The Ringer NBA Show - The Hawks?! | The Answer

Episode Date: March 19, 2021

Chris is joined by writer and Hawks fan Rembert Browne to discuss what it’s been like rooting for the Hawks in their up-and-down season and their current seven-game win streak (03:00). Later, Chris is joined by The Ringer’s Kevin O’Connor to discuss whether all bad teams are a Nate McMillan away from being good, how Bogdan Bogdanovic has changed the dynamic of the team since returning from injury, and more (17:00). Host: Chris Ryan Guest: Rembert Browne and Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Football season is never over. The Ringer NFL show has got all your football needs covered from free agency to the draft and so much more. Check out the Ringer NFL show on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello and welcome to The Ringer NBA show. It is The Answer. My name is Chris Ryan. I'm your host. And this week, the Hawks, exclamation point question mark.

That's the question. What's up with the Hawks? They just rattle off seven in a row. Not against exactly the Justice League, but they've, They beat some teams. Handily handled the Thunder last night. We're recording this on Friday morning. So last night, they beat the Thunder by double digits.

They look competent under Nate McMillan. They seem to be playing with a lot more chemistry and harmony than they were under Lloyd Pierce. They're getting some guys back from injury like Bogi Bogdanovich who seems to be playing at like his sort of like his real like Sacramento Heights right now. So you're seeing like exactly why Travis Scheng, the GM and the Hawks, went after bogey to come in and energize that that offense and he's doing some really interesting things with the second unit but the reason why i wanted to talk about them is that it's really

easy to give up on teams and the league you know i think it's really easy to see a team kind of start to nose dive put them in the uh do not remind me to watch this team on the league pass at the anti league pass rankings you might check in on trey young a little bit but like there's really no reason to and then because these teams are so bunched together this year because you've got so many teams like in and around a couple of games under 500 or right around 500, if you do something like what the Hawks just did, which is rattle off seven in a row, all of a sudden you're in fifth place in the Eastern Conference. That's all it takes.

And I was really fascinated by this transformation because it's a transformation that happened pretty subtly with Nate McMillan coming in to replace Lloyd Pierce. I wanted to talk to my buddy, Rembert Brown, who is a native of Atlanta and a Hawks fan, about how it feels to be cheering for this up and down team this season. And then I wanted to talk to Kevin O'Connor from the Ringer a little bit about what Nate McMillan is done here and what Travis Schlink, the GM, is kind of building towards because I think what his plan for the team is kind of unique among a lot of teams. You're seeing a guy who drafted Trey Young in the year of the Luca Donchish draft, which will probably be debated for the next 10 years. And then subsequently, he's been drafting almost for fit. And he's been drafting for role players.

He's not always drafting for maximum upside dude, no matter what we already have on the roster. It seems like he's putting together a team on the fly out of the draft, which is not something you see all the time. So I want to talk to Kevin, especially since we have the draft guide coming up. The draft guide is up on the ringer right now. I wanted to see what Kev thought about what Travis Schlank has been doing. So let's get into the answer and figure out what's going on with the Hawks.

I wanted to talk about the Hawks. There's only one person I wanted to talk about them with. It's Rembert Brown. What's up, man? My guy, it's so good to see you to talk to you, to talk about my favorite thing to talk about when things are going just immediately well. It's like, let me talk hyperbolicly about the hawks immediately. Nothing that makes you happier than a streaking hawks.

You showed up in my phone. It's a streaking hawk. And boom, now we're talking about the hawks. I can't wait. So you were saying when was the last time you talked about the hawks in any kind of professional capacity? So it was really funny. I was doing some promotion for the,

the podcast I was doing over the holidays about the Georgia flipping blue gaining ground. And I was like, I just want to talk to everyone in Atlanta about this and talked about the Hawks on January 1st when they were four and one. And the group texts, I have a group text literally of like, it's nine of us.

It's called 500 or better. Which is just what we want for the Hawks. And yeah, I was saying some wild stuff. I said, you know, Lloyd Pierce is a molder of men and that he was going to take this team to the promised lad. I was like, I was just saying everything that I typically say when an Atlanta sports team is doing well, which is like this is the year. And then immediately it fell off the rails. Yeah, immediately you started getting injuries. Immediately or soon after that there were started to become athletic tell-alls about dissension within the locker room.

