The Ringer NBA Show - ‘Sources Say’ — Agent News, Frustrated Teams, and LaVar Ball Speaks (Ep. 173)

Episode Date: December 6, 2017

The Ringer’s Juliet Litman and Chris Ryan examine the recent scandal regarding decertified NBA agent Andy Miller (0:43), wonder about the future of big men in the league (7:54), and debate the most frustrated teams so far (10:47). Then, Juliet is joined by ‘The 5th Quarter’ director and producer Michael D. Ratner and LaVar Ball to discuss the intersections between the NBA and Hollywood (21:26). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We won. Yeah. They suck. Yeah. We here. You feel me? We back in the building. Y'all thought we was gone.

What's that sound? That's the source to say, Siren. I'm Juliet Lippman. I'm Chris Ryan. Here we are back where we belong, talking about basketball, and what's going on with all these players. We're not talking about basketball. We're talking about off-court issues. We're talking about, like, personnel.

Yeah. This is kind of like HR for the NBA. That's good. Yeah, NBAHR. Yeah, MBAHR. Let's begin with big news today, which is that Andy Miller, one of the top agents on the NBA, has given up his player agent certification in the wake of this Adidas and NCAA basketball scandal. Yeah, you won't find this on the front page of ESPN.com.

It's not necessarily the most important story in basketball if you're just like, hey, who won last night, who's doing well. But, man, this is a big one. This is actually quite big. So he was the age... The college basketball scandal is metastasizing. Yes. And so he was implicated from the beginning.

There was a raid on his office. And northern New Jersey, I think is where he's located. And computers were taken. There was a big Yahoo story about this a couple of weeks ago. Yeah, we could just kind of talk a little bit about who Andy is as like, I mean, I'd say Andy, like, as if I co-host the watch with him. Andy Miller is a longtime agent. It's considered sort of one of the four or five most powerful agents.

He had his own agency called ASM. And I remember hearing about him early on. He was Garnett's agent. Yes. And he sort of steered Garnett's career. He was a Chaunty Billups' agent. So I remember kind of hearing about him in the mid-2000s, early 2000s, when those guys were at their peaks. And over the last few years, he's represented Kyle Lowry.

He's represented Christopps famously. And I think that as a Sixers fan, I recall Christops' unwillingness to work out for the Sixers. And recently he was the recipient He won the Dwight Howard sweepstakes When Dwight Howard left Dan Fagan in 2016 Yeah And Andy Miller guided him to the Hornets Yes

He also has a Baca Kyle Lowry or hat I should say And apparently most of the players are staying with the agency Though they won't be represented by Miller Yeah and he's got a couple of younger players Like Justin Patton and Miles Turner Yes So this is a pretty big deal

Like one of the agents sort of like he's basically tapping out. And also, like, it makes you wonder, like, what's coming next that he agreed to this. Right. So the guy who worked for him, Christian Dawkins, was one of the guys named in the initial sort of... I believe he was arrested. Dragnet of FBI arrests that included a couple of prominent assistant coaches at places like Auburn. USC.

And then this guy, Christian Dawkins, who worked for ASM, was part of this initial round of arrests. Right. And Dawkins had been fired last spring or summer when it came out that he had, charged $40,000 to a player in all Uber rides. Yeah. The name of the player never came out. Do you think you could put together $40,000 in Uber rides in a year? I take Uber a lot, like a lot, and I don't think so now.

Yeah. Like, that's really hard. Like, that's like, that's insane. I guess if you took 50 airport trips. I don't know. That's like, that's $109 per day. That's a lot. An airport trip is $35 to my home and Los Phyllis to L.AX.

No. Oh. UberX. Okay. It's way cheaper than a cab, man. I know, I'm aware of that, but I don't pay $35. I'm wondering if I'm getting the short end of the stick. The other thing about Christian Dawkins is he was being sued by Willie Reed for $13.5 million arbitration

because he says that the ASM had convinced him to turn down a $15 million offer from the heat, though the heat denied that offer ever existed. So there's just a lot of like messiness going on around Annie Miller before this even came today. I'm just wondering, like, who else? Like, is there anyone else who's going to be involved in this? Like, I don't know, there's so many questions and just not a lot of answers. The only information that we have on this is from a very short, particularly by his standards, Wode's report that came out this morning 9.30 Pacific time.

So we don't know what's next, but it's definitely something to keep an eye on and like kind of the center, for me, the center of intrigue off the court right now. Yeah, this will either be sort of the last lap of this story in some ways or the first lap because there's a money quote from a Pat Ford Pete Thammell article from last month, which is from a head coach at a perennial top 25 college program according to, I'm reading from Dan Devine's Yahoo

sort of roundup of all this information. And the quote from Pat and Pete's piece is, Andy Miller's computer has got to be interesting because the FBI took his computer. Right. He has lived on the edge for a long time. He has some expletive on a lot of people. I don't have anything on my computer.

I got to be completely honest. Because all in the cloud? Like, I'm just not a person who keeps records. I'm not like you. I'm not an archivist. There's not a lot of photography of me. The NBA is a business conducted over text message primarily. And I just wonder what that means for these kinds of probes these days.

I don't know. It's really fascinating. And also, like, now these players are going to be, like, potentially poach, which is another interesting thing. Yeah, the two big ones to keep an eye on are Christops, who I believe ASM employed his brother. His brother, yeah. Chris and Miles are both going to be up. Their deals will be up. Yeah.

