The Ringer NBA Show - New York’s Own Kemba Walker Is Headed to the Knicks. Plus: Chicago Is Loading Up, the Pelicans and Mavericks Disappoint in Free Agency, and More. | Group Chat

Episode Date: August 4, 2021

We’re two days into free agency and the hits just won’t stop coming. First, Justin, Rob, and Wos celebrate Kemba Walker, pride of New York City, planning to sign with the Knicks after the Thunder buy out his contract (0:30). Then they get into all the other action happening around the league, including DeMar DeRozan joining forces with Zach LaVine, Lonzo Ball, and Alex Caruso on the Bulls (11:49), the Heat’s bizarre age gap (25:53), the Lakers’ additions to their new big three (35:23), and the disappointing offseasons from the Pelicans and Mavericks so far (43:58). Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny Lambre Associate Producer: Sasha Ashall Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

On R2C2, C-Sabathia and Ryan Rucco guide listeners through everything going on in the MLB, NBA, and NFL. They also talk to friends, athletes, and celebrities about the world of sports and much more. Check out R2C2 with C-C-2 with C-Sabathia and Ryan Ruko on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. To group chat, I am Justin Barrier. Joining me today, as always, Rob Mahoney, Big Was. Gentlemen, our Lord and Savior of New York City is coming home. London or England national team didn't bring it back, but Kemba Walker can always go home.

Waz, as a man of the people of New York City, specifically the New York City people, how are you feeling about one Kemba Walker, the pride of the Apollo Theater of Rice High School, going back to the New York Knickerbockers? I mean, you know, before we get to the realities of this situation, just on the sentimental level, it's a huge deal. specifically because Kemba Walker is kind of the like he is not kind of he's the last of the

mohicans he's the last of the New York City Hoopers of any significant relevance right it's basically him and Lance Stevenson and I think Lance Stevenson is now in like uh Siberia or something so you know Kemba being the last of the New York City Hooper is carrying that mantle and you know let's face it the thing about Kimba that that makes this specials, like, he's not Stefan Marbury. He's not round our test. Like, he doesn't have a complicated personality. Like, he is easily one of the most lovable hoopers of his generation, like regardless of his New York affiliation. So, you know, he's going to embrace everything that this means sentimentally. And, you know, it's going to be great. Now, if we can get to the

un, you know, heartwarming parts of this, his knee has been bummed. He's had a bum knee for two years now. Right? So, and he just got bought out of two years of a $74 million deal to leave, right? So that says a lot about his medical and what teams think about whether he or not he's going to be able to perform. So that's something that we got to monitor. But if he can get right at all, he's going to give the Knicks a lot of what they need as far as shot creation, offensive initiation in the pick and roll shooting, you know, like the guy can actually make an open jump shot. I think if he's healthy, he's a perfect fit for what they're trying to do. But, you know, the health factor is huge.

You can't downplay it. Well, and for the cost, you know, like the fact that the Knicks are operating on a budget and they can still get a player of Kemba's hypothetical healthy caliber. That's a big deal. But I think, Waz, I think you're right in that the Thunder were willing to buy him out. And this is a Thunder team that has long played every veteran asset. said it's had to this point to try to spin it into more picks. I think that says a lot about what their medical staff must make of Kemba's knee

and his long-term trade value otherwise. Because if they thought there was any chance, they were going to get something for him down the line. This would not be happening. Yeah. So they have roughly 10 million in caps-based index, so you assume he'll get something around that, maybe a little bit under.

I got to say, though, like I agree with everything you guys are saying about the encore implications, but I care more about the vibes, man. Of course. This is incredible. This just continues the Knicks as completely turning around the Dolan Era and becoming just a lovable, like, spunky underdogs. If Kemma gives them two massive games where MSG just goes wild, or if he gives them one halfway decent playoff game, this is a win for both him in MSG. No, this move is going to have a 100% approval rate.

Right. Like, think about the minutes he's taking. Like, I mean, you're swapping out Alfred Payton minutes. for Kimball Walker minutes. I mean, that's a huge thing. Yeah, that's definitely getting rid of a Dotson for Tesla. And, you know,

and here's the thing. MSG, obviously, when we finally got crowds back and, you know, at least MSG Network was smart enough to send their announcers to the game and not having them watch it from their couch, eating pretzels.

Like other broadcasts were doing, Like when during the playoffs, if you can listen to the MSG broadcast when Clyde and Mike Breen were calling the games, Clyde, Walt Clyde Frazier, the Knicks MSG color commentary guy, obviously a legend in the game. I've been listening to this guy for literally decades and he does not get excited, right? Like, that's not his thing. He's kind of like a staid. Dude, he uses colorful language, but his temperament is generally like consistent. He has one register. Yes.

He cares more about swatches than actual color commentary. And during those Knicks playoff games, Clyde was getting swept up in it, right? Like, this is a team that got destroyed in five games by the Hawks. But like, during those moments, even Clyde can help me be like, wow, this is special. And so, yeah, the vibes that are going to be generated

from any excellent Kimball Walker play is going to be must-see TV for somebody like me. Having said that, though, We do need to talk about the rest of the New York next off season, which pretty much came down to signing Evan Fornier, which seems like a pretty reasonable deal. It gives them more shooters, as Waz was alluding to. But other than that, they pretty much just rolled everybody back from last year's team, kept all Tom Tibido's favorite grinders. We got Nerlin's Noel on a new contract, Eric Rose on a new contract, Alec Burke's on a new contract. seems like it's going to be the same team plus Kemba plus fournier.

Rob, does this change anything in terms of where the Knicks are and the tier system of the Eastern Conference? Not terribly. You know, this is still a team that's going to fall somewhere in the middle. But I think all the moves that they've made to this point to kind of keep most of their core intact, punch it up here and there, that's where, you know, Kemba kind of takes you over the top into a net positive type of offseason. Now, you can have a net positive offseason and still regressed to the mean a little bit,

still have a little worse injury luck next year than you did last year. There are just so many variables that swung the Knicks way last time around that I would be surprised if they even had the same record or improved upon it. I would kind of expect them given that the rest of the East is kind of steadily improving. I think they might drop a few wins, but they're still going to be a really competitive team. They're still going to be really formidable. My question is, you know, can they maintain the level of defense that that they're they did with, you know, they're losing Reggie Bullock, who's a really good perimeter defender,

