The Ringer NBA Show - Preseason Power Rankings, Part 1 | Group Chat

Episode Date: September 29, 2025

Justin, Rob, and Wos are officially back to preview the 2025-26 season with their annual preseason power rankings. Part 1 is about the bottom five in their rankings. Intro: (0:00:00) Team no. 30: (4:32)Team no. 29: (18:46)Team no. 28: (30:14)Team no. 27: (39:25)Team no. 26: (54:46) Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny LambreProducers: Ben Cruz, Isaiah Blakely, John Richter, and Victoria Valencia Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome back to group chat. I am Justin Verrier and joining me in front of me. It's Big Waz right there. And finally out of his closet. I know. It's Rob Mahoney. I'm as shocked as you are. How's it feel to be a Hollywood legend?

I don't know if I've reached that status yet. I'm hitting all the benchmarks, though. I was just talking about I need to get a plant. You know, I just need to fully embrace the LA lifestyle. I'm being humbled by the traffic on a regular basis. But unlike you, Justin, I have not been sunburned yet. You know, I'm used to these. harsh environments. I'm used to the Texas heat. The sun will not get me down out here.

He's built for it. I'm built for it. Have you walked him through what the do's and don'ts of being an Angelino? We actually had it. Driving, I would say, avoid it unless it's between the hours of 11 a.m. and 2 p.m. Okay, seems reasonable. And then after 8 p.m., basically, you can drive. Outside of that, you should avoid it. Just a normal, functional city you have here. Yeah, I mean, listen, look, you can drive in your neighborhood. Yes. If you want to get across town, you better have some good podcast fired up and some patience because it's going to take a while. Other than that, I would say, find your matcha spot, you know, crucial.

Locally. And just buckle up for the ride, man. That's what I would say. I'm looking forward to it. Well, you're already a kind of a pseudo-celebrity, which is like, that's what you need to get into. You're a podcaster. Everyone's a goddamn podcaster. You started from that.

I got bad news. We are not pseudo-celebrity. I think you are to a certain brand of guy. We are just some guys with microphones. A really cool type of guy. Rob is the guy for that. So funny. Jesus Christ.

But we have been assembled here in person in Los Angeles, two Angelinos, one former one, to do our annual exercise. That is the pre-execis. preseason power rankings of the NBA. We should mention we're doing this a little bit earlier in order to do it on video so you can see our lovely faces on camera and just send a bunch of strong commentary about how we look, our mannerisms, our little quirks. Yeah. So you sound like a man who's been just like under the microscope lately. Are you feeling the scrutiny? Are you feeling observed?

I want to be observed. I spent all offseason in the gym. Oh, wow. Getting fit. I know you can't tell because I have all these layers of flannel on, but you know, you take this top coat off? Yes.

You're doing it the right way. That's a powerful. The secret buff is a powerful thing. You take off the oversure and all of a sudden it's like, whoa, have you seen Justin? I wouldn't say buff quite yet, but like,

it's a little bit more firm. That's wonderful. I mean, listen, you're like chopping trees in your backyard and, like, doing like a lot of manual labor. So it makes sense that you're becoming more firm, as you just said. Yes. I am built for the harsh environs of Portland these days.

I'm about to say you're built for town. Not quite. No, I wouldn't go that far. I mean, if we get the appropriate sponsorship, I am definitely willing to say that. I look forward to that. There you go. But I am built for six separate pods,

which is what we are going to do. We're going to start from the, bottom up number 30. So this is what we typically do. So if you're familiar with the show, you should be familiar with this exercise. We basically just rank every team one to 30. We aggregate them, or I do because I do all the work.

And then Isaiah Blakely breaks any ties that we have. Then we have our list. We're going to talk about each team in depth. We got an existential question for each of them. And then also we're going to name some guys, four things. Can I just say this one in particular, 30 to 26, my favorite podcast we do all year? Just absolute sicko shit.

And, you know, the fact that there is any audience whatsoever for us talking about these particular teams is just an incredible luxury and grace. And I think, I think both of you, I think the NBA world, I think the fellow sicko is out there. Well, with that note, we're going to start. Number 30, we've got the Utah Jazz. Who else could it be? Well, you guys both pick the Jazz. I did not have them at 30. I actually had them at 29.

I don't know if I regret that in retrospect, because. now I'm looking through all the rosters. I'm like, this team doesn't have a lot of talent outside of her guy, Lori Markenden. It's tough. I think they had one of the more clarifying off seasons for the team because it felt like previous season since Aange got in there, we all knew they needed to strip it down and like try to get new young talent via the draft in there. And they had a bunch of NBA rotation guys on the team.

And it's like, guys, you need to get rid of them if you want to fully embrace the destiny that's so obviously in front of you. But, you know, they basically decided Danny Aange did, as is his custom, that he wanted nothing but perfect trades for these guys. And it feels like the process kind of got drawn out longer than I think it needed to. But this offseason, they kind of were like, all right, we're done with this charade of like pretending to be rebuilding but also like being competitive.

Yes. And, you know, the John Collins move for me because it's just like, they were just like, we just don't want you on the team anymore. Just dumping players for nothing. Dump them. Colin Sexton. Yeah. That's where it's like good news, bad news,

because you're right, they have cleared the decks and some room for these younger guys to do different things. But waiting that long meant they got almost nothing in return for these players who were an important part of their team in some respects. Yes. the rarely seen double tank. We have tank, but not as well as we should.

So are we going to ensure that we're going to tank as hard as possible this season? Can I just say, in light of losing the Cooper flag lottery, that wasn't untrue. I'm not saying they could have improved their odds meaningfully, but this is a team that was just, I think, devastated by where they landed in the draft order. And we'll see what happens with Ace. Maybe he turns out to be exactly the kind of like shot-creating star that they need long-term. I don't know. but this is a team that desperately needed the hope of someone like Cooper and just did not have the ping pong balls go their way.

Yeah, that probably segues nicely to our existential question, which is, is Lori Markin and the keeper just a walking bundle of future draft picks because he is the guy kind of caught in the middle of these two different errors, the sort of tank and then the full-on tank era. I don't know, was. What do you think? Do you think that they should just get rid of him because he doesn't fit, or would you keep him around and just see what can happen? I think the way that they've built the roster now with all of these young guys,

I think it would make more sense to move on from him and just decide internally what's the basement you're willing to take for the guy and shop them. That's what I think would be the smartest thing to do. And I think the best teams in the league could all use this guy. And he is one of these guys that can scale in terms of he can bring what he's doing to any situation. He doesn't need, you know, the pieces to be extraordinarily complimentary.

He's going to compliment whatever competent outfit he ends up on. And so that's what I think makes it easier and even more fun to think about because I can't think of a team in the league who can't use what this guy breaks to the table. Totally. It's the reason you give him $196 million. It's not because he's a superstar. It's because he's beneficial to any situation. He's imminently tradable.

