The Ringer NBA Show - Possible NBA Return Scenarios, Draft Prospects Declaring, and More Mailbag Questions | The Mismatch

Episode Date: March 25, 2020

We look to other countries’ professional basketball leagues and wonder whether the NBA can develop a model to return that works in the United States (0:42) before discussing a bevy of college players that have declared for the NBA draft in the time since basketball’s hiatus began (12:46). Then, we revisit some of the questions we didn’t get to from last Friday’s mailbag, including basketball book and movie recommendations, potential rule changes to the league, and more (21:11). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, it's Liz Kelly, and welcome to The Ringer Podcast Network. We hope The Ringer can provide you entertainment and companionship during this time. So as always, feel free to check out The Ringer.com, where we're still covering the latest in sports, pop culture, tech, and media. And the Ringer's YouTube channel can provide endless amounts of entertainment. You can find that at YouTube.com slash The Ringer. Welcome to The Ringer NBA show. I'm Chris Vernon. And joining me as he does typically every Tuesday, but this week on a Wednesday is Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'Conflict.

Kevin O'Concer, Kevin O'Camara, Kevin O'Cadder, Kevin O'Candyland, Kevin O'Conroversy, Kevin! Verno, what's going on this Wednesday? I've been very thankful to so many of you that have been listening, though the NBA season is not going on currently, I've been very happy with the amount of feedback that we've got from the listeners, and hopefully, for your sake and for our sake, there's at least something that we can keep normal, which is going on. And I say that as we're doing it on Wednesday instead of Tuesday. But hopefully we will all get through this. There was some news that we will get to before we get to the rest of a mailbag.

Very sad. In fact, right before I went to bed last night, I saw the Carl Anthony Towns video. And as if the NBA hadn't put coronavirus in full focus by attaching names, with something almost first in terms of celebrity-wise with the Rudy Gobert stuff and that night and when it all happens, you know, we continue to get these stories from people that everybody knows. And Carl Anthony Towns took to Instagram for those of you that do not know and spent a good amount of time explaining the story of his mother, who as currently is in a medically

induced coma. I would encourage everybody to go watch it, but Carl was trying to get across the seriousness of this to people and make this a real life story, which is what he is going through. And so he talked about his mother and he talked about what she had gone through and feeling like she had turned a corner. And now we're to the point where she is fighting for her life. And they, you know, they're sitting there going. She's going to get through. this, but certainly scary times. And so Carl Anthony Towns used the opportunity to tell his story and encourage people to take this very seriously if they're not already. What did you think when you watch that? It broke my heart, too, man. I mean, the amount of times that he just kind of stopped

himself almost from crying when he talked about, the word he kept using was deteriorating, you know, with his mom and, you know, for me, like, I'm sure many, many others is like my greatest fear is my mom. catching this, you know? And yeah, it's just, it's, it's heartbreaking to see that because I know, you know, there's been stories in the past about how tight Carl Anthony Towns is with his mom. And you can tell it hurts him, man. And, you know, the fact that he hasn't even been able to see her because she's in a coma right now, it's just, it's all very heartbreaking, how this is happening to so many families across the

world right now. Thoughts and prayers with Carl and his family. but I do think that for those that, you know, I think there's always a sentiment of something isn't going to happen to you until it happens to you, right? And when people see somebody like an NBA star coming out and saying, hey, this is happening to me, at least for a moment, even if you don't think, oh, this isn't going to happen to me, you start to realize this absolutely could happen to you. it could happen to any of us and it could be our family member instead of Carl Towns's.

And so I thought it was nice, you know, and I praised you a lot for doing what you did over the course of the past year. But when somehow people can turn what is a devastating time in their life into the opportunity to try to help other people. And that's exactly what Towns was doing. He was taking this opportunity. which you know is just a dreadful time that you wouldn't wish upon anyone and giving them the opportunity, encouraging them. And with you, it was spend time with your family, make the most of the moments, whatever it may be. With Carl, it is, hey, look, this isn't just something you're seeing on the news.

This is affecting real people and real people like me. And so turning bad news into a good message, you know. Yeah, man. You mentioned about, you know, enjoying the moment. That's the one thing and that I hope comes from this. You know, if there's one good thing that comes, I hope people, when we're back to walking around the streets and we're going to restaurants together and we're able to embrace and hug and high five and shake hands and not worry about catching something or passing it on to anybody else, I hope those little moments. There's a great new respect and love for all that because right now it's weird. I mean, I was watching Netflix last night.

I was watching ugly delicious Dave Chang show. And like we've only been sort of in some sort of, you know, stay at home type of thing for two weeks, two or so weeks. And it was weird to me to see people out to eat together to see people walking the street. And I was just thinking about that like psychologically, the fact that it was weird to me to see that already that that changes happen. I can't imagine what it's going to be like when things are back to normal. and that first time you do shake a hand or you give your friend a hug, that's going to feel really good. I guess that's the one thing I'm trying to really look forward to

and I would encourage others to look forward to. If it feels like if it's difficult at home, I forget who it was, but I read yesterday a quote from some world leader, and he said to their citizens, you know, these next 21 days will be worth it because if we don't do it, we'll set ourselves back 21 years.

That might be higher, But fact is is that people will get set back unless the sacrifice is made now. So it's important that we continue to do that. A couple other pieces of news that we do want to get to. One, which is a very positive bit of news, was Mark Cuban, who is honestly, I think, like, the only voice were, like, hearing rather regularly. And this started the night that the NBA was going to postpone their season, their game happened to be on ESPN that night,

and he took the opportunity to talk live on television then. And then he did a radio interview, I believe it was, a day or two ago. And he said, you know, this was actually the most optimistic. I think we've heard. He said, you know, I think June 1 is kind of a target date, and I'm taking the under on that. And at least Mark Cuban from the people he talked to. had the optimistic belief that maybe by mid-May,

there could be basketball games going on again, which I thought was incredibly promising. It is. And yet you do see the news from Brian Windhorst this morning, who reported that the Chinese Basketball Association pushed back resuming basketball until May. And that would mean that they've had approximately a four-month hiatus, assuming that they do start in May,

So if you think about that in an NBA terms, four months from early March would be sometime early to mid July by the time that they returned. So if it's consistent with what happened in China, South Korea also tried to bring games back as well, then they had to stop again. So Mark Cuban's optimism is encouraging. And I'm sure the NBA, which is like a richer league, has more resources, can do more to make games happen. it's a positive thing. However, what's happened in China, what's happened in South Korea with them trying to bring games back

only to push it back, that does sort of damper a bit of the hope of seeing those games being played when Mark Cuban thinks they could be. But if I'm not mistaken, they were not going to do it without fans. Yeah. That is a big difference.