swapping him out for Evan Fornier, who is not. Not. And none of their point guards are really great in that regard either. So you're losing that first wave of defense. Can, you know, a healthier Mitchell Robinson, can Julius Randall, can RJ Barrett? Can those guys pick that up, Ner Orleans-Nuel, as you mentioned, re-signed, really important for them too. That's kind of what I'm worried about because defense was how they won. And so if their defense isn't elite, what is this team going to be. Yeah, and I think if Knicks management is playing the game kind of right, in the sense that they're in a position to strike gold if disgruntled superstar game happens, and somebody's like, I need to get to the Knicks, right? Because I think the hard in trade is very

instructive in that Brooklyn didn't give up anything, right? I don't think the Knicks can't put together a better package tomorrow with what's on their roster and mortgage in future picks, et cetera, et cetera, if that opportunity presents itself, right? And so they're still in the catbird seed for something like that. If, say, and don't aggregate as relax, I'm just saying, if Dame Lillard says, I want to be in New York, they're in proposition to make something like that happen, right? Whether it be with some decently intriguing young pieces like a RJ, like even to some people, Mitchell, Mitchell Robinson or Obie Topping, and, you know, future first, et cetera, et cetera, right?

Like, they're in a position to do that. However, you know, the thing about being competent in the way that they are, in the way of being like a sixth seed or something, seventh seed, you completely take yourself out of the ability to land a Jalen Green, to land a Cade Cunningham, these type of franchise altering potential young guys, right? So you got to tow that line. I think if you're the Knicks and you believe in what you're doing, you believe in your market, you believe in, you know,

the prestige associated still, even somehow with Madison Square Garden in the Knicks franchise, then I think they're playing it right. I think other teams, like, say, a OKC, this would be imprudent, right, to not be trying to get lottery tickets because nobody's going to ever force to trade the OKC, right? So different markets present different paths to getting to contention, right? Like when people are always complaining about Rob Polinka's moves, I'm like, guys, the margin for error when you're the Lakers, when Anthony Davis is forcing his way to your team,

and LeBron James is signing with y'all after five years a complete and utter pathetic putrid performances, you don't have to operate the same way Memphis does. You don't have to win on the margins. Your reality is much different. I think the Knicks are operating under that premise. Like, if we could get big guys to come here. Right.

I mean, the Knicks tried the draft pick route, and it did not go well. In fact, Christoph Przingas was their one hit, and he openly rebelled against them eventually. I mean, I was talking to Kevin O'Connor about this a little before, too, and it is interesting. Like, when was the last star-star-calibre player who actually hit the open market.

I guess it was Kauai. Like, it just seems like this is how star players are going to get where they need to go nowadays. And to your point was, it does seem like they have at the very least tradable contracts. They're a little bit longer than I would have liked.

I don't know why they did three years on some of these guys. Maybe we'll find out that a lot of the third years are options or non-guarantees like they did for some of their previous free agents. I'm curious about that happening. My one concern, in addition to what I just mentioned,

is also who is the second guy stars are going to want to team up with because I also don't remember anybody just starting fresh in a big market. Like it was Kyrie and KD. It was AD. It was probably Carmelo.

It was probably Carmelo Anthony. Right? With the Knicks. I guess LeBron would be the only one and he eventually. But they also had the raw means in order to flip those guys four star. And obviously LeBron has all these moves

plotted out a couple years from now. But, you know, so I think they put themselves in good position, it's a we'll see. Well, that's why you're cultivating the vibes. That's why you're having

Kimball Walker smiling and MSG every night on TV. Like that's, that's kind of part of your pitch at this point. Right. Yeah,

and they definitely have removed the stench of the Knicks like past, what, two decades, maybe even longer. It is a new day, although,

unfortunately, it's the same day as last season with Kemble Walker. So we'll see how that plays out. All right, let's get to some of the other bigger moves that have happened through God,

it's only been two plus days of free agency at this point. We're recording, by the way, at Wednesday at 10 a.m. So if anything happens throughout the course of the day, that's why we didn't account for it. I'm sure our takes would have been just fucking fantastic about it. But I want to do a little second guessing because I think we got most of the big moves out of the way here. And I want to start with the Chicago Bulls, another big market franchise who's making some moves.

Unfortunately, for Bulls fans, they're much splashier and much more interested in going in now. I was really interested in what the Bulls did on the first day of Free Agency. Monzo Ball got a lot of money, but he's the type of player that I think you want to pair with Zach Levine, a 3-and-D guy, can move the ball. Alex Caruso, I was like, okay, you're doubling down on defense, right? Caruso's maybe just pair him with Levine,

and then Caruso and Ball can be your defenders while Vucevic, Levine, power your offense. And then to Rosen happened, I'm like, what the fuck is going on here? Rob, can you make sense of this at all? Are you intrigued at all by this new power trio of ball, DeRosen, and Levine? I mean, I'm intrigued, but I've spent the last 24 hours trying to make sense of the DeRosen part

of it in particular, just because, as you mentioned, all of the value in shifting toward defense, in shifting toward a younger core, which was really important for them, given they just traded for Vukovic, who is, you know, not exactly developing at this point in his career. So you get some younger guys in there. And then you commit huge money to DeMard de Rosen, who I can see the appeal of it. I think what it comes down to is just like, they're going. goals are what their goals are, which is we need to make the playoffs this season, period. I was listening to a podcast with the movie critic Amy Nicholson, and she was talking about how

she reviews a movie against the scale of its ambition. And that's kind of what I'm starting to do with the Bulls is their ambition is to make the playoffs. Demarta Rosen is going to help you get there. The fit is going to be a little bit awkward. There's some diminishing returns with putting him alongside Levine and Vucovich. But you can see how that would get you to the end point that you want. If that's your goal, Derosen's absolutely going to help with that, and you can sort out the rest later. Right now, it's a talent play. It's let's get more quality

NBA players in here. And as we're saying, if Chicago is in this same group with New York and the L.A. teams as far as market size and appeal, maybe there's trades we made down the line to clear up whatever redundancies you see here. What did Amy have to say about the Russell Westbrook trade?

I think she's a Lakers fan, actually. So I'd be curious to hear. We'll get back to you on that. Sure. So if the question is, did the Bulls up their talent quotient this offseason, that's 100% yes. However, the guy who's going to be charged with making this fit in Billy Donovan, I don't really have the confidence that he can be creative enough to make this fit work. Specifically with DeRosen and Zach Levine, one playing the same position, right? Like, that's a one.