Trey Young, John Collins, not getting along. Dude's just getting hurt for extended periods of time. Lloyd loses his job. Nate McMillan comes in. And granted, against a pretty light schedule, the Hawks, A.K.A. the Nate Hawks, which I saw them referred to on Peach Tree Hoops, which I'm 100% approval rating of that.

Love the Natehawks. They go on this seven-game winning streak, and they're about to walk right into a bussaw with an LA trip, and then also Golden State, Denver, Phoenix. So I'm not even sure what we're going to be. If we did this podcast in two weeks, I don't know how you would be feeling. We would never do this podcast in two weeks. We have to do it when things are just so incredible.

We have to talk about it right then. So you watched the Hawks, they did the Thunder last night, a usually very competitive Thunder team that they completely handled them. What did you see last night? What did you like that you saw when you were watching the Hawks? So there is a version of the Hawks that I love, which is one that I genuinely feel like even when they get down, they believe that the game's not over.

And I can, I see it a lot on, I feel like offense, they're always just excited to be playing basketball. But also defense, it's like, hey. Defense, they're excited to be playing offense. Yeah, there's like, oh, like we could actually get a stop and play more offense instead of like, oh, this is when they come score on us,

and now we have to go score again, or we're going to go down again. So that's what I've seen progressively in the, to quote the Atlanta Hawks Twitter handle, the H-A-W-W-W-W-W-KS, because they love to track our wins. But yeah, seven game, like, what's that about? Well, it's weird.

I love it. It's terrifying. With a conference, it's so bunched up like that, though. If you put together seven wins, you are in fifth place, like the Hawks. They get out from under this play and stuff. Now, granted, they could go out and lose five of their next seven and be back where they started with this.

But I think one thing that I've seen with McMillan so far is he knows how to stop the bleeding when it happens. He can just kind of like take care of problems on the fly in a way that maybe Pierce wasn't doing. I don't know if that's a fair assessment though. Yeah, I also, yeah, it seems like, well, the thing about Nate, it's funny. It's like he really didn't seem like he wanted the job. Yes.

He was like, y'all, like, I really don't have to. to do this. Like Lloyd was kind of my dude. I'm not even looking to be a head coach really right now. So he doesn't seem like that proud in like what his system is. He's just like, yeah. Like, you know, if something's not working, let's stop it immediately and try something else. Which doesn't seem to be a hallmark of, you know, the Lloyd Pierce system that, you know, had nice runs, but also had us, you know, losing three games in a row, like often.

We just like kept being on three games kids. I think it happened like three or four times. Yeah, I was looking because when I got to Atlanta a couple months ago, we were in 11th, I mean a couple weeks ago, we were in 11th place. And like you were saying with just this run, they're now in like fifth place. Right. Which is how it's going to go until the end of the season in the East. Like we could, like we, there's no telling how this team ends up.

But it is nice to see them at least show some life and get spoken about again. Because we were getting to that point in the season where, like, people forget that the Hawks are a team. Even though, like, you know, the Hawks went on a skid. That was such a weird skit. Like, Trey Young just suddenly didn't become an All-Star anymore. People are like, who is- Well, he was also getting blamed, I think, you know, fairly or unfairly for, like, a lot of the worst tendencies in modern basketball. It was, like, this kid is emblematic of everything that's wrong.

with contemporary NBA ball, which like, you know, whether it's the mimicking of Steph's like deep shooting is one thing, but like the constant foul hunting and obviously like complaining a lot, which is something that Luca does too, so it's not like it's exclusive to trade a bitch and moat about calls. But I wanted to ask you this. You said that your text thread was called 500 or better. And that that is kind of like, I am also a fan of mediocre basketball teams. I don't think there's any shame in being okay. Is that enough for you? Like, you came from the highs of the bud era,

which were actually weirdly, like probably a little bit more, I would imagine disorienting because you were so good in the regular season, and then LeBron would just wipe your face off your head. Yep. To go from that, and then there's some years in the wilderness,

and now you're back, if McMillan gives you a Pacers-esque existence of like 500 or better, it maybe get into deep into a first round series, if not even to a second round series in the playoffs. Is that an acceptable Hawks existence for you? I think that's not because I think we've actually started to believe in puzzle pieces actually coming together

to become one of those like Sixers teams or one of those teams that we don't have to fully tank. We could actually just like, you know, go braves on it and like have like a farm system that actually works with like this kind of rag tag collection of people. I don't think 500 or better gets us back to those underwhelming years, which is like we're good, but who cares? And I've always thought like we're good, but who cares doesn't work for Atlanta sports.

