ball cutter for this position. If I'm Janus, I'm going to give the ball up and I'm just going to be a roller on this possession. I think it's really smart to include Lopez in that group because the fully actualized,

the best version of the Bucks, Lopez is this kind of spacer and he's posting up to, and he's more of a creator. Yeah. So, you know, we often talk about centers who can't punish switches, who can't punish when teams are like, well, we want to space the floor. So we're going to put a six-foot-seven guy. or six-fid six-five-six guy on you, don't even dare do that against Brooke Lopez. Like, you're done. You're toast. He's going to maul you if you try to put a wing or,

God forbid, some little guy. You try to put Pat Bev or somebody the way he used to guard some of these senators who've been much maligned on here and in other media outlets. Like, you can't do that to Brooke Lopez. And so, yeah, man, that's important. He plays big as well as stretches the floor, which is beautiful. defensive player of the year? He has to be the frontrunner right now. I mean, the Bucks are the number one defensive team with a bullet. He is easily the reason why.

I think he's got to be leading that conversation right now. Yeah. All right. Let's pivot now. Waz, why don't you bring up your player? Tyrese Halliburton. We touched on it.

Me and Rob very briefly, but this guy is an all-star play. Like, he's clearly an all-star level point guard, right? watching him play is cool, not just obviously he's leading the league in assists. This Pacer's team is up there in pace. But for me, it's his spirit and his emotion that he plays with. That he's leading this group. You know, like he came into the seasons like, all right, Tyrese is our best player.

And he's playing that way. And he's, man, like a team that was supposed to like borderline tank. And he's out here just playing his heart out. Career high in volume from three, shooting it at 39% of course, still 86% from the free throw line. Kind of the only thing outside of his, you know, he need to eat a couple of cheeseburgers, okay? Because the guy is small. Basketball reference has him as 6'5. I'm a bit dubious of that.

I don't know that he's actually a legitimate 6'5. So, like, obviously on defense, it becomes an issue. But besides not getting to – I would like to see him get to the line more than 3.2 times a game. Other than that, he's been a perfect point card, okay? He's doing everything you want him to do. He's making open shots, creating opportunities. Miles Turner, good God, man. You know how when quarterbacks make the Pro Bowl, they buy the offensive line like Rolexes or –

Like pickup trucks and shit like that. Miles Turner needs to do that for Tyrese Halliburton. Seriously, he's having a year of his life. And I think Tyrese is a big part of that. And it's just incredible to watch, man. Honestly, you know, 20 and 10, he's a double double guy. Yep. It's incredible.

It's amazing what can happen for like a really smooth, really talented player when you give them the greenest possible light. And that's what we're saying for Halliburton, where not only is he feeling empowered to throw, some wild and some pretty risky passes sometimes, but he's pulling up for deep threes in huge moments, and he's nailing him. And I think more importantly,

he's learning to take the things he knows he does well and learning to leverage them even further in the way that we've seen young stars do for so long. And for him, a lot of that comes down to establishing the shot, as you said was, and he's been not only 39% on threes, but 42% on pull-up threes, and turning that into,

okay, now you have to overplay me, now I can get by you, now I can try to finish or create for my teammates. Like getting through that progression, that's the whole game for a young point card. And Halliburn has just been aces in so many of those departments. I think the one area where he can really get better is finishing against guys who are as long as he is.

Like he might not be a true 6-5, but he is long for a point guard. And when he gets more wing-sized guys or he's trying to finish past bigs, there's still a little bit of trouble there that he can work out. But if he can get that stuff down, I mean, he's going to be a three-level scoring threat. he's obviously a passing threat and he knows how to move with him without the ball.

He can just do so many different things. 20.4 points, 10.7 assists, 4.6 rebounds. A little trivia, my friends. Over the past decade, there have been four other players averaging 2010 and 4. Can you name those four players? A couple did it multiple times. So it's specifically 10 assists?

10 assists, yes. 10 and 4? This is tough. 10 years you said? Yeah, so over the past decade. So since 12, 13. Russell Westbrook. Five times.

Yonnis. Nope. No, no, because yeah, it has to be the assist, so not Yonis. Hardin. Yeah, Hardin's got to be there. Hardin did it four times. Last two, or they only did it once? Think about recent assist leaders.

No. No. It's tough. LeBron and John Wall. LeBron once every season. 10 assists. When did he do that? Yeah, it was last season, or two seasons ago, when he just decided to be the point. Oh, yes, yes, yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. So, shout out to John Wall, though. I would not have pegged him for that category. Yeah, I know. I was surprised that John Wall is that good in the 2012. Yeah, exactly. Another follow-up stat for that. So Tyrese Halliburton has a 23.8 usage rate by far the lowest among all of those guys, nearly half of what Russ was in his MVP season. I think that's the thing that jumps out to me with Halliburton. It's not like he's just dominating the ball and this is like heliocentric. I'm just, I'm just making everything work from me. He's playing within the flow of the offense and just like to watch him like pass it off and like work like cut off the ball and and just get everyone involved. It's just like it's been beautiful to watch. And it's just like the team is just set up so well

to bring out the best in him because they're shooting threes at a pretty high volume. And So I wonder, like, if this team is another one of these candidates where they're too good to tank at this point. I mean, we expected the Pacers, the Jazz, be right in there for the Webben, Yamma race. But, like, I don't know, all of the advance indicators, point the front trail, etc., suggests that the Pacers are going to be pretty good all throughout the season. Yeah, I don't think the tank thing is on the table. And more importantly than that, Rick Carlisle will not allow it. He is not going to let that team take.