I think that most within the NBA circles believe that the NBA would come back and they would do it without fans. Like, that's how they, that's how they would get back to going. And like, because the TV deal, I mean, you've heard Adam Silver say, most of our fans, it's not a in-person experience. It's on a tablet. It's on a TV. It's on a phone. It's on wherever it may be. And so the audience is still gotten, right, for this business venture. You know, the majority of the audience is still able to

watch it. If you're just able to broadcast it without actual fans in an arena, I can't imagine the same is true on the on the business side of the chinese basketball association i don't know but you know i i'm pretty sure that like even in south korea they did plan on playing without fans in the crowd and then they just can't all right cancel the season and you know we'll see you know how things develop here compared to other countries um but what has happened there with their sports leagues is at least worth keeping in mind with what could happen here uh a month from now two months from now, maybe three months from now. Few other things.

What an incredible debacle for the 76ers yesterday with the not going to pay salaried employees. And then, I mean, have you ever seen anything like this where I mean, you think, I mean, these, look, typically these people are really smart people. And the 76ers, you know, I know within NBA circles have been lauded in many cases. as a place to work and really smart people in charge of things. And I don't know how this could have taken place yesterday. But it did. And you have Josh Harris who ends up, for those that don't know, they were going to dock everybody's pay 20%,

and then and also make it voluntary in some quarters of the organization. So you voluntarily say, I don't want to get paid my full salary. But you would work four days. I mean, you work four days instead of five days and then they're going to dock the pay. And you have their best player, Joel and B, come out and say, I'll help pay for them, you know, whatever they're going to lose in this. And I mean, it's just a, number one, it's not enough money that you're saving. Number two, now, like, I get that they're doing the right thing in the end, but how much trust is

broken? I mean, if you work there, right? Like, I mean, I'm just saying this from any point of view. you like if you work someplace and you know the guy that that was what he wanted to do he wanted to doc your pay during this during what we're going through um and he's a billionaire i don't know man it was obviously you would think i know some owners you just can't talk to them you know and they're going to do whatever they want to do but how did somebody not get to this guy and say this is this is not going to go over this is not going to do well

Well, it's not going to be the first team that tries to do it either. I mean, we just saw the Boston Bruins owner owns TD Garden, which is where the Celtics and Bruins play. And he just laid off all the ushers there. And that's an NHL owner doing that, not the owner of the Celtics, but the fact is that that's another sports league that is laying off certain employees at the arena. We're going to maybe see other teams do that with their own employees themselves. but the fact is that because of the backlash to Sixers received,

they're absolutely going to be a bit more hesitant in doing that. So it was nice to see public pressure actually work and reversing the decision yesterday. I mean, it's a good thing that happened. Yeah. Other thing that we do want to get to is there are draft announcements still going on. There have been several over the course of the last couple days. I saw last night where a Kenyon Martin's kid is going to be heading to the NBA. But of the ones that have made the announcement, which ones have stood out to you the most?

Devin Vassal is the guy that I'm looking at as somebody that I think people should be talking about more. I have him ranked as a top 10 prospect. He's a sophomore forward slash wing who is absolutely one of the best defenders that we're going to see enter the league this coming season. and one of the better, most versatile defenders what we've seen in recent years. You think about the impact Matisse Fible has made on his rookie season with the Sixers. Vassel, I think, could have a similar type of impact

as him early in his career. He reminds me a bit of like a Covington type or a McHale Bridges type coming into the league just with his versatility and intensity and length, nonstop hustle on defense, add to the fact that he also was a good spot-up shooter to me, he's one of those guys that's going to be an important part

of a championship formula. One of those guys who just aids all the stars on the core. He's not a top end guy, but he's somebody who can help lift everybody else in the roster because of all the complimentary tracts that he has. You know, when I started doing this, I started reaching out about draft stuff.

Lord knows I got time, right? I got the Florida State guys, which of course, Vassel is one of them, the other one which is highly ranked as Williams from from Florida State he's up there but then they say make sure I go watch Trent Forrest too as a draftable guy who's not on a lot of list but I mean look they're loaded at Florida State obviously got a bunch of guys there and it's interesting I mean all I'm saying is when you watch like somebody goes and looks up Devin Vassal as you were just speaking to him there's a couple of

others on that Florida State team that you're going to see in passing too and not even in passing. I mean, the Williams kid, he's been ranked high all year. But the other one, Forrest, Trent Forrest, is one that people have brought up to me. Yeah, I mean, look, this draft, when people say it's weak, it's weak with top end star talent at the top of the draft. There's no like bona fide superstar in the draft. But what it does have is I think a lot of good quality teams. players that can be found. So, you know, even somebody like Tyrese Halliburton from Iowa State,

he might not be a superstar, but I think he's a guy who, with his playmaking ability, as a passer, and his improved scoring ability, he reminds me of like a Chey Gildes-Alexander style prospect. Somebody who is a good prospect, maybe not going to become a superstar,

but there's a chance he becomes one of the better guys in your team. And Gildas-Alexander has thus far really exceeded early expectations and maybe someone like Halliburton could do that too, especially because he has the baseline as such a smart, high IQ player who's improved on offense score, that the playmaking ability is always going to give him something to have,

to have a long career. It's just a matter of what level he reaches beyond that. But there's guys like that that you look at, like I mentioned Vassal, Halliburton, Kara Lewis with his speed. There's a handful of guys that in this year's class, you're like, yeah, I'd be happy to have him on my team. just there's no clear number one guy

but not even clear number two or three guy there's just a bunch of like guys you'd be happy taking seven to 20 that's what there is and in that sense it makes this this year's draft class fun to me because it's about finding the best of that group that Halliburton targeting him Haliburton kid has always intrigued me

because that the guys that are coaching him is the staff from Murray State that found John Morant James Kane, who's the guy that found John Morant in an auxiliary gym, that's the staff that's at Iowa State now, right? So all I'm saying is, like, hey, there has been talent that you hadn't necessarily heard of before. They've had a good eye for talent in the past.

