The Ringer NBA Show - ‘Sources Say’: The Air-balling of Grievances (Ep. 186)

Episode Date: January 3, 2018

The Ringer's Juliet Litman and Chris Ryan kick off the new year by discussing the photo of Baron Davis and Laura Dern (01:00), Isaiah Thomas's return (10:15), Jackie MacMullan's piece on Kyrie Irving (14:45), and the Lakers airing their grievances (24:30). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We want to date's up. Yeah. We're here. What's that sound? Oh, it's the source of stay alarm. I'm Juliet Litman. I'm Chris Ryan. First source to say of the new year.

Happy New Year. Oh, jinks. Bind me a Coke. We're here in 2018. How does it feel? It feels great. It feels like it's been a little bit of a quiet time for our podcast. Like, I don't feel like this has been a season of ill repute yet.

Me neither. There's not a lot of... At least not on the surface. That's true. What's the biggest feud in the NBA right now? I guess it's probably Kyrie and the... And the calves. Okay.

We're going to talk about them. But first I want to start with some love. A few days before the new year, the best development of 2017 came to light. And it was photographs of Laura Dern from Big Little Eyes and several other films and daughter of Bruce Dern. So she's Hollywood royalty. And Star Wars. She was just in The Last Jedi. I haven't seen that yet.

Yeah. Pivotal role. Really? Yeah. So it was a big 2017 for Laura Dern already. Yes. And then she was photographed making out with a former NBA player, Baron Davis, outside of the Beverly Hills Hotel. Yeah.

And this was, I believe, on Thursday, December 28th. I will never forget where I was, but I found out about this. And it made me inordinately happy. It's like the best thing that's happened to me in a really long time. So is that because you're a huge Dernhead? No. Is it because you're a huge Baron person? No.

What's so cool about it? Just like that love, like anyone can find love in the weirdest places. It's such a random couple. Yeah. How do they meet? Like where do Laura Dern and Baron Davis meet? Yeah, I have a bunch of questions about this. I have a theory about it.

Okay. She is having like a big 2017 and she's like behind the scenes and both in front of the camera. And he is like a filmmaker and like he made a documentary with the truly. And I was thinking like maybe they met like trying like trying to like collaborate on a project. This is complete conjecture. So it's a beautifully framed photograph of them kissing. Outside of the Beverly Hill Hotel, yeah. Staged, frankly.

Not in a bad way, but just like, I feel like they knew that they were coming out or something like that. Counterpoint. Outside of the hotel and now we kiss. Counterpoint. He's holding her purse. I'm not saying it's not sincere. I'm just saying it's staged. Like, you thought they just knew there'd be cameras at the Beverly Hills Hotel.

Yeah, I mean, like, if you don't want to get, I'm not trying to negate this love at all. Okay, I think it's real. I think it's beautiful. I don't know if it's important. But I just think it was staged. They kissed outside of the hotel. You know, what I mean?

Like, lovely, lovely composition for the TMZ photograph. And it led me to this question, Juliet. Oh, wow. Okay. It doesn't necessarily have to be in a romantic interlude. But if you were to be photographed by TMZ leaving any Los Angeles building, what would it be? What would you want to be associated with?

Like, true food kitchen? The brood. Excellent. It's the brood. Excellent. Why? But you mean with my, like, with my hot basketball boyfriend or just like in general? Any in general.

But yeah, hot basketball boyfriend coming out of the brood? Yeah, definitely. Me and my hot basketball boyfriend leaving the brood is basically like the biggest dream I can dream right now. That's not true. That's not true. That's not true. And then we would just get in the car and drive to my Malibu home. Okay.

But yeah, if I was going to be like photographed on a date, it would definitely be a museum date for sure. Interesting. Yeah. Okay. I would be worried to go on a museum date at this point in my life because I get really sleepy in museums after a while. And I just feel like I wouldn't be that good of a day. And plus, like, a lot of my charm is tied up in, like, talking a lot. Sure.

And you can't really do that in a museum. That's true. Beverly Hills Hotel. They had some issues where, like, people were protesting because of, like, the ownership for a while. But now it's, it's been resolved. And it's like a real kind of, like, old L.A. place. It makes sense for Barring Davis and Laura Dern. They're both from L.A.