Like I think nobody goes. Yeah, it's like I would rather, to some degree, sometimes I would rather flashy and terrible, but like relevant. than, you know, the perennial 7 seed that gets beat by, like, the Nets for the next four years. Like, that would be a really bummer existence. I'd rather just, like, not watch the Hawks for five years and focus on something else. So, you know, I think Atlanta's in this weird cycle of, like, the Falcons are just, like, not a team to think about right now. So now it's like, okay, now I really got to focus on the Hawks.

And now people are caring about the Hawks because of Trey and all this other stuff. So to just be mediocre feels kind of a bummer. Is he the biggest Atlanta athlete right now? He is, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, yeah. I think, I mean, you know, I love me some Ronald Acuna Jr.

Yeah, I was wondering if that if Ronald was. But just like, just the NBA is just, it's just bigger. And I think Trey, again, Trey has that little bit of like exciting vickness to him where it's like, I don't know if this is going to result in wins or losses, but people care. Yeah. And that's tight.

But the team's also good. We're approaching the trade deadline. I don't care about basketball value. I'm talking about value to REM. Whatever. Let's just call it like the stat is REM. It's like P-E-R. Who's untradable to you based on REM?

Right now, number one, Tony Snell. Yes. Now, how much of that has to do with the fact that we found out recently that Tony Snell has a Blackberry? Tony Snell is, he's like, he's... This is true, by the way, apparently. Yeah, yeah.

Tony Snell, Blackberry game winning shot, Tony Snell. I just... My thing is like, what have you proven to me in the last seven days? In the last seven days, Tony Stale is a Hall of Famer, so he's untradable. You know, like some of the... like some of the other guys, I'm like, you know, like, I know you're better, but what have you done for me lately? I think, in reality, I think I want to see a playoff healthy Capella. I just like, I want to see this like weird experiment that the Hawks are trying to pull off actually work.

Because there's like, there's a really amazing world in which having Rondo come off the bench and tight playoff series is like the greatest thing in the world. Like it could actually work. Bogie and Rondo coming off the bench is like a pretty decent second unit if you get D'Andre Hunter and Cam Reddish back. Yeah. Another person, the other, I won't say, I'd say in my seven days, what's happened in the last seven days metric,

the other Nate that we have, Nate Knight, Nathan Knight. Yeah. Yeah. There's something about watching him dunk. I think it was when we were playing Toronto. he dunked on someone in the MLK jersey, and it was like the funniest thing I've ever seen. I was like, oh, that's like a rock and jock eight-pointer.

If you dunk on someone with two hands in an MLK jersey, I was like, okay, yeah. He's got to make it to at least a playoff squad. We can't lose him. He's got too much of the right energy for me. What about John the Baptist? Because he's the guy who, because he's a restrictive free agent, and I think that there's been some talk about other teams

having interest in him, specifically the wolves, which I thought was kind of weird. But he's the guy who I think has been most vocal when it comes to the Trey stuff and just being like, this is not necessarily Trey's team. Like, I might be better than him.