He's also their best player, like by a wide, wide margin. And so I understand the tension point. I just don't understand why, like, who does it benefit to keep him around as a member of the Utah Jazz at this point? There are all these young guys that need reps. His existence on the roster, I think, forces you into some tough lineup decisions in terms of like, if you're going to, Lowry obviously needs to start. But that means like, like Kyle Filipowski was one of the bright spots of

last season. Are you going to bring him in off the bench? Are you going to like give short trips? I did not say that. But like if you are the jazz, what else are you endeavoring to do? Like you should be investing in guys like Filipowski, investing in guys like Hendricks, investing in guys like Cody Williams and saying like, what do we have here? And Lowry Markinen is helping you be slightly more competent now. But by the time your team is good again, he's going to be nearing the end of his deal,

entering into his early 30s. And then like, what are you doing here? Or he's just sitting on the sidelines. because he hasn't been playing much of the past two seasons, 47 games last year, 55 the year before that. He was an All-Star, and I have to say, if you look at Lori Markinen's shot chart, especially from that All-Star season in his first year in Utah,

it is a Darry-Wet Dream. Yeah. And it's not just the layups and threes model, which is typically what you hear about that. It's also the dunks, the power at the rim. I was looking into this. This guy in his All-Star season, 200 made threes. Yeah.

A hundred made dunks. I couldn't find a single player who's ever had a season like that. So you have finishing and you have three-point shooting. It's really like maps on to virtually any roster at this. And to me, I think about, when I think about marking it, I think about the Jimmy Butler deal in the sense that Golden State was just on a treadmill of mediocrity the entire season. They got Jimmy in there and it took them from, all right, also ran to be like,

okay, this is a team that like needs to be recognized. with now. And I think that's what marketing can do for a team. He can take you from, all right, you're a nice, you're nibbling on the edges of the playoffs to, whoa, like, you could give anybody a

tough series. We're talking about the top of the league, a tough goal of it, if your team is healthy enough relatively. So that's why I think I'm excited about the prospect that he would move somewhere. Because I think he can do that for a team take you from

and that's nice to whoa, we're working with something. I mean, he's a big time ceiling razor. And in particular, like, if you are a team that plays a traditional sort of pick and roll style, he just, like, helps your spacing, he helps your movement. He does a lot of very natural, easy things that help you. But if you play in flow and you can get into what you're talking about, Justin, which is the mobility that makes him both a threat to shoot off the move and a threat to drive and finish inside with all that length,

like that versatility is what can really transform you as a team. Yes. We have shooting bigs, but somehow Markinen still manages to play big while functioning more like your typical wing shooter, which is very rare. The one difference between him and a lot of other guys that potentially on the market, big old fat contract. I do wonder how much, especially considering the off season we just came off of, where a lot of teams are blanching about the money on their brooks. A lot of teams just kind of nipping at the edges of that second apron, he makes $46.4 million this season and it just keeps going up. Good work if you can get it. Which is great for him, but I think for a team that wants to trade for somebody for immediate help, it's like, who has that open space in order to do so.

Do you guys have any teams you like as sort of like a marketing suitor? I mean, it's been going around the ringer. Michael Pina wrote about it for the site, but Detroit is such a juicy fit. Yeah. Like, and think about, you know, how much of a difference Tobias Harris made for that team. Right. What if you replace Tobias Harris with the best possible version of that player type and someone who's more malleable and adjustable who could help. You know, I think the question is whether Jaden Ivy would be involved in that deal.

I would presume that he would be. I wouldn't do it for Ivy. So you're too enticed by Ivy's potential. I'm enticed by Ivy, but I'm also worried about the shooting if you're relying on an Assar or a Ron Holland to step into that void. Because they went out and got a lot of plug-in-play shooters in order to spot the Malik Beasley and the Tim Hardway Jr. It might be even bring him to believe in that one. We might be able to bring Malik Beasley back. soon to the Ringer podcast network.

But I would want to rely on shooting from my core guys as opposed to these like hired goons essentially. And if you're not, it's a lot of Markanin and Kade with three potential non-shooters as your core guys. That's the only thing I'm worried about. I mean, you can shoot the fucking lines off the ball. Like, I think that's where if you're trying to figure out how do we make these pieces fit,

Markanin is the kind of pressure release that helps. But I really like Ivy. I think the reason it could be enticing for both. teams is the jazz from a guard perspective, incredibly bleak. And if you want to reason why Lowry Markinen, when he did play last season, didn't feel exactly like Lowry Markinen, I don't know. They don't have a point guard who's functional and experience. Like, you know, they're getting assists. They're technically have point guards out there, but this is a team that could not run baseline offense. And that's a huge problem. And part of what you need is someone like Jaden Ivy. Yeah. And to me,

Marketing, he's not, he's not somebody who you just give him the ball and be like, soak up, you know, a trillion possessions. But I think that's the appeal, honestly, is that he's not that kind of innings-eaters, so to speak. It's that, you know, he's opening things up for all of your guys because of his gravity. And he's happy to just be super efficient with the touches that he does get and doesn't need, like, an offensive overhaul, right? Like, you don't need to rejigger your entire offense to put this guy in there.

And I think Detroit, because, and that's the thing, like, is Cade going to start playing a different brand of creator? That might be a question for part three or four of this podcast. You know what I mean? And so if he's going to be the Cade that we've seen, then marketing makes a lot of freaking sense. No. Well, we were talking about some guards on Utah Jazz. Should we name some guys? I mean, Isaiah Collier is a guy who demands to be named.

Again, they're like nominal point. guard led rookies by a huge margin and assist. So like was doing his part. The problem is he can't score. He's not a threat to score. The bigger problem is everyone knows it. No one treats him as a threat in any capacity whatsoever. It's like the constant problem with them. And part of the reason someone like A's so appealing is who is like an actual threat that people are responding to who's not Lowry Markinen? The answer right now, especially in a world where Colin Sexton is not a member of the jazz anymore. Jordan Clarkson is not a member of the jazz anymore. John Collins is not a member of the jazz anymore.

Who is the next player in line after Lowry? That sweet, sweet red, Kiante George, baby. I have to say, the answer does not seem to be Kianti George, but I am ready to be proven wrong if he turns a corner. Let's talk about Kianti George, though. Because I can't

tell if he's good, even though I do realize and recognize that he does have some real juice to his game. He does. Theoretically, what is he good at? Scoring, but not official. Lee. Yeah. Okay.

Yeah. In fact, I have a nice little stat for you guys. There are three players since the three-point era, so 1980, so 7980, who have taken 12 or more

field goal attempts from the floor and shot under 40% from the floor. Oh, no. Over their careers, it is Keante George, Alex Saar, who will get to very shortly, and Brandon Jennings.