It's true. L.A. kids. Yeah. I mean, you know, he famously went to Crossroads. Like I said, she's Bruce Dern's daughter. And she used to date Ben Harper? She was married to Ben Harper for whom she... She dated Nicholas Cage, right?

Let's just stop for one second. She dated... She was married to Ben Harper. They have two kids. She converted to Judaism for him. Okay. That's like one of the biggest facts in my life. It's something that my family has always been like keenly aware of and discussed.

Why do you care? Because it's just... She joined the tribe. You guys can still recruit. You're like Coach Kay. Still got it. You can still get one and done players. She also dated Common.

Oh, really? Yes. Okay. And yeah, she also. dating Nicholas Cage. She was recently had a spread in architectural digest where she has a very like, she's a very like architectural friendly home, a lot of clean lines. This was covered on Champ Session. There's a courtyard at the middle of her home. It's a real kind of like, you guys talked about Laura Duren's Architectural Digest thing before she started dating Barron's.

Oh, yes. Okay. Big little lies shot her back into relevancy. Yeah. And then and then she want to go or an Emmy for being on the show. Yeah. And I think she'll probably want to go. Yeah. So it's Dern's moment. Oh my God. What if he goes with her to the Golden Gloves on Sunday. Shit. I didn't even think about that. I'm so excited. He's probably bummed that they weren't dating earlier

so he could go to the Star Wars premiere. Although I bet he could go to the Star Wars premiere. Glad you brought that up and I wanted to discuss this. He's recently divorced six months out. He was married to Jordan and Brewster's sister. Interesting. They have kids together. So I'm not sure this is like really that serious.

It also might be new because he has been in L.A. for the last week while she's been in Hawaii. I immediately started tracking. Why was shooting? Why? Shooting something? Just vacation, I think.

Or maybe shooting something, but I think it's just like vacation time. I think it's healthy to have separate vacations. Totally. I mean, also like they just, I assume this is a fairly new relationship. Yeah. But who knows?

What did you think about his attire for their date? Let me re-familiarize myself. I'll tell you what it was. For those of you who were just listening to this podcast, he was wearing a red crew neck sweatshirt with like designer black sweatpants and then red and black Jordans. She looks incredible.

She's wearing a black raincoat type thing with a, not fishnet, but like a kind of printed stocking. Is that what that is? And then these designer ankle boots. Yeah. And like a tweed dress. She's like, she's doing great.

She's going to lunch like near Columbus or El. Alexander McQueen boots? Yes, they are. And she's like going to lunch in Manhattan for like casual lunch with friends. And he's like just like super LA guy right now. Yeah. Like just wearing his sweats. Super for, for, for former.

athlete. Like in college, you always could spot the athletes from like very far away because they're in like their cool sweats. That's what Baron Davis is doing right now. Man, they look deeply into each other. Yes. Thank you, Chris. You doubted it before. Also, like, just, I don't know. I'm so excited about it. It's such a random coupling and I, it's just, it's just brought me so much joy. If you could pair one of another actress in your constellation with an NBA player, what would it be? Wow. Hmm, another actress. Not to break up any marriages or whatever. Let's get Sersher Ronan, an NBA boyfriend.

Oh, man. Yeah. But like a cool, heady one. Not like Andre Drummond. No, no, definitely not. Doug McDermott? Oh, that's interesting. It's interesting.

I think more of like a someone who's a little bit more hipster than that. Rubio? Hmm. That would be like real like international. Hmm. I don't know. She's so great. I'm just so high on her right now.

I just watched all. of her work, like, in the last two months. God, who else should we... Who else needs a cool celebrity girlfriend? I mean, obviously, Lanzobal needs a better girlfriend. No offense to his current girlfriend, but, like, for his... Kuzma? Kuzma?

No. Definitely, def not. You're not in Kuzma? No. I honestly think Blake and Sershaw would be a great couple, but he's taken. But he's an actor as well. So she... He is an act.

They could talk shop. Yeah, exactly. I don't know. I'm just so excited about Baron Davis and Laura Dern. I don't know. This is the kind of story that I was put on the earth. to care about. It was a Christmas gift.

