The Ringer NBA Show - Opening Up the Thanksgiving Mailbag | The Corner 3 (Ep. 342)

Episode Date: November 21, 2018

We open up the mailbag by answering questions on the Wizards’ dysfunction, the first-, second-, and third-year players we’re most excited about, pre-agency, the Lakers, and much more. Hosts: Kevin O’Connor, Jonathan Tjarks, Danny Chau Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey guys, it's Liz Kelly. Right in time for the holiday season, the ringer's merch store has tons of new stuff. And right now, almost everything on the site is 20% off, including your favorites like binge mode and ringer NBA. And for the first time, we are introducing brand new merch for NBA desktop, Shea Serrano's villains, and Bill's Parent Corner. This Black Friday Cyber Monday sale lasts until Monday, November 26. You can check it out on the ringer.com slash shop. Welcome to our NBA show. This is the Christmas. Corner 3. I'm Kevin O'Connor, and joining me here in gorgeous, kind of a little chilly Los Angeles. It's Ringer Associate Editor, Danny Chow. I'm here, and the weather's great, to be honest. It is great. It's always great. It's from Dallas, Texas. It's Ringer staff writer,

Jonathan Charks. What's up, guys? I'm ready for a podcast and a quick little vacation, man. Absolutely. We're recording this at 1.28 p.m. on Tuesday, November 20th, and you're hearing it on Wednesday. Since it's a short week with Thanksgiving happening on Thursday in the United States, we thought it felt like a good time to do a mailback. You guys have any Thanksgiving plans going home? What are you doing? Staying home. I think we're frying chicken this year instead of doing a turkey.

Fried chicken. I like that. That sounds good. Yeah. My dad's just like, none of us really like turkey anyway. So, you know. That's what's up, man. That's awesome.

I watch you, Charks. I'm in Dallas. You know, you're the only transplant here, KFC. The rest of us are just stayed home. Sure, yeah. I'm flying home tomorrow morning. Looking forward to seeing my parents. Looking forward to seeing family.

It'll be a good time. Have some turkey. Really great. But now you guys submitted questions, and we really, really appreciate that. We've got some really good ones. A lot of questions. A lot of questions. Yeah, a lot of questions about the Wizards.

A lot of Wizards questions, especially after the news broke this week, that they are open to trading John Wall or Bradley Bill and anybody else on their team. There were so many, and they all kind of had a particular theme. What is the best course of action for Washington? Yeah, so do you guys have any, like, trade possible, you know, trade machine tinkering that you guys have been working on? It sounds like you do, Dan. So I saw one question, didn't catch the name, but they were basically asking, how do we get Bradley Beal onto the bucks

and whether or not that was feasible? I think it might be feasible if you do a trade something along the lines of Bradley Beale and some young talent that the Wizards don't care about. I think they have like Devin Robinson on their team, just throw them in there. That's a corner three deep cut, I like it. Right.

For Eric Bledsoe. the corpse of Jody Meeks, Thonmaker and Malcolm Brogden. Any picks? I mean... How many picks? Sure? I don't know.

But like, just that, that chord in itself, do you think that's enough? I don't know. For Bradley Beale, that's pretty much just Malcolm Brogden. You can't play Bleds-on-wall together. I get a Kentucky reunion going or something.

I mean, that was kind of what I was hoping for. You know, like, we're starting with Bradley Beale here, right? Right. And I think he's the player, like if you're a general manager or an executive, and you're calling the Wizards, The guy you're probably asking about first is Bradley Beale. And if you're the Wizards, I think you're going to be like, we're not trading Bill.

He's the one guy that we're keeping. We are open to trading other guys, though. We're open to trading Wall, open to trading Porter. And maybe then, do you think they get bites? Is there interest in a guy like John Wall? How many teams would realistically have interest in a John Wall? There being so many teams that have point cards, Danny? I mean, Phoenix and the magic stand out because they just have the two most dire point guard situations in the league.

when you consider maybe personnel and I guess the ways that their front offices generally gravitate towards players. I think magic would probably be more of a team with interest, but at the same time, do they really have any assets to give up?

Well, I think if you're trading John Wall, you're just dumping the salary at this point. I don't know you're getting much back for him. That raises the question, which Joshua Axelrod asked you says, is what do you think the best return the Wizards could get for John Wall would be at this point?

And, you know, in my article this week on The Ringer, I put it on a trade idea, and I said two first round picks for Wall is something I could see Washington wanting and an executive text to me that morning. I'm sure they want that. Yeah, an executive text to me that morning. He's like, dude, your value, your idea of John Wall's value is just way off. Right. If anything, they might have to give stuff up to get rid of him. I don't necessarily agree with that, though, because John Wall is still a really good point card. I'm not a big fan of him.

I never have been. I'm definitely not now. But he's still a good point guard. You can still help a team like Phoenix or Orlando. He still could be an interesting fit in the back court for Pelicans with Drew Holiday. There's teams that I could see Washington getting at least a solid return. But charts... I mean, I like the change of senior idea with, well, I think he needs to go somewhere else.

It's just the money, man. The money makes it so hard. That's what it comes down to with him. The money is significant. He's going to make, I think, his average annual salary for this new deal is $42 million, I believe. Right. I think he bikes 47 and a half in the fourth year of that contract. Yeah, that...

outrageous. That player option is just like... And here's the thing too, like, if you could create a player who's not going to age poorly, right? A point guard who depends on speed and athleticism doesn't take care of his body and has a characteristic in the locker room. Isn't it like the worst possible combination of skill traits? Absolutely. And that's why I think for Washington, that's what makes this situation so difficult for them. It's like so easy. Like I love blowing it up. I love one of the team blows it up because I think it's a proactive move oftentimes to get ahead to accumulate assets, create cap space, to get young players in your team.