But two being guys who can't guard multiple positions, they're two bad defenders. So it's like doubly complicated when there's redundancies on offense. And unfortunately for the Bulls, redundancies on defense and their inability to play any, the both of them, if you're going to have them on the floor at the both times. But just humor me, guys. And as I put on my conspiracy hat really quickly. So our friend Brian Windhorst asked Levine about his deal and an extension. And I was interested in Zach Levine saying, I just want respect.

It's just a weird place to invoke the framing of respect as it pertains to your deal with your current team. So if I'm reading the tea leaves, I feel like I'm watching Levine read the tea leaves and he feels like he's not going to earn any respect from these cats. And I think DeRosen is his replacement. That's just what it feels like. It feels like they said, all right, we're not giving Zach Levine $200 million. We'll give DeRosen 85 instead. We think he's a close enough facsimile as a player as far as a ball dominant wing that

Zach Levine, you're not getting five years, 200 million from us. And he's going to be out of here. That's just me sort of reading the situation because I don't see. see how it makes sense to bring Demar DeRoson as a two guard who's, again, he's not a shooter, he's extremely bald. And I'm actually, I'm higher on DeRosen than most people are. I think he plays with a certain poise and a discipline that is valuable, even if he is a long two guy and he doesn't take threes and he's not a great defender.

But this seems like they brought in this guy's replacement. And like, just hearing somebody say, I want my. respect from the current employer? Like, I don't know how that doesn't raise eyebrows everywhere. I mean, he definitely feels, DeRosen definitely feels like leverage. He definitely feels like insurance in those conversations. And, I mean, Levine, yeah, I want my respect to me. Sounds like I want the max.

And I would understand why the Bulls would try to be negotiating that down. I don't know that they're going to get away from it. If they want to keep Levine, as I've kind of been talking myself into this, though, here's kind of what I'm thinking. Oh, I like it. Let's go. Lonzo Ball is not a half-court point guard. He's going to be off the ball strictly,

cutting, moving. That's great. And so then you basically have a situation where throughout the game, you have three guys you're balancing touches between in Levine, De Rosen, and Vuccovic. That can kind of work, you know, staggered to that two of them are on the floor at a time throughout most of the game.

You're balancing those lineups. That part of it makes some sense to me, especially because Levine is a really good off-ball player. Like, he's such a good shooter, and Vucovich can be such a good spacer that, again, if you want to give Billy Donovan credit for doing some creative stuff this season, we'll see if it happens.

You could basically play Derozen in the post more. You could work him inside more because Vujovic can space. So that flexibility, I think, can work. Again, it depends on how far outside the box they want to go, how they want to balance these lineups. But I think there's a universe in which, offensively, this could really make sense. And a lot of it comes from the fact

that Derozen has really evolved over the last couple years. as a playmaker. That, I mean, that completely transformed his game and his appeal. It doesn't change the central problem here, which is that, you know, he's probably more valuable to a team when he's filling a void of shot creation than when he's complimenting other stars. But I still think this kind of arrangement can work.

If this were Eric Spolstra, if this was Nick Nurse, if this were Rick Carlout, guys who have seen be crazy creative with the pieces that they have, have on offense and defense, I'd be like, I bet you those guys will figure out a way to make it work. Like, we all recall Dionne Waiters leading the heat to a 30 and 10 record down the stretch. Like, this shit was unthinkable and unimaginable, right? The way Spolster unlocked those cats. Billy Donovan ain't that. He's never demonstrated himself to be that. That's why I'm just like, eh. Well, what do you think about the three-guard lineup of Dennis Schrooter, Chris Paul, Shea,

Alexander. I mean, like, that took some creativity. It was making chicken salad out of chicken shit. So that's fair. Yeah, that 20-20 Thunder team is kind of the prototype for like, how do we, how do we get a group of like-minded and similarly, you know, built players to overachieve different players, mind you, but I think there's at least some kind of template there to work from if we're looking at Donovan's resume. Yeah. And there are opportunities, as you guys were alluding to, to get a little wild here. Like, one of the things, I think it was Kevin Pelton, I'm not sure brought up, is playing DeRosen is more of like a microball big man like he kind of did for that bubble run. I think that could be really interesting. It does

call into question, ask that distribution because then I don't know what you're doing with Vucevic and so you're playing Derozen more as a big, and at times with Vucevich isn't on the court. But there are options here. I guess my biggest concern, if this is a way to signal to Levine that they're moving on is what they paid in order to give up. To get the right to sign to Rosen. So they gave the spurs because they had already plunk so much money down for Ball and Caruso, that young Alfrucaminu, who they took on in the Busavich trades, who they now had to pay extra in order to offload a future first, which is insane.

And two future seconds, I believe they are likely to only have two first round picks from now until 2026, which begs the question. like if DeRosen Ball, Caruso, whoever you have left after Levine potentially leaves next off season is your future, like that's not much of a future. Like these could be very valuable picks. These picks can be more valuable than like

what the Nets are giving the Rockets per se. Well, and doing two sign and trades for two big money guys, the Bulls had to give up a lot of players. Like as far as I can tell, I think they only have nine players committed right now. Two of them are Kobe White and Troy Brown Jr. So, you know, they have a lot,

to resolve in terms of their depth, especially in the front court. You know, we don't know if they're going to... Well, that's actually a good question, though, because they did have this long run where they tried to go through the draft. They did the Orlando Magic thing

where they just didn't pick high enough. They ended up with more marketans and Wendell Carter's and guys, like you mentioned, Kobe White. Patrick Williams is someone who they're really counting on here. Do we have any expectation that he could be a guy who could take a leap maybe into, first of all, a two-way impact guy,

but also a star because they're kind of banking on somebody else rising to the fore here and completing this picture. Did you see anything last year that would suggest that this guy is going to be a future star in the NBA? I mean, I think he's, you know, he's obviously a second contract guy. I think he's going to be an NBA rotation player to be sure, maybe even a dead on starter. But a star in this NBA, I didn't see any. of that last year while admitting that I didn't watch like 12,000 minutes of Chicago Bulls tape either. But no, I don't, you know, I just think the Lori and Kobe White part of this is interesting because it just seems like they're done in Chicago. Because the idea that you would go out and give Caruso this type of money and Lanzo this type of money and DeMarne de Rosen while already having Zach Levitt.

Like, that's your wing rotation. Like, that's it right there. Where's Kobe White? So he's supposed to be your fifth guard or wing in all of this. And, you know, this guy was a top ten pick. I think those guys are out. And it'll be interested in to see what type of depth they could get. Or maybe they'll try to get future assets by moving those guys.

