The Ringer NBA Show - Preseason Power Rankings, Part 5 | Group Chat

Episode Date: October 13, 2025

Justin, Rob, and Wos are back for Part 5 of their preseason power rankings. But first, Justin and Wos address LeBron James’s injury and how it will impact the Lakers. The guys then reveal the teams they ranked 10 through 6. Intro: (0:00:00)Team no. 10: (16:03)Team no. 9: (29:56)Team no. 8: (46:25)Team no. 7: (58:35)Team no. 6: (1:15:33) Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny LambreProducers: Ben Cruz, Isaiah Blakely, and Victoria Valencia Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome to group chat. I am Justin Verrier and joining me for this special addendum edition of group chat. It's Big Was. What's up, Boz? I'm good, man. Yes, it's an addendum. I'm out here in the deep south. The antebellum south, some would say.

Out in South Carolina here for the union of the future Mr. and Mrs. Kiki and Chris Jones. So shouts to the future. and current happy couple. But yeah, man, we had some NBA breaking news, so we had to hop on and address the situation, Justin. That's right. Was is in the deep south. I'm in the war zone in Portland,

just struggling to get through to the microbreweries of the world because there's just so much chaos going on here. No, there's absolutely nothing going on in Portland, despite what you may have heard. But there is something going on with the Lakers, a team that we talk about in this up. coming edition of the preseason power rankings. This is part five is what you're going to hear.

We recorded those in advance at the end of September. And funnily enough, we didn't talk much about LeBron, which is pretty telling about where the Lakers are at this point. They're kind of leaning into being a Luca Donchish team at this point. But we also didn't have the news that we got this week that LeBron is actually going to be out to start a season pretty much for the first time in his entire career. he's expected to be reevaluated in three to four weeks with sciatica on his right side, which means that he won't be reevaluated perhaps until the start of November,

maybe late October. And so from there, he might miss some more times. We might be talking about December, mid-November until we get LeBron basketball, which is odd to say. But, my first thought about this whole thing is that sciatica just seems like an old guy issue. And it really just hammered home how old and like, deep into LeBron's career we actually are. Bro, this is how we know he's in his Robert Parrish on the Bulls era of his career.

Because I'm like, what's like an old foggy ailment that he could have got that would have been like worse than sciatica? I'm like glaucoma. Like, what are the ailments beyond this? That would have been like, wow, this cat is old. At the same time, I think because he's so then. to his career. You know, I think we kind of baked in the idea

that LeBron would miss games this year. It's just going to be the reality of LeBron's seasons going forward, limited that they may be, that he's going to miss a decent amount of games no matter what the situation is. And I don't think, like, I think it should be expected and is baked in. And that's why it's like so important and imperative

that they did trade for Luke. Kodanchich. They did extend him and he's now, quote, unquote, in the best shape of his life. That's what you need that for. Right. Yeah, sciatica is a weird one because I don't think you could just have some sort of procedure or, you know, work it out in a certain way and all of a sudden you're back in. It's really just a maintenance sort of thing. I honestly hear about it more often because I watch a lot of these chiropractor videos online where they do like the cracks and whatnot, which is satisfying in a weird and almost concerning way. But, I think they really just have to take their time, allow him to rest it out, and then go from there.

And so you're right. Maybe this is the type of thing that lingers not only past this three to four weeks kind of timeline, but perhaps into the season. The other part of this, though, that we should talk about, which we should always talk about with LeBron, is what if this isn't actually what they say it is? We had the whole thing in the summer, didn't seem like he was happy that they were leaning more into Luca Donchitz. And lo and behold, after nothing happens, after he stays on the Lakers, he's not there to start the season. Is this like a quiet quitting, silent protest kind of situation? Look, I don't have any indication that that's what this is.

All the reporting, everything that I've heard from anybody that I've talked to, this seems to be pretty legitimate. But at the same time, I wouldn't be surprised if the Lakers are just being extra cautious because of the age and because, again, they have another horse, a younger horse to lean on

and sort of carry them through this early stretch. And so, you know, I wouldn't be surprised if it was just more so that they were being super cautious with the guy and not that LeBron is kind of,

because, like, you remember the training camp situation, like the way they described his load management situation for this year, was like it was like going to be an unprecedented level of load management. So maybe that does tie into this.

But until we get some other indications to the contrary, I'm willing to believe that this is like completely legitimate and that the guy just needs to give his body a little bit more time before he fully ramps into regular season mode. Yeah, on the one hand, he's old. And so these are the type of things that pop up when you're old. know this probably better than anybody else. Like when you get toward 40, like things just start aching. You can't really do anything about it. You just have to manage it going forward.

On the other hand, you know, satica is the type of thing where it's like, how can you tell someone that they are capable of playing through this sort of thing? It's a pain management issue. And so if he says all of a sudden, like he just didn't get enough sleep the night before because he went out partying before he went for a game. Like, oh, my satakas actually. You literally can't saying anything and that's compounded by the fact that JJ Reddick is out here saying to the press like LeBron is on his own timeline, which could be pointed, it sounded pointed, but JJ also has a way of saying things in a way that sound more nefarious than they probably actually are. Yeah, and also I feel like JJ of all people would be on board with LeBron and how he's managing

things. I think there's a pretty decent, healthy respect between those two. And if LeBron, it's a much as he has a problem with the Lakers and what's been expressed through the media, it's with management, who by the way, ain't even really management no more. Like, Jeannie Buss doesn't own the team anymore. Rob Polinka, he's on borrowed time. Like, who are you really mad at this point? Can't be the new ownership that barely knows you. So he's just got to just take it one step at a time, man.

Yeah. So we had the Lakers seventh in the powerings to spoil just a little bit. of the show that you're going to hear going forward on this one, would you look at them any differently knowing that LeBron could miss somewhere around a month of the season? I don't.

I don't. And the main reason is because I base my power rankings on what do I think these guys can do in the postseason. And so I think, and what I mean by that is, if there were a playoff game in two days, LeBron and his sciatica would be out there. You know?

And so I haven't really changed how, I feel about the Lakers. I think if Luca's on his revenge tour started with the revenge body, I think he's pretty, he was coming into the season ready to shoulder a certain level of burden. And that's just going to be accelerated by LeBron missing these games. And if anybody's able to do this sort of one-man wrecking crew kind of thing, it's Luca. He's demonstrated that in his previous stop in Dallas. Like, two, like, you know, top four, top three MVP type of finishes with rosters that were less talented to this one, even without LeBron.

So I'm not too worried about in terms of the Lakers in their pecking order. Again, I priced in and baked in LeBron having nagging, you know, annoying injuries because of the age. And again, knowing that Luca is so highly motivated in a way he's literally never been in his entire pro career. this kind of feeds into more of that to me. Yeah, I mean, LeBron probably at this stage matters more to their ceiling and what they're going to do in the playoffs than what they're going to do in the regular season for all the reasons that you mentioned. I think we expected them to be a little bit more week to week during the regular season

because of all the different management that needs to go on with his team. And also the fact that they have to cobble together a defense around a lot of offensive juice in that back court with Reeves LeBron and Lukadjic. You know, it's to the point where even in preseason, Giannii and is looking around being like, I actually haven't played with Luca and LeBron at the same time. So they haven't even really put their whole team together on the practice score before the season starts.

So this is just kind of how it's going to be with the Lakers. So I agree. I would put them at seven as we have them. Anything else you want to get into? It's been a couple other injuries that have happened. But surprisingly enough, when we started the power rankings, during nothing major that would have really derailed. as he has happened in, you know, in terms of other Lakers, this is definitely a Rui Hachamora moment.

Like, I would expect that his minutes and workload will be increased by this LeBron absence. And the same with Austin Reeves. He's going to be the other ball handling, ball dominant, offensive driver on the team. You know, even when LeBron and Luca are on the floor, he does a pretty decent amount of that. But I think he's definitely going to be thrust into a more prominent role. now that LeBron is out. So those two guys, I expect to step up in LeBron's absence. That's right.

No emergency topper when Scoot Anderson goes down. But when LeBron James misses a couple weeks, not for the hardworking Americans up here in the Pacific Northwest, just the finely manicured Angelino is out there. All right. Let's wrap it there. What you'll hear now is what we recorded for Part 5. of the preseason power rankings with Rob Mahoney in Los Angeles a couple of weeks ago.

So enjoy that. We'll talk to you soon. Hello and welcome to group chat. I am Justin Vrier and joining me for part five of the preseason power rankings. We got Big Was. We got Rob Mahoney here. Week three of the power rankings, definitely not the third straight day that we are recording these pods back to back to back and in Los Angeles.

As you know by now, we're starting every pod. with a little team building. Yeah. Thanks to our friend Rob. I'm very excited about this one today. I have been, you know, figuring out which questions we're going to be talking about.

I have been mulling this particular question over. I've gone back and forth. I've had many different answers. I want to see where you guys land. Your house containing everything that you own catches fire. Oh. After saving your loved ones and your pets,

they're all out and safe. You have time to get one thing safely out of your house. What is the thing you're going back for? Is it bad that my first instinct was my laptop? It's same. Same. I do most of my life on this thing.

It's true. Same. 100% is my laptop. Really? Because that's what's definitely going to keep me most comfortable in my time of, you know, grief and distress. Watch Netflix as you watch your house.

Right. Like Netflix, insurance company problems. This. That like figuring out a new plays, but I'm going to be doing all of that on my lap. Not to mention personal me time. You are a millennial.

If you're younger than us, you have your phone and you're probably fine. For us, if we're doing anything serious, it demands a laptop. 100%. I don't like booking flights on my phone. Yeah, anything that I think is like real serious. If this is serious, it needs to be on the computer. You get a pop up on your phone like I'm thrown for a day. Like, I just can't do anything.