So those are the two interesting ones. If someone could sign them before they sign their next deal or both Turner and Christops, particularly Christops, will presumably get really large contracts. It's a big payday for someone. Do you think that there's been more agent volatility in the last couple of years or is it just that we're paying attention to it more? Because I mean, there's been a lot. Obviously, the Fagan stuff was big.

Yeah. And, you know, Wall and DeAndre. I feel like the DeAndre emoji kidnapping scandal was the original sin. And now since then, there's just been a lot of like, I'm leaving my agent. We were discussing this this morning. It's very hard for me to tell because I'm. I'm so obsessed with agenting and like what that and like how that the levers are being pulled behind the scenes. But there's definitely like agents are more famous.

Like first of all, Bob Myers and Rob Polinka are two GMs who used to be agents. And Arntellum. You know, works for the Pistons as like in a barrow half in the front office. So like they definitely have more of a presence over the league. I guess as it's matured the influence of like the behind the scenes deals have come to light even more. So. Yeah. And also like shoe deals are such a big part of like a.

analyzing someone's star power and their value. Like, it was funny when Kevin Durant went to Golden State. Like, a lot of it was like, this is really good for his endorsements. And so that's, like, as much of his business. And he even says that. I mean, that's why he took a lesser deal, he says. And that runs through his agency and his business partner. So I guess we are.

There's more information available about them. Yeah. I guess so. I guess so. Yeah. And I think that there has been so much, so like in soccer, there's really nothing in it for an agent unless you're trying to do. get that guy a transfer.

And you can transfer us. I mean, yeah, you have contracts, but you can just basically be like, there's already talking about Namar leaving Paris. And that only benefits his father who has a huge role in his career and gets paid a commission essentially every time Namar signs a new big deal. So if he was just somehow orchestrated and moved from Barcelona to Paris to Real Madrid and over the course of a couple of seasons, that would be a huge windfall for him. And by that same token, in the NBA, we're seeing more.

more and more player movement, huge, like huge names moving. All these guys are on two-year deals, three-year deals. I think that this is only going to become a bigger story because these agents are, it's in the agent's best interest to get someone a new deal and move and get different sneaker deals. And it's that churn that's where they make their money. Nobody makes money off of like, oh, I signed a seven-year deal. That's the last contract of my life. And to that extent, DeAndre Jordan signed with a new agent this week.

Yes. He signed with Excel and Jeff Schwartz, which is, interestingly, the same agency that Blake Griffin, his teammate has. And yeah, and like in DeAndre's and all these trade talks. And there was a lot of speculation that Clutch was going to sign with Clutch. Yes. And he is up for a new deal. He can opt out at the end of the season.

So, yeah, it's time to get an agent. He's also possibly a trade target. And a trade target, right. And the trade talks were being held up because teams weren't sure if he was like legitimately interested or not. Oh, interesting. Well, or basically like if people wouldn't know if he would resign or not. Oh, so he was apparently on the block at various points,

but nobody was sure who to contact like kind of in regards to him. him. Exactly. Interesting. Because teams don't want to trade for a player that, like, him who's just going to give up something good for DeAnda Jordan for him to leave after, at the end of the season, basically. Yeah.

I wonder what's going to happen to the trade market in general. We were talking about this with Riverboat Willie Simmons the other day. Yeah. He was just like, I don't know how teams, you know, we were just talking about how hard it is to just kind of feel like there's an obvious trade. Right. And I think, you know, Mark Gassal and DeAndre Jordan have been kicked around a little bit. Obviously, Paul George is a name you're going to hear, but I have a real.

really hard time believing that Sam Presti is just going to be like, oh, yeah, this was a failed experiment. Yeah, I agree with you. And also to the DeAndre and Marcus Sull point, I've talked about this with Gonzo. We've talked about it in our office. Like, where do you send those, the kind of, like, more traditional big men? Like, it's just, like, as Steve Kerr discussed in the BS pod, like, the role of big men has changed so much.

Their niche. Yeah. So, like, it's not like, Paul George could fit on so many teams, like, contracts aside, like his skill set could fit on so many teams, which was one of the reasons why he was such, like, a delicious trade target. But it's much harder with Marker Sol. Even though he could be more talented by some metrics. I wonder whether or not this sort of happened with big men for a while 10 years ago, 15 years ago.

But now there is basically a shooter's drought. There's not enough shooters to supply the demand for shooters. So the people that you think like, oh, man, if they could just, if the Sixers could just add a shooter, if the Pistons could add another small forward, if it's just there's not enough guys to go around. And furthermore, a team that could maybe incrementally improve like the Pistons. like, I don't know, like even Cleveland. Sure. What would you want to give up? Because you're sacrificing depth.

Depth has like been the biggest thing of the year this year is like teams that can go 10 deep and play like even teams like Toronto who have like just good active benches. And Toronto has continuity at this. You know what I mean? That's the other thing. Like with the Cavs, David Griffin was like on NBA TV saying he wouldn't trade for DeAndre Jordan. That meant giving up Tristan Thompson even if like he could fit in better. And like he had a lot of reasons.

