The Ringer NBA Show - Sorting Through All of the Madness From a Wild Regular-Season Finale | Group Chat

Episode Date: April 10, 2023

Justin, Rob, and Wos recap the wild final day of the NBA's regular season. They start with the altercation between Rudy Gobert and Kyle Anderson (8:51). Then, they discuss how all the seeding in the Western Conference shook out and who has the easiest path to the Finals. They preview all the play-in tournament matchups and who they expect to make the playoffs. They also talk about the contenders in each conference (38:32) before wrapping up with some coaching carousel news. Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny Lambre Producer: Isaiah Blakely Additional Production Supervision: Ben Cruz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I'm Derek Thompson, long-time writer with the Atlantic Magazine on tech, culture, and politics. There is a lot of noise out there, and my goal is to cut through the headlines, loud tweets, and hot takes in my new podcast, plain English. I'll talk to some of the smartest people I know to give you clear viewpoints and memorable takeaways. Plain English starts November 16th. Listen for free on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to this special weekend edition of group chat. I am Justin Barrier. and joining me after having to be separated in the locker room, Rob Mahoney, big Waz,

what's up, gentlemen? Was, I can't have you telling me to block a fucking shot. I just can't take that at this point in time. Especially not on a resurrection Sunday, y'all. That's just unconscionable. Shouts to all my people who had Passover get-togethers, those who are still celebrating Ramadan. But yeah, the Lord was risen today, guys.

And so was the NBA. Any Easter egg hunts for you, Was? No, I just got together with my L.A. family, just a bunch of friends, you know, because a lot of us at New York expats, we don't actually have real family here to hang out with on the holiday. So a bunch of friends got together, had some food. I limited myself to one glass of move. But, you know, we're feeling good. So far.

For what it's worth, I consider both of you my. family. This is what we have created here. This is what we have cultivated in the group chat. What is this, if not a family? Well, that's great because I consider you my Jesus. I don't know how the math on all that works, but whatever you say, Justin. Or at least John the Baptist. Come on now. Well, we typically don't come into your earbuds on a Sunday or maybe Monday if you're listening to this. But I have some breaking news here. Rob, do you want to hit the siren for us, actually? There we go.

Starting today, we are going to be coming to you live on Sundays throughout the playoffs. It's probably going to be a little bit earlier than this recording. This should probably go up late on Sunday. It will probably be midday on Sunday. So you got HBO to look forward to on Sunday every night, succession these days. You got Jesus. And then you got the group chat crew. What more can you ask for?

Those are the big three, right? Big three. Group chat, Jesus, and HBO Sundays. Absolutely. And Logan Roy, that's right. But we're coming to you today because today was the end of the regular season. I have to say, I was expecting this to be quite a dull afternoon of NBA basketball. The first, what was it, eight games on the schedule were atrocious because every single team was rest in players, whether it was for tanking purposes or for seating purposes.

The Nets and Sixers alone sat 16 regular players, including or not including Jaden, Springer, who played two minutes because he had just played so much in the G League. I was one of the few people to tune into the ESPN game between the Celtics and the Hawks. And they did not one, but two separate segments on Joe Missoula's juizitsu coach, just because that game was so bad. I was really expecting this to be a dull one. I mean, first of all, shout out to whoever did the work ahead on the jujitsu reporting. That's just good thinking.

You really got to, you know, cross your tease, dot your eyes. last game of the regular season. What happens if no one plays? I guess we'll have this stuff to fall back on. Can you clue us in for those of us who didn't watch that game? Like what's the deal with the Jiu Jitsu coach? Listen, it was ESPN proprietary reporting. I don't want to step on that.

But they did the typical like, oh, here's Juba Missoula's into Jizitsu, yada, yada, yada. And they showed the coach in the crowd. And it was like, okay, cool. That's nice little story. I'm sure the public watching will enjoy that. But then when they came back in the third. quarter and it was pretty much the Peyton Pritchard show. They got him for a sideline interview

in which he talked for at least five minutes. So if you ever had any interest in Juzitsu or Joe Missoula or those two things colliding ESPN on this Sunday Easter was your place for it. Well, there was a lot going on today in addition to that. You know, we had LeBron hit a dagger three to put away the jazz locking up the Lakers spot in the playing games. One of eight threes he hit today, by the way. we had the Warriors beaten the Blazers by 56 points on the road in Portland and in doing so they moved up from the 27th best point differential on the road this season all the way to 24th. Congrats to them.

Huge development for Golden State. You know, the Clippers took some heat for how like the seating stuff turned out for them in their game today. But also more importantly, Bowens Highland and Mason Plumley got into it on the bench. And I honestly don't know what those two would even fight about. So I would love to get the audio on that. Kenny Lofton Jr.

dropped 42 points on the Thunder. The Mavs gave up 42 points to the Spurs who were playing nobody. And oh yeah, Rudy Gober and Kyle Anderson got into a fight in the middle of the Wolf's Bench and it became a gigantic story as you're saying just in a day that I think a lot of us were just kind of penciling

and as being okay, like we're going to move the pieces around for seeding reasons and not expecting quite this much intrigue. You know what's interesting about that that Joe Missoula jujitsu coach is like, that's like the... The most important story, yeah. Yeah, no, but what I mean is, like, that's like the human interest version of Mark Madsen

taking pull-up threes in April games, right? Like, we used to get so much more of that. I think that's what I've noticed the most about this last, these last two or three nights of regular season basketball in the NBA. This playing game stuff makes it so a lot of teams have stakes. And we see way less of that when you combine the play. playing game plus the new lottery structure with the odds, right? And so we get a lot less of just unconscionable basketball back in the days.

This was like a fringe sort of NBA nerd subject where like teams that were sort of positioning themselves for the lottery would play weird people at point guard and center. It would just get nasty at a certain point. It's just a lot less of that now, which is also cool. There's definitely some of that. I thought it was odd in particular because the NBA sent out a tersely worded report, or at least I think it was a quote from Mike Bass, who's head of PR there, about the MAVs tanking just because they kind of said the quiet part out loud about resting some other guys. And I guess the MAVs

are in air quotes under investigation. And yet on Sunday, literally every team tanked, except for like maybe four or so, including the MAVs who did literally nothing to change anything that they were doing even though the NBA kind of put the fear of God in them, I guess. Well, this is another little wrinkle as far as the NBA being so involved in the betting markets these days. How do you, like, on the one hand, you know, we have this conversation about load management all the time. And like how transparent teams need to be with this stuff vis-a-vis. There's now an incredible amount of like league sanctioned money on the line going into these games. Wouldn't it behoove that relationship if teams like,

teams like the Mavs were open about what is happening versus not open about what is happening. Like I'm all for, you know, keeping this above, like, beyond a certain pale, so to speak. And, like, you know, we all want this to be done tastefully. But at the same time, like, what are we doing punishing teams for things that so many teams are doing, effectively? Am I a bad guy for not caring about the people

who want to gamble on April basketball? Like, to me, that just means you don't care about your money that much. if you're doing something that incredibly stupid because you never know who's actually gonna play. And teams fortunes sort of turn on a dime. It was like a week and a half ago with the Mavs were legitimately playing to put themselves in the plan. And just like that, they make a strategic decision

to be like, no, we're gonna position ourselves for better ping pong balls. Yep. But let's talk about the one team that actually, or the two teams that actually did play all of their guys and actually had an actual NBA game. That's the wolves and the pelicans. I'm calling this one Punches Gate because this one devolved pretty quickly.