You didn't say that, but like you can kind of get the vibe from John Collins where he's like, this is my team. Like maybe John, maybe he doesn't have like a Twitter account or a cable subscription and he's like under the impression

that he is the Hawks franchise player. He's like North Korea. He's only getting John Collins clips. He has no idea that. That anyone else can show it on SportsCenter? Yeah. You know, I'm hoping that with Big Nate at the helm, this maybe deals with some of the Collins issues

because I'd hate for... There's something about drama ruining a not great team that's not allowed. Like, I need the big personalities to stay on, like, the big teams. Like, for us, it's like, we don't have... have time for big personalities. We just need to try to score more points than the other team every game. Like we just need to focus on the nuts and the bolts of winning consecutive basketball

games. And so I've just been hoping all year that, like, I think Collins has too much of an upside to lose, but I don't want to, I hate just chalking people off as like locker room cancers, like those type of people. I don't want to go there with them. I just want them to just work it out. Yeah. My concern with Collins would be the price you pay to keep him

is actually just like way more than you would want and that he would wind up tying up too much money for your team when you could play around with that cash otherwise. But I think he stays. I just like watching him and trade play together, it's so interesting to know that they might not like each other because those alley-oops are just like one of the best things in the NBA right now. Yeah.

It's really good. There's like big AAU energy on the Hawks right now. Yeah. And Trey and Collins feel like the two dudes from like opposite sides of Atlanta that got put on the same AAU team. And they're like the best kid from the east side and the best kid from the west side. But they're not used to not being the dude. It's like very AAU energy. And so I would just like, I'm just hoping Nate like one just like, because he's still interesting.

him. I'm pretty sure. That'll change. Yeah, I just hope that with this mid-season coaching change and this streak, which, you know, it's probably the longest winning streak most of the Hawks have ever experienced.

I'm just like hoping this excites people. Like, hey, let's like each other. You just got to get back from the West Coast of one piece. I think that's the main thing. Rem, thank you so much for joining me, man. I really appreciate you giving me your time. Of course, man. For you, anything. All right, now I'm joined by Kevin O'Connor.

Kevin, first of all, congratulations on another year, another draft guide. Thank you, Chris. It's fun doing it. We have the draft guide. Mike and Lindsay, they do amazing stuff with that guide. Yeah, everybody who works so hard on this thing, and it's one of the things we're most proud of at the company, honestly. So it's really cool to see it come to fruition. You've got to check out all the work that went into it.

And Kevin does such a good job tracking this year's draft class as they, like, as we sort of round the corner into draft season. But, Kev, the reason one I wanted to talk to you today is I remember, very distinctly, especially right when Travis Schlink got hired to be the GM of Golden's Day. I think that is right around when you and I started working together at the ringer, or shortly thereafter. And he was one of the guys and the Hawks were one of the teams that I feel like you've consistently pitched as a team of interest for you, that you were like, I want to go check these guys out. I think something interesting is happening down here. We get into the season. Obviously, I just talked about this a little bit with Remberg about fan expectations and his

relationship to the Hawks, but we get into this season. And after some injuries and some locker room stuff, Lloyd Pierce loses his job, Nate McMillan comes in and takes a team that seemed like it was basically falling apart and makes them almost immediately competent, rattling off seven games in a row. So my question to you, Kevin, is, are all bad teams just a Nate McMillan away from being good? I mean, if only every team could have a Nate McMillan, huh? Chris? The NBA would be a better league.

with Atlanta you know I think certain teams are a coach away but there's not many of them though like with Atlanta their issues like that athletic story about the problems that players had with Lloyd Pierce seemed very much to do with

definition of roles and just the relationship like person to person like Cam Ranish had that quote in this well not a quote but like the behind the scenes quote anonymous quote about him not feeling like he was valued felt like he was getting picked

on. McMillan seems to have a better relationship with these guys. And as a coach, like I don't, I don't see many changes from a system point of view with what Atlanta's doing. That's what I was wondering. Yeah, but like there's definitely differences with what he calls a timeout and his rotations.

And that stuff matters, right? Like a lot. There was a part in that athletic story that you're referencing where they mentioned a game that Lloyd Pierce was absent from while he was still the coach. And McMillan coached for him. and that it was strikingly obvious that like just minor rotational things and just timeout calls and just that that game management stuff that I don't think that we really as a fan