But I do think also part of that is the continuity. that's kind of the key to the spurs, like the reason like they're still like being viable at all without both Kauai and Tony Parker for a while and still now without Kauai is because of the continuity because of like the system. And so even if you don't have like a great system like they do, there is somebody to be sad for like knowing how to play together. I mean we're watching with the Thunder. They don't know how to play together. They don't know how to play together and let's get into the frustration power rankings. Oh, what a great, great transition. Because we were going to talk about a bunch of these teams that are having a little, I think that there has been like a little bit of an NFLification of. of NBA discourse where I think we're always kind of concentrate, talking about crisis points and

is this team, are they good capital G or are they bad capital B? And the NBA just doesn't really work like that. Teams just go through bad stretches. Scheduling has a lot to do with it. I would say that these first few days of December with the maybe the exception of the Thunder, who were just won three in a row anyway, that most teams are just experiencing like, oh yeah, there's a lot of games to play. And injuries happen and we have back-to-backs. So I don't get overly upset or nervous about a wizard's game where they score 69 points because they know John Wall and they've been on the road for a while. Yeah. It happens. Yeah. Let's talk about the wolves, though. Sure. A lot of activity around the wolves today. They're sitting in five in the West.

They're 14 and 11 and their body language isn't great. Kevin O'Connor and then Paulo Ugetti on our website. They both addressed how Tibbs is playing an eight-man rotation with like ridiculous minutes for his main guys and we're still in December. They've only played 25 games. So it's just over quarter of the season. And they don't look like a team having fun. My paradigm for no frustration is the Rockets right now. It's crazy as that may be. And the wolves are kind of the anti-Rockets.

There's a lot of like Tosh Gibson and Jimmy Butler telling guys where to go on the court. And there's a lot of Carl Anthony Towns not playing defense. Yes. Carl Towns keeps putting up absurd numbers. On any given night, you'll just be like in your head working on it. Carl Towns is struggling narrative. And then you'll look and he has 32 and 15. but he is the odd man out on this team, you can tell.

Like just from visually watching him and watching Jimmy get on him and watching him not know really what he's supposed to be doing on defense, I don't know what the answer is going to be because I don't think that you can give up on a Tibbs administration this early. Kevin O'Connor was sort of advocating for that on the Ringer NBA show on Tuesday,

and I saw that that topic blew up on Reddit. It's a hot topic. And there was very little disagreement. There was mostly people being like, yeah, like, Tibbs has just kind of got found out. We were saying the same thing about Stan Van Gundy. It's true. Like a couple days into the season. Like maybe the game's past standby.

Maybe players don't want to be yelled at on every play. And the Pistons have gone on to be one of the success stories of the season. So I still think that there's plenty of room for the Timberwolves to turn around. And some would argue that there really isn't anything to turn around because they're having a plenty of good season. Yeah, they're 14 and 11. That's good. Yeah. I'm sure they'd like to be, you know,

17 and 9 or whatever, but I think that for the most part, four and six in the last 10 is indicative of some struggles, but they're still fifth in the West and a competitive West. Yes, that's true. Okay, next team, the Thunder. They've won three in a row, but not a convincing three in a row. They're still 11 and 12, and they're ninth in the conference right behind the Pelicans, and then the Jazz are right in front of the Pelicans.

So 7-8 is Jazz, Pelicans, then Thunder. Who do you think is the most unhappy on this team? Probably Westbrook. Okay. But only because I think the idea that Russell Westbrook is not aware of public perception is ridiculous. So let's just say that Russell is aware of that. I don't remember a sharper drop-off in approval rating for an MVP in my lifetime, with the exception of maybe people turn on Iverson as like, can you win with him pretty fast,

especially with all the stuff to happen with Larry Brown at the end of the Sixers there. but just people regularly kind of being like, you can't win with Russ. Which I find a little ridiculous because he has won way more than Paul George and Carmelo. Sure. With Kevin Durant as a side man, yeah. And through dragging his team to the playoffs

and losing in the first round. But even so, that team seemed to have more joy. Maybe it was Ennis Cantor. Maybe you need that guy as your locker room glue guy. Well, I mean, I think that they were a folk story last year. They were built around this sort of hero worship of Russ, and then you specifically bring in two extra guys to help him and to make a run.

I still think that they're going to get into the upper half of the Western Conference. I think that they'll figure it out, even if it means Mello playing less or coming off the bench or just shooting less. But I do think that they're going to look back and maybe regret going after Mello. I would do that deal seven out of seven days of the week, canter for Mello, but I just think that there's something about watching Paul George and Russell Westbrook that really makes sense.

And when they have Mello in there, I've seen a couple of Thunder games where they've been up seven or eight or 11, and they bring Mello back in the fourth quarter. And I can't help but make the association defensively and also with his style of play, that it really, you can't have two ball stoppers on the court at the same time. Yeah. Billy Donovan had an interesting quote today, which was coming off his three games, Stephen Adams is playing really well. He's averaging 22 points in eight boards.

And Billy Donovan was like, that credit has to go to Paul George and Carmelo Anthony for being unselfish and facilitating it. And I just thought that was very interesting ego management. It just seems like there's a lot to be massaged in that situation. I mean, it must be frustrating to lose all those fourth quarters. Although last night they beat the jazz by four. And it included...

They outscored them by 20 points in the fourth, I believe. Yeah. Something close to that. So that's positive. I really want the thunder to turn around. obviously like Russ. I've for some reason root for Paul George. And I like the latter days of Carmelo Anthony.

