The Ringer NBA Show - The Lakers Finally Beat Denver, Orlando Goes Electric, and More From Saturday’s Playoff Slate. | Group Chat

Episode Date: April 28, 2024

Justin and Rob recap Saturday night’s slate starting with the Lakers staving off elimination with a wire to wire win over the Nuggets (2:09). Then they talk about Orlando’s turnaround in the series and if they think the Cavs can bounce back (17:08). They wrap up with the Celtics dominant win over the Heat (32:59) and the Thunder taking a 3-0 on the Pelicans (48:39). The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Justin Verrier and Rob Mahoney Producer: Isaiah Blakely Additional Production Supervision: Ben Cruz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Have you ever wondered about the meaning behind your favorite song lyric or why certain melodies make your skin tingle? I'm Cole Kushner and these are the kinds of questions I try to answer on Dissect, a podcast that dives deep into one album per season examining the music, lyrics, and meaning of one song per episode. I've dissected full albums by Kendrick Lamar, Radiohead, Tyro the Creator, Beyonce, Kanye, and more. Our latest season just launched all about MF Doom's Mad Villany. Listen to Dissect wherever you get your podcast because great art deserves more than a swipe. Group chat. I am Justin Barrier. No big wads today, but we got the big dog. Rob Mahoney. What's up, Rob? Today, Justin, what's going on? Look, I come to you on the worst day of the playoff so far. How does that feel to you?

I'm still getting over that quick transition. You just men from that's how, look, that's why we're pros. Full-throated woof to just like getting into the middle of a podcast. What's funny is we've prepared a drop for this exact situation. You don't even need it. But you just, you just did it live and in person. I love it. So I'm here for, you know, dial it up on demand. What are we, if not performing circus animals, Justin? I guess this is where we find ourselves. Interesting slate of games today on Saturday. I wouldn't say that this was the best day for the first round, although overall, I guess, the first round probably hasn't met maybe the expectations going into it. Yeah, a lot of series that feel like they're winding down, if not already effectively closed.

But today in particular, three of the losing teams didn't even break 90 points. Just some sludge fests going on with teams that could not cut it against their respective opponents. Yes. I'm very hopeful for the second round

because it seems like we're cutting through some of the riffraff that it was pretty good in the regular season, but now we're going to get to the creme de la creme. But first, the Lakers, unfortunately, or fortunately are hanging on by a thread here. They finally, after 11 straight losses, to the Denver Nuggets.

They vanquished the Denver Nuggets the Lakers did. And this is their Super Bowl. Congrats to the Los Angeles Lakers. Yeah, I mean, at some point you have to put your foot down and say, you're not going to beat us 12 times in a row. So congratulations to them.

And the Nuggets, we have to say, true gentlemen, doffed their caps, preparing for the gentleman's sweep in five. It felt there, you know, there were some moments where it certainly felt like Denver was revving up

for their inevitable second half run, especially in the fourth quarter. but we were just knocked over the head with symbolism when LeBron blew up a handoff between Yokic and Murray, when KCP couldn't even hit, you know, the favorable side of the backboard on a corner three somehow. It just was not Denver's night in a lot of ways. Like they tried to activate that gear

and found they did not have it. Rob, you're a TV nerd officially now. Is that a nice thing to say? I don't know. Are you being mean? I a little both. I felt like the Lakers or the Nuggets had what you would call narrative armor throughout these first three years.

Plot armor. God damn. I didn't even get it right. Damn. That's what the nerds are for. I'm here to correct you. Yes, thank you. If you're here for anything, it is to correct me. But I felt like even in that third quarter where the Nuggets won the quarter, but not all that much, even late in the fourth quarter. Even when it was really tight, to the point where the Lakers had to call a challenge, while up nine points with 42.8 seconds left, I was just hanging on for dear life. Did it feel the same way to you?

A little bit, and certainly the margins were a little tighter, even within the final minute, that I'm sure the Lakers would have liked. But as far as, you know, the plot armor goes for the Nuggets, I kind of wonder if the biggest takeaway from this game is not going to end up being the Lakers extending their season, especially if it's only by one game. I don't think that's going to ultimately matter that much for anyone involved. But Jamal Murray seeming to suffer some kind of leg injury, holding either the back of his knee or the top of his calf,

and over the back part of this game during closing time, when he basically always sings, having a little bit of trouble separating, finishing, doing the usual Jamal Murray's suite of activities. Yeah, Murray hasn't been himself throughout a full game. I would say this entire playoffs. Obviously, he had the huge moment knocking down the buzzer-beater that will probably live in infamy for as long as he's going to play. Just another one to add to his resume.

But unfortunately, he just hasn't been all the way there. Obviously, he missed a bunch of games going into the playoffs. And when he reached for that back knee, I'm like, that's the fear of every Nuggets fan and optimist about this team. Because it really seems like the thin bench won and just injuries to this rock solid starting five is the only thing that could maybe take them down, at least in the West. we'll see, I guess, but it just seems on top of that. The Lakers just made a little more of the plays than they typically hadn't. Delo, for instance, had probably the most complete game that he's had this entire postseason. I mean, LeBron trying to save face, trying to at least get something out of this series in order to get at least a moral victory going into the summer,

like is one of the best players in the league. That probably was a difference. I don't know if you saw anything differently. Well, and Anthony Davis, who's been one of the best players overall in the postseason, finally getting a win to validate the way that he's played. And I thought the combination of LeBron and AD, they've been great throughout this series. They've had incredible moments. They've come up short in some of these third and fourth quarters as they've kind of run out of gas

because of how much they've had to do. But I thought the way that they dominated the paint was a huge reason why the nuggets were not able to close the gap and were not able to mount some of these runs. They were getting inside and they were a little spooked by 80s rim protection or the threat of it. they were a little rushed in their process because LeBron had a chase down earlier in the game. You know, 80's risk was bothering him and he still was able to have just like a massive impact over the shape of this thing. It's kind of remarkable how AD just hasn't been deterred virtually at all this entire season

by injuries. And like it seems like he's playing through a lot at this point. Clearly, like the noise seems to have affected him to the point where I feel like he's pushing through more than he used to for good and we'll see long term maybe for bad. but I think like I don't know if he'll ever get the credit that he deserves because I think people hold him to the standard not only being LeBron's teammate but because of the player he projected to be early on in his career but this is as far as I've seen at this point his best postseason performance through the first four games of the series 30.5 points 15.8 rebounds for assists one and a half blocks he had 23 rebounds today he can't do anything more than he's doing right now no and a meaningful contested rebounds, not scooping up, misses on free throws, like plays that actually mattered and fending off Nicole Yokich, fending off multiple smaller nuggets in the process,

getting a couple putbacks for second chance opportunities for the Lakers. He's doing everything you could possibly ask him to do. It just so happens that he's playing against the best player in the world. And with that, I think we've seen in stages in this series, Yokic has just kind of moved him around, gotten Ann Wens, like manipulated even one of the best defensive players in the league in AD. the other part of it is that at the end of some of these other games, it just seemed like AD was gassed because he had to work against Yokic all game long.