I don't really notice that that much sometimes I get like I do pick up on rotation stuff but when to have a time out and stuff like that especially for a young team that are susceptible to giving up chunks of points on defense you got to know how to manage that right yeah no doubt about it. And, you know, there's a couple instances in a game earlier this week where the other team made a run and McMillan calls a timeout after five points, not waiting for it to get the 10-0 run, 11-0 run, 12-0 run. He tries to end it early. And, you know, I think all these little things are adding up to help. And you're also just seeing, you're seeing guys get minutes that weren't getting minutes before. Like Nathan Knight, I know it's silly to say he's just

a role player, but Nathan Knight looked pretty good in preseason, had a really good game early in the year. And then he never played. played at all. And now he's getting consistent minutes and having great nights, shooting three, he's attacking clothes, he has a big dunks. He has a poster every night, it seems. And I think sometimes, you know, coaches

can, like, they fail to self-scout their roster. And McMillan has suddenly shifted that in terms of rotations and who's getting minutes. And that's all helping. But part of it, though, like it, obviously Lloyd Pierce had his issues as a coach, but these guys have also gone

unhealthy. Like, does part of you feel like, he just didn't ever had a chance to succeed. There's so many guys out early in the year. I feel bad. I feel bad for Pierce. No, I mean, go look at their schedule. They, you want to see the Hawk season in nutshell.

Go look at Bogdanovich's game log. Because there's something like four and four or four and five when he goes down. He misses February. They go into the tank. He comes back and they win seven in a row. I mean, he's not necessarily the only reason that happened. Obviously,

that coincided with, with Nate, it coincided with them getting a little healthier, although they also lose, they lose Reddish in that time. They've lost Reddish and Hunter. And he'll be back soon, hopefully. Yeah, but I think that there's definitely something to be said for the fact that Pierce never really got to play with his full roster at all and was blamed a lot for things that were out of his control, like injuries.

I guess I was going to ask you, when you watch Bogdanovich play for them, I was watching them last night against the Thunder, and I thought I kind of, one thing that I think they've had a lot of issues with is what to do when Trey Young's off the court. Like his on-off numbers are pretty, pretty striking. But I saw them playing bogey in a little bit of like a kind of shadow tray roll last night when he was playing with the second unit. And that was part of the plan, you know, when they got him, is to have him be that guy who can, when he shares the floor with tray, push him off ball a little bit.

But, you know, still primarily be the guy coming off screens and handoffs and cut into the room. That's what Bogdanovich is so good at. But what's long been underrated with him is his ability on the ball and his ability to create. and having that guy I mean they signed Rondo too who has not been quite the same as he was in the playoffs last year as Gallo's yeah right Gallo of course was out too

and wasn't the same until recently Gallo hasn't produced like the Gallinari that we know but Bogdanovich is that guy who there's more you can get out of him as a playmaker and even now like even like last science game gave a preview but I still get excited about what Bogdanovich

and Trey Young could potentially be if Trey can be maximized off the ball. That was what I was going to, I was going to ask you this. Do you see a little hardened Kyrie there? Like, not obviously anywhere near as good as those guys, but using Trey in that sort of Kyrie off ball way, the way the nets are currently using it and giving Bogdanovich a little bit more playmaking responsibility. I'd love to see it. I still say with Trey Young, he's brilliant on the ball. That goes without saying. I mean, the average nearly 30 points is such a young player, you know, the last couple of years. And the ability to create

for others is elite. But to take that next step, I think offenses nowadays, the best offenses can beat you in different ways and have different guys who can either, you know, it's simple to say, but shoot,

pass, and dribble, you know, just the basics of offense. And if you have a number of those guys who can do that, Trey Young is going to have to make himself a threat off the ball. He's already a threat to shoot from 34 feet. If he can also become a guy who can run off a screen

and come off a handoff, and Drina 3, I would love to see Trey bring the Steph qualities into his game more so than be like the Hardin or be the dame. He can do that too and that's no knock against those guys. But for Atlanta when you have a 6 foot 1, 180 pound point guard, I'd love to see some more variety with how they use them. And a guy like Bogdanovich, that's sort of what you need. That's sort of what you want next to Trey. So for them, I think that's on Trey to adapt and embrace that, but also for McMillan to push them in that direction. And maybe, maybe when you're winning more games, it's easier to have a guy like Trey Young as good as he is to accept that