I like adult mellow. I like adult mellow too. There's a really good Jason Concepcion piece on the ringer this week about the three mellows. NBA mellow, Olympic mellow and hoodie mellow. Yes. Us sort of like waiting for Olympic mellow to take over NBA mellow's career and how long we're going to have to wait for that. Is there a couple other teams that you wanted to talk about frustration-wise? We were going to say the Nuggets, but they're having actually fine season.

Yeah, they're totally fine. Considering the fact that they're without Milsat. I know, which is pretty crazy. I'm pretty impressed. They are currently fourth, the 13 and 10. I will just say in general, I feel like there's more parity across the league than we were expecting this season. I think that there's a top three or four teams, and they are far beyond everybody else. The Cavs, the Celtics, the Rockets, and the Warriors are just much better than everyone else.

But let's talk about the Warriors, because Steph is hurt. Yeah. And before Steph was hurt, Steve Kerr went on Bill, was pretty open about the malaise that they're facing and the prospect of another long season and another long playoffs. And I don't know necessarily, like, they're as of today, 19 and 6. They're half a game behind the Rockets who are 18 and 4. Right. And Katie's been thrown out three times or two.

And now Steph's out for at least two to three weeks with this ankle sprain. Yeah. And they don't seem to have the same bounce in their step. I just want to say I predict Steph will be out four to six weeks, is my guess. Oh, you think he's going to... I'm not a doctor. I literally have no information, but I just think that two to three weeks seems unnecessarily fat. Also, again, unnecessarily fast.

I guess it kind of depends on how it goes without him. But why would you rush him back if you're doing okay? As somebody who has experienced several two to three week diagnoses with Markle Fultz this year, I agree with your skepticism. I literally forgot Markle Fultz in the league. Thank you for the reminder. Thank you so much. I'm excited to see the Kevin Durant Warriors, which Charks wrote about today. I'm excited to see what this team looks like

It's the inverse of what we saw last year When Durant went out And it's kind of like your time dude Like let's see what you got Yeah try to get tossed Try not to get tossed Who you think would have actually won a Boogie versus Durant fight Buggy? No there's no question in my mind

What do you think? I can't tell whether Boogie is a school bully or not And like if you just go back at him He like gets freaked out I find the people that Boogie chooses to have Befs with like Myers-Lennard to be curious And reportedly Nick Stouskis Yeah

I mean, just go after Tage Gibson. I bet he would. Go after David West. I think he would go after David West, too. Although I think David West is a better shot than Kevin Durant against Boogie. I kind of like David West. I don't know. I have a real softness for the Frank Vogel Pacers teams.

I don't know why. Okay. Last biggest news of the week is LeVar Ball pulled Leangelo Ball out of UCLA. And this is relevant because the ball family is dominant in basketball. pro and amateur, and apparently European as well, since he's trying to get both mellow and jello on a team over there. And because I spoke to Lovar Ball last Friday. Today is Wednesday, December 6th. I spoke to him on Friday, December 1st, and we're going to play that interview shortly.

I spoke to him because he was doing press for this streaming series he's on called the fifth quarter. And in it, I asked him about Leangelo, basically. And he talked about his desires for his future. And I was really caught off guard by it, to be honest. I was like, oh, okay, interesting. Yeah. So we'll hear that interview. But like, do you have ball family fatigue, Chris?

No, I don't. But I'm also not, I have somehow successfully, of all the things that I can't seem to stop reading about in America, the ball family has been something that's been pretty easy for me to turn on and off. There also was a LeVar ball rule this week from the Lakers, which is they are basically limiting access to associates of team players after games. If you're a guest of the team, so if you're taking, if he's there on Lonzo's ticket, he can't talk to the press. Right. It's all just, like, fascinating to me. And as this interview will show, he will find a pulpit. Like, there's not much the Lakers can do to hold him back. What we're going to find out, though, is as Lanzo struggles, like, up and down, the impression that I get is that Leangelo was never going to be an NBA player. Right. Like, that there was no real... They never thought he was going to be. It almost seemed like UCLA took him as, like, a favor.

Sure. To get the other two. Yeah. And then now Lamello is in question about whether he's going to go to college at all. I just wonder how much this exists off of, like, Lonzo not being like a good NBA player yet. Yeah. It's true about, like, with Lonzo and faults. Is that the oxygen supply or does LaVar just provide his own oxygen? Do people lose interest if Lonzo is coming off the bench and kind of not playing that much? I will say I definitely find it significantly less fun without Lonzo being good. It's more, it's more of a familiar, like, stage parent story.

It's very strange to watch this rookie class and have the top two picks struggle so hard while Donovan Mitchell. and Jason Tatum and Jason Tatum looked like sixth year pros yeah Jason Tatum is like really good

Donovan Mitchell's field goal percentage has gone up like 10% per month it's nuts Jason Tatum's like leading the league in three point

percentage I'm just saying I'm just saying so yeah we're going to hear from Lavar and then the reason I had him on

was because there's a show called the fifth quarter on Verizon streaming service and the director dot show is someone named Michael who you also Michael Ratner

people would recognize from photos of him with Kendall Jenner and Blake Griffin. And we're going to talk about that right now. All right. And now I've got my good friend Michael Ratner here. Hello, hello.