Sheesh. Shout to Brandon Jennings. Since 1980. Our colleague in podcasting. What? It's just, He clearly has something, but I do think maybe moving to a bench roll, perhaps into that Jordan Clarkson's slot, which is now open, might benefit him. Well, it already started. You could see the jazz already kind of leaning in that direction. And I think that's where somewhere like Bryce Sinsabaw kind of quietly shuffled into a nice little supporting role as more of a traditional three and D wing spot up role playing kind of guard for them. And they need some of that. Like they need stars, but they also need guys who operate into like a functional.

competent capacity doing normal NBA things. And they're still searching for all that. They have guards who aren't threats. They have wings who don't really know how to play yet, forwards who are like versatile but kind of untapped. And if since the ball's like, just a good three-point shooter like he proved to be over, you know, most of last season,

that's like a meaningful thing for them. And I think ultimately more important for where they are right now than Keante George coming in and shooting 38%. Somebody's got to do a bulk of the ball handling now. even, you know, Clayton Jr., who I like, you're not going to give him the ball and say, handle the rock all day, rookie. Like, that's not going to be his strength.

So I don't know who's going to do the dribbling here. Yeah, I actually like the rent court because it is Walker Kessler, Hendricks, you presume, will be healthy and starting again. And if Laurie's there, like, three through five, that's actually not bad. It's not bad. They've got some guys, three through five. Why did they trade for Yusuf Nurchich? Why is he on this team?

I don't know why several of the players that they brought in. Kevin Love is still there as we're recording this. I was looking up he's 19 years older than Ace Bailey. Is he really? I mean, I think it's nice to have some adults in the room. Oh, for sure. We got Yang. We got slow-mo.

They really packed it with some known guys. They really did. Anybody else here? Is Cody Williams good? Unclear. I think it's no. I think the early returns were not encouraging. But again, it's like you want to know for sure.

And I think that's part of the issue they have with their front court right now is like with all of these wings and a glut of guards who are going to play but maybe don't deserve consistent minutes. Are you going to be able to look at all the forwards you want to actually take a look at this season? I mean, it's Will Hardy's problem and not ours, thankfully, but a big problem for the jazz. Yes. Ace backdoor is going to get what he wants. He's going to get a lot of opportunity because there's nobody else here, especially if they trade flower marketing. I did see they had 46 different starting lineups last season. That's crazy. Over under 46 starting lineups for the Utah Jazz in 2526. I'm going to go under.

I would hope. Yeah. I think they're going to be consistent, but consistently bad. Yeah. Yeah, they're going to find a lineup that leads to a lot of losses and stick to it. That's right. Got to do it.

Well, another team with that same sort of blueprint, the Brooklyn Nets. So was this year number, 30. Number 30. Yes. Although, since we did the voting, they've just been adding good players for free, which is, oh, he's nice. They had Haywood Highsmith coming in there. Kobe Buffkin, the Hawks are just giving them just like guys on their bench that they don't need anymore because they have this reservoir of cap space in order to just take all of the flotsum and everything you don't want. I have to say, there's been like a mild bit of like just ripping of the Brooklyn Nets over the

offseason because of what they did. And I think part of it is because they went ahead and drafted five players in the first round and I have to say deservedly so. That was a little bit weird. I didn't think they're going to do all five. But overall I don't see what else that they were going to do besides what they've done now which is just rent their cast base up, get future

assets and just build toward a future because they don't have that one guy to build around so they're still searching for that until they get that. This is what a team does. Yeah. Yeah, they got, it was a tough situation for them in the draft lottery this year. Making all the picks like

as opposed to what, just giving them away for free? Right. Or, you know, for the promise of some future picks that are probably going to be equally as bad. Right. Just keep trading back and back and back and back like Brad Stevens. Yeah. Yeah. No, we're going to draft past 25 next year.

It's like, what would have been the point of that? I actually think the problem is more that Sean Marks has been given an opportunity to write the wrongs that he made himself. And so there is a little bit of just like fan dissonance where it's like, like that guy fucked up. Why is he still in charge? Because in sports, you don't get second chances in life.

Many people are asking this in many areas of life right now. Why is anyone being allowed to fix the shit that they created is a constant question. But as far as those guys go, I'm kind of of two minds about it. Because one, if you are picking in the teens into the 20s, picking two guys in the 20s who are like a little redundant is not really a problem. You were taking two separate dice rules and hoping one of them works. Now, if they start getting in the way of it, each other having minutes, then it's a problem.

If they start getting in the way of each other having creation, then it's a problem. I would see the bigger problem on that front is you have two players who are not stars, who believe that they are stars. Who might those two players be? Dairon Sharp and Noah Clowny. How much oxygen are Michael Porter Jr. and Cam Thomas going to kind of suck out of the room, developmentally speaking? Both good players, who I like in some capacities, not in leading a team capacities.

Michael Porter Jr. had an interesting summer. Yeah. Probably the best summer in the NBA. He was on a tear. Talk about great podcasters. I mean, Porter Jr., I'm a little bit less so. Because even when he has the impulse to kind of ball hog, like, it goes bad quickly. You know, like, it becomes obvious that what he's doing isn't going to work, right?

But is it obvious to him? I think so. I think it will be under these circumstances because he's not going to have any oxygen on this team. Like, teams are just going to load up on him. And he's not the kind of player that is good being loaded up against because as we know, he's got limitations as a passer. It's Cam Thomas, on the other hand,

who's going to actually have the ball a lot. and is on a revenge tour to prove that he got lowballed on his contract offer. That's where I'm just like, okay, this is highly combustible. And if you're going to like ding the five first beyond just the obvious, this is funny that they took five players, like they all are of a similar type, which is they are playmakers with if he jump shots. And so those guys presumably are going to have the ball.

So I think Boz is right. There's only so much damage Porter can do. And if he does damage, as long as it's not like, in the public sphere. And he still cares. And he's still a floor spacer, right? Like, he still has to have an elite floor spacer. The ultimate respect of the team.

Yes. As we know, because he told us, he is, only Steph Curry is a better shooting than him in the NBA. And so you have the second best shooter in the NBA, allegedly, that's going to help your young guys. It's a real thing. Like, Michael Porter Jr. is one of the best shooters for his size that the league has ever seen.

Like at that size, at those dimensions, incredible shooter. Cam Thomas, I thought, made meaningful strides last season in terms of reading the floor, in terms of what he was doing off the dribble. Like, he's always been able to fill it up and get to his spots. I thought he took a meaningful step forward. It's just not so much of a step forward that clearly the Nets feel comfortable giving him a huge deal. It wouldn't be so, like, so much of a step forward that it would make me feel comfortable, like handing him the keys to our franchise.

But, Justin, you talked about, like, the way that those young guys kind of fill in around that and the skill sets of the rookies, that to me is, is very big. for our existential question. Which is, thank you, Rob, which current players will be on the roster the next time Brooklyn is a contender? So I think there's the easy answer and there's the kind of more naughty answer.

The easy answer to me is probably Drake Powell, who they just drafted. It's like the safest bet as like, this guy is just going to be an NBA role player kicking around rosters for a while. Will he be a meaningful part of the future contending nets? I don't know. The one non-playmaker type.

Exactly. Just kind of like you can slot him on the wing. You understand what he does well. He's going to hold his own defensively. Just kind of like easy to find room four in a lineup and on a roster. The more difficult ones to me are the playmakers. But for me, I think one of Yeager Diyomun or Ben Serraff are going to work. I don't know which one yet.