I think the thing that may push them in that direction, if they do, would be that they're just a bit shallow. And so they are an injury risk in that way, not that like any of their guys are just, we're kind of waiting for the moment where they turn an ankle. But it's just like, if Miles Turner is out for three to four weeks, like you could, you could drop a lot of games really quickly. And the only stealthy, tanky thing that they're still doing,

and here comes your obligatory Ben Mathron reference. go Haiti, is still bringing this dude off the bench, still playing less than 30 minutes a game. It's like, really? I mean, really? Really? Like, I get it. Oh, he's a rookie and blah, blah, blah.

I get it. And your rotation and the bench unit, and I get all of that. But really? Come on. It does feel like a classic Buddy healed showcase. You know, like, let's put Buddy in the front window. Let's see if we can get anybody passing by to come inside. Yeah.

Well, let me ask you this because this probably helps pivot to our team section a little bit. Do we think Halliburton would be this player if he was still on the kids? No, definitely no. He would be awesome for them. Like, I think he still would be really good. He'd still be really good. He'd still be really good. But no, because the green light that you guys speak of, like the green beam, the green beam.

The green beam. And not that he's monopolizing possessions now, but he's the focal point. He's initiating possessions, right? Like maybe he doesn't get the direct assist, but he's probably getting that hockey assist. You know, he's just so central to the program. It just wouldn't be, it couldn't be the case in Sacramento. By the way, I think they might have made the best deal, man.

Have you seen these guys recently? They're freaking good. The Kings? Yeah. Yeah. So, Rob, why don't you kick us off in the team portion? because I think the question really is, like, was Halliburton the best player in the deal,

but was the deal of success for both sides? I mean, it's obviously paying off right now for Sacramento. And like, let's start with Tale of the Tape, 10,000 feet. The Kings have won seven straight games. They beat the Cavs. They beat the Warriors. On Tuesday, they beat the Grizzlies. They are third in the West by point differential.

They have the second best offense in the entire NBA. And moreover, they're just a delight to watch. And a lot of that is like there are pretty, there are clear stars involved here, Dier and Fox first and foremost, but they are where they are in the standings because they share the ball really well in a way that Sacramento teams just have not

for basically almost 20 years. So it's been great to see that. And it's been great to see Fox ascend as a star and as a creator without, just like we were talking about Hallibur, without needing to dominate in that particular way. You know, it's giving it up. There are so many grab and go options

with this team in transition where you, see Sabonis push it. You see Kagan Murray grab a rebound and go. And all of that is not just like greater pace for your team, but it's a lot of flexibility in terms of like, where is your offense starting? And it's not always starting with Darren Fox. It may find him along the way. And he does a ton for that team, but he doesn't have to dictate everything for them to be an elite offense. And that, that's where we're seeing everything pay off for them right now is the flexibility of subonis can be your elbow creator. Fox can be running pick and roll. You can just be working to the weak side to someone like Murray or Kevin Herder or Harrison Barnes has really come on strong lately after a slow start.

Everything is coming together for them. And they look like just a really varied and versatile and dangerous offensive team. I want to give a big, big shout and recognition to Mike Brown, man, because he had a lot of success during the LeBron years in Cleveland that he got zero credit for. Those teams were always elite at defense, overachieving at defense. And, you know, since the second Cleveland stop was a bit of an embarrassment, the Lakers thing went up in flames. There were all these jokes about, Jesus, two teams are paying this guy to leave, you know, at the same time.

Like, he got maligned and we don't say it enough, but coaches can get better, you know, coaches can improve. We tend to think of just young players as being guys that add stuff to their game. Coaches can do the same. And I think he's learned from his time away from being the same. the lead guy while he was in Golden State and other places. And he's sort of imported that beautiful game, egalitarian Golden State stuff here in Sacramento.

And let's face it, those Cleveland teams did not have creative offense. They just did not, you know, and Mike Brown implementing that with this young team, and he's coaching him up, Mike Brown deserves his flowers, man. He's doing a great job. And by all indications, he is one of the sweetest, nicest, most lovable guys in the whole NBA. So it couldn't be happening to a better dude, which is, you know, I still think is a thing that we should root for. So shout's to Mike Brown and what he's doing over there. Yeah, this looks more like an Alvin Gentry team than it does a Mike Brown team, but they're definitely making it work.

I can't remember in recent history where a team set out with a clear blueprint envisioned and then executed it and it looked exactly like they drew it up. Like this team has a clear main artery of those offends with the subonis and Fox pick and roll. They imported a bunch of shooters, some of whom had probably been pushed aside, like just gotten lost in the shuffle, Herder being the prime example.