And so when it comes time to the fourth quarter, I think there's been a lot of conversation about why the Lakers haven't been able to execute prior to game four, why they weren't getting the ball to AD in some of those spots, why they weren't just running basic pick and roll. I think a lot of it comes down to when we're getting into the fourth quarters, AD doesn't have the energy in some of those games and the burst in some of those games to get open, to roll hard to the rim, to keep. fighting through another 12 minutes after he's already been battling Yokic every step of the way.

And the difference in this one, one, he was able to push through that wall a little bit. And some of it was the way that the Lakers staged some of LeBron and A.D.'s minutes, I thought did give them some staying power in the fourth quarter. I thought they did do a better job of picking their spots and most importantly, of trapping Yokic down the stretch in a way that forced the ball out of his hands and honestly gave AD a little bit of a break on defense sometimes. So you're saying a win for Darwin Han. Is that what I'm hearing?

I am not willing to go that far. Well, I don't think he's going to get much credit from most people, maybe first and foremost, LeBron James, because, oh my God, the temper tantrum that LeBron through was probably the most demonstrative thing I've seen him direct at his own team ever. Like, obviously the one that comes to mind is the famous J.R. Smith, what the fuck are you doing play?

Yes. But this one was a full jump in stomp. like a two-year-old practically in order to get that challenge call. I'm honestly wondering, like, is Darvinham going to make it to Denver? Or like, is LeBron just going to be player coach for the remainder of the series? Look, we don't have any vested interest in the outcome of these games or this series. But part of me, a dark part of me, would have loved to see the post-game press conference if the Nuggets won by two points after LeBron begged for that, begged for that review.

and in the process, Jamal Murray got a free layup out of it. Like, if that had been the deciding factor in the game, I would have loved to see the nuclear fallout that would have resulted from that. But crazy sequence. And LeBron is sure of anything in his life and guess he was right.

Like the ball did not go off on him. It was called an error. They should have reviewed it. They should have challenged it. Did not happen. But I think we need to have a conversation more broadly about challenges that are happening in the playoffs right now.

It's been a very strange postseason for them. And I think I'm seeing in particular one thing, like Michael Malone earlier in this game in the second quarter also challenged a random out-of-bounds call with like seven minutes left in the second, ultimately not a meaningful play, and all it would have even done if it were successful was give the Nuggets one possession back

versus the Lakers getting the ball in the second quarter. Why are we doing that? I'm not opposed to using them early, especially if you have certainty, if you have the iPad clarity of the LeBron kind of play where it's like, we clearly didn't touch this ball, it's definitely going to be overturned and we'll get to retain our challenge.

But I basically otherwise only see three reasons to ever challenge and it's if it's a meaningful swing of points or fouls, right, like an and one opportunity that could be taken back, a crucial second or third foul for one of your guys that's going to potentially take them out of the game when you want to be able to keep them in.

That's obviously something worth challenging. Also, if it's late enough in the game where a single possession is ultra-valial challenge away. Darvin Ham, I don't know that you needed to challenge to save DeAngelo Russell's possession late in this one when the game was probably in hand, but why not? Like, let's wrap that thing up.

Let's be safe about it. Go ahead and challenge it. The third reason, the LeBron reason, your star player told you to. And maybe just for the sake of maintaining good balance and politics in the locker room, maybe sometimes you just have to eat it and take that challenge. I think that's it right there.

That's the most important thing. It's much like coaching itself where, yes, there is a scientific evidence-based, like, plan in place or, like, things you could point to for what you should and should not do. But a lot of it is just feel. And you could definitely see the distinction between coach to coach, and it really seems to reflect their personality. And in part, I feel like the first to LeBron and some of his players more than other guys, whereas, like, Spow earlier in the evening, he doesn't call anything because he's pocketing those in order to save them for key moments, which is what you should do. And to give Darwin Ham credit, like, at the very least he got it right at the end. Did they need it? Probably not. But at the very least, it was that extra bit of comfort you had when you needed to make goddamn sure that you got out of this game.

This particular game was at least this one win. Mission accomplished. They did it. AD played great. LeBron played great. Austin Reeves is back. The challenge was ultimately successful. Everything is coming up, Lakers, Justin.

But now that we've given them all due credit for this win, can we say the quiet part out loud, which is that for the vast majority of this game, I would describe the Nuggets general tone as cruise control. Did you see anything different from them? No. I mean, well, I put this in our chat before we started the podcast, but not only did we have Nicola Yokic dressed as grew before game one, which in retrospect, I have to say, if I was a Laker, like, that is the biggest fuck you. And I would take that personally. That the best player on the opposite team is showing up practically in cosplay to your first round series where you're just like trying to lock in and this guy's out here selling hats for disrespectful for me.

Like whatever. And then Michael Malone in the Nicola Yokic-esque like Young in Denver Nuggets sweatshirt, which I know that they sell at the team store. But at the very least, like, there's just not the same like hard edge to the nuggets going into some of these games. Whereas with the Lakers, this is like life or death to the point. where it's like, LeBron didn't just yell at Darvinham. Toward the end of that game,

he yelled at Austin Reeves for letting go a dunk back cut on him that he should have picked up. And just like, everyone is on pins and needles here. And the nuggets, I guess, to their credit, don't really have to be. I feel like you're missing the time honored tradition of the fact that players are just doing bits all throughout the playoffs.

Jimmy Butler showed up in pigtails tonight. Like, this is just what happens, right? He's not playing, though. He's not, but like, guys, Guys show up to the podium or to the press conferences wearing all kinds of performative shit. Like, this is the way it goes. And I, for one, I for one salute Michael Malone for his tasteful attire that was also team branded. It is a kind of cool sweatshirt, I have to say.

Like, good colors, all that. Did you happen to see Jalen Williams, though, looking like bedazzled Kenny from South Park? I did not. Was it the hood? What went to look like Kenny? It looked like he had like a diving guy. Bagels periscope thing going on where you can only see out of like this part of his face for the listeners at home, just putting a circle in front of my face.

And but the hood was so tight on him. And I'd never seen that before. I don't know if I'm just like super washed and this is what the kids are doing. But like there's something going on with the thunder. They definitely have that big dog energy. I'll say that. Actually, that was prescription, Justin. He got hit in the eye during the game.

And the doctors were like, we need you to cover your peripheral vision as much as you possibly can. So let's get his hood tightened up. bedazzled horse blinders. Yes, it's all very standard issue stuff. Like your doctor would tell you the same thing. So I think we'll agree that the Lakers are going to win three in a row now. Yeah, that's where we're headed.