I just throw it away. I just don't have any sort of, like, family heirloom that was a pass down from generation and generation. I mean, that's a go-to, right? It's like something sentimental that could not possibly be replaced. I get the thinking with that. And I'm sure lots of people have those items or photos that aren't digitized or whatever it is that they want to hold on to.

I found that as I was thinking about this, any item I picked, it felt like too much pressure on that item to then have to keep it for the rest of my life or keep it. it safe for the foreseeable future. Right. I ultimately landed on, I just want the blank slate. I just want to be free of my material possessions. You know, let's get rid of all of it. And let's really rebuild back stronger with only what we need.

You know, I like this idea, Rob, because, you know, we got enough, like, environmentally conscious people in all of our lives. And, like, the idea, like, you know, those sneakers you dropped off. at Goodwill is just going to end up in a landfrey. Oh my God. Do you guys know the George Carlin bit about his stuff? It's a classic. You got to look it up. But it really hammers home. It's just like,

do we need all this stuff? We just shut our skin. We just don't. I know. Straight up. But I'll say this. The less intense version of this is what I did coming back from New Orleans, moving back to L.A. I just kind of let everything go.

Yeah. The most part, I basically, I had all my stuff in storage as I went to Connecticut for like a month or two. And I was like, oh, I'll pick it up eventually. But when I moved back, I was just like, do I need a bunch of utensils and IKEA furniture and all that sort of stuff? Well, so what happened? Did you have to pay someone to take it out of the unit? They repossessed it probably. They just took it? It was a storage war. Wow. No, no, I didn't do that. I had a friend who sold off some of it while she was still down there. And then I stopped in to take all the stuff that I still

wanted. And then I gave some away, unfortunately, the storage container place was like, You actually have to put some of the stuff in the dumpster, so I spent two days doing that. But I will say, looking back on it, it was a pain in the fucking ass. You do not realize how much, like, a toilet paper holder, like, costs. And, like, your random forks that you don't care about. That's, like, $20 on top of $20.

It's like, it's a terrible idea. If you could hold on to even the basic essentials, I think that's true. That part is true. The hassle of replacing the essential stuff would be unfortunate. And that's when the new iron. Yeah, I mean, that stuff is just kind of boring. And you know what? Most crucially, doesn't give you the dopamine hit of buying something you're excited about.

Like, part of the point of having the sneakers is the thrill of buying the sneakers. And you don't get that when you're just replacing forks and irons. You know what? I was just thinking about this now. Now did you say essentials, there's probably like a couple of like all clad pans that I own. Yeah. That are supposed to be lifetime heirlooms that would just go poof. But maybe it would survive the fire.

I got good news. I think they would be fine. That's crazy to think about. So I could go back and just grab that shit. I've seen all clads saved from all manner of disrepair. Like I think those things are kind of immortal. Are you asking this question specifically because Jonathan Kaminga is what you would say from the Golden State Warriors? You know what?

I don't think if push came to shove that is the piece of the roster that they would hold on to. Well, number 10 on our list, number one team on the docket. today, the Golden State Warriors. I have to say, like, in the post-Lebron to Miami sort of era and media, like, we'd gotten accustomed to routine updates for certain players as they were going through what Kaminga is going through now. It was more around the range of, like, the Carmel Anthony types. And for a while, it was maybe like once a week or whenever he, like, played York, we would get

a bit of a fervor. It has since accelerated to the point where we're getting just, like, regular updates, probably daily, if not like every couple of hours. It's one thing if it was Kevin Durant before his free agency. It's a little different when we're getting to a restricted free agent who isn't pretty good. Like, he's fine. He might be good.

Might be good. I think we've had enough of this. I think ESPN is covering this as we're recording this at the end of September. Like, this is Iran-Contra? You know, I just don't need this in my life. I think the Warriors just generate a lot of interests generally.

Yeah. So that's part of but like we did a whole podcast before the show. I think people are just interested because this is just a new situation in the NBA where teams can just bully a guy who he's not a two-way player. He's not a 10-day contract. He's like a guy we think is going to be in the NBA

for at least seven, eight more years. I would think he'll be around. Right? And he's just being treated like a nothing burger by the organization. Like they just don't care to bully this guy. Yeah.

And that's new. That's what's fascinated to me about the story. It's like, this young guy who's shown promise can't get a deal. Yeah. Or it's that's just so transparent than neither side wants to be in business with each other. Yes. But they have to come to an agreement in order to just part ways.

I think that's the part of it that feels a little bit new or at least specific to the situation. Like Jonathan Cumminga is not an important Golden State Warrior as a player, or at least not a very valued one, it seems, based on the way that they've treated him over the last couple of years. But they need to get something for him if they're going to trade him. Like, they need him as a piece to facilitate whatever it is they actually want to do. Yeah.

It's also partly a Joe Lacob versus perhaps the desires of his front office and chiefly, probably Steve Kerr, who is outright said, like, I don't know, play him. I don't really see him as a part of what we're doing here. Yeah. So it's hard to leverage or like to negotiate against that position when it's out there and pretty frequent. And I think it's important to say also that the Lacobs, kind of

this is something they pride themselves on sort of being hard negotiators and like we could do the history they kind of like semi-played hardball with Steph which I thought was this unconscionable at the time but they did it they did it with Draymond they did it with Agu Dala

they did it with Clay Thompson if you guys remember the last deal that he had signed with Golden State there was so much consternation around that deal so like they did that to legends to literally the greatest players in the history of the organization. And now was Kaminga's turn to get the treatment. It's fair.

He's been treated like Steph. It's a compliment. I imagine by the time you're listening to this, he will have signed some sort of deal. And it brings us to our existential question, which on a scale from one to ten, assuming that he's still on the team they haven't signed and traded him, how much does he matter to the bottom line of this team to begin with? I think it's quite a bit. Yeah.

Ten being the most. Where would you put it out? Seven? Mm. And I say that in the sense that like they either need him to be productive or they need a productive player in his place. I just look at this roster and I see a lot of guys who are like, okay, I kind of like them as a, as an eighth guy on a team, as a ninth guy on a team.

And they're all playing a little over their heads in the rotation. Like they're deep in role players. And then at the top end, it's guys who are 36, 35, 37, now 39, presumably if Al Horford is going to be a part of this team, which we assume he will be. It makes me very nervous. And so the idea of having a young springy forward who can get buckets is in theory appealing. Steve Kerr won't play him. Certainly won't let him be that.

I'm not even saying he should, but they need somebody who's going to produce in the regular season. I have a question about that. Like, on a scale of Jason Wallace to Cam Johnson, what is that scale? role player contribution. So what's the high end? I think you just described high to high as far as I'm concerned. I think Han Johnson is like the high end of like... And Casein Wallace is the low end?

I'm not saying that's the lowest. I guess Isaiah Joe is the lowest end, right? As far as like a guy who's in the rotation, in the rotation, you say like in the regular season, he's doing well for the rotation. So he's the low end. Fine. But I just felt like it'd be kind of disrespectful to

compare Kaminga to Isaiah Joe, no? It is disrespectful, but Isaiah Joe will play the way a coach wants him to play. So, Cam Johnson to Jake LaRavia, perhaps. Or like Gabe Vincent. Sure. I'm just thinking of role players. Would I rather have Jonathan Kameng or Jake La Ravia

on my team is a question that I would have to sit and think about. I don't know if I had to think that one. But what I'm asking is like, what could be reasonably expected from Jonathan in terms of his contribution as a role player every single day by the Warriors this coming season. That's what I'm asking. Is it just Isaiah Joe?

Like, would we be happy with that? No, I think they would have to lean into him carrying a little bit of weight. It would have to be like, can you be a 14 point a game score? Got you. Coming off the bench, presumably. So we're talking the higher end of role player contribution. In terms of responsibility for sure, like you may not feel great about every shot in every minute, but ultimately like they just need someone who's going to

sop up usage and points in creativity. And I say that in particular because Jimmy Butler, while a terrific player even still at this age, he needs a spell, well, it's not that he needs spells. He's going to take them whether he needs them or not. I mean, here's the thing. When do you guys think was the last time that Jimmy Butler played more than 65 games in an NBA season?

Was it the Philly Minnesota season? It was not. It was after that? It was not. Wow. That's tough. That's crazy. 2017 as a member of the Chicago Bulls.

Oh, boy. Eight years ago. And, you know, Steph has had two relatively healthy seasons, but, like, picks up his share of injuries. Yeah. Like, these guys are older, and you need a rotation to accommodate that.

And I don't think that rotation is, like, we're just going to play Moses Moody more, who I like, but I don't like to do that. Well, that's where I wonder at the depth of old guys that they're presumably going to bring in. It's Al Horford, DeAnthony Melton, Seth Curry. is that enough to mitigate needing Kaminga as much?

I agree with what you're saying is they need some sort of pop to supplement the old guys. But if we have just enough old guys, is that enough to get us by? But here's the rub, though. You think your goal is state and it's like, we're going to need you to do X, Y, and Z. Kamauga comes back and says,

well, then you should pay me to do X, Y, and Z. That would be a very reasonable thing for him to ask. You know, that's what I'm saying like this impasse. It's like, what do you think about this player? You know, because it feels like, again, like Golden State is trying to have their cake and eat it too. Because, again, what's been out there is two years, $44 million with a team option on the second year,

which, like, if you're Jonathan Camingo where it's like they've been, they've had you on a trade block, they've basically spent the summer telling you you're not worth a damn. Yeah. And then they're like, I will lock you in on a, you know, a nice pay bump. But like, yeah, we can trade you whenever we want. You won't hit unrestricted free agency to choose your own destiny for another two years. It's like, which one is it, guys?