Now shooting 50% on seven and a half three-pointers a game. Come on now. And it just works. Like listening to that game last night against the Grizzlies, you could just hear the exasperation. on the Grizzlies broadcast crew, when they knew, like, when the Grizzlies were up, the Kings were going to keep shooting threes, and they were going to put pressure on them. And when they were up on the Grizzlies, that it was going to be tough to claw back and you have to try so hard

because they're going to keep shooting threes every single time. They tried their damn miss to cough that thing up last night, though. My God, Jesus Christ. It was ugly. And like, the defense is ugly and the backup center minutes are particularly bad. I guess Rashon Holmes is just like, a non-entity anymore to the point where Jaron Jackson was literally just like

eating METU alive at certain stretches for that game but this team it works man like the vision the execution is not only like good for a king's team which has historically been just a complete disaster but like one of the best like just playing execution jobs of a GM

Monty McNair in like recent history they remind me a little bit in that way different style but just in terms of like plan to execution early in the season of some of what we saw from the Bulls last year before their injuries, where you saw like, oh, this is what it looks like when you throw Lonzo and Caruso and all this perimeter pressure. And they found a style of play almost immediately. And what's impressive about this group with the Kings is all of their core guys have found fluidity with each other, like just in a

snap. Like Kevin Herder and Domana Sabonis feel like they've been playing with each other for a decade. Like they just know how to move around each other. And you're seeing those synergies up and down the roster. Sometimes it's guys who have played together before. Deere and Fox and Malik Monk just have like a natural chemistry. But you're also seeing it with like Kegan Murray, just like an instinctive player who knows how to move, who knows how to cut, who knows how to work off of these kinds of actions. And when you have those synergies up and down the entire roster, this is what happens. Like this is what the result of that is. And if anything, I think what I probably discounted or underestimated coming into this season was those two shooters in particular,

Kevin Herder and Malik Monk and the difference that they would make in this rotation because is Malik Monk, a two-year $19.4 million deal, extremely reasonable for what's been one of the best bench players in the NBA this season so far. Kevin Herder acquired by trade for Justin Holiday, Mo Harkless, who is not currently in the NBA, but may or may not be working out for the Lakers at any given moment, and a protected first round pick. Those are just great moves that have paid off in such huge ways and have really stabilized this rotation and made everything kind of makes sense.

Like now all of a sudden, Davy on Mitchell can just like be a star in exactly the way they need him to be coming off the bench and shutting people down. Like everyone kind of falls into a natural role when you get shooters like that. Yeah, it's funny. It's like a lot of these teams now who are stacking draft picks are kind of working with the assumption that like, you know, they'll just pull a bunch of lottery tickets and some will be good and some won't. And then they'll just keep the ones that work. And then they'll trade a million picks for Jejante Murray and then we'll solve it that way. But like, I almost wonder if there's a market inefficiency to be had where there's. There's like a lot of good players who just simply don't fit.

And the teams themselves are a little over leverage because they just like, instead of trying to work these players in or giving them like 10 to 15 minutes a game, they can get a first round pick. And so the Kings just jumped on that. And it's been one of the best decisions front office moves in at least the past year or so. But I will say like if we're talking about teams with the Pacers who are like one injury away, if the Kings lose a bonus who got. God help him. He must be living in an ice bath at this point because all he does is like rub up against his like his granite body is just slamming into larger men for like 30 minutes a game. It's a real hot time. If he goes out like Lord help them. I think this team could be one of the worst teams in the NBA very quickly. They really need him just like structurally, functionally, much less to your point about the rotation. I think Mike Brown has actually done a pretty good job of like duct taping together that second unit sometimes. Sometimes. Chimesey Metu does not always have great moments,

but they've gotten really good spot minutes out of Trey Lyle's just being, I guess like the Mari Spates of this team. He just comes in and guns away, and he ends up with like a crazy amount of points in 10 to 15 minutes. Shows to Moose Spates. You know, every team needs a guy like that. Less green energy, yeah. Yes.

But talk about a green light. This guy thought felt he had a green light on the Warriors, Splash Brothers. He was like, nah, that light is green for me. Sustomo spates. How do we feel about the beam? Love it. I love it.

I love a bit. It's so unnecessary and so silly, but, like, it's great. I look forward to all the time. Like, when they make the big, like, pomp and circumstance of, like, lighting the beam, like, Sabonis goes and hits the button that clearly has not connected to the beam whatsoever. Like, I love it. It's incredible. I love when any team has some bit or some gimmick that's just, like, completely.

completely divorced from what every other team is doing and just gives them such a unique. You go to a Sixers game and you hear the theme coming on at the end of a Sixers win, that's just a great vibe to have. And I'm feeling the same things from the beam. I'm feeling a lot of good energy. We love the beam. Get more out of your holiday week with Fandul, because new customers get $125 in free bets guaranteed when you place your first $5 bet.

So we're going into Thanksgiving. week. I like both the Kings and the Celtics to hit their over in their game on Friday. The two best offenses in the NBA, absolutely scintillating the Kings, flirting with NBA history with their offensive efficiency earlier this week and over the course of this early season. And honestly, any game with the Celtics and the Kings, I might look at that over pretty closely just because of how much they are scoring. Fandul is now live in Maryland, getting on the action. with great offers, boosts, and more. Just download the Fandual Sportsbook app.