It looked like Brandon Ingram was just going to just run the wolves off the court. And then Rudy Gobert took a swing, I guess you would call it a swing at Kyle Anderson on the bench. He definitely like lunged forward, but he missed entirely as Rudy Goeber is want to do. And kind of like, he grazed like his shoulder,

is what I saw. Am I looking at the Saprudeville? incorrectly. You're the fight expert here, Rob. That is what they say. I mean, I thought he maybe pulled it a little bit, but I thought he made contact.

Yeah. I thought he kind of got what he was. No, no, no, no. He ended up hitting him in kind of like the shoulder. I kind of thought that's what he was going for. It was like, I want to punch this guy, but I don't want to punch him in the face. And then Midway kind of got caught, just like between a layup and a dunk and ended up between, you know, kind of punching him in the shoulder instead.

At the same time, respect to Rudy for using his reach. You know, he was like, I don't need to get inside of this guy to make contact. I can land shots from distance and, you know, scurry away from that thing really quickly. So shout to Rudy for being a seasoned vet with the jab game. We've already seen the reports trickle out as far as like what was said that led to this, what happened after the fact. I'm also hoping, look, the ringer's own Austin Rivers was like three, feet away from Rudy Gobert.

I'm hoping we can get a download on what happened here. We'll hope we can get some in the huddle perspective because I, we've seen a lot of things on NBA courts and NBA huddles, two teammates going at it like this in a game of this magnitude with this level of visibility and this level of like immediate accountability. Rudy Gobert did not return to this game. They kicked him up out of the building. They sent him home, the reporting said. I don't know that I've ever seen that before.

Yeah, it's weird because. We have so many, like, shoving matches these days. A lot of, like, hold me back, hold me back sort of kerfuffles on the court. And the one time someone actually throws a punch and potentially even hits someone is between his two teammates on the bench. Yeah, apparently it trickled back into the locker room. Things were said. Rudy goes out. The crazy thing is it almost galvanized the wolves who storm back in this game and actually won it.

What did you think about this one? Could you see the just maybe the testosterone level spike after the showdown on the bench? Or what do you think happened? I mean, to me, it's like these guys really care about this. Like, they really care about this result. They really want to be in the playoffs. They really want to, you know, they were really fighting for their position. And sometimes in the heat of battle, these things happen.

And I'm not surprised that it galvanized these guys to go even harder and play harder when the adrenaline is pumping in the way that it was. So, you know, to me that just means these guys really want to play. You know, KG put out the tweet where he's like, you know, this is just good, this is just good energy before the playoffs. This is great. Which, of course, you know, somebody like KG is always going to believe in the idea of high tension, high adrenaline, and, you know, its ability to boost your play.

So I don't know. I feel like Rudy Gobert is. Son of a bitch. I feel like Rudy Gobert is, is, he hasn't seemed to be the most likable teammate throughout his career. It just doesn't feel like guys respond to Rudy's brand of teamating. So I don't know that this is, you know, too big a surprise, but we should take too much out of it.

It feels like everywhere Rudy Gobert goes, people sort of roll their eyes at him. Yeah, it's a complicated thing to parse because on the one hand, Rudy Gobert is a veteran guy the wolves brought in to help professionalize the group that they had to help escalate what they were doing both on the court but also just like as a locker room as a unit. The idea that your veteran is the guy taking punches at another veteran on your team. Not a good look under these circumstances. Not good for the locker room for the culture of the team, obviously.

The question now becomes, what do you do with that? Does Rudy Gober gets suspended for your playing game against the Lakers, which would be a dramatic turn of events? And even if he doesn't, does putting this out there in front of all the world to see and not just the punch, but now all the reporting, now all the digging that's going to come, like, has this exposed the kind of rot within the wolves where even if you don't or do or don't suspend him, no matter what you choose to do, you can't just put all that back in the box. I think it's, well, we should mention Rudy Gobert has already tweeted out an apology. There's been a bunch of stuff that came out. I don't know if this is the type of thing they can get over with. Ironically enough,

Mike Conley is the one playing peacemaker, as he always is. I'm sure he did this a lot in Utah with Rudy Gober. Just another feather in the cap of Conley and a reason to trade for him and not go bear, and we don't have to rehash that situation. But, I mean, it does sound like there was leaked audio from the locker room. There was the B word thrown around,

which seems to be the one no-no when you get into fights about this stuff. But there was what seemed to be Kyle Anderson in recording and saying, like, we need to figure this out this summer. I don't know what he's alluding to because Rurie Gobert has like millions, zillions of dollars and years left on his contract. I'm sure he would probably be the one not picked up in that situation, if only because they can't choose to move Gobert. But I think the bigger issue here is that in addition to that punch throne,

there was also one thrown by one Jaden McDaniels against a wall, which ended up breaking his hand, which meant he wasn't there. for the second half of the game. And I mean, I'm no doctor, but I think a broken hand might sideline him for, if not a couple of weeks, then the entirety of the wolves posties run here. That's tough.

A young guy, their best perimeter defender, especially, you know, a most niceman aunt sort of doesn't feel like doing it. This is, I don't, there's no interpretation of this that isn't. This is unacceptable, inexcusable, boneheadedness.

How could you do this at this part of the season when you're this integral to what the team does and your potential success going forward? I mean, he's a young guy. You know, obviously I think he's going to learn from this, but that is, that is tough, bro. Break your hand punching a wall, bro? Wall don't punch back.

And out of, if I'm understanding the context of what happened, I mean, there could always be something else that's frustrating him. It seemed like he was really frustrated by picking up his third foul and leaving the game. And, like, frustrated with what was happening in the situation. And yeah, he could be out the rest of the way. Like, very much shades of Amari Stadamire punching a fire extinguisher and breaking his hand. Like, you have to be careful in those moments. You cannot let this frustration boil over in either of these ways.

Punching teammates, punching the wall, punching literally anything when your hands of your livelihood. Pretty dangerous business, to say the least. and yet the wolves win this game without Gobert, without McDaniels coming back, without Nas Reid, who's still out with injury and will be out with injury, I did think it was like, you know, not to give Kevin Garnett credit,

but this is a wolf's team that does need a little tension sometimes and does need a kick in the ass sometimes, does need a wake-up call sometimes. And you have to wonder if maybe there was some of that in the mix for this game. And in particular, the plays the wolves got from Anthony Edwards,

after all this happened. I mean, just two of the best plays you probably have saw all NBA season. One, he basically did like the MJ switching hands layup, except it was on an offensive rebound all in midair. Insane. And secondly, C.J. McCollum had what I would have sworn to you was a dunk. He had it. And Edwards rotated over from the weak side and just ripped it out of his hands.