We have every reason to expect that. Do you think anything changes for this? Do you think, I don't know, there's something tactical that the Lakers may be found here that they may be able to explore later on or anything come to mind? I mean, the biggest things that could change the series would be Jamal Murray's knee or leg. If that's any kind of serious injury, that's something to monitor for sure. And especially the way that intersects with the fact that the Lakers were more open to outwardly and aggressively doubling Nicola Yokic. Because if that's how they're going to play it, Murray is one of the key weapons to counter it.

His ability to not only theoretically hit open shots, although he hasn't really been hitting from three in this series, but more importantly, get into space, maneuver, wheel and deal, whether getting to the basket himself or dishing out to other people, that's how you break those doubles. And so if he's not able to do that to the full Jamal Murray effect, maybe that closes the gap a little bit. But honestly, this just feels like the kind of series where the Nuggets we're going to get back to Denver and finish it. It feels like we're headed in that direction. But then Christian Wood just emerges out of nowhere. Just hits all sorts of threes.

Totally different series. Technically available to play, you think his invitation to the rotation got lost in the mail? What happened? Potentially. Maybe Jared Banderbilt stole it because it seems like he is potentially able to get in the mix here as well. I mean, it would be nice to have an extra defender here and there, you know, if Gabe Vinson. Oh, Jared. I thought you were talking about Christian Wood.

Okay, okay, okay. Yes. But no, I don't see anything significantly changing here unless Jamal Murray isn't able to go unless something happens on the ride back to Denver, you know, God forbid, doing the cross right now. But this seems like a wrap, but congrats to the Lakers for saving face. They get the gentleman's sweep. The gruees. sweep, if you guys. Yeah, we really need to trademark that one. Let's get ahead of that. Let's go ahead and get grew sweep.com locked down.

Let's do a little digital real estate. I am available. I'll tell you that for any sort of advertisements. Do you want to go to the Cavs next? Why not? I honestly think this might be the second most interesting game on the docket today because I have written down here that the magic just went electric after a pretty stilted first half to that game,

it looked like the game was following a familiar pattern in the series outside of game three when Paulo obviously had a monster performance. And then the Cavs just fucking disappeared. I want to give Orlando their credit. I want to give them their flowers because they just played with life and pride in a way that like the Cavs specifically do not. But what the hell is going on with the Cavs? 37 to 10 in the third quarter.

They didn't score for a 10 minute stretch. I think the Cavs got a lot of cover over the first two games of this series just by winning and by some of Orlando's failings and their struggles to score. But their offense has been mostly bad throughout this series if we want to take it in total. Even when they were winning games, their offense was bad. And so the fact that Orlando was able to finally get some juice to what they were trying to do in their efforts to score. And I want to circle back to the why of that.

And a lot of it has to do with Franz. Wagner. But overall right now, the Cavs have the worst offense in the playoffs. Like that's where we are four games into this series. And considering everything we've said about Orlando and their lack of spacing and their lack of flow in some of these games and how much they struggled to score over the first two, the fact that we've gotten to this point, a tied series in which the calves are the worst offense and they have even more reason for concern. It's just a wild turn of events. I can't say I would have expected this. You know, I definitely thought they're going to sputter at some point. Orlando.

too good of a defensive team to not seize some of the reins during stretches of this series. And it's just going to be a question of whether, you know, Paolo and Franz and these guys could create enough offense to take advantage of that. And not only did they do that in this game, but I think Cleveland has a lot of soul searching to do in terms of how they want to run their offense because they were just getting jammed up in one-on-one coverage. Just trying to like beat guys in base coverage and they couldn't do it.

Got some numbers for you from JV stats and info. I would love nothing more. Hit me. 29 points after halftime, two offensive rebounds total. The entire game. Yikes. They have two offensive rebound, a team with a huge front court in Mowbly and Allen, four total three-pointers.

I will say the magic had their issues offensively, specifically in those first two games. But the defense has really showed up every single game here. And it really has been the backbone for all of their efforts. And now it seems like they're finally starting to figure things out offensively. as you alluded to, Pollo had the big game and he deserves his credit for that. But struggled in the first half of this game, had four turnovers at halftime. It seemed like things were going the same sort of pattern as they had before, where he was a lot of ISO base for Pollo.

But then Franz, all of a sudden just comes out of nowhere, finally playing like the all-star level guy that like he was supposed to be next to Pauline. And it's widely disappointed this season, I would say. Paulo moves off the ball. Franz just goes electric. And here we are. It just seemed like they had a balance. and we should mention Wendell Carter Jr. now in the starting lineup in place of Jonathan Isaac.

That's been a huge adjustment as well. But Franz just looked like a player in a way that he hasn't, like, for a very long time in the season. Well, especially when the magic were really searching in those first two games, Franz was kind of wading off on the wing on the weak side, like ready to catch the ball and go, but was never really in very advantageous situations. And if we're being honest about his game, spot shooting is not really his strong suit. Like, he's a decent enough shooter, but he's an attacker. Like, he's a downhill guy.

And the biggest change for him in the magic has been basically putting him in a point guard role. Letting him cook from the top of the floor has, as you said, move Palo off of it into more advantageous positions himself. But also there's a thing happening there where I think it may be unconscious, but the calves tend to respect some of the magic guards as shooters a little bit more. Like Cole Anthony in the corner, you'll see a defender kind of hugging a little closer to him than they might have even DeFrance in some of the earlier games in this series. And so you have a little more space to work with. You have this huge, aggressive, like, offball player in Paula Bancair who can do all kinds of things, incredibly skilled, incredibly versatile. And you have a guy going downhill, flexing on people, muscling through, like, throwing George Nying into, like, the Phantom Realm and then giving him the Sean Kemp point for attack on the ground. Like, I loved everything about Franz's game.

He was incredible. That was tough. The point. I was like, God damn, love this kid. We got to stop giving people text for that. Let people point at each other in games. That's all I ask. Just outright taunt at each other.

That's what we do in this podcast. Light to medium taunting feels acceptable. If anything, it juice the game of. Like, what's wrong with that? He's even said it, and I think in the walk-off interview, he's like, I was just trying to get into the paint. I just wanted to get downhill and attack. And things just opened up for it.

You even saw Paulo kind of lock in the place where he's like, setting screens, he's such a threat, like, off the short roll. And maybe this is like his inevitable goal where he could still isolate and run the offense when you need him to. He's especially against mismatches. He's really good at that. Definitely. When he's like kind of more ancillary, you could see how much more danger it is where he's like more picking his spots. And the entire offense just flows from there.