Where's his motivation? Yeah. To actually buy into what you need him to do. Yeah. Which is why I would put this probably closer to a four. I just don't see a path where he's going to be motivated to do what you want. And what he does and when he wants to do, take him. typically just doesn't really fit what they need.

He'll have the occasional 20-something point scoring game when certain guys are out or hurt or whatever, which is fine. That gets you through the drudgery of the regular season. I just, in terms of bottom line proposition, I just don't think he'll matter that much for the Warriors this season, which is kind of why I had them lower than the Spurs when I was ranking them initially.

Yeah, I just think if he was a seven like Rob suggested, he wouldn't be in this predicament. Well, to be clear, I think he's a seven because either Cummingo or the trade. is important. They need a seven. They need somebody. Yeah. And it could be him do like, you know, grousing about, kind of producing kind of not. Who's in Sacramento that could be a seven for them? Malik Monk? I don't know. The problem is they've already got a lot of guards. They do. Yes. And so he's Jimski, Monk, Steph. It's. Melton. Melton. Who, I mean, if Melton's,

do not forget DeAnthony, Melton, don't you dare. The only problem is you tend to forget him because he's just not around. It's played 44 games over the past. two years. Yet another injury risk on this team. We talked a lot going into last season about Melton being that perfect combo guard to be around some of the guys that they had at the time. Now Jimmy's in there. We should mention the team was excellent. Yeah. At the end of regular season. So here's the thing. From the time Jimmy joined the team. Yeah. They were the equivalent of a top five

offense for the whole season, like the numbers equivalent, a top two defense and a point differential that was right in line with Cleveland and Boston. I think there's a lot of reasons to think that that, that's not sustainable over the course of a full season. And I think some of it is physical with all these older guys and potential for injury. Somebody's also just mental of like the psychological. They were on a sprint to try to make it to the real playoff. This is exactly it.

They were hard sprinting to the end. You could tell that it took a toll, even doing that. They are not going to be on that pace for 82. They're still going to be really good. But they can, the point is they can reach that. Yes. Ceiling when the time calls for it. And so that's why, like, I'm bullish on the.

Warriors this season, I just, yeah, I would just really love to see a resolution to this comming a thing. Yeah. I like them probably more as a playoff team than as a regular season. Sure. Because actually, if Milton does play as well as he can, and Horford is as spry as he looked even last season moving around, which is unbelievable that he's still able to get around because that's a big old boy making those moves and keeping track with much younger players,

he and Milton round out the core three in a way that they probably haven't in a little while at this point. And so I just don't know if they'll get there. And if they do get there, what's their seed? Because in the Western Conference, it's going to be a bloodbath. I do think matchups are going to dictate things. We already saw that last year with clippers and nuggets going head-to-head in round one. Like, we're at a point with the West where matchups might dictate who wins the title more

than it had been 10 years ago when it's like, it usually best team wins. And we know as soon as it going into the playoffs that that is the dominant team. I think that's true. And so then then you have to ask like, what are the match? matchups that are advantageous for Golden State. They do get to the playoffs fully healthy. Who at the top of the conference do we feel good about the matching up with? OKC feels a little overwhelming in terms of the length and athleticism.

It feels like the kind of matchup where if they could jam up Steph a little bit off ball, it could be incredibly disruptive to their offense. Houston, I think, you know, and we've seen. Houston is a good matchup for them. I don't know about good. Like a Houston team with Kevin Durant is a very different proposition ultimately. But if you're going to pick and choose, if you're the Warriors, probably rather the rockets than the thunder. The Nuggets, I don't know that Al Horford is helping you contain Nicola Yokic.

I don't think that's like the solution to that matchup for example. No, just the physicality part. Like, love Horford, love Draymond, two of the best defensive bigs of their generation. These guys are older. They can't stop Nicole Yokic. This is the thing, like, as we're talking through that, what I'm hearing is that the warriors are like the joke of of the NBA. It's like there's Alcaraz over here,

there's Yonix Center over there. They're in a class on their own. No one else can beat Jokovic. I think if you're the warriors, you could go into the season thinking like, why would we be scared of any of these other West teams? The Lakers, the clippers. I think they could talk themselves into thinking

that they could beat those teams, right or not. Like the wolves too in that mix. The wolves, yeah. You know, a healthy, a healthy crack with Steph, like maybe we would have a different chance. I think they could talk themselves into that. Which is why they end up tent on a rankings, but seventh in the West teams that we have

because we only have a couple more East teams to go here. Anyone else we want to talk about? Buddy healed. Yeah. I think the Jimmy Buddy stuff is not just like good comedy, but they're just like a good basketball pairing. And I think that's one of those things that Steve Kerr should not like tether them together per se,

but find as many minutes as you can for those guys to be on the floor together. The buddy system? The buddy system. There you go. We're safer together. I don't know who's going to start. I assume that's kind of Pajemski's job to lose at the start. at the start of the year maybe,

but buddy's worth a look in that spot. Do Anthony Melton if he's healthy? To me, Pajemski should be bench. Bench? I mean, they could use the playmaking, to be honest. Yes.

Like Pajeminski when he's on, but then you see in the playoffs when he's not. To me, Steph, Draymond, Jimmy, that's plenty of playmaking. Yeah. Like, go do your playmaking on the bench against bench units. Well, from one team that has a lot to figure out

before this pod gets published, to another one. that has a world of possibilities that could happen between now and then. We have the Los Angeles Clippers at number nine. I kind of waffled on how to rank them because I was like, should I factor in that they might not have Kauai or that something might go awry in between now? You have not have Kauai for what? Well, for a variety of reasons.

For injury or? Or maybe our guy Adam is just like, I don't know. Guys, I'm here to make a prediction. Kauai Leonard is not going to be Joe Smith from this team. it's not happening. I also think whatever penalty is issued, it will not be to him. Probably because it helps get that out of their hair, finally.

Maybe. Yeah, I would expect that as well. But it's going to be looming over the season. I mean, their recent, maybe not report the scuttle button that suggests it might wait until after the All-Star break because All-Star is in Los Angeles at the Intuit Dome where the Clippers play.

And so maybe we'll try to sidestep that. I don't know, but, I think this is going to be weird for a while. Oh, yeah. Ultimately, I ended up settling on the fact, like, I have to treat them as if that doesn't exist. And so I rated them highly, because I think highly of what they did this offseason,

but you just never know. I just, to me, their most important players, like, one, like, is this going to be a weirder media situation than general Kauai? Well, that's actually a great point, because I have written down. Is this going to phase Kauai at all? No.

No. I don't think he doesn't. care. I promise you this is the thing he cares the least about is media perception. He just doesn't care. Like it doesn't factor into his equation of what's like important, which is like getting paid and being the best hooper he could be. Do you think like James Harden, he doesn't have the internet?

Wait, what? There's this whole thing about James Hardin a couple years ago where he's like, I don't have the internet. I don't go on it. That seems improbable. It does. It's another one who's not. never really tried the craft of public image.

And like, if you listen to his interactions with the media, it's always stilted in bullshit. So it's going to be more hard than being stilted and bullshit. It's really easy. This is the thing about this story with the Clippers? And again, Pablo's my man. I love the lebitrar people. At a certain point, we're powerless in this.

Who's we? The media. We could try to make this a big deal. But if Adam and the owners don't make it a big deal, it's not going to be a big deal. I mean, that part is true. But I do think Pablo has made it a big deal. I think he has made this a major story. He's gotten a lot of attention on it.

Yes. But like in terms of getting something done? See, I would say it's more than attention. Because I think the way that the reporting has come out, it's been a lot of like, here's initial findings. Here's a soft rebuttal from the clippers that does nothing. And then you can see the mounting evidence sort of building a wall around any plausible deniability. Yeah, the follow-up reports were important because I think the initial report was met with some skepticism, especially from certain media types that were suggesting, like, do they have the smoking gun?

Is there enough to hold their feet to the fire? Pavel, keep coming up with stuff is basically applying more and more pressure to where that they can't push it under the rug and just say, like, we didn't find anything in our investigation, even though the investigation. even though the investigation was probably... What I would say where I slightly disagree with you guys is that... Pablo being the only one on this is kind of proof of what I'm saying.

Like, something different. Like, somebody would have... I think that has a lot more to say about the reporting landscape than it does about interest in the story. Maybe. But what I'm saying is, like, something big would come out, which Pablo breaks. Yep. It's like, yo, there's something happening over here.

And every other part of the media would have been like, here's my part of it, here's my part of it. It's like Bruce Sotha being like, yo, Uncle Dennis was like asking for the world from the Raptors. That's it. So what I'm saying is like, again, if Adam and them decide, we're not doing anything with this. It's over.

It's done. There's nothing anybody could do or say about it. And I don't think fans are going to be like, we're boygotting the Clipper games because they got Kawhi Leonard. They were doing that anyway. Just weren't as interested. It's a soft boycott. Yeah, I think it speaks to where MBA media gets its information.

And I'm not even knocking them because this is just how the job works. Like, you get it from MBA types of people, whereas this is a story that's much more business-oriented. It's in the courts. It's on paper. And it's within one company. And Pabel spent the time in order to develop the trust of the people who actually look there. Yes. It's in fintech.

Like, this is so outside of our normal realm of coverage and the reporting chain is. so different. I do think the things that can force hands here, one, any kind of arbitration, right? Like, it's one thing to have an investigation. It's another thing when there's like binding arbitration with actual concrete findings. That could be something real. As far as the public opinion goes, I think a lot of that sways with the rest of the NBA's governors. Like at what point is it, you know, Mark Cuban out here kind of defending in some ways what the clippers have done or or at least like saying, oh, this is normal, this is normal, these are standard of business practices. At what point do the billionaires break ranks?