And all indications are that Lori is completely cooked. I mean, not cooked. He's done with the Bulls, specifically. it does seem that way, but his market is so thin right now. I kind of wonder if maybe he'll be back on a qualifying offer. And then that'll be, you know, basically we're going to do one more year together. We'll get you back on the open market as an unrestricted free agent and that'll be that. And the Bulls could use, frankly, any front court help they can get right now.

But as far as Pat Williams goes, I think I'm a little higher on him than you are was in terms of I see him as like a pretty solid, at least a pretty solid starter long term. and then you're playing upside from there. But he's 19 years old right now. So, you know, that is a, that's a very different timeline question than everything that is happening right now. If anything, that's kind of a bridge to, you know, once Vucovich is starting to decline, once some of these contracts are coming off the books,

whatever it is that happens with Zach Levine, that's kind of almost the next half era of Bulls basketball. And until then, he's more of a role player for them. Right. Yeah, I would love someone to swoop in and try to take a chance on marketing. Like, he had such a good start to his career, kind of tapered off. and large part because of injuries,

large part because the Bulls have had 60 coaches over the past couple of years. But like, you know, the Hornets, I believe, still have money if they didn't give Is Smith like $50 million, which I would do it. You know, Pelican, some other teams that with front court needs could be interesting.

You know something else that could be interesting? And I mean, Markinen would have to take below what I'm sure he thinks his market value is. But because Caruso is coming this way, could you swing a double sign-in-trade, sending him to the Lakers? You could, but I think,

the Lakers have so much money on their books at this point that being hard-capped is like a non-starter. The hard cap is the problem. And the Lakers let Caruso go. They had his bird rights because they're really just like, all right, we're going enough into the luxury tax here. Even though they've freaking just raked in the fucking dough the last few years by fielding teams that were not very expensive because it was young guys and all of that. But, you know, the bus family, this is how they make. money, right? Exactly.

They're not, they're not Balmer, they're not Paul Allen, they're not the freaking Ali Baba guy in Brooklyn who they're paying. Oh my God, Brooklyn is, yeah. I love that, by the way, that he's like, yeah, I got three generational talents on my team. I'm paying for a freaking real team. A luxury tax or whatever be damned. The Lakers are just like, listen, man, this is how we make money.

So yeah, we'll do the luxury tax thing, but we're not going crazy. And that's why Caruso's gone. I wonder if Katie gave Joseph Sy like a credit check before we took over that team because good Lord, that guy is going into pockets. It's glad to see that the Lakers are thriving. I'm sure they put that small business loan to good use over there. All right. Let's talk about the Miami Heat here, probably the biggest story overall in free agency.

I mean, maybe you can quibble with that. But if we're second guessing here, I think a lot of people are saying like the heater back to have loaded up for this next season in order to reboot. My question is, did the Miami Heat commit too much to a bunch of old dogs? Dogs using one of Rob Mahoney's just prime tweets. The humorist account at Rob Mahoney just throwing out the gold there. Keeps hitting. Over and over.

Over and over. So I like all that they did here. They bring back Duncan Robinson for an absurd amount of money. they extend Jimmy Butler for an exert amount of money. Kyle Lowry gets a three-year 90 million deer. PJ Tucker coming over from the bucks, Markief Morris. And as we're recording,

they just signed Victor Oladipo. All of this looks great on paper, but when you start looking at the ages of these guys, I'm starting to wonder like maybe next season they will be quite good. I don't know if they're in the elite tier with the nets in the east, but they're going to be very, very good.

I'm just wondering on the back end of this. Are we worried Waz at all? that this can get pretty ugly pretty quickly. I think you're worried about the age of the wrong people. Pat Riley, the man in charge, he's like, shit. I'm 75. I'm going to be out by the time this shit matters. I don't give it fuck.

And, you know, the bottom line is if you watched what the Sons did this playoff, sorry Sons fans cover your ears, this Miami team would beat any single team that the Sons face in the playoffs. last this past postseason, right? Any version of those teams that the Suns played to go to the finals, if you're Miami, you have to feel damn good that you could have beat those teams. Meaning if you're not as talented as Brooklyn, you're probably still not as talented as Milwaukee,

although you've closed that gap somewhat. But if things break your way, pardon the pun, you can find your ass in the finals, just like Phoenix did. And I think that's the bet you got to make it. Pat Riley's always been something who, you know, he's in it to win it. Like, this idea that we're not going to go for the gusto has just never been a credo of Riley's, you know, managerial style specifically since he's been in Miami. So I think Riley being on the finally, I know we've been saying this for like a decade,

but he's finally looks like he's about to be done. This is his one last, like, all right, we're putting all the chips in the table and we're riding with our gods. And I think the Jimmy Butler thing is just a declaration of just like, all right, Jimmy, Jimmy Butler is the face of this franchise. We're going to make him whole because that's what we do here in Miami. Miami Mafia, he coach you, baby. Well, in saying they committed too much, too, I think presumes that they haven't been untangling these kinds of salary knots for the past decade plus.

This is what they do. They commit lots of money. They get out of it when they need to. As we've been talking about there, this whole conversation, they know how to operate as an attractive market. They know people want to go there. and they know they can get off money when they need to. The Butler thing I feel totally fine with, to be honest with you.

It's huge money, but he just has a massive impact on the game. And in terms of like on-off metrics, stuff like that, he's always right there with the MVP finalists every year. He's a lot to that organization right now. And a big draw in terms of why you're getting Lowry in the first place. So there's clear risk in giving money to those guys, you know, this deep into their careers, Lowry especially. But, you know, there's always going to be risk with these kinds of big-time investments.

the fact that the heater in a position to do it, that they look like they were kind of capped out, that they might have to make trades, that they might have to give up Hero or Robinson to get someone of import. None of that matter. They just brought in Lowry on what looks to be a pretty reasonable sign in trade. The latest reporting is Goran Draggich and precious Sachua going out. We'll see if there's any other components to that. That's a coup for a team in this position that, that frankly needed some juice to get up into that next tier. what do we think about them next season then? Because on paper, it looks interesting, but I am looking at the projected started lineup,

which we'll assume is Butler, Lowry, Robinson, we'll say, Bam, and probably PJ Tucker. It's a lot of talent there, but not a lot of shooting. You're really counting on Lowry and Robinson in order to space for a bunch of non-shoitors. Maybe Bam takes a leap forward in that regard. I don't know what he's doing over the off-season. Butler's shooting comes and goes,

but PJ Tucker, good Lord. he took four shots in the final three games of the NBA finals. And I thought he might just retire after that, just go out on top. Apparently, he's good enough to make two years 15 million. Maybe, like, maybe that defender just, like, comes back in the playoffs and he's locking guys down. And this is like they're holding teams to 80 points like the Detroit Pistons of 2004. But I don't know. It was.

