The Ringer NBA Show - The Lakers or the Thunder: Who’s in More Trouble? Plus Milwaukee’s Overhaul and Boston’s Slow Start | The Mismatch (Ep. 325)

Episode Date: October 23, 2018

The Ringer’s Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor discuss the lack of shooting plaguing the Lakers and Thunder through Week 1 of the season (1:43). Then, they break down how Milwaukee and Denver have overhauled their style of play for the 2018 season’s pace, while Boston, surprisingly, has not (33:17). Five Takeaways From the NBA’s Opening Week, By Kevin O'Connor The Celtics Didn’t Get the Memo About the NBA Scoring Boom, By Paolo Uggetti Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, it's Liz Kelly. One shiny podcast will be joined from Friday, November 2nd to Wednesday, November 7th where Tate, Titus, and Nephew Kyle are traveling to Columbus, Ohio, Louisville, Kentucky, Bloomington, Indiana, and Chicago, Illinois to tip off the college basketball season. You can find links to tickets on the ringer's Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram. Welcome to the Ringer NBA show, The Mismatch. I'm Chris Vernon, and Jordan Meese does every Tuesday from The Ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'Conflict, aka Kevin O'Concert. Oh, Climber, oh, Candyland. Kevin! What up, Chris? How are you doing this morning? You had a late night last night. Oh, yeah.

Because you witnessed an overtime thriller for this early season with San Antonio Spurs beating the Los Angeles Lakers 143 to 142 to drop the Lakers to 0 and 3. LeBron missed some free throws down the stretch. And man, oh, man, there's only been a. two games there at the forum for the Lakers so far, but both of them have been wildly entertaining and have had something big come out of it. We knew there was already going to be an immense amount of attention paid to the Lakers, but good grief, man, the first two games of the season. One of them has a fight and one of them has LeBron going to the free throw line at the end

and then done in by and misses some free throws. And Patty Mills does in the Lakers on their home floor. What was it like? Well, first of all, the atmosphere was ridiculous. I mean, that was a wild, wild, regular season game, especially for October. I don't recall a place being that loud this early in the season. The game itself, I mean, it feels weird to say this in a game where both teams scored over 140, but San Antonio's defense had a really nice job in the first half at containing LeBron James.

Dante Cunningham, granted he followed out eventually. That a nice job containing LeBron. Spurs' defense was collapsing into the paint. there were two, sometimes three guys in the paint, which made it hard for LeBron and other Lakers players to attack the rim. Things changed in that second half. But overall, I'm still just blown away by the pace and the scoring as a result of this freedom of movement because of the 14-second shot clock,

all of these things that are increasing scoring right now. Everybody's going to talk about the Lakers and what they have to figure out, but I'm interested in your thought on San Antonio, getting to see him in person. What do you think? Because this is a team that obviously is much different than it has been constituted for the last several years, right? The familiar faces are no longer there, even though we did have Aldrich have a monster game and Patty Mills hit the big shot last night. What did you think of this new version of San Antonio? A couple things.

The first one that really comes in mind is Demarta Rosen, right? I was talking to somebody before the game about how, you know, it's disappointing that we don't get to see DeJante Murray and Derek White with the opportunity to run point for this team. But that does mean Demarra Rosen gets more opportunity to be a playmaker. Last year, we saw him make strides passing the ball for the Raptors because of the increased role, the changed offense under Dwayne Casey. And this year with San Antonio, he's been kind of pushed into more of a heavy playmaking role. And last time he had the 14 assists to only two turnovers. Granted against it was the Lakers just horrific turn-style defense.

I mean, the Lakers defense is really, really bad. It is probably worse than what a lot of people expected it to be. It's still interesting to see DeRosen in that role as a playmaker. And then the other thought is just, Bryn Forbes, that guy's got a flamethrower shot. Each season, he's gotten better. This is his third year now with the Spurs. His shot has really developed and shot 39% from three last year, shooting nearly 50% so far this year. That guy can hit big-time shots at the hand in his face.

All right, so what do you think the issues are with the Lakers? What does Luke Walton have to figure out? We touched on this a little bit yesterday. He checked in terms of rotations. I think, like, Alonzo ball starting over Rondo. Once Rondo comes back, to me, that's number one. I think Lons of Ball is just a better fit next to LeBron James, and he's a better defensive player.

And then to close last night's game, Luke Walton stuck with Josh Hart over Contagius Caldwell Pope, who is just a, Hart is a far better player in virtually every category, I think, and a more consistent player as well. Besides that, Chris, look, I mean, Speed McI-Luke and Jonathan Williams last night

getting an opportunity to play, I think that says a lot about where Walton and the coaching staff is with Michael Beasley and Zubats. Williams was solid last night. He's a good rebounder after two years at Missouri, two years against Zaga, and then McI-Luke didn't hit a shot last night, but he has a flamethrower from three.