It really was. A Hohenka gift for you. I literally had like 15 simultaneous conversations about it. I texted so many people flying out. I think you actually said in Slack, is this my best pop culture day? Yes, because then on the same day, Prince Harry interviewed Barack Obama on the BBC. And he asked him. Good wife.

Right. They're doing rapid fire questions. And Prince Harry said, good wife or suits. And obviously he chose suits. Barack. I'm sure he likes the good wife more. But being the politician that he is, he said suits. and yeah, I mean, it was basically the best day of my life.

So I don't really know what else to say. Just incredible. We can move on now. But that's just sort of... I mean, I'm here for it. Whatever you want to talk about. I'll never move on. If I ever break up, like I'll always remember.

What's the age similarity between these two? Just that curiosity. He's 38 and she is 51 or 52, I believe. Well, her lady. Yes, she's 50. Excuse me. Baron Davis is 38? Doesn't he feel like he should be like a minimum 45?

Barron Davis, I feel like. Baron Davis has been in my life for the entirety of my life. I can't remember time when he wasn't around. Like somehow. I saw him like out and about recently. Also because the end of his career was marred by such like crazy back problems that I associate more with like deep middle age, you know? Yeah.

He had that brace on, remember? Totally. And then he wanted to come back. And it just, and also he's on a couple of like legendary teams. He had really bad any injury too at the end of his career, right? Really bad. Yeah. Really bad.

I saw him on the beach ones, chilling out. Seems like a very popular guy. I saw him in Beverly Hills recently. And then he's been on Bill. pod. He came through here. He seems like a very congenial dude. Yeah. I don't know. What a great power couple. Like, do they hang out with Reese Witherspoon? I don't know. I don't know. Reese is really busy. She's making a lot of content right now. So is Laura. Okay. I feel like you're rude to Laura Dern. I don't know why. Okay. She was also in Twin Beaks. I watched more Laura Dern content than you did last year. I'm a huge

supporter of her. You definitely did. I'm a huge supporter of her as a new member of the Jewish community. Okay. That's like the biggest deal there is. I am. Okay. This is my main event, but the rest of the basketball world's main event comes tonight. The Celtics are playing the Cavs in Boston. But I don't think IT's going to play, even though he torched the Blazers last night. And it just was awesome to see him back. I am a huge Isaiah Thomas supporter. We all are. Yeah, you're not. Why don't you just come out and say it? It's compulsory. That's why I don't like it. It's not compulsory. He said he wouldn't have played in the playoffs if he knew he wasn't going to be on the Celtics, that he basically sacrificed his body with a, The thought being like, I will be here for the rest of my career. We'll figure it out down the line.

I don't know. I just don't know that I'm okay with this sort of like relitigating of what happened. I feel, I think it's something incredibly tragic happened to him, his sister dying and then he's still playing is like unbelievably tragic. I wouldn't have played if I had multiple dental surgeries. I wouldn't come to work for like a month if I had the amount of teeth knocked out that he did. I just feel like we're conflating so many different issues. Okay.

Getting traded is a fact of being in the end. NBA. And it sucks that he got treated when he was hurt and really like just a lot of unfortunate circumstances around him. But I'm not really sure what everyone in Cleveland was cheering last night when he took the court for the first time. Well, they were cheering that like there were some people talking about how this hip problem could end his career. Who was saying that though? There was rumors. From who? Okay. I mean, this like the foundation of this podcast is rumors. Now all of a sudden everything has to be triple source. Well, I just, I think he had a really bad hip injury.

that has ruined other people's careers in the past. I think he's really likable and he's fun to watch and he was an amazing dynamo last year and he carried that Boston team. But I just think this sort of like, we all have to root for Isaiah. I think that that happens for everybody. And I am sitting across the table from someone whose favorite moment of last year was literally Kobe's retirement, number retirement celebration. But it's not because he deserved it because it was so over the top and absurd.

Okay, but you really loved it. I mean, I'm not saying Isaiah is anywhere close. Yeah. And so the Cavs fans were trying to welcome him to the team. I agree with you that there's definitely like on one side. He's like the only reason this keeps coming up is because people keep asking me about it. And then on the other side, he's doing like little mini docs about his like exit from Boston. I think he's pissed off at Dainee-Aange.