And for me personally, I like making time and space. And I think winning teams make time and space for these sorts of playmaking wings. Now, if Yegor Gehomen is more of like a wannabe point guard who just like doesn't have the juice to do it, that's a problem. If he can be a facilitating two, three, I think we're getting into an interesting conversation. Do you hear that pronunciation? Yeah, I don't know.

He's already. He's got the little accent of gut on there. Nolan Treor, you know, no votes for him. Yeah. Not yet for me. The 19 year old. We'll see. Traiori.

Yeah, I'm not seeing. I think Rob is right in terms of Drake Powell like sure maybe he'll just

be their seventh man but like this team is like two or three years from any like at least I'm taking the over on two to three years probably

yeah three years from now they might be as good as Detroit is that'd be great that'd be great yeah if you could feel

as good as Detroit does right now in three years as the Brooklyn Nets? It's the way that'll be the case I think that's a win. It might be, I would take the under in that if only because of their pick obligations, they do only have really this immediate runway

in order to stack young players and then they have to figure things out. They're not like the jazz who can keep rolling it over and over and over again. They really do have to figure it. But I would assume their answer probably comes in free agency and so I think you're right. I think the players that they need to develop

are guys that they could fill in around them because there was talked this off season about like, oh, what have they gotten to the Yannis Derby? I'm like, once they trade everything in order to get Janus, who's he playing with? It wouldn't even have been Michael Porter. It would not. I think for that reason, I also would not be shocked

if Dayron Sharp is the backup center for the next good Nets team. It is just like who can hang on. Who does the coaching staff or the front office have an attachment to because they drafted them or developed them or whatever? Who can be a role player on that team is kind of what a lot of these guys are shooting for

and maybe a high level role player, maybe a fringe all star someday, but those would be kind of extreme outcomes. also see Nick Claxton being the Miles Turner. Oh, yeah. Of the next good next team. We tried to trade him for 10 years. Yeah, and he just ends up sticking around and being on the next good team.

Yes. I think they love him as the shining example of we took this guy from A and now he's at B and never got to D or anything else down the alphabet. But like we love that we got him there. Do you guys like any of the free players that they basically acquired this offseason? We got Haywood High Smith, Terrence Mann, Kobe Buffett. Any buffkin buffs? I've always been a Terrence band guy in terms of like he plays hard. He's really versatile.

You know, on a real team, like there's always like a plug and play aspect. Like, all right, we wanted you to guard a bigger guard. You could do a little bit of ball handling duty. You can be one of our better transition players. I always like him as a Swiss Army knife kind of guy. and also just as like a level-headed human being in the locker room, I think is a dope thing for them. But yeah, hi-Smith, like, what's he going to do for this team?

I do like him. I do think also like taking on Terrence Mann's contract to get Drake Powell, basically. Like, that's good NBA business. I don't have any problem with anything that's happening there with where the nets are. I mean, it isn't Yonge Hansen, but we'll take it. We're all playing at different levels in the field.

otherwise like I mean I look I like Haywood Highsmith does he change anything for the brooklyn next I mean I don't think he's like a bad player but but he is a type of player they don't have a lot of they have expiring to so I imagine he will be moving on elsewhere I think he's good for that reason I actually kind of like Kobe Buffkin what are your hopes and dreams for Kobe Buffkin well for one I want him to play I would like that too seasons 27 games so do we even know who he's 20 he just turned 22 years old yeah He's back with Dwan Howard. He's former coach from Michigan.

There you go. I just think he's a free recent lottery pick or right below that. Just let him play through his mistakes. This is where I get a little nervous sometimes because it's like, I want the young guys to get their chances. And sometimes just like the wrong place, the wrong rotation, whatever. I also do kind of trust Quinn Snyder's basketball sensibilities, at least in terms of who should be playing.

And if he's not good enough for a Hawks team that could have used the stuff that he does theoretically well. What does that say about Kobe Buffkin? I honestly don't know. Any other guys or things? What else we got with the Brooklyn Nets? I mean, they turned over basically their entire guard rotation, especially if you want to tilt it back a little bit,

you know, like really giving up all of that responsibility, all of that playmaking to what's going to be a bunch of very young, very inexperienced players for a team that already like worked so hard to play over its head and win 26 games, it's going to be bad. This is going to be a very bad team. they're going to stink. The only, like, caveat, I guess, to that would just be that they managed to do well at the start of last season, so much so, that they really had to jettison players because Jory Fernandez would just very good. Joey's a good-ass coach.

He's a good-ass coach. Making chicken salad. And I have no idea if it's going to work in the NBA, but I am eager to see the Danny Wolf era of Brooklyn Nets basketball. Let him cook. Let him do his thing. Look, like, Camp Thomas and Michael Porter Jr. are not out here, like, pass in every time they touch the ball. Like we need some facilitators out there. We need some spacers. I hope Danny Wolf can play meaningful rotation minutes.

And we'll have to see kind of where he fits into the rotation exactly. All right. Next team on the docket, number one in my heart. It's the Washington Wizards, your new favorite league pass team. Now we're talking. I am titillated. Was does not seem titillated. This team could be.

You catch me at 4 p.m. Pacific. It's crazy. On November on a Wednesday, I am watching Washington Windsor's back. basketball. Yes. And what are you watching for exactly? Seeing some young guys do some dumbass shit. Okay.

Got you. Sometimes that's what life is all about. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, look, I think Sarr showed some signs last year, like, that he could make his athleticism work for him at the position. That would be, like, what his, you know, sort of special gift is. He, that damn game I was in Denver, he was, he looked for.

phenomenal against the nuggets that one night where he's like he's flashing everything. Excuse me. Maybe the jumper will come together. I think that's going to be kind of the side. In fact, if this guy's making corner threes at a normal, respectable clip and he's doing and he's bringing what he brings defensively in terms of athleticism and pain protection and switchability, then he's a guy. But we're a long way from kickouts to that guy at 3 being something you want to see as a fan or a coach.

Completely. But in the meantime, they're going to play fast. He's going to let him fly. They're going to play fast as hell. He's going to let him fly. All of these guards and wings are going to be able to make decisions and make mistakes. They got rid of, I think, crucially, the two guys on their roster who are kind of like sticks in the mud as far as, like, the overall operation. And so, like, I'm kind of with you, Justin.

I would watch 82 Wizards games. Like I would just dial it up. In the same way that you watch Blue Bloods. Like, got you. Some of us just need a comfort watch. Got you. Yeah.

In the background. Yeah. 82 Wizards games. I would watch 82 Wizards games. So here's the selling point for the Washington Wizards. Yeah. If you're a doubter like perhaps Waz's, and this brings us to our existential question,

are the Wizards the best rebuilding team to be a fan of? There are 10 first round players on this team still, still on their rookie contract. Let's go. That is unbelievable. If you're someone who just wants to explore the space of young talent, this is the team for you. Yeah, I mean, that young talent is Bub Carrington, though.