And I'm curious to see if those guys get more minutes moving forward for the Lakers to, especially with McKayley, to increase spacing, but also improve the defense because Javelle McGee, you look at his numbers last night, 16 points on 13 shots, eight rebounds, one block, and it's like, oh, you know, not bad. But then, you know, you watch games and you know those six files, a lot of them are avoidable files, and, you know, you see the misrotations and you see the lack of communication. You know, they need to find a defensive big. McGee can do it for you in 14, 15 minutes per game, but nearly 30 minutes for him is too much.

They need to find another big. Nice little shout out for Jonathan Williams. I actually filed him in high school. He's a Memphis kid. He was one of the few that was a highly recruited kid that left the town and went elsewhere. And obviously then he ended up on that Gonzaga team was outstanding that he was a part of. And I certainly didn't expect him to go into the league and end up getting 14 minutes in a big game. but he did well last night.

What do you think about the Kuzma deal? Because he ends up taking 25 shots last night. There's probably not a lot of nights, to be fair. I don't know, given the pace, maybe you were seeing a lot of guys take a lot more shots than you were used to. But in the absence of Brandon Ingram, you saw the full display of Kuzma.

Now, not only did he take 25 shots, he played 45 minutes in the game. You know, is this one of those, we're going to look back and say, this is the huge Kuzma night? Or do you think that Kuzma could be primed, especially now playing alongside LeBron James, that they've got to figure out a way to make the most

of what Kuzma can bring to the table. And last night, I mean, 37 is a big number, Kov. This is who Kuzma is. Kuzman's the type of guy where those first two games, he was two for 12 from three. Last night he was four for 10 from three. And the shot opens up the game for him, right? Cusma is somebody who he's shot developed early last season.

It looked like a much improved shot, and I think it is. But he's still a player who's going to be an inconsistent shooter, just like he was in his time at Utah. He was somebody who never found a consistent stroke. And it's better now, like I said, Chris, but I still think those inconsistency issues will be there. It's just it'll be instead of him shooting around, what was it in college?

I think he shot maybe almost exactly 30% from three over his three years at Utah And call it in the NBA, maybe that turns into 35, 36% from 3, where you get some games in high variance where he just knocks down everything, but then games where it's like, this dude can't hit a shot. Kuzma is a spark plug, right? I think a lot of times we think about point guards of spark plugs. They come off the bench, they handle the ball a lot, and they can spark offense for your team.

But Kuzma, to me, at the forward spot, can be that guy for the Lakers or whatever team he plays for over the duration of his career where he'll average you know, 18, 19 points, but he'll have 30-point games and a lot of five-point games, too. Do you think the LeBron, Kuzma, Ingram, Triumphra, is going to fit well together? Yeah, I do. I think it works. Okay. All right.

It'd be interesting to see if they can all, right, like, that's the goal, is to be able to all be super successful at the same time. And you saw in the absence of Ingram last night, you know, let's be fair. Kuzma probably doesn't get 25 shots of Ingram's in the game, right? He might. Yeah, he might. Maybe, maybe. He had games like this last year.

Well, he also didn't have LeBron James on his team. Sure. Yeah, but he also had a lot of games where he shot, you know, 18, 19 or 20 plus times early in the year, too. I forget he had his breakout game early November last season. I forget the team it was against, but dropped 30 for the first time. And, you know, this was following his flashes in Summer League and then an impressive preseason. Then early season, he was pretty good. Then he had that big 30-point game.

It was like, whoa. this guy actually for real. All right. You know the microscope is going to be much greater on everything they do. And frankly, I mean, they have given people reason to really pay attention. Their first two games have just been out of this world, the ones that have taken place in L.A. So far, do you look at this and say the O.N3 start is discouraging? Do you look at it and say the O&3 start is just them figuring out in a function of the suspensions and L.A.

is going to be every bit as good as you thought they were going to be. I think for both the Lakers and the Thunder, obviously O and 3 is not ideal because of the way the Western Conference is because of last season where you can win 46 games and you can miss out on the playoffs. Every single game matters, right? Every game matters. And this could end up being the difference between being the three seed or the eight seed or maybe even missing out in the playoffs. However, for the Lakers and the Thunder for that matter, especially the Lakers, because they have LeBron James on their team. It's not worth panicking over.

This is a new team. It's a lot of new guys on this team that are developing chemistry together. And I think last night we saw those two sides. We saw that team that's figuring out who they are that has some personnel issues with shooting and spacing in the first half where they couldn't attack the rim. And then in the second half, and in overtime, we saw what this team could look like. They're going to be fine. They're going to become a really, really high power offense as they did. develop chemistry over the course of the season and figure out the right combinations of

players to put together on the court to maximize their team. It's going to happen over time. It's just a matter of will it happen soon enough? And I think they'll be fine though, Chris. I still look at them as a high 40s, maybe 51 team for sure. And in fairness, we'll probably get to see how great they can look when they play. I think it's Phoenix that's up next. In fairness, the way their season started, it's murder, right? I mean, you're playing at port. Portland, Portland had won 17 home openers in a row. The last team to beat Portland at Portland, the first game of the season, was the Kobe Shack Lakers.