How about that? How about that? Right. And that kid shot up out of, he and he shot up out of nowhere. You know, nobody was talking about Halliburton last year. Well, and Halliburton is also like a coach's dream, too. I mean, he's just so freaking smart. I mean, on both ends of the court, like, he typically always makes the right rotations.

On offense, he makes the right decisions, and he puts his teammates into better positions by attacking and passing at the right moment. He's a technician already, even just in college. And so for an NBA team looking at him, you might not see him becoming like a top 10, top 15 guy in the league, but you can. easily see a scenario where he's like the 25th best guy or the 30th best guy and maybe even a bit better than that because of just his overall smarts and IQ and hustle and all the intangibles he brings to the court. That's to me, that's the type of guy that I'd be excited to draft this

year if I'm a need a playmaker. Yeah, he's just always fascinated because he's a three star guy right from Wisconsin. So he wasn't like, you know, this top 10 recruit, five star recruit. And he played two years there exactly like Morant did. There are some real similarities, especially if that group has a couple of guys. He did not have nearly the freshman year that Morant did. But I mean, the numbers are good, and he's going to leave Iowa State shooting 43% from three. You know, everybody in the NBA loves that. Sure, and he's improved as a shooter too.

You know, last year, you look at the way he shot off the dribble. It was nothing like what he's become this year. He's still not a guy that you're going to feed the ball at the end of the clock necessarily, but he's gotten better. And that's the type of progress you'd like to see year to year, month to month, and young players when projecting forward. So you look at the free throw percentage, you look at the three point percentage, which is largely in spot-up situations.

You look at his touch on floaters and layups. These are all positive indicators for him. Long-term as a shooter, very much like the guy I mentioned earlier, Gildis-Salleys Alexander, who had a high free-throw percentage, had a high three-point percentage, had good touch and we've seen him improve as a shooter off the dribble in short time in his NBA career. Halliburton perhaps with his proven high work ethic, his proven high IQ, his proven rate of improvement from year to year at Iowa State, it's a positive indicator for him moving forward that he's going to continue to improve as a shooter off the dribble and maybe exceed expectations

of what you imagine him as today, which is really just like a high end important core player, but not yet a star, but maybe there is a chance he can crack that threshold with improvement off the dribble. All right. And I will say this, the Kenny Martin Jr. kid that I mentioned earlier, his dad was the first pick 20 years ago in the 2000 NBA draft. He got his dad tops. I'll tell you that.

The video I watched, I was like, good grief. He got, he got dad tops. This kid can fly for sure. But another one of these kids. that we didn't see play college basketball, right? And we got, we're loaded with those this year. From Wiseman to RJ Hampton to the ball kid to now Kenny Martin's kid.

Blows my mind how many kids and siblings of, you know, former or current NBA players are entering the league. Lamello's interesting. Lamello is one of the most fascinating prospects in the draft. You talk to one person they hate them, talked to one of the person they love them. we're going to have a lot of time to talk drafts over the coming weeks and months.

I'm excited. Excited for that with you, Chris. For sure. All right, Bobby Wagner. We started on a mailbag in our last episode. Give us some other good questions that we got from people that sent them in, which I thought were extremely good, extremely good questions that we got. They really have been good. I mean, I think Friday show we might do some type of game or segment or something like that, but we've got to get to more of these questions.

All right. let's get to it first question comes from j c he says that uh given that analytics has dictated that the most efficient style of play for the NBA is predominantly three-pointers and high percentage twos will this be the style of play in the NBA forever if not what slash when is the next NBA style of play revolution so second half a little harder than the first half but well my follow-up to that would be well when a rule's going to change because rules are typically what dictate changes in style of play so when is the NBA going to bring back hand checking or when is the NBA going to change the three second

violation? Are these changes going to be made to influence the way in which teams are playing? If not, we're only going to continue on this trajectory that we've been on for this past decade. More and more teams are going to shoot more and more threes every single year and they're going to look for those highly, you know, analytic, analytics happy shots. That's not going to change anytime soon. However, I do think in the NBA today, even though it's predominantly three-pointers, you know, as J.C. mentioned, what we do see today, though, is we do see a wide variety and styles of how teams get those shots, whether it's high pick and roll offense like the Rockets, or whether it's putting your offense through a big man like the Denver Nuggets with Yokic,

or whether it's teams that play typical motion side-to-side ball-moving offense. It's like we see with the Celtics or we see with the Warriors. There's a lot of variety on offense as there's on defense with the types of defenses teams play with some teams switching a lot. Some teams having their big man, you know, sit in the paint like our guy, Brooke Lopez

from the Milwaukee Bucks. So some teams are a bit more aggressive with some traps and hedges. So there's a lot of variety in the way teams play and that's why I really love to watch team. I love to watch the NBA today. But in terms of the results of what shots teams are taking, I think that's

largely going to have to be rules-based. I think rules-based, whether or not you move back the line or you do change rules that enable you to discourage the amount of threes that are shot. The other thing will always, the two things, it's Copycat League. And so somebody not shooting a very high volume and being the best team would be one of those, right? the best teams have typically been teams that have shot in an inordinate amount of threes. And so if you have a team that doesn't win like that, I'll tell you this, like, what if the Sixers won?

And that's not a three happy team. And the other thing is like transcendent players can cause you to, if there's a team that comes along that is not a three happy team that could punish you for playing a lot of small guys, then that can change things too. Like I've wondered this before, like, and obviously it doesn't appear that the guy is on the horizon, but,

you know, what if Shaq's playing right now? Zion? I mean, the closest thing we got. Janus, another one as well. I mean,

look, a lot of our best players are not the three, you know, we went through the Curry span and obviously Curry and Hardin and some of the perimeter guys, but I mean,

Zion's not a big three point guy, LeBron's not a big three point guy. Yannis isn't a big three point guy. I mean, there are a lot of the best players that are not three-point shooters right now, you know? And so who wins? Typically who wins dictates what happens. And so teams that have shot a amount of threes have won. And, you know, I mean, I think there was a portion in time right there.

I mean, I've seen a lot of crappy basketball this year because the teams shouldn't be doing it, in my opinion. Right? I watch the Atlanta Hawks one night, shoot 13 for 49. I mean, it's just, it's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. Like, stop, stop.