What do you think? Yeah, like, as I previously mentioned, I think Eric Spolstra, specifically in a regular season environment, he's going to figure out a way to manufacture buckets and they're going to count on the collective defensive IQ of that starting lineup you just mentioned and defensive talent, by the way, to crush teams on that end of the court. So I'm not too worried regular season-wise

and end in the playoffs, you know, you try to mix a match and figure out how you can, you know, sew together a lineup that makes sense for your given opponent. I'm not, I haven't completely given up on Tyler Hero I think he's still a nice young player who has a lot to improve upon. And so, you know, I don't think all is lost for them. But, you know, I'm glad you mentioned PJ Tucker.

And while I know he wasn't a godsend on offense during the playoffs, but neither was Drew Holiday. Okay? This team won, that team won the championship because of what they did on defense. And PJ Tucker was a huge part of what allowed them to play the kind of finally switchy sort of defense that got them to the championship. They didn't win this championship because of their stunning, you know, beautiful game, half-court offense.

They stopped people. And PJ was a part of that. And I'm going on this rant, Justin, because I need small markets to shut the fuck up forever. You just won the fucking championship. You just won the fucking championship. And PJ Tucker leaves your team for. for $7.5 fucking million dollars. After Janice commits

to your ass long term, it's fucking pathetic. That's why I hate hearing about small markets and oh, woe is me! We can't do anything. $75, 7.5 million per for a guy who guarded Kevin Durant for a majority of that damn series

and slowed them down just enough that you guys didn't get steamrolled by a one-man army. And you know, the idea that this guy would just leave because your ownership was just too fucking cheap to keep him, shut the fuck up for every small market. Sorry, I'm done. Rob?

Well, especially when Kevin Durant isn't going anywhere. Like, that is your prime competition in the East. I will say this about Tucker on offense. Like, yes, he's not a great shooter. He's not a great offensive player at all. But do defenses have to guard him? And I think the answer with Tucker, if he's in the corner, is closer to yes. It's not always a yes.

It's closer to yes than it is for Trevor Areza, who he's replacing. And that's kind of the metric that you need to keep in mind. And especially when you look at the way that the heat run offense, say somebody's cheating in from the corner off P.J. Tucker, what is that doing for you when Duncan Robinson runs off a handoff from Bama to bio? Like, this is an offense that works off movement that's so perimeter oriented in terms of freeing, and Lowry's going to flow right into that. He's going to be a seamless addition to that kind of action.

I don't know that cinching off PJ Tucker to the corner is going to, do that much for you in terms of slowing the heat down. That said, this is going to be a defense first team. They are going to be incredibly hard to score against. Just super versatile, super flexible. Lots of guys up and down the roster who can guard a crowd. Like what Bamatabio is to centers in terms of guarding guards, Kyle Lowry is to guards in terms of guarding bigs.

Like that is where he makes his money in a lot of ways is working across positions. And so the idea that you would have another guy like that is going to be huge. The question is, you know, they filled out their roster pretty well. I think Marquief Morris was actually a pretty good pickup for them. And they reportedly struck a deal with Victor Oladipo today, which could be good if he's healthy. They could use one more guard with a little bit of off the dribble something. And there aren't a lot of those guys left. Maybe you're in like the kind of Lou Williams market.

Maybe if you can really put the hard sell on Reggie Jackson or someone like that to come at a discount, I wouldn't bet on that. But they could use one more guard who they could either play with Lowry some or behind him. I know Hero's going to do some of that stuff. but they need one more ball handler, I think. Right. And that's one of the good things about the heat. And if you're saying, like, yeah, they are giving a lot of money to a lot of older players.

They do tend to find these guys. They're one of the best organization. It's just mining guys from the depths of the first round or in Duncan Robinson's case, just undrafted in general. Yeah, that's one of the best cases of a, I guess, reclamation project or just building someone into something in NBA history, quite frankly. Like, we've never seen anything like that. He made the most money ever for an undrafted player.

Now let's turn it. to the other old dogs in the mix here, the particularly old dogs, who might be actually older than the heat collectively. We want to look into that one. But the Lakers, after trading for one Russell Westbrook to form their new, confusing big three, just went on a run here of bringing in pretty much every known big name minimum signing guy on the market. The list includes Carmel Anthony, Trevor Areza, Kent Bazemore, Wayne Ellington, Dwight Howard, Malik Monk. they also brought back Taylor in Horton Tucker for three years

32 million shouts said clutched boards for getting the absolute max he can get with his bird rights Kendrick Nunn for two years, 10 million who got let go by the heat and all of their moves Rob, are you feeling better about the Rust trade

as a result of some of these signings to fill in the gaps around those guys? Yeah, of course. I mean, they're starting to get some of the shooting together but this still looks like a team that's probably going to have take a step back defensively.

I'm not sure that the person is there. I mean, I'll put it this way. Like, there are good elements in terms of these minimum guys they picked up. But when you look across their role players, is there a single two-way player in that group? That's the problem. You're looking at a lot of guys who can shoot or guys who can defend. And so maybe you can cobble together lineups that balance those things. Maybe you can't. But it was nice to have some guys who could do both. And that's kind of how they're going to have shift from the championship core into whatever this new one is going to look like. They're just going to completely reset the way their identity works, the functioning of their defense.

They're just going to make a lot of adjustments. I think they have the talent to do it. Now they have some of the shooting to do it. But this team is going to look very different. You know, I have a confession to make, guys. As the days have sort of ticked away, I've talked myself into the Rust thing. There it is. There it is.

Beautiful. It's here. It's happened. And specifically in that he's going to be filling the russing. role that was vacated by Rondo in the championship year and Dennis Schrooter of last year. And conceptually, it's not that hard to envision him being better at that than those two guys were, like, it just seems obvious that he will be. To me, that's like saying it's easier to fill a glass of water with a fire hose and with a

faucet, you know? That's kind of like, I don't even know how to fathom what you're saying. You know what I mean? Like, he's going to be way better at that. And what I mean is, like, think about those times where, for whatever reason, LeBron just didn't feel like being the fucking engine of the offense. And he's letting other wings do it. Because let's face it, AD can't be that either.