I would just say though overall, the magic just have, I would say again, a pride and a heart. And the way that the calves just similarly like just do not. Like they're just playing like this is their. moment. And like these games, first round games matter to them so much. Whereas like, Cav's kind of just going through the motions. It's just like,

I don't know what's going on with that team. Maybe they're just seeing the writing on the wall with Mitchell and whatnot, but it just seems like they haven't been able to recreate whatever happened earlier in the season. And I have to imagine a lot of it comes down to the fact that like, when they were at their best, they were very uncomplicated, right? It was Donovan Mitchell. It was Alan Mobley wasn't there.

Garland wasn't there. Now it's just like, it's just kind of just in disarray. in a way that I can't really figure out. What is going wrong with this team? Well, uncomplicated basketball in the way that they had it with some of those guys out of the lineup. It can work against the wizards

and the pistons and some of the low-hanging fruit opponents that they had during that stretch. You get into the playoffs and you get against the defense like Orlando's. You're going to need some of those complications. You can't be in this series without Jared Allen and Evan Mowgli both. You can't be in the series without getting a lift

from Dariuscar. You need all hands on deck and you need the best version of Donovan Mitchell. And he was absolutely not that in this game. That was kind of the one thing that was going right for them offensively. I think there have been stages in which Alan and Mowgli have been very aggressive for a quarter at a time or a half at a time in a way that has given Cleveland a real lift. I would say even in the first half of this game, Alan was roaming to the rim, going aggressively, finishing really well. Mowgli was fighting his way through and scoring inside.

All of that stuff was really good. And then all of a sudden it vanished. And that's where you can see Orlando like winning the, basically like the line of scrimmage battle in a lot of ways in this series. Like they are being incredibly physical with these guys. They play with a ton of energy. And they have that kind of collaborative spirit

where they are building each other up. And they're energizing each other. And the Cavs, if we're being honest, have never had that. They've had stretches where they've won a lot of games. They've had stretches where it looks like things are working. But they don't necessarily have that spirit of cooperation. And a lot of that for the magic,

that spirit tends to flow from Jalen Suggs. Like, I don't think he's their best player, but he might be their most important. Like, good God, this guy last season even just could not hit a goddamn shot. Obviously, was always impactful defensively. Maybe not to this level. So the point where it seems like he's a defender to the point where he's able to swing a series and take a guy like Donovan Mitchell and really take him to task. But like, that guy is a baller.

I think he would fit on every team in the league. Yeah. And not only was he not making shots, you know, last season, He wasn't making shots over the first two games. And that was a big reason why the offense was clogged up for the magic. So him hitting a little bit and getting some home cooking, I think that's where I want to back off a little bit on all the energy talk and the momentum talk because it's very easy to get out in front of things when you're playing at home sometimes

and you have your crowd behind you and your role players are contributing in the way that are they're accustomed to playing. Everyone looks a little bit more comfortable. Jonathan Isaac is hitting every damn thing. Some of that's magic, if a pardon the pun, happens at home. And we certainly know that the Cavs are not a good road playoff team. But put them back in Cleveland and maybe they look a little bit different too. I believe Jonathan Isaac hit as many threes as the Cavs did as a team. Wild.

He has the most deceptive makes in the league where he makes, he hits a three and like, his form looks so smooth. The shot looks so good going through the NEM. Like this guy is really turning a corner. He's really got it. And then every time you zoom out in the aggregate, it, whether it's a season, whether it's a series, whether it's a 10-game stretch, he doesn't for whatever reason. And it makes me wonder where in his mechanics things are going awry,

because shoulders up, I think the form is really good. And maybe just his base or his balance, or there's, I mean, it is a very slow release so it can be contested a little more easily than some other guys. But I get fooled every time he has a game like this. His head's not in it. It's just working on his campaign slogans. Well, there's books to sell. There's product to move. Who among us isn't a little bit distracted? I was a little surprised for that reason that it didn't really work when he moved into the starting lineup. I thought he could hit enough shots that he could just be a terror defensively.

And it seemed like Mosley was kind of putting that in his back pocket into the last game of the season, moving him into the starting lineup. And it worked against Damien Lillard. And I figured it might be just as successful against the Cavaliers, but it didn't. But credit to Mosley, who we bagged on a little bit earlier in the series, finally made that switch. It seemed like having Wendell Carter Jr. as a throat offensively. did kind of soften things up for some of these other guys.

And definitely also to his credit, not just playing full bench units. At least we're getting some mixing and matching some puzzle pieces here. We respect it. Took you two games, but welcome to the playoffs. Well, and even some of the bench units just make a little more sense this way. When it's a Jonathan Isaac Mo Wagner front court versus a Wendell Carter Mo Wagner front court, there's just like a little more defensive dynamism there that rounds out some of those bench heavy lineup.

So, you know, we did bag on most. Mosy for some of those decisions, but he made the change in the starting lineup. He made the change in terms of how the offense was attacking. He put some of his bench players in even better positions to succeed, and they've had monster games by the margins over both game three and four. So Orlando is definitely turning a corner here. It's just a matter of like, is this just going to be one of those series where the home team wins every game? And that's kind of all there is too. I wish we had more clarity on that, but both of these teams can be so uneven offensively. So I have another stat from JV. Stats and Info, aka I literally just

crib this off a basketball reference tweet. Well, they've been busy over at JV stats and info. Really burning the midnight oil. I appreciate it. We're grinding. We're aggregating. 61 point margin of victory, the magic, over these last two games,

11th largest over a two game span in NBA history. Very specific stat, but like I think the telling one. Well, and the last two teams to win back-to-back playoff games by this much. Do you have any idea who they are? I'm just more impressed than we got Mahoney stats and info over here. Look, this is the repartee. You know, we're just bouncing off each other. We are the Orlando magic right now, you know.

Waz isn't here. We're just being full on stack geeks. That's all it takes. The last two teams to win back to back playoff games by 61 points or more, just a ridiculous margin, we have to say. The 2021 bucks, the 2016 calves. What do those teams have in common, Justin? One of title.

Just saying, just putting it on record right now, in case we want to start booking hotels for sunny Orlando in June. Okay. I'll keep that in mind. Anything else in this one? Do you have any like prediction, like big feeling for this? Or is it, you think it's just going to go seven and maybe the cabs pull it out? I think it's going to go, I mean, obviously at this point, it's going to be a long series,

no matter what happens. I do think the calves are going to pull it out. They just have been this style of Rocky for a very long time. And I think that when it comes down to it, they will have the ability to hit a little bit more of their offense. They will just connect on a few more iffy kinds of like three point attempts in particular in a way that's going to swing this series. But Orlando is fully deserving of our attention and our respect.

Like they have fought their way back into a series that as we've seen across the playoff landscape could have been over, right? Game three goes a very different way. And then all of a sudden the series is effectively terminated before you even have a chance to close it out. So all credit to them for fighting their way through this thing and especially for evening it up today. Yeah.