Well, what do you recommend? Do you recommend they shoot more long twos? No. You know, those aren't the only two options, by the way. I know. You can go to the basket. You can. you can go to the basket. You can try. I mean, come on. I'm just, I'm serious. You can try.

Look, there's a lot of teams that don't have the Splash brothers that try to play like the Splash brothers. And if you don't have the personnel to do it, it's awful. That's what I'm saying. Do what fits your personnel. If you don't have the personnel to be taken 49 threes, then do what your personnel is built to do. But what we have now is teams that don't have the good three-point shooters, but are still taking a million threes because that's what the analytics say to do. And they suck.

And it's terrible to watch. The teams that have the Splash Brothers and the good three-point shooting teams, look, do you think Russell Westbrook needs to shoot more threes? What happened was he started leading the league and points in the paint. Yes, but why is he leading the points in the paint?

Because he's playing on the team that does lead the league in frequency of three-point shot attempts. and that is by far last in mid-range. But I'm talking about individual players can play to their strengths. I agree, but like it's still about the team, though, and that's why he's able to shoot at a career high frequency at the rim is because of the system that he's in.

The spacing that's provided by four other guys being behind the arc is what allows him to get to the rim. Well, keep in mind, they've been a disappointment up until when they come back. 40 and 24, but whatever. What? I mean, Houston is still like two games back from being the three seed. It's not like they're... So what seed are they? They're the sixth seed right now.

Okay. They're 40 and 24. Okay. I repeat, that's disappointing. What? Where did you have them? Where did you have them? You had them six?

They have a... They have a top 10 net rating. this year. Their top 10 in offense and defense. I mean, I don't know where the disappointment is. Like maybe there's, I guess I didn't think they'd have the same record as Oklahoma City. You did. I mean, what are we talking about here? We're going to act like Houston being the sixth seed is not disappointing? Let's move on to the next question, Bobby. What planet am I on? This next question, actually it follows up from what you guys are talking

about with the rule changes. Cal asks what's one rule change in the league that you think needs to happen and one that you want to happen that's unlikely. You want to start with this? You want me to? I'm still thinking of Houston. Text Daryl. He's disappointed.

You're the only one not disappointed in your beloved rocket. Hell, the city of you. Houston's disappointed. Oh, okay. By the way, I need to lighten up on the, what a friggin year, by the. I was just thinking about this the other day.

They've had the frigging-ass Astros. They traded away DeAndre Hopkins and they all can't stand Bill O'Brien. And then the rockets are in six, and they've had to come to terms with cheering for Westbrook, who they always hated. Tough, tough go. Tough going, Houston.

Rule change. I time limit on replay there there you go I don't know if it'll happen one minute how many times do we watch a game and we sit there and go god I could have told you that I mean why did this take a half an hour it takes forever I don't mind replay but it takes forever they need to put a clock on replay one minute there there's one that there's one that is an easy fix Bro, if you can't figure that shit out in a minute, then we need, there's 50,000 eyeballs. You know, they show back in Sikakis.

There's 50 people sitting in that room. Like we're trying to figure out whose fingernail it went off. We can do this in a minute. I don't mind replay. It takes too long. There's my rule. I'm with you on that. Better replay.

Better replay is a big one. I think if three point percentage league one, Lide gets to a point that even fans who love basketball are like, come on, let's, this is a bit much. I think at that point, the NBA is going to have to do something to curtail the rise of the three-pointers every year, whether that's extending the line, whether that's, you know, hand-checking, whatever it may be, I think at some point that day will come, which was sort of like the general thesis of Kirk Goldsbury's book, Sprawball, and when he talked about at Sloan last year,

what others like Seth Part Now have written about in the past before he worked for the, the bucks. A lot of analytics guys have talked about like what the NBA should be thinking about moving forward to make the game as beautiful as possible to make it as appealing as possible to as many people. And that's something that I always think about with three pointers. Right now, I think the game's in a really good spot. But I do wonder if at some point it gets to the point that every team is taking like over 40% of their shots from three and then it might feel a bit more stale. Hey, you know what? I was thinking about this the other day. If, now this would, I don't think it would abolish it completely, but what if they, you know how like a three point line is an arc, right?

And I know people have talked about like moving it back. We can't really move it back on the side. There's not much. Certainly on those corners, there is not much space. You see guys stepping out of bounds on accident all the time down there. But what if it didn't even extend all the way down into the corners? What if that shot was just way up top, right? And it extended it was like a, you know, a half of a curve.

You understand what I'm saying? Yeah. And then the rest of the court was just two-point shots and opened up. Like you would still have, it'd still be the same core, but you only have the three-point line like almost up top. And that's like your spacing. It would certainly, I mean, God, you'd go from 40 a game taken to maybe 15. the NBA would never do it but I'd also love to see you know in some sort of whack basketball league teams can

draw their own three point line or have a couple of or have a couple of three point lines to choose from because that would make every home court different sort of like every ballpark is different in baseball and I think that would give every team their own distinct unique type of vibe when you go into that building you might have to adjust like one arena might not have might not have a corner three.

You know, I don't know. I mean, like, it might end up being silly. Because basketball is a far different sport than baseball, of course, which is, you know, obviously pitcher and hitter. But basketball is like constantly changing with 10 players on the court at once. So it's totally different. However, I'd be interested in seeing that in some type of basketball league out there just to see what it's like. Fair enough.

Yeah. The one that first came to my mind, and I'll stick with that, is that replay thing. I can't. I continually get frustrated in arenas and on TV. It drives me crazy. I got an interesting proposal from a listener, Austin, who asks, what do you think about having a second free throw line for three point shots, I guess being further back from the three point line?

Or his favorite, he says, you shoot the free throw from the spot of the shooting foul, and the traditional free throw line stays for when teams are in the bonus. So in that case, it would potentially eliminate foul hunting. like the James Hardin type stuff and it would help out centers because they would get to shoot it from closer if they got fouled there. Yeah, but what do we do on the hacker?

That is another one that drives me crazy. If you made fouls that are in the in transition, if you made transition fouls, intentional files, I would not be against that at all. And it would also, I mean, what do you do on, what are we doing if I'm hacking DeAndre Jordan in the back court on that though, Bobby?