I like Bob Carrington. I'm not seeing he's a bad player, but like you really, like, get up out of bed in the morning because you get to watch Bub Carrington, who? It's not about Bub Carrington specifically. It's like there's Bub, and there's AJ Johnson who looked better for the Wizards. than he ever had a chance to with the bucks.

It's, you know, Trey Johnson, who will see kind of how he fits into all this, where he plays, how much, but very interesting young shooter and player. I'm still a Keishon-George guy. I have no idea what to expect from Will Riley. Ballah Kulabali, Cam Whitmore, more. Like, there are so many young guys to the point that I'm excited for Kim Whitmore to play, but also how much is he going to play? I don't know.

Probably not. Probably not. But this is the one team where too many guys, I think, works in their benefit. Because if one of those guys isn't hitting, they're just cycling. through guys. They also have the benefit, like these other really low-ranked rebuilding teams are all in their ways, exercises and frustration. It's, we just tried this thing and it failed, and now we have to reboot again. It's we were waiting for the Lowry-Markin and deal after losing in the lottery. It's like, who is really peddling hope right now? And I think the

Wizards are one of these teams that actually has a lot to hope for. Like, they're going to have their own pick because if it's protections, they're going to be relying on a lot of young players. They're going to play this really energizing style. I think they're going to come out of this year feeling good about where they are. I can't tell you exactly which young guys are going to be the reason for that, but they have enough of them that I think some of them are just going to hit. Yeah. I think the one thing to counter that would be how much structure are these young guys willing to be

beholden to. I think Cam Whitmore is the prime example of someone who's had a reasonable almonic success in this league. Is he basically going to be like, no, this is my showcase and I'm going to blow this shit up? I do think Blalcula Bali, who is set for surgery on his thumb, is going to miss the start of the season, opens the doorway for Cam Whitmer, not only to do. start to be a featured guy. And as we've seen for the Wizards and any of these

rebuilding teams, you could stack them with as many veterans as you want. Those guys are going to be playing sometimes. And when they do play, they might not even play into the second half. As we saw with the Wizards specifically, with the Marcus Smart types and some other ones. That's the new way of tanking where it's like you look at the box score and it seems like that guy

played, but did he actually? Yeah. And so I think C.J. McCollum, good vet. Yeah. Chris Middleton, very good vet to have there. It seemed like he played that role well for them last season. How long are they going to be around and what happens after that? Yeah, and I think the only thing about the wizards, I don't want to say they're cautionary,

but it's like, to me, they're the best example of why it's, to me, it feels like foolhardy for people to get overly excited about the picks. Sure. Right? Because they do have a bunch of young guys on their team, but nobody thinks they've identified a franchise cornerstone as of yet, and they've picked high in the draft. I get it.

Like, they finally moved away from the old, you know, Ernie Grunfeld model of perpetual mediocrity. But even still, even when you do that, you still have to have some patience because I don't know that they've identified yet. You know, they might still be in moving in the direction of trying to get that guy still via the draft. I don't think we have any reason to think that the guy is necessarily here yet, unless Trey is that guy. Like he's maybe a potential like eye popping score that they've been missing. Like Bub can fill it up. He certainly has his strengths as a creator in that way. But I don't think he's quite at that level.

Maybe trade will be. Maybe he won't. But I think the combination of having a lot of guys who could be interesting and something, plus those two veterans you talked about JV who are, I think are just going to be in trade discussions all year in addition to everything else. Part of the reason this is exciting is because of all those young guys and the future pick. And also the fact that they're positioned to basically turn over every expensive piece of their roster. next year. This is a team that's positioned up like $100 million in cap space.

So there's a lot to work with here and a lot to be excited about and a lot of conversations for guys like us to have about who's going to trade for Chris Middleton, who's going to trade for C.J. McCollum. Yeah, another team like the Jazz who's waiting for a star in order to build things around, but I do like some of the pieces they've assembled perhaps to support that player when he gets there. I think SAR is a prime example of that. Not quite of a star or a Star Star, but seems like a high level role player type who will fit around

virtually everything. I think Trey's another one of those guys. I'm curious, is he going to be Ray Allen at the end of his career, or Ray Allen at the beginning of his career? Like, how much actual dribble juice does he have in order to score for himself? Or is he going to be the type of guy you want running off a screens, more catch and shoot sort of player? Let me tell you. Scouts seem to heavily disagree

on that. Yes. I think that is the central dividing point with him among the people who love Trey and the people who are a little skeptical. is like how much of an on the dribble like off the dribble players he actually going to be. Yes, he didn't seem to love being off the ball in college at several points at Texas. Hook him though. Absolutely. Who do you think starts for this team?

You know what? I don't know. Really? I think it's C.G. McCollum. Okay. Chris Middleton, Sarr. And I assume Whitmore will start as a nominal four with Ballol out. But what about when Ballal's back?

Probably Ballal. Unless Whitmore just goes gangbusters. I think actually the debate is at the two. start Chris Middleton and C.J. McCollum? I think they will start. Jesus. But will they finish? And with Chris, the question is always like, when is he healthy? Will he even play? Will he play?

Will he be on a load management plan? I'm saying defensively, that's ugly. I mean, they're not going to be good on defense. Yeah. But like, don't you want to try to be good at defense? Well, but sometimes, honestly, a C.J. McCollum veteran defender, while not good and flawed,

is still sometimes a little bit more of it. Better than a young guy. Well, you know, like, you were in the right. place and you can show these other guys how to be in the right place kind of way. He's a huge target. He is a big target. He was a target at 23. You know what?

Maybe that'll save the younger defenders. 26 he was a target. He was a target. But Carrington isn't getting targeted if C.J. McCollum is getting targeted. You know what I'm saying? I think the question is do you start Bob or Trey next to C.J.? That's a tough call. Yeah.

Any inklings? I would think Trey would start just based off the investment. Right. The idea of taking a guy number six overall and then not even starting him on a rebuilding team, unless you're just really sold on the player that Bub Carrington could be, I don't necessarily see that. I also think from a backup perspective,

like Bob Carrington is a little more comfortable on the ball, at least from what I've seen so far at an NBA level. And so the idea of bringing them off the bench in more of a combo capacity makes sense to me. Because otherwise, who is your backup point guard? It might be like Malachi Brainum or somebody like that. We'll see. I pour one out for goggles, Jordan Poole era on the Wizards.

Yeah, I'm okay. with that. We'll catch up with them later in this episode, it turns out. But first and foremost, we have the Charlotte Hornets at number 27, a team that as we're recording this, a week of when this pot is coming out, doesn't really have a center still, unless TD and Salon is just like going to transition to just being big. I mean, Musa Diabate is standing right there. He's right there. He definitely plays hard. I'll say that. My main concern with this is, I just have, I just feel it in my bones that may Plumley is going to be the day one starter

and I already hate it. That's... I hope that's wrong. I hope he's just there for veteran influence because... That is so dark. I think we have a lot of empirical proof that Mason Plumley is not an NBA player anymore.