He's a finisher. He's not an initiator. Like, the idea that Russ is going to be doing this instead of Rondo, instead of shooter, instead of even at some points, you know, they tried to let Caruso do it at times in stretches. And I think that's why they chose THT over him because THT has flashed. Okay, theoretically, he's flashed some on-ball ability, right? That Caruso just...

It also helps to have the right agent. But yeah, sure. Well, yeah, of course. But I'm just saying Russ is going to be much better at that. And I think the main calculation that they made is that, look, Vogel is proven that he's going to coach these dudes up on defense. He just has done it, right? Even, and I think, I think, uh, Rondo and Shruder specifically are instructive because

before those guys came in, Rondo didn't play defense for eight years. Schrooter had never shown himself to be a pretty competent defender. They get into the Lakers and they're getting into guys and being like good defensive players. So I think the calculation is Vogel is that elite at coaching them up on defense and just get some offense around them, right? Like, they're going to figure out the defense because they have AD who before when and he's right is the best defensive player in the NBA.

And they have LeBron. And, you know, they're going to let the chips fall where they may. I'm really talking myself into this actually being a thing that could work. And, you know, and this is going to sound hilarious. I think if Russ can just be Russ when LeBron's not on the floor and be closer to Alex Caruso when he is, this is going to be amazing. Seems reasonable. I do think the Anthony Davis part of this

is something that we probably haven't talked about enough in that last season was pretty sobering, I think, for Anthony Davis and his role on this team, how aggressive he can be on offense, what his role will ultimately look like, especially once some of the jumpers regressed to the mean a little bit. He was super hot in terms of shooting in the bubble, that wasn't the case last season, to the point that the Lakers lost the minutes

when AD was on the floor and LeBron was not. That is a big problem. So the idea that we can bring in someone, as well as I was saying, to champion those minutes, to run them, to maintain them, to be more aggressive in those spots in ways that AD, whether because of injuries or the flow of the season or just kind of an off year, whatever it was, that's, you know, there's some security in that, to be sure. And I watched those damn games last year. The guy wasn't trying. He really wasn't. Like, I remember the one game,

I think they had just played Memphis, and AD was complaining about the team's defense. And I'm like, bro, you're talking about yourself. It's you. It's you. You're literally the reason why they're not playing good at defense. You're not trying. So we'll see what kind of intensity comes into the season with next year.

And we'll see how much five he plays, et, et cetera, et cetera. But, yeah, for me, with AD, it's about the defense. If he's going all out on that end, the Lakers are whirlbeaters, and there's nobody who they can't, they shouldn't feel good about being able to take down. Anthony Davis wasn't trying on defense?

No. Isn't it interesting that he and Janice always get kind of paired in conversation in terms of like ability and skill set, but in terms of effort level on a night-to-night basis, focus, I mean, just totally different worlds. Yeah. Right.

I mean, AD makes that. comparison because one of the reasons he wanted out of New Orleans is he wanted a shoe deal like Yonis did, which is why he wanted to be in a big market. I mean, one of my main concerns, I'm like, was to a certain extent. I am like looking at some of the moves they made. I'm like, okay, this isn't so bad. All three guys they're counting on to carry everything were injured, not just often, but last season. Like all three of them went out with major injuries. I think that's a concern. We haven't seen or heard much from AD outside of his cameo and space jam, which I didn't watch. I'm sure he gave an Oscar-winning performance there, just often like he does on the court,

right, when he's asking for a call. But I think that the one thing that keyed the Rondo generation or era of the Lakers was he was making shots in the bubble. And that was, it's huge. And you're still counting on Russell Westbrook plus two other guys. I guess we're just going to assume it's going to be like Malik Monk or Wayne Ellington and maybe like, who even plays that other role. I guess maybe you do both of them and you just put LeBron at the four. There's still a lot of questions about like who will be the guys here. I think Rob made the good point here. There's a lot of three guys and like rebounding guys like Dwight Howard and Carmelo Anthony,

who's there for morale and towel waving, but like there's not three and deep. And they're like shooting guards and guards are short. These guys are not big. Like Malik Monk, Kendrick Nunn. Like this isn't size. They're pretty small dudes. So we'll see how the defense is, that's what you're going to be having to keep your eye on, man.

There is room here, though, for this to be like a suboptimal fit and us to have all these questions, and they still win the Western Conference. Because you look out across the West, none of these teams are in great positions. You know, the sons are going to come back with what they have, but everyone else, you know, Kauai is going to be out for a long time. We still know what's up with Jamal Murray.

And when he's going to be back in the lineup, up. Dallas didn't meaningfully improve this offseason. Nobody's in a great position to like just completely blow the Lakers out of the water. Rob, are the reigning Western Conference champs your favorite? No, you know what? Free agency is not done yet. I'm going to no comment that until we see a more complete picture. All right.

Let's pivot now to a team that was supposed to build on their defensive identity. Unfortunately, they ended up with one Devante Graham filling all that cap space that they opened up with the Eric Ledsoe and Stephen Adams trade. I'm talking, of course, about the New Orleans Pelicans, going from slandering old, pelicans of old to Pelicans of New here. My question, I'm going to step aside here for a little bit because I don't want all of the Pelicans in cells attacking me yet again. Shouldn't the Pelicans, if we're looking at this big picture, have just matched on Lonzo

Ball? Because the real decision came down to Ball got, what, four years, 85 million. they pretty much let him go for a sign and trade package of Thomas Satteransky, Garrett Temple, and a second round pick. I believe they had to sign Garrett Temple to multi years in that deal. I think it was reported as three, which is like not great. And then in order to sign Graham for four years, 47 million, which don't hate that contract, seems perfectly reasonable for a guy with his three-point shooting ability.

They had to give up a lottery protected first to Charlotte. And it seems like it's their own lottery protected. first. So if Graham works, they're giving up like, let's say, the number 17 or 20 pick. And if it doesn't, then like, then the move failed. So I, this is all very confusing to me was, do you, can you make sense of this? Are you feeling good about the pelicans these days? I think Graham, I don't think he's a better player than Lonzo, but he's certainly a better fit with the guy who the pelicans have to devote all their efforts into making happy, right? Because he's a threat off the dribble to pull up from three and he's a, like, a decent

enough picking and roll operator. Like, he just fits better, just pure shooting and the fact that his shooting is way more versatile than Lanzo Balls is, right, as a lead on the ball guy. So that part of it makes sense to me. And, you know, because apparently Lonzo went in and told him like, I need space to operate. And so, you know, that part of it, I understand. Look, when Woj tweeted that the Pelicans like Valanchun and says stretch more than Stephen Adams sure, like I guess I like, you know, poverty in like Section 8 better than being homeless?