And you had Paul Allen passing away and all the emotion of that going in. So that's not an easy spot, first game of the season. And then they've lost to the Rockets and the Spurs, right? I mean, so that's why I'm glad you brought up Oklahoma City. They didn't lose to the Rockets and the Spurs. They got their ass kicked by the Kings. and Imman Schumpert of all things. So that one's stay.

I could not believe it. All this time, Shumper just needed to get away from LeBron. I swear to you, I didn't see that game. And then when I saw the box score, I was like, what the hell?

Imman Shumpert, because the first game that they played when they put out their starting lineup, right? I think, well, they played that Pelicans game, the King's head.

But what was the, the first game, because I had put out their starting lineup. Oh, it was the jazz. They hosted the jazz at home, right? Yeah. And their starting lineup was Bealeigh, Collie Stein, Yogi Farrell, De Aaron Fox, and Buddy Healed. And, like, Shumpert was just like one of the other guys coming off the bench. I like Josh Jackson or Frankie Mason or any of the others.

And then the next thing I know, I was like, wait, hold on now. Imman Shumpert is dropping almost 30 points against this team. And that one got a lot of attention because it was going to be Westbrook's first game back, right? That's what makes it a little different. It's not Houston. It's not the Spurs. That's at home in Westbrook's return getting run out by the Sacramento Kings. Do you think it's too early to worry about what they've got going on in Oklahoma City?

They do seem to have a lack of shooters. I think for OKC, yeah, their roster is problematic because they don't have a lot of shooters on that team. And, you know, you could say the same thing about the Lakers. But I think overall, the Lakers team, I think, has better shooting. This Oklahoma City roster does not. There's really not a lot of good shooters on this team up and down the roster. Even somebody like Paul George, who is a very good shooter, I'm not sure there's a single, great shooter on this roster.

There's not. There's not a single great shooter, is there? Well, they need, they need Ferguson to be, right? But he's not. No, he's not. I mean, Adams is a space to floor to three. Patterson is a solid shooter for a big. Noel can't space the floor. Grant is a subpar shooter. Shruder is an average shooter. Abrein's is a pretty solid, good, good shooter.

Not a great shooter, though. Dallo still developing his shot. Deaute Burton, not a knockdown shooter. There's nobody on this roster that can effectively space the floor for Russell Westbrook, who is a guy, you know, optimally would be on a team with the floor spaced floor out. I mean, this is like an extreme example, but just imagine Westbrook with like Houston spacing, right? Or what Milwaukee is trying to do right now. Those are the ideal conditions for Westbrook, so we can attack the rim,

draw a lot of files, and get a lot of easier baskets at the rim. But right now with this Oklahoma City roster, they don't have the shooters, but without Andre Robertson, they also don't have their best defender. The team I thought even before the year was possibly on that playoff bubble. If you're thinking about teams that would have surprisingly missed the playoffs, to me, they were that number one team that could. And I'm not sure where the solutions are for shooting. Well, I tell you this, you mentioned Patterson. He has been a colossal disappointment for me. I mean, I was a big fan of his in Toronto.

and I thought that was a sneaky, really good signing by Presti last off season. It was worth it despite like the injury. And it has been an abject disaster. I mean, he played 15 minutes for them and gave them four points and two rebounds last year. And he hadn't hit a shot this year. I mean, you know, through the three games, he's 26% from the field for God's sakes. I mean, you should. That's a team like you were saying.

A stretch guy should be getting a lot of open shots. and I really liked what he brought to the table in Toronto. And it's just, it just has not worked at all. And I know he's had the injuries, but still beyond the injuries, he has just not been the Toronto Patterson at all since he has been in Oklahoma City.

No, it seems like that knee injury that he had. He's not the same guy anymore, which is disappointing because he was a really, really good player to watch for a long time. That's for sure. One of the thought, De Aaron Fox, looking pretty good so far this year.

Looking like a more advanced player. It's early. Just three games. But we saw a little bit of this in preseason where maybe he's made some strides. I'm not going to jump the gun on him yet and say he has because he still has, you know, shot still needs a fall.

He didn't shoot the ball well in preseason and the regular season he's only one for seven from three. But he does seem like he's made some strides overall. He has got a great head on his shoulders, great kid. You even got to, you sat down and did that interview

with him just last year. Anybody that's around him, incredibly likable kid, speed kills, man. He is so damn fast. He really is. And he's so good with the ball. And I,

you know, I loved him last year going into that draft. I thought, I thought he has a chance to be very special. In fairness, I happened to be

at the NCAA tournament game that he was, I mean, he destroyed Lonzo. Absolutely. destroyed him and I thought, God, what a competitor, because that's all anybody was talking about was Fox

versus Lonzo, Fox versus Lonzo. And that kid played absolutely out of his mind in that game. He was so good. And he's, you know, I'm not, I'm not going to be surprised if Deere Fox ends up being a star in the league at all. He had a lot