I think he probably would not have played during the playoffs with like, if he was like, I'm at 60%. I could really aggravate this hip injury. But this is a special team, this special moment. I'm going to push forward. And he did. And he tried and they lost. But, you know, I mean, I think he has every right to feel a little. away about it, for sure.

I completely agree. I think Boston used him up and trade him. I am not a feelings denier. I encourage everyone to feel their feelings. And I completely support it. But I'm just saying, like, me as like a fan of basketball, I don't understand why I have to like be living my life for Isaiah Thomas's return. Okay.

I get it. I get it. It's fine. Sorry. No, I don't, I'm not personally invested in his return or his exit. I just really like watching him play. Me too. And I think he got screwed a little bit.

And it makes the Cavs more fun and a better team. Yeah, and they actually, like, it was a nice little gear change because, you know, just for the whole year, you've been watching, like, Collarone and whoever else they can muster up to play point guard. And Isaiah just has, he's still really bad on defense, but he has just like a little bit of a spark. He's like a different pace for that. Yeah, he's a great player. And it's like exciting, exciting that he's back. But I'm just saying the sort of like, I can't believe it.

Like, thank God he's back on the court. That's just like every time somebody goes down. That's just, oh, no culture. It's like, oh, no, not AD culture. Yeah, I guess so. Yeah, it's like we have no vocabulary anymore to talk about injuries that, like, you make it sound like it's saving Private Ryan when these guys fall down. Yeah.

And it's like ridiculous. Yeah. It's like the folklore of Isaiah Thomas based on one season is completely out of hand. Like the tragedy of his sister is like so horrible. And I don't want to like minimize that at all. I think that he actually, it's almost like this old fashioned thing where he was like this, like you said, folk hero. Yeah.

And because of social media, folk heroes are just like insane. And they're just also like, you just get so annoyed by it. Whereas like if this is just like on the back page of the Boston Herald in 1994, you wouldn't give a shit. Right. Yeah. It's just like, it's just a lot. So anyway, he's out playing tonight.

Okay. But this story churns and turns and turns. So for a while, it's been on Isaiah where it's like, was Isaiah mad at Danny? Did Isaiah want to play in the playoffs if you knew he was going to be dealt, yada yada, and when's he going to come back? And they're playing tonight. I don't, they would say that he was not going to play tonight. I don't know now if that might be changed.

This is a back-to-back for them. Yeah. But this morning, Jackie Mack on ESPN.com, dropped a big Kyrie feature. And just every time you think maybe Kyrie is like wrapped up like his speech that he's been giving this season, he just dials up some more stuff. She did. I guarantee. I can't guarantee. But I would strongly believe that he probably said something like weird like Earth's Flat stuff that she just didn't print.

Well, let me just say. I think Jackie Mack might be my favorite. basketball writer. I think so too. I totally agree. She doesn't, there's not the same kind of like sentimentality. Like, doesn't drench her writing, which I'm so sick of. Yeah. And she gets, she obviously gets really good access. And she had more, like, named sources than any profile I can remember in recent history. There's also, like, a grace and a calmness to, like, her writing that I really respond to you right now. There's no sort of like, here's my big drop. Like, read it up, bitches. Right. She's like, I can imagine if Jackie McMullen was like,

Here's my drop, bitches. She really is like the model for these kinds of stories. I can't believe there are two people who host a podcast that starts with an alarm and is just about like sources say and it screamed about Baron Davis and Lorraine. It's really all about the grace with which Jackie McMorland handles herself. I like how she names her sources. I do too. There's very few unnames in there and that is increasingly rare in the NBA.

I only had to wonder like one time like, huh, I wonder who said this. So this is an interesting piece because I really encourage people to read it. because it kind of begins as a Kyrie profile. Yes. And most of the times what happens when you get like a profile going is there is a tacit agreement with the subject that, at least in sports media, that things are just going to be somewhat told from that subject's perspective, right?

Or that it's not going to be necessarily all flattering, but that a lot of the stuff is going to be filtered through their lens. And what's interesting about this piece is that it's initially about Kyrie and it's about Kyrie's life, really. And then it kind of gets into Cleveland and it kind of changes perspective a little bit. And it's more about not only like what he was frustrated by in Cleveland, but maybe what was frustrating about him in Cleveland.