At what point is this something that is not offensive, but like agitates other owners to the point that they would be pissed off, that they would want retribution. They wouldn't want actual results from this. So this is the thing to me is that we've seen them sort of buck back against each other before. prime example LeBron and the decision and they're like, you know what? We're disallowing signing trades and that can't happen again.

Right? Or, you know, just KD leaving OKC it's like, oh, we got to come up with the Derek Rose rule or we got to they always react when they feel like they've been wronged somehow by the system. Yeah.

Nobody's moving yet. I do think, and I don't mean to be polyanish about this. I do think this is a case where like the public actually has power here and not to make it more of a political thing.

But like the reason why Jimmy Kimmel was put back on the air was like the people affected the bottom line or threatened the bottom line of Disney. Whereas like I think if enough people threaten the bottom line

at the NBA, then it will motivate. I would disagree. I would say that wasn't public pressure that's powerful people in the industry. Being like,

I'm off your Marvel shit. I'm off of, I'm not working on that. I'm not writing that. I'm not starring in that. I'm not directing that. People with actual power and influence. That's fair.

Moving the needle. Not us plebs at the bottom. Like, the clippers, they went to the second round three times since they got Kauai Laird. I'm sick and they're cheating. But it's not going to happen.

To that point, though, if enough owners think that the bottom line is going to be effective. Owners, yes. Yes. But I just. But that's people being like,

it's almost what the story you believe in. And if you have, it's a group of 30 people, three individuals, essentially, if five of them believe enough of the public discourse, then that has effect. Yeah, again, if we get, like,

if we, like, sort of drill down to it, right? Like, cap circumvention exists so that there could be, a quote, quote, quote, even distribution of talent around the mood, right? It's like, that's the reason we have the cap. It's like to control the spending that you can do to acquire talent.

Yes. Right? It's not baseball. There needs to, like, somebody would have to show that the clippers, like, disproportionately held the talent via this cap circumviting. It's like, that's what I'm saying. Like, I don't doubt that shady shit is happening. I'm actually pretty convinced that what they did was shady.

Yeah. And not above board in a way that it's just like everybody would be, oh, open the books. The communications, blah, blah, blah. I'm convinced of that. But I'm talking about where you connected to where it's effed up, where it's like the clippers

gained unfair advantages that ruined the results for a bunch of other fan bases. It's just not there. Right. They were able to re-sign Derek Jones Jr. Something like that on the fringe.

It probably was. But I mean, just getting Kauai in the first place in retain. That would be the undue advantage is getting Kauai. Which is a bottom line proposition in its own way. So Laker fans would have to bitch about it.

Well, it's also... They were the only other team in the running. Let me tell you, they already are. It's like Steve Balmer was definitely paying for that shiny new arena, but, like, quite helped, you know? Sure. He's definitely putting a lot of money into that system just by being there still in a second.

I think we are, and we're, look, we're waiting into untimely newspegs by the time this publishes to the point that I think we need to reserve the right to just ADR this whole segment. We'll just re-dub ourselves, having a different argument, as the new results and information come out over the next couple weeks. But I do think we're not going to hear substantial movement on this four months.

Should we just do one of your New York Times questions, but as the Clippers, you know, he's hardened. I'm zoo. I honestly would like that bit even more. You're John Collins. I would love to be John Collins. Well, as a team, we should talk about this team on paper because the offseason was very interesting. I mean, I don't know if it's the expendables, but there's just a lot of veterans. talent on the team at this point.

It's unlike anything I've seen in recent years because it's not just like the Lakers era, Carl Malone, Gary Payton team, where it's just like one last run. It's like a lot of freaking guys. It's basically the whole team. So between Chris Paul, Brooke Lopez, Nicholas Batum, who's been in the league like 17 years,

which goes unnoticed because he just looks so fresh and dewy. James Hardin, Bradley Beale, Kauai Leonard. There are 96 seasons of experience. Wow. Just between the two of them. And then the guys beyond him, Zubach, Dunn, Derek Jones, Jr., John Collins, and Bogie. Those are all eight plus years veterans.

All vets. And that's another 43 years. So, yeah. It's one of the wisest team. I don't know if that necessarily, how much that will be effective when you have a team like the Thunder where everybody's like 22. True.

But there's something to it. I mean, it's an older team. I think what separates them from the Warriors in my mind, and this was sort of an either or for me in the ranking. It's like, what do you do with Golden State and the Clippers? I think the Warriors are better positioned as a playoff team. I think the Clippers, even despite the age of that roster, because of the depth, are better positioned as a regular season team. And so will Golden State get the chance to get to the playoffs in one piece and prove how good they are?

We'll see. I think the Clippers is going to be right there on the page. This was already a very successful team. I think they're going to have to be successful in different ways, though, with this roster because of all that changed. Like if you look at last year's team, they won 50 games. Incredible with the roster that they had and their ability to specifically dominate on defense with pressure. And with Zhu's coverage on the backline, incredible stuff. But you look at that team, the top six guys in minutes played one and two, Hardin and Zoo, no problem.

They're critical parts of this team even still. After that, Norm Powell, Derek Jones Jr., Chris Dun and Mir coffee, two of those guys are gone. The other two are less important now than they were last season to the point that I don't know. I couldn't tell you right now what Chris Dunn's role is going to be. I could tell you what I would, you know, I would like him to continue to start because I think that's the best, like, balance. Is Jeff Van Gundy still on that bench? He's still on that bench.

He's going to get some minutes. And that's the thing is like, I don't, they're going to have to rework their defense. They're going to have to reimagine kind of how they were playing. But Jeff Van Gundy did such a great job with it last time around. I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt that they will find ways to be a successful defense again. You got Zub. You can be a damn successful defense. And to Rob's point, like, even when I look at it's like, Chris Paul, you're not going to play more than 12 minutes a game.

Brooke Lopez's Zub's backup. Like, these roles that these guys have are more than manageable. That's what I think is different where, like, you know, depending on injury luck and all of this stuff, like, we could see Draymond, Jimmy, Steph averaging over 35 minutes a game. That's not great. you know, in terms of the wear and tear for those guys. Where's the Clippers veteran guys? Nobody's going to be asked to do that much heavy lifting. So, yeah, the depth is different, man.

Probably one of the best benches in the league. If they can sort of out the rotation in a way that makes sense, it's going to be a lot of ball handlers to kind of wade through because you'd assume Bill might want to run some second units. Chris Paul obviously is going to want his hands on the ball. If he does play, how much does he play? Yeah. And that's kind of like an unsung little story here.

It's like the whole quiet situation to do. disrupt what was setting up to be a fair world tour to one of our guys. And I imagine Chris Paul was very intentional, as he is about everything, about picking the clippers as his final team. He's like the comptroller of Lobb City now. Sorry, the city councilman. You know, year 21. Yeah. So it's going to be a little bit more muddled probably than what was a nice little storyline for them. But there's just, there's a lot of options here. And I do like that it's also leaning into their size advantage that they already had by basically not only getting a if there's anyone bigger than zoo it might be brookez they're probably one a one b in some uh order uh and then you

have john collins as a like as a power for basically getting a chance to play competitive basketball for the first time in three years it's been a long time i mean i love everything that they can throw out there some some combinations i'm excited about one you just hit on justin which is i think if chris paul and brad beale can play together a fair amount and i would love for them to come off the bench together. We haven't seen Beal play with like a true playmaker of that caliber since John Wall. Yeah. And so getting him off the ball more playing into his strengths in that regard, I'll be really excited about. I think James Hardin and John Collins, Collins feels super important to this team structurally. He's a kind of player they haven't really had before. I mean, I guess you could

argue Derek Jones Jr. is a lob thread in a similar way, but he's so limited offensively. Otherwise, John Collins can handle. He can, he can, he can shoot. He can finish. He's really flexible moving in and around the basket in a way that I think is really exciting playing off of Hardin and all the attention he draws. And then Brooke Lopez and his Disneyland season passed, I mean, thrilling times for everyone involved. Yeah, I like the John Collins deal because they kind of, it felt like they were doubling down on their defensive identity from last year, while also like this guy is not, you know, he's not a Chris Dunn or Derek Jones on offense. Like he can still do things. But, you know, it's adding just a little bit more physicality, a little

bit more umph at the four than look, Derek Jones, man, he did yeoman's work. Did a great job for them last year. He even did a little bit of rim protection at times for them. Like, he did a lot. I just think Collins brings a different dynamic on the boards and stuff like that. And so, yeah, I love the depth. I love the Collins move. I'm just, like you said, I'm fascinated to see how they fit everything around this regular season. And I do I do really hope they maintain that defensive posture that they took where it's like, yo, we're going to suffocate people. And in the offense, look, we got Kauai, we got James Hardin.

We could put things together offensively, but defensively we're killing people every night. A lot of guys, but one of those instances where, like, I don't think anyone will mind. Yeah. Taking some plays off, taking some games off. Especially like Chris Paul proved he can play 82. Like, it was an incredible achievement.

Wild. Does he have to do it again? I hope not. you know, like, again, they're going to need to balance that rotation over the course of the season, because there are not a lot of young legs here. Like, Yonik Conan Niederhouser is not going to play. That's right. One of the surprise picks of the first round, like, there's just no room for guys in that position here anymore.