Like I don't know. Like, you know, like as far as like stretching is concerned, it's obvious they're trying to manufacture space. And so the grand move makes sense. They have to bring back Josh Hart just on a shooting level, professionalism level, all of that kind of stuff. Like they've become a little bit stretchier. And that's the only thing that I could say.

Other than that, like, I don't think this team is more talented. than it was last year. I mean, I've been trying to just piece together the justification for not matching on Lonzo and going this route instead. I can't quite get there. I think you make a lot of great points, Waz, in terms of the flexibility of Graham as an off-the-dribble shooter. That has to be the case, is the idea that, you know, in our pick and roll game, we need to be able to diversify.

We need other players who are going to draw the defense's attention other than Zion Williamson. This is the way to do that. I just, I don't know. I mean, when you look at the deal that Lonzo ultimately got, which is a lot of money given, but a deal that as we've been talking about with lots of deals in this conversation feels pretty movable down the line, I think there's going to be a market for him if you ultimately needed to do that, why you wouldn't match on that now or strike a deal with him now and then try to figure something out later,

especially when you have to give up a lottery protected first to get Graham, just that chain of events doesn't sit super well with me. Yeah, and I also don't know why the Hornets would have wanted Graham back, considering that they just drafted Boknight in order to fill out a backcourt that I already had Lonso, or excuse me, lamella ball and also Terry Rozier. I just look

at this team and I just like, I don't know if it's much better than last year. And the biggest issue, and I wrote this at the time, was the trade that they made in order to get off Blood Zone Adams and correct their mistakes from last year was done in large part to open up cap space and we'll see what they do

with the cap space. The problem is nobody took that cap space. Laueri a pipe dream. That was already done before free agency even started. And like, I mean, KOC said this yesterday. Like, apparently they offered a ton of money to Tim Hardaway Jr. And he just didn't take it. He took like significantly less to go back to Dallas. And so it's like, it's a complete misreading of your market. Like, this has happened all the time with New Orleans. Last time that they opened up meaningful cap space, they got Solomon Hill and Etouin Moore. And I don't want to call Devante Graham Solomon Hill 2.0 because like completely different players, like the Pelicans were trying to read into

like a playoff run in a couple of regular season games for Solomon and Hill and just hoping that like he was the player that Del Dems thought he was coming into the draft. Graham has a track record, is a very good three point shooter. The defense is just, I don't get it. Like I know his advanced numbers are really good, but he's like 5-11 and you can't stop anybody. And the whole point of this offseason for them was one to take advantage of the cap space and two to get in shooting and defenders. And they really, I don't know, you got Valentunes is a close enough approximation to Adams and you got Graham and I'm just like, where are the answers for this team? I just like, it's a complete misreading of everything going on there.

I will say this. Like, Graham isn't Solomon Hill 2.0, but for him, they're hoping that he is a unsung, like, hidden gem in the way that the Pelicans of Old thought that Solomon Hill was. And you're really hoping that like all of those indicators that suggest that Graham is a much better player than the horns were giving credit for, like actually come to bear. And like, that's a big bet. And you're kind of betting David Griffin's job on it, which is like, I wouldn't do that with Demonte Graham.

I mean, guys, Donovan Graham, Devante, excuse me, Graham, his, you know, he had the crazy defensive real plus minus numbers. I'm to believe that this guy was part of why they played good defense while he was on the court. He's a very bad defender. Yeah, those metrics are such bullshit. Same to me. Yeah. Just on its face.

So, I don't know. Good luck, guys. I will say, for DeVante Graham, he, you. He's never played with anyone with remotely the gravity of Zion or Jonas Valcunas for that matter. Like, those guys on the role are going to give him space in a way that he never had in Charlotte. So the Hornets really relied on him to be a tough shot maker. I'm curious to see how his percentages fluctuate when those shots aren't tough all the time. Yeah.

All right. I'm confused. Well, I have kind of a 4B here because Dallas, the team I mentioned with Tim Harway Jr., also had a very perplexing offseason. And another team that suggested that we were going to make big moves, they cleared all this cap space or potential cap space in order to go after Yannis didn't work, ended up Tim Hardaway Jr., Bobon, Sterling Brown, Moses Brown,

Reggie Bullock, Rob, as a man of Texas, are like, is this situation worse than the Pelicans? Are they like in a close approximation? Because this has to be disappointing outside of the presumed Luca Donchich extension coming soon. it has to be a pretty disappointing offseason for Dallas. Well, they're not in a worse place

because they're starting in a better place. They're starting as basically a default playoff team and one that could challenge some of the best teams in the West. So I think of it as kind of, in terms of their off season, as let's think of it as like a flow chart, can you get a high level ball handler

to relieve some of the pressure on Luca, to make it easier for him to sustain through these long games and longer series? Clearly the answer was no. They struck out on Kyle Lowry, whoever else they were targeting didn't work out. So then you move to how do we maximize our spacing and try to get the most out of Chris

Apzp. Sforzengis. And that's where I think these moves, they facilitate that. It's the idea of playing smaller, of moving KP into more of a role as a full-time five, of being a primary pick-and-pop big, pick-and-roll big with Luca by putting Reggie Bullock on the floor, by keeping Tim Hardaway Jr. by getting Sterling Brown, who's a pretty solid reserve, you know, three-and-d wing to plug in here. So they're not meaningfully improved over where they were last year, but again, they were already a pretty good playoff team. This presents a similar, it's like the other side

of the coin of what's going on in New Orleans where New Orleans is rushing to do this on a timing wise that doesn't make any sense whereas Dallas timed it perfectly. Luca's still on a rookie deal. They had already gotten the guy who was presumably another

star and they lined up their cab space to bust the moon, this specific offseason in a way that would firmly entrench them as contenders in the NBA. Like, they did it right. And too bad, right? Like, nothing came of it. Like, this is the last offseason. They're going to be, they would have, they would have potentially been able to make a move,

to improve on the roster dramatically with this Luca and. KP Core and the stars just didn't align for them. And so that's why, you know, although we're supposed to get people excited about stuff like draft picks and assets and cap space and all of this stuff, it's all of this stuff. It's all theoretical. It's always theoretical until your lottery balls do come out. And again, like, we can point to other teams that do different things, but stuff that we think is prudent. Like you mentioned the magic, keep drafting people in the lottery. It's supposed to work out, you're supposed to eventually end up with a freaking star. That shit hasn't happened.