Yes. So there's a specific scene where they were running, they were playing in practice. And Tyloo came up to Kyrie Irving and was just like, you got to slow, you need to speed up the tempo. So we can get more shots. So we can get more shots. He's just basically, and Kyrie was just like...

And he says specifically for RJ and JR. Yes. And Kyrie's just basically like, I can get shots no matter what tempo. Like I don't need to play at a fast tempo. Like I can get... Because he can create space like... Yeah. From a standstill.

And Tyroloo is like, well, it's for other players on the team. It's about getting the ball to these guys. And he goes, that's LeBron's job. He says that's number 23's job. Right. He doesn't even say LeBron. Right. Which is fascinating.

Yes. Sounds like a real prick. Yes. And also somebody who was just thinking about things from their perspective of like, I know what I'm capable of. It's up to these other guys to be capable of it as well. Yeah.

And also, like, this is another guy's job. It's also very sort of like, like without emotion. Like, this is what I do here. This is what he does. And like, I'm going to do my thing and he does his.

What I was really fascinating to me about this piece, though, and it's something that I don't think goes remarked upon a lot because this is a pretty unique trade in a lot of ways, like, at least in terms of the way it's been talked about afterwards, because if you think back from some of the other things where people have forced themselves off teams, like whether it was PG last year with the Pacers

or Mello even back from the Nuggets days like when Mello basically was like this is where I just want to get out of here and this is where I want to go and you should trade me now. This Kyrie trade is, it seems like a lot more rooted in Kyrie's conception of himself.

And it has like a real kind of normalcy to it where you're like, oh yeah, maybe you were just tired of being in this specific situation. And it sounds like almost going to the finals took away some of the luster of being in Cleveland frame. Sure. It's like sort of like

he got to the mountaintop. Yeah, it's like, what else can I really do here with LeBron? Yeah, there's a couple of anecdotes about how he's always like looking for a new challenge. I forget which one of his team,

former teammates said it, but it was like he, or he asked him on Shumpert to ambush him in the layup line before game so he could like practice his finishes. And he's like, Kyrie makes things harder on himself on purpose. Yeah.

And there's also a great anecdote at the beginning about when he first meets Michael Kid, Gilchrist in high school and how he just sort of like brings it to him. And Kyrie just seems like a low owner who wants to like be his best and like test himself, which doesn't necessarily lend itself to being a great teammate. Though it does seem like he has quite a few,

like he's still friendly with the former Cavs. Yeah, for sure. I think none of these things are as soap operaries. They probably come off in print. I think that also one thing this piece does is it's been rumored for a while that Kyrie was pissed that the Cavs thought about trading him for to get Paul Jordan. For the first time to get Eric Bledsoe. Yeah.

And when Dan Gilbert was still there. And because Eric Bledsoe was a clutched client. And it was like LeBron pulling the strings. And LeBrod is openly said like, that's nuts. That's not true. Yeah. That had been rumored for a while.

I don't think it'd been committed to print before. But so it's sort of like almost like a... Yeah, I think Win Horse had talked about it. Like people have talked about it, but it was... It's been mentioned, but it hasn't been like confirmed or like sources, like this kind of like sourcing or whatever. So now that's like part of the record. That's kind of interesting.

It changes the timeline of how we think about the Kyrie trade a little bit. And it also like, one of my big takeaways for this as a Kyrie defender is like, like Dan Gilbert just breeds chaos. Like that's kind of like underlying the Cleveland section. Yeah. where she's like, you know, Jackie points out that he never extends any of his GMs. And she, he met, Gilbert met with Kyrie and his agent, Jeff Lexler. And then he went to Vegas for Summer League.