You'd be a Conan guy? You know what? I'm going to find out. Okay. I'm going to find out in the G League, probably. Okay. Well, a team that has a lot of young legs and is hoping that they have a little bit more experience underneath them in order to make a push here. number eight,

your Orlando Magic, went through a big old overhaul in the offseason, bringing Desmond Bain in. They put their money where their mouth is. We've been talking about when this team is going to take the leap. They're ready for the leap. Unfortunately, the expectations come fast and furiously

because this team is going to get very expensive starting next season, the season after this one, when the Apollo Bencaro extension kicks in. So they're kind of on the clock, ASAP. They are, I mean,

this is the funny thing about waiting to make the move. If you make the move early, maybe you take away some developmental seasons, maybe you don't get the draft picks that you would have gotten if you had slow-plated and the expectations come sooner. But if you wait, as the magic have, to kind of make the trade specifically for shooting, something that everyone knew that they needed and wanted to do,

there's still the build-up of expectations. There's still a mounting pressure, I think, for this team to be good, in part because everything else seems to be there. And so now that they have the shooting, if it doesn't work, someone has to answer the question of why. I'm extremely bullish on this team, as you guys know. I just think Bain is such a perfect bet to make because he's so proven and he's played in the context of I'm playing off of a John Morant, a like a ball dominant kind of guard. So it's not as if for him to get off he needs to have the ball constantly.

But he's also, you know, had to step in because John missed so many games. So he has both of those things working for him in terms of being able to play off of ball dominance elsewhere and being able to step into that role when it's called for. And his shooting is not theoretical. Like this guy, he's going to shoot the leather off of the ball, man. And I think they're top four. Bain, Wagner, Jalen Suggs, and Paolo.

Like, to me, when you think about the youth, the athleticism, the, like, the motor? Like collectively, we're talking about dudes that play so freaking hard. I'm just really excited about what they could do around that, man. And it's just the age of these guys that I love the most because they can be relentless. Like, you can see them maintaining it for a whole regular season and racking up wins that way. One of the rare instances where I like this team, I like the move. But oddly enough, Bain is the one I'm least worried about going into this kind of leap season where it's like,

I kind of know what I'm going to get for him. And I think he's a problem solver in the way that they've always needed. Like, he'll do a little bit of the on-ball stuff. You need him to? Don't need that. Okay, he could just play off ball and do that. Forceful enough and meaty and mighty enough on the defensive end to fit that identity. Because even despite everything that happened last year, still second on defense's team.

That was not the problem. But then I'm like, oh, is, is Powell going to take the leap? Is Fron's going to shoot it at any degree of consistency? And is Sugg's going to be healthy? and all by the way, is he going to shoot it as well? Well, let's take those problems one by one. As far as Palo, I think, I mean, he is the differentiating factor for this team. I think, you know, you bring in Baines, there's a lot of attention on that,

but really what shooting does, what a shooter like Desmond Bain does, is in theory allow Palo Bancaro to be the best version of Palo Bancaro. And I think there are two things that he does that have kind of held him back offensively from being like a true young star in the league. One of them, he just settles too much. Like he hits the first wall of the defense and he gets a lot of pressure in fairness and he just settles for too many 16, 17 footers over the top of the defense that he's not like the best at.

And so that drags down ultimately what is the biggest and most imposing physical force on the floor. Like he should be able to get inside more often with better spacing. Hopefully he'll be able to do that. I think the other thing is because of all that pressure and the way that defense is collapse on the magic, he holds the ball like a little too long, trying to read what's going on and trying to make, like, he's trying to make the right play, but the result of that is it kills clock,

and it leads to a lot, like, more turnovers than it should. And so you put one or two, like one dead eye shooter in Desmond Bain and anyone else who's hitting any shots out there, all of that math changes, all of those dynamics change. And then all of a sudden you're seeing a version of Palo that hopefully can be getting to the basket in the line even more consistently than he does. Yeah, see, that's why I'm not worried about Paulo.

I think if he's able, if he's allowed to operate in space, he's going to do well. Yeah. He's already really good. I mean, to me, the two questions are Franz Wagner, where it's like, make a shot. Because if he does, this thing is, like, super scary. And Jayla Suggs just staying on the floor.

Because I think he proved last year when he played, he was just, he had just ascended to a whole other level when he finally played. So to me, it's just Franz Wagner, man. like actually understanding the stakes now because that changes things too and him like you know

coming into his own as a more well-rounded offensive player. Can I, I want to give one reason for optimism on Franz Wagner's Aaron jump shot. Not even Eurobasket. Or is it God? I mean look like that everyone playing

for that Germany team is a totally different player over there and Franz is already a great NBA player I thought his most successful stretch was on the ball last season with all the injuries. is like really, really impressive stuff. The jumper was not necessarily the reason why over the longer term. And I think the hitch that was really developing over the back part of the year, very, very worrisome.

But the way that hitch is like coming to be more prominent tells me this is like, I mean, it's a deeply psychological thing happening. It is a guy who is feeling the pressure to hit those shots because nobody else on the team can and like kind of buckling under it a little bit for as good as he is in every other dimension of the game. I wonder if adding someone like, who it's like, that is our designated shooter. This guy is not, you would hope,

Contavius called Will Pope coming in and the percentage suddenly cratering. Like, this is a star level shooter who's going to absorb a lot of those shots. And now Franz can just be a shooter and not a guy who has to hit that shot. I wonder if that relief might actually help him a little bit. A little bit of stage fright.

I mean, I don't know how else to explain the fact that he was good and then all of a sudden two back-to-back sub-30% shooting seasons in a row. Well, you're right, though. He felt like a different player when Pop, Pollo was out and he had the keys to kind of run things himself. Perhaps it's as simple as comfortability and like how he's getting those shots. But I think you're right that Franz is probably the start of the chain reaction in order to figure things out. Because I think Paulo plays on a different level when he has the space.

The space comes from Franz being aggressive and being able to step out and hit shots in the playoff games where he's been able to do that. You've seen Paulo take a leap, be a little bit more careful with the ball. And then Pollo being able to create filters down to the Suggs types. And you saw that last year where Suggs was basically. basically the main guy for a long stretches because both Powell and Franz were out. And was doing a damn good job with it, by the way. He's a

baller, but then you look at like the finer details and it's just like that was another poor shooting season from Jail and Suggs after what was practically a 40% 3-point shooting season this season before. It seemed like he turned things around. I think he's still a good shooter. Me too. I think having to, having to try

to be like a Dame Lillard type. I mean, they had him way out there. That is not suited to his skill set, I think. I think just being a guy who's catching and shooting with, like, a decent amount of space, I think he'll be fine again. To that point, seven assists last season from Paulo Bancaro. That's Suggs taking the shots there.

82. The previous season. So, obviously, having the helping hand, I think will help him because he needs to be set up. He's not taking a lot of step back. It'll be white shots. This is the thing, like, as you mentioned, with their core four guys, like, they're almost like built in a lab to appeal to my basketball sensibilities the way those four guys fit together. Smash mouth basketball.

I mean, it is smash mouth. It's the way that Franz Wagner drives into people. It's the way that Suggs will pick up anybody. It's the way they don't back down from any challenge. There is a combination of interlocking skill and temperament that I think just really, really works if those four guys can stay healthy. Yeah, they're like Detroit without the mania, right? Like, they don't have... Well-balanced Detroit Pistons.

Emotionally mature. Or, like, you know, a Ron Holland. But they had, that's another young, a young team that, like, they found themselves when they discovered, like, oh, we're like bigger, stronger, faster than everybody. Yeah. We should lean into that as our identity. And so, you know, that's another thing I like about them. Like, they kind of know who they are. And now it's just like, all right, these glaring weaknesses have started to be addressed in, like, a major way.

So I thought that was part of the problem last season too Where they had all of these kind of overlapping injuries Where one of their core guys or multiple core guys were out at the same time To say nothing about other role players who were out It's like they did have they didn't know who they were And they were still guarding people And it's like this isn't working because we can't like Their half court offense was abominable for most of the season

Like they just could not score and there's a frustration that comes with that Of like we are playing our way and we're still losing these games Because we don't have the firepower but then you put everyone back, I don't think there's any question about the clarity of purpose and style and identity. Like the magic are still the magic.

Right. We have the essential question down here is the magic will win the east if we kind of explained all the more finer details of it. I think top line takeaway is like, hit some shots. Hit some shots.

And I think... Without sacrificing the defense. Yes. And within that, if hitting those shots allows Paulo to take that jump. Exactly. Yeah.

Well, I guess combination wise, I assume Wendell Carter would get the first crack at being the center because they need the offensive pop. Yeah. Any worries there? I like Wendell, solid player. His three also has just like kind of abandoned him.

It just has left him as a player. Yeah. And I think not having... We can call him a stretch big anymore. Maybe not a stretch, but like can do other things like good enough defensively to hold it down, works offensively. Isn't like as big as you would like your big center to be if he's not going to be stretched. So that's a problem.

The other problem is like Mo Wagner, who tours ACL last November, December, I'm blanking on when exactly. We'll have to see kind of like what his availability is going to be. Really important part of their team was in the running for six man, like one of the highest scoring reserves in the league last season before he went down. And if he's out for a continued significant period of time, then it's Wendell and Goga and Jonathan Isaac playing more than 12 minutes game. Yeah, John and Isaac playing five, which, you know, not without its merits.

Yeah, I do love at the end of last season, not the two seasons ago, where they like went to that to the end of the season is like, we're finally let it lose. And it just didn't make a difference. It's nice to have that option. But the whole Isaac experiences is interesting for a lot of different reasons. We mentioned that they were second defensively. They ended up being a negative in net rating overall. Crazy.

And that's because the offense was 27. This is the thing. If they just get to league average offense, they are a dominant team. Yeah. So that's where the bar is. And it's very achievable for them. Definitely doable. So I think we all agree.