But for John Wall, it's tough with Washington, because I'm not really sure when you get back to the point where it's actually worth pulling the plug. It might not be worth blowing it up for Washington, making a tweak. Look at this. This is getting mature, man.

He's aging. He's growing up on front of our eyes. This has always been my perspective. It was just overblown that I'm always about pushing, push and go on, you know, detonating a team. It's not true.

It's like context matters and depends on what you're going to get from Wall. I think Otto Porter, maybe he's a guy, Maybe it's the guy you dump. He just doesn't do well in their system. I mean, there's not a lot of ball movement on that team.

Otto Porter is a guy that flourishes with ball movement. And this is something that Charks had alluded to in a piece that he wrote last week about the Rockets. One possible way for them to kind of get back to that level that they were at last year's by acquiring another plus player. And plus player that they could possibly acquire now is Otto Porter. He would fit perfectly in their system. Absolutely. And it just feels like with Washington, with Grunfeld, they always take the path of least resistance. And the easiest trade to make is to dump Porter for spare parts and save a lot of money.

And I feel like that's what they're going to do. If I had to guess, they'll make the easiest possible trade and just find a contender once Auto Porter and just get rid of them for pennies on the dollar. And Porter's another guy that has a very expensive salary, making $26 million this year. And then in the 2020, 2020, 2021 season he'll be making $28.5 million. That's the fourth and final season of his contract. Auto Porto is a good player He's a good too weird But he's not worth that money

And so for these teams That are interested In any of Washington's players You're literally paying a lot for them Bradley Bill is really the only guy That I think you would cough up a lot for I think something you touched on earlier Charks

Related to a question from Joseph Horner Could heat culture fix John Wall Is there a situation where You would feel like Okay John Wall Maybe this could be good for him Maybe we can get new sides of his game Maybe he can extend his career

Is there a spot for him that you would feel comfortable with John Wall? I think just getting out of D.C. It would be a start. I think clearly he needs, like, kind of a kick in the pants. Okay, let me get my career, take my career seriously.

Just put John somewhere where he can't party every single night. Yeah, so that might take out the heat. Yeah. I mean, maybe New Orleans, too, I guess. Yeah, when you think about heat culture, you're kind of thinking about anonymous players who suddenly rise from obscurity

and become very solid players like Josh Richardson, like a Rodney Magruder type, like Hassan Whiteside. I don't know if that's necessarily the... Yeah, but there's the James Johnson thing, though. Like kind of guy, talented guy and the care of his body goes to Miami and fixes himself.

There's that avenue, I guess. I mean, he kind of fixes his body after he left Chicago the first time, I think. I'm curious. In my article on Monday, I had, like, the idea for Pelicans to go for him. It's kind of like an all-end move. Like, here you go, AD. We got a superstar. The move is Porter for the Pelicans.

They need more size in the wing. That's what I mean, Charks. If you're in New Orleans and you're calling Washington, you don't have enough assets to get Bradley Biel. I think an offer that you can give Kimmy Top by somebody else. So let's just say Beals off the table. Are you going for that all-in move with John Wall? You have a wall, you know, a wall holiday back court.

Wall, you know, he's a love's transition, playing an Alvin Gentry's offense with Anthony Davis now. That pick and roll could be devastating. or do you go for the guy? Really, that's the position of need with Otto Porter. I mean, like, what's your approach if you're the Pelicans

and you're looking at this wizard situation? You prefer Porter, you said? I think so, because you got to have some perimeter size. If you're in the same conference as Golden State and they're putting Drew on KD last year, you've got to have a taller wing to guard KD. I think you've got to go for Porter. That's fair.

I would lean towards Wall just because I think the Walladay nickname would catch on in New Orleans. Well, he's definitely a better Alfred Payton. I mean, there's that. Oh, goodness. Has Alfred Payton come back yet? He came back and his first kid broke his pinky.

So he's out six more weeks. Fantastic. Unfortunate. I don't love John Wall, but I think if you're New Orleans and you're thinking about how do we keep AD, I think John Wall's a pretty good option. I'm not sure if Otto Porter is going to swing AD one way. Well, but the thing about it is, I don't think marriage was going to swung him either last year. Right.

But like the fit on the core will swing it more than the big. big name. And I think having Porter makes some a more dangerous team than wall. That's what really comes down to is winning, more than even the big name. Moving on, we got a question from 21 Shump Street. Good, good Twitter handle. There you go. That's good. He said, will the Sixers regret trading for Jimmy Butler

too quickly as more stars become available? Would Bradley Bale have been a better option giving them a higher ceiling? I mean, sure. You have a player who is a better three-point shooter and suddenly you're looking at a Sixers team that is in desperate need of that. And locked up

long term. Sure. And much younger. With similar... Yeah, they're going to age much better. Similar injury concerns, but I feel like

Beal has kind of moved past that, whereas Jimmy Butler's less than a year away from his knee injury. Why can't Philly still go for Bradley Beal? I'm just saying, like, they have the salaries

and they have enough future assets. Well, they have a lot of future assets if you're going to dump a bunch of first round picks, if you're going to say, hey, here's Markell Fultz. You know, maybe you can fix them. Like, they still,

there's not stopping them. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. The wizard's locker room fixing Fultz is high comedy. That is incredible. That's an incredible thought experiment. Well, maybe Austin Rivers stick him under his wing. You got on the podcast? Hey, don't underestimate Satiransky as a mentor for Markle Fultz.