The kind of play was, you're absolutely right about Anthony Edwards, like does not necessarily care to be at all defense level focus all the time. All the time. Just not really where his priorities are necessarily. And it happens with a lot of young guys in that way. But he has these plays in him. And he has all world, offensive, defensive, like big game moment plays. And that's why the wolves believe in him.

That's why everyone who sees him can see him and say, that guy's got it. He's got something that even these other stars, even these other young, young prospects, even these other guys who we love their games or love what they do, they don't have it. They don't have the ability to do what Anthony Edwards did in this game. Yeah, Edwards also had the steal on Brandon Ingram where he just picked his pocket. And like maybe that was being galvanized by whatever happened on the bench and with McDaniels going out. It's also just Edwards. And it was Edwards without perhaps having any Biggs really just saddled in the pain. It was really just an open court and he really just made place. And now Edwards is the type of

player who will probably do as many boneheaded things as he will amazing things. There's at one point where he just airballed a three. He turned it over a ridiculous amount of time. So he's definitely not fully formed at this point, but good God, some of the plays that he did. He basically just ran the Pels off the court themselves. And they were already in the midst of an amazing game from Brandon Ingram. They kind of just snuffed that out. And Edwards was a big reason why Engram was flustered most of that second half. Yeah. And the thing is the ways that the wolves have been failing season long, as Rob mentioned, are these mental things. Just straight up miscommunications, blown assignments,

just not being in spots that you are drilled to be in in your scheme. And so to watch them in the second half just up the intensity and these high effort, like you mentioned, it's not just that he's coming to block, that he's blocking a CJ shot, is that he's a rotating defender. You know, like this is the defense playing on a string as his design, and he's there.

Not only is he there because he's a mega athlete, he's making this incredible play. And so that's encouraging to see, right? It's always disappointing when, you know, even for us, as much as we do this, it's like, guys, y'all get paid a lot of money to do this shit. At least y'all could try your best, you know? So it's always disappointing when that doesn't happen.

So to see them actually do that in the second half after the Rudy punch or swing or whatever we're calling it is nice. Because this is a team that I certainly had high hopes for coming into the season. And I think, you know, a lot of people did. Yeah, I certainly did too. And I think not only are plays like that nice to see and good to see for Edwards' development and the player he can be and kind of where he is at the stage in the season, this was an essential game for the Wolves.

Like to set the stakes of what was happening here, like getting into the seven eight game, the seven, eight game part of the seating bracket of the play in bracket versus the nine, ten. Minnesota is a team that will blow opportunities that will blow leads, even when they're fully healthy, even when they have all their guys, even when they aren't imploding in the middle of a huddle. Like, they just do make those mistakes you're talking about was. And so the idea that they're going to at least get two chances to play their way into the

playoffs now versus one do or die game in, or I guess two do or die games, really, is huge for anyone, but especially a team that runs as hot and cold as Minnesota has basically all season. Yeah. So in the other game going on simultaneously, the Clippers ended up beating the Suns, there was this odd situation going where the Clippers could have either played to win this game and potentially vaulted in the standings, or had they lost, there was a potential of dipping into the play-in game And so the one good thing that the NBA did for this final day of the regular season was basically run all of the conference

just competition all these games happen simultaneously. So you couldn't really scoreboard watch. But so but there were a lot of people on Twitter and I would assume a lot of people in the front office of these teams and potentially even on the benches who were probably trying to do that.

At one point, the Pels were up so much, and I wonder if that affected what the clippers were doing. And then things flipped very quickly. At one point after the second half, the clippers just went on a huge run. You wonder if the Sons were intentionally trying to take in order to get the clippers as opposed to the Warriors. It was like kind of madness, but it was actually really fun. Like, if you knew what was going on, it was great to watch. Ultimately, the clippers won by five points. Rob, do you think that was in their best interest?

Because a lot of people on Twitter, including our friend Haralabob, was pretty critical of the Clippers' decision to go for this or in air quotes, go for this as much as they did. I cannot in good faith or good conscience sit here and tell you that playing the Phoenix Suns in the first round is in your best interest. I don't think that's in anyone's best interest. That said, there are some things you just don't mess with. And if we're talking about, like, can we slide up and down the standings a bit

to get our preferred matchup, who in this case, basically what we're talking about is would you rather play the Sons or would you rather take a bigger risk and either play the kings in the first round or potentially fall into the play-in bracket? I don't think you mess with the plan

if you're the Clippers. I don't think you want any part of that. If you have a chance to lock in your playoff spot, I think you have to do it. The Clippers are not a team. You can just say, like, oh, we absolutely trust ourselves to get through these playing games.

First of all, the reason why, and listen, I rarely go against our good friend Haralabab. The reason why I wouldn't, I don't necessarily feel that way is watching KD's cook his ankle in a layup line. Like, how do you leave your chances to fate that way? You know, like anything could happen to Kauai Leonard. Paul George is out already. He's probably not going to play in the entire first round. And so you're saying like, yeah, let's just leave it to the playing. Nah, I don't, I don't like that as an idea.

What happened last playing? Paul George got COVID and the clippers were sent packing by the Pelicans. Like after that, there's no way I'm going anywhere near the playing. So I don't really fault them for that. So this is where we ended up with the play in. The East, which was been pretty much foretold for what seems to be years at this point. You have the heat versus the Hawks and the 7-8. You have the Raptors and the Bulls in the 9-10.

Then you have Lakers, Wolf, 7-8, Pelicans, Thunder in the 9-10. And just for a refresher, the 7-8 plays one game. The winner goes on gets the 7-seed. The loser of that matchup then plays the winner of the 9-10. I've literally had to been told this like 90 times. Yeah, same. If I got the wrong, let me know. But I think I finally, after three years, have this right.

Just to check the box, anything in the, in the east that jumps out to you guys? Or is this going to be the most boring playing as it typically is? I mean, if you talk to guys like Bill and the great Mike, sure, the Celtics should be deathly afraid of playing Miami for some reason. I don't necessarily believe that. I think Miami's half-court offense is just an abomination. And it's not going to happen for them in the playoffs.

But that's about the only thing that I could see because the bucks are going to scrape the freaking floor with anybody who comes out of this group. So I don't, you know, especially the Bulls. I mean, come on. I just don't, I don't see anything interesting beyond that. I don't think the Hawks are a threat to give anybody any real problems. And so, yeah, it's just Miami and Boston, who for whatever reason have had, you know, tough matchups against each other over the years.

Yeah. Bucks Bulls, we've seen that dance before. I'm honestly good. You can keep it. On the other hand, Bucks Raptors, which is a very possible matchup

at this point. So, you know, the Raptors do have to play their way through two of these games to get that spot. I mean, the Raptors play the Bucks pretty tough. They jam things up pretty well.

Like, they do maneuver and make life really hard for Yannis. If I'm Milwaukee, and I'm thinking about like, I could play Atlanta in the first round or I could play Toronto. in the first round or I could play Chicago in the first round potentially. I'm going to give the heat the benefit of the doubt personally.