responsibility and embrace that responsibility more so than if you're losing and you feel like you get to do it all yourself as a young player. So hopefully, like for Atlanta, that's the next step. But I think it has to be for them to thrive someday in the future in the postseason. I actually quite enjoyed last night's game with the Thunder. And I was like, oh, why, why am I having more phone watching the Hawks tonight than usual. And then I looked and I saw that Tray only took four free throws. And I was kind of wondering whether or not you felt like Nate, it was maybe stripping a little bit of Tray's foul hunting out of him. I hope not. I mean, if you're a Hawks fan, even if it's annoying to watch, it's like, as a fan and there's certain calls where it's like

the NBA should never call that, the rules are what they are. And if you're a Hawks fan, you should be trying to get him to the free throw line as much as you can. Wasn't there like a little tidbit about like on a coach, a coach's call like Lloyd Pierce? like, oh yeah, really like, Lloyd Pierce was like, I hate when guys are looking for fouls

and it was like a repudiation of his own franchise player. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, there was that in the story. Yeah, I mean,

I think, I mean, the rules are with air. That's on the NBA to change how games are officiated. Players should do everything they can to get up the free throw line as is,

I think, personally. Are you happy that the hawks kind of stuck to, stuck to their guns here? I mean, they obviously decided that there should be a coaching change.

But we've seen a couple of teams, not throw up a white flag, but like, you know, because they have pick protections that they're concerned about, like, say, Houston, or they've been ravaged by injuries or, you know, like Cleveland

in the way that they've kind of handled their veterans on their team. I'm kind of impressed that the hawks just like, we're like, you know what, we're making the playoffs. By hook or by crook, whichever coach has to be here, if we have to trade John Collins or not,

like, whatever the case is, like we're making a push for the postseason this year in a kind of soft underbelly of the Eastern Conference. We can do that. I kind of, I wish more teams had like their fight, you know? Yeah. I mean, I think with Atlanta, I still look at them and I think about their future more than anything else. It's, it's just hard for me. How bright is the future? It depends so much on camera edition, DeAndre Hunter, what those guys become. The leap we've seen Hunter take this season. I mean, even when Atlanta, when Atlanta was bad, like, a week you go, you can look at that team and see DeAndre Hunter's development as a real bright spot,

even though he was out. And with Cam Reddish, the struggles, you know, are worrisome. It's hard not to watch Cam Radish and think, is this guy ever going to figure it out offensively? He showed some flashes towards the end of the last season, but fell apart again the beginning of this season, just like he did the beginning of his rookie year. But Cam Reddish, the guy's slank has brought in makes sense around Trey Young. DeAndre Hunter and Cam Reddish. guys who can defend multiple positions, you know, play a low maintenance role for you on offense, but also have the upside to be guys that handle the ball a lot more than a 3-and-D-style role player.

Cameroners has that potential. He has the ability to be a playmaker. It's about really improving his handling, improving his shooting off the dribble. And with Hunter, he's already done that in year two, year three. So with these guys, they do have a bright future. I still look at Trey Young, though, Chris, and I'm like, he's in for a rude awakening, someday in the postseason. And someday it might be a couple months from now.

Yeah, when he gets, yeah. And then like that's in the postseason is where you really find the opposing offense hunting for matchups. Yes. And that is a lot of exposure for a guy if he's not ready for it. Because if teams,

like if a Brooklyn or whoever, decide to play whack a tray as their offense and they just, you know, run P&Rs until they get who they want on him, he's going to be given up like 42 points a night on national television. and it's going to be rough. So we'll see what happens with that.

I was curious about that Reddish and Hunter thing because I remember when those picks happened, it feeling like Schlink was almost drafting for role players and fit rather than absolute maximum upside. Obviously, some mixed results, Hunter is incredible when healthy. Reddish we just talked about has some work to do. But as you just could, you know,

as you're working on the draft guide now and you think a lot about how teams go about putting together their drafting philosophies, I was curious what you thought of the way Schling has made picks over the last year. I think the logic makes a lot of sense because with those guys, Cam Reddish, for example, it's so easy to see Cam Reddish fitting into a three and D role where all he does, his simple offensive responsibilities are catch and shoot,