of the wall stuff going, right? All the way down to the not trustworthy shot. The other one is he reminded me a lot of Conley and it took Conley a long time to figure it out right it took him a long time to figure it out but once you you know if you're willing to put in the work you can fix a shot Mike Conley was nobody from three and then became a dead eye three point shooter um if fox could put that to his game because he still doesn't really do it boy he could be devastating because he can get to every spot um let's get to

some of these other takeaways because you wrote this article about the takeaways at the beginning of the season. We're always given to overreactions over the course of the first couple of games. But I like some of the ones that you outlined that we have seen so far, one of which, and we'll see which of these have staying power. But the one that you did about Denver's defense and what it has looked like so far, and you go back and you look at that Warriors game, they missed like 20-something free throws in the game. They shot like hell from three, and they still end up winning that game. That is just not a game that Denver would have won when they're missing all those free throws and missing all those threes and they're able to do it by holding

the Warriors under 100 points. And obviously, Yokic has been out of his mind. But do you think that this is now a schematic thing with Denver and that this is going to stay that like a team that we kind of knew as a horrendous defensive team could really flip itself into being a pretty good one. It sure helps having Paul Millsap back healthy. I think, you know, the blurb you're mentioning in that article focused on Yokic, right? And it focused on how Denver this season seems to be hedging on pick and rolls more often, which means instead of having the big man defender drop into the paint and, you know, sag and invite shooters to attempt a three or for mid-range. He's instead hedging, which is meant to force a ball handler to make a pass. So you're trying to make somebody else beat you

or you're forcing the point guard, the ball handler, into more difficult shot attempts. And that's been the main change of their pick and roll defense. But Millsap, ultimately, when it comes to rotating and the help defense it needs to occur and covering for Yulch, if he does get blown by, having Millsap back, I think is what's really making this click on either higher level.

Like, Denver's not going to sustain the number one defense and basketball curse, but they definitely look better overall, don't they? Oh, for sure. and this is, listen, I hate that they lost Will Barton because he was off to a really good start, and that's a killer. How about this? That warrior game? Kevin, I will freely admit this, and I can, you know,

I can already hear people goofing on me about this, but I don't care. I am going to freely admit to you. I had absolutely no idea who Torrey Craig is. No idea. I'm sure you're not the only one. He was starting in that game against Golden State. I think you would be forgiven if you didn't know who Tori Craig is.

Oh, I thought you were going to hit me with the Rashon Holmes. No. No, Rashon. No, I'm not going to hit you. He played at USC upstate. This Tori Craig? I mean, Rashon Holmes with the Bowling Green. You got to know Bowling Green, Chris.

Right, because all his games were on TV too. Tori Craig. I was like, who is Tori? Usually, I will at least have heard of every star. much less for a starter that's on a good team that's getting a win against the Warriors. But when I saw that name, it said, you know, it said the starters were Gary Harris, Jamal Murray, Nikolai Yokic, Paul Milsap, and T. Craig. And I was like, who is T. Craig?

Yeah. He's like the type of guy. I mean, we talked about Robertson earlier and how his loss impacts Oklahoma City. Craig might be like even more of a zero on the offensive end of the floor. But like his defense and his hustle, you know, valuable. But it is valuable, and I'm going to be curious to see how many minutes he gets moving forward, because you still have, like, Herni Gomez and Liles and Malik Beasley, who I like a lot. I'm curious to see if Craig continues to A, start, or B, gets increased minutes over those guys when he doesn't really offer that much on the offensive end before, if anything. It's interesting that you brought up Beasley.

What's happened with him? It just might not be as good as what I hope for. You think? No, I mean, Beasley was an interesting. Interesting prospect. I liked him a lot in the draft for like a mid-first-round guy, late first-round guy. And he ended up going, I think, in 19th to Denver. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, he's a solid player. But he's also in a situation where he's behind better prospects, Jamal Murray, Gary Harris. There's not a lot of opportunity there for him yet. But still, like you would have liked to have seen him become the guy to elevate into a role when Will Barton goes down. It just hasn't happened. I'll tell you what, the sneaky one. And he's he's one of these guys. guys that I think I love more than most people. I love Liles. I do.

I think he could end up taking a step. I was kind of upset that I didn't mention him when we were talking about guys that could possibly take a step this upcoming season because I'm a big fan of his. I bet he ends up starting, honestly, for that team. Because he can stretch it out too. I mean, I know he hasn't been burying three so far, but I think he brings a lot to the table. I think he's a little underrated. Ultimately, it's about how do you put the best line up around Nicola Yokic,

who has just been magnificent this season, as he was to end last season. It's really carried over. I mean, that game he had last Saturday night, 35 points on 11 for 11 shooting, 11 rebounds, 11 assists. That's crazy. That's crazy. That dude was outstanding. And yet, like, because of that fight that happened with Rondo and Chris Paul and Ingram, nobody was talking about it.