There are a couple of variable things that could swing their way. obviously Max Drew's just like can't hit a goddamn shot. All of a sudden he hits a few of those things start to open up. I wonder if they could play with the rotation a little bit more, like maybe just add a little bit more shooting there, maybe go a little bit smaller in certain situations. I know the size is so kind of intrinsic to who they are. But like there are still adjustments there that I have to say like the calves,

it's their probably series to lose. But like, and magic are playing with just such a force and energy right now. If they translate that to the road, I think they will be tough to be. I think so. And their bench has not been very successful either, just have not been able to get especially much scoring out of that group. And so if there's any way to, you know, let me back off that for a second and say like,

Isaac Acoro is not going to go off for an 18-point game that's going to swing this series, just not really in his constitution to do that. But you hope, like, there's going to be a George Nyang game, right? You hope there's going to be more of a Karras-Livert presence in some of these games. That's kind of what you're hoping for. And if you can engineer the rotation to put some of those guys in better positions to succeed where it's not all falling

on Mitchell and Garland and Mowgli and Allen in particular to have to produce that scoring, the Cavs will be all the better for it. A little bang, bang, bang, action. Maybe get Mike Breen to bang, bang, bang, bang. Wow. But unfortunately, that will never happen because all of these games are probably going to be

on NBA TV from sharing out. Yeah, it's quite true. But look, if it goes seven, maybe you fight your way into a T&T slot. Yes. The series now has our attention, the bare minimum of our attention. Oh, come on.

It's more than that. Jalen Suggs alone deserves much more than that. Yeah, this is probably one of the more fun games on the docket here because the other two were absolute beatdowns. The road to the NBA final starts now and new customers on Fandul can go on their own playoff run with 150 bucks. Just plays any $5 bet and you'll get $150 in bonus bets,

winner-lose, to use during the NBA playoffs. So here we go here. We're going to pick two games coming up. I like the Timberwolves minus two. got to say, even though they're on the road in Phoenix, close out the suns in four. A lot of pride with the wolves. I think they're ready to sweep them. No gentleman on that team. And I also like the thunder minus four and a half in New Orleans. Same sort of drill there. I think that series is pretty much over. The Pells don't really have any moves left. So give me the wolves,

give me the thunder, lock it in. And Fandle, guess what, is now live in our nation's capital, Washington, D.C. Just go to Fandul.com slash ringer MBA to get started, Fandul official sports betting partner of the NBA. Must be 21 plus, 18 plus in D.C. In present in select states, gambling problem, call 1,800 gambler or visit RG dash help.com. First online real money wager only,

$10 first deposit required, bonus issued as non-witrable bonus bets that expire seven days after receipt. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fandu.com. I feel like we got to go to the Celtics. now just to go full circle from the other podcast I did the other night where it seemed like the Celtics might be done forever as our friend

was kind of underlined there. Turns out Celtics pretty good basketball team. Yeah, I think there's a reason why we get our hand ringing out when we can with the Celtics. There's a massive difference in firepower in the series that was not going to last. It's just hard to get too worried about a team that can turn up its defense in this way.

Turn up the pressure on perimeter guys, on the ball, shut off your water. Boston has all of that capability. Some days they don't do it. And clearly game two was one of those, but I don't think any of us have any questions about their ultimate potential over the course of an entire postseason

and especially what they can do in this series. Like this series is theirs to lose. And they lost one game spectacularly, but I wouldn't expect many more of those. So in game two, the heat were 23 for 43 from Three Point Land. in this game 9 for 28. So they had almost as many attempts as they had makes last game.

They scored 12 points in the first quarter, one for nine from three. So what a nice little bounce back from Boston because I have to say like any sort of performance like the one they had in Game 2, you're gripping the seats. Like this team is not very trustworthy. And for them to have, dare I say, like a championship level medal to this one where they really look. left no doubts from the jump, I think that was very encouraging to see. Those are the games we love to see from them. I know a lot of people have questions about Boston

in fourth quarters or in crunch time and in some of those very pressure-packed situations. But I love these performances where there's not even a sliver of a doubt for the vast majority of the game that they are going to roll away with this thing, especially when Miami's offense just felt like it was going uphill the whole time.

And they just don't have enough guys who can create, who can dribble, who can do anything in any fashion that's adaptive, to be honest with you. Like they are kind of straight line weapons and players at this stage. It's a lot of role players. And Bam and Obio is kind of what the roster has been left with at this point in the season. That's a team that you can stop. And you can completely shut off if you give them the bare minimum of your attention and effort.

And Boston gave it that and then some. Why they didn't try this seemingly at any point in the previous game is still something I'm trying to figure out. like was Joe Missoula trying to do like a psycho like reverse thing where he's like actually we're going to lose this game so I like really spur these guys and really get them going. Yeah. I don't know because it was it's literally right there for them. The fact that these are a lot of shooters or not even good shooters even, but worse than that there's not a lot of ball handling.

Like Tyler Hero is functionally the point guard if you want to nominate one person for this team. Like why they didn't just hug the shooters and force them to put the ball on the floor before. I just like, I honestly can't come up with a logical reason for that. I'm glad that they did it and that they could do it so easily, but I guess all as well. That ends well. I don't know. How do you feel about this? It was baffling. But if you look at the first quarter of this game, it was the complete, like, hot and cold contrast as far as the heat shooting goes. Yes, the Celtics were guarding better, but Miami got some pretty open looks for some guys who were hitting the other night and none

of them went. It was like, this was the Faustian bargain, right? You get all your hot shooting in game two and then your soul leaves your body and you're just never going to hit enough three pointers again. That kind of feels like where Miami could be headed. And Boston, by and large, will be the better team in the series. They will have those moments, those game two type moments where they don't play up to their potential, but their potential is so much greater than Miami's. Like the high, even the mid-level Celtics performance is better than almost like a high-end heat performance with this version of the roster. I have to say, Drew Holiday might have given the most Drew Holiday performance of all time in this one.

What makes you say that? Three points, one for five from the field. Yeah. Six assists. Seems like he was doing a lot of good work like getting into the zone and spraying it out. Him and Peyton Pritchard, we should mention. Plus 23 in this game.

That's like if Drew Holiday were to draw up his perfect game, it might be that. I do virtually not a lot on offense. And then I just hound guys on defense. That's what he wants to do. And it was the kind of game, too, where no Celtic really had to press that much. I think there were moments where, you know, Jalen Brown was going at it like a little too hard on some attempts that he maybe

shouldn't have. There were some early Porzingis possessions that were a little bit shaky as they were trying to kind of feed him around the free throw line. But overall, they played really comfortably. They looked like fully, fully in their momentum and their rhythm and their style. And the heat didn't seem like they really had anything to say or do about it. Like they just don't have the power to disrupt a team that is all of these advantages. when it's actually playing this well.