attack closeouts, make the right pass if it's open, and play your best on defense. Reddish is already a very good defensive player. I mean, he has that side of the floor covered. So with Atlanta, you have a baseline. everything I just said about Reddish applies to Hunter, even though he's a little bit older now. He still has upside. And we've seen that upside this year with Hunter improving on the ball, creating his own shot. So for Schlank, I would assume his logic was,

let's get guys who could fit in at the least as role players next to Trey and give him the defensive support that he will need. Like Trey Young, like you just said, he's going to give up possibly in certain games 40 points because teams are just going to attack him relentlessly. Atlanta's going to be scrambling. in ways that we saw the Celtics do years ago with Isaiah Thomas. Remember the Celtics during his MVP, you know, when he came in fifth for MVP, they had to have these weird unique switches where he was kind of like zoning off ball and they were avoiding everything they could to get him out of those screens. That's what Atlanta will have to do with Trey.

But when you have all that defensive support around him, you can do that. So what Shlank did make sense. Like their roster on paper makes sense with all their young guys, even the guys that they signed with Bogdanovich for the reasons we talked about earlier. So I like what Atlanta's done. I mean, given the circumstances and given like how the challenges are building around Trey, but it still comes down to Trey to me more than anything else and how he evolves.

We have a week until the trade deadline. If you're Shlinked, do you do anything? Do you make any moves? I mean, is Collins worth thinking about? I think it's worth thinking about. I'm not sure we'll see a move actually happen. here because I really like John Collins for all the same reasons with fit around

Trey he's a room runner he can shoot threes for you he's still only 23 I still think his defense can improve over the course of time he can play with Capella or without Capella that versatility playing in two big lineups or as the lone big matters a lot so the defense needs to get better

and there's maybe better fits than having him but it's not a bad fit by any means so what's the offer out there that makes it worth it. Where's the multiple first round draft picks for this young player that's averaged nearly 20 points in the last three years?

Where's that offer that you can't say no to? I don't think it's out there. And neither do any of the executives I talked to this past week or so about what Atlanta might do. Because there were rumors with Collins that like the wolves were interested in him, right? That was like a real like they'd almost... Dallas likes him too.

Dallas likes him too. There's a number of teams that like John Collins. I'm curious whether or not like a move for Atlanta signals a certain amount of confidence in where that roster is right now versus like, you know, if they stand pat, are we, are we to take it that Schlink is like, it's probably not a playoff win for us this year. Like making the playoffs alone would be, would be enough. I'm not sure. I'm not sure those moves are even out there. I know, I know it's silly to say,

but like, who are the guys out there right now in the trade market that can really swing things? You have to, you do mismatch twice a week, you go on pods and stuff, and this is all we want to talk about. I am not seeing the title swing. I'm not seeing the Power Sol Rashid Wallace deal out there right now. It's not. And I mean, even like Kyle Lowry. Kyle Lauer,

as a Sixers fan, Chris, like you've heard the name Kyle Lauery, but then there's all this stuff. Well, no, he's actually not getting traded. You know,

like Harrison Barnes has been out there as a name for like, you know, thinking about these teams in the middle and the east. The Celtics going for Harrison Barnes. Well, Sacramento might not want to train Harrison Barnes. Yeah. The Bulls might not even trade that as young.

So, you have all these teams that could theoretically, you know, unload some veteran players that could help teams that want to contend. And yet it's not happening. And I think that speaks to the addition of the play in tournament this year with those nine and 10 seeds getting opportunities to, you know, face the seven and eight seeds, get in, you know, the postseason, sneak in, maybe make a run or at least get some playoff exposure, playoff experience. So more teams feel like they're in it. Atlanta felt like they were in it. And now they're suddenly pushing for the foresee.

Yeah. Like, there are the evidence that you are in it with just a couple weeks of good basketball. So I would imagine, unless things dramatically change over the next week,

it could be, uh, not a quiet deadline. You'll see guys moved, but not, uh, I agree, deadline with a lot of headlines.

Yeah, it's just too many people out there looking for Jay Crowder and there's only one Jay Crowder. You know what I mean? Like, there's a lot of desire for a defensive wing that can shoot a little bit. And I just don't know if there are enough resources. Kemp,

thank you so much for joining me today, man. It's always a pleasure. Thank you, Chris. Thank you.