Maybe nobody would have talked about it earlier because it's a Denver Phoenix game in October. But Thursday night, Nuggets faced the Lakers, if Yokic has a big game on national TV, maybe, finally, maybe finally. We'll see. Nicole Yokic got the credit he deserves as the premier offensive center in the league right next to Anthony Davis. He is really a remarkable player on the offensive end of the floor. Feels like this is going to be the first all-star appearance. Got to be. It's got to be.

I mean, this guy, Yokic, Yokic is, not only did he show at the end of the last season, he can score at a high volume with efficiency, but he's an elite rebounder. He is, to me, you know, one of the best passing centers, if not the best, most talented passing center that I've ever seen. I mean, he has a point guard. He has point guard skills at his position. You can run an offense through him, and his defense has improved. So he's not as much of a limitation on that. He's on his way. He's trending up to becoming a top 15, top 10 player maybe by the end of the season.

When I mentioned Liles as a guy that could take a step up, you mentioned as a possible Ola Depot leap. One of the other ones that I wanted to mention in your five takeaways, which is this kid for Brooklyn, Karras Levert. Love him. Dude, the highlights you have, I would encourage anybody to go to the ringer and find Kevin's article on five takeaways. The highlights you have in there of him putting Ola Depot,

in a blender. Holy mackerel, these moves, I mean, Karras Levert looks, I mean, he looks like a big star, right? Making those moves. And he is such a insanely interesting story, to say the least, right? Because the kid, he just got his college career ruined. He ended up playing, he had three surgeries in 22 months. He ended up playing 33 total games his last two years,

18 his junior year and 15 his senior year. And I went and looked it up to see because sometimes you have these, and I know you had mentioned as a guy that he had been talked about as being a possible lottery pick. I think he would have been if it weren't for those injuries. Yeah. And I went to go see if he was one that was like sometimes you'll look back and you'll say, wow, well, that guy was an amazing high school player. He's very highly touted high school player.

And so, you know, long ago, people. have recognized that this kid was going to be special and he just got kind of, you know, screwed up by injuries. That just is not the case with him. I went and read the stories. He only, how about this? That kid went to one official visit for college and it was Alabama State. He ends up getting offers from Michigan, Dayton, and Ohio.

He signs with Ohio, their coach, John Gross, weirdly. beats Michigan so he gets the Illinois job and the kid just got lost in the shuffle. He was ranked 236th in his high school class and then shows up to Michigan weighing 152 pounds. And like I said, you know, then his college career gets, I mean, you don't talk about the ultimate late bloomer who not only was a late bloomer, but late bloomed through, I mean, three surgeries in 22 months could, I mean, it ruins careers. Right? And so I love these stories like this, for sure.

And then looking at those highlights that you put up there, this kid looks special, man. He does. He does look special. And obviously the numbers he's putting up so far are crazy. Yeah, really with Lavert in the draft, he had his flaws. And he still does. You're finishing through contact, absorbing contact.

And, you know, because of his lean frame, he was a good and not great defender. But the weaknesses, you know, you really had a, you know, just poke holes. him, right? You're looking for something. You're searching for something because the positives were obvious with his shooting ability, his ball handling, his playmaking at his size, his passing vision. The fact that he just simply play hard and as a high character kid who worked hard on and off the court, right? Like the positives were endless. The only real big question was injuries. And that's why I had him ranked in the second round. A lot of NBA people had him ranked in the second round. But ultimately for the Nets, they felt the confidence that his injuries would be.

fine. And so far he has been. And they made that Thaddeus Young for the, they traded Thaddeus Young to the Pacers to the pick that was used on Lavert. And now in his third season in the NBA, Chris, he has seemed to have elevated his play. I mean, we'll see if he maintains the points per game. But even if his numbers drop to, I don't know, the 18 points per game, we're talking about a guy that got picked 20th. He has already exceeded expectations with his versatility on the offensive end of the floor to me. me, if you're projecting ahead for the Brooklyn Nets, Levert is a guy that can fit next to anybody because of the fact he's a good spot-up shooter,

because of the fact that you can use him on ball in a playmaking role, he can do anything for you, no matter what guys are around him on the court. And, you know, for all the chuckles about, you know, when I reported that the Nets weren't willing to put him in an offer for Jimmy Butler, it's kind of easy to see why now, isn't it? It feels a little bit like the back in the day, I remember, thinking and a lot of people thought you're really not going to give up Clay Thompson to get Kevin Love. You remember that whole deal?

Yeah. In Minnesota and it kind of, you know, at the time, it didn't look as big of a no-brainer that you wouldn't give up Clay Thompson to get Kevin Love. And obviously, as time is going on, it was the right move to

stick with Clay Thompson. That being said, I'm not telling you that Karris Levert's going to end up being that level of player. He's not. He's not. He's not. He's not that level of a shooter. No, but it can be one of those where you look back and say, you know, no wonder they didn't give the guy up. Absolutely.