I guess you would have to consider that in the bonus, you know? If anything happens in the back court, it would have to be like a bonus or a regular free throw style. Yeah, because that's the other thing. You'd have to, you'd always have to take my idea

and put that into that. Because otherwise, you know, hell, I'm hacking everybody 40 feet from the basket if that's where they shoot their free throws. Yeah, well, I guess he's saying, though, it's a, you only shoot it from that spot if it's a shooting foul, you know? Like, you don't have to shoot on every foul now.

Yeah, I don't want to move the line around. I don't want to move the line around. That'd be something interesting for like a pickup game. You know, you're just playing with your buddies. You get hacked like trying to draw a foul out in the three point line. They're like, fine, shoot it from there, you know. Maybe, all right. So we'll do those for pick up games.

New pickup rules. Pickle games, cool. NBA, I'd rather them do what they tried in the G league this year. And that's a single free throw attempt instead of two or instead of three. Wait, can you explain that more, Kev? Because I played in a pickup league that did that too. So it was a single free throw attempt and it counted. it for two points. Yeah, that's right. Just one equals two. You take one

shot. That's it. If you make it, it counts for two. If you miss it at zero. And at the end of the game, it's a one and one that still counts the same. If you're in the bonus. If we're a college, you know, like NBA one-on-one wouldn't be the case.

Right. But in college, if they were to integrate that, I'm not sure. Like maybe you might have to totally change the college free throw shooting roles as well. but like with NBA, that's something I'm interested in. But the pushback against that is players are able to get some rest at the free throw line. Yeah.

You know, so like how much is lost in that regard that you might be saving in time for the viewers? I don't know. I'm not smart enough to know that. But that is something that people in the NBA do look at and think about when it comes to player health. Oh, hey, let me give you one more because now that we're thinking about it, because this has become a real thing. And that is offensive players initiate. contact. That drives me nuts too. If the offensive player initiates the contact, it should be

an offensive foul, not a defensive foul. I hate the foul hunting. And obviously it works. And so a lot of guys do it. And a lot of guys are very, very good at it. But if you are initiating the contact, they have got to give these defenders some leeway because now you can just jump into a defender and get a foul called by doing it. And I do not like that at all. That one drives me nuts. Next question, Bobby. All right, Tanya asks,

name a player you've met that surprised you the most by their attitude. Either you thought they were going to be, either you thought they were going to be an ass or they were really nice or vice versa. This is a good one for you, I'm sure, Chris. Oh, God. Where are your start, right? I mean, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a, there's a million of them. I would tell you that, uh, obviously, it's been a long time now, uh, that I've been in these locker rooms and been at arenas. And I would say 95% I'm not kidding or are good dudes. Really. Truly. I have been, I have been way more shocked on the good side than I, I, I've ever been on the bad side. I, I, I, I, I have been. I, I have been. I, I, I have been. I

I haven't had many bad experiences ever, honestly. Like people that are, you know, it weirdly, it's usually young guys, like, you know, swagger-filled like rookies or something

that still have the arrogant, you know, still have the arrogance going for them. But, and veterans are usually great, especially with the media. So I haven't, honestly,

like, I haven't really had a ton of bad ones. ones. Good. I had a great experience with Iverson. And I think that would, yeah, I think that would be shocking, probably, the people, you know. Iverson is one that stands out that I thought was. When did you meet him when he came to Memphis?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, God, look. This is like, I don't even know how to describe it. outside of the early 2000 Lakers when they would come to a town, I mean, they were like rock stars. Like it's just a different feel in that arena when that team came, that Kobe and Shaq team came. The only one, and I would say the biggest buzz and the most rock star feeling ever was the one time, because they're an Easter conference team, that Iverson would come. I mean, it was like frigging, you know, I don't know, like the Beatles' wall.

walked in or something. Pandemonium with Iverson. It was crazy. I've never seen a fan response like with him. But anyway, I waited forever after the, after the game one night. He took a long time to get out of showers and whatever. And then I was sitting there waiting and I didn't know. I had never been around him, you know, but I was one of, there weren't that many people there interviewing him. And he could not have been cooler. And I guess, That's just not. I mean, I was kind of nervous, I recall. I mean, it was very young.

But I remember being nervous and then being calmed almost immediately because he was super cool. Maybe I caught him on the right night. I don't know. Because I know that people have had, you know, not great interactions, but he was great. I'll give you another one, Durant. And I have not been around him in years. But during the lockout, which is kind of this. same feeling that we're having right now.

What year was that 11? Is that 2011? The lockout. Rudy Gay threw like a celebrity basketball game. Like they were just Nike was putting this stuff together. And he did it at this like small arena. But everybody showed up. Like LeBron showed up.

Durant showed up. Everybody. But after that game, you know, players were like kind of going back to the locker room and whatever. And Durant's, you know, he's already a star at that point. I'm not kidding you. This dude walked through and took. every pitcher and signed every autograph.

And it was like Ali walking through Zaire. It was unbelievable. I was just blown away at how great he was with the fans. And I'd always heard great stuff about him. But I'll never forget that. He was awesome. And give me some of yours, Kevka. I'm going to try to think of some bad ones

or if anybody's ever gotten mad at me off the top of my head. One, two that come to mind to me. And this, this side did not go in with anything but positive expectations that were only further confirmed. Steph Curry, when I interviewed him, was incredibly nice and thoughtful and insightful. And Clay Thompson, when I interviewed him for a separate story, both those guys are sort of perceived publicly as nice guys or fun guys and or family. guys or party guys like Clay is. And both of them are exactly, in my experience, exactly as what you think they are. I really enjoyed both the conversations with them. I mean, I remember with Clay with the story I wrote about him, it sort of started off. Like, you could tell he was

tired after I'll work out of your sweat and kind of like, you know, catching his breath. Obviously, one of the last things he wants to do is talk to me. But as soon as I pulled out my laptop and we were watching plays together, he just lit up. He just lit up. He, just got totally into it was so insightful with everything he was saying when we're watching video of him running around screens and shooting and all that he was so into it it just very nice as well um so those two guys come to mind first when i think about that question i i can't i can't think of a single person that i've met or as tanya said like someone you thought was going to be an ass i can't think of anybody who was an ass um and yeah for the most part like every single

single exchange I've had with players ever since I started this years ago has been a positive. No one ever yelled at you for trying to blow up their team? The only time someone, nobody yelled at me, but the only time a player ever said something where I was like, what? Was Rajan Rondo? Really? So this was when I was just a Celtics writer. And I was in the, for a Celtics Lakers game, I was in the Celtics locker room.

and Rondo said like, you're a Lakers writer, right? You're a Lakers writer. You know, like, get out of here. And I was like, what?