A lot of Peyton Pritchard. It went well. It is a blowout. Yeah. Yeah. Well, no, he played, I think most of his minutes early. It seems like Missoula relied on him early on to harass some of the shooters and to get into the zone a little bit.

Yes. I mean, look, the Celtics, realistically, have many options against the heat zone. And it has not fared well of these last two games. I will say, like, Jason Tatum is never more comfortable than on Duncan Robinson's side of the zone. That's just, that's his, his happy place and I understand why. So you could go to that over and over. Obviously, you can spray out to shooters. You can work the offensive glass, which I thought Boston did like selectively, but to good effect in this game. They just have so much they can do. And it's going to get them by the heat sooner rather than later. And the question is going to be,

how does it fare against, you know, the next opponents in line? In a weird way, I was a little worried when Peyton Pritchard played so well because it almost seems like Joe Mazzula wants any excuse to play him as we saw during last year's postseason. Yeah. It almost feels like he's like the living embodiment of Missoula who when he was a player, like at West Virginia, the scrappy guy who's just like getting by on on guile and quickness and whatnot. But so far so good.

Those are the guys you got to worry about. The coach surrogates, it can be very, very dangerous. The coach on the floor. Yeah. Anything else on this one? I want to talk about Nikoloyovic. a little bit here. Oh, okay. What do you have to say? I think he's a guy. Of course he's a guy. Of course he's a guy. I know. He's had a pretty good postseason this far, 15 points in this one,

eight rebounds, pretty good overall in the playoffs, 12 points, eight for 15 from three, almost eight rebounds to assists. I think like there's a lot to like there. He's just a tall ball handler with Lentth, who seemingly when he's hitting his shots, and he's made a lot of them down the stretch here, he's good in those playing games as well. I think he might be like a part of this team. I don't know how big of a part, but I could see him being like a pretty solid starter for them going forward.

Yeah, he started like half the season for a playoff team. He's good. Like, Nicole Iovitch is a good player. I think where I've been pleasantly surprised is you see this with these, especially these like stretch four types sometimes when they get into a series. and they just have these very hollow games during the first playoff run or especially the first series

where they don't know how to find their spots yet. They don't know how to impact the game beyond the spacing that they provide. And so they just wind up like standing in the corner and they end up with six points in like a couple of rebounds and really like are kind of invisible for the vast majority of the game.

And there were games in this regular season where I felt Yovic played that way, even in those games, where he was out there, but he wasn't doing a lot. The offense was going in other directions. Defensively, he's pretty matched up dependent. I think he can actually make some plays

and mix it up a little bit on defense probably more than you would think. Just based on him being a young guy and thinking of him as like a bigger stiff, but he can move. He's got pretty good hands. I think he can impact plays. This series and in particular,

these last two games, I think, have been kind of a best case scenario for him. As a second year player coming into a really difficult environment and finding ways to make a difference on the move when you're being chased off the three point line

when you're being put in like playmaking positions he's doing smart things with the ball and he's making good choices for him in the offense when they don't really have like a star presence that he can draft off of at this point

and so to be doing all of that against a team that's this good in this way is really impressive stuff for him he's a heat guy he's not just a guy he seems like a heat guy now that's a compliment

yes totally well I think it's an interesting contrast here, especially as the bucks kind of hobble through their series against the Pacers, it seems like Damien Lillard might not be available for this next game. Obviously, Janus, we're not sure when he's coming back. It doesn't seem like it's going to be this next game on Sunday when you're probably listening to this. It's just, I think you make the dame trade if you're the heat 10 times out of 10. In the same way, I think you do it if you're the bucks. But it is an interesting like life not lived to be watching the bucks have to rely on a top heavy three-stallel.

sort of team and how much that dictates all of their success. When you look at the heat, obviously don't have the same ceiling. But I do wonder if long term, like maybe there's a little bit more runway than we give credit for, like the heat are kind of slowly stacking small moves. And maybe they just turn that into a superstar this summer or whenever. But at the same time, like, I think there's life after Jimmy Butler if they really want to go that path where it's like, maybe we just keep stacking good moves, build something around bam, and then maybe figure it out down the road.

It seems very possible. I guess where I get caught on that is he'd have a way of stacking those moves regardless of the people and players who are involved. Like if it wasn't going to be Nicole Jovich who's going to be somebody else, they make good picks, they make good selections.

They pick up good, promising undrafted players and cultivate them in their system in a way that makes sense. So if you gave me the premise of Dame Lillard and Bam out of bio and still like ultimately the bones of this team in a lot of ways as far as the role players go, that sounds pretty good right about now.

to me too for as good as you have it just played yeah i don't disagree at all dame on that team would be sick like i think they would threaten for for a finals bid with that core um it's just interesting like i don't want to kick jimmy off the boat too because he's been amazing it's just like it's just really tough to rely on at this point we saw on the regular season i know that the injury he suffered in the play and it was a little kind of a fluke you know like ubrae just kind of fell on him in the wrong way and all of a sudden he's not available for some of these games but like happened last postseason. It happens throughout the regular season at this point.

It's like there's this weird thing that's happening in the league now where everyone is just so deep. You really have to compete pretty much up to the standard you are in the playoffs throughout the regular season just to get a high seat. Look at the OKC. Yes. Getting the one seat, how much that's changing their fate. Like it does pay to have depth at this point in the league's just arc.

It pays to have depth. It also pays if you're Jimmy Butler to treat the regular season as if it is an exercise that, matters and not be straight chilling, taking games off effectively, like not taking any of it seriously to the point that you end up in the play in and then anything can happen. You could get hurt. Anyone in your team can get hurt. A ball bounces a different way and you're not even in the playoffs to begin with. You have to secure the playoff positioning, good seating, as you mentioned. All of that comes down to not only what you want on your roster and wanting to have depth,

but you need stars who are going to show up and play. And Jimmy Butler has been very very, valorized and for good reason for how great he can be in the playoffs and he deserves every bit of that. But he's part of the reason why the heater playing the Boston Celtics in the first round. Like him playing below his level and choosing not to play, it seems in some cases, is why we're here. And the matchup could have been totally different and a lot more favorable if he had taken the regular season as if it meant something. I said this before. I'll say it again. If you look at the super teams that assembled in 2019, the Nets, Katie and Kyrie, Lakers, getting Anthony Davis.

obviously the clippers, Paul George, Quiet Leonard. The thing that really undid a lot of those teams and the fact that they only have one combined title is the fact that a lot of those superstars were not available. Like they just didn't have the horses when you needed to when it had time in the league where teams were really loading up on the depth. The team like Denver, first and foremost, was building this rock solid starting five that complimented Nicola Yoakic in just the optimal way. And it does feel like the wolves are following that blueprint as well.