I think they're going to be in that seven spot. I mean, one of those options is much worse than the other two. Like Toronto is by far the least appealing of those possibilities. So do you guys like Toronto more than Elena coming out of that second matchup, assuming the heat win the first one? I do. How do you feel about that, Was? It's tough because I, you know, I've, as much as I love the guys on the They're just not going to score.

They're not going to score at all, right? I think Atlanta has the potential to get pretty competent to even like sometimes kind of good defense. And their offensive ceiling is so much higher than the Raptors, potentially anyway. And so that's why I think I lean Hawks in that way because I just can't see the Raptors threatening this Bucks team. the way these guys can protect the paint and just be like, all right, Scotty and OG

and the rest of you guys, shoot some jump shots and kill us that way. I don't know. I think that's a bad matchup. I mean, there would be some things that would have to swing in their favor in a matchup like that. Fred is going to have to continue to be as good as he's been.

They're going to need like a hot Gary Trent Jr. game. Some of those things are going to have to work out, but Toronto's offense lately hasn't been that bad. I felt like pretty good about where they've been these last like four to six weeks or so overall as a team. Like it's it's not a surprise that we're talking about them now, a team that I think a little while ago you could have just written out of the playoff picture entirely that looked to be in such a bad way,

especially before the trade deadline. We thought they were going to trade in all of these guys. That's not what I'm saying like they've really kind of put something together here. And I think they've put something together in a way where if you're talking about which of these teams has enough momentum and has enough going on to be at least a problem in the first round, supposing they can make it there. it's Toronto and Miami. And I think there's a pretty big drop

before you get to Atlanta and Chicago. Yeah. Jacob Perter, the, uh, Perker, Jacob Perthal, the, uh, stabilizer.

Do you say Jacob Perdu? I thought he said Jacob Proverb because he's the Sunday. Oh. God bless, Justin. Jacob Pertil, uh, is the stabilizer on that team. See,

all that work and the, the joke wasn't even that funny. That's great. Um, I think my only issue with Toronto is it feels like they would be more in the advantage if they were playing a longer series where they could really grind on an opponent like the Hawks, whereas the Hawks seem like built for this one game sample, where if Trey Young just goes off for 40 or whatever it is, just is dancing and is just talking shit to

people, that's really the way that they thrived in the 2021 postseason. And I can see Elie's happening again in the play. And so I would bet on the heat in the Hawks, especially now that Udana's Haslam is just jacking it for three, you know, now they have that. like ace in the hole there. But yeah, I would bet Heat and Hawks. And it sounds like you guys might be too. Yeah, easily. Those are my picks.

And it's funny because I'm looking at the matchups. And I feel like the Sixers have the easiest matchup of the first round in the Eastern Conference. So they're blessed in that way that they get to play the Nets. And they'll be completely fine. But yeah, I don't, I like the Raptors, man. I really do. All of these guys on a different team that has established superstars would be incredible teammates.

Like, we're talking about first-rate role players all up and down that roster. However, as a whole, I'm, you know, I can't get excited about it. I mean, it's not ideal. You know, they're not contending for a reason. And I take your point, Justin, about the Hawks being tailor-made for these kinds of games. I mean, we saw it exactly in this scenario last year when they beat the Cavs to get into the playoffs. I'm still taking the Raptors.

I think they have a shot. And Miami to me is a walk-in. I think that is going to be. That's chalk. Nick Nurse stand over here. I would not say that. I'm not sure. Is Nick Nurse to stand anymore?

The Toronto Raptors is Nick Nurse stands anymore. When I tell you, the Nick Nurse Hive went from, whoa, this guy might be the best coach in the league to whom. I don't know about this guy. That's the fastest of. seen ever since Ty Lou went to that's even faster to Ty Lou Vince Lombardi comparisons

weren't you the ones given those I was I absolutely was that's how I know yeah right in the west side we have Lakers wolves Pelicans Thunder Rob who do you like in these matchups it's hard to pick against the Lakers

under these circumstances right if the wolves had been full strength and looked great in this Pelicans game and I think there's parts of it in which they did look very good, even under the circumstances, you still probably would have picked the Lakers. And so now that Rudy Gaubert may or may not play, Jada McDaniels almost certainly will not play,

they're already out Nas Reid, as we mentioned, in a game where you probably would really want Nas Reid to stand up to some of the Lakers' bigs and to just give us some resistance to AD in particular. The Lakers feel like an easy end. Beyond that, man, it gets messy. And you know what? The Pelicans have me back again.

Oh, Lord. I'm kind of back on the hook a little bit. I think I agree. Yeah. It's crazy that we got here. How many weeks ago was it that we were trying to figure out? We were like power ranking all the teams in the conference, like from bottom to top. And like our faith in them, our faith in the Pelicans at that point was completely shattered.

We just could not trust them to do literally anything on a basketball. I thought this would be Dallas in this spot rather than the Pelicans at this point. They were just playing so horribly. I think some of you had them lower than the Jazz even. I think so. I mean, to be fair, if the Jazz had been interested in this spot, the Jazz could have made this spot. But I think what wins us over with the Pelicans,

who were nine and two coming into this game today, now nine and three during that stretch. During that stretch, Brandon Ingram, as you mentioned Justin, great, not only today, over that stretch, 29 points a game, eight and a half assists a game, 6.8 rebounds on some insane shooting splits.

Trey Murphy has been phenomenal for them too. Like them getting some of that stabilizing offense from Ingram has been so huge. You know, his ability to curl into mid-range shots to create and spin into good stuff out of nothing out of just like thin air, ISO situations, I think is really stabilized and otherwise very up and down team.

And that's not always going to be the case. there are going to be times where they struggle. But when we're talking about a Thunder team that is kind of run out of steam a little bit coming over the finish line, and they haven't been playing all their guys in some of these games, so some that's to be expected,

or a Timberwolf's team where we just kind of talked about the reasons we can't necessarily trust them on a nightly basis and the fact that we don't know if one of their best and most important players is even going to play, and we do know that Jade McDaniels, another of the most important players,

is definitely not going to play. It's just really hard to believe in that. It's really hard for me to say to anyone, to you guys or any of our listeners, you should be buying Wolf's stock at this point in time when their guys were just getting into it in the middle of a huddle.

Yeah, I actually like the Thunder and it's really as simple as I feel like SGA is the best player on the three teams we just talked about, the wolves, pelicans, and thunder. And he just watched him all season when he's wanted to

just completely take over games and dominate them. just getting to wherever he wanted, eliciting double teams. And guys have just started doing the Steph Dame Lillard, hard double against this guy. He's been so dominant in certain spots. And so I think he has the ability to take over. And I've seen him do it the most this season.

And so I think in a big spot like this, and he really wants it too. I really do think it'll be the Thunder and the Lakers ultimately making it to the real playoffs. I want to believe in the Thunder. You know I believe in the Thunder long term. But man, some of these late season games where they're just like vomiting against like the Pacers

and the Hornets and some of those games were without SGA who's really been the stabilizing force. So basically booing a lot of these younger players still really trying to find their footing in the NBA. It's just like there's just enough shakingness there just overall and then toward the end of the season that I'm not as bullish as I. this play in about the thunder.