Hi, Michael. Hi. You are the director and executive producer of the fifth quarter, which is a mockumentary show streaming now on Verizon's Go 90 service. Yes. And you did 20 episodes. 20 new episodes. 22 in total. And you were here last year after season one.

Yes. And to narrow back. An annual event. It's kind of like our version of the Masters. Yes. So for people who might have missed last years, because the ringer was still kind of new, they might know you as the sneeze guy. I am the sneeze guy. Or from photos of Kendall Jenner at the Clippers games.

Yeah, there have been a couple of those. So one thing I noticed last week, I was checking in on the Daily Mail with my favorite publications, you've been upgraded from Sneeze guy to a friend to producer and director Michael Ratner. Through some investigative work, it seems as though they've put it together. That's pretty impressive. Thank you. When you see that you're being photographed, do you change what food you're eating? Do you go from fries and a candy apple to just having a beverage? Like, how does that affect your experience at the game?

You know, I'm not really cut out for this. So I wasn't ready for it. So I was just eating sushi because I was trying to be healthy. Okay. And then I got just ripped by everybody. Good sushi at Staples. Yeah. But I guess just that's faux pa eating sushi at a basketball game.

I got really, people went after me on that one. Really? Yeah. I think that's a good. Well, no, you'd be surprised. What's the ideal basketball food for a paparazzi shot? I don't know. I don't know. Maybe some chicken fingers. Does anyone from TMZ or The Daily Mail or elsewhere call you to be like...

Never. Never. So you don't get any notice from that. No, I wake up and I find out I'm the sneeze queen. The sneeze queen. And the sneeze queen is from over the summer or something like that. I was sneezing. You were in a car with Blake and Kendall, and there's like a close-up of them and you just happen to be to the left of them and you're sneezing. I think it was the night we shot right about. there and we're just like eating dinner and then I you know listen allergy season no good you can become

the sneeze queen overnight it's not it's not a good thing and so no one's like hey what's your name like no one tries to figure that out how does the daily mail figure that out then I really don't know I assume you know I think Kendall has a bunch of followers and whatnot and they probably like figured it out through just like social media that's the kind of thing I do and then yeah I mean if you go to my social like you're in know what I do it's not that hard to figure out that we have very production company. Got it. I kind of like the Sneeze Queen thing.

Like which of like the characters in a Kendall Jenner photograph would you like to be the most? Like, Sneeze Queen, sushi guy, other, like what's the best? I'd like to be none. None. Yeah. But you're in a lot of them. You guys also, I saw in the Daily Mail that you went to Mr. Chow or Nobu or something

in Beverly Hills. Potentially. I mean, you do know me. So I don't really pay like that much attention to this stuff. I just get texts from someone like you being like, how is your meal? Yeah. Exactly. Did they notice it? Like, is Kendall aware of all the people? I think that's her, like, life. She's been, like, in the petri dish for so long. Yeah. Okay. And so the reason you know her is because you know Blake, who is in the fifth quarter.

I actually knew her before, but I mean, I've spent some time with her, yeah. But, like, you know, out here you move out and a lot of people, I mean, you know, like, everybody's sort of trying to do the same hustle and you meet people. And I don't know, try to surround yourself with, like, just good people and whatnot. And when I moved out here three years ago, like, we were quickly put in touch just because we're too, like, young, hungry people trying to, like, make cool stuff. Sure. So you just meet people.

And, yeah, I think it was around the time I first got out here. Cool. I met some people. And you meet a lot of like-minded people in not only entertainment and making, like, cool, creative stuff now, but definitely into this like sports crossover space too. Cool. So that brings us to the fifth quarter, which is your mockumentary series.

I survived the gossop part. Yeah, you did seem uncomfortable in your seat. Because you were, you weren't making eye contact with me, and now you are. I'm a little more of my element talking about like the TV film stuff. And I'm more of my element talking about the Daily Mail. Yeah, I know you are. So there we go.

We're done. We're done. We made it through. You're the sneeze guy. I'm the sneeze guy. To everyone listening next time you see a picture of Kendall Jenner. Here's the clip. I do sneeze a lot, just in general.

Maybe you got to get some Zyrtec, my man. Yeah, something. Okay. So you made this mockumentary show the fifth quarter. Yes. And there's been 32 episodes, as you mentioned. And you cast athletes to do, like, short acting bits, basically. And so this season has Blake Giffin.

It has Joelle Embeddeed. It has... Dr. Jay. Dr. J. Cuddy Cousins. Chalers. Courtney Lee. Courtney Lee.

Courtney Lee. Amad Shumpert. John Carlo Stanton, Jason Pierre Paul. And then on the acting side, it's got everybody from Ed Asner and Judd Hirsch to Marlon Waynes, who we mentioned. I mean, really kind of like a crazy cast. Sure. And then just like staple traditional sportscasters like Kenny Maine and Michelle Beadle.

Yeah, Kenny's awesome. He's a co-producer on the show for season two and three. Oh, cool. Yeah. He was involved season one, but then I brought him on board to produce this season two. So someone like Blake, what's the pitch to him to get him to be in the show? I pitched him just, I mean, now it was easy because he knew what it was from season one. But when I pitched him season one, the first episode he did, which was like the Daniel Lamonte spent, like spend.