I think any time, it's really hard to find two-way players with Lavert's level of versatility. I don't think it could be said enough that this guy, like you look at the numbers and you might say, oh, four assists, three point seven turnovers. Like, he's not that great of a passers. Like, no, he is. He's a really good playmaking wing. He's not got to put up big passing numbers, but he can run, pick, and roll for you. and make smart, good decisions, and accurate passes.

LaVird is a do-it-all guy in the offensive end. He is also, people may not know this or people may know this. He is also actually the cousin of the famous R&B Lavert from, you know, his cousin was the lead singer of the OJs. And obviously everybody knows Gerald and Sean Lavert from the group Lavert back in the day. So how about that? That's pretty cool. A guy could end up being a singer too, maybe.

I don't know. I wonder if he can sing. another parallel story with Victor Oladipo. Oh, yeah. He is. I remember seeing when Oladipo was at Indiana, he was in a talent show at the school. And that's when I first found out about him

because I just happened to come across it on YouTube when the kid was in college. He's saying, Usher's, you got it bad. And he was great. And I was like, now this has got to be pretty rare. He's a talented, talented guy. All right, Kevin, we'll get right back to it. First, I want to hear from a couple of our sponsors.

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contest. To get the free upgrade, visit 99designs.com slash NBA and click on the link in the landing page. That's 99designs.com slash NBA. 99 designs where creativity meets possibility. Let's get to the bucks. Everybody had kind of thought like, hey, the Buden-Ozer thing is going to be a major upgrade to Jason Kidd no matter what. It was just a matter of how big of an upgrade and how much you're able to do with it. And we talked about unlocking, Janus, but you kind of charted that,

and I was a little surprised by this, that their shot distribution at least through only a couple of games mirrors more of the Houston Rockets and is much, much, much different than what they were doing last year already. Yeah, it is a significant difference, right? If you look at the Milwaukee Buck shot distribution

so far this season is, pretty damn close to what the rockets have done, what the Rockets did last year and what they're doing so far this season. Like, you know, Milwaukee has attempted about a third of their shots from the restricted area, nearly half of their shots from three-point range. And if that sounds like the Rockets, it's because it is like the Rockets. The difference with Milwaukee is they're not getting their points in the way Houston does. Houston runs their high pick and roll with James Hardin and Chris Paul over and over.

And if the defense switches, they isolate with the, space floor. You know, you'll see Milwaukee run isolations and you'll see them run pick and roll, but not at the frequency that Houston does. They run a lot more ball movement sets that Budenholzer has done for years in Atlanta and, you know, what he, you know, learned from his time in San Antonio, his merely two decades there. They use Yannis in the post a lot, and that's something Houston never does. They rarely ever go to the post. And it's just been really fun to watch Yannis in this role where he's put all over the floor, whether it's as a pick and roll ball handler

or as a screener in the pick and roll, as a guy in the post who's looking to playmake or taking advantage of mismatches or a guy who's just, like we've always seen him done, just dunking on fools in transition. It is really amazing watching Yannis operate with all this space within this new system.

All right. I want to move on to a couple other teams. Is there any level of concern regarding Boston? And last night, obviously, The offensive output has been poor so far. There's even an article on The Ringer today, and it, of course, ends with they'll end up figuring it out. But so far, what has taken place with the Boston Celtics is probably not what we were expecting. Paolo wrote it, and it was the Celtics didn't get the memo about the NBA scoring boom.

And they are adding in Kyrie Irving and Gordon Hayward into the mix. What do you think? I mean, that was a weird loss to see come across the scoreboard last night with them losing at home to Orlando. You know, you see the ticker go by if you're watching another game, and I kept seeing that ticker go by. And, you know, it's one of those where it's like Orlando's up by four. And I'm like, yeah, well, in the end, they'll end up, you know, down by 20, right? Like the Celtics will turn it on. They never turned it on, right?

And they got caught by Orlando on their home court, which was not something I particularly expected to see. For what it's worth, I didn't see any of that game last night. I haven't even seen a highlight for that matter. But the one thing I have noticed watching Boston so far this season is it seems like they're taking a lot more mid-range jumpers early in the clock. I don't recall them doing that quite as often. And that might just be, it just might be a small sampling, but it does seem like they're taking more mid-range shots early in the clock. And, you know, again, Kyrie Irving has not seemed like the same guy so far this season, maybe working himself back from his offseason injury.

His knee injury last year, sorry. Hayward obviously not the same. They're going to be fine. But I am curious about some of these trends with the mid-range shot selection. I tell you this, and again, it's still early in the season. But Clifford has been good for Nikola Vosovic because that kid has started on fire. He's averaging 19 and 10. We've always known he's a talented guy, right?

but he was great last night against them. I did get to see some of it because not only he, but I mean, they're front court with him and Isaac. Isaac ends up with like 18 and 12 last night. I was like a big numbers. Yeah, you said that Orlando could surprise some people by getting some wins,

even despite the fact that they may not end up winning a ton of games. And so it's interesting to see that particular tandem And so far this year, I mean, this has become Vucevich, it's weird, right? The mix was so goofy when they added Bionbo and like it was like, I don't know, we all had very high thoughts about Vucevich and then kind of got lost in the mix. And obviously they're losing a million games. But maybe Clifford is going to get, you know, we're going to see the, the Vouch that we saw a couple of years ago when it looked like he was one of the real prime. promising young possible stars, right? I mean, that was how everybody felt about that kid.