And even after watching the wolves pretty much blow the pelicans off the court in the second half of today's game, I kind of agree with Rob, man. Like the pelicans have Ingram, who has just been phenomenal over the past couple of weeks. I mean, if he had played like this and been healthy over the course of the season, I think he's easily, what, third team, all NBA, or at least in the mix for something like that. Before they took off on this nine and three, nine and two run, as Rob mentioned, he was playing horribly. He was. While when he first

came back, he wasn't cooking. And now that he is, the team the team's fortune has turned around. It's dope to see. They look more like the team that we saw to end last season and carried that into the playoffs. There's more of a verve there. They only hit three threes

today, which is just an extreme outlier. You'd expect all of the guys that they have. They have so many shooters on this team now, especially train Murphy. The one like, like worry I have is if you ever get into a situation like you are today and you have to rely on CJ McCollum, McCollum has just been really iffy this entire season.

I was not a big fan of that extension when they signed it to him. I mean, I guess maybe he would look different as Zion had been there all season. He wouldn't be relied on as much. But like, man, he's just kind of fallen into the background where he's essentially a supporting player. And it's really the Ingram and occasionally Trey Murphy show or the Valenciennes show.

And if they do get into a situation like today where Edwards kind of gets, into Ingram, I do wonder, like, who's that guy stepping up for them. But overall, I do like the Pelicans and the Lakers in this one. I mean, it would be fun to see these teams run it back. If the Pelicans and the Wolves get a chance to play again for a playoff spot on the line, especially with those dynamics that were laying out. And maybe in particular, if Rudy Gobert doesn't play.

Because then you have, like, how much do you play Valenciunis versus how much do you go small and smaller and play Nance? We saw in this game that the wolves, you know, once, once Gobert was out, obviously you of Towns. We probably didn't talk about enough on the top, honestly. Like, he had a huge game, too, not only hitting, like,

a stretch of incredible and incredibly important threes and shots overall in this game, but playing through foul trouble when he had five and staying in the game under these circumstances, it was huge, great game by Towns.

But when Towns was out, the Wolves basically just said, okay, I guess Kyle Anderson is going to be our five. Like, under the circumstances, that's what we've got. And so they're playing pretty small there. And how, like,

how that matchup would work out, I would be very curious to see. Again, supposing Gobert doesn't play. Obviously, the best case scenario is that he does, and the wolves look full and complete and can kind of roll into the playoffs on their own terms. We'll see if they have that in them. You know what I love about this playing, though?

Because once the Lakers, as presumably win, like, there is kind of a little showdown of like who's like the next up-and-coming guy that's going to happen. It's almost like a junior division show-off before the big boy playoffs begin, where it's like, oh, is it Edwards? Or is it SGA? Or is it Ingram or is it SGA? And there's a little like clash.

And I love to see it on this stage, which we didn't have before the play in. And so it's almost like a warm up. It's an amuse, bouch, if you will, of some of the bigger names superstars that are going to clash in the big boy playoffs. I like that. This is fun. It is fun. And there's some potential for chaos too. Like, if the Lakers lose their first playing game.

Did you guys watch that freaking jazz game the other night? It was just like they give up a 10 point. lead without turning the ball over or bricking any free throws somehow. Like, this is, I call them the best sitcom on TV. And so, you know, as much as I think they're the best of this group, you certainly can't just pencil them into the next round. Like, that's just, that hasn't been the reality for this team all season. Why don't we flip over now to the big boy playoffs?

Should I list off all the matchups here to begin? with? Would that be helpful? Yeah. Yeah, what do we have? Okay. So in the east, we have the Bucks as the one seed against TBD. We have the Celtics at two against TBD based on the play-in. Three-six is Sixers Nets, four, five, calves, nicks, and in the West, Nuggets, TBD, Grizzlies at the two-seed, also TBD. Then we have the Kings and Warriors in the three-six matchup, Sons, Clippers, four, five. Um, waz, out of all of these matchups, what's the one you're most excited to probably the Cavs and Nicks. I'm excited to watch playoff basketball at the Garden for one.

I would be more excited about the Clipper series if they were whole, right? If they actually had all of their guys, that would clearly be the most intriguing of the series. Cavs and Nicks because of Garden Playoff Basketball, and in a close second is Warriors Kings, because I think that's going to be pretty competitive. And there is this sort of little brother component up there in the Bay area with, you know, the Kings and the Warriors and Vivek, like people who've done great reporting around the kind of thinking Vivek does. He's just been trying to copy everything the Warriors do at every single turn.

And so the fact that they'll be, you know, hosting these playoff games in Sacramento And it's going to be incredible crowds, like insane, rapid crowds. So for me, that's the second best. But I'm looking forward to Cavs Nicks, even though I think the NICs are probably going to lose in five games. I think it'll still be pretty fun. If we're thinking about this from the King's perspective, and I'm of the opinion that the Kings, I think they do have a real shot to beat the Warriors. I think they're probably going to be whether you're looking at, like, quote, unquote, expert predictions,

whether you're looking at the betting lines. I'm going to imagine that the warriors are favored in some of those situations, maybe even overwhelmingly so in some cases. I think the kings have a real shot. And yet, I'm also wondering if they too would rather have played the clippers, just like the clippers would probably have rather played the kings.

Like, I'm thinking about that match. Yeah, or certainly the pelicans versus those two alternatives. And so, like, it is a bit of a tough fur draw for the kings than it necessarily had to be. and I think you could kind of say the same in their own way for the Sons, right? Like, no matter what was going to happen in this range, three, four,

like you're playing against the warriors who are kind of rounding into form, who have a championship pedigree, who know how to play together, who have Steph, may or may not have Andrew Wiggins back, or you're playing against this wild card clippers team that has Kauai Leonard,

that may or may not have Paul George for some part of the series, TBD, I guess we'll see kind of what he's available for or not. But I'm looking at like Phoenix, what Phoenix's draw is now. And right, first round series, Suns Clippers, I'm signing up for that. That sounds great.

We'd love to see, like, some of the elite scores and the elite wings of the league go at each other. That sounds like a fun time. But if you're the Sons, your path is now. You have to beat the Clippers

with Paul George, again, TBD. Then you have to beat, presumably the Nuggets, who are either the favorites or the co-favorites in the conference. And then you have to beat a team that, at that point, once you get,

get to the conference finals, it's either the warriors who really look like the Warriors or the Grizzlies who have proven a lot and really come into their own, right? You're like, facing a team and the conference finals at that point that will have proven so much that they are going to be credible. They are

going to be a tough out. Do we think Phoenix can run that kind of gauntlet? That is a tough run of teams to play against. I absolutely do not. I'm not a believer in this son's thing the way people are. People have kind of been like, and I think it's because nobody really believes in the Grizzlies or Nuggets

as like these stalwart one and two seeds, right? And so I think a lot of people just feel like the sons have the most talent and so therefore they're going to beat everybody. I just don't think so. I think they're going to have a rough go of it. And I don't think they're going to the finals. Quite frankly, I'd be shocked if they made it to the conference finals. I would be very surprised if they beat the Nuggets in round two. See, I would actually... I would look at this more from the Nuggets perspective and be like, man, this bracket really broke shittily for us.