I just told him the idea and I knew that he was into comedy and he had done, you know, just for laughs. And I had a production company, Mortal Media with Ryan Khalil. Right. And I was like, you know, if I can get a clean shot at just like pitching him, which that's the hard part. Sure. Getting him to pick up the call. And he heard me at the premiere day and I'm like, it's crazy that he picked up like some random guy's call. That's all I was.

I was a random guy. And pitched him like just my best pitch as far as like, this is funny. you're in your offseason, you like comedy. This is a go show. And he was down. He's like, yeah, let's do it. And then he was awesome. So, yeah, I think it's just you need to just really go and think of something that's funny and fit somebody.

And if you do that effectively, like, I think a lot of, you know, men and women that play professional sports want to do stuff like this. Yeah. So you just got to get the opportunity in front of them. That's cool. For someone who is, like, less inclined to doing this kind of thing, like, I don't know, you got a lot of people who are inclined to being in this. Who are inclined? Yeah, like it can't be very hard to convince Embed or Chandler to do this kind of thing because they're like so open to being celebrities, not just athletes. But like someone like Courtney Lee or like John Carlos Stanton, who I know less about admittedly, like, is it helpful to be like, we have Judd Hirsch in this?

You're like, what's like the one thing they want to hear to get them to do it? I think Stanton was like pretty into the fact that George Lopez had done it. Cool. They were actually going to shoot on the same day. So it's kind of like cater to your audience. Yeah. And depending on what the episode's about or who else is in it, you know, I'm. I do think it makes a big difference.

So, you know, it depends. Like, you know, you got Donnell Rawlings. Oh, my God. You know, Chappelle's show was my favorite show growing up is for certain people. And it could be someone like a George Lopez, like I said, you know. I think it's all just dependent on who it is and what the idea is. But the series now is pretty well known. So it's much, much, much easier to cast.

That's cool. And we'll actually have incoming calls now from agencies and players themselves being like, I got to get on that. Who do you think is the best NBA player who isn't on the show already that you'd want to have it? Like, who's like your dream guest or your dream actor slash athlete? The episode I need to make at some point as a Knicks fan, I would love to do the unknown story of post Reggie Miller's retirement. He then goes to all Spike Lee's movie premieres and Heckles him at the movie premieres. Oh. I just think that would be awesome.

And that was an idea I had, I think, around season one, but it will require some very specific production stuff just given their schedules with, you know, Reggie now does commentating and Spike is always on set. So it's a hard one to pull off, but I think that would be. I would love to do that. Nice. Of all the athletes who've worked with, who's the best actor? Other than Blake.

Blake's like it is, we all know Blake's an excellent. Blake's really damn good. Yeah. I was really impressed with Joelle. Oh, cool. You know, I knew he was funny, obviously, like through social media and whatnot.

And we worked together on a vice project, and I've just gotten to know him pretty well. But he really impressed me. He was really, really good. And you know the episode with him, he plays an office intern trying to get his college credit to graduate college during the summer. I thought he was great.

Dr. Jay was surprisingly awesome. I'm named for him. You're what? I'm named for him, Dr. J. Really? Juliet is for Julius. Yeah. I swear to God.

I can't tell if you're, like, messing. No, I swear. It's true. 100% true. Are you messing with the sneeze queen? No, I would never mess with the Sneeze Queen. That's crazy. I didn't know that.

Yeah. He's my number one. So you also had Lonzo and LeVar Ball on the show. Explain the episode that they're in. So Marlon Wayne's plays an overbearing father who starts recruiting his son to play college basketball at UCLA at 7 years old. And the balls find that. that undignified to exploit the sun at that age. When I say the ball is really LeVar.

And then Lonzo has a cameo as well. Tons of NBA guys are in that episode. It's a really fun episode. They do weigh in quite a bit. It's like pretty amazing how the balls have just taken over NBA culture so quickly. Yeah. I mean, L.A. provides the opportunity to do that for sure. Yeah.

It's like quite a stage. But they've embraced it and really pulled it off. But I think this episode is really cool because they're so in on the joke, you know, and I think that that's awesome for people to see. Who do you think would be like a more potent foe? Chris Jenner or Levar Ball? Like who are you more scared of taking on in a fight? Well, LeVar just recently went up against the president.

That's true. So that's one. I don't know. Coin float. Okay. Is that a horrible answer? I was going to call it diplomatic. I really, I just don't know.

I've never thought of it. I need to sleep on. I need to take the weekend. I'm more afraid of Chris Jenner, I think. She's just been at this for longer. She's damn good at what she does. And she's got more kids and she's still managing all. Like, she's managing more careers than Levar.

Yeah, so Levar is managing three. And she's managing five. Yeah. Or has a hand in five. You know a lot. You know a lot more than I don't. I think she... You're going to be the new sneeze queen.

I don't think so. As you know, I don't think so. We're going to have Lavaar on in a second. But first, like, can you just tell me more about the experience of working with them? Yeah, I mean, they've been really awesome and super professional. You don't know exactly what you're going to expect when you, you know, someone's got like that larger in life personality. I always said he kind of reminds me like Vince Wickman from WWA. Totally.

Like he's like the true showman. But they're all. awesome and they're down to do this sort of stuff. So like I'm always coming up with these like crazy ideas of how we could bridge that gap, that sports entertainment thing. And they're like perfect. They're also here. They're in LA. So I really will say like they're their class acts as far as, you know, everything we've done together. Thus far, it's been two projects over the summer and it's they've been really, really great. Cool. Yeah. So like how do you first initiate getting the ball family involved? I just work with them already on the Kevin Hart Show. Oh, cool.