And he's just been in witness protection almost for the last couple of years. Yeah, Vucevic, you know, last year he started incorporating shooting threes more frequently. And this year's attempts are down. But, yeah, I mean, he's always been a talented offensive center. Maybe the opportunity will be there now that that glut of centers isn't on the roster anymore, where he can, you know, play next to Jonathan Isaac or Obama, who can also based the floor from three. It'll be interesting.

I mean, this Orlando team has some quality young players on it, right? I mean, Aaron Gordon as well. Vucevic is, you know, still only 27. Jonathan Isaac, ultimately, him and Mo Bamba are the guys that their development is the most important thing this season. Those guys making strides independently

and together on the floor is what could someday make this Orlando defense into a high power defense with all their length and versatility. Yeah. Do you know, well, and the same guy that built Hammond that built the bucks, and you look at their absurd length? I mean, he's obviously running the show down in Orlando. And so you just end up taking whoever the, who's the guy with the longest wingspan?

And he's probably got a chance of being drafted by John Hammond. I got to see last night's game because Isaac specifically, you know, scoring 18 points. I need to see how he scored those points and why he scored those points because he's always had like tantalizing offensive potential. It's just he doesn't really have that scores mentality and his ball handling needs to develop. But it's encouraging to see him do that against a really, really good Celtics defense. If anybody pulls the plug quick because a team starts, you know, with a terrible record, like maybe way behind the eight ball. They start one in eight or they start, you know, something like, all right, so we've got a couple candidates for sure, right? You got the Bulls.

So would you be more worried if you are Fred Hoyberg, Ty Lou, Luke Walton or Billy Donovan. Oh, boy. I'd be worried if I'm any of those guys. I wonder which one, right? The Bulls spent a lot of money in the offseason. Dan Gilbert said, we're still going to win without LeBron.

They have looked like shit. I mean, they were, I saw that Hawks team in person, Kevin. That team is awful, awful. Yeah. And they turned and they ran about. Much better than Marshall Brooks, though. You ain't lying.

Now, in fairness, he's going to get to do everything he wants to do, you know what I mean? If you put Marshawn Brooks on the Hawks offense, we'll see what happens. Listen, I saw Marshawn Brooks on a rat team last year, by the way. I did. I saw him on a rat team. Did you see what he did? That's what happens. You're allowed to do whatever you want.

When you lose 60 games, you're allowed to do whatever you want. Nobody cares what you do. I told you, listen, I know everybody's. you know, got an erection over Trey Young already. I've told you, this is Is that the first time that word has ever been used in the ringer NBA show?

Probably. It's a good good, good, good context. There's going to be a little Oklahoma going on with this. Just watch. Watch what I say. He ran through everybody at Oklahoma for about two weeks and then they lost 50 games in a row to end that season.

And it wasn't as easy as it was. Like he'll get to go this first time through and I'm not trying to take away from him. I'm not. 35 in a win is unbelievable. But I, and I know that you roll your eyes at this, but I do believe in when you lose like hell, when you lose a lot and you're able to take whatever shot you want to take and do whatever you want to do, that that is not what is necessarily best because I'm seeing it now with a kid like Dylan Brooks who was able to do anything you wanted to do last year. And now, like when you're trying to win games. You can't just do whatever you want to do. And in fairness, I saw it years ago.

I loved O.J. Mayo. And anybody can go back and look at this. Kid almost average 20 points a game his rookie year. If Derek Rose didn't exist, he probably would have been the rookie of the year. And then you fast forward to when, you know, the team became a winning team. And guess what? That's not what you are when the team wins. And maybe Trey Young will be like Curry. And that's what you are on a winning team. But I have. my doubts of that. That's all I'll say. I'm writing about Trey Young this week, so I'll save my thoughts for that article, but I'll say that I think you're hitting on some good points. And I had Trey Young ranked 11th for a reason.

But I do think his play early this season is very encouraging. Very encouraging. Listen, he's a very good player. But more, more than that, to me, that Trey Young amazing performance at Cleveland was way more about Cleveland. That's just bananas. I don't know, man. It's been. That's crazy. The one thing. about Trays, it's not just scoring, it's passing. He's a really, really great passer. And the one thing he's also, the point guard on a team that I watch give up 77 to the

freaking Grizzlies in a half, in a half, in a half. That team is awful, Kevin, trust me. That is bizarre that Cleveland would get run out like that. On their home court, Tyloom may not make it there, seriously. Because Gilbert thought they were going to be a good team, right? Now, he may be dead wrong about that. But I thought they were going to be okay. Maybe not good.