Because let's say the Suns just trounce the Clippers. They got out of that four or five matchup. Paul George doesn't play. Then you have potentially the best player in the Western Conference coming at you in the second round. You're not waiting until the West Finals. You're getting him then. And then you're going to have to play someone else just to get to the finals.

Or let's say the Clippers get out of there. Well, that's more time for. for Paul George to get back into the form? What if the clippers beat the Sons? And all of a sudden, they're fully healthy with their entire lineup that we've been predicting to make the finals for what, like 20 years at this point? And so, like, man, if I'm the Nuggets, I feel awful, but I have to face one of those teams in the second round.

I am a believer in the Sons, but I know logically that it's going to be tougher. There's a stat I saw today that the Sons with Kevin Durant played as a big three. So that's Durant. Chris Paul, Devin Booker. Eight games this regular season. You know how many games the James Hardin, Kari Irving, Kevin Durant, Big Three played before the playoffs?

Eight games. And they lost to the bucks, as we all remember. So, I mean, that could have gone one way or another. It was the whole foot thing, like, on the line, you know, the Nets played really well in that postseason despite the injuries. But I think this is what they're up against.

injuries could affect a team that's so shallow like the Suns. And also just not having the continuity of playing with Kevin Durant, even for post-dedeline, like 15 games. You have eight games to figure this out. So it is going to be tougher for Phoenix, but I do like the talent. It's really tough to just overlook that. To me, I see it differently.

I feel like the Grizzlies present a tougher matchup for the nuggets in a sense that they're going to out physical athleticism, them. They want to get in the paint. the nuggets are not going to be some great paint protection team under any circumstances. And so, you know, trying to keep Jama rant out of the lane is going to be a problem for them specifically. And I think you'd just much rather play a freaking long too happy-ass team. I just really do feel that way.

I think you'd rather play the Sons if your defense isn't as reliable, right? Like, because the sons are going to take a bunch of mid-range jump shots. The three guys doing it are three of the best we've ever seen at it. Yes, I understand that. But just mathematically, I think that's better than guys that are trying to get layups and offensive rebound me, bludging me to death in the paint, right? And so I just think I'm not, I wouldn't be so afraid of that son's matchup. I get that everybody thinks there's some juggernaut right now.

I just don't see it that way. not just the continuity stuff, but just the style of play. So the suns are screwed, the nuggets are screwed, the grizzlies inherit the earth, is what we're circling around. Kings and five in the West finals.

I will say, while we're talking about series we're looking forward to, supposing that the Lakers do get in, I think if the Lakers end up playing the Nuggets, I think they get crushed. I think the Nuggets win that series in five. If the Lakers played the Grizzlies,

and it's been reported that Stephen Adams is going to be out for the foreseeable future, man, I would love to see that Jaron Jackson Jr. AD matchup. Like that, that sounds like some really juicy first round stuff. Not to mention all of the animosity between those teams.

Obviously, the sideline-related history between those two teams. Sweater-gates. You're just gating everything today, and I'm not, I don't appreciate it. If you're a Lakers fan, you show up to that first home game between the Grizzlies and the Lakers wearing your best Christmas sweater. Like that is what you have to do. Everyone needs to be packed. I don't care that it's been 80 degrees

in L.A. in the past couple days. That's what you do for that one. But like, man, I think the bracket kind of broke nicely for the Lakers if they do win that first game. Like the Grizzlies, yeah, they've been through the fire sort of in the playoffs. But we saw them last year kind of tip over against the Warriors, a team that kind of been there. And I do wonder if the institutional knowledge and just having the days of rest in between so that LeBron can visit the LeBron James of Feet every once in a while. Like, I can't stop myself from like wondering how far the Lakers can go in this in this playoffs, man. Is that a return visit situation?

Do you need like a punch card for the LeBron James of Feet? You don't pay for the return visit. It's just a checkup. But, you know, every top of the month. Yeah, you have to settle up. Well, as long as it's covered. but if you're the Lakers, so you have the Grizzlies, I'm not going to overlook that series.

Highly likely that the Grizzlies come out of there. But let's say you get out of there, then you have the Kings or you have the Warriors still trying to figure things out with working Andrew Wiggins back in. I don't know, man. The very least there's a pathway for the Lakers to make it to the West finals. Stop doing this. Stop, stop getting Lakers fans riled up.

Look, they're nice. They're going to be fun. They're going to be fun in the playoffs. I just don't see how you can have any expectations for this Laker team. I just don't see it, guys. Because, like, we can easily see them just losing two games in a row. That's not hard for me to imagine. So the idea that this team's going to go to, like, the second and third round.

Like, and they can't win do or die games. Like, I don't have the supreme confidence that they could win do or die games against the pelicans or the thunder? Like, I don't see that as a given. Yeah, I'm just saying, if I'm the Grizzlies, and I am John Morant, and I've probably been watching LeBron pick apart playoff defenses since I was like five, and I was playing with toy guns instead of for ones. And then potentially seeing the Kings, another team full of younger players.

Like, that's exactly why we started hearing. just anonymous quotes about how much LeBron was excited to get back to the mix in the playoffs because there is an opportunity. Like those are the type of teams. Like if I'm the Kings or the Grizzlies, I am fearing the Lakers more than probably anyone because of that. Yeah, I don't think the Grizzlies or the Kings, the nature of youth is that you don't know that you should be fearful. So like, I don't know that they actually feel that way.

But, man, you talk about AD versus Jaron Jackson. Is he going to play more than 25 minutes? a game in that series? Because like when AD got it has it... Which one? Who are we talking about? Well, Jared Jackson. But when AD has it going, he's a foul drawing machine, you know, like legitimately. So I wonder about that.

Like, I wonder if they are susceptible to that, but I'm not doing this with the Lakers. I can't. They got to show me more than what they've shown me in the last two weeks for being like, oh, they're going to be some sleeping giant in the West. it's a fair concern on the Jaron Jackson Jr. part of that. I think that's kind of what makes that matchup fun. Also, part of the reason he plays the minutes he does is because that's what Taylor Jenkins has decided to do. Like, he's not, he doesn't have five fouls every night.

He just plays 27 minutes because the Grizzlies don't play. No, the Grizzlies don't really play anybody huge minutes. They just don't really do that. It's tough after watching it happened in last season poses. Not even having Stephen Adams to throw out there as a big body. But as we've seen, they have multiple large-bodied players, including Kenneth Lawthamton Jr., who scored 42 points tonight. We should mention it was in a loss in which they got blown up by the Thunder Scrubs.

But, you know, they have guys in reserve. Maybe one of them steps up. But I don't know, man. I wouldn't count out the Lakers, I guess is what I'm saying. I love that we're 82 games into this. And like, I still don't know who to trust in the West. We're still just going round and round with all of these teams

One good week, two bad weeks, three good weeks, three good weeks, one more bad week. No one has really stabilized beyond I think the Nuggets have had the longest successful stretch of the season And even they are kind of finishing on a bit of a lilt To take some of the wind out of that particular sale. So I don't know how to trust it all. Like the East is a little bit more concrete at least.