And that's when all the details came out. And like all the basketball world is in Vegas together. And it just sort of made it. It actually, I thought in some ways, absolved Kyrie a little bit and also absolved LeBron and just made it seem like the calves were a mess over the summer. Yeah. I think, I mean, there's also this underlying plot line that came up in a Sports Illustrated post off of this or this morning too which is just the idea that

part of the reason why Kyrie also wanted out was just the lack of clarity on LeBron's. Now that feels like a little like counter programming to me like well it's not my fault like LeBron won't commit to Cleveland why should I you know and if I can get out all the getting's good and go to a contending team like I'll do that but it's where's your head at in terms of

I feel like the LeBron exit stuff has been remarkably well handled by LeBron this season. It has not become something like with Oklahoma I think when they were losing games it became like should they trade Paul Georgia at this trade deadline to get whatever they can from them

what are they going to do now that they have mellow on their books and stuff but LeBron has been every once in a while some you'll just be like he's going to L.A. We wrote about how Houston is a fit for him people have talked about Philly but if LeBron stays healthy he's going to be the MVP this season especially now that Hardin's going to be out for a few weeks probably

right yeah you know and I think that he's putting up his MVP number season that when Horace had before like when his what his PR is as high he's he's always won the MVP so I don't know I I kind of see another one two year deal one year one player option it may it may not be good for the calves in terms of their long term planning but it's probably good for Cleveland in terms of being the epicenter of the NBA yeah and I guess it also just depends on like what are the other options like I don't know if the Lakers are really that appealing I mean everyone says we're going to get into

that yeah I'll talk about them in a minute but like you're playing with Dwayne Wade if they figure things out with IT like what Why would you want to leave? Yeah, they have the pick. They can trade it or they can use it. Kevin Love's playing much better. It seems like also... Still a soft conference.

This is like the fourth year for Kevin Love and LeBron together. And it seems like they've actually really developed like a chemistry on the court in a way that you forget, especially with these super teams. Like sometimes it takes a couple of seasons for guys to get used to each other. And their bodies go through changes. They change positions. They change styles. Like it's just really interesting to watch them. Who do you think wins tonight?

Boston. Because Cleveland's coming off a back-to-back and that was a pretty tough game. Right. I just, this is the part of the season where I just like, every time anything happens, I'm like, I just look at the schedule and see how many games guys are played. Sure. I noticed that the Celtics celebrated New Year's together via Jalen Brown's Instagram. He did like a slideshow. And this was alerted to me by our good friend, intern Andrew Sharp.

Sharp. They all went out somewhere and like for some reason, Jalen Brown tagged it at like this place, the new leaf, which is like a juice place in Nita, Massachusetts. Okay. And I was like trying to figure out where they are. And this is on Jalen Brown's Instagram. This is his most recent post, if you guys want to check it out. And it's like, it looks like they're in, like, a ballroom of a hotel. And I just don't know what kind of, like, deception he's going for.

It's very confusing to me. So you think it's a, it's a new leaf that's inside of a hotel? No. I think he just was like, oh, this is funny. New Year. It's like, it's a turning over a new leaf. So he, like, he, like, probably goes there as his Jews place or something like that. So you think Jalen Brown's making puns in his Instagram tags?

He's very he's very hewress. Don't you know about that? Okay. And then my other thought was Jason Tatum is, he's in these pictures. He's a teen. He's underage. So, like, if they're out of club, they probably don't want to, like, advertise that. Although, I don't know if NBA players worry about that.

Yeah, I mean, why take the Instagram photo in the first place if you're not trying to advertise it? You got to do it for the gram. Okay. So you did it and you pretended like you were at a juice place on New Year's Eve. Yeah, there's this picture of Jason Tatum, Marcus, March, Shane Larkin, and Jalen Brown. And I'm just like, what a quartet. Like, did these four go out together regularly? Two Jays, Marcus and Shane, huh?

Uh-huh. That's great. What a squad. What a crew. It's, it's, I don't know. Where's Kyrie on New Year's? He was there too. Okay.

He was wearing a great leather, uh, velvet blazer. I wasn't sure if maybe he didn't believe in New Year's because the days, like, years aren't actually 365 days. And that's just a construct. I think he believes in New Year's, but I don't know if he, like, acknowledges the spinning of the Earth. So it might mean something different to him. Right. Right. Like, maybe it's just like a night you stay up late.

Who knows? Who knows? Um, okay. Now we can move on to the Lakers. Yeah, Bill O.ram and the, uh, O. register. He had an article the other day about the Lakers having a team meeting, sort of airing some grievances that Julius Randall was his minutes and like his

sort of role in the team was sort of an issue and that the players talk to the coaches. One of their forwards was upset about minutes. What? I'm so surprised. We are seeing the Lakers stress test about like whether or not you can have all this excitement about young players when there is also the major rumor that most of these young players might be used as make weights or need to get jettison to make cap room for multiple all-MBA players.