They're like after Cavs and Nix. They're the next team. And I feel like they're knocking on the door if everything breaks right. Yes. All right. Can I name one more guy on this front? This feels like a really critical Anthony Black season. Because one name we haven't mentioned.

They brought in Tias Jones as another backup guard. A magic team that has both Tias Jones and Desmond Bain doesn't have to play Anthony Black. At all. And so now he's in a. a position where it's like, and he he's just had like such a weird like fits and starts kind of start to his career. He has to justify his minutes.

Like he has to earn that time. And we'll see if he's able, if he's cut out for that or not. I don't know. I don't know if he's there. He's there Jonathan Kaminga. Could be. Or perhaps there are a men Thompson where it's like, we tried you as a ball handler, but now you're just going to be our wrecked shit up defender. Could be interesting.

Um, all right. Next team on the list. Number seven, the Los Angeles Lakers, who if we cut to them, let's say, like early July, it would have been like the Donald Glover and community walks into the door and everything's on fire thing that I love, bring up once a month practically. LeBron Mift. How dare you lean into someone who isn't me

and build the team around him? The team isn't enough, not enough defense. We saw this. What is this team? It's a calamity. And then all of a sudden, Luca Donchis takes some thirst traps and it's a whole different situation.

Yeah. And I think it's warranted. I think him just looking's felt just completely changed the face of the team. And it also sounds like, based on the reporting game, Woyki and other guys, like they're starting to think about the team a little bit differently after he signed the extension.

Yes. After he got in shape, showed that he's serious about things. And so I'm kind of buying it a little bit. I'm waiting. I want to see how it ultimately does coalesce because I think even the version of Luca that we got on the Lakers is a great regular season player last year.

Sure. But in the playoffs you saw, like, it just wasn't good enough for what playoff defenses can bring the bear when you consider the roster that was around him. Right. Right. So I just want to see what the new one improved, the Luca actually means on the floor. I actually want to see what's different. Like, is he actually getting to the paint more?

That's the one. Are you getting all the way to the basket? All the way to the basket. Because that's the thing that's suffered the most. And it's in the numbers. Like, the guy straight up just wasn't getting the paint touches that he was. So we'll see if that's the case. And then, you know, my guy, Yovam Buha was watching his show.

And he's like, LeBron dominating. Luca guaranteed three starters. Yep. And then the back court minutes, it's Rui, Marcus Smart, Gabe Vincent. Austin. And Austin Reeves. Like, how do you balance? Obviously, it feels like Austin is a made man over there.

So he's going to start. So who's... Who's going to guard guards? Who's guarding anybody in speed on this team? And I guess that's Marcus Smart, bro. Does he know that? She. I think he hopes that's his role.

I think he will probably get that crack just because they do need someone to at least try it. And like, Austin is not cut out for that kind of role. Rui is not. Luke is not going to do it. This is why, you know, ultimately, one of the reasons I'm bullish on the Lakers is they have had time now to reimagine themselves as a Luca team. Yes. Some of that is personnel based. Some of just going in knowing that's what you are.

they, I don't think they're going to recapture that like February stretch of really good defense. Like that's not who they are. They don't have, as we just said, point of attack defenders. They don't have lock and trail guys who are going to chase shooters around screens. And on the back line is Yondra Aden, who for whatever attractive qualities he may have as a player, protecting the rim is not one of them. It's not dominating on the defensive ones. That is not the area in which he is dominating. So that's not who they're going to be, but they're,

offense is going to be great. Because Luca Donchage is going to be great. Like, I am buying the thirst traps. I think he's going to win MVP. Like, I just think it's going to be that kind of season. Oddly enough, they are built defensively to guard the Dallas Mavericks because they're all power forwards. It seems like those are the guys that they have available to them.

But I think you're right. I think the offense could be push your rig back type good. If Luca is as sharp as he looked in Eurobasket, which he always does. But this time, he's had a little bit of gusto to his play. I think the other part of this is just how much is LeBron going to be engaged in the situation. I think he will ultimately come around because he realizes the opportunity. He doesn't have many of them left. And also, like, this was the best opportunity on the board after he opted in.

Not even close. Yeah. Like, opting out, save for being like, yo, I'll go take a mid-level for a contender. Yeah. You weren't. Like, you didn't have great options to get paid and be on a contender. that just wasn't the case. This is a good team.

It's just, you know, not balanced in terms of offensive defense. They have a little more to prove than some of the teams we have yet to talk about in the West just because they are reinventing a thing. And Luca is coming back from his injuries last season and needs to prove that he is still the player who could take a team to the NBA finals. I just happen to believe in that stuff. And I think they're going to be right there in the mix with some of these great teams in the West. And Luca's a huge reason.

why. I think it is, can he, the question is, can he get to the basket more consistently? Can he penetrate past the first line of defense without relying on the step back so much? And also, if he is lighter and in better shape, just carrying the load over the course of full games is going to work in his favor a little bit better. And also, hopefully he can say healthier as a result of that stuff. I also think the question is, how much does his buy-in and the Lakers projecting that they're now willing to be a little less precious about the cap space going forward? How much does that factor into what they're willing to change on the fly over the course of the season. Now, it's a little tricky because LeBron makes so much money,

can't really do much with him. Austin Reeves, you would want to keep because if LeBron walks next off season, then Reeves is your guy. You've built him up to be the shining boy wonder of this team, if Luca himself isn't that. Are you more willing, though, to change things on the fringes? They only really have two first-round draft picks owed at this point, which is wild to say because we've been counting Lakers' draft picks

for what seems like half a decade. There are options here on the board. I mean, we talked in the past about Andrew Wiggins as someone they've had perhaps an interest in. But there are better versions of Andrew Wiggins. But that's what they need. A wing type of player who that they can ask to guard people because, as we mentioned, it's defense. First and foremost. Yeah, they need somebody who's closer to Alexander Walker than a Wiggins.

I think that might be true. You know, like somebody who, because so for Marcus Smart, who we haven't seen play since, what, 22? He's played. He played at the end of the last season with the Wizards, but he was paced out.

How much did he finish games? He looked good for what it's worth in those games, but it's like... But he's looked good when he has played over the last couple of years, he's looked good guarding threes and force. Like, he's good at playing up.

That's what his skill set is in this point. Even his last year in Boston, you know, coming off of defensive player of the year and all that kind of thing. Not my defensive player of the year. Not my vote. In Boston, he was carrying a,

a bigger load than anything close he's going to be asked to do with the Lakers. To me, it's just like, does he actually still even have the legs for it? Because, like, nobody wants you to dribble and take shots at the end of the shot clock and stepbacks and be anybody's leader. He don't got to be any of that in L.A. But, like, can he streamline whatever he has left in his body to this defensive stopper type of role? Yeah. No.

The case four was that he just didn't really have a clear fit in Memphis because he got hurt. And then it's just like things were a little bit more mixed. They'd have so many guys that they didn't really need him. They didn't rely on him. He kind of got shuffled around a bit. Ended up in Washington as a contract dump. Didn't play much there. And so like was it circumstance more than did he lose something?

I would guess it's a little bit of both at this point. But if there's enough of the old Marcus Mark, Mark, defensively, that's really all they need him for. 31. Because there's enough offense. I think there's a lot. This is another thing I think is working in the Lakers' favor. There's just like a lot of motivating factors, right? There is Luca on his revenge tour, a guy who I guess you didn't believe he would be motivated

enough so you traded him to give him the ultimate slight and like chip on his shoulder for the rest of his life. Sure. LeBron eager to still prove that he can be the best version of himself at this age he can be. Mark Smart trying to show he can still be that guy with a chance to compete for something. Even D'Andre Aiton, who, again, is not a perfect player. but the comparison point is Jackson Hays. Like that is, that's where the bar is.

Also playing for, to get off the minimum cycle. Exactly. That's the next phase of this. So there's a lot of guys who are like eager and in positions to prove something to somebody, whether it's to themselves or to, you know, the public or other teams or agents or whatever. But like, there's a lot of guys playing for things. And that can be an exciting mix. How do you guys feel about the Luca PR Blitz?

Because in addition to him actually looking good and wanting to sell that, There's been a lot of, like, Luca and in traditional media that typically at this point in our cycle, where, like, people aren't doing magazine cover stories or softball. You're saying, like, why isn't he on with the Kelsey brothers? Yeah, a little bit. It's a little traditional, and it's a lot. Like, I know too much about his business manager, in part because she's just everywhere. A classic case of, like, after the trade, Luca's doing a sit-down with Malika Andrews. and they're talking about, oh, God, it was so sad, yada, yada.

And I threw my phone. And she's like, here's the phone. It's right here. It's broken. You want to see it? It's just like, on the one hand, I get it. He's taking his opportunity to be the golden boy because he was never that with Dallas. He never really seemed like wanted to be in the public eye.

I don't think he's taking a responsibility. That's what it feels like to me. He's becoming a fucking man. Like, you are the face of the biggest team in the NBA. Like, it's your job. to lead this team, to lead the league, to be who you are. This is what it means to be the superstar of the Los Angeles. Yes.

It's a magic thing. Yes. To me, he's finally stepping into the role that we've all been like, bro, it's you. Right? Like, go out and take your job seriously, every facet of it. That's what it feels like to be. Not a guy who's like, oh, I'd like to get my curating up. It's like, oh, like, this is what comes with the actual job.

Not whatever the fuck I was doing it. Dallas before. I mean, that was also pretty good, for the most part. On the court. To say it wasn't pretty good, but again, like, we're happy about the, you know, what was that reality show, the black swan? What is the black swan? Yeah.

Blacks mirror? I think it was the black swan with a, where the person got like a makeover, basically. Okay. You know, like they got plastic surgery. It's a she's all that situation. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that kind of situation. But with surgery? Yeah.