I think I will. Look, I don't think Philadelphia will regret training for Jimmy Butler. Even if he leaves, I don't think you regret it. I think Jimmy Butler is a calculated risk. It was worth it. Yeah, it was the type of move that they had been angling towards for upwards of three years. And they got it. And they got it for two good players, not great players.

Tonight, we have the Philadelphia 76ers facing the New Orleans Pelicans. That's one team that needs to make a deal. New Orleans Pelicans and one team that already made their deal. Joan LeB. versus Anthony Davis. That's fun. How have they fared in the past? Y'all remember that matchup one-on-one? I don't only remember it atop top of my head.

I don't remember. But it is interesting how you have two drastically, you have two teams in different situations, right? Where Pelicans are feeling pressure to build around this guy, to make this guy happy in his new situation. Whereas the Sixers are, you know, starting with

what Sam Hinky built and then what continued the Calangelo now with the new regime. Philly's feeling pressure now, though. They are feeling pressure, yes, you're right, Charg, they're feeling pressure in a different way to compete now and maximize on this court, around this core. I'm intrigued by how they've built this team with

Philadelphia. We talked about it last week. Now Markell Fultz may not be playing. Who knows anyone? Who really knows? But I think since we did last talk, Ben Simmons, as well as he uses a screener more often. Jimmy Butler, we saw him win a game right at the end. This team suddenly has become far, far, far more of a threat, I think, you know, for the playoffs than they were even just last week before that Butler Dale. It's exciting. I mean, and yet, there's always going to be an and yet with the Sixers. You know, if you look at the total margin of victory over these games, it's like nine.

Yeah. Over four or five games. They have more trades to bake, I think. I think that's pretty clear. They do. This isn't over at all. They still need more shooting and that gets back to Bradley Bale, right? I mean, I don't think they're going to be at Bradley Bale.

I think somebody could top what they would be willing to offer, but they need to find another guy. There's still more to do. Axel asked, considering his impressive play this season, where do you guys see Shay Gildis Alexander in, let's say five years? What's the ceiling for him, Char? Shout out Isaac Lee. I mean, I was always an SGA guy.

I thought he was the best point card in this draft. And to me, he could become one of the best point cards in the NBA. I think he can be an all-star, maybe even all-MBA point card. The only thing with SGA is he kind of has to have the ball. So you have to kind of be careful who you put around him. But this team now, I think, they might make the playoffs because of SGA. He's been great as a rookie. And it's rare that Doc Rivers is willing to play a young player so often.

I think it says a lot about Gilvis Alexander what he does well, Danny. Absolutely. And it's interesting right now because he's kind of, of in a holding pattern, kind of waiting for a lot of these incumbent point guards to finally leave the nest. He's... I mean, he took the spot, though. He's took the spot.

Right now, right now, I think he's starting at the two because he's playing next to Beverly, who I think both of them have pretty low usage numbers for, you know, lead guards. I think eventually you're going to want to take the training wheels off. And that could come as soon as, you know, next month. I think Avery Bradley's absence that early this season has also helped give Gilgis Alexander a real chance, a real opportunity to actually get playing time and to establish like, hey, guess what, Doc Rivers, Mr. Guy who never really plays young players, I'm ready. I can play now. You know, I think for a young guy, his defense has been encouraging. It seems like he's gotten better at the

little things on the court. You know, his timing and the pick and roll, his ability to change pace and change fees. He's just like a basketball genius, man. He's a really, one of the smartest players I've seen. Absolutely. And for him to do it at his experience level is impressive. I was talking to someone around the clippers recently, and they said to me that it seems like Gil's Alexander was going to learn something every game. Like there's always something he takes away, always something that he builds on. And you can see that happen on the court. I hope they do take the training wheels off charts. Well, and I think too worth pointing out, like, it's really nice for him to have Tobias Harrison Galanari. That's a great forward combo for a slashing point guard.

Two like big wings who shoot the ball, building the ball in their hands all the time. The Clippers as a whole have been, to me, one of the more exciting teams to watch this year. Doc Rivers? Yeah, they're fun. Coach of the year candidate? this is more his kind of team for sure without like the big stars. It's funny you say that charts because it's like Doc left the Celtics. You know, you wanted out from the Celtics because they were

entering a rebuild. But I thought, you know, with Doc Rivers, some of his years were those early to mid-2000 Celtics teams were impressive. Like those Celtics were bad. Right? The 0-607 Celtics were a bad team. But they competed a lot. I don't remember anymore. They were a tough team. On those teams. I guess they had Paul Pierce. I mean, the year that he won

his first coach of the year was with the magic. Yeah, yeah. He was rebuilding with the magic. So this is definitely his style. It's just, you know, once you win a championship, you suddenly think you're you're elites only. Yeah, for sure. Except now it's gone back the other way.

For the World's Worth, Charx, that old Celtics team was Rajan Rondo, was a rookie, Sebastian Tel Faire, Delante West, Paul Pierce. Leon Poe. Gerald Green, Leon Poe, Ryan Goames. Ryan Goams would have been a pretty good, he was a tweeter then. He had a nice career. If you didn't wreck his knee, right? Yeah.

And then Al Jefferson as well, who another guy had an injury in Minnesota. I think Al Jefferson had another good career, of course, but could have been even better. From Nathan Goodwin. If you guys could build a team around one player drafted in the 2016, 2017, or 2018 class, who would it be, Danny? Oh, this is good. This is a great question. Shout out Nathan. That's a good question, yeah.