I really want to believe in Luke Walton, but he's not giving me a lot to work with. It's not necessarily his fault. Yes. But there's definitely not a lot of good personnel management going on with this team. Yeah, I think that Luke Walton would like to be running warrior stuff. And it turns out that much like running the triangle with the Bulls, like Warrior stuff looks good when Steph Curry is the point guard. Yeah.

And Draymond Green is your point forward. but it doesn't look great when it's these guys. Yeah, it's tough. I do think Brandon Ingram is good. I think Brandon Ingram is good too. And Coos is legit. Yeah. Where are you out on Lanzo Ball?

I think all the rookies have gotten out of their incredible of one of the microscope and now can just be rookies now. That's my take. So Tatum continues to be good and you get good Dennis Smith night nights. But for the most part, I think a lot of these rookies have like stepped into. the like, oh, it's really hard to play basketball in the NBA for 82 games. Yeah. I just think.

The Lakers are in trouble, though. The Lakers are one and nine in their last 10. They suck. They do suck. Yeah. And they're like, there's just, we know this was going to happen, though. We knew that the Lakers, like, the first six weeks would be, like, really fun. And then they were just to be really bad and be a mess.

So they are fun to watch on a night-to-night basis. They have cool players. Like, it's fun to watch Nance. It's fun to watch Kuzma. It's fun to watch Ingram. Lonzo makes interesting passes. KCP, you never know what's going to happen. I just don't know what the plan is.

Like I know they say it's like a two max players and get rid of this team. Well, it's not even, it's not unlike the, the, the calves in that sense where it's like the plan is to win as many games as you can. But like I, they obviously are. I don't, I think it's interesting because Polinka, I bet would build through the draft and put together little pieces. Right. Whereas it's like, I just don't think you can keep magic away from the lights. He's going to want to get an all like a big time NBA talent. Yeah.

By the way, the most insane thing about Kobe Day, Kobe Knight, was Magic saying that Kobe was the most important Laker of all time. That was crazy. That was absolutely insane. Just want to throw that out there. Anyway, yeah, like, show me a team that has done that, like, there's no, there's not a lot of evidence that, you know, going after pre-agents will basically be the better path to winning a championship. Yeah, yeah, well, we'll see. Cavs not, notwithstanding, but LeBron's an exception. to every role in the NBA.

We'll see when the Thunder are the Finals. When the Thunder and the Finals, I mean, today Russ did say that. Yeah, they said, like, what's your pitch to Paul George to stay? And he's like, when a championship beat that pitch. Yeah. Russ is still good.

Russ is still got it. The Thunder are not dead yet. Speaking of Paul George, he said today, this is from reporting by Ramona Shelburne, that the tampering charge was the result of him having a conversation with Brian Shaw, but the official released from the,

the league had said it was Polinka talking to his agent. Yeah. Dun, done, done. This is tough, man. I think the Lakers are,

like, the Lakers are kind of that spot now where it's like, anytime they make a move, I think there's going to be a lot of scrutiny on them. I don't think they're going to get like tampering charges all the time. But it'll be interesting to see. I'll be interested to see whether or not, if this Lakers team is just garbage for the rest of the season,

are they just like, hey, let's just get rid of these guys. And we'll trade, Randall will trade Clarkson, we'll trade. everybody but ball, maybe? I mean, I guess they'd want to keep Ingram, but if they, if they, if they,

it's going to be tough, tough to make a lot of space for these guys. Question. Who would you rather have? Lonzo Ball or Markell Fultz? Markle Fultz. You would? Yeah. Are you serious?

Yeah. I did not expect you to say that. You think I was going to say Lanzo Ball? Fultz has not, like he can't play in the NBA. I'm all in on Fultz. Okay. Explain to me the case for Fultz as it stands today. What's the case against him?

He just hasn't played yet. He, I mean, like, he's hurt. Should we just review the official, like, talk from the Sixers? Like, their release earlier this season, this week was completely crazy. It said that he's now available for practice and being reintegrated into team activities. Yeah.

Who has ever needed to be reintegrated after playing, like, five games? He had a shoulder imbalance. Okay. Have you figured out what that is, by the way? No, I have it. Me neither. I don't think it's real. Just throwing that out there.