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See terms at sportsbook. Fandul.com. Gambling problem, call 1-800 gambler or visit Fanduel.com slash RG in Colorado, Iowa, Michigan, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Illinois, and Virginia. 1-800 next step or text next step to 5334-2-1-888-78-9-7777 or visit ccpg.org

slash chat in Connecticut, 1-8009 with it in Indiana, 1877770 stop in Louisiana. Visit MD gambling help.org in Maryland, Tennessee Redline, 1-800-9-9-9-7-89. Visit KSgamblinghelp.com in Kansas, 1-800-5-22-2.4.2. 24700 in Wyoming or visit www. www.1-800 gambler.net in West Virginia. All right, wise, why don't you go? Yeah, my team, man, that I want to bring to the potluck, another team that we touched on briefly,

but I want to get into is the Cavs. I truly think that they are in the same tier as the Bucks as the Celtics. I promise you that. They are second in net rating right now. third on defense, which is like, that's a big deal when you play Garland and Mitchell as much as you play them. And sixth in offense, okay? Like, this is real.

And years ago, my man Tom Habistro put out an article that was just like 20 games into the year, we basically know who the hell you are. And like 20 games in, damn near, this is a bona fide championship contender. And the reason why I'm saying that, I watched them play Golden State, who's having their struggles or whatever, but I think if, you know, in a series right now, we would be like Golden State's as formidable as anybody because they'd cut the rotation and all that stuff.

And they basically got out-executed at the end, championship medal type of stuff. These guys have done this literally hundreds of times over the years. They could do execute down the stretch and crunch time with their eyes closed in a way that the cabs have not reached that. level. And what I will say about the Bucks and the Celtics, talented and greatest they may be, nobody thinks they're going to just out-execute and just be so precise in the biggest moments in big games in the playoffs. Nobody believes that.

No, not a couple of Swiss watches, those two. No, they're not. They are not. And so because that, to me, is Cleveland's main deficiency and not talent, Man, I really think they're a championship level and worthy team. Just the talent, by talent, I think it's clear. You know, it's just the newness of it, the youngness of the core, you know, because that shit just always works against teams in the playoffs. You know, I can't have it. And the last thing I'm going to say, man, speaking of Golden State again,

Garland and Mitchell are Splash Brothers, okay? These guys are combining for 18-3s again. game shooting it at 42% collectively. That's ridiculous. And no, they're not the level of shooters that Clay and Steph are, but because of the juice that they got on the ball, they can leverage their shooting in ways that is just incredible for the offense that allows them to play these two bigs. And this is just an exciting team.

This is fun. This is really dope to watch. Well, especially when, as you mentioned, why, it's like they're probably. primary problem right now is like closing games together. That's been a little touch and go. Some of that execution stuff, but they're both young and new. They're both working in Mitchell and like,

again, still getting used to their new backcourt in the shape of it. And they have so many guys who are just going to get better by virtue of being 20 and 21 years old over the course of the year. And so that's your starting point. You're already showing elite signs on both sides of the ball. I think there's been a couple of blips defensively

that has J.B. Bickerstaff freaked out a little bit to the point that Lamar Stevens is now a starter on this team. Yeah, they came up like 132 the other night in a win, but like Jesus Christ. It happens. It happens. But like I don't mind it. I don't mind going through those kinds of growing pains when you've already shown that in aggregate you are going to be a high level defense.

You just need to work out some of these kinks. You need to figure out who goes where, like who is playing the big minutes. And some of that is going to be by feel. Some of that's going to be as we saw against Atlanta on Monday. Chetty Osman is your closing three in this game. And that's just what it's going to be because he's having a good night and he's shooting it well and moving well.

And some nights it's going to be Lamar Stevens, some nights is going to be Keros Lavert. It's going to be a little mix and match. But those four guys around them, that's as talented a four as you're going to find anywhere in the league between Evan Mobley and Jared Allen on your front line, Donovan Mitchell and Darius Garland, your back court.

That is formidable as hell. And that's going to give a lot of teams, a lot of problems as they try to figure out how to scheme around them. Right. So six on offense, third on defense, second in net rating. Everything suggests that this is a, an elite team, best point differential in the east.

Oh, actually in the NBA as well. They're right above the sun. So best point differential in the NBA. I guess the question is how much of the defense is built around Allen. And as you saw in recent games when he's not around, how poorly it can go without him to clean up all the messes there. Maybe that's a function of this team being new, as you guys are suggesting,

and they just need to rely on him a little bit more than they typically would. I would also say, like, seems to be important when you base your defense. around protecting the rim with two center-sized players and one of the best rim protectors in the NBA. It's starting to feel like that thing where Alan is the guy who makes them a good defense and Mowgli is the guy who makes them a great defense.

And when you pull out Allen and you're just relying on Mowgli strictly as your full-time five over big minutes, it doesn't quite work yet. And maybe it never will. Maybe he's never going to be that guy. But I think what Mowbly does do now is give you the flexibility by virtue of, oh, we're just going to throw this guy at Jalen Brown. And he's going to hold up and we're going to win this game.

There just aren't many guys who can do that at his size while also giving you the shot, like the shot protection around the rim while also rebounding at that level while also being able to punish mismatches in some cases. So it does feel like Alan is just like structurally a little more important to them right now than Mobley is. I just like Allen's just junk pale garbage can mentality,

not just on defense but on offense. Where it's just like he catches everything. I know this is like the NBA. and everybody's supposed to have hands. They don't, folks. And this dude catches everything around the rim when it's given to him, and he'll finish shit.

Like, he'll finish offensive putbacks. I love what he's doing on that. And with Mowbly, some of his off-the-bounce stuff, it looks nicer than it is effective right now. But whatever, keep doing that shit, please. And then every now and again, Rob, he's showing that little turnaround jump, jump right hook.