I've covered the Celtics. And then there's this one of the time, Rondo just kind of, and this is not the only, I'm not the only person this has happened to. He just sort of like held a stare at me. He just glared at me as we're walking down the hallway until I looked away. I'm pretty sure he was establishing himself as the alpha,

uh, overall media members. I'm not the only one that's happened to. Yeah, I was trying to think if there's anybody that's been actively, like, mean to me, and I can't even think of one. I can either. Have I told you my Gilbert Arena story? Look, no, I don't know.

I don't know if you have. If you have, I forget, but please tell it. All right. So when I first started covering the NBA, the first thing I ever did was cover draft workouts. It was honestly looking back, the strength. strangest thing ever. So you didn't have any, there were, there were no like, there were no places to do the workouts except for like a college gym because the team is just moving here. And,

like, they're having, they're having these draft workouts at Rhodes College, a college in Memphis. And so they sent out this thing and it was like, okay, if you want to come cover the workouts. But the team was so new to town, like nobody was going. It's so like on Saturday morning. I would like get up and I would drive over to this college and they would let me in. And like I remember Chuck Daly was there and Dick Versace and Billy Knight and like all these dudes. And and then they would just like let me sit and watch these draft workouts. And so at one of them I watched Jason Richardson and Trenton Hassel. And it was epic. Like they just went toothed the nail against each other and Richardson was off the charts.

like athletically, I couldn't believe what I was watching. He was just done at Michigan State. Turned out they would have actually taken him in that draft, but he got taken fifth, I believe, and they took Shane Batier six with the next pick. So anyways, long story short, Jason Richardson, of course I'm there. I interview him afterwards.

I'm the only media guy there. And we get friendly with each other and sitting around talking because I'm just out of college. I'm college age. at the time. And so anyways, the Warriors draft him. They come to town later that year. And I go into the locker room before the game because I'm going to say, hey, to Jason Richardson and, you know, congratulate him on, you know, good rookie season so far, whatever. And I walk up to him and I'm kind of talking to him. And Gilbert Arenas is, is the locker next to him. He's

playing for the Warriors, right? And so I'm standing there talking to Richardson, and Gilbert Noreenus looks up and he's like, Chris? And I was like, hey, hey, Gilbert. He's like, Chris Vernon? And I was like, yeah. And I was like, you know, and I'm like, what in the world? I'm like, how do you know me? And he goes, I'm reading your name tag. I was like, come on, bro. I mean, I was so embarrassed. I was so embarrassed. I was so embarrassed. everybody's laughing. I mean, it was funny, man. It was fun.

I can't deny it. Shit was funny. But I was, you know, imagine me. I'm in my young 20s. I'm already nervous being in these locker rooms anyway. That's what he said. I'm reading your name tag. That's awesome.

Thanks, thanks, thanks, thanks, thanks Gilbert. That's amazing. I really thought this dude, like,

I mean, I'm like, how does he know who I am? He didn't know who I was. That's the point. We're ready for the next one, Bobby. All right, let's do a couple of pop-culture-y ones. Lucas asks, what are some of your favorite basketball movies or movies that heavily involve basketball?

You know, I'll say this. Air Buds came to mind first, I'm just saying. What the hell? What? You know what? For all you nerds that are going to tweet me, I don't know how you do the show with Vernon. I'm typing on my keyboard. so mad. How do you put up

with Vernon? Oh, Vernon's on there, delete. Oh, you idiots. I want you to rewind it and listen to what this dude just said. And you tell me who has to put up with who. We're frigging eight. Are we

eight? We're eight years old. Air Boyd. What in the... Have you ever seen Airbud? Bro. How about... I'm not. I'm not.

even entertaining this. How about semi-pro with Will Ferrell? All right. Jackie Moon. I mean, look, I like all of them. Hoosiers? Hoosiers? Yes. Okay. I mean, all I said was Airbud came to mind first. I'm not saying I would choose to watch it first or anything like that. It's just what came to my, because I'm thinking back to my childhood. That's the way my memory was working right there. I don't have a great movie memory. How about you? I know you're going to say, He got game and blue chips and, you know, obviously, you know, all these movies, white men can't jump. No, white man can't jump is the one.

That's the one I probably have seen and laughed, you know, most often at the most. It holds up, it holds up too. I love it. I have a confession. I've never seen it. Oh, my God. Wow. You seen Teen Wolf?

That's a basketball movie. I don't think I've seen Teen Wolf either. Oh, no. You got to watch White Men Can't Jump. You have to watch that. that. Have to. That's essential. Maybe, maybe, maybe I'll watch it this week and we'll hit it on Friday show then. Perfect. I watch that. Want to do like a white man can't jump. Yes. I do. I'll wear my, uh, I'll wear my, uh, Billy Hoax. Billy Hoyle is the,

the, he's, uh, Woody Harrison in the movie. There is an actual white men can't jump recapables with Bill Simmons, Rember Brown and Chris Ryan recorded, uh, oh, wow, over three years ago, 2017. They did that. rewatchables. Rewatchables. Yeah. What did I say? You said recapables. Recapables.

What a ringer employee. Too much ringer content, baby. What we really need. What we need is our re-listenables, like for music. That's what I would be good at. It's recapables. What a dope. I watched,

I watched Hoosiers with my son about two months ago. And he loved it. He loved it. it. I mean, it's great when you're a kid, for sure. Yeah. But I... I haven't seen that in years. Oh, yeah. You got to watch White Man Can't Jump. That's, that's a perfect one. I mean, I haven't seen...

He got game in years, too. I mean, I don't even really... I don't even really remember what happens. My movie memory is horrible. It's... I have a bad movie memory. That's why I grade everything on Letterbox. I don't know. You seem to remember Air Bud.

Yeah, I don't remember a thing that happened in it, though. It's about a frigging golden retriever that plays basketball. Yeah, no kidding it is. What do you need to remember, the plot? Oh, man. All right.