So I think without that it would have been really difficult to pitch them on that, but I had them on the Kevin Hart thing that we did that's coming out in January. What is that? It's like between two ferns, but with athletes. Got it. And Kevin Hart. Kevin Hart hosting. And it's really fun.

It takes place in ice baths. So it's players recovering like after a game and then Kevin's freezing. And it's the only time that the athlete is more comfortable than like the comedian, right? Sure. So it's pretty funny. So anyway, we had Levar on and the episode set up. Kevin thinks he's getting Lonzo and then LeVar just shows up. Oh, nice.

So that's, yeah. So, but it was just LeVar and that, but then I got to know them a bit. And I told them, you know, we do tons of the sports comedy stuff out here. And he's, you know, we'd love to be a part of that. So then I think we were shooting fifth quarter, maybe like, two weeks after that. So I said, hey, why don't you guys be a part of that? So we already had Marlon Wayans in it. It was already, like, all set. And I was like, this will just elevate the episode to such a new extreme, just because, like, the dichotomy of what Lvar is normally like and his day-to-day persona and whatnot versus the character, obviously, which you saw.

the episode where he's like condemning marlin so it was really fun and and the two of them together was awesome what was their vibe like when they weren't on camera lanzo and lavar i mean lanzo's pretty like mellow like that's all and that's real he's mellow oh yeah yeah he was he was mellow but he was you know when he was ready to roll he was good did he roll his eyes at lavar when directed to but like no like i mean it was they like obviously they had great chemistry but like they got in and and we talked about the scene and whatnot they're in a few episodes they're they're they're They're featured, obviously, in that one, like, they're a big part. They're sort of like the B storyline to Marlon.

But no, they, I mean, his dad, LaVar is like a big character, obviously. Sure. But it's toned down when the cameras aren't rolling, but then, like, they come on and he's ready to roll. How many people do they show up with on set? They came in, like, one of those big vans because they live in. Chino Hills. Yeah, Chino Hills, exactly. So they came in, like, one of those big, like, sprinter vans.

And I think it was Lavar, Lonzo, Allen, who worked big baller brands. and maybe like one other, but it's not like a huge group of people. Was he like, was Levar like bombastic? Like what was, like, was he asking a lot of questions or like just he tried to say hi to everyone? Yeah, he's just like a good guy. Yeah, he is, he really is.

And I remember he took every bit of direction perfectly, both of them. They really were, you know, we did a few takes of everything, but the one thing he wouldn't do was there's a joke in the script about how Marlon Wayne's character stole everything from LeVar Ball, which you saw. and he says even my mustache and Marlon has this big fake mustache on

so I was directing Lonzo and LeVar and I said to there's some line about the mustache and LeVar goes you know what did he say about my mustache and I said to Lanzo improv I go hey tug on your dad's mustache tug on LeVar's mustache and say this thing's real unlike you know Romar Jones which is Marlon's character and then LeVar just went absolutely not he's not doing that

I was like oh okay all good all good and like Lanzum Mustache off limits. Lonsa, mustache off limits. So Lonza just like dropped his head in his hands, like laughing. So, you know, basically anything was fair game besides tugging on the mustache. Did you ask them? Like, do you pepper them with questions? Like, when you work with these people, like, do you fan out at all?

Because I would. It would be hard for me not to. No. I would do the work first. I think I'm so laser focused on getting what we need. It's always a bit with, like, athletes. It's a bit of like a rush always. You know, like it's not their core job.

Like, they're not actors. also there's a lot of waiting around when we shoot. Sure. So it's not like you show up, you know, like, do warm up to you again. No, it's like a whole. Or there's a, please hold like this camera went out. We need a battery. This lights out.

So there's a lot of sitting around. So I'm always pretty focused on getting what we need. When we're done shooting, no, because I'm so focused on getting them in the next thing. And I feel like if you fan out too much, there's like a weird line, you know. Yeah, totally. It could like make them uncomfortable or something. And also like contrary to popular belief, like amongst our friends. Sure.

Now everybody knows we're good friends. I'm like not the craziest basketball fan. Like you know more than I do. You'll tell me things. I'll be like, what? I think I do. That's true. I'm actually friends with. And I'll be like, no way.

Like, oh, good for him. I'm going to tell them. Like, good job on your game last night. I'm like a casual basketball fan. Got it. And like not really a football fan. I'm not really either. That's okay.

That's okay. Did Lonzo like have good manners? Like, I'm just so curious. Like, he's so polished in front of the camera. Like in every interview, I'm just like curious about what he's actually like. Yeah. Yes. It's all like real.

Like he was just like well-mannered and super respectful and into it and like deliver. I mean, he's got some really good lines in that thing. Yeah, he does. I think he's got one of the best lines of the series, obviously the last line of that episode when he talks about all the events that Marlin's character missed. Also like his deadpan kind of style, which is default is like good for comedy. I really wanted them and when I saw that Foot Locker commercial. Do you remember what I'm talking about?

Yeah, yeah. So like obviously the Kevin Hart thing like started our relationship doing stuff like this. But then I saw that and I was like, Oh, they could kill this. And having the two of them together made it that much better. Because then basically my direction was after each line, you two should stare at each other in the eyes. And that just made them break. Like they would die laughing.