Yep. That looks pretty promising, which again, these are things that you're going to need in high leverage possessions where, you know, they might gum up whatever Donovan and Garland are able to do

with help and with switches. And guess what? You got to beat a little guy and you have to have a go-to move that you need to finish or get fouled on. And I just love what they got in their core. You know, the benches,

the benches, you know, his touch and go but it's exciting I'm excited to see what they're going to do for the rest of the year I also just want to spotlight what might be my favorite moment

of this season so far which is Donovan Mitchell accidentally stealing Evan Mobley's 10th rebound for a double double and then Jared Allen just staring him down for two minutes

wonderful stuff wonderful stuff from this team on the court wonderful stuff in the bits let's keep it going let's keep the vibes going Alan might be one of the best bit guys in the NBA tremendous bid guy

I don't know if like if any of the listeners at home get a chance to watch like the lead pass streams and thus you get to see the big boards in Cleveland or whatnot he often has like legitimate comedic timing on some of these things he's legitimately good at this stuff good and super self-aware he's um he is so different from so many of these NBA guys

won't get into the nitty gritty but like just seems like a normal normal, down home type of guy, and it's very refreshing. All right. Well, pivoting now to a team that is anything but normal, I have the Los Angeles Lakers who were so damn close to their fourth straight win on the season. They only got to four last season. This would have tied their longest winning streak from last season, but now, unfortunately,

they fell to five and 11 after some explosive moments with Pat Beverly, throwing DeAndre Aiton over Austin Reeves. Just briefly on that, I got to say, good on Pat Bev. Really? I agree that, yeah, Devin Booker and DeAndre Aiton were just being dixed to Austin Reeves, which seems like something every NBA team has to do once in their life. It's a real right of passage this season. But like, he was literally standing over Reeves, Aiton was.

and he wasn't even involved in the play beforehand, so he didn't really have much to say to him. He just wanted to get into an extra thing. And Bev probably went a little too far, but I thought he had the right idea in standing up for his teammate. Like, I do not fault him whatsoever. I'm just not going to be on the good on Pat Bev corner

very often in life. He does feel like a guy who goes 150% way too far with every escalation. It's like he's not somebody who's got his, toe on the line. He's like way past in the wilderness, past the line, you know. But whenever guys are doing the, oh, we're going to, you know, punk the white American NBA guy thing is like, it's tired.

It's old. By the way, Austin Reeves, really tough player. He's not soft. Like, this guy plays with a level of confidence and toughness that, like, this shit is unwarranted and stupid. So yeah, I'm with you Justin on that. And, you know, DeAndre Aten, give me a break, bro. Like, you know what I'm saying?

Like, dunk the basketball once over a six-for-three guy and then start towering over dudes. Please get out of here, fam. Well, and if you're going to punk the white American player, like, do it right. You know, Kevin Garnett was on all fours barking at Liquid Hour. And this is the best you got. That's true. I mean, Booker talks a lot of shit and he could get annoying if you're the opposing team.

I get it. But he could back it up, whereas, like, Aton's like, all right, buddy. make make a couple more jump shots and then you could loom over a guy you weren't even defending at the time. Anyway, I really want to talk about the Lakers, not only because they've been playing well, question mark lately, but Anthony Davis has just been unbelievable with LeBron out over the past five games. So last night he had 37, 21, 5, and 5 before that 30, 18 and 3 steals, 38, 16, and 4 blocks, 37, 18, 24, 14, 3 and 2. It's old school New Orleans Anthony Davis. So on the positive side, it's great to see him just dominate.

On the negative side, I guess the team is now, like those old New Orleans teams really built to empower him and to put him position where he has to do everything. And so I guess the question was long term is like, are you encouraged by this stretch? Do you think like this could be an inflection point where like they get old AD back, LeBron comes and this team can maybe make something of it? it or are you more concerned where it's like, yeah, they have old ADB back. They're winning a couple of games against some of the worst teams in the league, but big picture it doesn't matter as much.

No, I'm not more concerned. I think because this is not something he can't replicate when LeBron comes back. It's just run a bunch of LeBron and AD picking rolls around shooting. This is what happens when you do that, right? And he's doing this with Russ. That's where it worries me. It's like when Bronn comes back, Russ's natural position. becomes more muddied

because he's not going to if he plays with Bronn he won't have the ball as much or maybe he will maybe LeBron's just like fuck it man I don't I don't care about having a ball I don't maybe

he's never done that before but you know he's 40 now so we'll see that's the only thing that I'd be worried about but this like this is something he can do while playing with LeBron James

so I'm not surprised by this when AD plays his hardest his talent allows for him to be one of the very elite players in the NBA. I think we knew this. As a matter of effort with this guy, and it has been for like two plus years.

He ain't played this hard since the bubble. Think about that. He has not played this hard consistently, I should say, since the NBA bubble, which feels like an eternity ago. So, yeah, these are the results of, you know, trying. And that's where we hope he can take it and build on it and stretch it when, you know, he's not running pick and roll with Austin Reeves or Dennis Schroeder. He's running it with LeBron James.