I am torn here, but I am a sucker for point guard play. and I'm going to go with severe recency bias right now and say I would love to build a team around Deerrin Fox. Whoa. Oh, interesting. I would love it. Like, I want it over Ben Simmons, over Donovan Mitchell, over DeAndry Aiton.

Sure. What I've seen is... Over Jason Tatum. Danny, be careful with these takes. I think I'm okay with that. But just in terms of the team that I would like to watch, night in and night out, a team that flies up and down the court,

a team that spaces the ball well, and has a point guard who's one comfortable flying up the court, comfortable pulling up from three, comfortable making plays in weird mid-air positions. I love this guy. I don't see how you can't love him. They've been fun this year for sure. Yeah, Monday night's game, like he couldn't score.

He couldn't score, but he still made a positive impact. Like he had some of those passes, the ability to create space, his ability to play fast but still be under control at the same time. It's impressive. But I will say that I am probably the antithesis. of KOC as a GM. I'm just looking to make money. I'm just looking to entertain the fans.

I'm not necessarily needing the championship ring, you know? You're not running a process. I really want to say Ben Simmons here, but I can't just because the lack of a jumper. It's really close. I think I know who you're going to say, Charks, so I'm going to say the other guy, Jason Tatum.

That's what you want to say all along, KOC. Come on. Get out of here. I mean, I really want to pick the guy I think you're going to pick, but I want to talk about Tatum anyway. Jason Tatum, the go-to scoring is still magnificent for a player of his age. I think, you know, to what you just mentioned, Danny, when it comes to winning at the highest level, I think having a guy who can score at the end of games like Jason Tatum with his size and his versatility,

his ability to pull up from three, pull up from mid-range, or get to the basket and draw falls. This year's been a little bit frustrating with him. Yeah, Keos, you already about the little Duke habits coming back this year? This year's been frustrating, hasn't it, Charks? Those Duke habits are coming back. I think after he's settling a lot. And that needs to change for him to really continue maximizing his potential. Maybe he needs to block Kobe's phone number off his own.

Maybe, maybe. I mean, Tatum himself didn't have a quote that Kobe told him like every time you have the ball shooting. It's like, no, don't. Well, apparently there was more to that quote. And he said, pass only if you need to. Yeah. So, yeah, great, you know, great addendum there. Tatum has improved as a passer.

And he's improved in every way. as a defender, every way. As I score overall this year, she's been a little bit of a hiccup early on, but Tatum to me, yeah, he could be one of the better players in the game. How about you, Charks? I mean, I may be unbiased,

but I got to go with, I think he's the corner three's guy, really. We've got to go with my guy, Luca, man. He's been killing it. He's been absolutely crushing it all season. Love him. He's the best, man. He just, it's someone fun to watch the Mavs now.

That's great. We got a question from Lord Asbury about Lord Ashbury, Asbury. I'm not sure which one we have it right. But anyway, Lord asked, is future MVP a legit ceiling for Luca? Why not? Yeah, why not? Exactly.

I'm not going to put a ceiling on him right now. Shout out to my guy Kirk's serious face. He dropped this stat on the other day. He says, players who are shooting 19 points a game with six boards and four assists, there's only 10 guys in the league doing it. And it's like LeBron, Janice, Durant, Anthony Davis, Westbrook. And then my guy, Luca, not only that, Luca's effective. field goal percentage at 19, 53.3%.

That's higher than Anthony Davis, right below Kevin Durant. I mean, this guy is, to quote Kevin O'Connor, this guy is 19 years old. It's incredible. That's quoting, like, yeah, it's quoting every single player or every single tweeter who has ever tweeted about Tatum. Yeah, yeah. He's only 19. And by the way, Tatum's always going to be 19, even when he's 25.

Oh, yeah. 19 in your heart. I still want to say he's 19. But Luke, yeah, Charks. Like what Luke is doing now is pretty remarkable. Even the people who are highest on him, we were all liked him. We all had him rank number one, like a lot of people did. Even people who were high on him, I'm surprised.

Who the heck could have predicted that he would average 19 points per game? Yeah. I thought, you know, maybe Lucas' scoring goes down at some point, but I thought his rookie year would look something like Evan Turner-esque numbers. I'm talking like 12, 6 and 4. No, I don't mean. I like Evan Turner. Evan Turner's a good player, very underrated. but I thought rookie year

and 19-year-old Luca Donchards would be like 12, 7 and 4. The man just gets buckets. He just sensed the need for the team and said, okay, this team needs buckets, I'll get buckets. How much credit does the coaching staff deserve charts for enabling him, empowering him to do this?

I mean, I'm glad they did it. What are they going to do? Empower Dennis and Wesley Matthews. There was no other option. That was going to happen on any coaching staff he was on. I guess you've got to get crops to match putting older guys around him. And the question is long term. Like, this is good for now,

but what are the pieces long term around him is the question. That's really what it comes down to now is because they got the guy. Now, how do you build around? And that alludes to a question from Dinell, Thadethyl. I'm definitely butch on your name.

I'm so sorry. What do the Mavericks need to do to optimize Lucas sealing? Yeah, and this goes back to something Charks had talked about a lot of last year when we were doing draft class. The idea that, you know, he as this teenager,

played so maturely that you can kind of, it's almost better for you to surround him with veterans who know exactly what they're doing than put him on this trajectory where, oh, he has to build alongside other young players for like five years before we see anything. There's that, but you see what the Sons did last night with Devin Booker? And so they started on point guard with Mikhail Bridges, Trevor Reza, T.J. Warren, DeAndre Aiton. I kind of love that.