So basically, LeVar would say something like crazy. And then they both stare at each other. And then I tell them to hold. And then one of them would like break and start just laughing. Let's hear what LeVar has to say about being on the show. Cool. Hello? Hey, thanks for taking the time today.

Okay. So we want to talk about the fifth quarter and also the show that you do with Kevin Hart. Was acting always in the mix for you in Lanzo? Well, not really in the mix. That's just what we do. We can act all day. How do you decide what projects are right for you then? Any project is right for us.

Really? The floodgates are going to open after this. Anything we decided to do when we feel like doing it and we got time for it, man, we good. Is there anything you would say no to at this point? I'll say no to a lot of things. If I don't have time or if I don't feel like it, then I'll say no. What's the most recent offer, like, a professional? offer that you've rejected?

What's the professional? I don't know if it's professional and I don't know if it's professional and I usually go ahead and do them. I haven't said no to anything. Is acting something you guys like doing together? Sure, it's fun. Doing it together is even more fun,

but it's just acting. It's just entertainment. Okay. Yeah, the two of them together also, like I directed LeVar and Kevin Hart, and I was just amazed because LeVar went toe to toe to him with him right off the bat.

And obviously, that's what Kevin does every single day. and they just had an amazing chemistry. And then I think it was only like two weeks later, right, LeVar, when we did the fifth quarter stuff with Lonzo. And again, the scene back and forth and whatnot, LeVar really could turn it on. And he could take direction really well, too. Between your other two sons, who is the better actor? Between my other two sons, I think they're all actors.

You just got to get them in the right moment. Okay. So there's no opportunity that we could really rule out for them or for you right now. No. Okay. Can we talk about the Lakers for a couple of minutes? We sure. We can talk to anything you want to talk about.

about. We're on the phone. Let's go. Amazing. How do you guys feel about Kuzmania that's taken over in L.A.? Kuzmania? Yeah, the Kyle Kuzma fans. Oh, I think that's a good thing. Anybody that's on the Lakers and they've got some fans behind them, I'm good. I like that. All right. I like Kyle Kuzma, too. I'm glad we're on the same page. Have you heard from the president in the last couple of weeks

since you were last on CNN? I haven't heard. He hasn't called me on my home phone. If he did, would you pick up? If he called on my home phone, I would take it. up. I call anytime. I pick up when y'all call. That's right. That's true. Whoever calls my home, I'm picking up. Taking calls from anyone. How did you first find out that he tweeted about you and was talking about you? I first found out. He tweeted about me when I was on the way to one of my son's games.

And then some reporter called me and asked me, were you offended? Offended for what? No. I'm not offended. It's got to be a pretty shocking phone call when you pick up and they say, hey, did you know the president of the United States just tweeted about you? Yeah. No, it's not a shocking phone call. Like I said, when you had a certain level, anybody called you, you shouldn't be amazed at nothing. That's fair.

I figure his entertainment, he's probably an entertainer, too. You thought he wanted some big baller brand stuff. He wanted the ZO-2s. I mean, you can't play with him to the guy. I know he wanted them ZO2, but he tried to want to come. If he invited you to the White House, would you go? If he invited me to the White House and if he had some Roscoe's chicken and waffles, I might come. But if he's doing the cooking, I ain't coming.

I need somebody that knows how to cook there if he's going to be. invite me to the Whitehauer. So only if it's good food. Yeah, I want some good food. I'm not coming there to do no talking. I come to eat dinner first and then talk. Is there any truth to his claims that he helped get your son back to the U.S.? There's no truth.

I told you guys all that long time ago. Okay. That's what he made the big deal about. Right. What did Leangelo think about all the attention? Leangelo, he don't think nothing about this stuff. I mean, he's just going along with his life now. It's a situation that happened.

He made a bad decision. Now, that's over here. We over here doing what we do now. Do you have any sense of when he'll be playing again? When he'll be playing again for, you're talking about for who, as far as just playing, he's going to play tomorrow. Oh, okay. Great.

But it ain't going to be for the school and nothing like that, but he ain't going to stop working on his game. Do you know when he'll be back with UCLA? Do I know when he'll be back to UCLA? Yeah, playing for the team. Yeah, I do know. Are you allowed to say? Am I allowed to say?

Yeah. Sure, I'll say. You're asking me? Never. Okay. How's that? Okay. That is emphatic.

Exactly. Thanks so much for taking the time. Thanks, Levar. Hey, you guys are more than welcome. You guys have a good one. Thanks. Appreciate it. All righty.

Bye. Leangelo Ball, potentially never playing with UCLA ever again? Yeah, I did not expect to hear that just now. I think we might be breaking news on this podcast. Yeah, the fifth quarter is available. Yeah, that was kind of crazy. I don't, wow. Michael, thanks so much for coming.

I love doing this. Thanks for bringing Levar with you via phone. Yeah. And we'll keep an eye out for the rest of your work. Thank you, Juliet. Thanks for listening to sources say. I'm Juliet Litman. and Chris Ryan will be back in two weeks.

Tomorrow you got the NBA group chat with Chris Ryan and friends. And you can catch me every Monday morning with John Gonzalez for the Monday heat check. Thanks again for listening.