And he's not. He is going to at least play. You could always go home, you know? Maybe it will unearth the dog in him. But they do have a ton of guards after this offseason, bringing in Colin Sexton for virtually nothing. They got Pat Conantin on this roster

via a dump for a guy Vasily Mucci We miss you, my brother. But they also still have lamella ball on this team, despite the fact that he has been in trade rumors relentlessly for what, two, three years at this point? And so I think we should start with the existential question is whether or not the Yoko

can finally make a decision with Lamello Ball because I have to say I'm getting a little tired because this guy, yes, he hasn't played recently, and yes, he is a bit of a goofball. But he did make an all-star team and he was rookie of the year, like at a certain point,

you can't just keep turning over teams when you already have, like the jazz are turning over a team that didn't have much of anything, right? Whereas this team has Lamello Ball and Brandon Miller who can make them the All-Star team this year, by the way,

and now they're talking about, oh, we just need more talent here. We just can't deal with these guys. We need to get this guy out of here. Just like, make it work. Well, who was it that they let go or traded away that you were like, man, the Hornets really blew it.

Mark Williams. Letting that guy out the door. It's not so much that it would be trying to trade lamello at this point as opposed to putting your foot in the ground and being like, let's just like see what we have here. Yes. So I hear you, but I think the Luca Donchage trade and his subsequent offseason is very instructive.

In terms of, I don't think La Mello Ball can become a serious professional in Charlotte. It would have to be somewhere else where he's been less exalted and just been treated. like the prince that was promised since the day he walked in the door. I just don't think it's going to happen in Charlotte. Just like, Luca ain't turning skinny this offseason if he's still in Dallas.

Because the Tex-Mex or what? That and a variety of other things. But like, I just don't think that's going to happen. Like, anybody who's been around Luca knows, like, sort of what is off-season regiment has been, his whole. thing has just been like, look, I show up and put up all NBA first team type

of numbers. Don't talk to me about what I could be doing better. Would have never happened in Dallas. And this is a team that was like getting close to like greatness. They were going to NBA finals and conference championships and he

wouldn't have got it in his head that like he needed to take it more serious to get over the hump. What's a guy who's done nothing but perpetual losing and been rewarded for, at every single turn, why is he going to do this in Charlotte? Can we get lamello on the cover of men's health in Charlotte?

On what ground? Just gets swall? I'll take him into the gym. Okay. We'll do a couple supersets. Look, I'm here for it. I'm here for anything that can professionalize the lamello ball experience. Because Lord knows and Pod knows, one of my red flags,

I am a lamella ball believer. Like, I see the vision. I believe in him as a player. I don't believe in the work habits. I don't believe in who he is as a professional. Absolutely. I think the reality chaguas is one the losing you described, like consistently losing, trying to do it your way.

Yeah, there are some guys who need a change of scenery. Some guys take a look at the wind totals and are just like, I can't do that again. Something needs to change and maybe it's the talent, but maybe it's also me. And I think with him specifically, we're now running on like three straight years of Lamella Ball only played X number of games. So there is clearly a health component that is not just,

bad luck. There is a there is a like ankle stability. Like you need to take the physical part of your job and stability and weight training and muscle building a little more seriously among other things. I'm here, man. Let's get those Steph Curry trap bar deadlaves going. So, so this is the year. I didn't say that. The mellow ball is going to look around and be like, wait a second, Colin Sexton's here.

I got to clean up my shot selection. I think that is the question. He just got con can't nipple. I got to be better with the crazy passes. I can get my shit together. Khan's going to be on me today. Why would it happen this season is what I'm asking? You know, because like things do change for players a little bit later in their career.

You know, I think about a guy like Paul Pierce who, when it was the him and Antoine early Celtics, they were going to the playoffs, all of that. He had tasted that. Then it fell off of a cliff. And he was beginning to develop. I'm not going to. a lamello ball-ish kind of reputation like, yo, this guy's

a loser. This guy doesn't have the winning habits. This guy doesn't take it seriously enough. This guy's going out. This guy's blah, blah, blah, blah. Then KG gets in there and it's like, yo, like I can be way more serious. He also got stabbed.

Well, that's what I'm saying. You know what I mean? Like, these clarifying incidents happen. You know, but this is, he's not in year five of his career when it happens. It's way older when it happens and like these are crazy interventions KG and Ray Allen and

totally all of a sudden you're just like part of a brand new kind of team like this is not a brand new time yeah brand new kind of team yet more just getting paid ungodly sums of money to do clown stuff that's what we say about Rob when

because I think we got to watch out for him when he's going out into the club it's true in Los Angeles so I think if you were to be stabbed you would turn things around for this I would change a lot if I got stabbed. Yeah, I think so. You threw out the Colin Sexton thing as like kind of a dig. No, it's not a dig in Collin sexes.

I love Colin Sexton. But the circumstance. He's not resolving everything that ails them. I will say this. Colin Sexton plays hard as hell all the time. He does. Lamello ball does not. And I think there is a quality like that with guys like that who are brought in who can help.

But overall, Justin, I think the question of like when do we trade lamello? Do we trade lamello? How do we feel about him? is as much of a lamello question as it is a Brandon Miller question. Like those two guys have just not had an opportunity to play together all that much. And so it's hard for you to evaluate

what they have when over two years they played 828 minutes together. For contrast, Justin's Bulls, Josh Giddy and Kobe White played 1,300 minutes together last season. Not well. I mean, they were fine. I would not say so.

Kind of fun. Yeah, kind of fun. And I'm ready for the Hornets to be kind of fun again. think Lamello, look, he does things that no one else can do, that no one else will try. He will make plays late in some, like if the Hornets can make it to crunch time, will make plays in pressure situations that are incredible.

Is he ever going to be the half court playmaker they need him to be in creator? I don't know consistently enough. Like he's still trying to prove that. Can they be healthy enough? Can they be talented enough? What does this roster look like when it's actually competing for something? It feels like they still have a long way to go. Yeah.

And that's kind of what I'm saying here is that when you have, someone like Brandon Miller as a potential cornerstone, a guy who would have won rookie of the year in any non-Wemby year, practically, shot out of a cannon. Obviously, needs to add strength. The wrist surgery is a concern going into this season, but if he is fully healthy, like,

that's a guy. And at the very least, you pair those two guys together, there's enough talent on the wings with Canipal and Bridges, whatever you get from him. Like, there's a fun team to build off of, as opposed to just like trading lamello and just starting from scratch. I just don't have much time for a team with actual, all

star level talent being like, well, we got to turn over the page. I mean, and I think, honestly, the argument against is like, who are you trading this guy to? And for what? Like, what would be the point of just dumping them? Because we know, like, in terms of value, it's pretty low right now. It's low right now. So what would be the point of just being like, we're dumping this guy? Like, you would have to think that he's just like this huge cancer to the team, which I don't think anybody is saying.

I think people just don't think he's been leader guy. He's a loof. He's a good ball. He is kind of like off on his own planet. Yes. He's wearing the AirPods while he's playing. He is exactly that guy. There's no question about it.