We can feel confident about who is actually good there. Chalk. The West. Big chalk in the east. It's probably going to be chalk. But what gets the Lakers into this conversation is not just the youth

of some of these teams at the top. It's not just some of the limitations of the Nuggets. It's that none of these teams have shown that they can be what they need to be consistently for months and months at a time beyond, again,

Denver's one run, one sustained run earlier in the season. That's why I still probably favor them over everyone else. But I see the Lakers window you're talking about just and i again i don't want to i don't want to feed i don't want to feed too much to the lakers fans at this point in time like they're going to have enough to to you know juice up their egos to really get them going but i see it i i do see the the glimmer of the vision you're

talking about so who do we believe in in the west it sounds like rob saying nuggets why is you still saying nuggets i'm i'm nuggets i'm still still nuggets uh they have the what many people consider to be the MVP they're relatively healthy which has been the case the last few years, and I just think they're going to be really, really hard to beat. I can't stop myself from looking at the suns, man. They're just so beautiful. They have all this shooting. They have two of the best scores in the league. You just think any team KD appears on is going to be magnificent and amazing. I mean, it's not bad logic, though. Yeah. It worked out at the first half of the season for the Nets. Yeah, I don't know. There's just a lot of firepower on that team. And I do

think, as Rob mentioned, like, if everyone is kind of shaky, I am going to probably default to the best player in the series. And Katie's going to be that guy for pretty much every series he plays. And so I wouldn't be surprised to see Suns Lakers at this point, but I know that the Lakers have a tough road to get through. Anything else to jump out to you guys from these brackets? Any shot of maybe the calves doing anything against the Bucks, the Sixers, and Celtics are on a collision course? Well, yeah, I think the calves are going to be. be, you know, I've been on this Cavs thing all season. I think they're a really good team.

Jared Allen is finally back. Shouts to Michael Pina. He wrote a dope piece for us on Evan Mobley and his growth and maturation throughout the season as far as his game is concerned. He's peaking at the right time. Donovan Mitchell is proven that he gets buckets in the playoffs. He might not necessarily be the best distributor.

You know, he's saying, something's from Tunnel Vision every now and again, but he's a proven, efficient, high-volume playoff scores. So they just got so many great things going for them. I think I'm not going to pick them against the Bucks, but I think they're going to give the Bucks hell for sure. I think the Cavs are really good. Justin is on record that not only are they bad now,

but they will be bad for the next three seasons. Justin, your thoughts? Bad. Never said bad. Just less good than the Orlinom Magic. Your sustained Cavs take, I'm in awe of it. I cannot understand it. It's Pelicans East at this point with the Cavs.

Well, I was going to ask, Waz, just because they are against the Knicks here. Are there any, like, everyone's kind of billing this as the Donovan Bowl. Are there any, like, lingering, just longing feelings you have, seeing Donovan on the other side as a longtime Knicks fan? I'm not a long time Knicks fan, first of all, but second of all, are you not? No, no, no, no. I've never been a Knicks fan in my whole life.

But first, what are we been doing for the past like nine years on content? I already regret calling us family at the top of this podcast. Doesn't even know a single thing about Was. Listen, everybody in my family, a bunch of all of my closest friends are all Nick fans. But me personally, when I grew up, I was a Jordan fan. I just, I was not inspired to hoop by Derek Harper. It just wasn't the case, right? And so, like, I never, you know, I like when the Knicks do well,

but that fandom where you, like, can't eat the next day because, you know, you lost a playoff game by one possession. Like, that has never happened to me in relation to the New York Knicks, right? The shot to Derek Harper. uncalled for you're telling me you were Davis you were

you're telling me kids weren't growing up dreaming of hand checks dreaming of like methodical backdowns in the post that's what that's what dreams are made of

they certainly were not no I don't I don't see why you can't I understand why they're Knicks fans who are like God it'd be so nice

to have that guy in our uniform doing what he's done this whole season which is all NBA level play all season in a Knicks uniform. Like, I understand

that feeling. But the price tag was the price tag. And I think the Cavs deal made more sense for everybody, you know. And, you know, whatever. I guess they'll be regretful when he's dropping 40 against him in this playoff series, but ultimately I think it was the right

move, you know. Do you guys think of Jalen Brunson, Donovan Mitchell, and whatever else was left of the Knicks after that? It's some like, as good as the Bucks, Sixers, or Celtics, I don't see how you can come to that conclusion. Well, what the Knicks are now is a pretty good counterpoint.

Like, I know we've all been skeptical, but their ability to get here. Like, they've proven that this is a real team, that this is the real construction of a team. And Donovan Mitchell will not be in a Knicks uniform. The other guy who unfortunately may not be in a Knicks uniform is Julius Randall, who we don't know his status for that series yet, in terms of if his ankle is going to be ready. That was a pretty nasty ankle turn.

I hope he's able to give it to go for at least some of that series. You know, even if he needs to join it midway, because when he's out there, they can be a really competitive team. They can push teams like the Cavs pretty far. And frankly, like, yeah, Donovan Mitchell is going to have a great series.

But I also look forward to, like, the game four where Mitchell doesn't shoot so well and we're just, like, singing the praises of Quentin Grimes. Yeah. You know, like, if we want to get the wheel, shurning on what the Quinn Grimes pun is going to be for the tabloids. I think we can go ahead and do that. What do you got?

It seems like you have this one holstered. I don't have it holstered. I mean, I'm just saying, like, we may want to start doing some brainstorm. Like, Grimes time is right there. You're right? Like, that's easy money. That's money in the bank. Let's see if we can beat it.

Best idea wins, Justin. That one doesn't win. I'll tell you that in advance. So we're saying bucks out of the east. Any like late in Sixers love Celtics? Anyone thinks that they can make it past the box here? I mean, I still think the Celtics are going to come out of the East personally. So long as long as time, Lord can be reasonably healthy,

I think they got enough firepower on defense to manage the Janus thing. And obviously, offensively, they got enough that they can muster good enough offense, man. And again, I say this over and over again. And every time we get excited about the bucks, everybody just conveniently forgets how this offense looks every single playoff. It just, it is so nasty at times. And so I'm still bullish on the Celtics.

I don't know why everybody else isn't. And you know what? I can understand. There's, like, Jason Tatum just doesn't feel as dominant as the number ones, you know, that are yonings. and Joelle, like, he just doesn't dominate in the ways that those guys do. So it's like, is Tatum going to be able to do this? I just think collectively, man, the guys around him,

they're just such a well-balanced team that I really still think they're going to come out. They're really good. They definitely have what it takes to win the East. I think the Sixers have what it takes to win the East if their guys can stay healthy. And to that point, if we're looking at all the matchups we can reasonably expect on the board right now. I think there's a good chance we get out of these playoffs and Celtic Sixers

is the best series we see all playoffs long. That matchup has the juice. It has the give and take in terms of like who is good where on the floor, the positional give and take of that, where they're dominating, how they're dominating. You have this element that you're describing Waz as far as like Tatum and

him need, I mean, I don't know how much Jason Tatum needs to prove necessarily after just going to the NBA finals, but he needs to prove that he can step it up even a little bit more to overcome that level. The Joelle and Bede level of star, the Steph Curry level of star, to show that he has that in him will be an incredibly interesting thing to see. And to see Joelle go up against a team that has these kinds of defensive resources,

that has this kind of offensive versatility. I mean, I can't wait to see them go head to head. I really hope we get that as planned, you know, but the nets, they could be plucky in the first round. They could be difficult. They're not going to be plucky. Okay, no, they're not. But I am looking, I'm already looking forward to it, is what I'm saying.