To me, it's, you know, and the same thing with Zion, it's almost an indictment, bro. Like, NBA finals, conference finals, max contracts, none of that was enough to make you want to take an off-season series. You need personal vengeance, yeah. Putting Luca and Zion in the same bucket. Well, no. No, no. Luka is more excusable because he was actually achieving. Yes.

Yeah. While fat, where Zion was underachieving while fat. was like have amazing playoff performances and go on long playoff friends. That's all he did. The whole time he was there. Sure. Sure. But we could draw straight line to his lack of seriousness in that category to the failures that happened.

Where he's getting pantsed on defense on national TV against Boston and just running out of gas and stuff like that. Right? Like, it's great that he's doing it now, but it's like, you know, Nico Arison had a point. Not that the trade was good. Yes. But he had a point. Yes. I will just say, circling back to this PR strategy,

I just want to talk about for whatever reason. I don't think it's in his best interest, though, to be so out there because I just don't think he's interesting. And I don't think the polished Michael Jordan approach to PR strategy works anymore. I think people can see through it. And I think like he's taking a very stock thing where he's just giving access but not giving anything. I still don't know who Luca is personally.

Yeah. Like, it almost works the opposite way. I'm like, what are you hiding? I mean, I think we know who he is, and it's a young guy

who plays a lot of video games and just move to Los Angeles. Like, it's not that... You too? Well, the video games less so these days, also not the young part. But I don't know that it's a more complicated than that. And I think ultimately,

maybe you're giving people too much credit for actually reading these stories. Like, it's just, it's a tough sell on some, on some of these big glossy features sometimes. But the fact that he's trying is different, because he didn't try. Am I wrong in Dallas really? This is definitely a level of outreach and I think

proactivity on the media front from Loka that is very different. Yeah, I read his media style is just he's new still. Yeah. Even this far into his career, this prominent player that he's been, he's just not used to it. He's not used to doing it. So he's not going to be good at it automatically. I don't see why he can't, if he continues to stay open,

I don't see why he can't one day do a better version of whatever the fuck Braun was doing on McAfee that day, right? What was Braun doing on McAfee that day? He was doing a lot. I was entertained, but I know it was bullshit, right? But like, it's a recognition of like, oh, let me try to do something different and interesting. I think Luke, but this is a guy who's been doing it for 25 years, right, understanding the sort of nuances of just like,

I can't just sit out with Malika. Like, in order to make a splash, I got to do the McAfee thing. But again, that's somebody who's been doing the media manipulation game for two decades plus. Luca, which is literally his first summer ever, he's just like, oh, look, I'm on TV. It took LeBron going to Miami

and experiencing the backlash to really figure that out as well. He was always more of a polished character and personality. He was always, but he was definitely. more unvarnished. Less careful. Yes, less careful than after the Miami thing. But then that all comes around in the same way we saw with Kobe

where he was doing the fake Michael thing when he first came in, which was so fucking annoying. And then, you know, he got into all of that trouble. And then he came back on the other side of that of just like, the fuck you, Black Mamba, say whatever I want. You need a new PR strategy after that one.

You know what I mean? Like, it's, it's, part of the evolution, I think. Yeah. I just would like to know one anecdote about Luca Donjich. Like, I don't know anything about him personally. Like, just not like a, like, I work hard and I play well. It's like, I don't, I own a fucking

boa constrictor. I don't want to be... I think they're sick. I don't want to be... A lizard guy. I don't like how this is going to sound, but like I got a call that I could get Luca one-on-one

this summer. Okay. but I was unavailable. There was like nothing I could do. I was unavailable. Yeah. It would have been different than Tim and Malika. Oh. It's not disrespecting her.

She's one of the best people in our business. Okay. Me and Luca's interview is going to be different. You're like the Frost and the Frost Nixon. Yes. You're the guy to bring it on. It's going to be a little bit different. But to clarify, what's separating you from the people who did interview

Luca Donch, which is you did not make yourself available to interview one of the best basketball players in the world. I literally couldn't do it. But also, I was separating you. would have treated as as if Luca never talks to me again, I don't care. That's what the difference would have been. ESPN, like, they want to maintain a relationship with Luca. Group chat? Yeah.

It's a cool. I want to be able to throw a shot to his weight if he ever gets off the treadmill this season. I would have been, I would have asked some different questions. That's what I'll say. I would say your interview with Jared Allen was different than anyone he's ever had before. It's true. And we love you for it.

A one-of-one interviewer, truly. Justin, I would have loved to see a conversation between you and Luca, you know, two Jimbrose now, two guys who've been getting after it. I just want to see what you talk about. I want to see what those two minds have in common. That's right. Does he use dumbbells for his bench press? Unclear.

Bands. For all the details we know, we don't know those. That's true. The Metelf expose really didn't have much about anything except, what is it? He did have some AI generated fake facts. It did have that. Right. Well, no, he fasts, right?

He does fast. He fasts and eats a lot of protein. Anyway, Luca Dongeant's really good. Probably going to be the MVP. Honestly, even if he was just as good as he was as a Maverick, I think the Laker amplification machine will make it so clear how good he is that he will win. Yeah. Probably another guy on the short list in that running for MVP,

one Anthony Edwards. The Minnesota Timberwolves clock in at number six, last team on the docket for this episode. You know, I kind of had a. revelation as I was doing the rankings where I was like I was trying to find a team for my fifth spot basically I think the first four are pretty locked in we can get into that in the next episode then I was left searching for like who's that next team up and my inclination coming off of the off season was to ding the timber wolves just because they're in a broader sense

a lesser version of what they were last year they lost Nikilalexander walker sure big part of their defensive identity uh they pick nazreid essentially over bringing him back And so you want to think, like, maybe they won't have as much. But as I was talking my way into it, I'm just like, this team's just so rock solid. And I know it's like a kind of a blogger way of looking at this.

Like, I think Terrence Shannon or whoever fills those Nikiel minutes. Yeah. Like could, like, maybe solve who wins the West next season. I think it's as big as that. They're an awesome team. And they give Denver in particular fits. And so it's like, if you're this good and you have a potential, kind of inside matchup track on one of your, like some of your prime competition, you have to take

them super seriously. And you have every reason to think that Anthony Edwards is going to be a half step better, if not a full step better this season. And that maybe one of those young guys, maybe it's Shannon, maybe it's Jalen Clark, maybe it's Rob Dillingham. And we could, if you want to power rank, how confident you feel about those three guys, I think we're probably in alignment on Shannon being the most immediately promising of those three. Yes. But they do need them. Like they're going to need more contributions from them. not just replacing to kill Alexander Walker, but offsetting Mike Conley,

as much as it makes me feel like my bones are turning to dust, as I say it, getting older and less effective every year we go on. Yeah, it's funny because in the previous episodes, we've talked about the continuity and collective identity of the likes of Detroit and Orlando. When, like, Minnesota has that, but it's Western Conference Finals.

Yeah. Level. That's just what they do. Get to the Western Conference Finals. You know what I mean? Like, they've got. that continuity and identity of a team that's gone to deep playoff runs. And credibly, we can say their best player, his best NBA basketball is still yet to come.

So that's why there's still a fun and exciting team. And, you know, like, my thing is like they play well every postseason. Every playoffs, they do their thing. Yeah. even when they played Memphis as a way lower seed, and it's their first time in there, and it's Ann Edwards' first time, like, they drove Memphis to the brink in that series

and it just kept doing this every playoff. So, you know, they got my utmost respect. I don't know about Anthony Edwards having a post game now. He's just in the full superstar development cycle. You pick your path, but then you just follow the beats that every other star has already done. Is he working out with Olajwan?

Oh, I don't know if he added the Hakeem wrinkle, but he definitely, he's got a post game. Okay. Akeem really figured out, like, the best racket in the game. Oh, yeah. You know, really incredible stuff from him. Just personal training. Personal training, a little fee on the side.

Like, it's good work, you know? The pathway for Minnesota to be incrementally better is just, like, so easy. It's just Anthony Edwards playing another year healthy. And it's also JD McDaniels playing more, like the second half of the season than the first half. Like, that alone probably leads to a couple of ones.

And there's stuff on the fringes that they need to figure out, but it feels like more of a playoff, like long-term trajectory sort of conversation rather than will this be a really good regular season team. I don't know, but I think ultimately the question is like, are they the Buffalo

bills of the NBA where they keep making the Western Conference finals? Or, like, is there enough in-house to make a leap? And I think it's a lot the young guys, they're probably going to dictate that. Thank you for explaining that, because I don't know anything about the Buffalo Bills. That's so funny. They made it to four consecutive Super Bowls and lost all four.

Wow. It's brutal. That's fucked up. They almost won a couple, too. Or the first one, they definitely almost beat the Giants. The Giants, yeah. I mean, this team absolutely can be slightly better. I think the concern with the wolves is not, will those guys that you mentioned find ways to improve?

It's have teams like Denver because of their additions kind of leapfrogged Minnesota in the pecking order. Houston, who we're going to talk about a little later, like they're a little harder to suss out without Fred Van Fleet for the foreseeable future. But by adding Kevin Durand, to say nothing of, Doran Phine Smith, and these other pieces, have they kind of jumped over the wolves?

There's just more teams kind of at Minnesota's level that I think there's going to be more for them to figure out, but they do win these series. They do win these matchups. They have a lot going for them, and I think still a lot of reason for optimism. Also, we have them, sixth, right?

Mm-hmm. Like, in a hypothetical series where, like, you know, there were no conferences, like, would it be surprised if they beat the Knicks? No. Or the Cavs? No. Or Houston?