And like look, this kind of experiment with the new roster where they have brought in all of these smaller guards for reasons that are not, I admit, it'd be like immediately clear to me. There's just like a lot of bucket getting small guards who I assume they are targeting specifically. Like there's enough of a trend here with Colin Sexton, with bring back tray man. with even drafting Cion James with Nick Smith Jr. still on the roster. It's like Lamello is such a playmaker first. Have they decided we need someone who will hunt a shot next to him on more or less a full-time basis?

And if that's a direction they're leaning into, there's defensive trade-offs for that, there's like flow trade-offs to that. I don't know what to make of it yet, but it does seem like that's the way they're leaning. I do think drafting con perhaps signal that they were looking for something a little bit more stable and to perhaps to use them in a variety of ways

for exactly what you're mentioning, because he is someone with some actual on-ball juice who could do a little bit of that, but he doesn't need to. He, to me, was a stabilizing pick as opposed to some of the high-upside picks. Like, you don't go for an Ace Bailey, you go for someone where you know who he's going to be as a supplemental player next to these guys. Well, they've already done to John Salon. Like, they've already kind of tried that, and we'll see...

I watched him in Summer League for whatever reason. Yeah. They did play a lot of Summer League games, so it was that. He looks like a guy who was in football linebacker drills and just got lost one day, ended up on a basketball court, and no one said anything. He has no idea what he's doing. He's trying to cut off the ball. He looks like he's just like wandered off into the tunnel and just doesn't know where he is. They have a lot of those guys. And I will say, you know, I don't think Pat Connerton is like a

meaningful part of this team. He hasn't been a meaningful part of the Bucks for a minute. But he was that guy one time. He's a grinder. Like I, okay, this is what I have written down. True or false, Pat Conerton is the Bruce Brown of Josh Green. Does that make any sense to you at all? By that I mean, Bruce Brown is a guy who was like, oh, this is a very interesting in theory player, and he hit the right situation, and it worked.

It just immediately worked in Denver. It really clicked for him. Pat Conantin had his moment in Milwaukee during the championship run where it's like, this guy's athleticism is exactly what this team needs right now, and he's sitting just enough of his threes, and Lord knows Josh Green is not doing all that stuff. But somehow Conantin is the Bruce Brown, as opposed to the other way around.

Because he did it. He made it work the one time and won a title. Playing exactly that sort of high variability athletic style. Josh Green is the like, he's the Pat Conninton. He wishes he was championship

run Pat Connoton. But he's like, I'm trying to think, I don't want to be disrespectful. But like, I don't know. I got to come back. Well, you're right.

There are a lot of guards here. I have to be disrespectful. assume part of it is because they want to push the campaign Pat Connotton Josh Green is the campaign Yes yes that is true Pat Connettyss See we've just flipped the script but we're talking about the same thing

There you go I'm so far down the rabbit hole I don't even know who's who Am I Justin or you was Who's to say I worry at times if some of the goofiness Has only been leaned into more by the style of play They adopted under Charles Lee By Jack in the three point math

I'm starting to wonder whether or not that sort of style where we're really going to let it fly is best suited for an established group of veterans who know how to use it, use the power of it, but not overindulging it, whereas the Hornace did it last year and it felt like a little bit too silly. Like Brandon Miller took 113s a game last year. Yeah. Metal ball also jacking it up. It feels a bit too much too soon.

Yeah, I think ideally you would be. running that system with a bunch of guys who know what a good shot is. And that just didn't seem like that was the case for Charlotte last year. Yep. I mean, the counterpoint to that would be if you have a draft, like a dramatically different idea of what makes a good shot, then maybe it's best to get guys early in their careers before they have all that muscle memory, before they have that voice in the back of their head that's saying, this pull up three in transition is not the shot I should be taking.

Like, I can understand the logic of wanting to take Brandon Miller and get him used to taking a ton of threes. I'm not 100% sure he's that kind of shooter. And we're kind of waiting to see if the jumper really falls into place that way. And I say that as someone who, like, I think Grant Miller is an incredible prospect. Yeah. I think he could be a really high level player. I think he could be a multi-time all-star, very excited about where his career goes. But I do want to see a little more than just that part of his game.

And I think part of the risk you run with his offense is streamlining him a little too much in that way. Right. The two draft picks for at least the first rounders they got in, presumably brought in in in order to further that. Caniple a shooter, Liam McNeely, late of Yukon, a shooter,

although hasn't shot it well, either at Yukon or in pre-draft workouts, allegedly, reportedly. Bagging on a Yukon lump. That's how you know it's bad. I mean, I like him. I just wish him more success

than he's had this far. I would also just like to say on the, just in case you don't think it can get any worst watch, worse watch for the Charlotte Hornets, I think this team is going to get fucking annihilated on the defensive glass.

They have no one who, can rebound. Like, I do like Musa Diabate. He's all over the place. He's really good offensive rebounder. But the chain reaction

of losing Nick Richards, Mark Williams, even Yusuf Nurkich, who came in and rebounded for them, like they just have nobody who's going to rebound at all. And they are so weird and wingy and athletic,

but with guys who don't actually hit the glass that hard, I think their defense is going to be bad. This guy has no faith in Cockburner. Honestly, I think he's pretty good. Cock Brenner. Excuse me.

Looks good in Summer Lake. Cockbrenner is among their most appealing options. but he's lean and a shooter. He is. So who will rebound? You? I have as good a shot as anyone on this team.

Are you a good rebounder? Yeah. Yeah? What's your style? I'm back to, I'm posting. I'm power posting down there. Back to the basket. Hitting some fadeaways, you know?

But you got to hit him with the no-look passes every now and again. I mean, look, I am but a pickup big man. Who would I be if I wasn't throwing irresponsible passes? A little budget young? That sounds great. Yeah. See. All right. Last team on the list for this episode, number 26, New Orleans Pelicans, who are an absolute catastrophe of an organization. I considered putting them second to last on this list.

And their only saving grace was the fact that they don't have their pick next year. And thus, they have more motivation to kick up some late season wins that mean nothing in order to push up farther on the list. Yeah, I still think there's a lot of talent on the team, which is something we say, literally every freaking preseason. You had them I. Yeah, I did. Get him 22nd. I'm just like, look, like, if all of their guys play,

well, let me stop you there. They're better than the 26 ranked team in the league. Yep. And that's why I had them 22nd. There's a lot of talent, yes. I was doubling down on the Derrick Queen trade defense by putting them at 20 second. Listen. Well, he's not going to play, so he won't cause any problem.

It's not about Derek Queen. It's just like, I just think the guys on the team, Trey and Zion and the like, these guys are really good NBA players. And again, if they're on the floor, they're better than the Chicago Bulls. You know what I mean? How are you going to take that, Justin? Are they way better? Probably not.

But I think they're better than a lot of the teams that we ranked ahead of them. It's just New Orleans, like the injury history. Listen, the foundation of the team, as you're mentioning, is pretty solid with Zion, if he plays, Trey Murphy, who also was injured often, and Herm Jones, who basically didn't play last year. Also injured a lot as well. But that three as a core, I think a lot of teams would love to stay. Problem is they have taken what was there and mapped on a completely different timeline. Yes.