You're seeing the Thunder, clearly a big team doing that as well. It just seems like there's a sea chain's happening there. And a lot of it comes down to guys who are available. As weird as it is the same. Yeah. And two of those teams that you mentioned in terms of the Nuggets and the Wolves, one of the things they have in common is Tim Connolly, who I think has quietly done a very good job of not just building and trading for,

you know, guys like Aaron Gordon, for example, but the bench that the Nuggets had when they were getting Will Barton and Monti Morris and Mason Plumley and Tori Craig. Like they were turning second round picks and borderline guys into real rotation players. And you can see the same thing happening right now with Nikiel Alexander Walker and like the kind of murderer's row bench that the wolves are rolling out there and just punishing the sons with.

That's your guy. That's my guy. It's so good. You love that guy. How could you not? He's shown up Devin Booker and they're ushering the sons out of the playoffs. And this is a guy who was maybe not almost out of the league. Like I think, I think Nikiel Alexander Walker would have gotten lots of shots just based off of

his energy level and his dimensions and like the kind of. usual cadence of his game, he would have gotten opportunities, but he's really made something of himself and seized a great spot for a team that really needed him as a backup ball handler, him as a shooter on the perimeter, and him as a guy who can go toe to toe with one of the best scores in the sport. He's a different player as well. Like, if you saw him in New Orleans, and we should stop and say, if you've seen the clip of him doing Vanessa Carlton. Vanessa Carlton, yes, thank you, in front of what seemed to be an entire stadium. Please do.

But he was like kind of a spark plug ball handler scorer. And he's really moved off the ball, become like a pretty intriguing, very good 3-and-D prospect for a league that, as we've said, a million bazillion times wants that exact player. In order to just like kind of develop these guys, like those are the type of moves that the very, very good teams need, and especially the top heavy teams need

because you need those guys in the playoffs and clearly they have that in Walker. Yeah. And sometimes they can be hard to identify. Like he's a classic guy where when he was in New Orleans, he was out of control. Like he was always way over his skis trying to play downhill and making crazy decisions with the ball.

And you're right, moving him off the ball alleviates some of that, but he's also just playing with a lot more restraint. Like he has a better sense of who he is and what he needs to do. And if you can identify the young players who are just kind of off-kilter, but if you rein them in just so,

they could be really effective pros. Like, that's a very specific scouting skill set that you have to have. And it's not easy. Like, it's why some of, like, some of these teams continue to be good, teams like Miami, that can I just very much identify, what are the undervalued assets?

What are the, what are the skill sets that we can find that other people can't? And what are the ones that our team and our coaching staff can grow? So we've kind of talked around the thunder. And so we should get to, the last game on the docket, the least interesting game, probably on the site here. I think that's all folks for our New Orleans Pelicans.

I think they're officially out of options when you're trying Najee Marshall at center. You're trying to guard Josh Giddy with a center. You're really breaking out all the stops. Nothing is working. And I think when you're in the torture chamber, it really is kind of tough to get out. And I think they're officially locked in. They threw away the key. Jalen Williams just scarfed it up.

And it's now going through his esophagus. I'll stop here. But like, good Lord. This is just completely changed from game one. There's just nothing left for the Pelicans to do. You're right. They're out of options.

Ultimately, like, the best playmakers that they have right now are not dynamic enough. Like Brandon Ingram is getting thwarted. He is in the torture chamber. C.J. McCollum has been fine, I think, for the most. part, but has very clear limits and cannot surpass them. Like bumps against a very hard ceiling in series like this as a playmaker, as a creator

for other people. And when they've tried to apply pressure defensively, to Shea, for example, they're just getting burned all over the place by the way the Thunder moved the ball. And so what do you do? Yeah, you play with the matchups. You try to adjust your rotation, but like, this is a team that's pretty deep, but it's deep with role players who aren't going to come in and change the nature of this series. and if you do play Naji Marshall at center, guess what?

The Thunderer is just going to go even smaller. If you try to play small, they will outsmall you, and they're better at it than you are, and they're going to hit tons of their threes because, yes, they're going to have hot shooting games, but also they were the best three-pointing, three-point shooting team by percentage in the regular season. So this is the bargain that you strike with them.

They're just a really hard team to match up with. So I have Dork down with 12 points, four made threes in 94 Big Boy Denials on Brandon Ingram. Yeah. What's the threshold for a denial versus a big boy denial? You just got to be a little bit bigger. It's really more intrinsic. Okay.

He has one or two of these games every time he makes it to the playoffs. So I guess we should not be surprised, but like he legitimately controlled this game at points. Nor should we be surprised by him hitting shots like this. Lou Dort was like a 40% three-point shooter this season. He's a knockdown guy. And we all need to accept that we, live in that world now, where Lou Dord is just catching and letting it rip and hitting these shots. Just an awesome role player.

I love watching him in these matchups, obviously, but even when he's not on Brandon Ingram, even when he's basically playing the five for them, just a fascinating role player to watch and is really instrumental to the way that the Thunder play, like alleviating other players from having to take tough matchups, but such an energizer, like creates extra possessions, hitting the floor in ways that like take the soul out of another team by stealing a loose ball away from them. Like those things matter in a game like this. And especially when you're kind of already writing the edge of the knife

in the way that the pelicans are. And like one little push is going to take that team's spirits. Lou Doord is the guy who's going to snatch it away. I also like the symbolic nature of Doric just having this moment where they seemingly close the door on the pelicans here. Just because like outside of She, he is kind of the last bestage of the pretextage of the pretext. previous era, which we should mention was like three, four years ago.

Wasn't that long ago? No, it was not. The Thunder rebuild has been quite swift, it turns out. God, it's just a whirlwind. If Shay is like the imbid of their process, like Dorts like the Robert Covington, you know, he's a guy that like very important and like kind of symbolizes a lot of what they were looking for, like rehab projects, guys who like play D and like can go both. with what could shoot enough

in order to provide space for some of those other guys from really torturing these metaphors. But I don't know, it just felt like nice. Like there's definitely some good vibes going around the team. We talked about the barking.

You gave us a sample of the barking. It's just like the fact that Dort did this, I think was like a nice little step up because it seems like the thunder have really acquitted themselves. After like, you know, I had some doubts going to the first round. So it seems like they're going to maybe

hang around for a good bit here. Oh, definitely so. And I think he's probably got like five or six more years as a thunder to catch up to this, but he's, he's kind of on pace to be this thunder's Nick Collison. Yeah. Like that's the kind of, that's the energy that he's bringing. And that's, you know, sometimes elder statesmen, sometimes veteran presence, sometimes just like enforcer, sometimes game changer and energizer. It's kind of all of those things rolled up in one. But he wears a lot of hats for this team. He's very important to them. And he's the glue that makes some of their smaller looks make any kind of sense whatsoever.