Yeah. So you're going bucks though overall. I'm going bucks overall. But, I mean, again, it would not shock me. I think the bucks are the team that gives us the most confidence of any team on the board at this point, including everything you mentioned was about how their offense is going to get bogged down, how we lose that to memory, how are, you know, our associations with the bucks or how they make us feel and not the reality of those half-co possessions. He was fired two years ago. This guy was fired. We were firing that guy.

I never seen a team's narrative. I've said this before. I've never seen a team's narrative flip. So completely after the Bucks won the finals. I get it. You're minted. But the way everyone just completely flip-flop to thinking that they're the most bankable team in NBA history is wild. I just don't feel that way.

I don't feel that way. They're not the most bankable team in NBA history. What they are is they're a team that does not have the shit that the wolves are going through right now. The shit that even the Sixers have sometimes. The shit that the Celtics certainly have sometimes, right? Well, speaking of the Celtics. Yeah, Celtics with Jalen Brown apparently doesn't have a right hand to work with for who knows how long, accidentally cut it apparently and had to get stitches in it.

I mean, that could be a big deal because I worry that, like, for instance, that he get into that seven seed and I would pick the Celtics every time in that matchup. But let's say it goes six or seven, then you're exhausted going into another matchup. with the Sixers potentially, and then you got to face the Bucks. That's a gauntlet, man. And that's something that the Sixers, for instance, don't have to face just like worrying about Camp Thomas having a random 40-point game way or in there. So it's going to be a tough sled.

And that's kind of why I have the Bucks, too, because the Bucks are going to be coming out having to play one of these two teams after they play each other, which is a huge advantage. I'm, you know, I'm with the Mike Scher's. I'm with the Bills on this point about the Heed being a tough match. matchup for the Celtics. And in particular, you're right. Like, if Jaylen, whatever the situation is with Jalen Brown's hand, the heat are not a team.

You want to have like a little bit of doubt in your handle or a little bit of doubt in the consistent. You have to see if your pull-up shot because of a hand injury. Jimmy Butler and Bam out of bio. Yeah, they're going to, they're going to test that thing. Absolutely. And there's still a really good defense. In quite unique ways, too, by the way.

No doubt. Yeah. All right. Let's, before we go here, there were a couple of coach firings. that happened, one of which happened maybe before Stephen Silas had even left the court for his final game in Houston. Stephen Silas is out in Houston after three years, 59 and 177, which is brutal. Dwayne Casey also announced himself that he stepped out. I guess he's getting a front office role in Detroit. Why, has any of these surprise you? Anything else? Jump out?

Nah, y'all know I've been anti Stephen Silas and what he's been doing in Houston for a while. I'm not saying that the guy can't one day be a good coach to a team. I just think for whatever reason, he was not getting the most out of that team, that group of guys. And so in the NBA, when that's the case and you're the head coach, they get you out of there. That's just the way it goes. DeWan Casey, I mean, you know, that felt like he was brought in there to sort of be a grown-up in the room. and their rebuild process. And, you know, they might want to get some young blood.

It's just, I don't know, you see what OKC is able to achieve with their new coach. You see what Utah's doing with their new coach. And it's like, if you're a team like Houston, it's like, yo, I want my version of that. And Detroit should be saying the same thing to themselves. And so I understand these moves completely. Yeah. I know we said firing, but technically, Dwayne Casey was kind of, promoted, right?

Right. Well, and technically Stephen Silas' contract just ran up and they won't option. Also not technically fired. Yeah. Yeah. But there are two teams who needed new voices. Like, yeah. I think Stephen Silas's situation was imperfect to say the least in terms of the

players he was given and especially just like offensive coordination without real point guards is always going to be an uphill battle. And when the replacement is a bunch of young players, like you're kind of screwed from the start as far as becoming a competent basketball. team. That's what Houston's next step is going to have to be. Like, they are going to have to either bring in veteran playmakers and distributors, get people in the right places, or they're going to have to grow those players from, I can't say I see that from like Jalen Green necessarily at this point in time. He got reversed Del Negrode is what happened. He was, he was brought in,

Del Negrode. He was, so Vinie Del Negrow brought in for the Clippers famously to coach the young like pre-lob city Eric Gordon DeAndre Jordan Blake Griffin they instantly traded for Chris Paul Stephen Silas brought in to coach the Russell Westbrook James Hardin Rockets Russell Westbrook who helped bring Silas in then as for a trade

and Hardin went out and he's stuck coaching a younger team well that's actually my question Rob do you think Silas like over the past three years have shown that maybe this isn't what he's suited for the head job maybe he's better as an associate working like the offense on a team like the Mavericks or somewhere else? Or do you think like he just got jobbed here and it's more about the situation?

I think he got a little bit jobs. The difficulty with that evaluation is this. Very rarely do you get to be the guy who is the Del Negro is the guy who's coaching the young up and coming version of the team and you actually get to stick around for the long haul. Either the team is this bad, like consistently very bad, or they hit a seal and relatively early and you get replaced for veteran coach of your choosing. Doc Rivers, you know, like,

it's just kind of the way of the world at a certain level. And so what would Stephen Silas' next head job be? My guess is it would be another job that looks a lot like this one, right? It would be another young team. And my hope would be that it would be a young team that has its construction a little more together. That looks a little bit more like, okay, these guys are young, but this is a basketball team.

These are pieces that make sense together. I think he has it in him to be the coach of that team. I don't think he added in him to take this Rockets roster and turn that into a playoff group. Yep. That makes sense. All right. Before we go, do we need to share anything?

Do we need to get to know each other any better after this Knicks mishap? You guys want to do show and tell at the end of some of these episodes? I limit my misery to the Mets and Jets. I'm good. I don't need. I got enough grief in my. my life between those two teams. I do something to share that's on the other end, the non-grief, the non-missory.

You guys were right about Daisy Jones and the Six. Excellent. Excellent show. I've given it a shot. I'm in. Look, like catchy riffs, good chemistry. Like, I'm buying what they're selling. Have you been listening to that album on Spotify?

Aurora? I have not. Let's get that the show notes. Let's get that straight link. You know, let's get the synergy going here. I will just say this. Like, it's probably going to be higher in my Spotify rap than I would care to admit. Because I have been playing a lot of the songs afterwards.

They're very catchy. Are you a honeycomb guy? What are we into? Honeycomb is pretty good, I got to say. All right. We'll be back on Wednesday. We're going two times a week now. So Wednesday, and then like we said, up top, we'll be back also on Sunday.

early-ish, probably afternoon. Until then, until Wednesday, thank you to Isaiah Blakely on production. Thank you to Ben Cruz. We'll see you later.