And also some veterans who I don't particularly love. So you have the former team with those three guys. You have the new draft picks and fears and queen. And then you have like some old guys, honestly, a lot of former warriors in Kavana, Lune and Jordan Poole. It all doesn't make sense to me on top of the fact that this organization is regularly cursed and nobody actually plays. And so all those things combined, this is a fucking train wreck. Sounds great to me. Sounds like everything's going according to plan.

I don't know what the plan is, but it must be clicking. They're already talking in the media day leadups like, oh, Zion has to be a leader and all this other stuff. And like we're counting on him to do X, Y, and Z is just like, I've heard this before. And so I've gotten to the point. If we want to get to our existential question. Yeah. I am starting to feel sympathetic for Zion that he has been led astray to, in part, by an organization that doesn't know what he's doing. I think he is his own mess, injuries on top of just also goofiness and not really taking a shit seriously.

Yeah. But also, where's the example for him? Yeah, I think the train wreck of the surrounding management structure around Zion's career combined with being with a shit franchise has gotten us to this point. I think Zion could have been a train wreck in his personal and the way that he's managing his career. Yeah. But, you know, if he somehow ends up in Miami, I think it's a different story.

Totally. An outcome for his career. But you combine just organizational turmoil and just ranking competence with what he had going on personally. It's tough. Perfect storm. Yeah. He has mismanaged his course.

career. They have mismanaged his career. Yes. There's no coming out of that looking clean and everything clicking in place. Like it just hasn't worked. It hasn't worked in any respect to this point. How that changes, I don't know. Like, I don't, again, we're talking about with La Mello. Like, what is the, what does the come to Jesus moment that's going to change something here? Put the

bignets down. I don't know what it is. And I, and here's the thing, even if he was the best version of himself, I'm not entirely sure how far that gets the Pelicans in a loaded Western conference. Like, maybe it gets them into the Memphis, Dallas, like fighting for the play-in kind of group, the best-case version of the Pelicans?

That would be incredible. Yeah. I don't have that kind of aspiration for them. Right. How does he play with fears without sacrificing defense? How does he play with Kvon Looney without sacrificing shooting? It's just like, I don't know how the parts all fit together.

And frankly, I don't know if the people making the decisions that put enough thought into that. Perhaps they're thinking farther down the road than the immediate. But when you have a talent like Zion, And like you probably should be thinking about the here and now. Yeah, I think so too. But here's the problem with the here and now. You talked about the three core guys that are very talented.

Are all three of those guys going to start? Like are Herb Jones and Tray Murphy's locked in? Tray Murphy is too good, too unimpeachable, too useful to bring off the bench. Are we positive Herb Jones is going to start? And I think he should, but you just traded for Jordan Poole and you just drafted Jeremiah Fierce. Are both of those, is one of those guys going to come off the bench? or do you intend to play them together? I don't think you could bench those guys.

I mean, they were trying to shove Herb Jones as a nominal center into their starting lineup last year in big old air quotes here. He might still be their best center. He could be. So I think the question is, do you start Zion at center? Make some room for some of more of the guards wings. No, that's... You just drafted Derek Queen, who I assume we'll play some five.

He's hurt to start the season. To start the season, so he's going to come in a little later. Just throw your season in the trash if you're starting Zion at center. That's the other thing. I don't think Queen and Zion can play together. Both big creators who can't really shoot well. Yeah. I think they're going to, it'll be a little bit more of like Derek Queen playing the five with Trey Murphy at the four. That kind of thing could potentially work. Eve Misi is still in the mix here. I think worthy of rotation and like an investment like should

play should probably start to start the season, I would think. Again, I just don't know how these guys like actually make each other better, how their skill sets complement each other. Why would you introduce Jordan Poole to what was already like a fundamentally broken mix. And we haven't even talked about Dejante Murray, who's just going to be out for the foreseeable future, may or may not play next season. I have no idea. Just there's so much that feels like a headache with this team. To your question, though, I always lean veterans over everything. Anything that makes sense, whatever is the best actual lineup. Yeah. So I wouldn't be surprised if Kavanaugh and Jordan Poole start. Wow. Yeah. Next to those three guys. Yeah. I love Looney,

but no. That should that should not. I'm not saying it won't, but I'm saying it should not happen. Jordan Poole running the point. Zion is going to handle the ball a lot as long as they're leaning into point Zion again, which they change their mind about every year. One minute he's the center, one minute he's a point guard, and he's coming off the ball.

It's just like it's all over the place, but I have to assume it would be Zion running the show and having shooting around. We should also say, like, one of the thing that is preventing them from going counter to your veteran model that you're talking about is they do not have control of their own pick next year.

So they do not even have... Why is that? I don't even think we need to say it at this point. But they made all this noise to get Derek Queen. Even if he were healthy and playing great basketball, and they wanted to start him and lean into the Derek Queen, Jeremiah Fears' version of this team as much as humanly possible next season, they're kind of discouraged from doing so

because it probably will not result in a ton of wins. And this is a team that basically has no choice but to try to win some games. So maybe they will have more wins than some of the other teams at the bottom of these rankings for exactly that reason. but I don't think those wins really will amount to much, and I certainly don't think it's going to actually get them in the playoff race. It's embarrassing. It's not good.

They're not a playoff team. It's so bad. And I have to say, I still believe that if New Orleans ever built the product, I think the fans would come. But we're getting to the point now where, like, they've been waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting. Yeah. I just don't know when it's ever going to come,

and I think it brings up bigger existential questions beyond or even existential question about the roster, about the viability of basketball in this sound, or at the very least, under this ownership group, I think there should be... It's the ownership group, though. As Adam Silver does a lot of things this offseason in his board of governor's meetings,

perhaps he could give a little nudge out the door for our... Yeah, just sell the team to somebody who actually wants to do this and do it right. Yeah. Can I say one thing I am excited about with the New Orleans Pelicans? Sadiq Bay missed all last season with an ACL injury, let's get him back out there. Sadiq Bay.

I like Sadiq Bay. Do you not like Sadiq Bay? Everybody likes Sadiq Bay. He's never rewarded us with it, though. Not all the people you believe in come up for you when you really need them to us. He has never been there for us. We've been loving Sadiq Bay for five years now. And I still do.

And I will like to see him back on a basketball court being a part of this rotation. Maybe so, but I'm in it. I agree. I like him as a flyer. Sudec Bay, don't get you flowers on Valentine's Day. He forgets every single anniversary. It does. He stinks.

Doesn't call your mom on Mother's Day? It's tough. I was like, God damn. He's 26 years old. That's crazy. We love you, Sadiq Bay. We wish the best for you. We do.

All right. That's it for part one of our six-part pre-season power rankings. We'll be back next time with part two. What is that? Teams 26 to 21? 25. 25 to 21. That's how math works. Thank you to Victoria Valencia.

Thank you to John Richter. Thank you to Isaiah Blakely and Ben Cruz. A lot of thanks there. We'll catch you next time.