And he's getting even better looks out of those scenarios because I think there's just a big enough body of work at this point to know that if you just run AD in any kind of pick and roll with basically anybody and anything resembling decent spacing, he's going to get pretty good looks out of it. And I think what we've seen in this stretch where he's been particularly effective is he's not waiting for the great looks. Like he's taking it when in those situations where he's still like kind of covered on the role and just powering through people and finishing and finishing over and through potential shot blockers. He's he's looking and moving incredible. And if you can just get any like again, get LeBron back, just keep this kind of energy and this kind of momentum and that kind of mentality going, then you hopefully can have basically every minute that AD is on the floor. He's playing with either LeBron or Westbrook. And he and Westbrook, those lineups have actually been pretty. good offensively overall.

Like they're actually a pretty good pair. It's just the three of them together. That's the problem. Yeah. 80 hard catches off of the roll. Finishing over two guys at the rim. Going to the line and finishing through contact. That's one thing I should have brought up.

15 for 16 from the line last night. He had another gamer who is 18 for 21 against the Detroit Pistons, taking very few threes. And when he is, it's just not making them. So that is a deterrent in its own right. It's just like he's doing all the things. things I think we would hope for going into this season. And the biggest play probably was when he went to the floor last night where he hit his wrist and it looked like he might go out for a little bit of

a stretch to the point where like, I believe it was Kevin Harlan was like, I spent a lot of time on the floor. And I was like, yeah, first time, my friend. But he played through that for better or worse. I thought it was funny after the game. It was like, oh, it was my funny bone. But it's just like, he's doing all the things I think you would hope for. And yeah, like, when LeBron's back, maybe that leads to good things. I just think like I keep coming back to the same point. And I won't belabor it because I've said it a bunch. They had one or two more guys.

How much easier would this be? Like if he was catching more freely in the lane because it was space and people weren't crowding, expecting them to just dump it off to him. Like how this team would be pretty good. We would be talking about them in a mix of a West that is suddenly pretty crowded and pretty wide open. Bro, have you guys been watching Kyle Kuzma lately? Like, it's pretty good.

It's insane. it's insane. I know we say this every fucking show, but it's crazy. The players they just let walk away from LeBron and AD who are perfect for what they are trying to do.

It's craziness. Well, I know we've already been in the conversations about, oh, can they get Miles Turner? Can they get Buddy Healed? Can they get on somebody's? Nice. I want to zoom out, though.

Like, does AD playing like this change your, perspective at all on like do the Lakers need to trade these sacred future first round picks? Like do they have even more of a responsibility to do it now? No. I don't know. I don't like I just think the price tag is so, like that's an unreal price tag. It's just too much. You know, like New Orleans is about to get a top 10 guaranteed pick out of this deal, you know, probably if nothing happens going forward. It's like, You have a shot at number one top five picks with any Laker pick in the future that you get if it's unprotected.

And like the idea that's like, oh, I need two of those for Miles Turner who's never even made an All-Star team. Like, what the hell are we talking about here? I think the price tag is too steep. But, man, it would be nice to have Miles Turner on this squad for sure. My opinion hasn't changed because I had been consistent throughout. They should have traded the picks before the season. So they would have had a chance. to fucking, like, be competitive.

If they were 500 right now, they would be in the play-in mix. And then you're in a play-in game with LeBron, James, and Anthony Davis. Let's see what happens. Like, worst-case scenario, that is where they are. Like, you signed LeBron.

You traded all those picks for AD. You bought the ticket. Like, see through the vision that you started off with. Don't, don't, like, pearl clutch at the end of this and just, like, ruin and waste good years of LeBron. And now, Anthony, it just makes, it makes no sense. It's just tough. It's tough.

It's, it's like. Like Rob Blinkie, you want to win trades now? You gave up every single wing that you freaking had on your team in one offseason and you want to win trades now? Okay. This is a great point, though, in the conversation of do these regular season games matter

and how much? Because like we've been, you know, worried about the clippers and worried about the warriors and worried about the wolves. Those teams are in dramatically better position standings-wise than the Lakers are to the point that as we're talking about, It starts affecting your thinking as an organization.

It changes the math on can we even get to the record we need to by the end of the year? Just because you had a bad 16 games. Yeah. Yeah. Well, the regular season overall just seems way more difficult than it has in recent years. It's crazy. Yeah. And you have like certain teams that are almost built for the postseason where now the regular season has become the big battleground.

The clippers are probably the prime example of this. Yeah, you could be built for the post season, but you got to get there, fam. Exactly. Like, Kauai has to get there. Paul George has to get there. You need to figure out a team. Like, can you play small ball throughout the entire season

to the point where you're like, you don't even roster a second big man and like your current big man is struggling relative to like how he's played in the past? Like it's just such this weird, like almost bizarre world in the NBA now. Justin, Detroit just beat Denver. And I know I'm the highest in the world on Denver.

They just beat them last night on the road without Cade Cunningham. Just straight up beat them. Like, they were just better than them last night. That team is now 4 and 15, okay? Like, this is the most high level all around NBA play we've ever seen in our lives. I don't think that's even up for debate at this point. It is hard to grind out wins in this NBA.

So, yeah, I guess to your point, man, having Miles Turner and a couple of other guys that are not just high-level NBA players, but legitimate rotational guys and not Wembenyama. I mean, not Wembeen Yama. What's his name? Wendon Gabriel. Can we start calling him Wendon Yama?