Or even Denver, who they'd just been mopping the fucking floor? Like, it's kind of crazy, right? When you really sit and think about the collective talent and what they've already achieved in meaningful basketball settings. So, yeah, man, I'm, Every year I'm excited to see what the wolves do. Not to mention just dissected the previous version of the Lakers too.

Yes. And so I think that's part of the reason why they get a slight edge over L.A. and these sorts of rankings. You just have to acknowledge the success that the wolves have had. And the fact that it is built on something so sustainable, two-way play, good quality bigs, aunt and Jaden and kind of, you know, the steadying hand of Mike Conley, Dante DiVincenzo, I think coming on even stronger could help them as well if he finds, you know,

taps into some parts of his game again. There's just a lot here that you can hang your hat on as being a really high level basketball. Yeah. Obviously, we talked about defense with the Lakers, though, and defense is a key part of the identity for Minnesota. They don't have Nikiel on the wing, and he was such a big part, especially of their playoff defense. I do find myself wondering, in retrospect, that decision, Nas versus Nau. Well, it wasn't really a decision. Kind of was.

Because of the bird rights situation, because they don't have Nikiel's bird rights, they can only offer him $8 million. So it's like you could tear your team down completely and say like preserve Nikol Alexander Walker. But really it's just like I think a sign and trade is kind of a win under the circumstance. Like doing anything because he was out the door. They just could they could not logistically pay him. They didn't ultimately fill the spot though. Because they're hoping to turn it over to some of the young guys. And I think that's a reasonable bet.

But I think that goes to the construction of their team. And like what makes them unique is to have all those bigs and have Nause be able to play with your center type of guys. But, like, you know, Nikiel is very valuable when you need to stick him on a playoff wing. Yeah, that's the thing. Like, he's not the kind of player where when you kick it out to him with it. You know, there's certainly these three and D types where the second they dribble, you're just like, no, no, no, stop.

Like, he's not that. Like, he could, you didn't feel like the Titanic was sinking when he was dribbling the rock. He made himself a reliable shooter. Obviously, the defense is there. I don't know that Terence, like, we know he's not going to be as good as Nikiel was last year this year. But, like, you know, reasonable facsimile paired with and elevated Anthony Edwards and, you know, just the guys being better at just being teammates. Yeah. The guys that are left, maybe that, you know, makes all the difference.

but I do think, you know, in terms of like, if you have the choose between Nasrid and the Kiel, the league being as perimeter oriented as it is, I might be inclined to be a Nikiel guy, to be honest. I think that's kind of the crux of the thing. Like, regardless of like the mechanics involved, they do need Nikiel Alexander Walker type players. Or Terran Shannon type players.

Like, they're not very similar in style, but if Terran Shannon can give them some energy and some juice, offensively in a way that's different from Nikiel, like that's a really useful thing for them to have. Yeah, played well in Summer League, which is also older. And so, like, presumably a little bit more ready

than perhaps someone like Rob Dillingham. I look at it as Shannon is the stabilizer of what they've already built, and Dillingham is the potential to be something different. And right now, different hasn't necessarily been good because he hasn't really been able to crack the rotation. And I don't know if he's been able to really distinguish himself enough about, like, what he would do on the floor

or how he would play off a band, in a way that would really meaningfully change that approach to him. I just, I don't know, is he going to be an on-ball guy and Ant plays off of him? Is he going to play off of Ant? And does he have the juice overall in order to earn those minutes when you assume the defense is going to be a sacrifice? He needs to hurry up and figure it out because Mike Conley is like, it's, bruh, we're putting a lot on this guy. At his age, with his mileage, like, somebody needs to step into that. role that's handling the ball that is more distributed.

And I think Julius Randall went a long way in carrying some of that burden and making himself into more of a pass first player on certain possessions. But like, they need a point guard that isn't my colleague to be able to create, especially when you have Rudy and another big on the floor with him. Like, for goodness sake, Rob Dillingham, step up. They need that Ninja Turtle meme of like splinter with this. young turtles and then the old turtles helping old mess or splinter. They need that from Rob Dillingham.

The full Ninja Turtle treatment. I assume Conley at the very least is coming off the bench now. And start Dante or start who? That would be the hope. Although, are you going to put that much trust in the ant kind of being more of a ball hand or are you just hoping that Julius does enough supplementary that, like, collectively we have enough in that first unit? I think that's kind of the trick of this team is like they actually do have a lot of

guards and they have a lot of bigs. And then there's Jaden McDaniels in the middle. And he's kind of like the pivot piece as far as making these combinations work. If you like, if you decided you wanted to lean bigger or smaller, but they could play Dante there. And I think it could work because Ant has that ball handling ability. And maybe Conley at this point is more impactful as a stabilizer off the bench than

he would be with that starting unit. I don't know. But like that's one of the big things they have to figure out is which guard combinations make the most sense to get Ant through the season, facilitate the development of these young players and prove that you can be like a rock solid playoff team yet again. How are you feeling about Julius Randall? You're two in Minnesota. I mean, he's earned my respect for sure in a way that I just wasn't anticipating because he went out of his way to kind of mold his game and its strengths around the guys that were

around him. Like back in the days, it kind of felt like Julius Randall was a blunt object. Whereas last year, especially in the playoffs, it felt like he was being more of a Swiss Army knife. Like what the occasion called for, he could bring the bear. And so I'm interested to see him doing even more of that. You know, like God only knows what else he's capable of doing if it's like, oh, like, I can apply myself to the team and be a contributing player that isn't just me getting buckets, dropping 25, right? It felt like back in the days Julius Randall had it in his head. if he wasn't dropped at 25, he wasn't being a contributing player. Whereas now, like, it feels like he is, like, better at screening.

He is better at facilitating. He is just straight up recognizing different matchup disadvantages and stuff. Or, like, even when some guys, they will gain an advantage, but they kicked it out because it's like, oh, like, the defense is committed. So it's like, oh, I can't put up a shot right now. Yeah. Like, the only play is the pass out. Whereas, like, last year it was like, no, he was doing things to cause a reaction by the defense and then make a move after that.

Like, this is a evolution in the guy's game. I'm like, look, I'm not saying he's, you know, like some all-time great. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying it was cool to see him, you know, basically sacrifice himself at the altar of the team, man. Like, that's cool to see. I mean, he has sick run. He surpassed even my wildest expectation. for what he would be as a Timberwolf.

And so with, you know, with Randall, there's always the question of year over year. Is it going to be the same thing? Oh, my God. Are we getting back into a cycle? There are always these highs and lows with you. It's just the way. And we even saw them within the playoffs.

Like there were some games in series where it's like, oh my God, he is the best player on the floor. And then some games where he was sort of defining what their ceiling is in a bad way. He bust LeBron James ass in the play. Straight up did it. Killed him.

That's a clip you could take with you to your grave. I just wonder, though, like, I think it's ultimately, going to come down to which version you get of him. Probably again, unless they make some big old move if they use Nasreed in order to get something else. I don't know if that's frightening

or encouraging, though. Yeah. Because you're right. I think it could swing either way without much notice in advance. He's paid up long term. Like... That limit motivation. The team committed to you. I was like,

you've gotten a taste of deep postseason run. You're playing with an incredible talent. Like, this is the best situation of his career. So, you know, let's see. Okay. Any other guys? Johann Baranget?

If Johan Baranget plays, things went real wrong. So, like, I, like, I support them taking their project to have on the back burner. Yeah. But there's a bunch of bigs here who need a lot of minutes. And Rudy? Like, look, I'm still, I'm still a Rudy guy. I still think he's critical to this team. Even I have questions about, like, what are their best looks against which a

And this is where the Nause thing is complicated because it's like, Nause is really important against the Nuggets, right? Like as much as you might have wanted to see them reallocate resources or even consider trade possibilities, it's like what makes them potent is their size. And for whatever reason, he's not a great defender in most other circumstances, but he just guards Yokic. He really does. And he spreads about. So it's like it makes Yokic's deficiencies even harder. to overcome. A lot of times these stretch bigs,

it's like how long is he actually going to be able to withstand the onslaught? But with Nas is like, oh, he's fine. And he's making Yokic's life hard on the other end. It is, you know, an interesting conundrum, but Julius, like, he's not really a center, you know? No. And Julius Randall, you just committed to.

So if you can sort of balance out, maybe some ball handling, maybe some wing help, by moving on from him, that's definitely something to consider. I worry that Nas contract's going to ultimately be pretty cumbersome on the back end. It's a lot of money for, like, your eighth most important player, seventh most. Do you think Nas is their seventh most important player? Nas is there four-fifths? He's still really good.

He's fifth. Randall Gobert. Sure. I would say Devinchenzo just because of what he, like the role that he serves. But Nas is so much better than Devin Chaz. I would say, he was last season. I think Devenchenzo on the next was pretty much. He was good.

I would say Jaden, Daniel, definitely because of the position, what he brings to bed defensively, like, all of that stuff. And then it's Nass to me live. Yeah, he's the fifth. I think he's the fifth. We'll give you a fifth. And here's the thing. Ultimately, the money tied up between those three bigs is a lot.

And I say that not because I... So much goddamn money. Get your money, but they have to manage this on a cap sheet with Randall and Gaubert and Nasreid making... 90 million combined. No, 85. No. I think it's 87.

90. Yeah, yeah. It's 87, 88. Yeah. Like, it's a lot of money. Arod's got to sell a lot of hot pockets in order to afford that. Come on, a couple more shark tank appearances. All right, why don't we end it there?

That's part, what is it, five. Preseason power rankings. One more to go, baby. We'll be back next time. Thank you to Victoria Valencia. thank you to Isaiah Blakely, the number one Terrence Shannon fan. And thank you to Ben Cruz.

We'll see you next time.