Like, give Luca three big wings and a role man at center. give him as many athletes as possible. I think that should be the goal. Zion Williamson. That's what you're saying, that's what you're saying, are they winning too much for that to happen? Hey, we can get Knows Little or Cam Reddish, whatever. I mean, there's a lot of wings out there.

Absolutely. A lot of guy. And Luke is somebody who can fit with anybody too. Abe Spargo asks, I feel like Brandon Engram's season has been a little disappointing so far. He looks passive and floats in and out of games at times. Where do you guys see his potential? Can he be a good enough sidekick for a?

so the Lakers can make a playoff run this year. I'm wondering now, like, maybe Ingram needs his own team. I don't know if he's good enough. Like, maybe he needs to have the ball in his hands all the time and kind of run point to reach his ceiling. Is he good enough shooter to be a number two-round-lebron? I don't know right now. I think that's my concern right now, the shooting.

Ingram entered college as a guy who needed to improve his shot. Last year he shot 39% in a very, very low volume of shots. Only 105-3-pointers. This year he's not shot the ball well. truth is that Ingram isn't a 39% three-point shooter. He's probably not as poor as he is right now either at 30%. But somewhere in between, 34%. I'm not sure that's the level you need to be to excel next to LeBron James.

It's only 21. Yeah, and especially with the amount of attempts he's taking, he's taking less than two per game, which is not even at this point, not even really acceptable for most modern centers, let alone a wing who needs to be able to, you know, create on the perimeter to free up everyone else on the team. That's the dilemma here, isn't it?

LeBron needs the ball, but Ingram is also a guy who, since college, has been an underrated playmaker for his size and position. So he's really good with the ball on his hands. I mean, it's tough if you need the box to LeBron James, because that's not going to happen. I wonder if they got to trade him. I wonder now. Yeah, do you trade him?

Do you really try and stagger those minutes? And if you do stagger those minutes, what does that really mean for the future of the team? You know, if you can't really play your, second best asset, pretty much, alongside your first best? The question, you know, asks, can you make a playoff run this year? I think the Lakers are going to make their playoff run on the back of LeBron James anyway, regardless of where Brandon Ingram is.

Probably second round, maybe if they get a favorable match, they can make the Western Harvats finals, but I don't think they're good enough to make a run beyond that. Ingram, we'll see. I think with Brandon Ingram, his shot needs a show that he can be a consistent shooter in order to play optimally next to LeBron James. But the chances are he's still probably going to be a trade asset. Yeah, that's what you feel like it, right? Is he an Anthony Davis trade piece now?

Is that what he is? Not a bad asset to have, but ultimately for the New Orleans Pelicans, if it comes to trading Anthony Davis, there's a team out east that can top probably any offer the Lakers can. Oh, you know, something I remembered. We had brought this up in a past episode, but Charks had that trade proposal for Bradley Beal for the Lakers. Oh, yeah, Ingram.

I do it if that's a tough one. Yeah, COC, both of us, I think we both said no. at this point, has anything changed? I still want to do it. I'd rather have cap space if I'm the Lakers. I'd rather go into the summer with cap space. But couldn't you still have a max space

if you trade Ingram for Beale with other stuff? No, I think with the way their cap situation breaks down, they wouldn't be able to create max cap space or it would be extremely, extremely difficult to do with Beal.

Granted, with that said, there's not a lot of great options maybe for them this summer. If Clay stays in Golden State, if KD goes to New York or stays in Golden State himself, you're looking at a lot of Leonard, from what I've heard, is that Clippers are the more favorable option for him.

So where does that leave you? Cambo. Chris Middleton? I mean, it's Anthony Davis ultimately. Yeah. That's where it's all roads lead to AD to Rich Paul. That's what it comes down to. If Katie were to go to the Lakers, just what would general question?

What would your reaction be? How would you feel about Kevin Durant? How would you be excited? You would be excited? Because, see, I'm a Texas guy, so I have his love for Katie no matter what he does. He's a longhorn, so nothing but love. Yeah, personally, he's, to me, the, the, greatest score I've ever seen, and I

just, I'm not at a point where I'm like, oh, this dude needs to redefine his legacy or whatever, I'm just like, you know, just put the ball in the basket. That's leaning into the legacy. He could be a super villain. Turning LeBron James, you'd be a super villain. I don't know. He would be... But like, what if he won three-known with the Warriors,

they went to Lakers and won like two or three in a row with LeBron? Like, they'd be pretty crazy, man. I'm no kidding, man. I think that would be really special. Can you imagine KD. Go back to Golden State with LeBron? Like, the storylines. Oh my goodness. Hashtag narrative. guys, the content. Exactly.

And not to mention, like, yes, KD would be more hated than ever for going to the Lakers, but he would also be more love than ever. The Lakers are the most popular basketball franchise worldwide. LeBron is one of the most popular players. Kevin around would have more supporters than ever and more haters than ever.

But if you're KD, I think it would grow your stardom to an even higher level. And then, guess what? Two, three years from now, you can go to New York if you want to. Bring your answer. Let's do it. Yeah.

I feel like, too, worth pointing out, I think KD is good enough for LeBron would actually like take it back to the rant. That's the one guy, LeBron, say, okay, you're the man.

I can be your kind of number two option. I'm with you. Like, there's the conversation as well, why would Katie want to go to the Lakers and play second fiddle

to LeBron James? And I'm like, well, what do you be really? Second fiddle? I feel like he's on the same level as him, at least over the course of the regular season

in the playoffs. They do what LeBron and Kyrie did. They take turns. Yep. But Katie also Kevin Grant has a seven foot

Kyrie Irving like with LeBron. Are you kidding me? I'm getting excited for this now. Oh, my God. If I'm KD, if I were Kevin her and I would really think about it. You remember what is it, like two years ago, and Boston was like, oh, come here, be the man, don't be on too good a team.