Yeah, man. It's tough. It's just, man, League Pax is a freaking treat every single night, not to sound like an NBA shill. Yeah. Well, this probably takes me to my take here, which is, I wonder if we're seeing a change of the guard here in the NBA. And like, maybe we won't like acknowledge it now. Maybe like five years

from now, we'll look back on this and say, maybe this was the point where the NBA we thought we knew has pivoted to something else. I wrote a little bit about this on the site a couple weeks ago, specifically talking about some of the super teams built in 2019, the Clippers, the Nets, the Lakers, and how much they've struggled and how just bizarre that is, because, like, for most of my adult life and your guys as well, like, we've known an NBA dictated by star aggregation about the off season almost dictating the final big picture race in the regular season in the playoffs. But now I'm looking at the standings. And like, yeah, we'll see some some shaking up here, but like the calves are number three in the east, followed by the Pacers,

wizards, and Hawks. In the West, it's the Suns, a team we expected to be in the mix, followed by the Jazz, the Kings, the Clippers, the Pelicans, the Blazers. Everything seems topsy-turvy in a way that I can't remember recently. Like, we've had, like, last season, the Bulls were pretty good, but then they faded. But I can't remember things just being so against expectations, preseason expectations, even this early in the season. Rob, what do you think is going on here?

Do you think this has staying power that these are the type of teams that are now coming to the four or this is like, is this small sample just wonkiness? It's a great question. I think if this kind of trend, like if the standings as they are now

are more or less where they are even a month from now, like going into the new year, I think we're probably due for a like, where did we get this so wrong conversation about so many of these teams and about so many of those, like just the comings and going

of certain franchises at the same time because you're right. Like this is no one quite expected that kind of layout, especially like four through eight in the Eastern Conference. Like that's just inexplicable from where we thought we were starting.

I don't know why that is exactly. And there's still enough counterpoints where like the Bucks are still kind of a super team. You know, they're not a super team in the way the Nets are, but they still have three all-star guys, if you include Brooke Lopez's kind of pre-Bucks career. We've been talking about the calves

and how loaded they are. The Warriors are still one of the most, most stacked and most expensive rosters in NBA history, and they could still win the championship. So, like, I'm not ready to totally, like, throw out old models yet or necessarily have that conversation, but just how unpredictable and inexplicable these standings are is something worth monitoring. And a lot of it ties into just the quality of play being so high across the board. Yeah, I think, one, the talent is crazy. That's a one. I think it's why people are talking about, like, expansion in the way that they are.

So, like, back in the days, man, just like 10 years ago, maybe even six years ago, you could count on like six teams being just horrible, right? Like, that's 18 wins, damn near on your schedule. If you're a good team, guaranteed, right? And so I think the talent is one thing, but I think competence is up across the board from management to coaching. Like, who's the Kurt Rambis of this current NBA? Like, it don't exist.

It's Linda Rambus. That's what I was about to say. There's no con in management, save for Rob Belinka. Like, across the board, people are using the best business practices available, whether it be three-point shooting, running people off of the three-point, whatever the case may be. Like, the competence across the board has made it so that, like, there's just not a lot of crap.

It just doesn't exist anywhere. And I think that starts from top down, from, you know, everybody's like, oh, I need to get 3ND wings. Oh, I need to get this. Oh, I need rent protection. Oh, I need this. Everybody understands they need these things to make their team good. And so everybody's gone out and acquired them, even the horrible teams. And so, you know, I think that's what we're seeing, just a level of competence.

And everybody having a better understanding of what winning NBA basketball just like, bro, like you used to be able to create advantage by taking threes. That's insane. Just by taking threes, taking shots that are worth more. That was an insane advantage back in the days. Those kinds of advantages don't exist anymore. Yeah. And in the same way, like, the NBA has caught up to just like the math of it all.

I do wonder if one of the byproducts, one of the ripple effects of that 2019 offseason, which I wrote about, is that it spurred teams like the Bucks, the next wave of teams that were trying to protect their superstars, to keep them in house to build with the same sort of aggressiveness and boldness and devil may care about the future in order to make their current product very good. Like I made a distinction between a team like the Bucks and the Cavs who brought a superstar into their existing core just to be the best possible version of what they are. We never used to see that, especially from the smaller market teams.

which is why I think like the hawks and the wolves and those moves that were made over this past off season where the most like eye-catching, most symbolic of like maybe some sort of like sub-genre or sub-paradigm paradigm shift of what we'd had seen before, where now LeBron almost spurred everybody else to be good right now on the timeline where his team was supposed to dominate. and if anything, his team is now getting old and injured and is over-reliant on superstars who are just not playing as much because that's one of the big kind of quiet things about some of those teams, like Kauai, Paul George even, not playing. Obviously, Kyrie and KD didn't play a lot.

The Lakers thing is literally one bad trade, though. If they would have did that superstar hunting for a guy as good as Drew Holiday and not Russell Westbrook, they wouldn't be this horrible. You know, like they literally just got the wrong freaking guy. Yeah. And I also think like part of it is they probably, that was a clear indication of teams overreaching and doing too much to welcome a superstar in-house to the point where they just like completely turn their franchise over to guys who probably aren't fit to be making those sort of high-level decisions. So it's a very long-winded way of saying. I almost wonder if like that created an environment where every team wants to win now, which is why.

we have so much competition. Like there are a lot of just very, very good teams, but not as many super teams. Well, there's a lot of really good young talent, too, coming into its own at the same time that the LeBrons and stuff are aging out, which I think it's actually a pretty good backdoor into my take, which is that I think we're going to see a changing of the guard and the All-Star selections this year to reflect some of that. And one result is, I think, weirdly enough, I think Jeremy Grant is going to be an All-Star this season.

and I think Damian Lillard will not. And I think that's just a result of, one, Grant has been awesome, like a real starring presence for a really good Blazers team, absolutely essential to their defense. And for as great as Dame has been, he's already missed about a third of Portland's games.