Fultz has been, there's been some, a very funny thing this week has been the raw footage of Fultz practicing at the Sixers gym. You arrive at work each day and immediately start watching it. Yes, I start watching it. And then it's like Fultz playing against a coach and bricking 15 footers. And then at the end of the day, the Sixers put up a tweet of like, it was like watching a propaganda film. It was like seeing like you could take the raw footage of Fultz like uninspired league practicing. and then put a trap beat over it and have Fultz do like two layups

against like bench guys and it's like, look who's back. It's Fultz, baby. But I still believe. I don't know. I think he's going to be fine. I think he's going to be really good. Okay.

Why did every draft guy say he was the number one pick? Because he had a good shot, but he's completely changed his shot. Now he looks bad. Okay, but I saw him in July and he was fine. I don't think this could go this bad this fast. I think it's a combination of something we're not hearing about

and actually a shoulder thing, and I think he's going to be okay, and I think he's going to be really good. I just want to concern control a little bit more. I'm concerned about Embed. Okay, let's hear it. Because bad backs are bad? Yeah, and I just think that he probably should be taking off more games than he is,

like, and playing less. Like when they went to, they played against the Thunder, and that was triple overtime, he was clearly laboring up the court, and hadn't played the previous game, because of a bad back. Yes.

And I just don't know if that, I'm just concerned about how that injury or that nagging ailment is being managed. And there's nothing scarier than Mbid falling and it happens like 10 times a game.

So, well, that was this whole thing that he said he likes to fall because like his limbs go loose and is less like, it's not as much impact. Like releases the tension

for him? I don't know about that. But that sounds like some weird Sixers medical jargon. I don't know, Juliet. I don't know what I want. I can tell that they want

to get into the playoffs. I think that they really want to get into the playoffs. And it's, they're 17 and 19. They're in 10th. And it's just so funny. It's like for the Sixers, people are like,

oh, are they playing and be too much? Like, is he okay? Is he okay? But then, like, the Knicks are one game better and everybody's just like, what an inspirational,

like, story about Christops and the bad news bears. So it's just like, one or two games changes the way people think about you. They had a really nice start to the season. I think the difference of the Knicks, though,

is that they were expected to be like a lot worse than they are. Yes. I think also, there's like a I don't know anything about this but it just seems to me that like Brett Brown is not the guy that Brian Colangelo hired. If this team is like

super bad this year, I don't know if Brett Brown comes back the following year and he, I think that when I see him playing guys and I'm like why are you know when I I sometimes wonder about some of his rotations about whether or not he's in a little bit of a win now mode. Uh huh.

Well I think I think the process trusters also want it. Also Ben Simmons is so exciting but he's so limited. He's a rookie. Yes. But, like, you just want him to be better than he is. He's quite good. He's going to be able to shoot a shot. Yeah.

Yeah. Outside of two feet. Yeah. Good luck, Ben. Okay. Shout out to the Sixers. I hope they can figure it out. I will say one thing, positive about Joelle Embed.

No idea what he did for New Year's. He's not, like, being caught on TMZ. He's not, like, DMing randoms. I think that's very positive. I'm not joking. I'm serious. That's great. Yeah, I think I'm pretty, I'm okay with Embed

having, like, a tight back. It's like, that's normal. He plays really hard. He takes a lot of physical contact. It's probably tough being like a seven-footer who flies on planes and sleeps in different hotel beds all the time. But I agree with you. I think he could take a few more games off.

I just want as much M-B'd for over as long a period of time as possible. The thing is that when they don't have M-B, they suck. They're bad. I know. And that's why we got to protect M-Bed. Bring back Folds. Come on, Marquil. Save the season.

Yeah. Okay. Thanks for listening. I will be, I'm very available if anyone needs, Laura Dern or Baron Davis updates. Let us know where you'd like your TMZ photos staged listeners. Good luck beating the bro. I mean, I can't think of anything better than me and my basketball.

It doesn't have to be Los Angeles. You know, it could be wherever your hometown is. Okay. Cool. Thanks for listening. And we'll be back in two weeks. Yeah, I saw we was gone. No.

Yeah. Here's my big drop. Like, read it up, bitches. Right. Right.