Like, where they're Goldilocks, like, it's just right. Like, no, if you're going to leave the team you're on now, go to a great team win a championship. Like, guarantee rings. Don't be doing this halfway half in that thing. I think it would be dope. We got a good question from Theodore Karate. Which of the three of you would be the most revileable to make a corner three under the gun?

I am so bad under pressure. literally any kind of pressure. If you've seen me on any of those pop quizzes that the ringer has done, even if it's about like LeBron, I crack. I am not good under pressure, so it's not me. Do either y'all play basketball regularly anymore? Not anymore, no. It wouldn't be me.

I'm not a good shooter, so I'm guessing it would be a charles. I still play regularly, but I've taken it out of my game. I'm like Ben Simmons now. Like, it's just not my game shooting threes. I play near the basket. I rebound. The answer is you. You would hit the three.

If you see me shoot, you would know it's not me. Like, I got an ugly shot. I'm playing 10 feet and under on the rim. Yeah, that's me. I'm the guy who screens and just did the little dirty work out there. Play hard on defense, rebound, clap for my teammates. I'm not the guy to hit a quarter. So you're the Aaron Baines of the pickup basketball?

Yeah, I try to be. I'm definitely team manager. Question from Juan Hernandez. With Zach Levine's improvement, Wendell Carter's impressive play and Lari Markinan returning. The Bulls have an exciting young core, says Juan. Is there another young core you would take over

the Bulls at this moment? I like this question. I guess the question is how are we defining young core? Is it like, what about like Yokich Murray Harris? Is that too good of a team already? Is that to be a non-playoff team? I mean, Murray's still what? Like 22? They're only 25. Yeah. Yeah. But I think

if you go to look at non-playoff teams, how many are better than Levine Carter, Lori, right? I'm pretty into that group. I mean, going team by team in the east, You're not taking Miami, Washington, New York, or Cleveland. Atlanta. Is there an argument for Atlanta? Not right now.

Maybe they draft someone else next year. Brooklyn, I'm not sure. They're not there yet. They haven't had the high draft picks in recent years in the Western Conference. Phoenix is an argument with DeAndre Aden and Devin-Berner. I think I'd rather have that young core over Chicago. That's the question. Let's put, let's put in the Cal Bridges in there.

So Booker Bridges-Aton or Levine Carter-Marconin. It's pretty close. I mean, Booker is probably the best player, right, of the six. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. I think when you factor in some about Phoenix as other guys, like a cobo type, even like T.J. Warren is still fairly young. T.J. Warren, who is having a breakout season?

D. Anthony Melton. They have some good talents on their team besides those guys. I would say, like, the broader point, though, the bull, I think, have an exciting future. I think that's been very much underplayed this year because they've been so bad. But Levine getting so much better, Carter being so good right away. like this is an exciting team. If they can get RJ Barrett or something,

they're going to be really fun. Is Zach Levine a guy where when you have all those players, if you draft R.J. Barrett, Zach Levine going to have touches to do this high volume scoring that he does now. I think he takes so many threes. He can play off the ball super easy. I think he can fit in pretty much.

That's like a thing about a high volume three point shooter. It's easy to slide him in somewhere. Yeah, we're talking about Zach Levine taking six threes right now. If he takes any kind of backseat in terms of an actual creation role, that could get ratcheted up to about seven or eight if he's just spotting up. That's not even accounting for Markinen,

who's also going to be launching threes. I think that's like talking about Chicago to me. Yeah, they have two high volume three-point shooters, and that's what you really need now in the NBA. I just don't know how good of a shooter Levine is. He's shooting 35% on spot-up threes this season, 32% last year, 42% the year before. If he's 35-36% on spot-up three,

he's not sure how good he is for the role. Oh, wow. I didn't realize he was shooting 31% on the season. Well, I mean, a lot of those, it's just like, but who's cutting shots for Levine right now? Like, really? I think the question is if they don't get RJ and they have to draft a wing, is Chris Dunn the point guard of the future. I think that to me is still the big question. Me and Danny just looked at each other. Yeah.

I mean, speedy recovery, I want to see him on the court with these guys. I want to see how this all works out because I think Dunn is still, he can be an impact player. It's just, I don't know if he's the right point guard for what they're trying to do. We'll be back with more of your questions, but first we're going to hear from our sponsors. Thank you, Microsoft Service, for being a sponsor of the show. Need a device that helps you get stuff done, but is also perfect when you want to catch up on some fun, like streaming live sports or checking on your fantasy team. Check out the latest member of the Microsoft Service family. The new Surface Pro 6.

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And hurry, the deal ends November 26th. Back to the corner three. Matt Cassata is worried that the magic will get stuck in middle class purgatory. And he wonders, are there any risk-reward moves that might help? And he says, could a Markell Fultz risk ever makes sense for Orlando? Do it. Why not? Yeah, that's a team that Bobby should do it. Yeah, there's no pressure there.

Like, he wins like 30 games. You know, it's exciting. No pressure at all. And I think their point-garde situation might be more dire than the Sun's situation. I'd say so, because at least with Phoenix, you have. They have Booker who can run some point- for you. Orlando.

I mean, yeah, Augustine is fine, but, like, you'd be... He's a backup. You'd rather him be your, like, eighth man.