Let's move on. Let's move on. Oh, boy. Easer asks, I guess they're from London. So they asked, there's no sport on TV, and they live in London,

and support both Liverpool and the Lakers, and they feel absolutely gutted that both their teams are on course to be champions. It's assuming a lot. And it's all been taken from them. Any good suggestions on good basketball books to read while they're locked down at home? Bill Simmons,

the book of basketball. Give me a raise. Yeah, definitely book of basketball. Definitely not basketball and other things by Chase Serato. the breaks of the game comes to mind breaks of the game i'm going to give you one that uh i have found myself picking up more than other ones in the past and it is the it's the writing slash teachings

of uh of john wooden i love that i love that book and i do think there are valuable lessons that can improve everyone's life. So wooden. It's just called wooden. I love that. I'm going to give you one that I had to read. So I used to have to read all these books because I would get everybody on for like,

you know, in radio, you would get sent the book and then they would offer you the author to come on. Let me tell you a story. It's the Red Hourback book. It's great. great. I don't remember who wrote that. I don't remember who wrote, let me tell you, let me tell you a story. But that John Feinstein. John Feinstein. According to Google. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah, that's great. Obviously, like that, yeah, like something like that.

Bill Russell's books good. I always like biographies and like, and autobiographies and stuff like that. But yeah, and then those like behind the curtain things like you're talking about. with breaks of the game, those kind of books. I love those two. Oh, the McCallum one. Seven seconds or less? Yeah, seven seconds or less. Yeah, totally worth reading.

And especially with the way basketball has changed so much now and Mike Dantonie's still a big figure in basketball. I haven't read this book yet, but I know a lot of people love Jackie McMillan's when the game was ours. Larry Bird and Magic Johnson. I need, like, that's one thing. I get a, like this, during this kind of downtime, I got to read some more books. I get a whole bunch of books backed up that I'm slowly trying to get through.

But this is sort of a downtime to do some catching up. Oh, speaking to Jackie McMullen, she wrote a book with Larry Bird called Birdwatching. And it's like his biography. But it covers it covers him into the after he had like coached the Pacers. So he talks a lot of, he talks a lot about coaching, which is super fascinating. Like he had this thought in there about how, you know, three to four years. That's how long you should be a team's coach.

I've always remembered him saying that. Three or four years because the voice gets stale. You've done all the speeches. You've done all the stuff and whatever. But that book's really good. Jackie McMillian, you can find that a paperback for nothing. And it's really good because he talks a lot about coaching too.

So it gives a totally different perspective. And it's obvious him and Jackie had a tremendous. this relationship. I mentioned not reading Shay's book. That's a joke earlier. You should read

Shay's book. But did you see Chris Obama tweeted about Shea with the New York Times story? Unbelievable. And well-deserved too for all the good

Shay does on social media helping people directly. She's an awesome guy. A really awesome guy. To get back to that question about somebody you meet and you think about what they might be like, I always imagine

Shay to be like this loud, funny, obnoxious person, but he's actually super quiet and kind and sweet when you meet him. Oh, no. He's the first person that I met when I first got hired at the ringer that offered me advice. He's like, hey, man, you know, so like, what do you do? You know, here's what I, here's a piece of advice for you. Now, after I spent some time working at Grantland and, and he mentioned how like file a day or

two in advance when you have, if you have a story running on a Wednesday, file early Tuesday, afternoon Tuesday at the latest, or file Monday if you can. That way you have more time to work with your editor and getting edits and collaborating and working together. And I'm like, when he said that to me, I'm like, wait a minute, why wouldn't anybody do that? And he's like, okay, you're ahead because you have that mindset. That's crazy. That's crazy that you had such a great experience with him because I met him and he was a colossal prick.

That's the answer to your other question. Which NBA guy have you met? Shays Serrano. Shai Sorano. Got any other questions, Bobby? Yeah, let's do... Do two more. Yeah, let's do two more.

Pick your favorites. All right, Joshua asks, considering the social distancing, what's your favorite home-cooked meal? Last non-basket one, then we'll do one more basketball one. That's a good question. Favorite home-cooked meal?

My mom makes a lot of good meals. I don't know. if I can pick just one. I think she made like some really good chicken vegetable soup last week. That was awesome. So good. I don't know. I feel like I can't pick just one.

She makes really good chicken parm. Really good turkey burgers. I don't know, man. Like I can't just choose one. I can't. I think probably for me like either like steaks or, You know, with the steaks potato. I like meat and potatoes, that kind of stuff.

But enchiladas, that one, for whatever reason, stands out to me. My wife is a tremendous cook. She's great at it. She loves it. Like, it's a passion, right? She loves to do it. Not really. I mean, I can, but, I mean, I can, but obviously I am, it's kind of like,

let me see, like, like, Draymond Green could shoot free throws, but if it's a technical foul free throw situation, we're letting Curry shoot it, right? It's kind of like that. So I'm Draymond and she's Curry. And so we just let Curry, right? Chef Curry, how about that? No, but she loves doing it.

You know, she loves to cook. And so it's like, and I mean, I can make some stuff. But yeah, I think probably like, you know, if we do steaks, How about you, Bobby? I'm curious, like, what are you eating right now at home? Oh, what I'm eating right now? A lot of the same stuff over and over again because I'm trying to avoid the store, you know?

But if given one choice, my favorite home cook meal is Newkey Bowling Yays. There you go. I actually just ate some yokey the other day from Trader Joe's. It was in that, like, frozen food section. You know, it's one of those, like, you just throw it in the, you just, there's something like a cook. All you have to do is throw the thing into a pan and heat it up and it all like melts together.

It was great though. It was great. Did you guys buy any frozen foods? Like you know, like TV dinners type of things? Oh, I here you go. I promise you there is nobody

in America. I'll put it myself up because anybody in America in terms of eating Amy's gluten-free cheddar burritos. Oh, I eat those too. Yeah, those are good. What do you get those? Oh, God. I bet I eat 200 in a year.

Where do you get them? I want to try them. Where do you get them? Oh, the supermarket. Any supermarket? Any supermarket? Yeah. Like a whole foods or Trader Joe's. No, no, no, no. Just go a frozen food section. You can't get them at Trader Joe's though because they're a brand name, but you can get them at any other normal supermarket. Okay, that's what I was checking it on. Like we, um. Amies. Yeah. Gluten free. I like the gluten-free one better and I like the regular one.