10 seed in the east. Is that okay? I mean, didn't you think they would possibly fight for a playoff spot? I don't know. I mean, like, I think you can get in playoffs in the east and still be a bad team in the seven or eight spot. That's true. That's true. That's fair.

All right. So, hey, Hoyberg, Lou, Walton, Donovan. it seems like Gilbert would be the least patient, right? I'd probably be most worried about Tyler that if it spins out for a couple of game, a couple more games, that he would, you know, the Bulls, I don't know,

are you going to sit there and say, I know we spent a lot of money in this offseason, but we're not living up to what I thought we were going to be? I mean, who could have thought, you know, spending money on Zach Levine and Jabari Parker would help your defense. Come on now.

And it seems like Jeannie Bus is really in Walton's corner. So we throw that one out. And Presti has been a very patient guy. That Oklahoma City team was not very good for a good portion of last year. And he stuck with Billy Donovan. But listen, you know, these guys, these GMs, they go to the owner and they're either blaming the coach or blaming the roster. And you know sure as hell, they ain't blaming the roster. They're saying, we should be good.

Our coach stinks. I mean, can we be real, though? I mean, for a team like Chicago or Cleveland, for that matter. A, you shouldn't really be expected to win that many games, right? For Chicago, it's about the development of those young players about Wendell Carter. And once Laurie marketing comes back, it's about those guys getting better. It's about hopefully, you know, if Hoyberg can help Levine turn into it actually a competent defender, right? You know, if you can help these guys develop, you're still not going to win a lot of games. And then not only that, you're just better off losing.

You're better off having a high draft pick if you're Chicago or Cleveland. You're not if you're Oklahoma City or the Lakers where the expectation is the playoffs. The expectation is a high playoff seed. It's not to win a championship, but it's to be a really competitive team that gets a three seed in the Western Conference. If you're not meeting those expectations, then yeah, I think you'd be worried. I think for Hoyberg and Lou, the conversation, the context is less about the winning or

losing and more so, you know, how are they managing the players? How are the players developing? How do we feel the team is being run? And that's true also for the Lakers and the Thunder. But it's a little bit more results based maybe with those teams. Yeah, if we were talking about maybe like somebody making a move, obviously the one that people have already thrown out there once Cleveland looks like crap is, hey, now it's Kevin Love's turn to get traded somewhere.

It's tough to blame the coach, though, man. Like, you know, we talked about Oklahoma City and the Lakers to open the show. Oklahoma City doesn't have many shooters on their team. It's tough for Billy Donovan to probably run the type of. of offense he wants to. And same for the Lakers. They're shooting as average or below average for that matter. It's the personnel, too.

Like judging coaches is really, I think from the outside for us, like we can look at rotations and we can look at how they're, you know, utilizing the roster, but we don't see into practices like how they're managing the guys. We're not seeing how they manage, you know, disagreements that happen. Like those are the things that, you know, in my opinion, ultimately would play a factor and whether to, you know, fire a guy or keep a guy. Well, and what we're seeing with that Oklahoma City team is kind of what we saw last year, which is the Robertson loss is way to, it is bigger than what it should be for them.

But it is significant. Like, you saw their defensive numbers just plummet last year without that kid on the team. And now they're talking about, you know, December. Who knows? Hopefully, you know, for their sake, they could get them back by December. But Robertson being out of the lineup probably shouldn't have that drastic of effect. And that's kind of where their bread was buttered. They were a team that was a very good defensive team because they had one of the best perimeter defenders in Robertson.

And they've got obviously a back line that includes Adams who's outstanding. Paul George as well. Yeah. But now when you took that kid out of the mix, their defense isn't, you know, it's not daunting to deal with. and it certainly hasn't been through the first couple of games of the season. In fairness, Westbrook's only, you know, he just got back. Long way to go. Yeah, got a long way to go.

Kevin, it has been a very fun first week of the season. We would have gotten more into the spitting incident, but I know you guys chronicled that completely on heat check yesterday. I'm tired of it already, to be honest. You are? Yeah, I'm tired of it. The only thing that's still interesting to me is the length of the suspensions. I think it was very soft, four, three, and two.

I'm very surprised. Like David Stern would have laid the hammer down on those guys. And whether that's for better or for worse, I'm not sure. But the suspensions were absolutely light. I thought that they might make an example of it, right? Me too. I look forward to reading your, when's that Trey Young article coming out? I think we're going to have it after the Mavericks' Hocs game on Wednesday.

Oh, yeah, right. Nobody's going to be paying attention to that. The Dantzich-Trey Young game, are they? Nobody. Nobody's going to watch that. I know. Between two non-playoff teams, who's going to watch that? We're going to watch that, Chris.

Everybody will be tuned in for sure. Kevin's always a pleasure. Hey, thanks, everybody, for listening to another episode of The Mismatch. If you dig what you're hearing. Go give us a rating and review on iTunes. Please give us five stars, five stars. It really helps the cause. And we will talk to you next week.