Markele Fultz for Terence Ross. You know, something like that. Yeah. Yeah, actually. Something like that's actually not too shabby.

I'm into that. Yeah. I mean, he's got to get out of there. Whatever's happening now, like, it can't be going well for them with Jimmy there. He's got to leave,

like, immediately. If I'm feeling, I'm still, can't give up on Markell. Brett Brown has. He's playing T. Michael over him. I know, but you can still have the asset.

Kevin, what's the word like depreciating asset? That thing is burning a hole in your pocket. I know, I know. But that's what I mean, like, what are you going to get for them? I mean, really, it's a shooter. Maybe like Rodney Hood, you know, like, that's what it's just kind of come down to. All right. So back to the question.

It was about the magic. Yes. Do you think they're headed towards middle class purgatory? But wouldn't that be good for the magic? They've been like the worst team in the league for the whole year. I mean, yeah, I guess. so. Oh, God.

I don't know if there's any, like, big moves. It just keeps feeling like their one, you know, lottery hit the, you know. One away. Yeah, it's one away. And that's why Matt's worried because Orlando is 9 and 8. And some of the stuff they're doing feels fairly sustainable, unlike last season, when it was all due to hot shooting their early start. This year, it's like, oh, Orlando's not too bad.

And I do know that they are trying to compete. they're trying to win games. They got to win games after it's so long. But by not winning games, it means that you're losing on our chance on another top prospect. The one guy away. Here's the thing about Orlando, too, if you look at the numbers, like they've moved Gordon to the four

and played a window at the three. And that's really been made them a better team. And they brought Isaac off the bench. Right. And it kind of feels like Isaac and Gordon are both fours. So they might have to make a trade at some. That's a tough situation now. I don't know.

Maybe the move for Orlando, if you're talking youth movement, is eventually to trade Vucevic. Oh, they have to trade Vuccivich. Yeah, he's gone after this year. Yeah. He's got to let Bamba be alive. I mean, he's...

He's killing it, though, from three. He's been great. He's been amazing. Another one of those... You can't pay him and have Bamba behind him. Absolutely. It just doesn't make sense. Another one of those big men

who advanced his game extended his range. Vucevich deserves a lot of credit for that. But Orlando... He gets buckets now, man. Orlando could be heading towards purgatory of the middle class. Hey, but at least it's not in hell, though, right? People keep saying that.

Pergatory's a lot better than hell. It's not hell. in hell. Carla asked, with the Lonjo Trier exceeding expectations on Frank Nila Keene and not progressing as quickly as we hoped, how does the future of the Knicks back court look? Frank is still one of the youngest players in the league.

I think his... You're not given up on Frank, so like some of our big bosses are? No, no. Can we just get up on Frank? Is our Knicks fans people are giving up on him? I thought they're still high on Frank. Nix fans understand Frank is just young and developing and already a really good defensive point guard. He's really good.

He's really good on defense. Oh, oh, our check rider is given up on Frank? Yeah, I think so. There's a handful of voices getting up on Frank Nillikina. I think he's not a point guard at this point. I wouldn't trust him to run a team right now. So to me, they need a point card still. I mean, he can't score at all.

It's an interesting conversion that he's going through. It's almost like when we all thought, or not we, but like, when people thought Austin Rivers was a point guard, and then now he's basically a three. I feel like that's kind of Nielakina's positional transformation. I think he could obviously be a lot better than Austin Rivers,

but yeah, I don't really see any lead playmaking ability out of him anymore. At least complimentary. Yeah. I think he can compliment you as a playmaker. He's not a bad passer. He's pretty solid, right? I think he can do that, but Frank's offense is definitely worrisome, but I think his defense is enough to keep him in the league for a long time.

Yeah, they feel like they need RJ Barrett. That's another team. Charks, do you buy Alonzo Trayer? I mean, he gets buckets, but like what else does he do? He's a guy who gets buckets. And it's like, here's the thing about Alonzo Trir. If you watched Arizona in the last two years, you remember Alonzo Trir freezing out,

Lori and Aten in the NCAA tournament. And it's like, when K.P. Right now with the Knicks, who's not going to freeze out really? When K.P. comes back and Trir freezes him out, how people feel about it. I don't know. He gets buckets, though.

I'll give him that. I guess the context matters here, though. Are you buying him as an undrafted free agent sticking in the league? Or do you think this is just a... I think he can be a bench score. I think that's possible, yeah. Mark plug, you agree.

Yeah, he definitely works hard. I see, like, future Memphis Grizzlies player in his future. He feels right, like a Marshaun-Bruck guy. Oh, Marshaun-Brux type, okay. Yeah, no, like as an unheralded. But what does Grisleys type mean? Oh, okay, unharreled. Yeah, I mean, over the past three years, they've basically run through, like, the bargain

bin of, you know, of wings who may or may not work because they invariably get injured. That's just the grizzly thing. Their backcourt gets injured. Question from Jomi Adineren. Of the four young guys for the Lakers, and I'm assuming that means Kyle Kuzma, Lonzo Ball, Brennan Ingraham, and Josh Hart,

which one is the most likely to be dealt in a mid-season trade? Really, of those young guys, only Josh Hart really fits with LeBron, right? Absolutely. Like, Kusma's probably a four. Bron's a four. Ingram doesn't really shoot,

Wanzo doesn't really shoot that much. Like LeBron's got a very specific type of player. So I wouldn't surprise any those guys are moved if not this midseason

by next season. Yeah, if things get dire, I can kind of imagine Kyle Kuzma getting dealt, which would be a huge blow to Lakers fans

who were... Cusmania? Yeah, who were basically like, oh, we don't need LeBron because we have Kuzma the next Kobe,

you know? Was that a thing? Kuzma's so overrated. It wasn't necessarily a thing, but like, there were a lot of people who were just like, I like Kuzma

more than. and Brandon Ingram because Kuzma has the Mamba mentality. Oh, that's fantastic. That's a great take. I hadn't heard that one. Yeah, look,

I like Kuzma. He can score. He can get buckets, but he doesn't play a lick of defense. It doesn't rebound. Doesn't pass. Yeah, Kuzma at the 5 was like, that was just killing the team

when they try on that. Kuzma, good player, but I worry that he's pretty much near his peak already unless he starts doing other stuff in the court, which he didn't do at Utah either.