I think he's just going to get outflanked by Deere and Fox and SGA in particular in terms of the guard categories. And I'm looking at the front court in the West, which is good, but includes Anthony Davis and Paul George, and some guys who might be worthy all-stars, but also might be potential injury replacements

come February. And I'm looking at Jeremy Grant, and I'm saying, you know what? I think you might be at the front of the line for this thing. So you're saying both Jeremy Grant is having himself a year, but also like maybe the wing front court depth

is more shallow at like the star level. When I lay it out, here's what I'm thinking. Here are what I consider to be the locks for the all-star starters. Steph, Luca, Yokic, and probably on precedent and talent and history alone, LeBron is going to be in there.

The fifth spot, I think, is probably going to be Zion. I think he's just going to get voted in. And plus he's been great when he's played. I think he's probably going to be in there. So then you're looking at five bench spots, two wildcard spots, Jaws a lock, Devin Booker is a lock.

I think Lowry Markinen is kind of a lock at this point. He better be a lock. Maybe that's a sub take in itself, but I think Laurie Markinen is a lock. there. And so then it's basically Paul George, A.D., Deeran Fox, or if you want, Damien Lillard,

Brandon Ingram, Townsend Gobert, Sabonis is in there, Desmond Bain is in there. I think there's a lot in that group. There's a lot of glut. But if I'm looking at the standings and I'm thinking about like how coaches tend to vote, who Adam Silver tends to reward with injury replacements, all of that kind of stuff, Jeremy Grant is that

kind of player. And it would be weird for him to get the spot over Damian Lillard, but usually these things go front court for front court if it comes down to that. And there's just more opportunity to box out, even someone like Lowry Markinen, who's been great. But if you told me that Jeremy Grant is even better than Markinen between now and the All-Star Selection time, that seems more plausible than, you know, Dane beating out John Morant. Yeah, I guess the question is, does do the Blazers have staying power? Because right now, 10 and 7, when in the West, every team is pretty much 10 and 7 plus or minus like 1.

two wins, plus one point differential. So it puts them at sixth. I mean, I think they're good, but they're definitely one of those teams where I'm like, huh, let's give me like five more games and I might quickly flip on that. They had a tough homestand too. Like it's just at a time where it was like the momentum was all really building for them and the air got led out of the balloon in a way that was a little disappointing. But I think there's enough staying power to the defense. And I think some of it's just like getting Dame back healthy when he hasn't been available for some of these games. Right. Yeah. It's tough for a while. is moving soul stock.

Listeners are not going to get that joke, but that is a very good joke. Juan, what's your take? I don't have a take. I didn't know I was supposed to come with a take. Happy Thanksgiving, everyone. Do you have a Thanksgiving take?

What is like, are you a? A Thanksgiving take. Are you a pecan over pumpkin guy? Where can we take this? If the cranberry sauce isn't made from scratch, throw it in the trash. That's a waste of... That's a bad take. Everybody, I can't do the stock cranberry sauce.

Don't give it to me. Stop putting your turkeys in the oven hole. You got to spatch cot that thing. Or actually dismember it, right? like actually cook the breast, the dark meat and the white meat separately. Because they cook at different temps. And,

uh, you know, if you cook it to the temp that you need your dark meat at, your white meat's going to be dried to crap. So just stop throwing your damn turkey. I know it looks nice on the table. But for the, for those of us who actually like to eat the food and not look at it,

it's bad for it. So, so figure out a way to, uh, take your turkey apart and cook it properly. What else do I got? A lot of style versus substance problems with the turkey in general. It's ridiculous.

You should have seen Rob's eyes light up as soon as you started talking about spash-coaching. Because Rob knows. I get it. I both get it and spatch-cocking any bird is just a delightful way to spend an afternoon. You know, it's just like slow roast that thing. You get to keep the freaking. spine for stock. Come on now. Come on, y'all. Give with it. All right. On that note, let's wrap it up here. Just a reminder to keep sending in those suggestions to our suggestion box. Suggestion box gc.

at gmail.com. I have to say, just love all the suggestions thus far. We've seen a lot of people email in. So thank you very much. The positivity from those emails, especially in contrast to other social media platforms has just been an absolute delight. When people are like, I love the show. You guys have great chemistry. Like I listen every week and then you look at Twitter. It's like, fuck you. How dare you not talk about the Blazers for one week in a row?

They won five games. So thank you. How do you think they're going to feel about the fact that I push Damien the alert off the All-Star team? Is that going to be received well? Hopefully they won't listen is late. The soccer mom's not going to be happy. Yeah.

But yeah, keep sending those in. I think we'll probably soft launch. segment maybe next week maybe the following week we'll see but we appreciate it this far but until then have a happy thanksgiving everybody and thank you to isaiah blakely thanksgiving enthusiast we'll see you next time same place same podcast