Really? Yeah. Yeah. We bought quite a few TV dinners, and the ones that I'm really liking are the healthy choice simply steamers. Really, really good. I mean, I eat the Frontera Grill. It's a place out of Chicago. It's actually Skip Bayliss's brother.

You know Skip Bayliss's brother's like a world acclaimed chef. No, I did not. Yes. Look him up. Rick Bayless. is his name. Rick Bayliss. Oh, yeah.

Rick Bayliss is a, like a monster chef. Oh, my God. And he has, yes. He looks just like him. That's his brother. But they,

he has a restaurant in Chicago called Frontera. They started making TV dinners, Frontera TV dinners. They're taco bowls. They are a 10. They're great. Yes.

All right. You ready for one last one? I didn't check these out. Yeah. There you go. Frontera grill. They make like, what's it called? Frozen.

I saw it in the frozen section. I got it. Taco bowls. They have barbacos. Because I'm like on the search for like healthy. Yeah, that's healthy. Because some are like really, really bad for you. Oh, right.

For sure. I'm in the search for some healthy, you know, frozen foods. Yeah. We're ready. Last one, Bobby. All right. This last one comes from Gerard. He says he's a huge fan of the show from Australia.

And I just want to say real quick, thanks to everyone sending in their emails from all over the world. I made a little running list of all the countries that I saw from, and I'm sure I missed a few, but Australia, Brazil, Kenya, Slovenia, the UK, Italy, China, Spain, Finland, Israel, the Netherlands. It's just, it's crazy, man. Holy mackle.

Anyway, Gerard says that their national sport has just started this weekend after a lot of debate playing an empty thousand capacity stadiums. The atmosphere was bizarre and it definitely wasn't as entertaining without the crowd noise. If the NBA does come back this season without crowds, how much of a turnoff do you think the lack of

atmosphere will be. And I guess my follow-up personally would be how much do you think it will actually change the competition, not having a home team advantage quite as much? Oh, I mean, I think it's going to be a major turnoff personally. I mean, I was on the article I wrote this week on the ringer about Zion's first game, I was rewatching the clips of that fourth quarter. And if you remember, he hit four threes in his first game in the fourth quarter all over the course of like two minutes. Every single time he hit a three, the crowd got louder. and louder and louder. And watching that, I'm like, damn, I can't imagine that moment without the fans cheering as

loudly as they were, without the hysteria. And I think to what Ethan Strauss wrote on The Athletic, he interviewed Andrew Bogot, who did play without fans in the crowd in Australia. And he said just kind of how weird it was. You know, at first, you know, you're sort of excited, like for this atmosphere where you can just focus on the game, but then it just felt sort of stale. And I would imagine that that would be the case in the NBA if games are played without fans. However, I do think about it.

And I'm like, I wonder if there's a way with testing that maybe they could test, you know, some amount of family or friends. And maybe like you can make it almost sort of like an AAU type of atmosphere where it's a lot of close-knit people in a smaller gym. And that could create a totally different environment if people are tested in advance. I mean, that I'd be asking way too much. But like when I'm playing in Fantasyland here, if you can get a gym of people who are tight with the players, it could create a really unique atmosphere that we haven't seen in professional sports before.

That sort of brings it back to what it was like for a lot of players back in high school. I think it is going to, I mean, there's no way. It's not, it's going to feel like we're watching our practice. So it's going to feel like. Like that's, you know, like when you watch those like, and they do like team, USA stuff and whatever in the gym.

I'm still going to enjoy it. I think what they're going to do is it'll just be like tighter shots, right? So it's not like you're going to show a huge empty arena behind it. The basketball itself will still be tremendous, which is what I want to watch. And so, but will it hurt not having an atmosphere there? Of course it will. Of course. That's what we love, you know?

And I would just tell you, like, I don't know. Like you say you went back and watched that Pelicans game, right? And the Zion thing and the crowd gets better and better and better. And especially there's for the playoffs, that would really be a bummer if there was no. Because the playoffs, I mean, you just get, you see these cities in totally different lights once the playoffs come around. And so that would be a bummer. But I would, you know, yeah, I mean, it's going to hurt. But look, if that's a price I got to pay to get to watch basketball.

then so be it. Sure. And I get back to what Woj reported back in March. He said, quote, for now there's a working plan that games would return without fans. And teams have been told to search out arena dates well until August for the playoffs, sources said. Teams have been directed to give the league office potential dates

at smaller nearby game venues, including team practice facilities that could spare the use of empty carbonerous arenas and possibly provide backdrops to unique. television viewing lines end quote and that's the part that I'm thinking about like what would make the viewing experience interesting for fans to watch and what would make the playing experience really interested in engaging for players and that and that's what what I get back to with like if you were able to test you know 50 people that are close to the the players either friends or family if you were able to pull

that off which is probably very unrealistic you could create an AAU style atmosphere, which would be a whole totally different thing in a small, small gym that could be pretty dope for the players and for people watching. And I don't know if it's feasible. It probably isn't, but it's just something on my mind that I'm thinking about to create that quote, unique television viewing line that Woj mentioned. I don't think it'll be, it won't be all that bad. I mean, it'll be like watching a Hawks game. Well, so. Why? Why? Why in such an necessary shot. You ever watch a Hawks game?

There ain't nobody there. I love to watch Trey Young. Yeah. Well, there's nobody there. Just go back and watch some Hawks games. You want to prepare for watching games with no fans. I'm looking to see where they rank in attendance this year. Doesn't matter.

I know, I know, because attendance numbers are misleading. I know because it's whatever, but 25th. 25th. You know who's 26th in attendance? The Grizzlies.

Is that right? That's all I wanted to say. I just wanted to load up to take a shot. It's a lot bigger market. This ticket sold. I know. Typically. Yeah.

Yeah. Flip on a Grizzan game and then flip on a Hawks game. You tell me who's got more people. I know. I know. I wanted just to take that shot at you, Chris. All right. It's going to do it for our show today.

Thank you to Bobby Wagner for producing as always. We will be doing another show on Friday. And Kevin, I will talk to you then. And thank you again for everybody. Thank you again, everybody for the question. If you dig what you're hearing, go give us a rating and review on iTunes. Five stars. Five stars really helped.

We'll talk to you on Friday.