Even in college, he was a player you look at him. He was like, oh, six foot nine. He's long. He can move. he could be versatile

defensively but he's not he's not but he can be but he's not it's like the same thing right now nothing's changed right for him on defense his offense his offense is just popped

but still a streaky shooter but at least he can score in volume he has a role like that he's a spark plug it forward that's good yeah fun fact about him I was I was looking up speed stats just because I love looking up useless information

because it really is useless information with the pace that the Lakers are playing on Kyle Kuzma is on average the fastest player in the NBA which is hilarious because he's basically a four or five. But yeah. That's a great. That's a great stat.

That is a good set, actually. Totally useless. It doesn't mean anything. But, you know, there you go. From Nathan Shee, what is an honest solution for the son's point guard needs? A solution that takes into account the team's timeline away from the quote, they need to overpay for a star because no one likes Phoenix narrative. Is this a John Wall sub-tweet?

It is a John Wall sub-tweet from Nathan Shee. So what's an honest solution for Phoenix? Is it tanking again and taking a R.J. Barrett playmaking forward type? Is it a free agent signing? Is it overpaying for a younger restricted free agent that might hit the market? What is a plan for them? Or is it developing them? Let's see how the same work as Booker at Point Card.

I just tried it for one game. They'll see Philadelphia last night with it. Right. Eight assists and two turnovers, I think was the stat line. So you want Booker in that hard-enroll, sharks. Let's just see it. I mean, why not, right? Let's give it a month or two and see how it goes.

I don't need to make a decision right now. Booker's averaging seven point assists per game this season, the 4.3 turnovers. I think with Booker, he's developed more of an on-ball scoring presence than I would have ever expected from what we saw him in Kentucky and even in high school for that matter. So why not see what he can become as a point guard? Yeah, and really after that, you're looking at, what, spot minutes from other contributors at the position. And I think they already have those two. That's a backup point. The Cobo, Melton, like, these two aren't bad options.

And with their timeline, with their trajectory, you don't need like a star point guard to accelerate this process. I think you need a guy who compliments Evan Booker because Booker's going to handle the ball a lot. You need a point guard who's going to be able to compliment him in the same way that he compliments the point card. He can play on ball or he can play off ball. Booker can be a guy who runs pick and roll or runs through screens. You need a guy in the back corner who can do the same thing that he does. John Wall is not that guy. We did a piece at the start of the college season like picket player for a team.

and I put this guy Quentin Grimes from Kansas. I love this. He's a great player. I really love watching him play. He's a 6-6 combo guard. He can shoot it, play on or off the ball. I think he might be the guy. Final question here from Joe C.

If there was a doomsday scenario where aliens need to be stopped on one possession in a basketball game to save planet Earth, who do you guys put on the all-earth defensive team to save the world? Who's our five guys? Okay.

Who's our five? Kau. Yeah, for sure. Quilana, no doubt about it. Anthony Davis. Anthony Davis. Do you think LeBron would still, maybe in one possession? One possession. I'm putting LeBron out there for one possession. I've putting Kevin Durant out there for one possession too. They're all going to try and stuff. Then let's go Yonnas too. Just put five seven footers out there. We really don't know what these aliens are. They might be small that it could be large, but I would rather have size out there anyway.

You want versatility for different types of aliens, obviously. And I think I'm putting Dremond out there too. Dremond. Dremond over, over Duran. But he might start an intergalactic incident. Let's see. So what's our file? We get 80. LeBron. Kawai.

Kawhi. I'm putting Janice out there. So you're putting Janus. Or maybe Ben Simmons. Ben Simmons is a good defender. I don't trust Ben Simmons. Compared to Draymond Green. Like one of those.

Yeah, I guess that's fair. Do we trust Draymond in a life or death situation? Yeah. I mean, he might kill the guy, but maybe that's for the best. Yeah. Like are, so we're, are we defending the basket or are we defending Earth? And or are they interconnected? You just need to stop on the basketball court.

Okay. One possession. I'm leaving Dremont off here. So we're putting Janus out there over Dremont. A.D., Kauai, LeBron. We're putting LeBron out there because this is one possession where he's going to be giving everything on defense. Yeah. And then Janus over Dremont.

I'd feel better with Dremont out there. I feel like Earth would be in good hands with that five. I think so, too. You cool with that, Charks? Sure, it's been a long podcast. Let's just go with that. It has been a long podcast, and that means it's time for a little break. Danny, John, happy Thanksgiving, guys.

Thank you. Of course. It's been fun. Have a good holiday, y'all. And thank you again for listening. We'll be back next Friday. Please give us a five-star rating on iTunes and tell your friends and family about the show on Thanksgiving. That would mean a lot.

Special shout out to Bobby Wagner for producing the podcast and to my good friend, Elon, for listening to the show. And thank you again. for listening. We'll be back next Friday. Have a great rest of your week.