Like if you're going to play, again, whether you consider him or Jalen Williams to be the center, or Kenrich Williams obviously kind of play some backup five for them sometimes. I mean J. Dubb, Jalen Williams, by the way. But Dort is the guy who is active enough on the glass,

versatile enough as a defender, to make that kind of stuff even plausible. I want Dort to be the guy who finishes his career with O.K.C. and just like hangs around town. Like, know how Tony Honey Helen just like basically moved to Memphis and you could find them at like whatever Cracker Barrel is open at like 1 a.m.

I love Cracker Barrow. Pretty good. I want Dort to be at like Brahms just getting burger bags on like a Thursday and you run into him. You're like, hey, thanks Dort for those two titles. Shout out to Broms. Can I buy your milk for you? Yeah.

They're really dishing a mean scoop over there. I appreciate the work that they do. If you're the Thunder, who are you rooting for? Now that let's just assume that the Pelicans aren't going to storm back and that Zion is going to come back in this series. Who are you rooting for in the clips Mavs series? Is it clearly the Mavs after considering Kauai is like a zombie out there? Yeah, yeah.

I think you're rooting for the team that's dragging Kauai Leonard who's dragging his leg around. That's your favorite. That's your favorable matchup. But look, if we get Mavs Thunder, I think I'm going to have to hop on a plane, Justin. I think that's where this is going to be headed. That sounds like the kind of series. I think I got to be a part of something like that. That seems like not must-see television.

I got to be front row. I got to be front center for that. Would you break out the cowboy hat for that? I feel like I'd be blocking the view of the patrons behind me. It might be bad for him. You know, we've talked a lot about media etiquette on this podcast in these spaces. I can't say I've ever seen someone at a Mavs game covering it in a cowboy hat or a Thunder game for that matter. But maybe I or we need to be the first.

You know, me you and Waz, three Stetsons lined up. I'm sure Waz has one. is the thing. You would maybe have to stop somewhere. I'm sure Waz maybe even has an extra. Oh, don't worry. Lots of options available in both towns.

Cavenders Boot City hit us up, you know? Let's work out a deal. Anything else you want to talk about in this series? I mean, we kind of eulogized the Pelicans a little bit in the last podcast, looked ahead to what might be there. At least I did.

Is there anything else you see for this team going forward? like do you foresee big moves, etc? I think they have to make some big moves. And, you know, some of it has been kind of foretold already. Trey Murphy has to play a pretty prominent role in the future of this team. Him and Herb Jones make too much sense as the wings. And where that leaves Ingram and Zion, maybe there's a way you play all five of those, like all four of those guys and either a guard or big together.

And it can kind of make some kind of sense. I'm open to various permutations of it. But Trey Murphy is a prominent piece of this team's future. I have no idea what to do with Brandon Ingram, a player who admittedly has always left me a little bit cold as a star, and Zion Williamson, a player who you just cannot really trust to be healthy. And it hurts to say that at the end of what has been basically his healthiest season to date, but he's not here right now.

And it kind of proves the premise of that. What do you do with two guys like that? And the pelicans are almost too good to completely reinvent the wheel, but I think they have to do something dramatic with one of those two guys. Like, if I were them, I would be looking pretty hard at Brandon Ingram deals and trying to figure out what that could mean for our team and how that could reshape it in a way that makes sense. Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if we get one of those this summer. I wouldn't be surprised if we see something happening with CJ McCollum as well. He just, sure, really kind of outlast his usefulness on this team.

I think he is a very good steady hand when this team needs it. But when he isn't shooting like he is in the playoffs, you really start to see the seams in his kind of game. I think he would be maybe better off going to like, for instance, if the magic wanted a stopgap solution, maybe they can give a try if they just wanted to play out the remainder of his contract, something like that because the Pelicans just, it feels like they're ready to take a next step. I don't know what that's going to be because as we always talk about with the Pelicans, the luxury tax is going to be a major concern. And you also hit the biggest issue there. It seems like they almost need to build two separate teams. It kind of circles back to the Jimmy conversation. It's like you need to build the optimal version with Zion.

And it seemed like they were ready to do that. But you also need to have enough in reserve to be okay when Zion inevitably sits for long stretches. And so that's the hardest thing to do for any team, but especially a small market that's historically been very precious about going over that luxury tax line. So I don't know what they're going to do. I expect them to do something. But they're probably one of the most interesting teams going into the office. I think so. I have one other thunder note that I think we should probably hit too, which is this has been a very mixed bag for Josh Gideon.

these playoffs, but this was the blueprint game. 21 points, eight rebound, six assists, most importantly, 31 minutes of action because he was hitting his threes, because he was able to be such a presence. If Josh Giddy can give them real rotation minutes in round two, that is a massive, massive win, given the limitations that he has shown to this point and how defenses are willing to guard him. So we're kind of on pins and needles with that game to game, whether he's going to be hitting shots, and then when he's turning down shots, the choose-your-own-adventure. of him putting the ball on the ground and driving into traffic. It's not my favorite thing to watch or my favorite thing for the Thunder's offense,

but they have to navigate it. And they have to figure out if he's going to be playable in those sorts of games, or if they have to crank up Kaysen Wallace or Isaiah Joe or Kenrich Williams or Gordon Hayward or the beauty of being the Thunder is that you have all those options. You know, the beauty that they have in the Pelicans don't is that they have everything else they need where we're just kind of trying to fill this one role player spot. And if it's going to be Josh Giddy, that's amazing. and if it's not, we're going to turn the dial and find something else.

I think this is why it was so important for OKC to land the one seed because they did get probably the easiest opponent on the board in the Western Conference with the Pelicans, a hobbled Zionless team. And it really allowed them to kind of take a punch in that game one and then really kind of rebound and get their footing underneath them again. It seemed like they really, like they figured something out in that game, or at the very least they got through whatever jitters existed. And I think this giddy point you're making is exactly that.

To allow him to maybe play through certain mistakes, maybe realize like what teams are going to do against him in a playoff setting and kind of like try to figure out the right approach there. Maybe he ends up in the same scenario in the next round as well. I assume teams will keep putting bigs on him more and more, especially some of the teams, the coaches that are a little bit more shoot from the hip. But it's great to see them just kind of like Chet,

just be as dominant defensively. as he has been throughout this regular thing. I think he's 11 blocks. Oh, my God. Yeah. I get why people are trying to test chat, but I wouldn't do it personally. That's not a decision I would be making,

you know, going up for a junk against that guy. People say that about me. Yeah. Why don't we wrap it there? We'll be back on Wednesday, same time, same place. So after the Wednesday night game.

So check your feeds. Very, very late night Wednesday. If you're up for whatever reason and you're a sicko like us, or Thursday morning. Thank you to Isaiah Blakely on production. Thank you to Ben Cruz. We'll see you next time.

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