They've stunked up for a decade now since the White Howard left, right? Like, this is just kind of the way the league functions. Like, sometimes, you know, the best laid plans of mice and men often go astray, guys. This is depressing if you're down this, bro. I mean, it's just another difference between trying to get your big get in free agency versus true. Because free agency, as well said, you have a very finite window before extensions kick in, before you start paying younger guys, whatever it is. If you're working via trade and you're doing talent acquisition and accumulation and getting good players in the door on reasonable deals to ultimately move later, you just have a much

longer time horizon to work with. Yeah, I mean, they are the big loser of the Yonis Chase because Miami was the other team talked about who set up their moves last offseason in order to strike this off season. they got Kyle Lowry and the Dallas Mavericks didn't. And the problem with the Mavs is their door is closing pretty quickly here because Luca Donches is what is presumed to be a max extension is going to kick in next off season, which is going to hamper your ability to really do things.

So you're really hoping that like some of these Moses Browns, Sterling Browns turn into like big time players in the way that some of the other guys that they've hit on, you know, Dory's Finney Smith, some other starters that they've kind of mined from the depths of nowhere. They've actually done a pretty good job of that, really come to the four and fill out this roster. But you're right. Like,

what's next? I have no idea. Like, Luca, to his credit, is signing up for more of this. But like, there isn't a clear pathway here unless Chris Stops just becomes the player that they thought he would be in it. It's not the worst bet in the world. At the very least, they have someone in hand that they could say he's an all-star when he's available. But the problem is like he's a massive human who's never available. Man, if Chris Stabs could just learn how to rebound.

and muscle up on little guys on switches, this thing would make a lot more sense. I'd settle for him anchoring the defense again. If he can be a good interior defender, that'd be a huge difference. All right, let's close it with this last question because there are a lot of things that have happened over the past two days here.

Are there other things that we did not talk about today, Rob, that you are more perplexed by, perplexed by or intrigued by? there's a lot of pressure right now on the Blazers to meaningfully upgrade their roster. And here's what they've done so far. They've re-signed Norm Powell, five years, $90 million. Love Norm Powell. I'm into it.

They signed Cody Zeller. Good signing, especially for Dept at the Five. Love that. They signed Tony Snell. It was. You're a big Zeller fan? I am. I am.

I think he does a lot of shit that, you know, it won't land you on Sports Center. But when he's right, he helps your team win. he's always contributing. The only variable is Zeller is health if he's on the floor or not. Because when he's on there, he's quite useful. He's productive, bro.

So they bring in Tony Snell, a guy who both didn't miss a three pretty much all last season, but also was completely out of the rotation in Atlanta. I think it says a lot in terms of what that team thought of him. And they signed Ben McLemar, who's another small guard

and a theoretical, more up and down shooter. That's it. That's it so far. And if I'm Damien Lillard, I can't say there's anything going on there that makes me feel eager to stay. Yeah, I mean, for me, and I know this is like some weird, like, fringy thing, but, like, the campaign settling for 20 mil,

like, I get that, like, you know, there's a humility to having been a first rounder, leave the league, come back to the damn summer league and finally make a roster again. So you're like, yo, they offered me 20 mil, so I'm going to take it. But, like, just, T.J. McConnell?

I mean, he is way better than that dude. He's shown himself to be way better than Taylor Horton Tucker. I would argue in the playoffs, he was obviously way better than Alex Caruso, and these guys got deals way bigger than his. Like, I don't know. I don't know if that's like something he agreed to way in advance, et cetera, et cetera, but he's got to be watching this market and being like, I was like legitimately a pace.

and game changer in the fucking playoffs in Western Conference final games and these guys got like T.J. McConnell's, I mean, come on. Like, give me a break, guys. I guess if you wanted to rationalize it, maybe he's saying to himself, I'll spend

a couple years under Chris Paul's wing. I'll go to yell at ref, manage the offense school, and then once Paul goes on to Greener Pastures becomes secretary, of state or whatever he's going to do after basketball, he rises and becomes the starting point card.

I don't know if that's going to happen, but it's not the worst thing in the world to hit yourself to a team that you finally figured it out on. Is there really an ocean between Devante Graham and campaign? No. Oh, no. Totally not. No. No. Yeah.

I do want to circle back to the Trailblazers, though, because Rob, you listed off a bunch of their moves this offseason, but you forgot the key. ones, which are Kenneth Farreed, Michael Beasley, and Emmanuel Moodye, all three of whom are playing for the Trailblazers

Summer League team. Oh my God. Kenneth Farid. You know, I was, so a Team USA highlight flashed across maybe my T, yeah, I think it was my TV or something from past. And Kenneth Farid was on one of those teams somehow back when we were calling

a manimal. And I was like, yo, what's that dude's name again? I couldn't fucking think of this guy's name. But, you know, hopefully he makes it back into the league. Shows to Kenneferi. The obscure big man who is bouncy and is, in theory, a lob threat is just like a tradition like none other for Team USA man. There's like multiple plummlies probably in that category.

It was a mess. Also, I'm a snitch on myself and say that I was a mixed-a-draft Moodye over Poise think this guy. Cool. That one's working out for you. Can we put Waz? When Waz goes to Vegas, can we put him on the Michael Beasley beat full time? I don't think I got to survive that.

I have a few things with it down here. I thought the Nets getting Patty Mills was pretty remarkable. Like, God damn, this team keeps just winning. Drumming to the Sixers. Awkward. Really interesting.

I'm glad that. Awkward. Almost as awkward is when the clip is traded for Paul George. But I'll let you all figure that one out. Okay. The other thing I have, too, is pretty much every marquee player signed a lucrative extension in the summer. Like, I turn around and like Trey Young is now making the max. Like everyone seemed to do that.

And I wonder if there is something to be said about players in our teams in fear of players wanting out, losing all leverage. and now they just have to give the max as soon as possible. There's no negotiation, and this is how you show your stars that you love them. Well, I think the breaking news extension is Steph Curry, the idea that after the offseason that they've had so far, bringing in a lot of teenagers and young picks to play for that team, that he's signing up for another $215 million from them, another four years. That's huge, considering, I think, Steph's level of commitment and Clay's and Dremont,

that was the big variable there. All right. Let's wrap it up there. We'll be back next week, hopefully with Waz, regaling us with tales of summer league experiences with one Michael Beasley. Yes, sir. All right. Until then, thank you to Sasha Ashall on production. Welcome back to the team, our Pat Riley.

We'll be back next week. We'll see it.